Guild Wars 2

I love the guardian for the most part but one thing bothers me alot about its design. You can only block with one weapon. You can’t even use a shield for that it’s vary purpose?

The Guardian is melee class without block skills. Sure we have Aegis but due to its difficulty to control and long recharge time we often cant use it when we actually need to. Yes some of the weapons have blind skills but those cant be used to trigger our blocking traits. Probably the biggest issue is that you cant even use a shield to block. A shield is a device created specifically for that vary purpose and the guardian cant use it for that? Sure we can block ranged attacks with it but thats a mute point when we are usually fighting in melee range. You can say your supposed to dodge all you want but thats not the point. Their are some times when its a much better option to block than dodge but when you cant do it that can become a real issue. You can argue about originality but the when a design choice gets in the way of functionality it becomes a big issue.

Their is even a way to fix this easily. The mace a weapon that is terrible at blocking in real life is the only weapon that you can block with as a guardian. I purpose swapping the Protectors strike and the shield of Judgment ability’s. Giving the block to the shield and the buff/attack to the mace this wont mix up the mace/shield style it will just swap the functionality of 3 and 4. While adding a block to the Sword/Shield and Scepter/Shield styles. Creating three styles capable of blocking.

I would further suggest not swapping the names or cool-downs just the skill functionality. As the names would better fit each others functionality and having the guardian being able to pull off a manual block with Aegis might be a little Op if the block doesn’t have good cool-down. Also I have read complaints about the Shield of Judgments protection buff having too short a duration for its cool-down.

So what do my fellow players thing?

agree o/
shield lacks its puropse

Good idea to swap those skills. I like it and would certainly use the shield more.

That’s a valid point and I totally agree, there is a trait called Defender’s Flame in the Valor tree (Gain a 100% chance to burn attackers when blocking.) and I was confused what blocking meant really. The warrior has the shield block spell but I couldn’t figure out why they added the trait if we can’t even block with a shield like that…

Also, giving the shield the block makes other weapon combo’s more valuable and versatile, so I naturally agree.

Have you never heard of this weapon called focus?
Personally, I’ve been using a Mace/Focus build with the trait that burns enemies if you are blocking. Additonally, you have the first heal skill, the one that allows you to block while casting it. Also, I went into the bottom tree that grants you reduced CD on virtues.
I’ve been doing pretty good so far, not sure if it has any viability compare to toher builds though (and I have yet to try it in PvP)

I agree on the shield feeling pretty bad for melee combat, but I still like to use it with a scepter.

spaten.6971:

Have you never heard of this weapon called focus?
Personally, I’ve been using a Mace/Focus build with the trait that burns enemies if you are blocking. Additonally, you have the first heal skill, the one that allows you to block while casting it. Also, I went into the bottom tree that grants you reduced CD on virtues.
I’ve been doing pretty good so far, not sure if it has any viability compare to toher builds though (and I have yet to try it in PvP)

I agree on the shield feeling pretty bad for melee combat, but I still like to use it with a scepter.

I agree with you but there was no need for you to be rude when replying to the topic poster.
Anyway I feel for efficient blocking you’ll have to use utilities and a focus.

I agree. many of the Traits for this was badly designed. Why have traits dedicated to Blocking, when we dont have short cooldown blocks?

I’d also like to see a block on the shield.

About Shield of Judgement, you throw a huge spirit shield forward or whatever, so it’s kinda unique to the shield. I’m not a fan of it either and would like Protector’s Strike instead, but a mace throwing a shield? I’d say they’d need to change the animation of Shield of Judgement if they switch them.

I’m currently using a Focus for Shield of Wrath(up to 3 blocks within 4s, 45s cd). Not much of a fan of Ray of Judgement since blind doesn’t make bosses miss.. but hey, I can block up to 3 attacks and if it doesn’t block 3, it does a load of damage.

I’m hoping something will be done about shields in the future.

Barsimoprimo.2759:

spaten.6971:

Have you never heard of this weapon called focus?
Personally, I’ve been using a Mace/Focus build with the trait that burns enemies if you are blocking. Additonally, you have the first heal skill, the one that allows you to block while casting it. Also, I went into the bottom tree that grants you reduced CD on virtues.
I’ve been doing pretty good so far, not sure if it has any viability compare to toher builds though (and I have yet to try it in PvP)

I agree on the shield feeling pretty bad for melee combat, but I still like to use it with a scepter.

I agree with you but there was no need for you to be rude when replying to the topic poster.
Anyway I feel for efficient blocking you’ll have to use utilities and a focus.

I did not at all mean to be rude here, sorry if it came out that way.

I also find it very strange that the Shield does not have a blocking mechanic to it. I really like the Ascalonian Warrior’s fiery blocks.

*moot point

As others have said, the focus is great, blind + triple block gives you four hits to completely negate.

Also, virtues are really, really terrible unless you go into the virtue (forget the name) trait tree and bring the virtue renewing elite. If you do all that, they’re pretty good.

Knighthonor.4061:

I agree. many of the Traits for this was badly designed. Why have traits dedicated to Blocking, when we dont have short cooldown blocks?

I’m not sure why folks say that Blocking is unreliable, or hard to control.

For one, I have the Trait that gives me Aegis, Protection, and Regen when resurrecting — during particularly taxing fights I can reasonably run around resurrecting or rallying people. My Aegis (chiefly) is refreshed each time. Retreat is also a fine option for getting that Aegis up in a pinch. Add to that the Mace, Shield, Sanctuary, Focus, Sword… blocking can happen quite often if you really try to build for it.

As for the specific trait that Burns when Blocking… It’s not like the Guardian has a hard time lighting people on fire, it’s their Condition of choice. Personally I’d prefer to see a Blind on each successful Block (but that might be too overpowered).

As to the suggestion of swapping Mace skill 3 with Shield skill 4… I’m of two minds.
Yes it makes sense to do this from the obvious “well Shields block!” argument, but then again, Warrior and Engineer already have “blocky” Shields, and the Guardian is introduced as an asymmetrical Profession, maybe the one which blurs the lines the most. It’s a magical warrior, I think it’s allowed to not make some sense in the spirit of being unique (and still pretty dang effective).

Remember, the Guardian is not designed to defend itself as much as its ALLIES. The Shield is not for the Guardian, it is for the troops behind them. As tough and survivable as the Guardian is, I still feel like my defenses “belong” to my allies (nearly every one benefits me and at least one other ally), and really that’s part of the appeal.

I think the trait that adds +90 toughness when using a shield could be raised to act as a %-based modifier, but yeah; think of the shield as you protecting your allies and not necessarily yourself first. Guardians already have plenty of traits to survive solo, so it’d make sense for the primary defensive off-hand to be more about others. Whether or not it’s effective is another thing entirely, but I think the skills ring true to its intended role.

I think you guys are missing my point. A shield is meant for blocking while a focus is not all that great in melee aside from the block anyway it feels unnatural, and honestly weapon builds should make sense so that people can actually choose what they want to do based on what makes sense not by what kinda works if you do it like this build shows up.

The shield should be used for what its vary existence implies front line fighting. I like you chose the guardian because it seemed like the best class for support however the current shield does not work in that you cant defend yourself which means you’ll be dead before you can protect others sure the Guardian is a good support class but it is also a close ranged fighter if it cant fulfill that role properly it cant succeed and it can fulfill its support role either. If you don’t give the guardian a shield block then in the end you will only be supporting the whole support exist only to support the group and should not be able to help himself at all mentality that makes people hate to play the support role so much right know.

I think the 5 ability on the focus and shield were accidentally swapped during development and no one noticed it :P The focus shield would work better on the actual shield both mechanically and thematically. Projecting a huge, light dome seems something more akin to something a focus would do.

Dragonhero.1852:

I think you guys are missing my point. A shield is meant for blocking while a focus is not all that great in melee aside from the block anyway it feels unnatural, and honestly weapon builds should make sense so that people can actually choose what they want to do based on what makes sense not by what kinda works if you do it like this build shows up.

The shield should be used for what its vary existence implies front line fighting. I like you chose the guardian because it seemed like the best class for support however the current shield does not work in that you cant defend yourself which means you’ll be dead before you can protect others sure the Guardian is a good support class but it is also a close ranged fighter if it cant fulfill that role properly it cant succeed and it can fulfill its support role either. If you don’t give the guardian a shield block then in the end you will only be supporting the whole support exist only to support the group and should not be able to help himself at all mentality that makes people hate to play the support role so much right know.

So according to your rambling, the whole idea of Guardian Support revolves around the Shield being able to Block?

Really?

Morvick.8475:

I’m not sure why folks say that Blocking is unreliable, or hard to control …

… every one benefits me and at least one other ally), and really that’s part of the appeal.

I agree on this. A guardian can block just fine. Your virtue gives you one block every 40s, you can activate it for an additional block, mace skill 3 blocks and focus skill 5 blocks thrice. Also, the focus skill 4 makes the foe blind, another way to prevent damage taken. You can even use the elite skill that regenerates your virtues for yet another block. (forgot the name), it even makes you invulnerable for a brief time.
By the time you’ve used all those skills, either the foe is dead or one of the skills has regenerated. That is without any traits at all.

Some say that a shield is supposed to do the blocking, which is true, but don’t forget that a guardian uses magic. He is not using the mace / focus itself to block, but rather create an aura / ward that does the blocking. Also replacing mace skill 3 with shield skill 4 prevents the player to have a weapon set for blocking, so in my opinion not the best solution.

With these skills i find it easy to take on more enemy’s at a time, or even a veteran enemy, and barely taking damage. if all blocks are on cooldown i can dodge out of the way

station.6421:

I think the 5 ability on the focus and shield were accidentally swapped during development and no one noticed it :P The focus shield would work better on the actual shield both mechanically and thematically. Projecting a huge, light dome seems something more akin to something a focus would do.

I completely agree with this. As well as the OP on swapping 3 and 4.

Guardian’s blocking is fine, it’s just weird that best for it is focus and not shield. I use mace/focus as my solo defensive weapon set and it works great – against most veteran mobs i dont even have to dodge.

You can block with: Mace, Focus, Shelter and Aegis.
The Mace isn’t a very logical choice for a block, but it does fit the Mace-playstyle. Swapping the ability with Shield of Judgment would screw anyone who uses a different combination than Mace/Shield over.

I really dislike any kind of “But X-weapon is supposed to do Y”, or “X-weapon works like that in real life, so it should do the same in game”-debate.

I never said that the whole idea of a guardian revolves around them needing to block, However not allowing a class to block especial one revolving around protection makes no sense. Its a poor design choice. Next why the heck do I need to use four different skills when all I need is one option? Finally Swapping those to skills would not mess up the Sword/Shield or Scepter/Shield builds it would make them more viable. As far as builds with the mace in the main hand and a focus or torch in the off-hand. The Torch skills really aren’t for up close and you guys leep saying you can block with a focus.

Furthermore the focus 4 is a ranged ability that does not suit a melee style. So You have to choose between a block and a useless skill. Or a useful up-close skill the shields number 5 without a block. I don’t even see why your arguing this point. Most the guardians Ive asked in-game want a shield block. Furthermore just because you can do x with a b and c build choices this doesn’t mean anything when you should be able to do it with a single build choice.

Dragonhero.1852:

I never said that the whole idea of a guardian revolves around them needing to block, However not allowing a class to block especial one revolving around protection makes no sense. Its a poor design choice. Next why the heck do I need to use four different skills when all I need is one option? Finally Swapping those to skills would not mess up the Sword/Shield or Scepter/Shield builds it would make them more viable. As far as builds with the mace in the main hand and a focus or torch in the off-hand. The Torch skills really aren’t for up close and you guys leep saying you can block with a focus.

Furthermore the focus 4 is a ranged ability that does not suit a melee style. So You have to choose between a block and a useless skill. Or a useful up-close skill the shields number 5 without a block. I don’t even see why your arguing this point. Most the guardians I’ve asked in-game want a shield block. Furthermore just because you can do x with a b and c build choices this doesn’t mean anything when you should be able to do it with a single build choice.

Looks like your sample size of “Guardians I’ve asked in game” isn’t representative.
And the Torch if perfect for an up-close playstyle. As is the Focus.
How is the Focus unsuited for a melee-Guardian?

I think the switch isn’t a bad idea, though not for the reason you list. More to keep mace from being the default defensive weapon because of how amazing its #3 ability is. I would love to run sword/shield instead for increased mobility and the extra range reflect but the #3 mace ability is just too good (not to mention how good #2 is with full healing suit).

As far as the shield goes, because of the +90 toughness trait I’ve never felt that it isn’t incredibly useful as is.

Shimond that was my original point. As far as it really maters how does the focus even tie into this. I am suggesting the ability to block with a shield so that we can have fine control over blocking. Rather than the clumsy control we have know.

Actually, I had thought of this before, and I think what needs to be swapped is Shield of Wrath on the focus, with Shield of Absorption on the shield.

i wish some developer could comment on this or at least say if they would look into it and come up with a solution cos i think a main complain coming from guardian players is that the shield is really poorly designed and doesnt serve its real purpose

as a guardian who loves his shields i fully agree

I totally agree, I’ve found it to be a bit disappointing that an object which main purpose is to block cannot do so. I’d love if they switched it out with the mace block or the Shield of Wrath ability from the focus, since I (and many others) think that defensive abilities are more suited for the shield, while support abilities would go better with the focus.

The shield does give 61 pts. of defense, but the the skills associated with the shield have huge “down-time” timers. I gave up on the shield and primarily use a scepter + torch approach. At least my skill bar isn’t sitting there on a 180 or 240 second down time which in some boss fights gets used maybe once or twice at most. But again the 61 pts. of defense… it’s not entirely useless- just not fun to use.

station.6421:

I think the 5 ability on the focus and shield were accidentally swapped during development and no one noticed it :P The focus shield would work better on the actual shield both mechanically and thematically. Projecting a huge, light dome seems something more akin to something a focus would do.

Not really – Shield of Wrath is our most powerful single hit damage skill, and suits the focus for that reason.

I believe that Shield 5 and Focus 5 should be changed just because it just kittening makes sense xD otherwise it just looks stupid

I oppose the idea of switching the Shield and Focus 5 skills. Even if people feel like it would make more sense thematically, Focus 5 has much more synergy with Ray of Judgment than it does with Shield of Judgment. In 1v1 situations, it’s easy to set up Shield of Wrath using RoJ, since the double blind buys you a couple seconds while closing the gap, and RoJ can get rid of movement-impairing conditions that the opponent could use against you to stay out of SoW’s reach. SoJ offers none of this synergy. Although the Shield’s current skills don’t have a direct interaction like those of the Focus, both function effectively as group support tools, and have synergy in that sense. You can reduce incoming damage on allies, stop projectiles coming at them, interrupt stomps in PvP/WvW, clear room for a res, and so on with the Shield.

If you swap the skills, you lose this and weaken each weapon overall. Instead of having a strong tool for personal defense and a strong tool for group defense, you have tools that can each function in either scenario, but at a mediocre level, and you completely eliminate the Focus’s awesome internal synergy. I don’t feel like it’s remotely worth trading those things for aesthetics.

That said, I’m not so strongly opposed to switching Protector’s Strike and SoJ, but I don’t regularly use the Mace, so I don’t think my opinion is valid on that subject. I know PS can crit hard, though, so damage would probably need to come down if such a switch were made. Either way, I don’t expect it to happen, and I’m fine with that – I enjoy using the Shield as is.

Knighthonor.4061:

I agree. many of the Traits for this was badly designed. Why have traits dedicated to Blocking, when we dont have short cooldown blocks?

Virtue of Courage (passive) + Virtue of Courage (active) + Retreat + Shelter + Zealot’s Defense + Shield of Wrath

How kittening many do you want…? And that’s not even accounting for possible extra blocks and aegis from traits.

Yeah, you don’t have many on REALLY short cooldowns… You just get a kittenton of them if you want them.

They developed the off hands in the mind that torch is offensive, shield is defensive, and focus is a split in the middle. Keeping that in mind they are all balanced in what they are intended to do. Guardians already have a full self blocking skill “shelter”, which is indefinably the best heal in the game. Remember block bug and how ridiculously game breaking it was, i don’t think the developers are gonna change any of the guardian off hands soon. Seeing how it is the most balanced class in the game.

I had a hit register just after I poped shield of absorption, it said it was blocked. It could’ve just been an aegis block I didn’t notice, but has anyone already tested whether or not it blocks melee hits?

Edit: Nevermind, it must’ve been an aegis.

LegendaryLukeee.1462:

They developed the off hands in the mind that torch is offensive, shield is defensive, and focus is a split in the middle.

Not quite. The torch is for offense, the focus is for defense, and the shield is for support.

I personally wish the guardian’s shield skill set was more in line with that of the warrior’s. I don’t like having to choose between a shield that doesn’t look like a shield and a shield that is a shield in appearance only.

Yeah, I know the shield should autoblock while in melee just by wearing it. This should be further boostable by a signet with a passive block% increase.