Guild Wars 2

From the patch notes: Improvements of infused gear
Newly created or dropped infused ascended equipment will have empty Agony Resistance slots.

How is this an improvement?
I look at this as a backward step – let me explain:

• Previously you would get a +5 AR agony resistance on infused items automatically.

Now we have to grind for an agony resistance infused drop. This now increases the effort (not decreases) to get +5 AR back on this item.
The effort to infuse the prototype fractal backpack is expensive (>250 ecto) and this used to give us an automatic +5 AR when it got infused. Now we get a slot for AR which we now have to put an agony infusion into.
(Wiki still has the old recipe list here: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Beta_Fractal_Capacitor_ – where you get a +5 AR when it is infused. This recipe looks like it is currently bugged from other posts).

This increases the costs, time and effort to get back to the +5 AR resistance when previously infusing items. I fail to understand how this is an improvement – if someone could explain to me how increasing the effort and grind required is an improvement please do.

TPMN.1483:

This increases the costs, time and effort to get back to the +5 AR resistance when previously infusing items. I fail to understand how this is an improvement – if someone could explain to me how increasing the effort and grind required is an improvement please do.

Up to +5 it is not an improvement – but you can go beyond that. Last time i looked there were already double-digit infusions on TP (because they are buyable now).

The problem being discussed tough is that NEW infused items don’t come with a 5 agony infusion already, but have an empty slot instead. So, “old infused item” was a given 5 AR + empty versatile slot (5AR). “New infused item” is now 0 AR + empty versatile slot (5 AR) + empty agony slot (+x AR).

Many words simply to say that new infused items now have 0AR instead of 5AR, as it was the case before.

Marna Nindar.8120:

The problem being discussed tough is that NEW infused items don’t come with a 5 agony infusion already, but have an empty slot instead. So, “old infused item” was a given 5 AR + empty versatile slot (5AR). “New infused item” is now 0 AR + empty versatile slot (5 AR) + empty agony slot (+x AR).

Many words simply to say that new infused items now have 0AR instead of 5AR, as it was the case before.

Anet stated those who already had an infused item would have the free +5 agony upon update.

New infused items would be blank. This is working as intended.

Azure Prower.8701:

This is working as intended.

Yeah, the only problem here is the intention.

Azure Prower.8701:

Anet stated those who already had an infused item would have the free +5 agony upon update.

New infused items would be blank. This is working as intended.

Yes, but that isn’t the point of this thread. We know that it works as intended.

The point is simply the base amount of AR that newly crafted / acquired infused items get, wich is gone from 5 to 0, and getting those 5 back currently costs around 5G.

Marna Nindar.8120:

Azure Prower.8701:

Anet stated those who already had an infused item would have the free +5 agony upon update.

New infused items would be blank. This is working as intended.

Yes, but that isn’t the point of this thread. We know that it works as intended.

The point is simply the base amount of AR that newly crafted / acquired infused items get, wich is gone from 5 to 0, and getting those 5 back currently costs around 5G.

Infused rings did not go from 5 to 0. They went from 10 to 5 with an empty slot. I understand your complaint but after doing level 31 and 32 of fractals i can see how easy it is to get the infusions. The change happens to be no different then if you had been dropped an infused ring and then had to fill the extra slot with a versatile simple infusion. It still gets dropped with only 5AR and an empty slot. When an ascended ring drops it only has 5AR as I understand it since I don’t do fractals under 20.

Nope – ascended rings now have 0 AR when they drop.

Well don’t bother with the ascended rings. Switch some of your ascended items to a simple infusion and get to level 20 for the infused ring drops.

You will need them to have +10 AR on to be able to do the higher levels. It is already noted that the dropping of the +1 AR infusions will take a long time to get back to +10 AR on a ring. So I am still confused – how is this an improvement?

If anything it seems to increase time gating for people to do higher levels (especially new players).

Exactly. It is a grind and money sink. It also doesn’t do anything to solve the problem of specialist AR equipment for fractals that performs worse that stat infusion items in WvW and elsewhere in PvE. To my mind this update solves none of the infusion problems seen by the player base and creates a new unnecessary gear grind when none was asked for.

I’m glad some people here understand the issue. When something is listed as an improvement and it is clearly not – this is what I call dishonest.

I am yet to see a single person explain how this is an improvement.

TPMN.1483:

I’m glad some people here understand the issue. When something is listed as an improvement and it is clearly not – this is what I call dishonest.

I am yet to see a single person explain how this is an improvement.

It starts being an improvement once you put a +6 agony infusion in this new slot.

TPMN.1483:

You will need them to have +10 AR on to be able to do the higher levels. It is already noted that the dropping of the +1 AR infusions will take a long time to get back to +10 AR on a ring. So I am still confused – how is this an improvement?

If anything it seems to increase time gating for people to do higher levels (especially new players).

Just to clarify… I had 1 char to frac lvl 80 and another nearly 60, bot with 55 AR – wich they retained ofc. All my alts wear ascended jewelry because i have too many pristine relics. So i don’t need them. I hopped here because the OP brought a valid argument wich was misinterpreted and with wich I quite agree.

Edit: i quoted the wrong post, but i’m on my phone and i don’t feel like editing it :p

It would have been improved in my opinion if the “infused” items kept the +5 AR and you had the option to make it a higher level at a later date. The number of +1 infusions required and runs seems high to get back to a +5 pre FoTM changed state.

TPMN.1483:

From the patch notes: Improvements of infused gear
Newly created or dropped infused ascended equipment will have empty Agony Resistance slots.

How is this an improvement?
I look at this as a backward step – let me explain:

• Previously you would get a +5 AR agony resistance on infused items automatically.

Now we have to grind for an agony resistance infused drop. This now increases the effort (not decreases) to get +5 AR back on this item.
The effort to infuse the prototype fractal backpack is expensive (>250 ecto) and this used to give us an automatic +5 AR when it got infused. Now we get a slot for AR which we now have to put an agony infusion into.
(Wiki still has the old recipe list here: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Beta_Fractal_Capacitor_ – where you get a +5 AR when it is infused. This recipe looks like it is currently bugged from other posts).

This increases the costs, time and effort to get back to the +5 AR resistance when previously infusing items. I fail to understand how this is an improvement – if someone could explain to me how increasing the effort and grind required is an improvement please do.

Short answer: it’s not. This was clearly stated though before hand. That’s why people who actually read up on what is comming made sure to infuse their rings/backpieces BEFORE the patch hit.

Long answer: For anyone seriously interested in fractals the ability to go beyond 10 ar per ring/backitem is nice (only needed for fractal level 50 if at all) but still nice. It is more than possible to do fractal level 30 with 40 ar (5 ar infusions onto every possible ascended slot), hell even 25-30 ar is fine. Yes fractals have become more grindy. This too should not come as any supprise to people who have played the last couple of living world events.

Basically anet is going through most living world events, dungeons, farms, holiday events, etc. and redoing them this year with more grind, less reward, and more only temporary doable achievements. Don’t expect them to change that direction. It’s been evident in every bit of content of the last 3-6 months.

Also expect wintersday this year to:
a. have less events from last year
b. have a poor story and barely new content
c. provide WAY less snowflakes and holiday crafting mats
d. provide some mediorce new skins (maybe reskins of cultural armors with some freez effects?)
e. have scarlett appear cleary stating she is behind it all

Yeah, this revamp has been a pretty unpleasant experience regarding the handling of agony resist. I main a different character than I was maining when I had made all my fractal progress before. I was very happy about the decision to make fractal progress account-wide, but the character I main now didn’t have any (infused) ascended gear, putting him on a much lower level as far as agony resist. I was lucky enough to get an infused ring drop on the night of the patch with stats good for my build, but the empty agony resist slot pretty much sucked any positivity from it. Now we’re expected to spend money and time we didn’t have to spend before to get the item back to the same level it was on Monday.

As someone said above, it’s a gold sink and a grind. Even worse, it’s a gold sink and a grind where one didn’t exist before. New infused fractal ring drops should come with the +5 preinstalled just like they have been before, with the option to go higher. That still gives us the gold sink and the grind ArenaNet wanted to inflict, while making the account-wide fractal progress more relevant and still allowing for a sense of progress when we get the “lucky” drop versus the standard drop. I don’t understand why this wasn’t the route they took.

TPMN.1483:

You will need them to have +10 AR on to be able to do the higher levels. It is already noted that the dropping of the +1 AR infusions will take a long time to get back to +10 AR on a ring. So I am still confused – how is this an improvement?

Actually no, it won’t take a long time. You get at least 4 +1 infusions per full run (and it seems roughly every 5-7 fractals I get 2 +1s). You only need 16 +1 infusions (and some coin) to get to a +5 AR infusion slot. If you are even more impatient you can buy the infusions directly from the tp as well. I have 30 +1s sitting in my inventory, and that’s after selling the first dozen or so when the patch first hit, and I’m only level 36 (to be far I did repeat a level, and on another the leader decided to leave before the boss fractals :/).

If anything it seems to increase time gating for people to do higher levels (especially new players).

Anyone serious about doing fractals before most likely already had 2-3 “<item> (infused)”, this change doesn’t affect them negatively in the slightest. If anything it lets them get some money by selling their infusions or save up and get > 5 after a couple of runs. Anyone new to fractals does not need any AR for the first 10 levels (arguably 20). By the time they get to lvl 20 they will have more than enough fractal relics to get their base AR. And by the time they get to 30+ they can most likely get or drop an infused ring. And by the time they get an infused ring (or back item) they should have more than enough +1s to get at least a +5, if not more. The grind is the same as it was before, there is no increase in the time gating.

“Actually no, it won’t take a long time. You only need 16 +1 infusions (and some coin) to get to a +5 AR infusion slot. "

If you hadn’t noticed the infusions are in a geometric progression. From 16 it’s going to go up to 32 for +6, 64 for +7, 128 for +8, etc. This is going to push up the quantities required and cost of reagents up massively.

More than that, I’m assuming that once an infusion is slotted it cannot be upgraded. So if you slot a +9 you are going to need to collect two more +9s before you can make yourself a +10.

Infusion costs will drop as more come on the market, unless people stop playing fractals altogether. Right now, 30s guaranteed per fractal chest, I don’t see too many people stopping their grind. And the fact that a +5 only costs 5g on the TP, it’s not all that hard considering the cost of 250 ecto to get that 5ar back on your beta capacitor.

Stooperdale.3560:

“Actually no, it won’t take a long time. You only need 16 +1 infusions (and some coin) to get to a +5 AR infusion slot. "

If you hadn’t noticed the infusions are in a geometric progression. From 16 it’s going to go up to 32 for +6, 64 for +7, 128 for +8, etc. This is going to push up the quantities required and cost of reagents up massively.

More than that, I’m assuming that once an infusion is slotted it cannot be upgraded. So if you slot a +9 you are going to need to collect two more +9s before you can make yourself a +10.

I have noticed (and I think commented on it already, at least in other threads) the growth. My comment was directed at the person I quoted. And my point stands, it will not take a long time to replace the +5 innate infusion.

It’s already been noted a bunch of times that it kinda sucks that you can’t remove an infusion, which means most players won’t bother getting above +10 or so (it’s also been stated that when ascended armor comes out we’ll get another +30 AR). Also it won’t take “too long” to get a decent amount, a +8 will take (a little less than) 32 full runs. So even just doing 1 run a day you can get a +8 in a month.

The real shame is that you’re only rewarded in intervals of 5.

This becomes expensive :
Additional AR from agony infusion slots: there are only three gear slots that can currently hold agony infusions: the two ring slots and the back item. Although you could create agony infusions of any level, the cost becomes prohibitively expensive. For example for single +13 Agony Infusion, you have to spend 61g for the Thermocatalytic Reagents alone. To get additional +39 AR from three such upgrades requires a minimum of 183g and to get additional 45 AR from three +15 Agony Infusion upgrades means spending over 735g.

Yup it’s an increased gold sink – that’s the only way I can look at it.
It’s not just the infusions that are required but a lot of gold also – this previously was not required for the +5 AR (inherent).

i am just confused by one thing… why do ppl even bother getting those +10 etc?
55 AR is easily reachable with infusions from vendor, ascended armor gonna have more slots mostlikely…so what is the issue?

Cynz it is only easily reachable if you already had it prior to the patch.
Infused rings or backpacks no longer have a +5 AR – they now need to be crafted with reaganets using

This has now dramatically increased the cost (compared to previously) and makes a casual player find it even more difficult to obtain 55 AR. Currently it increases the cost by 15gold for each character (based on TP for the +5 agony infusions @ 5g each) – previously this was 0g when infusing a ring via the mystic forge or when an infused ring dropped from FoTM.

The reason why people are getting +10 infusions is to ensure they get 0% tick dmg at higher levels due to the new side-effects and some harder end bosses.

Given that FoTM will now also officially go beyond lvl 50 – a few (small group) of players are preparing themselves in case the cost of these goes “up” again.

TPMN.1483:

Cynz it is only easily reachable if you already had it prior to the patch.
Infused rings or backpacks no longer have a +5 AR – they now need to be crafted with reaganets using

This has now dramatically increased the cost (compared to previously) and makes a casual player find it even more difficult to obtain 55 AR. Currently it increases the cost by 15gold for each character (based on TP for the +5 agony infusions @ 5g each) – previously this was 0g when infusing a ring via the mystic forge or when an infused ring dropped from FoTM.

The reason why people are getting +10 infusions is to ensure they get 0% tick dmg at higher levels due to the new side-effects and some harder end bosses.

Given that FoTM will now also officially go beyond lvl 50 – a few (small group) of players are preparing themselves in case the cost of these goes “up” again.

No because you use a +5 Simple infusion and a +5 AR one. Know what you are talking about before talking.

Cynz.9437:

i am just confused by one thing… why do ppl even bother getting those +10 etc?
55 AR is easily reachable with infusions from vendor, ascended armor gonna have more slots mostlikely…so what is the issue?

Well the +10 don’t really have too much of a point right now. Though they have said that they plan on adding high levels/instabilities in batches of 10 or 20, so they may eventually be needed.

But I know I’d rather make a +7 and a +8 instead of getting an infused back item.

“No because you use a +5 Simple infusion and a +5 AR one. Know what you are talking about before talking.”

I have looked at this extensively new “infused rings/ascended backpacks” no longer come with the inherent +5 AR. Yes – you can put a simple infusion on to get you +5 AR.
But you are still missing +5 AR which you used to get as part of the infusion process via the mystic forge.

This will now cost you approx an extra 5g/item. It’s documented and fully explained in the patch notes.

TPMN.1483:

“No because you use a +5 Simple infusion and a +5 AR one. Know what you are talking about before talking.”

I have looked at this extensively new “infused rings/ascended backpacks” no longer come with the inherent +5 AR. Yes – you can put a simple infusion on to get you +5 AR.
But you are still missing +5 AR which you used to get as part of the infusion process via the mystic forge.

This will now cost you approx an extra 5g/item. It’s documented and fully explained in the patch notes.

you basically can’t put 2 versatile simple infusions in 1 ring with 2 slots?

Correct – you cannot do this.
You have to use 1x simple infusion AND 1x Agony infusion.

They are different infusion slots.
This is why the cost has gone up in a BIG way.

TPMN.1483:

Correct – you cannot do this.
You have to use 1x simple infusion AND 1x Agony infusion.

They are different infusion slots.
This is why the cost has gone up in a BIG way.

i guess i should be happy they only reset levels to 30 and not 55 AR we had …

still with simple infusions alone you can get around 40 AR, add ascended armor to it, i don’t think that + 1 are really that necessary unless you wanna run above lv 50

i know for fact i don’t…. simply because while agony does play a factor, in 99% of the cases you die to normal dmg from scaled up mobs

i get one shot by about anything above 40 if i don’t dodge it, i can just imagine 50+… or rather i don’t want to

People who want to go to the top of the leaderboards are the ones who will have to pay out the expenditures required. You can’t have everything you want for free, you know.

Actually making me think about this stuff.

Lets say getting 55 AR previously would cost you just the 250 ectos for the back piece.

Now you can get a +7 and +8 infusion.

Reagent cost would be about 3 gold.
You would need 192 x +1 Agony Resistance.

They are currently at about 25 silver each, which will cost you 48 gold.

So now it will cost you about 51 gold to reach 55 AR.
Previously it would cost you well over 75 gold to reach 55 AR.

Costs have gone down. Not up.

eekzie.5640:

Actually making me think about this stuff.

Lets say getting 55 AR previously would cost you just the 250 ectos for the back piece.

Now you can get a +7 and +8 infusion.

Reagent cost would be about 3 gold.
You would need 192 x +1 Agony Resistance.

They are currently at about 25 silver each, which will cost you 48 gold.

So now it will cost you about 51 gold to reach 55 AR.
Previously it would cost you well over 75 gold to reach 55 AR.

Costs have gone down. Not up.

actually it is 84g for 250 globs but ya… spent 500 ectos here hehe

Eekzie, you’re forgetting to take into account that you still need that 250 ecto to upgrade the backpiece. So it’s 75g + 51g to get 55AR. EDIT: I get what you’re saying with the +7 and +8 infusion on the rings to make up for the backpiece’s ecto requirement.

But you’re also assuming that you’re buying every single +1 infusion, that the +1 infusions will stay at 25 silver each (which they obviously won’t considering they’ve dropped 10s in ONE DAY), and that you won’t end up getting +2 or higher infusions from fractal chests as you play it.

I have zero remorse for someone who has done no fractals at all since they were introduced, or who have the skill levels necessary for a level 50 (where that 55AR is actually necessary) without actually collecting or crafting +5 inherent infused rings and backpieces on their characters already.

As for brand new players, they need to work their way up to level 50. That’s a minimum of 200 fractal chests. A minimum of 200 +1 infusions. 40 +1 infusions makes two +5’s. 10x +5’s, 5 +6’s, or 2 7’s and one 6. You’re already quite a bit higher potentially than those of us who worked our way up to 55AR and much higher level fractals than the current level 50 cap, doing the dungeon for a year.

So veteran fractalers got a boost by grandfathering in that +5 infusion, but newer fractalers get a boost by not having wasted time accumulating these infusions.

I’d say that the veteran players have a total leg-up on the newer players when it comes to available agony resistance (that total cost has to be multiplied by the number of characters one wants to be able to take along on a high level run), but that’s fine. That’s what Veteran tends to do. I’d hate it if after a year of playing fractals I have to start at the same level as a brand new player. Perks for loyalty.

people just want things here and now… they don’t realize how much we had to grind before patch…

All I know is that now I’m feeling a little gipped by selling off my dozens of infused ring drops because I ran out of room in my bank slots, and had no characters at the time to use them on. I could always just buy another ring and upgrade it with my mists essence materials if I wanted to change my build. Now I need to pay 5g for a +5 after buying said ring and upgrading it. Oh well…it’s still super easy to gain AR by playing fractals.

I’m still wondering where these figures for cost of thermocatalytic reagents came from…you don’t use a full 14s stack of 10 for one upgrade. It’s one reagent..1.4s per upgrade.

AKGeo.6048:

Eekzie, you’re forgetting to take into account that you still need that 250 ecto to upgrade the backpiece. So it’s 75g + 51g to get 55AR. EDIT: I get what you’re saying with the +7 and +8 infusion on the rings to make up for the backpiece’s ecto requirement.

But you’re also assuming that you’re buying every single +1 infusion, that the +1 infusions will stay at 25 silver each (which they obviously won’t considering they’ve dropped 10s in ONE DAY), and that you won’t end up getting +2 or higher infusions from fractal chests as you play it.

I have zero remorse for someone who has done no fractals at all since they were introduced, or who have the skill levels necessary for a level 50 (where that 55AR is actually necessary) without actually collecting or crafting +5 inherent infused rings and backpieces on their characters already.

As for brand new players, they need to work their way up to level 50. That’s a minimum of 200 fractal chests. A minimum of 200 +1 infusions. 40 +1 infusions makes two +5’s. 10x +5’s, 5 +6’s, or 2 7’s and one 6. You’re already quite a bit higher potentially than those of us who worked our way up to 55AR and much higher level fractals than the current level 50 cap, doing the dungeon for a year.

So veteran fractalers got a boost by grandfathering in that +5 infusion, but newer fractalers get a boost by not having wasted time accumulating these infusions.

I’d say that the veteran players have a total leg-up on the newer players when it comes to available agony resistance (that total cost has to be multiplied by the number of characters one wants to be able to take along on a high level run), but that’s fine. That’s what Veteran tends to do. I’d hate it if after a year of playing fractals I have to start at the same level as a brand new player. Perks for loyalty.

I’m not forgetting it.

I’m simply saying that you don’t need it anymore now (for 55 AR), thus you don’t need to spend 250 ectos on your back piece. Which currently will save you money. And I agree, in the future it will be even less expensive to get it.