Guild Wars 2

(TL;DR at bottom)

Without judging the effectiveness of the traits as we haven’t played with them, and speaking from a purely subjective point of view as I’m certainly not #1 engi NA (yet), I’m quite sad with the traits we’ve received (and in the past.. RIP KR and whatever Modified Ammunition could of been). I also think they are all around lackluster for those that want a different build type to run while still being optimal for their group.

Personally, I LOVE Engineers. It’s probably my favorite class in any MMO I’ve ever played. But, I play it purely because it has fun mechanics and I actually dislike explosive-based aesthetics in games. You can probably guess that I love the SD play-style now and then, but I’ve been using bombs/grenades for a very very long long time now with a -few- trait changes that actually made our most optimal DPS choices even more boring. (I’m looking at you, Mr. Modified Ammunition)

New Explosives GM
Good for decapping/bursting PvP, this’ll be fun to play with for sure as it holds a lot of potential. For PvE? I can’t think of a single instance where my standard burst wouldn’t be much better than anything this could offer me

New Firearms GM
Finally an active Firearms trait, and it’s a minefield. Ugh lol. Has decent potential in PvP imo. Assuming they are the same damage as our other mini-mines then we would need to spec 20 into Explosives on top of the 30 in Firearms to make these things a little dangerous. All in all, it could be semi-useful for making things rough for bunkers but I’d rather take the 30 in Explosives and put the rest of my points elsewhere. CPs are about to get cluttered with even more particle effects from our explosions.

In PvE, for stacking on bosses you’re looking at a random spread of mines that’ll sit there if they happen to not spawn on the boss. Trash mobs will most likely walk all over them when not stacked up and the AoE capability will be all but lost. Lets see how their exact function turns out though, as there may be something we can take advantage of that we don’t know about yet.

-Overall this trait was the most dissapointing, Firearms should be more about benefiting our single-target DPS/control imo. I would of much rather saw a Quickness buff unrelated to KBs in here, preferably just for rifle auto or whatever.

Both turret GMs
Reflects for a full investment into the turret line? No thanks for PvP from what I can assume. I can’t judge it right now, but if it’s reflects on tiny damage/effect increases to our current turrets then that’ll be very lackluster.. but it’ll look cool at least I guess. Applying aoe boons is a cool idea for turrets, but 30 into Alchemy is a rough exchange for such a minimal boost. On CPs, I’d rather something more controlled keeping me up than boons that are up roughly 1/3 of the time.

This won’t work well in PvE, as the boons won’t be able to make up for the significant DPS loss and the reflects are more than covered by other more popular professions. I don’t have much to say here, I don’t think turrets will be useful in the current dungeon scene yet either. They’ll be fun to take on joke runs, and open world. That’s all though.

New Tools GM
Welp, it’s something for gadgets atleast. This opens up more SD possibilities, but for PvP the only one I really saw becoming that useful is PBR (fury) and Ugoggles (might) as the other boons are easy enough for us to come by through other investments. Throw mine could be useful-ish, but i’d rather just take the passive Aegis that we already have as a GM in this line if i wanted that. Overall the only one that I think I’d say is a decent active trait that offers some choice. for the builds it looks to be apart of.

For PvE I wouldn’t take this at all, MAYBE Ugoggles in some situations where I don’t feel like stacking might through blasts because I don’t feel like dealing with Light Field’s kitten.

(TL;DR) Uncrittable blind spamming Eles, interrupt spamming Mesmers, annoying dire condi-burst Guardians and Thieves making everyone bunkers in stealth and then proceeding to use their new stealth buffs. Then there’s Engi runs around in circles, spewing out mines yelling ‘HAHA COME AND GET ME’, while being as annoying as ever.

I agree with much that was said here. Wholly underwhelming and nothing to really invigorate or excite me out of the current engi meta.

I feel like they messed up with the Explosives and Firearms GM traits. Swapping Synaptic Overload and Bunker Down places makes more sense.

I think you guys are missing out on the multiplicative potential here for experimental turrets and bunker down. I mean imagine a 5 engie turret party. Possible instant 15 stack of might, plus perma protection..or fury..or anything else they want for ALL OF THEM! And for bunker down sure one at a time might not look like much, but with a party of engies you can turn any place into a mine zone

there are some very good builds incoming

Penguin.5197:

I think you guys are missing out on the multiplicative potential here for experimental turrets and bunker down. I mean imagine a 5 engie turret party. Possible instant 15 stack of might, plus perma protection..or fury..or anything else they want for ALL OF THEM! And for bunker down sure one at a time might not look like much, but with a party of engies you can turn any place into a mine zone

The problem is that a balanced comp can provide that and more without giving up tons of trait points. Bunker down will be good for fighting on point or kiting people, but anything that’s not forcing a DPS specced engineer to move out of his spot a lot will most likely stay where it is, safe from the engineer’s mines.

A party of engineers with this trait on would be very bad as the only way to make it hurt is if the party could even stay alive in a single zone to make use of it.

Bunker down’s purpose in pvp will undoubtedly be CP bombing, as you’ll more than likely force bunkers to constantly run into the mines due to kiting attempts. This is a cool alternative, but niche. In the current meta, I’d rather just decap the point with a more versatile build than pressure the bunker to mess up using a more glassy mine spec.

The problem with bunker down and the quickness trait is that they are in the wrong traitlines entirely. Firearms is the traitline you go when you want to burst, explosives is usually not. And not to mention that the trait that creates explosive landmines on crit would make sense in you know explosives. They even went on about what a synergy it would have with the explosives traits (vulnerability and the like) and how you could easier follow up a overcharged shot with a grenade barrage thanks to quickness (who uses grenade kit when you can’t have grenadier?

Swap those two and it would make a little more sense.

Also keeping the boon removal on the mines would have given us a leg up similar to boon removal on mesmers shatters.

I personally like both new turret traits. Definitely going to try them.

miriforst.1290:

The problem with bunker down and the quickness trait is that they are in the wrong traitlines entirely.

That is what I felt. While I can see Bunker Down working nicely with Flamethrower I just can’t see Synaptic Overload working with the Bomb Kit which I feel should have been the first choice here. But I guess Synpatic Overload opens up more offensive Flamethrower Builds.

Rhomulos.2089:

(TL;DR at bottom)

(TL;DR) Uncrittable blind spamming Eles, interrupt spamming Mesmers and annoying dire condi-burst Guardians. Then there’s Engi runs around in circles, spewing out mines yelling ‘HAHA COME AND GET ME’, while being as annoying as ever.

You forgot to mention thieves…..even more buff that comes FROM USING STEALTH….so more stealth spam ;D …now with -50% dmg while in stealth OR +200 power some seconds after stealth(basically after a backstab) .

Xaylin.1860:

I personally like both new turret traits. Definitely going to try them.

miriforst.1290:

The problem with bunker down and the quickness trait is that they are in the wrong traitlines entirely.

That is what I felt. While I can see Bunker Down working nicely with Flamethrower I just can’t see Synaptic Overload working with the Bomb Kit which I feel should have been the first choice here. But I guess Synpatic Overload opens up more offensive Flamethrower Builds.

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks. the only actual explosive that it will work with is throw mine. synaptic overload is just one of the worst traits. i’d rather take autodefense bomb dispenser. nobody is going to go 30 explosives for that garbage. it’s a master tier trait at best.

I think you’re nuts. 6/6 Runes of Altruism with Med Kit + Rifle Turret (with Experimental Turrets) = permanent group fury.

You’re also looking at things as they are, today, March 22. There’s going to be a significant paradigm shift once the feature release hits. It’s not that 30/30/0/0/10 will stop being the meta for PvE. That’s definitely not changing, and I don’t expect much if any revisions at all given what we currently know about upcoming changes.

But we’re now going to be able to swap trait lines out of combat on command, so these traits that seem situational will actually be beneficial to rounding out the engineer. For example:

Rhomulos.2089:

Both turret GMs
Reflects for a full investment into the turret line? No thanks for PvP from what I can assume. I can’t judge it right now, but if it’s reflects on tiny damage/effect increases to our current turrets then that’ll be very lackluster.

Having a ton of projectile reflects is a massive contribution in several select dungeons and fractals. Reflects are the number one reason mesmers are a part of the meta, and now we’ve been buffed to the point where we are capable of maintaining over 30 seconds of reflects. In most mob engagements, that will cover the entirety of the fight.

It may not be useful in every dungeon path in the game, but you can very easily now swap out 30 points of Explosives with 30 points of Inventions or Alchemy as necessary. They’re redefining how the entire game is played, and the engineer is perhaps the number one class in the game at taking full advantage of this new system.

I can’t effing wait.

ellesee.8297:

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks

Don’t forget about Big Ol’ Bomb.

Nirvana.8659:

Rhomulos.2089:

(TL;DR at bottom)

(TL;DR) Uncrittable blind spamming Eles, interrupt spamming Mesmers and annoying dire condi-burst Guardians. Then there’s Engi runs around in circles, spewing out mines yelling ‘HAHA COME AND GET ME’, while being as annoying as ever.

You forgot to mention thieves…..even more buff that comes FROM USING STEALTH….so more stealth spam ;D …now with -50% dmg while in stealth OR +200 power some seconds after stealth(basically after a backstab) .

Sorry, I guess that SHADOWSTEPPED from my mind! pundog.jpeg.

Edited to include thieves.

Phineas Poe.3018:

ellesee.8297:

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks

Don’t forget about Big Ol’ Bomb.

big ole bomb is a blowout, not a knockback.

Phineas Poe.3018:

I think you’re nuts. 6/6 Runes of Altruism with Med Kit + Rifle Turret (with Experimental Turrets) = permanent group fury.

You’re also looking at things as they are, today, March 22. There’s going to be a significant paradigm shift once the feature release hits. It’s not that 30/30/0/0/10 will stop being the meta for PvE. That’s definitely not changing, and I don’t expect much if any revisions at all given what we currently know about upcoming changes.

But we’re now going to be able to swap trait lines out of combat on command, so these traits that seem situational will actually be beneficial to rounding out the engineer. For example:

Rhomulos.2089:

Both turret GMs
Reflects for a full investment into the turret line? No thanks for PvP from what I can assume. I can’t judge it right now, but if it’s reflects on tiny damage/effect increases to our current turrets then that’ll be very lackluster.

Having a ton of projectile reflects is a massive contribution in several select dungeons and fractals. Reflects are the number one reason mesmers are a part of the meta, and now we’ve been buffed to the point where we are capable of maintaining over 30 seconds of reflects. In most mob engagements, that will cover the entirety of the fight.

It may not be useful in every dungeon path in the game, but you can very easily now swap out 30 points of Explosives with 30 points of Inventions or Alchemy as necessary. They’re redefining how the entire game is played, and the engineer is perhaps the number one class in the game at taking full advantage of this new system.

I can’t effing wait.

While I understand where you’re coming from, I personally rarely, if ever, need perma group fury. I run Altruism already, that coupled fire staff eles and the many warriors I run into, I usually see a substantial amount of fury in my better encounters.

As for reflects, everyone seems to have this covered next to engineer. We have an RNG reflect that I use after everyone elses reflects are down, and I don’t want to sacrifice 2-3 slots unless it’s honestly the only thing I need on an encounter.

You’re right that it’s situational. I acknowledge that we can change builds whenever, but I personally don’t like the idea of constant build swapping just for set encounters unless I’m going for a world record speed clear or something. (on an engi lol)

After thinking about it overnight, the turret boon dispenser will probably be fun for awhile especially with 2 engineers. I still can’t think of an instance where I would need most of it, but it’ll be fun no less. I just hope after this I’ll take turrets for more than just blast finishers (looking at you, Thumper). Of course they put the protection boon on the turret that can put off 3 blasts in 1s.

ArrDee.2573:

Phineas Poe.3018:

ellesee.8297:

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks

Don’t forget about Big Ol’ Bomb.

big ole bomb is a blowout, not a knockback.

And that’s why I think the trait doesn’t belong in Explosives. It would work nicely with Flamethrower but you will lack Knockbacks when using the Bomb Kit. Of course, this would be different if they changed the mechanic to ‘Quickness on hard CC’.

Xaylin.1860:

ArrDee.2573:

Phineas Poe.3018:

ellesee.8297:

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks

Don’t forget about Big Ol’ Bomb.

big ole bomb is a blowout, not a knockback.

And that’s why I think the trait doesn’t belong in Explosives. It would work nicely with Flamethrower but you will lack Knockbacks when using the Bomb Kit. Of course, this would be different if they changed the mechanic to ‘Quickness on hard CC’.

To expand on this, I’ll list all of our available knockbacks from the tooltip. It’s possible there might be hidden ones due to bugs/incorrect tooltips but none come to mind.

Overcharged Shot (Rifle)
Magnetic Inversion (Shield)
Accelerant-Packed Turrets (Explosives adept tarit)
Air Blast (Flamethrower, and my favorite)
Edit: Throw Mine as well, missed that one

From that list, you can see a SINGLE explosive triggers the trait, it’s also one that doesn’t see use often. How is this in Explosives? Was there an error on the livestream or does it also count on launchs? Either way, this is a single target oriented burst skill or a punish for those stomping with no stability/blocks/blinds. While our Bunker Down trait is area denial that has perfect synergy with bomb kit.

Accelerant-Packed Turrets will be fun for this on my SD build.. but the 20s ICD makes this very very situational. To the point where I feel I’ll have to not KB people just so I can save it in case I need to rez a teammate.

overcharged shot is a blowout. you use knockback on yourself. i don’t know if this will proc the trait. and you forgot throw mine, which in addition to accelerant packed turrets, are the only explosives that benefit from this 30 point explosives trait.

Karl mentioned Rifle as an example for triggering Synaptic Overload on twitch.

Phineas Poe.3018:

It’s not that 30/30/0/0/10 will stop being the meta for PvE. That’s definitely not changing, and I don’t expect much if any revisions at all given what we currently know about upcoming changes.

But it WILL stop being the meta for PvE.
Everyone’s going to be going 6/6/0/0/2 instead!

ArrDee.2573:

Phineas Poe.3018:

ellesee.8297:

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks

Don’t forget about Big Ol’ Bomb.

big ole bomb is a blowout, not a knockback.

Blowout skills are just push (knockback) skills that also knockdown. I don’t see why it wouldn’t proc the trait. They even used Overcharged Shot as an example, which is a launch skill, not a push skill.

I think the collective mood of this thread is a bit too assumptive and knee-jerk. Why don’t we just wait for the patch to hit and evaluate how these things work? Rather than complaining that we’re not getting enough, let’s see how everything comes together when the patch hits. Getting flustered over theorycraft adds nothing of substance.

Albeit usually we get the hot shower when that time comes. But sure, having all the informations is better.

Phineas Poe.3018:

I think the collective mood of this thread is a bit too assumptive and knee-jerk. Why don’t we just wait for the patch to hit and evaluate how these things work? Rather than complaining that we’re not getting enough, let’s see how everything comes together when the patch hits. Getting flustered over theorycraft adds nothing of substance.

I think you’re forgetting where you are

Can someone link where these additional traits are confirmed? I have read about the Projectile Reflect for Turrets but I have seen nothing else.

Thank you.

Terrible traits, especially for PvE. They poorly tried to make turrets more attractive, but they failed. They have to be able to crit, or at least be much much stronger.
Sry ANet, you failed. At least give engi some minor buffs, like the fake previews.

Wolf.5816:

Can someone link where these additional traits are confirmed? I have read about the Projectile Reflect for Turrets but I have seen nothing else.

Thank you.

ready up or notes

Xyonon.3987:

Terrible traits, especially for PvE. They poorly tried to make turrets more attractive, but they failed. They have to be able to crit, or at least be much much stronger.
Sry ANet, you failed. At least give engi some minor buffs, like the fake previews.

I really can’t agree with that. Both, Bunker Down and Synpatic Overload are traits which can increase the overall damage of the Flamethrower which is needed to make it competitive. Fortified Turrets might end up granting the Engineer a higher reflect uptime than Mesmers. Furthermore, it is something Engineers can’t do right now so its actually pretty interesting. Experimental Turrets is very appealing for supplying boons. You might even be able to place them out of the range of monsters in many scenarios because they got a 600 radius.

How is this terrible in PvE? And please don’t tell me ‘speedruns’…

Xaylin.1860:

Xyonon.3987:

Terrible traits, especially for PvE. They poorly tried to make turrets more attractive, but they failed. They have to be able to crit, or at least be much much stronger.
Sry ANet, you failed. At least give engi some minor buffs, like the fake previews.

I really can’t agree with that. Both, Bunker Down and Synpatic Overload are traits which can increase the overall damage of the Flamethrower which is needed to make it competitive. Fortified Turrets might end up granting the Engineer a higher reflect uptime than Mesmers. Furthermore, it is something Engineers can’t do right now so its actually pretty interesting. Experimental Turrets is very appealing for supplying boons. You might even be able to place them out of the range of monsters in many scenarios because they got a 600 radius.

How is this terrible in PvE? And please don’t tell me ‘speedruns’…

I can already see us setting up turrets out of range of pulls for the boon buff, it’s perfect for stacking. Perhaps we’ll be joining warriors with their banners soon. It’ll be different at least.

As for the reflects, you have to take into consideration how much you give up for 4s of reflect that is easily covered by other classes, for longer and only 1 utility slot. To get a useful amount of reflects (with good RNG) we have to blow our heal turret, rifle turret (low cd) and then use our potion, while being specced into a non-DPS line that offers no other benefits. If no other class is around that can do it, and you REALLY need reflects for the next encounter, I can see it.

They’re turret buffs though, I’ll take them. More tricks up the engineer’s sleeve. We have a lot of those and keep getting more, not many know of them. I honestly don’t think I can really complain complain, but I’m more excited about the bug fixes than the traits for turrets. But maybe that’s just because I’m more of a pvper.

You’re right that the flamethrower needs a good pve buff (either in support or DPS) to be competitive, but I think with these traits it won’t be enough still. Air blast would be ideal for proccing SO, but actually using FT auto with it seems like a waste. Also, BD has potential to be good if the damage is decent, but again it’s better suited for our other high DPS melee kit.

I feel FT needs it’s GM trait, finally. I was hoping it would come this patch, but meh. I’ve been wanting to use it for awhile in the way I would of liked, as it has the potential. Even if they just made Juggernaut give AoE might over time I’d be happy. Maybe give it the ability to apply 4 vuln on #5 as well.

Xaylin.1860:

I really can’t agree with that. Both, Bunker Down and Synpatic Overload are traits which can increase the overall damage of the Flamethrower which is needed to make it competitive. Fortified Turrets might end up granting the Engineer a higher reflect uptime than Mesmers. Furthermore, it is something Engineers can’t do right now so its actually pretty interesting. Experimental Turrets is very appealing for supplying boons. You might even be able to place them out of the range of monsters in many scenarios because they got a 600 radius.

well to get 30 into explosives for the flamethrower, you’d be giving up deadly mixture, or juggernaut. can’t have all 3. and if you do run all 3, you’re missing out on permanent swiftness and modified ammo, which i think will still be much better than bunker down in pve. plus you can’t knockback bosses and knocking back trash mobs is bad. nothing makes me more annoyed than a mesmer using gs 5 or a ranger using lb 4 on a stacked group just because it was off cd.

fortified turrets is a garbage trait. you have to fully commit 30 points into the worst tree that engineers have and sacrifice multiple and actually useful utility slots for godawful turrets just to keep up with other classes like guardians and mesmers who simply have to use one utility slot and minimal trait investment with no damage loss.

experimental turrets is again a hefty trait investment into alchemy, one of the best defensive trees in the game. you sacrifice A LOT of pve damage going full alchemy for minor boons that will probably be destroyed in a few seconds. the trait also competes with other, better abilities like automated response, backpack regen, hgh, etc. and finally you’ll have to again sacrifice useful utility slots for turrets. TURRETS.

Let’s just summarize it to “The new engi traits are for the most underwhelming.”

It is understandable that they must not by any means be stronger than what we have now but frankly I wouldn’t bother with them with the GM traits we currently have. Lack of synergy or poor in performance.

ellesee.8297:

well to get 30 into explosives for the flamethrower, you’d be giving up deadly mixture, or juggernaut. can’t have all 3. and if you do run all 3, you’re missing out on permanent swiftness and modified ammo, which i think will still be much better than bunker down in pve. plus you can’t knockback bosses and knocking back trash mobs is bad. nothing makes me more annoyed than a mesmer using gs 5 or a ranger using lb 4 on a stacked group just because it was off cd.

Synaptic Overload quite obviously is better for PvP/WvW than PvE. But Bunker Down could be a lot more efficient than Modified Ammo, especially if it is affected by Explosive Powder (e.g. 20/30/0/20/0).

ellesee.8297:

fortified turrets is a garbage trait. you have to fully commit 30 points into the worst tree that engineers have and sacrifice multiple and actually useful utility slots for godawful turrets just to keep up with other classes like guardians and mesmers who simply have to use one utility slot and minimal trait investment with no damage loss.

Mesmers also have to invest 20 points into Inspiration to get more reflects. Buh. 10 points less. An Engineer with 2 turrets (which includes the Healing turret you should bring anyway) will probably not be as good as a Guardian at reflecting but at least as efficient as a Mesmer. This might actually bring Engineers back into PvE groups.

ellesee.8297:

experimental turrets is again a hefty trait investment into alchemy, one of the best defensive trees in the game. you sacrifice A LOT of pve damage going full alchemy for minor boons that will probably be destroyed in a few seconds. the trait also competes with other, better abilities like automated response, backpack regen, hgh, etc. and finally you’ll have to again sacrifice useful utility slots for turrets. TURRETS.

Investing 30 points for specific boons (Vigor and Protection) is not a lot when considering you would usually not be able to provide this for your group. Especially since ANet nerfed the availability of Vigor. Besides that, every supportive build has to sacrifice damage. If that is not for you, don’t pick it. But it doesn’t make a trait garbage just because it does not provide the perfect DPS. Not everyone is doing speed runs in PvE.

Automated Response and Backpack are pointless in PvE outside of maybe Tequatl. HGH in PvE would be utterly stupid at least when doing group content. I would not like to carry an Elixir Engineer through dungeons or fractals.

And again: Most Engineers already bring the Healing turret anyway. So don’t make it sound like you suddenly have to sacrifice all your utilities. If you want to run reflects, pick the Rifle turret for the low cooldown. If you want boons, get the Thumper turret for Protection. That is one utility slot.

I only have big issues with two of these traits.

First of all, the reflecting turrets has no synergy at all with the other turret traits in the inventions line. Autotool and Metal plating both increase the survivability of turrets and encourage them to be left out til they die. However, Fortified turrets only triggers when they are placed, meaning we get the most use of the trait by picking them up as soon as the bubble goes down. RTB gets you more mileage the longer your turrets stay out, so it would be the obvious choice if you take the earlier turret traits in the inventions line.

Second, our new gadget trait feels so lazy. Engi can already get so many boons going through elixirs, traits, combofields, and now even turrets. Why can’t this gadget trait be more creative? It is far from a build defining trait that GMs supposedly are meant to be. Instead it feels more like a " I’m running only gadgets so I guess I have to take this one" kind of trait.

insanemaniac.2456:

Wolf.5816:

Can someone link where these additional traits are confirmed? I have read about the Projectile Reflect for Turrets but I have seen nothing else.

Thank you.

ready up or notes

Thank you.

Nothing that helps with our condition removal problem. Nothing that bring a gadget build into the game.

Phineas Poe.3018:

ArrDee.2573:

Phineas Poe.3018:

ellesee.8297:

synaptic overload won’t work with bomb kit because the bomb kit has no knockbacks

Don’t forget about Big Ol’ Bomb.

big ole bomb is a blowout, not a knockback.

Blowout skills are just push (knockback) skills that also knockdown. I don’t see why it wouldn’t proc the trait. They even used Overcharged Shot as an example, which is a launch skill, not a push skill.

I think the collective mood of this thread is a bit too assumptive and knee-jerk. Why don’t we just wait for the patch to hit and evaluate how these things work? Rather than complaining that we’re not getting enough, let’s see how everything comes together when the patch hits. Getting flustered over theorycraft adds nothing of substance.

It’s possible that knockback and launch (AKA blowout) will be treated similarly in this fashion.

However, it’s not always the case. For instance, the elementalist’s tempest defense trait deals additional damage to foes that are “knocked down”. However, this bonus damage does not apply to foes that are launched. This means that doing something like updraft → burning speed does not benefit from the trait, although something like gale → burning speed does.

So even though the person that gets launched is effectively “knocked down”, they aren’t knocked down in a technical sense and thus do not proc the trait.

As such, it is not illogical to assume that “knock back” is different than “launch/blowout”, similar to how bleed is different from poison. However, given the example the devs used for overcharged shot, it seems that it should apply to launches as well.