Guild Wars 2

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

hint:
lingering elements and 10% more damage while in air atunement.
Kind of like a permanent 10% damage boost.

protip: lingering attunement does not work with air training

And to darkface.8925:

-Any Eles Build, if you want do contribute anything to the team, you need AT LEAST 10pts in Arcane and 10pts in Water. It is not my opinion nor anyone’s opinion. It is a FACT.
-And yet, no other Professional Skill has their weapon Set Skill CD sit on 40s, 50s.

- The different is all other prof just need to wait for their CD while our Skill CD also be affected by our Attunment CD. One skill in one Specific Attunment is off but the Attunment CD is not off, you are blocked on using that one skill. Simply put, we have a DEFAULT CD at 9s (if traited with Arcane) or 15s (with no Arcane).

Hope it clear you the difference bw Eles and other Classes.

Stealth.9324:

And to darkface.8925:

-Any Eles Build, if you want do contribute anything to the team, you need AT LEAST 10pts in Arcane and 10pts in Water. It is not my opinion nor anyone’s opinion. It is a FACT.

“Contribute anything to the team” is a non sequitur. We’re not discussing “contributions to the team,” we’re discussing whether or not 15 second CDs for attunements makes the elementalist unplayable. It doesn’t, obviously. It may not be optimal for your build to forgo Arcane. It may not even be optimal for any build to forgo Arcane. But to claim the profession cannot be played without pointing into Arcane is hyperbole, pure and simple.

Stealth.9324:

-And yet, no other Professional Skill has their weapon Set Skill CD sit on 40s, 50s.

I must be misunderstanding what you’re saying here, but because it looks like you’re saying elemental attunements are on a 40 second cooldown.

Stealth.9324:

- The different is all other prof just need to wait for their CD while our Skill CD also be affected by our Attunment CD. One skill in one Specific Attunment is off but the Attunment CD is not off, you are blocked on using that one skill. Simply put, we have a DEFAULT CD at 9s (if traited with Arcane) or 15s (with no Arcane).

There is no difference (except for engineers and kits)…none at all.

If you’re in Water Attunement and you want to use Meteor Shower, you’re going to have to wait for both Meteor Shower and Fire Attunement to come off CD. That’s no different than a warrior using a longbow wanting to use Hundred Blades; he’s going to have to wait for both Hundred Blades and his weapon swap to come off CD. It’s the same thing.

As an Eles, if you can not rotate between your attument effectively, you are simply just a Punching Bag. Eles is not built to be a DPS class, more like a Support Class with Mediocre DPS. Remember Anet’s Definition: Eles is a Jack of All trade, but master of none. What it means is we need to rotate our Attunment regularly to be effective. We also don’t have the luxury to switch Melee Weapon and Range Weapon like all others class, save for Engine. Don’t forget that Eles is also a Light Cloth Class with Lowest Healthpool of All. Also Eles relied on Boons to stay alive and evade to stay alive, always in the move, not stand still and tank. By staying in one Attument and with 0 in Arcane,Eles Class is not playable. I will withdraw my line back if you can put up a SINGLE eles player that can kill people with 0 in Arcane in PvP.

What I am saying is look at our Weapon skill number 4 and 5 in all Attunment, they are all on VERY LONG CD which none of any Class out there can be compared with.

There is difference, with Engine Kit, they can switch at will. All they need to do is just wait for the Skill Off CD then they can use it much like other class. Back to your Warrior comparison, Warrior can switch between Melee and Range at every 10s without sacrifice any trait point at all (30 trait point if they want 5s weapon Switch). However, a Warrior does not relied on switching Weapon regularly to stay in fight stay alive. If they fight a Range Opp, they switch to Range, if they are close, they fight with Melee. Simple as that. However, with Eles, we are Required to switch Atunment to stay alive and kill no matter what circumstances, plus we can not switch bw Melee or Range weapon. If you count switch Attunment as Switch Weapon, then with all other class, they are freely have 10s without sacrifice anything. With Eles, you have sacrifice 30 pts just to get 1s earlier than normal, otherwise you are stuck with 15s CD. Unless they give our CD Attunment equal to CD of Switching Weapon, until then, 10 in Arcane is a Mandatory. And unlike other, you switch based on Circumstances, with Eles, you swap Attunment is a MUST to stay in fight. And yes Hundred Blades only has 8s CD while Meteor Shower has 30s CD.

In short, here is my challenge for you. Prove me wrong by finding any video of any Eles (whether it is you or someone else) doing PvP, Duns or WvW successfully with at least 10 pts in Arcane.

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

hint:
lingering elements and 10% more damage while in air atunement.
Kind of like a permanent 10% damage boost.

Unfortunately, lingering elements doesn’t work the way that literally every person who ever read it thought it would. It’s basically lingering soothing mist, and then only if you have soothing mist.

Making it work the way we all expected would be the single biggest buff they could make to the fire, air and earth lines.

Caffynated.5713:

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

hint:
lingering elements and 10% more damage while in air atunement.
Kind of like a permanent 10% damage boost.

Unfortunately, lingering elements doesn’t work the way that literally every person who ever read it thought it would. It’s basically lingering soothing mist, and then only if you have soothing mist.

Making it work the way we all expected would be the single biggest buff they could make to the fire, air and earth lines.

bugger….. same as flamewall and icespike bug… and diamond skin not upping with increase of toughness through skills…. bugger….. bugs everywhere……

darkace.8925:

“Contribute anything to the team” is a non sequitur. We’re not discussing “contributions to the team,” we’re discussing whether or not 15 second CDs for attunements makes the elementalist unplayable. It doesn’t, obviously. It may not be optimal for your build to forgo Arcane. It may not even be optimal for any build to forgo Arcane. But to claim the profession cannot be played without pointing into Arcane is hyperbole, pure and simple.

That is just silly. If you don’t consider what is optimal or good then simply any build or trait can be run. Like 30 fire would be good. What the person is saying is that 30 Arcana is really good for a lot of builds because it synergies with other traits really well (20 water or 30 air [fresh air trait]).

If you run a suboptimal build in pvp and you get rolled 90% of the time isn’t that almost like unplayable unless you enjoy not doing as well as other Eles or you enjoy dying.

darkace.8925:

Aether McLoud.1975:

15 seconds attunement cooldown is not playable. That’s a fact.

Actually, it’s an opinion. And that’s a fact.

Zing, semantics!

But lets give you the benefit of the doubt. IF what is and isnt playable is just an opinion… opinions can be right and wrong! If the statements made were presented to the elementalist community for consensus, what do you think they would decide?

-0 Arcane, playable?
- Less than 20 arcane, playable for staff?
- Less than 30 arcane, playable for D/D?

In my opinion, the community would disagree with your opinion on playability in every single one of those cases.
Which would probably mean that your opinion is wrong.
Edit: It also means that Anet is failsauce at providing worthwhile trait options outside of Arcane.

Raven.9603:

darkace.8925:

Aether McLoud.1975:

15 seconds attunement cooldown is not playable. That’s a fact.

Actually, it’s an opinion. And that’s a fact.

Zing, semantics!

But lets give you the benefit of the doubt. IF what is and isnt playable is just an opinion… opinions can be right and wrong! If the statements made were presented to the elementalist community for consensus, what do you think they would decide?

-0 Arcane, playable?
- Less than 20 arcane, playable for staff?
- Less than 30 arcane, playable for D/D?

In my opinion, the community would disagree with your opinion on playability in every single one of those cases.
Which would probably mean that your opinion is wrong.
Edit: It also means that Anet is failsauce at providing worthwhile trait options outside of Arcane.

2 out of my 4 different burst builds I constantly switch to has 0 in arcana. I do perfectly fine in wvw with them whether I solo roam 1v1/1v2 players or following a zerg. Of course points invested in arcana is convenient to lower the attunements cd but that’s all it is… convenient, not necessary.

darkace.8925:

Aether McLoud.1975:

15 seconds attunement cooldown is not playable. That’s a fact.

Actually, it’s an opinion. And that’s a fact.

Aether McLoud.1975:

No other profession has to spend trait points to be able to USE THEIR WEAPON SKILLS…

And no other profession has 20 weapon skills. Technically, engineers can if they want. But the elementalist is the only profession with a default 20 weapon skills.

Aether McLoud.1975:

…because if eles don’t they are stuck using autoattacks for 5-10 seconds.

How is that any different than any other profession that spams their weapon skills (or Initiative, in the case of thieves) while their weapon swap is on cooldown?

Because ele autoattacks are terrible compared to thief/dagger necro/warrior.

Scepter autoattacks in particular do horrible damage.

Burst=/= sustained, and in pve sustained is what rules the field.

I find the duration between changing attunements to be quite painful without points in arcane. ATM I’m running a build that could benefit more from 10 points in water over 10 in arcane, but I do find it hard to give up the points in arcane.

Another thing you can do while you wait for CD on your attunements is to whip out a frost bow, use skill 5, then 3 then 4 then drop and change attunement. Grab the second frost bow 30-40 sec again and repeat.

LightningBlaze.4913:

2 out of my 4 different burst builds I constantly switch to has 0 in arcana. I do perfectly fine in wvw with them whether I solo roam 1v1/1v2 players or following a zerg. Of course points invested in arcana is convenient to lower the attunements cd but that’s all it is… convenient, not necessary.

It is synergy not convenience. Sure you can max power, precision, and critical damage and roll someone and dps them in one rotation. Of course in that situation you won’t need to attune much because the person is dead. However, in a small group setting or a fight that last more than 20 seconds you would need to attune more often. Even with Fresh Air having lower attunement means you can proc it more often. This means more damage (15 air), perma fury (more swaps) this results in more damage, and more might stacks (sigil of battle) which is again more damage.

For other builds like 20 water that means more heals. 20 earth more stability. Overall more boons (offensive and defensive)