[DA] Decisive Actions – Jade Quarry
Small Mans Encouraged, Mindless Zergs Not?
[DA] Decisive Actions – Jade Quarry
I think it is funny that people think they know that the zerg doesn’t have skill when they really have no clue at all. Juat a bunch of assumptions based upon their ego after getting rolled by that zerg.
I also think that a lot of you people have other issues seeing as how you feel people should be punished just because they don’t have any game knowledge. Never heard of newbs before obviously.
A lot of ego stroking in here from those that think they have the 733tz skillzzzz.
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.
Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!
“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me
Then your lack of comprehending what sarsbear wrote is a falsity. 3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped. That is fact if the Aoe cap was removed. You telling us that Aoe cap won’t help is incorrect.
That is not precisely why the AoE cap was put in place, see my earlier responses.
I would like to confirm from you though that you think it is fair for 3 Eles to drop meteor shower on a group of 25, and should wipe them out without actually putting thought in to the fight beyond “put them in the choke and drop one spell”. That would be “tactics” to you?
I think u missed the most important line jscull put in there. “3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped.” Cause most ppl will not move out of said AOE and stay clumped and should DIE. If they move out of clump they live eles die. Its not tactic in this example just gives the 3 eles a small chance to win if the 30 don’t move, which is the case in 50% of zerg fights lol.
You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.
Sorry, I guess I should have expanded on my thoughts. The average WvW player in my mind is that ranger that auto attacks while backstepping, and continues to do so while he is being focused. It is sad that I consider those that know how to dodge out of AoE to be among the more knowledgeable of the mindless zerg population… but I guarantee you if there was no AoE cap that our 5 man, and yours as well I am sure, would never lose to that skilless zerg. As it is right now, our initial hit will drop a good amount of them, but they have 3 people resing each downed zergling, and eventually we have to string them out or are forced off due to the sheer amount of damage that 30 auto attacks can do.
If they have that many to your numbers you shouldn’t be fighting that, you need to split that up a lot more before you engage themI guess this is getting a bit off topic from what I initially thought for this thread. I am just excited to see that the devs are trying to implement more skilled combat into WvW, and it is obviously something that some people don’t want (Not you Mezo, but our friend Raf here).
Response in bold above and :
Hmm. I think it’s neat that you can drop people quickly, but they aren’t necessarily out of the fight. Their allies can either choose to assist them and give up on you temporarily (giving you time to escape the situation WITH PRIDE) or if they chase after you, you can fight them and get your fight. Obviously if the group is large enough to do both, this is the scenario where you’re fighting with your fists instead of your head. You need to break that group up a lot more.
Not to be harsh, but I would hardly blame him for not understanding what you two are saying. I did’t call you out maliciously because I figured there is probably a legitimate excuse (ESL, emotional, young) for you two not writing clearly. I found this reply funny. Again, sorry that I AM now calling you out on it. I’ll gladly keep to the discussion of wvw as opposed to digressing to the petty though!
While I love me some run on sentences, I don’t believe my posts are very hard to comprehend. Besides that post you quoted of mine, I have not been malicious at all. People that debase an entire guild for comments that a single person from that guild make, (our superiority complex in this case) are just bum hurt like subcrazy stated. These people won’t ever actually read what we type as they already have their preconceived views on us.
Not Just A Goodtime – 80 Asura Warrior
[PAXA]
I would like to confirm from you though that you think it is fair for 3 Eles to drop meteor shower on a group of 25, and should wipe them out without actually putting thought in to the fight beyond “put them in the choke and drop one spell”. That would be “tactics” to you?
He isn’t saying they should be instantly killed. But if they stand there for the full duration of 3x MS on top of them, yeah they should be killed for their stupidity.
Currently, this does not happen. Only some of the 25 get hit. That 25 could easily stand in 3x MS without a single one (possibly a couple at most) being downed.
I think it is funny that people think they know that the zerg doesn’t have skill when they really have no clue at all. Juat a bunch of assumptions based upon their ego after getting rolled by that zerg.
I also think that a lot of you people have other issues seeing as how you feel people should be punished just because they don’t have any game knowledge. Never heard of newbs before obviously.
A lot of ego stroking in here from those that think they have the 733tz skillzzzz.
Ignorant comment man. There are numerous 5 mans with video footage of 5 rickrolling your “you have no idea about us Zerg”… If there was so much unfairly unnoticed skill those videos wouldn’t exist. Not here to troll, not interested in mindless conversation. Interested in Anet waking up and making the game COMPETITIVE.
stuff
I just want to talk about boons they wont have 100% up time on anything unless they are organized zerg which I know is out there and that’s cool. The reason boons are not on 100% of the time is cause u cant zergball no more you need to spread out and if ur not by ur guard (for example) your not getting boons from him no more cause your out of range.
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.
Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!
“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me
Then your lack of comprehending what sarsbear wrote is a falsity. 3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped. That is fact if the Aoe cap was removed. You telling us that Aoe cap won’t help is incorrect.
That is not precisely why the AoE cap was put in place, see my earlier responses.
I would like to confirm from you though that you think it is fair for 3 Eles to drop meteor shower on a group of 25, and should wipe them out without actually putting thought in to the fight beyond “put them in the choke and drop one spell”. That would be “tactics” to you?
Anyone else is welcome to answer this question as well cuz I think it is relevant…. I agree it should be able to happen, and I believe those 30 should learn to GET THE F OUT OF THE WAY
Again I am with you guys on this. If they don’t move, they should die. Removing the cap or raising it will help. However the zerg wont just stand there, they WILL dodge roll or use cool downs. Raising the cap isn’t going to work the way you think it is going to. But again I think it should be raised!
This thread is like watching someone trying to teach multi-variable calculus to someone who hasn’t passed basic algebra.
Solo & Roaming Group WvW Movies
Please remove the AOE cap, it definitely empowers the mindless zerg.
Yes I call it tactics to AOE choke points.
I also call it tactics to have your ORGANIZED zerg put up stability and double dodge right through it all and plow into the tower/whatever.
I agree, I think the AoE capped should be raised higher, and I would say pulling someone where you want them (choke point) is tactics. I was more appealing to the thought that “our 3 eles drop a group of 30 before they can scramble” like with stability or dodge roll is NOT tactics. If they can kill them that fast that is in now way tactics, that’s firepower. That’s blatantly dropping a nuke on North Korea saying “You cant do crap about it, good luck.”
They are saying (I believe) that those 3 should be able to wipe out 30 before they can use tactics to counter an ambush. I would say that if they are smart enough to roll out and stability up, those 3 should get their butts whooped, which is likely what is happening to them now.
Response in bold above and :
Hmm. I think it’s neat that you can drop people quickly, but they aren’t necessarily out of the fight. Their allies can either choose to assist them and give up on you temporarily (giving you time to escape the situation WITH PRIDE) or if they chase after you, you can fight them and get your fight. Obviously if the group is large enough to do both, this is the scenario where you’re fighting with your fists instead of your head. You need to break that group up a lot more.
Trust me, we understand small group tactics. You just restated what I said with stringing them out and such. My point is if they are bad enough to get dropped by our initial attack, it should really be more than that 5 people in a zergball that get downed. And yes, removing the AoE cap would definitely change things as much as we think in certain situations.
Not Just A Goodtime – 80 Asura Warrior
[PAXA]
This thread is like watching someone trying to teach multi-variable calculus to someone who hasn’t passed basic algebra.
I could do it.
Not Just A Goodtime – 80 Asura Warrior
[PAXA]
This thread is like watching someone trying to teach multi-variable calculus to someone who hasn’t passed basic algebra.
Can I figure this out on my fingers? Cause if I need to add my toes i’m out. lol
Please remove the AOE cap, it definitely empowers the mindless zerg.
Yes I call it tactics to AOE choke points.
I also call it tactics to have your ORGANIZED zerg put up stability and double dodge right through it all and plow into the tower/whatever.
I agree, I think the AoE capped should be raised higher, and I would say pulling someone where you want them (choke point) is tactics. I was more appealing to the thought that “our 3 eles drop a group of 30 before they can scramble” like with stability or dodge roll is NOT tactics. If they can kill them that fast that is in now way tactics, that’s firepower. That’s blatantly dropping a nuke on North Korea saying “You cant do crap about it, good luck.”
They are saying (I believe) that those 3 should be able to wipe out 30 before they can use tactics to counter an ambush. I would say that if they are smart enough to roll out and stability up, those 3 should get their butts whooped, which is likely what is happening to them now.
Since two of my guildies have pointed out what I meant already clearly about 3 eles and 30 zergers clumped can someone else try and explain what I ALREADY CLEARLY wrote. Oozo wanna help him out here? Mezo go back and retread what I wrote oringinally and read what you just “thought” we meant. Good heavens.
Mkay. I don’t think you guys are giving your enemy enough credit. If they are killing you, then you are fighting too big of a group, or they are more skilled than you think. Even if the zerg of 30 mostly “unskilled” if they have 1/6th of their group skilled enough to dodge roll, they are gonna wipe you. And you should wipe to that, you should not win that fight. I wont “pander” to you guys, I’m obviously not quite on your level, maybe my humble tactics on how to break them down might be put to use by you and you might have an epiphany.
Thanks for your time, you made my Friday after lunch fly by, 15 more minutes til I’m outta here! Good luck with your “tactics”!
Lol at least we agree on raising the Aoe cap. That would keep me from ever having another conversation with you ever Mezo. Plz Anet just raise that crap.
I think it is funny that people think they know that the zerg doesn’t have skill when they really have no clue at all. Juat a bunch of assumptions based upon their ego after getting rolled by that zerg.
I also think that a lot of you people have other issues seeing as how you feel people should be punished just because they don’t have any game knowledge. Never heard of newbs before obviously.
A lot of ego stroking in here from those that think they have the 733tz skillzzzz.
Ignorant comment man. There are numerous 5 mans with video footage of 5 rickrolling your “you have no idea about us Zerg”… If there was so much unfairly unnoticed skill those videos wouldn’t exist. Not here to troll, not interested in mindless conversation. Interested in Anet waking up and making the game COMPETITIVE.
The one that needs to ego stroke is the one calling my post ignorant.
Hitting close to your home I know.
(edited by CreativeAnarchy.6324)
Mkay. I don’t think you guys are giving your enemy enough credit. If they are killing you, then you are fighting too big of a group, or they are more skilled than you think. Even if the zerg of 30 mostly “unskilled” if they have 1/6th of their group skilled enough to dodge roll, they are gonna wipe you. And you should wipe to that, you should not win that fight. I wont “pander” to you guys, I’m obviously not quite on your level, maybe my humble tactics on how to break them down might be put to use by you and you might have an epiphany.
Thanks for your time, you made my Friday after lunch fly by, 15 more minutes til I’m outta here! Good luck with your “tactics”!
Oh boy. We aren’t complaining about wiping to zergs. Small groups being hindered by game mechanics is what we are talking about.
Not Just A Goodtime – 80 Asura Warrior
[PAXA]
The one that needs to ego stroke is the one calling my post ignorant.
Hitting close to your home I know.
Yup, he’s definitely stroking his ego. Hit the nail on the head with that one, buddy!
Not Just A Goodtime – 80 Asura Warrior
[PAXA]
This is all I am getting from this post:
Tetsuo= roamers/small groups
Vs
The Tank=large groups/zergs
(edited by AydenStar.4216)
I read a lot of post are more or less come from “we lost horribily against a zerg, we went 5v30! Lets buff the 5 people and nerf the 30 so we can fight them!” but isn’t losing horribly is suppose to happen when you are heavily out numbered?
I think the problem is not “zerg is OP omg”, I think the problem rose from not having enough intel for players. The fog of war is the one that OP in this situation. Give player more intel thru UI design would solve most of the problem of steamrolled by zerg as the player can avoid 1v6 situation more easily and more convenient to make tactical plan.
on the other hand, more robust UI intel would be beneficial for commanders to break off zergs to pursued tactical advantage, instead of size advantage
but until then chat is our main source of intel, and zerg is the most reliable advantage in this fog of war
Lol you’re suggesting radar. Daoc died because of radar. Good idea. Ask Anet what they think about radar.
I read a lot of post are more or less come from “we lost horribily against a zerg, we went 5v30! Lets buff the 5 people and nerf the 30 so we can fight them!” but isn’t losing horribly is suppose to happen when you are heavily out numbered?
I think the problem is not “zerg is OP omg”, I think the problem rose from not having enough intel for players. The fog of war is the one that OP in this situation. Give player more intel thru UI design would solve most of the problem of steamrolled by zerg as the player can avoid 1v6 situation more easily and more convenient to make tactical plan.
on the other hand, more robust UI intel would be beneficial for commanders to break off zergs to pursued tactical advantage, instead of size advantage
but until then chat is our main source of intel, and zerg is the most reliable advantage in this fog of war
No one is asking to nerf 30. Ppl are asking for a small chance to win. Lets look at hockey, guy gets a penalty it’s 5 on 4. So the guys that have 4 should never have a chance to score ever? Then why not just give the team with more numbers a goal instead. This is how wvw is right now. Look at it this way. Screw small man lets go with small pop server. If the aoe cap was adjusted they would have a better chance aginst a higher pop server if they played smart. Atleast give them a fighting chance. Would also help in off hours as well. Same thing goes with small group fights. If u out play the Zerg u have a chance to win.
There’s no fog here at all. Thing is this aoe cap adjustment would effect Zerg vs Zerg as well. Your in the 30 man Zerg up against a 60 man one. Wouldn’t you want a chance to kill them if u played smarter then them even if thechance is small. Just sucks the game is designed around numbers not skill ATM.
I’ve personally held a tower against a group of 30 by myself before. It isn’t that hard to figure out how to do it, either. I went up to a vantage point that gave me a view of the door, and then built a superior arrow cart up there by myself. I sat there waiting for awhile, and then when a large enemy group came up and started making rams, I rained down damage against them and they had to abandon their pursuit. This group lacked the wit to defeat me, so I was all proud afterward.
That said, I wouldn’t mind more equipment that either punishes large groups or strengthens the little man. The hard part about this is that most things that help the little man also help the big one even more. Take the AoE limits. Now, a lot of players are saying that removing the AoE limits will benefit the little guy, but the fact is that it benefits the giant zergs more. Without the AoE boon limit, zergs would be running around permanently under maximum might, invisible, and with 100% uptime on retaliation. So instead you would have to get rid of the AoE limit for just damaging attacks, but even then this leads to more abuse via retaliation, since instead of just 5 ticks you can now be hit for 50 ticks. Removing the AoE cap, even on just offense, makes the whole game about retaliation then.
Lets say you want more mobile siege that isn’t as expensive as golems, letting groups get mobility and strength. That’s nice, until you realize that zergs can make them too, and so zergs change from giant balls of players to giant balls of players and roaming chariots. Since the bigger groups have more people and more supplies that have better abilities to make these things.
Lets say you want to make damaging traps in WvW. It sounds great, because when players bunch up they’ll take a ton of damage, and with the low cost of traps it can make defense and offense better. But then, the zerg balls get these traps, too, and suddenly your small group can’t wander anywhere because damage traps litter the field and are in every camp, every tower, and every keep.
Lets say you want to remove the in-keep waypoints. That way, it is easier to assault different points on the map while making it harder for a giant zerg ball to rush in and stomp you. Problem is, the giant zerg ball can do this too, so without the sheer numbers to defend the towers and keeps the zerg ball will just run through everything, smashing through defenses like they’re paper while taking everything and your group can’t get there fast enough to defend. Because they stay together they stay alive, and by staying alive they can maintain more presence at the frontlines.
I wrack my mind with this frequently. I’ll think of something that I think will help out the little man, but then I think about it more and I discover that it’ll help out the big groups more. At the end of the day, pretty whomever has superior numbers has the advantage. The best things I can come up with are the removal of the AoE damage cap (which CAN bite you back but won’t always), and damaging traps which indeed are more effective against tightly packed groups. At the same time, this will make things harder for smaller groups, but it can give them an edge if used right.
A lot of people in this thread are so busy arguing over feelings they are missing the facts. Blood has a pretty good analysis here so it bears emphasizing. Just about every notion in this thread about how to let small groups “compete” with large groups will have serious side effects.
I have many memories of taking on larger (sometimes much larger) forces in small groups and beating them under the existing rule sets. I also have many, many, many more memories of getting my butt kicked by larger groups.
And, you know what, that is okay. It is supposed to be hard for a small group to beat a larger group. That is what makes it awesome when you finally pull it off. It is supposed to mean something when you accomplish the impossible. You are supposed to stop for a second and say “Holy crap, did we just do that?”
stuff
I just want to talk about boons they wont have 100% up time on anything unless they are organized zerg which I know is out there and that’s cool. The reason boons are not on 100% of the time is cause u cant zergball no more you need to spread out and if ur not by ur guard (for example) your not getting boons from him no more cause your out of range.
There’s a problem with that, though. If the group gathers together AND stacks retaliation up, then they lose the need to ever fragment themselves. They can just stack up all the boons they want because whomever attacks them will be hit with 50 ticks of retaliation for every attack. Even if you assume it only does about 200 damage per tick that comes to 10,000 damage with every AoE. It’s enough to drop a zerker elementalist or thief in one attack. Even while wandering around when not in combat, they can keep permanent uptime on retaliation without using blast finishers. They can also keep permanent stealth up, and also have better stability.
Removing the AoE caps on boons just helps the bigger groups get stronger and smaller groups fall behind. The bigger groups get more classes, they get more boons, and they get better boons. They also get better heals, and more AoEs to fight back with. Ultimately, the boon target cap MUST remain in place, especially if the AoE target damage cap is removed.
Some things to think about:
3) People who often consider themselves to be part of the “small skilled group” fighting the “mindless zergs” in games generally can’t handle getting killed very well so they like to blame other factors for their loss rather than accepting they picked a fight they couldn’t win. It was this way in EVE and this way in WAR and it is this way in GW2.
I couldn’t agree with this more, I wanted to do small mans at first but then I just realized it’s just a bunch of people who fit perfectly into this point. If small mans really wanted to play on an even playing field with no excuses they would play spvp tournaments, or rent a spvp aerver and host 8v8 / 5v5 team death-matches with other small mans.
Keyser Soze 80 Warrior | Muted 80 Mesmer | Crim De La Crim 80 Necro |
Server: Jade Quarry
I read a lot of post are more or less come from “we lost horribily against a zerg, we went 5v30! Lets buff the 5 people and nerf the 30 so we can fight them!” but isn’t losing horribly is suppose to happen when you are heavily out numbered?
I think the problem is not “zerg is OP omg”, I think the problem rose from not having enough intel for players. The fog of war is the one that OP in this situation. Give player more intel thru UI design would solve most of the problem of steamrolled by zerg as the player can avoid 1v6 situation more easily and more convenient to make tactical plan.
on the other hand, more robust UI intel would be beneficial for commanders to break off zergs to pursued tactical advantage, instead of size advantage
but until then chat is our main source of intel, and zerg is the most reliable advantage in this fog of war
No one is asking to nerf 30. Ppl are asking for a small chance to win. Lets look at hockey, guy gets a penalty it’s 5 on 4. So the guys that have 4 should never have a chance to score ever? Then why not just give the team with more numbers a goal instead. This is how wvw is right now. Look at it this way. Screw small man lets go with small pop server. If the aoe cap was adjusted they would have a better chance aginst a higher pop server if they played smart. Atleast give them a fighting chance. Would also help in off hours as well. Same thing goes with small group fights. If u out play the Zerg u have a chance to win.
There’s no fog here at all. Thing is this aoe cap adjustment would effect Zerg vs Zerg as well. Your in the 30 man Zerg up against a 60 man one. Wouldn’t you want a chance to kill them if u played smarter then them even if thechance is small. Just sucks the game is designed around numbers not skill ATM.
oh nonono, you had me mistaken, I am just suggesting maybe the game mechanic is fine where they are. The game just needs to address the problem of over usage of zerg tactics at the root, instead of changing mechanics around to discourage people to bunch up.
And my theory was that it’s fog of war in WvW that encourage people to bunch up in the first place, and no subcrazy, fog of war doesn’t mean water vapors in the air. Fog of war in this context means the lack of situation awareness and uncertainties in battlefield. And Fog of war in WvW is pretty high in my opinion, considering that most players have no idea of ally size, left alone location nor enemy size. When people have no idea what they are dealing with, they go for the next most certain thing, which is number.
an idea I would like to see implement in the game is simple, commanders have status options and squad size indicator, and also one thing I would like to add to that is to be able to see squad mate position at all time, you can read more about it from here
that should help player to make a sound tactical decision, as well as helping the force with minority manpower. And with that zerging is no long the ONLY viable option in WvW combat.
you see, I am all for the “small man” here subcrazy. I am just saying that maybe changing the game mechanic might not be the best way to dissolve the zerging phenomenon. The better way to go about this is to promote strategic game play, instead of slap the wrist of zergers by changing the game mechanic.
(edited by ManSlayer.8650)
stuff
I just want to talk about boons they wont have 100% up time on anything unless they are organized zerg which I know is out there and that’s cool. The reason boons are not on 100% of the time is cause u cant zergball no more you need to spread out and if ur not by ur guard (for example) your not getting boons from him no more cause your out of range.
There’s a problem with that, though. If the group gathers together AND stacks retaliation up, then they lose the need to ever fragment themselves. They can just stack up all the boons they want because whomever attacks them will be hit with 50 ticks of retaliation for every attack. Even if you assume it only does about 200 damage per tick that comes to 10,000 damage with every AoE. It’s enough to drop a zerker elementalist or thief in one attack. Even while wandering around when not in combat, they can keep permanent uptime on retaliation without using blast finishers. They can also keep permanent stealth up, and also have better stability.
Removing the AoE caps on boons just helps the bigger groups get stronger and smaller groups fall behind. The bigger groups get more classes, they get more boons, and they get better boons. They also get better heals, and more AoEs to fight back with. Ultimately, the boon target cap MUST remain in place, especially if the AoE target damage cap is removed.
It would obviously need tweaking rather than just getting rid of the AoE cap – for example making boon spreading group based. That’s just the simplest idea off the top of my head that could work.
Not Just A Goodtime – 80 Asura Warrior
[PAXA]
Basic overview:
- 5 man group, hit by all basic aoes because of AOE cap.
- (Even small) Zerg, 5 people out of zerg hit by aoes because of AOE cap.
Paraphrased: “Zerging should not be the only viable method of winning”.
Seems like the developing parties are purposely missing the basic tactics 101 from their desire to have “more tactical gameplay” in WvW. So, to make it as simply said as possible: Remove the AOE cap, remove the problem.
“Throw down more siege, powerbuild hur hur” should not be the proper response to this issue. The WvW Future post was a gigantic slap in the face for some of us.
Violent Tendency [vT]; twitch.tv/agriope & YouTube Agriope
#ProfessionalNomad
Wow…so you hate the retal…
are you a thief?
No AOE cap, no cap retal incoming. You do barage/meteor, hit 60 people, 200*60 = 12000, for 1 hit. (boon capped ? Sure, you can make sure there are 12 guardian inside your zerg, make party, each party has a guard + any class with blast finisher (boon favor party) = all 60 get retal.). Remove AOE cap just make zerg bigger and bigger and the one who can put retal boon in entire zerg win the battle.
(edited by deviller.9135)
Lol I love the response “put more seige down”… Clearly you guys that say that have zero experience in open field combat, or just don’t win when you do do it.
Anet kitten the outmanned side further with their arrowcart patch. Now the more populated side will just cap all the maps at night and sit in their tier3 towers stacked with arrowcarts during the day.
I doubt that was the intention though but they still managed to make the game stale and boring in one swift move.
It makes perfect sense, and is the way it should be … Brains/Organization > Ignorance/Unorganized.
Numbers shouldn’t mean anything if your all just drooling and tripping over each other, in fact friendly fire should be added just for those situations so the organized players can sit back and watch baddies kill themselves.
No AOE cap, no cap retal incoming. You do barage/meteor, hit 60 people, 200*60 = 12000, for 1 hit. (boon capped ? Sure, you can make sure there are 12 guardian inside your zerg, make party, each party has a guard + any class with blast finisher (boon favor party) = all 60 get retal.). Remove AOE cap just make zerg bigger and bigger and the one who can put retal boon in entire zerg win the battle.
I calculated it out once assuming the removal of the boon target limit, and you only need 4 guardians for permanent uptime, assuming realistic circumstances:
Lets say that you have a guardian with 30 in virtues and 10 in Honor, with the trait Superior Aria. This gives Stand Your Ground a 24 second recharge while having a 6.5 second duration Vengeance. Then you take 24 / 6.5 and you’ll come up with 4 guardians for permanent retaliation uptime. As an extra bonus, this also gives permanent stability uptime.
Now, there are many ways you can make guardian builds to do this, but I chose this method over more extreme ones because it requires minimal investment. 40 trait points and one trait, and then you are good to go. Hence, why it is I am so afraid of removing a boon target cap.
(edited by Blood Red Arachnid.2493)
It makes perfect sense, and is the way it should be … Brains/Organization > Ignorance/Unorganized.
Numbers shouldn’t mean anything if your all just drooling and tripping over each other, in fact friendly fire should be added just for those situations so the organized players can sit back and watch baddies kill themselves.
That would be awesome! Everyone who stacks boons gets destroyed. Try to push out of your tower and your own eles wreck you.
Organized Groups = simultaneous soloing of all supply camps on a map = problem for enemy servers.
Small groups trying to kill zergs are doing it wrong, guerrilla harassment and resource denial should really be used a lot more often… The problem with a zerg is that it becomes a massive target screaming “counter me, counter me!” Learn from Starcraft, people. A zerg without supplies is a useless zerg.
If camps could be on 1 hour “unable to flip” buff, or if maps would be 4-5 times bigger, I’d actually agree with you