Guild Wars 2

I’m sorry, I just don’t understand you people.

World vs world, this implies WAR, WAR is not a 2x 2 x2 or a 10 × 10 × 10 fight, if you enjoy small scale fighting all the time, you can always go play those battlegrouds.

WvW is world vs world, three servers fighting, its a game of stratergy or bruteforce.

There will always be zergs in war, in real life and in games.

If you can’t face that fact, wvw isn’t for you.

Oh nice, zerglings found the “new topic” button..

Zergs means skill lag.
Means no skill just more numbers.. so boring
At the moment its all about the numbers.. We don’t even have to play
ANET should just check how many people each side has in a zone every 30 minutes and give points accordingly.

This is no WAR this is a GAME . a game should be fun.
A game where your only skill needs to be stick with the commander and have more people with the commander isn’t fun.

I run alone taking yaks, sentries, camps, ogres, dredge, quaggan, doing support (building siege and repair) or just roam. I get ganked by small groups and zergs. I have fun.

I run with groups doings same things as solo, plus taking towers and have group fights. We get wiped by bigger groups and zergs. I have fun.

I run with zergs doing same things and taking keeps, garrisons, Stonemist and have massive battles in open. We get wiped by bigger zergs. I have fun.

If you like to run in smaller group (or even solo) nothing is really stopping you. Afraid that you get ganked by bigger force? It happens, get over it. Don’t join zerg if you don’t like it or do you justify it by saying that enemy has zerg, so we have to have gather up and have a bigger zerg. Don’t worry, there are people in enemy side that says the same thing.

i’m not a zergling, I just accept it is part of a WAR game.

Strategy can trump numbers, this is true in life and in game, running around in a blob means those players lose their identity, a lesser group who good leadership can out move the larger force, an even better smaller group can focus target key players, and perform an organized retreat while another group takes a key location.

in the end their zerg will have to split or lose keep.

in the end its all about stratergy, if you have no good commanders or players able to do it, then well.. your screwed.

Direwind.8409:

i’m not a zergling, I just accept it is part of a WAR game.

Strategy can trump numbers, this is true in life and in game, running around in a blob means those players lose their identity, a lesser group who good leadership can out move the larger force, an even better smaller group can focus target key players, and perform an organized retreat while another group takes a key location.

in the end their zerg will have to split or lose keep.

in the end its all about stratergy, if you have no good commanders or players able to do it, then well.. your screwed.

Hi, you must be new!

I dunno if it’s low tier servers who are just unaware of how strategic it can be but resorting to these ridiculous titles like “zergling” is a big roadblock in your understanding of how WvW works so far.

Quells.2498:

ridiculous titles like “zergling”

A member of a zerg is a zergling, no? And OP mentioned the word “zerg” in his topic.. :p

And why the reference to low tier servers? :p

What people complain about is Blobbing, not Zerging.

You may say “Where’s the difference, former is bigger than latter and that’s it”, but the issues are deeper.

Blobbing is skill-less playing. Turn off brain and follow blue tag. It brings lag for the whole map. It makes the game unenjoyable and boring. Just gather the whole map population of your side to commander and start running around like a mass of locusts.

“Zerging” is a smaller group, which means you have 2-3 or more of them on the field at same time. Zergs are usually guild groups, 20-30ish size. Zerg vs Zerg has no lag. No lag + Guild team = skill matters. Having multiple zergs at same time on map rewards tactical playing and coordination for striking your enemy hard and on multiple fronts.

The issue is that a lot of servers are leaning on the formet kind of play, cause due to game mechanics is easier to run and thus usually more effective. Which is making WvW less and less enjoyiable day by day.

Not every class is useful to a zerg.

Thieves offer nothing.
Rangers offer next to nothing.
Necros suffer because of the insane amounts of condition cleansing.
Engineers are boring.

You then run into the lag problem.
The fact that no other form of play is rewarded nearly as much.
There’s no other strategy or tactic in this game other than zerging.
There’s no anti-zerg option even when defending something like garrison.

It’s just boring. And while every other MMO out there has had zerging in one form or another, the other games offered other options to it and rewarded more than it. WvW is a bust in this game. It was stale 6 months ago. Nothing of value has been added since and nothing has changed as far as tactics or strategy since the game launched.

I don’t blame the zerg – I blame Anet.

Zergs (blobs – definitions may vary) cause lag. Anet promote zerg play and don’t solve lag. And this is just the start.

Anet give us:
• A map that is smallish. I’m “OK” with its size since already mentioned they can’t do anything there – but its too easy to navigate around, not enough vantage positions, choke, obstacles, bridges… objectives don’t hold anything, other than points.
• AoE cap
• WPs
• Fauna/NPCs with rally mechanics

All this leads to:
• Zerg is the best (if not only) way to play for the win (which is meaningless with 7 days reset and no real impact)
• If you don’t like zergs (i.e. to feel more part of the fight) – forget the points (WPs/map navigation means zerg will b there in 2min max), just go roaming trying to find decent fights – but this has evolved to GvG (more and more) and away from WvW mechanics.
• Strategy? what strategy? Zerg or GvG in windmill – that seems the future right now.

Overall, with current ruleset / map designs I don’t see WvW as a viable long term game mode – future of it to me looks bleak.

… and then there is the karma trains when opponent is weak – tons of fun warrantied to both sides!

If they start by changing ONE thing, maybe will see a new light on the tunnel… like pouring rocks and sand over those quaggans in the lakes – jeez, what a waste of space!

The thing is, that in 1v1 all the way through 10v10, 20v20 up to about 30v30, you can see real skill and talent making a difference. Once you get into the realm of 50+vs50+, individual skill means absolutely nothing, and it usually degenerates into who lags the least, rather than who plays the best. In clashes on that scale, because of lag, aoe limits, etc. it really doesn’t matter what you do or how you play, because all that matters is numbers and lag.

Thats why people find zerging boring.

Personally, if people want to play that way, I’m fine with letting them, as long as there are other small groups to fight (which, unfortunately, is often not the case). However, the reason I find zerging so offensive, not just boring, is that it is also by far the most effective way to play WvW. In terms of server points, XP, WXP, loot, karma, just about everything. Its the fact that zerging is so effective, and boring, that is why people are so angry with it. If it was only one or the other, then it wouldn’t be so much of a problem.

In theory a few teams of smaller groups of 10-20 players should be able to out-manoeuvre a single blob of 100 players. However, with the way the game and the maps are designed, that just isn’t the case. Blobs can easily defend/attack all objectives on a map, because it only takes 20 seconds to travel between them.

Unorganized Group in a Normal fight: press 1
Unorganized Group in a Lag Fight: press 1

Organized Group in a Normal fight: Rotation of utilities, leaps, knockdowns, stuns, stun breaks, water fields, blast finishers, positioning on and on
Organized Group in a Lag fight: press 1

See the issue?

Post a made a while back on Jackie’s topic.

LilMcGinley.3890:

Unorganized Group in a Normal fight: press 1
Unorganized Group in a Lag Fight: press 1

Organized Group in a Normal fight: Rotation of utilities, leaps, knockdowns, stuns, stun breaks, water fields, blast finishers, positioning on and on
Organized Group in a Lag fight: press 1

I am a semi-recent transfer to TC; been there about 6 or 7 weeks now having come from both Kaineng and FC before that. TC is probably the 4th largest of all the servers, possibly 3rd, and I still only get hit badly by skill lag a few fights a week. The majority of my play, even in zerg vs. zerg (or ball vs ball), I’m still able to do things like blast a water field or use my hammer skills. Yes sometimes I have to hit my blast skill 3 times before it goes off, but it does. It changes the game, makes it more hectic yes, but do you think that fighting a real WAR vs 100+ people is more hectic that a 1v1 fight? Probably.

If it is just BG, SOR, and JQ that are impacted by this then I still agree we need to solve it, however, we should also realize that a majority of the game population is not getting crushed by this issue. If it bothers you that much I agree with the people who’ve said “transfer”. We can’t all have our cake, eat it, and still have another cake to look at so make a choice and stop complaining.

Much Love,

Bane(lene)

baillenheif.7526:

LilMcGinley.3890:

Unorganized Group in a Normal fight: press 1
Unorganized Group in a Lag Fight: press 1

Organized Group in a Normal fight: Rotation of utilities, leaps, knockdowns, stuns, stun breaks, water fields, blast finishers, positioning on and on
Organized Group in a Lag fight: press 1

I am a semi-recent transfer to TC; been there about 6 or 7 weeks now having come from both Kaineng and FC before that. TC is probably the 4th largest of all the servers, possibly 3rd, and I still only get hit badly by skill lag a few fights a week. The majority of my play, even in zerg vs. zerg (or ball vs ball), I’m still able to do things like blast a water field or use my hammer skills. Yes sometimes I have to hit my blast skill 3 times before it goes off, but it does. It changes the game, makes it more hectic yes, but do you think that fighting a real WAR vs 100+ people is more hectic that a 1v1 fight? Probably.

If it is just BG, SOR, and JQ that are impacted by this then I still agree we need to solve it, however, we should also realize that a majority of the game population is not getting crushed by this issue. If it bothers you that much I agree with the people who’ve said “transfer”. We can’t all have our cake, eat it, and still have another cake to look at so make a choice and stop complaining.

Much Love,

Bane(lene)

I’ve played on ET (T8) with this kind of lag. It is not purely a T1 issue.

3sec delay on skill usage can make things a lot less fun

You know what, this is what would happen if they Enforced smaller fights..

rather than seeing WAAA zergs are boring, you’d see WAAA this game sucks its ruled by premades, premades are rolling over the pugs WAAAA change wvw so its pug only.

Direwind.8409:

You know what, this is what would happen if they Enforced smaller fights..

rather than seeing WAAA zergs are boring, you’d see WAAA this game sucks its ruled by premades, premades are rolling over the pugs WAAAA change wvw so its pug only.

I think you would see more of a “EU Approach” honestly. The NA side always play for the PPT or for the victory.. EU mostly plays for fights, GvGs and bettering themselves as gamers rather than just throwing numbers at a problem or relying on thrown together zergs to win.

LilMcGinley.3890:

I think you would see more of a “EU Approach” honestly.

I may be a bit biased as Eu player, but i think that pushing WvW towards the “EU way” (multiple smaller zergs) of playing should be one of Anet priorities.

AndrewSX.3794:

LilMcGinley.3890:

I think you would see more of a “EU Approach” honestly.

I may be a bit biased as Eu player, but i think that pushing WvW towards the “EU way” (multiple smaller zergs) of playing should be one of Anet priorities.

As an NA player, I’m jelly… I run with [AGG] a lot on JQ and it seems that most players will keep/tower hug and are afraid to die, opting to sit on an arrow cart or ballista to get a few easy kills rather than learn to fight. If they do fight, and lose, they call in a huge 80 man zerg to kill us.

I wish there wasn’t a 5-8 hour time difference between NA and EU.. I’d really love to fight some of y’alls guilds.

How do you change this on the NA side though?

I’m sorry this war looks nothing like a war imo. Just two-three acidic blobs speeding around the map melting everything in sight only to collide and lag the map. There is no coordination, there is no strategy, and there is little meaning to being a part of such a mess. For starters I don’t even fear dying because I know I can be revived in 2-5 seconds (if my team is any good) of going down to begin the process all over again.

Direwind.8409:

I’m sorry, I just don’t understand you people.

World vs world, this implies WAR, WAR is not a 2x 2 x2 or a 10 × 10 × 10 fight, if you enjoy small scale fighting all the time, you can always go play those battlegrouds.

WvW is world vs world, three servers fighting, its a game of stratergy or bruteforce.

There will always be zergs in war, in real life and in games.

If you can’t face that fact, wvw isn’t for you.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Bye-bye-WVW

People leave, Anet loses customers, you are left with no one to fight.

What strategy? How to herd your lemmings better? lol..

Next thing you’l say is that wvw is skill..

Maybe he is right. Maybe all those players that want any form of balance should stop playing WvW, since its all about numbers and having more and nothing to do with skill and outplaying opponents.

There is still fun to be had when you meet the right opponents luckily. Far Shiverpeaks and Miller’s Sound have lots of guild groups running around. Other servers have a bit less guild groups and are hit and miss whether you’re on the right borderland to find them. Some servers have perhaps one guild group and are a huge drag to fight against. These servers generally also cause the more fun servers to team up as well to counter their blob, ruining the entire matchup for a week.

Nobody has issues with there being zergs, the issues are with there being nothing but one giant zerg to fight. There’s a huge difference in those two. The ideal situation is one zerg (30-40) for the random people, one big (20+) guild group, 2 or 3 medium sized (10-15) and some smaller groups (1-5) in my opinion. This would assume a population cap of around 100 though, which I’m not sure is the case.

Since the map is rather small, there will frequently be groups adding on to eachother’s fights, which is fine (chaotic element makes WvW exciting) as long as the two bigger groups stay on different sides of the map. There should be no major issues with skill lag and the groups stay small enough to promote skill. Sadly at the moment it’s more frequently like this:
60-80 man blob, 10 scouts on arrow carts. If the previously mentioned ‘setup’ were to meet this server, there are 2 options:
1) All the groups get together to fight the blob and not have any fun
2) All the groups resort to PvD&AC in different locations, one group at a time getting wiped by the blob and nobody having any fun

It’s not even zerging that ruins WvW, it’s PvDoor and blobbing.

All the basic forms of WvW combat have strategy. Zergs have a group strategy. Players inside the zerg have one goal… to follow instructions. Solo is about self reliance and individual skill. Skirmish is about overlapping skills and leveraging your teammates. They are all valid, useful and in their own ways fun. I personally find skirmish to be the most rewarding and difficult since it takes both a group strategy and solo skill to be effective.

Atherakhia.4086:

Not every class is useful to a zerg.

Thieves offer nothing.
Rangers offer next to nothing.
Necros suffer because of the insane amounts of condition cleansing.
Engineers are boring.

I understand where you are coming from with this but it is selling these classes short. Thieves have the best blast finisher and that alone makes some useful. Rangers have the best water field. Necro marks have no player cap and they are the natural counter to the guardian. Necros have become a power class in the zerg. Engineers… don’t play one so I won’t comment about how boring they are to play.

I don’t get the QQ either. So many whiners. If you are not having fun playing a game, why do you STILL PLAY THE GAME? Stop threatening to quit and just quit. Stop telling anet they’re ruining the game and losing player base. They’re not ruining MY game. I’m having a blast and I’m sticking around.

Bogey.5423:

I run alone taking yaks, sentries, camps, ogres, dredge, quaggan, doing support (building siege and repair) or just roam. I get ganked by small groups and zergs. I have fun.

I run with groups doings same things as solo, plus taking towers and have group fights. We get wiped by bigger groups and zergs. I have fun.

I run with zergs doing same things and taking keeps, garrisons, Stonemist and have massive battles in open. We get wiped by bigger zergs. I have fun.

If you like to run in smaller group (or even solo) nothing is really stopping you. Afraid that you get ganked by bigger force? It happens, get over it. Don’t join zerg if you don’t like it or do you justify it by saying that enemy has zerg, so we have to have gather up and have a bigger zerg. Don’t worry, there are people in enemy side that says the same thing.

Great post and I’m on board 100%. I have fun in WvW.

LilMcGinley.3890:

I’ve played on ET (T8) with this kind of lag. It is not purely a T1 issue.

Born on ET (and still here). I can’t recall any instance where I’ve had skill lag.

I have to agree with the OP here. I see a trade off between skill-lag/ blob tactics, and less than 100% coverage. Anet should not have to punish or reward any type of tactics here. The game mode is determined by the players. I know of several players who do not engage in zerging, and find great enjoyment out of running havoc squads and camp capping.

That’s the other trade off: rewards. If you want to get a ton of kills, wxp, karma, and what-not, you will have to go where the greatest concentration of action is. If you want individual glory, team tactics, underdog battles, then you are getting less of the rewards for engaging high numbers of enemies. Bag city is lag city, after all.

I do love the paradox between raiding and WvW: get 40 guys together, have them listen to one guy’s instructions. For raiding that’s the highest level of skill, give the best rewards please. In WvW, that’s mindless, nerf rewards please.

I say if you don’t like whats happening, then chip up and change it. Find your server’s commanders and change your tactics.

Shademehr.1397:

I don’t get the QQ either. So many whiners. If you are not having fun playing a game, why do you STILL PLAY THE GAME? Stop threatening to quit and just quit. Stop telling anet they’re ruining the game and losing player base. They’re not ruining MY game. I’m having a blast and I’m sticking around.

Bogey.5423:

I run alone taking yaks, sentries, camps, ogres, dredge, quaggan, doing support (building siege and repair) or just roam. I get ganked by small groups and zergs. I have fun.

I run with groups doings same things as solo, plus taking towers and have group fights. We get wiped by bigger groups and zergs. I have fun.

I run with zergs doing same things and taking keeps, garrisons, Stonemist and have massive battles in open. We get wiped by bigger zergs. I have fun.

If you like to run in smaller group (or even solo) nothing is really stopping you. Afraid that you get ganked by bigger force? It happens, get over it. Don’t join zerg if you don’t like it or do you justify it by saying that enemy has zerg, so we have to have gather up and have a bigger zerg. Don’t worry, there are people in enemy side that says the same thing.

Great post and I’m on board 100%. I have fun in WvW.

LilMcGinley.3890:

I’ve played on ET (T8) with this kind of lag. It is not purely a T1 issue.

Born on ET (and still here). I can’t recall any instance where I’ve had skill lag.

Go up against 2 zergs of 80 SF/HoD in 1 tower with 15 and you’ll find the lag.. trust me, it’s there.

Quells.2498:

I dunno if it’s low tier servers who are just unaware of how strategic it can be but resorting to these ridiculous titles like “zergling” is a big roadblock in your understanding of how WvW works so far.

lol , while granted there are some strategic aspect to gw2 but really it’s a joke compare to DAoC where the zerg isn’t everything. When a game allows for smaller force to use speed and stealth to effect the outcome of a battle heck even if the game allowed a smaller force to stall a larger force it create a lot more strategic fighting. If real life was like gw2 Alexander the great would never have beat the Persians with 1/5 of the number , Hannibal would never have beat Rome over and over. The so called 300 would be just a speed bump . Seige warfare wouldn’t exist. No one would even bother build walls or castles .
In GW2 a zerg moves just as fast as small groups, defensive structures offer no advantage to defenders. Defenders inside a keep have 0 hope of thinning out attackers. No battle line or movement such as flanking encircle in large scale battles . Everyone just balls up. The only tactical fighting is using terrain and abuse gimmicks like invis and portal. I can go on and on and on. And yes I play on upper tier server.

My mind is completely blown that anybody in this game is actually in favour of zerging, bring more to win and coverage wars :0

sostronk.8167:

My mind is completely blown that anybody in this game is actually in favour of zerging, bring more to win and coverage wars :0

My mind is blown that some people don’t seem to see any value in it.

Ok this is what anet should do. Toggle PvP for all PvE zones on for the top 3 servers. This way all the PvE players will migrate off and move to other servers. This way all the “hardcore” WvW guilds can have WvW and all the other server will get a higher fair weather population to help. OK…its a bad idea and would ever happen but it would be fun for PvPers and PvX players

Funny thing is, if Anet inc AoE cap like people always talk about, and made downed rezzin impossible if in combat, the zergs would lose. 5-10 mans would wipe 40-60 mans, and Anet would lose 99% of their population. Simply quit, because adjusting to actually learning to use skills and coordination is out of the question for casuals. Will never happen. Look at that business model….. = game becomes more challenging for the general population? Mass exodus of $$$ paying customers.

= Let’s keep it easy

Personally my problem lies in Skill lag. Too much zerging brings skill lag, which affects the whole map at once. I wouldn’t mind zergs if my 20man group had a chance to use it’s skills in an effort to fight back. Which sadly isn’t the case 99.9% of the time these days.

KinkyWarrior.1879:

Personally my problem lies in Skill lag. Too much zerging brings skill lag, which affects the whole map at once. I wouldn’t mind zergs if my 20man group had a chance to use it’s skills in an effort to fight back.

Games with this many people have been out for over 10 years. fact that Anet cant allow their game to function with this population is just mind blowing. What a kitten poor job they did after launch. Their “update” teams should be fired.

Jscull.2514:

KinkyWarrior.1879:

Personally my problem lies in Skill lag. Too much zerging brings skill lag, which affects the whole map at once. I wouldn’t mind zergs if my 20man group had a chance to use it’s skills in an effort to fight back.

Games with this many people have been out for over 10 years. fact that Anet cant allow their game to function with this population is just mind blowing. What a kitten poor job they did after launch. Their “update” teams should be fired.

Its well known that NCsoft use cheaper hardware than they should.
Its also well known that they are evil villains with capes and monocols, and such.

Combine these two things together and you find yourself with an underfunded project with various technical issues which can only be truly solved with MOAR MONEH.

Arena net are doing what they can with the resources they are given, just like at the start of GW1.
After a while NCsoft goes away and tries to be a fat cat elsewhere. Thats when I presume Anet will gain full control and the real work will begin.

Mogar.9216:

Hannibal would never have beat Rome over and over.

Except he didn’t though, did he? He was bested by Scipio Africanus who never lost a battle. Hannibal’s defeat led to the demise of Carthage and the prominance of Rome.

Increase number of maps, reduce queue size of each map, problem solved. Zerging is fun. Zerg busting is even more fun.

If a map can only have max of 40 people zerg, there won’t be skill lags. And there will be less blob winning the day instead of stretagy. More maps ensure people can play wvw regardless some maps are queued. Since total points come from each map, it is still a test of server coordinate effort.

Honestly, I think wvw is good already. But if there can be some rework, it has the potential of been the game of the year for stretagy game.

Dutchares.6084:

ANET should just check how many people each side has in a zone every 30 minutes and give points accordingly.

Because this could never, ever be exploited…

Shademehr.1397:

sostronk.8167:

My mind is completely blown that anybody in this game is actually in favour of zerging, bring more to win and coverage wars :0

My mind is blown that some people don’t seem to see any value in it.

What is the value in it?

Well, the lag is especially bad when JQ and BG get their double teaming guilds together on sor… I mean they make 150 man zergs and the 5 dollar servers can’t handle them

I see both sides of the argument, but I also see the flaws in the argument.

For zerging: there is something to be said about large, epic battles. Some of the funnest times I’ve had in the game were when my group of 30 people bashed against an enemy group of 50 people, and through superior tactics we won somehow. When you have so many people all attacking a single objective, and so many people defending a single objective, you get an epic feel to it. The tower feels like a well deserved, strategic victory, and even though the battle was huge there was still those piles of loot everywhere that made you feel like you contributed.

On the other hand, 1v1 to 5v5 lets you perfect tactics and really get a feel for how your toon and other player’s toons feel. You learn strategy and become a better player on an individual level. While not being nearly as epic, it is more personalized and meaningful on the individual level. You can still accomplish various goals in a small team, and you can claim that tower for your own.

There is nothing morally wrong with either of them. So, why is it that, even though it is an often complained about tactic, zerging is still favored over small skirmishes? Well, this ultimately comes down to the goals of WvW. Despite what many would have you think, the goal of WvW isn’t backstabbing roamers with your zerker thief, or soling camps. The goal is to obtain key locations and maintain them to get points. It is natural that the tactic that accomplishes this goal easier is the one to use.

The problem with small teams and solo roaming is that there is always a danger of being overrun by an enemy group twice your size. The bigger your group is, the harder and less likely it is to be plowed through by superior numbers. Every small group that gets mowed down contributes nothing to the cause, so inevitably to be successful people bunch up into a big group. In response, the enemy tries to make a bigger group, and then the arms race of group size begins. Soon, to make sure you “win” the bout, you end up having groups of astronomical proportions running about.

This arguably isn’t the superior strategy. If we take a 100 man zerg, and 5 groups of 20 players, then those 5 groups can hit 5 times as many objectives as the 100 man zerg. With enough coordination, this will be capable of maintaining more objectives and receiving more points than just a big blob. The problem is that the 100 man zerg themselves are highly mobile due to waypoints, and also whenever this zerg meets another group that other group dies quickly. So, although multi-tasking gets you more points, it also gets you less loot and higher repair costs.

So in the end we are left with a giant arms race.

I think removing the waypoint option from keeps would probably be the easiest/quickest way to break up a lot of zergs… however, that doesn’t change the fact that you can run from your starting point to the top of the map in about a minute with runspeed up. This, with bigger maps with more capture points would probably solve most issues people have with zergs.

@Blood Red Arachnid, I don’t think anyone really has an issue with the 30v50 type scenario. Its when they bring 120 and you cannot attack except for skill 1 occasionally working.

sostronk.8167:

@Blood Red Arachnid, I don’t think anyone really has an issue with the 30v50 type scenario. Its when they bring 120 and you cannot attack except for skill 1 occasionally working.

It’s a kitten shame BL’s have a map cap of 80 per side, otherwise you might have a good point…

Clockradio.3257:

sostronk.8167:

@Blood Red Arachnid, I don’t think anyone really has an issue with the 30v50 type scenario. Its when they bring 120 and you cannot attack except for skill 1 occasionally working.

It’s a kitten shame BL’s have a map cap of 80 per side, otherwise you might have a good point…

Where is the proof of this? I don’t believe that unless a dev comes out and states the cap.

yep. /supply info on reset night. 80 is the most any commander I have ever talked to has gotten. This is with a full coordinated group on a map, its unlikely that a random could have run away from the herd without being seen.

Clockradio.3257:

yep. /supply info on reset night. 80 is the most any commander I have ever talked to has gotten. This is with a full coordinated group on a map, its unlikely that a random could have run away from the herd without being seen.

You have my attention! Is it the same in EB? I have a suspicion EB is higher? This would explain why I loathe EB.

Honestly my only issue is the latency. 100 v 100? Fine, that’s a totally valid fight and SHOULD be epic as hell. Give us the bandwidth to use a skill, for goodness sake.