SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: ThiBash.5634

ThiBash.5634

This game isn’t supposed to be serious like Skyrim.

Regardless, there are those that play the game for the story. Their concerns are just as valid as balance, gameplay or other concerns because they paid for the game just like any other player.

If you can read this then it is proof that ArenaNet’s moderators just, kind and fair.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Lexx.5780

Lexx.5780

Actually the fact that this is fiction matters more than anything.. I didn’t go out yesterday and throw grenades at my enemies, or chop down a tree for crafting materials. I didn’t throw 4 random things down a well and hope I get something better back. this is a GAME, we do things in the game we would never do in real life. That’s the point. My words don’t hurt scarlet because she never existed. How about this, if my words hurt this fake plant-person’s fake feelings, I’ll pay some fake money so a fake psychiatrist can make them feel fake better. I’ll even write a fake apology letter.

I didn’t read this whole thread so this has probably already been brought up but I gotta ask, how awesome must your life be that something like this annoys you? a few thousand years ago people worried about getting eaten by a saber tooth cat, or finding food. A few hundred years ago people worried about dying from the plague or giving birth to 9 kid sbut only 2 surviving. Our grandparents had World Wars to worry about. But some of you worry because a fictional character isn’t sensitive to the death of an evil fictional character. You must have the most problem free life ever. Good on you.

You see, in my opinion, game is the real thing, as real as this computer and that tree, because it was made from real and it incorporates real values and morals, emotions, norms…you name it.
Your words may not hurt Scarlet, but your words may hurt you, if you cannot express your real values, morals etc. (see below on how to counter dis)
Games affect us because they are real, at least in a metaphorical way.
A death in fiction can affect as to the same extent as it may in real life. Also, what’s so real about real life? As you said, you do things in game that you wouldn’t in real life. In that extent, it’s more real than the real thing since nothing is holding you back.

Onto game, I have no problem with ArenaNet trying to tell their own story, I have my own story of the character that I play and that way, I can express myself.

Thanksies, Lexxypooh

Quis qustodiet custodes?

(edited by Lexx.5780)

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Keyce.8137

Keyce.8137

You see, in my opinion, game is the real thing, as real as this computer and that tree, because it was made from real and it incorporates real values and morals, emotions, norms…you name it.
Your words may not hurt Scarlet, but your words may hurt you, if you cannot express your real values, morals etc. (see below on how to counter dis)
Games affect us because they are real, at least in a metaphorical way.
A death in fiction can affect as to the same extent as it may in real life. Also, what’s so real about real life? As you said, you do things in game that you wouldn’t in real life. In that extent, it’s more real than the real thing since nothing is holding you back.

Onto game, I have no problem with ArenaNet trying to tell their own story, I have my own story of the character that I play and that way, I can express myself.

Thanksies, Lexxypooh

I agree with that last sentiment. The first character I brought into the Dead End Tavern was the only one I brought to face off against Scarlet and her forces inside Lion’s Arch. The… choice of dialogue didn’t really suit her well. She’d have preferred to go get a drink and then take a nap.

But on the other hand, this game has a T (Teen) rating. I don’t think that this part of the story was meant for an adult (or at least older) audience. It’s light-hearted.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Cuddy.6247

Cuddy.6247

Also, what’s so real about real life? As you said, you do things in game that you wouldn’t in real life. In that extent, it’s more real than the real thing since nothing is holding you back.

Except if I went and declared martial law because there was a mass murderer I’d be thrown in prison. Game’s aren’t real, period. They’re fun and entertaining. Hitting people with a hammer in Guild Wars 2 is fun, very few people (hopefully nobody) would say it would be fun to hit real people with a hammer. I don’t think being able to “do something you wouldn’t do in real life” makes it more real, in fact that’s kind of what takes away the reality.

Also for the OP, I don’t get the point of this thread other than a valid complaint about the poor selection of lines our hero had to choose (why can’t we get some more Charm-Dignity-Ferocity options? I miss having Honorable lines on my guardian, Charm on my norn and I’ll love having Ferocity as a default answer for my Mad King Thorn). Other than that, what gives? Might as well complain about WvW and PvP since we kill other players. Don’t forget to be offended by killing Bandits, Inquest and Nightmare Court since we’re being such morally upstanding and all.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: CETheLucid.3964

CETheLucid.3964

Just because you choose to correlate fiction with non-fiction does not mean others do.

You appear to be unable/unwilling to separate the two.

Saw this same nonsense when I made a comparison a bit back. An analogy can be used to make things easier to understand.

The analogy doesn’t suggest the one who made the analogy is drawing a direct correlation between the two things.

It’s impossible to believe Scarlet to be akin to any real life mass murder in any serious sense. She’s a video game character.

The fact that you think people don’t get that says something about you.

It is however a very relevant analogy when trying to make a point story/lorewise in game about why most people would celebrate or otherwise appreciate the end of Scarlet.
_

OP, it is a sad story. I’m sorry Ceara lost her mind. But it is what it is.

You can take cold solace in the fact that whatever madness and/or evil that took her, that made her Scarlet Briar, can no longer torment her. Her part in this has come to an end.

(… Besides, she went out in a big glorious Kuh-Braham!)

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Lexx.5780

Lexx.5780

Also, what’s so real about real life? As you said, you do things in game that you wouldn’t in real life. In that extent, it’s more real than the real thing since nothing is holding you back.

Except if I went and declared martial law because there was a mass murderer I’d be thrown in prison. Game’s aren’t real, period. They’re fun and entertaining. Hitting people with a hammer in Guild Wars 2 is fun, very few people (hopefully nobody) would say it would be fun to hit real people with a hammer. I don’t think being able to “do something you wouldn’t do in real life” makes it more real, in fact that’s kind of what takes away the reality. …

What I was trying to say is, that if you think, that hitting someone in the face is fun in-game, it may be your deep desire and you just couldn’t express it in real life because there is law to obey. Any character you play and how you play it says all about your personality and you can deny it countless times. In that sentiment, it is more real than the reality, because in reality, you wouldn’t do it, but you sure would like to try it. Because it’s the real you.
It’s still fiction, don’t get me wrong, but hiding behind that term to deny doing something (as some here were saying, not you), doesn’t really click.

Also, you wouldn’t get thrown into a prison if you wanted to impose martial law. The body in which hands such jurisdiction is would kindly appoint you to the nearest exit. If you have such jurisdiction, you would face court first, had it been against the law.

Also sorry to get off topic, just wanted to clarify things,

Thanksies, Lexx

Quis qustodiet custodes?

(edited by Lexx.5780)

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Cuddy.6247

Cuddy.6247

Also, what’s so real about real life? As you said, you do things in game that you wouldn’t in real life. In that extent, it’s more real than the real thing since nothing is holding you back.

Except if I went and declared martial law because there was a mass murderer I’d be thrown in prison. Game’s aren’t real, period. They’re fun and entertaining. Hitting people with a hammer in Guild Wars 2 is fun, very few people (hopefully nobody) would say it would be fun to hit real people with a hammer. I don’t think being able to “do something you wouldn’t do in real life” makes it more real, in fact that’s kind of what takes away the reality. …

What I was trying to say is, that if you think, that hitting someone in the face is fun in-game, it may be your deep desire and you just couldn’t express it in real life because there is law to obey. Any character you play and how you play it says all about your personality and you can deny it countless times. In that sentiment, it is more real than the reality, because in reality, you wouldn’t do it, but you sure would like to try it. Because it’s the real you.

No, the real me doesn’t have any desire to kill anyone. In fact, I’m sure that everyone who plays Guild Wars 2 has no inclination to kill people. Sure, maybe a few people get tired of catering to idiot customers and stocking shelves for $8/h but there’s a vast majority of moral people who have absolutely no problem killing things or making fun of killing things in a game. Why? Because it’s fiction. People can distinguish it as not being a real act of violence and not imposing on somebody else’s life or happiness (well, I guess it could inhibit happiness depending on how immature some players are).

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

No, the real me doesn’t have any desire to kill anyone. In fact, I’m sure that everyone who plays Guild Wars 2 has no inclination to kill people. Sure, maybe a few people get tired of catering to idiot customers and stocking shelves for $8/h but there’s a vast majority of moral people who have absolutely no problem killing things or making fun of killing things in a game. Why? Because it’s fiction. People can distinguish it as not being a real act of violence and not imposing on somebody else’s life or happiness (well, I guess it could inhibit happiness depending on how immature some players are).

I might express, in a bit of temper, wanting to hurt someone else. Maybe even permanently injure them. I have expressed a desire to “take this table and break it on your stupid face” once when playing Settlers of Catan and someone dropped me into a corner and left me unable to win.

Would I actually? Probably not, unless I was . . . VERY inebriated.

People who cannot distinguish between video games and actual reality need help, and I almost think the people who claim others can’t distinguish the two or separate fiction and reality need help too.

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Lexx.5780

Lexx.5780

People can distinguish it as not being a real act of violence and not imposing on somebody else’s life or happiness (well, I guess it could inhibit happiness depending on how immature some players are).

Here is where I agree with you, it is an act of fiction to kill a mass murdering person in-game. What I am saying, though, is, that the very emotions that drive such an act of fiction are real. You willfully kill him because of your personal preference (rewards you get, your morality prevails, because it’s just a fictional character that was made to kill). They are real emotions of violence but I’m not saying you’d express them in real life because you have certain boundaries (this person is a subject who feels the same as I do – has something in common with you that makes it harder for justification of, as said, act of violence).

I might express, in a bit of temper, wanting to hurt someone else. Maybe even permanently injure them. I have expressed a desire to “take this table and break it on your stupid face” once when playing Settlers of Catan and someone dropped me into a corner and left me unable to win.

Would I actually? Probably not, unless I was . . . VERY inebriated.

People who cannot distinguish between video games and actual reality need help, and I almost think the people who claim others can’t distinguish the two or separate fiction and reality need help too.

Here are expressed real emotions in a fictional space. However, when he thinks about it, his reason prevails.

Maybe you ever killed a bug in real life and your morality just doesn’t work for your phobias or personal preferences. This may not be a good example but…it’s very relative, this morality and tradition.
And to conclude, what is real is defined by your sensations, by your reason and acts of any kind, fiction or non-fiction create real responses in your real consciousness, and though you identify it as something that’s not in your morality spectrum, your reason, it’s still there – real.
That said, without games, these emotions wouldn’t ever come to your mind, because they wouldn’t have to (or well, would, if it ever came to lawless »bellum omnium contra omnes«)
Hope I had triggered just a bit of doubt in your belief if not, I respect your opinion, which, what all this I wrote as well, is.

Thanksies, Lexxypooh

Quis qustodiet custodes?

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

And to conclude, what is real is defined by your sensations, by your reason and acts of any kind, fiction or non-fiction create real responses in your real consciousness, and though you identify it as something that’s not in your morality spectrum, your reason, it’s still there – real.

Well, here’s the thing . . . and I apologize because your incredible amount of technical terminology is sort of daunting to slog through . . .

People usually can tell the difference between real and not. They can usually apply morals of their own. Whether those morals include “I can do this and get away with it, so why not?” is what you’re hitting on, which is the thing games let you do. It doesn’t matter if you haul off and kill some vulnerable NPC in Elder Scrolls because you didn’t like their sass, nor does it really matter if you go harvesting Little Sisters in Bioshock.

What matters is, well, whether the person behind the keyboard leaves the game space with that idea closely held of “I could do this terrible thing and get away with it, and nobody would know” . . . then follows through. That’s the critical piece – do they follow through?

Having angry, irrational, aggressive thoughts is not a crime and is not the semblance of an unhealthy mind. The self-control to not do those things when they come to mind? That’s what matters.

That said, without games, these emotions wouldn’t ever come to your mind, because they wouldn’t have to (or well, would, if it ever came to lawless »bellum omnium contra omnes«)

Wrong.

Without games they do come to mind, because I can definitely assure you there are people who work in retail, in fast food, or elsewhere who entertain just the same fantasies of getting back at people who annoy them. From the minor ways (slipping cayenne into food) to major (eyedrops in a drink) to downright sadistic (screwing up someone’s credit score or criminal record irreparably because nobody can prove it was not a database error).

Hope I had triggered just a bit of doubt in your belief if not, I respect your opinion, which, what all this I wrote as well, is.

Thanksies, Lexxypooh

I try to doubt everything which cannot be concrete to my senses. Especially my self-awareness. But in this context, there’s a security of opinion in what I stated before:

It is not unhealthy to ever have aggressive thoughts cross your mind, nor to even consider them realistically. It is, however, unhealthy to cross the line of making that fantasy real.

I’m sure you understand.

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Lexx.5780

Lexx.5780

That said, without games, these emotions wouldn’t ever come to your mind, because they wouldn’t have to (or well, would, if it ever came to lawless »bellum omnium contra omnes«)

This was a slip-up of mine, you are right. Or to add to my quote, war everyone against everyone is what’s happening today as you said. And with below:

It is not unhealthy to ever have aggressive thoughts cross your mind, nor to even consider them realistically. It is, however, unhealthy to cross the line of making that fantasy real.

I’m sure you understand.

You are correct again. I’d go even further and say that playing games to unwind all that extra rage is benefiting for an individual. And again, acts themselves are fictional but the notion of doing them resides in your mind.

We pretty much agree on the other points as well

Now to add something for the OP as well, try to look at a story in gw2 as you would a movie in cinema and your character as the main (or side xD) character. They may not do what you’d like them too but they do anyway. It may be difficult to integrate because of the factors we might not be aware of.

Quis qustodiet custodes?

(edited by Lexx.5780)

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: ProtoGunner.4953

ProtoGunner.4953

What a ridiculous topic. Don’t have people real problems? Concerns about a game’s protagonists making fun of a dead evil character?

I assume you will die or jump from a sky scraper if you play GTA or Bayonetta…

‘would have/would’ve been’ —> correct
‘would of been’ —> wrong

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Sergoros.4398

Sergoros.4398

What a ridiculous topic. Don’t have people real problems? Concerns about a game’s protagonists making fun of a dead evil character?

I assume you will die or jump from a sky scraper if you play GTA or Bayonetta…

Not just protagonist. Protagonist, whose character we supposedly was able to influence/create in this game. Imagine you playing Fable. All your choices are as dark as possible. U r evil to the core. And then, all your choices become “save the princes” “save a child” “give your money to poor” and etc. I mean….wtf? And same in the game. My Sylvari is Noble. But his answers on the level of the Rat. It. Does. Not. Fit. Do you understand it?

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

What a ridiculous topic. Don’t have people real problems? Concerns about a game’s protagonists making fun of a dead evil character?

I assume you will die or jump from a sky scraper if you play GTA or Bayonetta…

Not just protagonist. Protagonist, whose character we supposedly was able to influence/create in this game. Imagine you playing Fable. All your choices are as dark as possible. U r evil to the core. And then, all your choices become “save the princes” “save a child” “give your money to poor” and etc. I mean….wtf? And same in the game. My Sylvari is Noble. But his answers on the level of the Rat. It. Does. Not. Fit. Do you understand it?

I don’t understand it at all.

Fable really does do that to you, at least the second game. The third game, so I hear, was worse about it.

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Shpongle.6025

Shpongle.6025

I get that Scarlet was the villain, but I felt horrible listening to Marjory and the others joke about her death.

Previous LS updates established that she’s been driven crazy by some external force that she encountered in the Eternal Alchemy and could no longer mentally fight it. We should pity her or mourn for those she’s killed, not make childish jokes about what it felt like to deliver the death blow.

Not to be rude here, but I’m genuinely curious – do dialogue ideas get checked before they are added? If so, did no one suggest that joking about killing a mentally unstable character might be in poor taste?

Probably because they’d realise someone somewhere gets offended over something so they stuck with their own vision.

Murder is to be enjoyed while sex is to be feared. The narrow mentality of 21st century puritanism is fraught with the irrational.?

Are you Shpongled?

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Duke Nukem.6783

Duke Nukem.6783

u say that fiction can be a reflection of the society we are in…..perhaps your overly sensative response is a reflectio of how weak and cowardly half of our society (who shall remain unnamed) has become.

grow thicker skin

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Lexx.5780

Lexx.5780

u say that fiction can be a reflection of the society we are in…..perhaps your overly sensative response is a reflectio of how weak and cowardly half of our society (who shall remain unnamed) has become.

grow thicker skin

We joined into a society because we want to eliminate violent behaviour against anyone. Fiction is there to suplement that need or desire to whack someone on the head because he stole your candy. For that, we invented judical branch, that justfully resolves any issues among us (disclaimer: upper thoughts may vary from country to country and planet as a whole. For any issues you might have unresolved, contact your nearest court of law, justice served may vary).

For growing thick skin, I suggest a brilliant documentary, The Act Of Killing.
:) Lexxypooh

Quis qustodiet custodes?

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Will.6210

Will.6210

Celebrating a death is always in poor taste.

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: Darkorical.9213

Darkorical.9213

Personally I enjoy the immersion afforded by this game, I enjoy the escape from reality so yes it does bother me to see such things in the game. In fact long ago I posted a very similar thread pointing out the racism in the game.

AKA I agree with the OP

SPOILER: Jokes in bad taste.

in Battle for Lion’s Arch - Aftermath

Posted by: CETheLucid.3964

CETheLucid.3964

Celebrating a death is always in poor taste.

Personally I enjoy the immersion afforded by this game, I enjoy the escape from reality so yes it does bother me to see such things in the game. In fact long ago I posted a very similar thread pointing out the racism in the game.

AKA I agree with the OP

That depends on who you ask. Some would dance on her corpse if they could get away with it. A sense of vindication, justice served isn’t wrong.

More mature people can concede it doesn’t change anything. It doesn’t take back the damage done.

The conclusion it brings is an end to the suffering wrought and a guarantee of no further episodes of pain or turmoil brought by the individual in question.

It’s a serious moment in game.

GW2 can be serious save the people/world/LA as it can be lighthearted and fun. This is one of those serious moments.

It shouldn’t bother you all to much if you keep your perspectives in line.

It’s a game. It’s entertaining. It’s diverse. If you don’t like that particular aspect, don’t participate in that particular aspect and go do something else that you do enjoy.

Some people like it. Some people don’t and that’s okay.

If it’s all laughs and smiles all day everyday, you lose people who want something more serious and mature.

If it’s all serious and mature all day everyday, you lose people who want something a little more lighthearted and fun.

There’s a great balance in this game of both things. And that’s wonderful.

(edited by CETheLucid.3964)