Guild Wars 2

azel, air isn’t really being nerfed because, unless you save your burst until the very end bolt to the heart is only 20/3=6.6% damage increase. ( The 5% less damage in air is much more noticeable except when firegrabbing foes)

Sadrien.3470:

azel, air isn’t really being nerfed because, unless you save your burst until the very end bolt to the heart is only 20/3=6.6% damage increase. ( The 5% less damage in air is much more noticeable except when firegrabbing foes)

And arguably with Tempest Defense and some good CC the damage increase could be over all massive with combos like Gale, Earthquake and Updraft. Good ol’ Flash → Earthquake → Unload just got 20% stronger.

Kodiak.3281:

Sadrien.3470:

azel, air isn’t really being nerfed because, unless you save your burst until the very end bolt to the heart is only 20/3=6.6% damage increase. ( The 5% less damage in air is much more noticeable except when firegrabbing foes)

And arguably with Tempest Defense and some good CC the damage increase could be over all massive with combos like Gale, Earthquake and Updraft. Good ol’ Flash -> Earthquake -> Unload just got 20% stronger.

And your s/d ele will get kittened 20% harder by thieves, who will still make it unviable, unfortunately.

The key things holding back berserker ele were not addressed (thieves, fulfilling the same role as mesmer but with longer CD’s, no boon-strip, no portal, and no stealth), while its actual strengths have gotten weaker.

Meh, I don’t play s/d vs anyone good, have to go df conjure build for that! ( or just 66002 s/f)

Sadrien.3470:

Well, for starters there are some very powerful ( by appearances ) aura builds. you can still maintain your high protection uptime on the meta spec equivalent, you were already extremely strong, need I list more? This is in terms of cele d/d and d/f meta. I am disappointed by lack of care for zerker s/f or s/d builds though.

And this is exactly what bothers me, I pretty much only like playing burst builds especially for elementalist because it always required comboing a few abilities instead of just pressing 2 and none of these changes help, mostly just hinder, with the removal of damage modifiers.

My lack of faith is based upon years of watching the class balance team struggle to balance the class with gear and seeing it swing from useless to very overpowered since release. The ups and downs of the class clearly show that it’s an extremely difficult class to balance because it has so many varied skills and utilities and the slightest change can shoot the class up or down very fast. I mean, just buffing the Cele amulet was enough to make the previous D/D build a meta standard, imagine what would have happened if they tweaked some numbers alongside of that.

Dual-wield rifles at the very least.

Raif.9507:

Sadrien.3470:

Well, for starters there are some very powerful ( by appearances ) aura builds. you can still maintain your high protection uptime on the meta spec equivalent, you were already extremely strong, need I list more? This is in terms of cele d/d and d/f meta. I am disappointed by lack of care for zerker s/f or s/d builds though.

And this is exactly what bothers me, I pretty much only like playing burst builds especially for elementalist because it always required comboing a few abilities instead of just pressing 2 and none of these changes help, mostly just hinder, with the removal of damage modifiers.

My lack of faith is based upon years of watching the class balance team struggle to balance the class with gear and seeing it swing from useless to very overpowered since release. The ups and downs of the class clearly show that it’s an extremely difficult class to balance because it has so many varied skills and utilities and the slightest change can shoot the class up or down very fast. I mean, just buffing the Cele amulet was enough to make the previous D/D build a meta standard, imagine what would have happened if they tweaked some numbers alongside of that.

The buff to celestial got nothing to do with what ele is now, it has always been a combination of very powerful traits all packed in a single build, something which I believe has been addressed, by bringing EA to GM and removing boon duration and healing power, making d/d (finally) that much weaker but still viable nevertheless

Supreme.3164:

The buff to celestial got nothing to do with what ele is now, it has always been a combination of very powerful traits all packed in a single build, something which I believe has been addressed, by bringing EA to GM and removing boon duration and healing power, making d/d (finally) that much weaker but still viable nevertheless

It has very much to do with the buff to celestial. While you’re right, the combination of Earth/Water/Arcane has many powerful synergies and traits, it still has been pushed out of the meta many times. See the original Sword/Dagger boon stealing Thieves or the Sword/Pistol stun builds when they first had that insane evades (long long time ago) as an example of being pushed out of the meta.

Previously, you would have run Clerics/Soldiers for point holding (same spec) or Valkyerie to do a more roaming damage sort of spec (and it was extremely weak in that respect comparatively). With the buff to Celestial the tank build gained a lot of damage and lost some survivability but the tools and utility it has from traits let it overcome that. The result of the Celestial buff made a very tanky/healy elementalist who can dish out enough damage to pressure points. Without that buff to Celestial, you wouldn’t see D/D ele in the meta because none of those other amulets gave you that mix of survivability + damage that the Celestial amulet did. With Clerics/Soldiers you were a complete tank with no damage (and a worse one than the at the time Guardian point holder or shoutbow) and with Valkyrie you did decent damage with a little survivability but did less than other damage dealers. Celestial with the buff let you do all of it together

Moving EAttunement to GM to compete with EvArcana removes all of 1 blast finisher and 1 AoE heal in return for AoE stability + 20% DR + an Earth GM. You lose some party wide support in return for possible clutch stability and some self DR & immunity. It’s a trade off, not one that’s even in either direction but it’s there. With the Cele ele being oushed out of the meta already by shoutbow and the incoming buffs to Warriors that we’ve seen already, it’s unsure if the tank ele will survive. Especially with the nerf to Cele amulet.

It’s early to tell, true. Hopefully that reveal was a “first pass” and maybe they’ll release a second showing of the numbers/traits and hopefully reworked some of it. I have very little hope that’s the truth though.

D/x is what I’m least worried about with the changes. I can not express enough that s/d has never been stronger than dd tank because the traits in the earth water and arcane lines have been far and above stronger than fresh air or light rod let alone blinding ashes which is relatively new.

I hope we have a leap finisher with sword attack \o/

Iris Ng.9845:

I hope we have a leap finisher with sword attack \o/

#GiveBackRTL ^^

probably is going to be some lame off hand like the warhorn, i just want to see if they finally add some decent elite skill

Kodiak.3281:

Sadrien.3470:

azel, air isn’t really being nerfed because, unless you save your burst until the very end bolt to the heart is only 20/3=6.6% damage increase. ( The 5% less damage in air is much more noticeable except when firegrabbing foes)

And arguably with Tempest Defense and some good CC the damage increase could be over all massive with combos like Gale, Earthquake and Updraft. Good ol’ Flash -> Earthquake -> Unload just got 20% stronger.

Hmm…. possibly, I must admit that I am leaning a lot more to lightning rod than anything else. With Tempest Defense’s easier access to interrupts this could be a good increase with the amount of lightning we will ditch, but Bolt to the Heart is not GM worthy at its current stage.

On another note, did you guys check the mesmer chronomancer trait? Wow…. They got one massive boost to burst spec, specially with the likely 100% slow uptime they will be able to keep, even with condi cleanse, and a 30% crit chance increase when the enemy is slowed…. wow…. that will be brutal.

Guardian’s new traits were also very interesting…. and this week we will see Necro’s elite spec, with possibly another very good trait line.

We will have to brace ourselves really hard for what is to come for the elementalist…. hopefully it will not be a major letdown but rather something on par with these new traits…. but I still feel winter is coming for us.

Tom.8029:

MyPuppy.8970:

Guardians get traps, i hope we dont get pets.

I doubt that will happen; we already have elementals, after all.

Actually, if the devs decide to revamp Glyphs to make them more unified in theme and useful I could see them making “summon” or “elemental” a new utility type. Oh god…oh god…

Lostwingman.5034:

Tom.8029:

MyPuppy.8970:

Guardians get traps, i hope we dont get pets.

I doubt that will happen; we already have elementals, after all.

Actually, if the devs decide to revamp Glyphs to make them more unified in theme and useful I could see them making “summon” or “elemental” a new utility type. Oh god…oh god…

Still glyphs=summons would get more love than now have (I didn’t meant that currently they aren’t useable). Their variety can be also advantage, but if we talk about trait related things then it is hard to came up with something that will work for all of them.

We have elementals and on the table: oozes and tar elementals (shape of grubs, but cloaked with element) and imps and maybe djinns.

Mem no Fushia.7604:

Lostwingman.5034:

Tom.8029:

MyPuppy.8970:

Guardians get traps, i hope we dont get pets.

I doubt that will happen; we already have elementals, after all.

Actually, if the devs decide to revamp Glyphs to make them more unified in theme and useful I could see them making “summon” or “elemental” a new utility type. Oh god…oh god…

Still glyphs=summons would get more love than now have (I didn’t meant that currently they aren’t useable). Their variety can be also advantage, but if we talk about trait related things then it is hard to came up with something that will work for all of them.

That’s more or less what I mean by unified though given what we know about how they are pruning down the number of traits we can choose from and making things more synergistic. Wouldn’t surprise me though if instead of all new utilities they just changed glyphs.

rotten.9753:

I believe in Karl.

I believe in Harvey Dent…

Lostwingman.5034:

Wouldn’t surprise me though if instead of all new utilities they just changed glyphs.

So core glyphs with wide variety, spec glyphs unified to easy trait them.

Mem no Fushia.7604:

Lostwingman.5034:

Wouldn’t surprise me though if instead of all new utilities they just changed glyphs.

So core glyphs with wide variety, spec glyphs unified to easy trait them.

Just throwing a “least interesting idea possible” idea out there. I’m personally expecting that Tempest is going to be a heavy control specialization.

Lostwingman.5034:

Mem no Fushia.7604:

Lostwingman.5034:

Wouldn’t surprise me though if instead of all new utilities they just changed glyphs.

So core glyphs with wide variety, spec glyphs unified to easy trait them.

Just throwing a “least interesting idea possible” idea out there. I’m personally expecting that Tempest is going to be a heavy control specialization.

Oh God please not just a glyphs revamp…. I hope we get something new and a heavy control spec would be fun specially if it could combine with lightning rod.

I hope we also get a “fix” to a lot of the poor skills we have, I.e., those that pale in comparison with cantrips, such as some glyphs, our elites, conjures and some of the arcane skills…. But right now I would just be glad if our new spec is fun and new and not a hastily and poorly constructed spec.

Am still so frustrated that Elemental Atunement wasn’t made baseline in some form. There is no trait more class-defining than it in the whole game.

just let me be op for a few months, im very bored atm with celestial

edit: maybe gimme invis and a backstab, that should be fun

Sadrien.3470:

azel, air isn’t really being nerfed because, unless you save your burst until the very end bolt to the heart is only 20/3=6.6% damage increase. ( The 5% less damage in air is much more noticeable except when firegrabbing foes)

Losing Bolt to the heart and Air training is a nerf to me. It’s not like ele has some great sustained damage.

Laraley.7695:

Sadrien.3470:

azel, air isn’t really being nerfed because, unless you save your burst until the very end bolt to the heart is only 20/3=6.6% damage increase. ( The 5% less damage in air is much more noticeable except when firegrabbing foes)

Losing Bolt to the heart and Air training is a nerf to me. It’s not like ele has some great sustained damage.

We may end up being just another annoying bunker class to fight after all these nerfs.

I guess shouts is a no go for Tempest so i guess now its going to be stances or deceptions (war or thf sub). Both could work out though i do not think they would give tempest the ability to stealth but they would give it the ability to be super mobile. The war parts would make it more of a tank dps. So i am saying Tempest may not be support at all.

I think after the “Reaper” reveal that the ele will be stuck in water and arcana even more than before once hoT is out.

Jski.6180:

I guess shouts is a no go for Tempest so i guess now its going to be stances or deceptions (war or thf sub). Both could work out though i do not think they would give tempest the ability to stealth but they would give it the ability to be super mobile. The war parts would make it more of a tank dps. So i am saying Tempest may not be support at all.

Tempest could be all blinks style thief. That might be a good answer for a highly mobile DPS.

Raif.9507:

Jski.6180:

I guess shouts is a no go for Tempest so i guess now its going to be stances or deceptions (war or thf sub). Both could work out though i do not think they would give tempest the ability to stealth but they would give it the ability to be super mobile. The war parts would make it more of a tank dps. So i am saying Tempest may not be support at all.

Tempest could be all blinks style thief. That might be a good answer for a highly mobile DPS.

But dose d/d cover this already though D/d is a lot of def and support effects on-top of bust dmg not dps. That and the way burning is getting a changes d/d seems more like a condition dmg wepon. So ya i could see a high “all blinks style thief” Tempest and i guess it fits the name to a point.
Now that i look at the ability tricks could be a thing too. I truly do not believe they will give stealth to Tempest. I guess we will just need to wait and see.

Raif.9507:

Tempest could be all blinks style thief. That might be a good answer for a highly mobile DPS.

If they just tried to make it like an s/x thief, it will just end up being a BAD rendition of s/x thief with less overall mobility (Anet won’t let anyone touch thieve’s role as top-dog in map mobility), less support (no stealth to share, and sharing boons/heals on a dps spec isn’t that great), and less control due to the attunement system being restrictive while the initiative system is empowering.

BlackBeard.2873:

Raif.9507:

Tempest could be all blinks style thief. That might be a good answer for a highly mobile DPS.

If they just tried to make it like an s/x thief, it will just end up being a BAD rendition of s/x thief with less overall mobility (Anet won’t let anyone touch thieve’s role as top-dog in map mobility), less support (no stealth to share, and sharing boons/heals on a dps spec isn’t that great), and less control due to the attunement system being restrictive while the initiative system is empowering.

I do agree, but I’m trying to see the silver lining somewhere.

Raif.9507:

BlackBeard.2873:

Raif.9507:

Tempest could be all blinks style thief. That might be a good answer for a highly mobile DPS.

If they just tried to make it like an s/x thief, it will just end up being a BAD rendition of s/x thief with less overall mobility (Anet won’t let anyone touch thieve’s role as top-dog in map mobility), less support (no stealth to share, and sharing boons/heals on a dps spec isn’t that great), and less control due to the attunement system being restrictive while the initiative system is empowering.

I do agree, but I’m trying to see the silver lining somewhere.

Right there with you, but the more I think about the more I feel like the best option is going to be reroll for the year that eles will be garbage-tier before Anet continues the cycle and over-buffs them to make them competitive.

BlackBeard.2873:

Raif.9507:

BlackBeard.2873:

Raif.9507:

Tempest could be all blinks style thief. That might be a good answer for a highly mobile DPS.

If they just tried to make it like an s/x thief, it will just end up being a BAD rendition of s/x thief with less overall mobility (Anet won’t let anyone touch thieve’s role as top-dog in map mobility), less support (no stealth to share, and sharing boons/heals on a dps spec isn’t that great), and less control due to the attunement system being restrictive while the initiative system is empowering.

I do agree, but I’m trying to see the silver lining somewhere.

Right there with you, but the more I think about the more I feel like the best option is going to be reroll for the year that eles will be garbage-tier before Anet continues the cycle and over-buffs them to make them competitive.

What? First nothing to do with Tempest seconded ele has been strong and is far from garbage-tier. Thf with out stealth but with self heals and boons would work. If any thing ele or Tempest if they end up being a thf with out stealth could be better at playing a “thf hit and move” roll better then our thfs in game who are “hit and stealth.”

Jski.6180:

What? First nothing to do with Tempest seconded ele has been strong and is far from garbage-tier. Thf with out stealth but with self heals and boons would work. If any thing ele or Tempest if they end up being a thf with out stealth could be better at playing a “thf hit and move” roll better then our thfs in game who are “hit and stealth.”

D/D Ele (and ONLY d/d) is strong now b/c it has good self-survivability and excellent support. Taking away that support, even with the benefit of better self-survival removes it from team viability, tbh (see: condi ranger, any other tank build).

Also, if you had a thief without stealth, without initiative to pick the most useful skill, without mobility as high (Anet has made it CLEAR nobody can challenge thief mobility), without a reliable ranged option (can’t swap to shortbow) and forced to deal with an attunement system, you get a CLEARLY inferior player competing for the same role. The key point is that attunement swaps only serve to lock you out of valuable skills and rotate CD’s, as opposed to initiative, which serves to allow you the ability to use the most applicable ability for any situation.

While I wasn’t focusing on stealth, the fact is that not only does stealth serve as a superior defense mechanism to boons for a bursty player, but it also provides superior support for such a role. Shadow refuge alone gives thief better team-support than the low-radius boons, projectile blocks, and spot-heals of a fresh-air ele combined.

If tempest is a bruiser (the only other option for a 100% melee spec), then it just competes with d/d for that same role, in which case it needs INSANE support capability to keep up with shoutbow and make up for the reduced options for d/d in arcana.

I completely agree with BlackBeard

I think Tempest will make us immune to dammage, cc and movement impairing conditions. That would be the most natural thing.

Leaked image of Tempest’s new elite skill “Storm”! Looks like we can take down entire WvW zerg alone!

soistheman.7208:

Leaked image of Tempest’s new elite skill “Storm”! Looks like we can take down entire WvW zerg alone!

Cost of unlocking this skill? 10k spoons.

I guess the name will be Stormbringer

This is a complete shot in the dark but what if the Tempest is thematically linked to the Zephyrites via the Aspects? According to the wiki page , the Aspects are “three forms of air magic that are stored in crystals recovered from Glint’s corpse”, which fits well with the name Tempest. Therefore, I reckon the Tempest mechanic might involve the Aspects of lightning, wind, and sun (ok, lightning is a bit of a stretch since the air magic line has that part covered).

Another idea, what if the new specialization allowed elementalists to swap weapons?
…
On second thought, it might be a headache to juggle weapon swaps along with attunements…

DiessasDilettante.6571:

This is a complete shot in the dark but what if the Tempest is thematically linked to the Zephyrites via the Aspects? According to the wiki page , the Aspects are “three forms of air magic that are stored in crystals recovered from Glint’s corpse”, which fits well with the name Tempest. Therefore, I reckon the Tempest mechanic might involve the Aspects of lightning, wind, and sun (ok, lightning is a bit of a stretch since the air magic line has that part covered).

Another idea, what if the new specialization allowed elementalists to swap weapons?
…
On second thought, it might be a headache to juggle weapon swaps along with attunements…

I like the idea of new elements, but the problem is that: (a) it ruins the other trait lines because many are specific to being in one attunement; and (b) it would require to make a ton of new weapon skills…. so I think that this option is out…

The Reaper btw was another great success. That seems very interesting to play with, I would say now that Anet made a huge success with the Chronomancer and two great successes with the Dragonhunter and Reaper, but all three are interesting and seem very powerful.

What worries me, besides how I am going to fight against the reaper and its 1001 means of putting you on chill forever, is when Robert mentioned that “Blinky and fast classes is the domain of the mesmer and the thief”…. and when he mentioned “Reaper made us think to add a new mechanic to the F skills of classes, when possible”

Those two comments sends chills down my spine as it means that my expectation – and hope – for the Tempest was that it would be a fast, mobile and blink style specialization, which would really on mobility and evades/teleports to survive rather than good old protection boon, is likely not going to be the case and, further, my fear that they would not have any new F skill to add to the Tempest might just be true.

Now I just fear the time that Tempest spec comes up for the week, as it just might be ANET’s first/sole failure with the specializations…..