Guild Wars 2

@Mantra Healing: It is true, if you trait for the mantra heals and whatnot, you can get a significantly higher hps than my normal build can achieve. The problem with this is that you spend upwards of 30% of total fighting time channeling that mantra in order to achieve this. I tried it. It didn’t work. This build is highly active, and needs every chance to be pressuring or avoiding damage, and sitting and spamming that mantra just did not work out.

@DrixTrix: Site is up for me. I use that site because it is the only site to date that can handle normal armor and whatnot, as opposed to the junk you get in sPvP.

@pvt stat distribution: I decides to split this into a separate post, because I felt a big explanation coming on.

As much as it’s lovely to get another commendation for my build, I feel compelled to weigh in my opinion on that analysis.

Firstly, you seem to have done an analysis based on just face tanking things, it seems. The problem is, that’s not how combat works in gw2, and even more so for mesmers. There’s a reason why pure glass cannon Mesmer is viable in ways that no other class is, and it’s because we have an absurd amount of active damage mitigation. Between permanent vigor, multiple sources of invulnerability, multiple spammable stunbreakers, forced movements, teleports, and dazes/cc, mesmers have the ability to avoid astonishing amounts of damage by simply not getting hit. This means that a glass cannon can potentially live as long as a tank, i.e. indefinitely.

Pvt is horrific for dealin straight damage. My build is more similar to a condition damage build than a power build. It works off of attrition from retaliation, with the potential for a confusion burst because Mesmer. The retaliation damage is not spike damage (excepting greatsword guardians and flamethrower engies, then it’s spike damage). In pve, it is even less potent, with the notable exception of flamethrower mobs in CoF. If you build pvt and expect to do a lot if straight damage, you will be disappointed.

Overall, in a game with combat dynamics as complex as in gw2, it is nearly impossible to effectively sum up the combat ability of a spec purely from numbers. There are just too many variables that can not be taken into account that way, and those ultimately flaw the analysis beyond repair.

Aha yes website is back up now i bet i picked the 30seconds when it was down for whatever reason haha, anyway i was curious to see as my build i’m working on is meant to be a kind of an ’’immortal’’ one i will make sure to read the whole thread so i don’t post or bring up points that have already been discussed then let you know once it’s fully tried and tested!.

great build though and really good of you to keep up with the comments/contacting people fantastic my friend, keep it up i and i’m sure we all appreciate it!

@G-Wolf & Pyroatheist:
My post was mostly intended to spark discussion. I surely agree that there are far more variables than I could account for simultaneously.

That said-
1. Why are all legendary weapons PVT? Why does “Invader” armor exist for WvWvW?
2. The active/passive damage mitigation argument is flawed: Any player given more efficient armor stats than what they are currently successful with should improve. I’m not suggesting different traits or skills, just different armor stats.

From a DPS standpoint, combining straight damage and condition together was the highest I found in my armor only comparison (but using numbers from in-game for opponent armor/self stats):
Assuming a round of 15 sec that you hit with 1. Blurred Frenzy once and 2. Had 3 bleeds on someone:
1. Rabid, 2. Rampager, 3. Berserker, 4. Knights/Soldiers.

But comparing DPS over a life-span based on damage you take:
1. Soldiers, 2. Knights, 3. Rabid, 4. Rampager, 5. Berserker.

Is the answer finding somewhere in the middle? Does the game reward moderation?

Hmmm.

@Stats: A few things.

First, the active damage mitigation point isn’t flawed. Suppose that the glass cannon can survive as long as the tank in the same situation (this is particularly true in pve, or smaller skirmishes in pvp). In that situation, the glass cannon will, of course, do significantly more damage than the tank.

Secondly, with regards to just pure damage, this has a ton of variables too. If the opponent has a large amount of condition removal, then any damage from conditions can be neglected, making a mixed damage build inefficient. Conversely, against a target with high armor and/or high uptime on protection, direct damage can be inefficient.

Lastly, as Gaiawolf mentioned, in pvp, what can be equally as important as total damage output is damage spread. You won’t kill a thief with slow and steady damage, you have to spike at some point, and this interaction is very difficult to reflect in a calculation.

1. Why are all legendary weapons PVT? Why does “Invader” armor exist for WvWvW?

1. This point has little to no relevance.

2. IIRC Legendaries were Berserker stats.

3. Invader armor exists so that random casuals who randomly pick up armor with no intent of optimization or customization get railroaded into a higher-survivability build setup so they last longer in WvW and have an improved game experience.

4. Theorycrafting is great as long as it’s anchored effectively to reality / uses realistic assumptions where applicable, etc.

@EasymodeX
Ah, irrelevant?
Indulge me by considering the following:
1. Legendaries are PVT. (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Legendary_weapon)
-They are not for casual pickup. People have spent long play periods before obtaining them.
2. Invaders Exotic Gloves are 238 badges of honor. Someone will have played a fair amount of W3 before buying just one piece, let alone a set.
3. All armors have at least one of the “big three (PVT)” in their stats. (I think)
4. [Big Picture Alert] – Anet is always walking a tightrope of fun/interesting stuff for people to play and having balance between the multitude of options.
How do you balance scales? With standard weights.
I conject that PVT is the “Golden” standard that Anet uses when developing other options, based on the above two points.
…drum roll please…
Nothing will ever, in total sum, be “better” than the standard of PVT, because that would then prove unbalancing with other things in the game.

I’d love to see Osicat, completely outfitted with PVT Exotic equipment, but his choice of Traits/Weapons/Skills, try to play his style of game. I’d bet he notices very little difference in end outcome (Him alive, opponent(s) dead). I’d also conject he could handle more opponents it that scenario, albeit taking longer to finish them off.

While I agree that Theorycrafting is a mental game, understanding the underlying game mechanics/balance is important.

Regards!

Ah, irrelevant?

Yes. Quite irrelevant.

Indulge me by considering the following:
1. Legendaries are PVT. (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Legendary_weapon)
-They are not for casual pickup. People have spent long play periods before obtaining them.

Yeah I had those confused with the precursors. Regardless, the Legendaries are 99.9% skin, and 0.1% stats.

You’re still about 10 miles from establishing a link between the stats of legendaries and their cost.

2. Invaders Exotic Gloves are 238 badges of honor. Someone will have played a fair amount of W3 before buying just one piece, let alone a set.

Your point?

As I said before, PVT makes sense for WvW gear so that random players that have no gear strategy won’t implode in 0.2 seconds in WvW. Players that live for more than 3 seconds in WvW will generally have a more fun experience in game.

3. All armors have at least one of the “big three (PVT)” in their stats. (I think)

Condition / Healing / Boon duration?

What’s your point here? Almost all gear has at least 1 offensive stat (in this case power), with a random mash of secondary stats — which happen to be defensive about half the time, because half the remaining stats happen to be defensive. Shocking coincidence.

ANet has avoided gear that has theoretically overpowered combinations at first glance (Condition damage / vit / tough, Condition damage / tough / healing power, Power / Condition damage / Toughness) and has only slowly been adding a few of those to the game. I could be speculating too far though, with ANet just being lazy / incomplete in their release itemization.

4. [Big Picture Alert] – Anet is always walking a tightrope of fun/interesting stuff for people to play and having balance between the multitude of options.
How do you balance scales? With standard weights.
I conject that PVT is the “Golden” standard that Anet uses when developing other options, based on the above two points.

That’s quite a gigantic stretch. I bet ANet uses the Mesmer class as the “Golden” standard for class balance because Mesmers have Portal. Makes about as much sense as what you said.

As a random aside, how do you factor the part where Precursors have Berserker stats? Is Berserker the “Silver” standard?

What about the part where Soldiers gems don’t exist? How can Soldiers be the “Golden standard” when it doesn’t even have complete itemization in this game?

Nothing will ever, in total sum, be “better” than the standard of PVT, because that would then prove unbalancing with other things in the game.

What the kittening hell?

Sorry, but Berserker kittens all over PVT when you don’t get hit.

As a general observation, condition damage + v/t kittens all over PVT when the target has 100% Protection.

Traits/Weapons/Skills, try to play his style of game. I’d bet he notices very little difference in end outcome (Him alive, opponent(s) dead). I’d also conject he could handle more opponents it that scenario, albeit taking longer to finish them off.

Unless his opponents actually have heal on their bar. I’m not sure if you realize this, but the Ret Tank build of this thread is actually pretty terrible at taking supply camps* and otherwise killing anything that doesn’t want to die, because it has low direct damage output. Like, really low.

• By terrible, I mean slow, because any build should be capable of soloing supply camps with sufficient player skill.

While I agree that Theorycrafting is a mental game, understanding the underlying game mechanics/balance is important.

You’re missing the giant elephant in the room called “low damage output minus healing x mitigation = exponentially high TTK / exponentially low real damage output”.

Nevermind the general concept of condition damage builds working poorly with power gear (e.g. spec – gear synergy).

You’re pretty weird, bro.

I’d bet he notices very little difference in end outcome (Him alive, opponent(s) dead). I’d also conject he could handle more opponents it that scenario, albeit taking longer to finish them off.

I’d wager he would have a lot more opponents who walk away without dying, or who get rezzed by teammates. You have some sort of major tank fetish going on.

kittenos Vant.4182:

I’d love to see Osicat, completely outfitted with PVT Exotic equipment, but his choice of Traits/Weapons/Skills, try to play his style of game. I’d bet he notices very little difference in end outcome (Him alive, opponent(s) dead). I’d also conject he could handle more opponents it that scenario, albeit taking longer to finish them off.

Osicat’s builds are shatter focused and therefore rely heavily on Crit Chance and Crit Damage. His fighting style is getting in close for shatter burst and then juking out and avoiding damage. PVT doesn’t fit his style at all since it would kill his bust potential and the vit & tough is wasted since he actively avoids damage. Sure he would live forever; chances are his opponents would too.

1 & 2. Who cares if Legendaries and Invader’s are PVT? Just because you have to work hard for them doesn’t mean PVT is Anet’s intended setup. Remember how easy it was to get a full PVT set from AC? PVT is a great starter set for players who can’t actively avoid damage and get downed all the time. PVT also has a place in certain builds but it definitely not the “Golden” standard.

3. PVT has a mix of offensive and defensive stats. Why is this important?

4. PVT is a safe choice for armor. That doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.

Good points all around, and great food for thought.
The normal “Here’s my build” replied with “looks interesting” was getting boring:
Playing devil’s advocate here to see what drummed up.
Thanks for the civilized discussion that certainly has brought up new points for consideration.
I certainly don’t run a PVT toon, and am busy trying to find the lowest HP/Tough combos that I can get away with in dungeons vs W3.

Note to Pyroatheist:
I’m happy to delete my posts should you feel they detract from your thread- just let me know.
Again, thanks for sharing your build and keeping the thread up for us readers.

EasymodeX.4062:

Ah, irrelevant?

Yes. Quite irrelevant.

Indulge me by considering the following:
1. Legendaries are PVT. (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Legendary_weapon)
-They are not for casual pickup. People have spent long play periods before obtaining them.

Yeah I had those confused with the precursors. Regardless, the Legendaries are 99.9% skin, and 0.1% stats.

You’re still about 10 miles from establishing a link between the stats of legendaries and their cost.

QFT. Easymode likely didn’t elaborate because he probably felt he shouldn’t have to. Either that or he was being an kitten ;p

Yeah, legendaries take hundreds, if not thousands of gold and plenty of time to construct. Transmutation stones take a few gold to buy instantly. Don’t tell me you honestly believe anyone with the means to acquire a legendary weapon will have the slightest trouble obtaining a stone.

So, irrelevant.

No need to delete posts, my thread is as good as any for an interesting discussion on theorycrafting.

I will say this though, @EasymodeX.

One of the aspects of the retaliation tank that does catch people off guard on a regular basis is the fact that there is no counter to retaliation. You can’t mitigate the damage in any way, shape, or form, and that is why my build has the potential to melt builds like full tank guardians, because they can’t stop the damage (nor can they stop a confusion burst, which has a similar effect).

@EasymodeX:
“As a general observation, condition damage + v/t kittens all over PVT when the target has 100% Protection.”
Cond. Dmg + Retaliation – No opponent armor involved!
Thanks for giving me another set of equipment to go try out.
Any specific build you’re thinking of for Cond. Dmg/V/T equip? Aside from the obvious “Immortal” from this thread.

kittenos Vant.4182:

@EasymodeX:
“As a general observation, condition damage + v/t kittens all over PVT when the target has 100% Protection.”
Cond. Dmg + Retaliation – No opponent armor involved!
Thanks for giving me another set of equipment to go try out.
Any specific build you’re thinking of for Cond. Dmg/V/T equip? Aside from the obvious “Immortal” from this thread.

Well, this build doesn’t have very much CD. I think I have about 405 since I use a Vassar’s band. The thing is that because confusion stacks in intensity, and stacks really sharply unlike bleeds, you can pump out massive confusion damage with little to no CD.

I will say this though, @EasymodeX.

Definitely. But you can’t really kill anyone that turns around and walks away, or who’s not attacking you (presumably in a group situation).

You’d probably have a hell of a time killing anyone with any measurable healing power / heals in their build and backed by any toughness. Well, as long as they don’t shoot a barrage of stuff into you + the iDefender, but I would consider that a major error.

What I meant was, if I equipped with say, a mix of soldier’s and Rabid (Or Rampagers, which I love but just can’t make work anywhere). Then set up something for Retaliation and Condi Dmg trait/skill wise. Likely would lots in common with the Immortal traits/skills.
In W3, where it’s usually lop-sided fights here on Kaining (T2 With plenty of organized groups), I’m guessing when I’m outnumbered the CD/Retal would definitely catch some groups unawares.

kittenos Vant.4182:

Any specific build you’re thinking of for Cond. Dmg/V/T equip? Aside from the obvious “Immortal” from this thread.

That set of gear doesn’t current exist in game IIRC.

However, it would be effective as a tank build because condition damage scales very well at low stat levels (high power scaling tends to require precision and crit damage to out-scale conditions). It would simply be a non-Sharper Images build. Virtually unkillable with armor-penetrating sustained damage? Yes please.

Due to the way the Mesmer class is set up, Mesmers tend to output a lot of hybrid damage, so a Cdmg/V/T set of gear is more to abuse with Thieves or Eles that can output more “pure condition” damage.

A pretty ideal stat spread for Mesmer mechanics abuse would be Condition damage / Power / Vit. In other words, Carrion with T instead of V. This setup would enable high powered Confuse and Retaliation, and still have the toughness to make getting hit manageable (Carrion is pretty kitten potent, but you’re soft with no Tough). Note that Mesmer already have high base HP, so the Tough is significantly more valuable than the Vit.

Of course, this abuse is why it’s not available in the game. If that stat spread were available, I would totally run that with an Unlimited Clone Works IP Shatter spamthekittenall build. Infinite Confuse, perma Ret, high armor, moderately strong iWarlock hits, 5k Prestige, 4k Blurred Frenzy. Unstoppable.

Warrior Sword mainhand would also be pretty kitten strong. Thief P/D would be completely unstoppable (although they would need some supplemental Vit to deal with burst conditions). Some Necro specs would be insane.

EasymodeX.4062:

Definitely. But you can’t really kill anyone that turns around and walks away, or who’s not attacking you (presumably in a group situation).

You’d probably have a hell of a time killing anyone with any measurable healing power / heals in their build and backed by any toughness. Well, as long as they don’t shoot a barrage of stuff into you + the iDefender, but I would consider that a major error.

Toughness really isn’t an issue. I do a bit of direct damage, but it really is tiny compared to confusion + retaliation. Strong heals are definitely tough, but the only class that seems to have strong enough heals to outlast me is a d/d ele for w/e reason.

In a group situation, people aren’t paying attention to damage they receive from retaliation and confusion, so its far easier to do large chunks to people, the same concept behind why the glamour build works in larger groups.

EasymodeX.4062:

Definitely. But you can’t really kill anyone that turns around and walks away, or who’s not attacking you (presumably in a group situation).

You’d probably have a hell of a time killing anyone with any measurable healing power / heals in their build and backed by any toughness. Well, as long as they don’t shoot a barrage of stuff into you + the iDefender, but I would consider that a major error.

Fortunately, major errors is what most wvwv players do best.

In a group situation, people aren’t paying attention to damage they receive from retaliation and confusion, so its far easier to do large chunks to people, the same concept behind why the glamour build works in larger groups.

Yes, bad players stack up 14 confusion into a Feedback, but we have to have a minimal skill level we’re talking about, because otherwise all builds can go naked into WvW and 100-0 the terribads out there, and discussing the point would be a waste of time.

If a player has a moderate healing capability (insert random Cleric shout warrior example, or hybrid Cleric/Knight’s or something, or even Knight’s base with Divinity stats stuck in wherever possible), you’d have to basically time a multiple confusion stack + ret into a flurry of their attacks on you after you’ve softened them a bit. Anything short of that and they can just heal and stand there. And that’s on slow reaction. I mean, with any reasonable reaction you’re talking a player who stops to heal at 70% and reconsiders the confuse and ret (or should), and there’s basically nothing you can do to stop them from bailing.

Bottom line is that it just kills slow. If the target is healing above a minimal degree, the killing is going to be very slow and thin unless they unload into your face.

EasymodeX.4062:

you’d have to basically time a multiple confusion stack + ret into a flurry of their attacks on you after you’ve softened them a bit.

That right there is precisely what I do, and is how I can kill most classes. People usually have the ability to outheal my damage over time, but the key to playing this build is knowing when someone is going to go after you, and counterattacking into it. The way my build is created is such that you can absorb several rounds of burst from people without dying. This allows you to 100% facetank someone’s burst combo in order to do the necessary damage to kill them. A warrior is coming at you with a hasted 100b combo? Facetank it, but have a defender up and burst confusion as he comes in. It will hurt, but it won’t kill you, and he will leave that combo at <20% hp.

Hi, I’m coming back from a long hiatus, and I think my Phantasm build is woefully obsolete. In any case, I was thinking of transitioning into something like this, but I have a question, and perhaps, unless things have totally changed while I was gone, a solution.

My question is this: Can someone explain to me why the OP suggest 30 Illusion? I understand that Illusionary Persona is a very powerful trait, as is the 3-4 stacks of Might that you would get from Shattered Strength. However, I do not think that it is worth 20 trait points, as it does not seem worthwhile to invest so heavily in a tree that is not based on condition damage, which is what Confusion derives its damage from.

Would a 10/0/20/30/10 build work? I would essentially move the 20 points into Domination and Inspiration. (LINK: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgQQNAW8dlwzKq3UTpGaNJhJF9G5neA9l/cUF2OpCwG;TsAA1Cto2xsjYH7Oudk7sgY8xGEA)

The 10 points of Domination synergize with the usage of Cry of Frustration to proc Retaliation (which is Power-based) and Into the Void (which counts as an AoE knockdown and thus, an interrupt). This basically adds ~6 stacks of Vulnerability to your target.

The 10 points of Inspiration get you Restorative Illusions, which has potent synergy with Mender’s Purity. Shattering essentially cleanses off conditions.

I keep 10 points in Illusions for Confusing Cry.

Oh, and I also use Runes of the Earth. They significantly boost your Protection uptime on top of all your random boon generators and Illusionary Membrane, and Magnetic Aura is another reflect effect ontop of all of this.

@Suzut: You mention that 20 points in illusions isn’t worth it because it supplies condition damage, which is what confusion scales off of. This might have been a typo, because it certainly makes no sense as is.

At any rate illusionary persona is too good to pass up. It vastly increases the damage of your shatters. Also, it provides an on demand interrupt and an on demand distortion, which is invaluable for securing stomps in crazy situations. Illusionary persona is really not an optional trait for this build. Additionally, 30 points in illusions is a large cooldown decrease on my shatters, which is important for maintaining retaliation.

You mentioned putting 10 points in domination. The small power boost would add to retaliation damage, but only minimally. The vulnerability doesn’t really matter, because this build primarily does damage from confusion and retaliation, neither of which are affected by vulnerability.

Restorative illusions actually has no synergy with mender’s purity. The condition removal from that trait only works with your main heal. The heal mantra will proc it twice, but other than that, nothing else works with it. Restorative illusions is a nice heal certainly, but it’s not enough to justify taking traits out of somewhere else.

Lastly, you mention runes of earth. Magnetic shield is worthless in this build, because you already have 100% uptime on projectile reflects if necessary. The protection duration is nice, for sure, but you need to consider what you are losing. In this case, you are losing -25% condition AND stun duration for 20% extra protection? Not worth it. Not even close.

@Pyroatheist
I see.

I meant that this is a Power-based build, so I found it confusing why I would need traits that are mostly for conditions.

You can never have too much reflect. Especially since reflect is stationary, but Magnetic Aura is not. But I can appreciate the Melandru setup for duels and PvP. Any alternatives to Rune of Melandru for when I am PvEing? Or is that the optimal choice there as well?

Suzut.4905:

@Pyroatheist
I see.

I meant that this is a Power-based build, so I found it confusing why I would need traits that are mostly for conditions.

You can never have too much reflect. Especially since reflect is stationary, but Magnetic Aura is not. But I can appreciate the Melandru setup for duels and PvP. Any alternatives to Rune of Melandru for when I am PvEing? Or is that the optimal choice there as well?

To say this is a power based build is a bit incorrect. While retaliation does scale off of power, a large component of my damage comes from well timed confusion bursting. Additionally, because the power component of this build is retaliation, none of the traits in domination synergize at all with it.

As for runes of earth, the 20% protection duration is nice. However, 4s of protection evey 30 seconds is completely worthless. Additionally, a 5 second shield on a 90s cooldown that only pops when you drop under 20% hp is completely worthless. If reflects are that important in a fight that they will matter when you drop under 20%, you should have been in sword/focus chaining reflects anyway.

Additionally, Melandru runes are absolutely amazing in every single fight and every single situation, not just duels and small fights. In big fights, having conditions just roll off you with no actions taken on your part is invaluable. In a 1 vs many situation, being essentially immune to crowd control is rather amazing.

As for pve, I don’t recommend this build for pve. While pve is rather easy with it, pve is rather easy with rather everything. This build is optimized towards the hyperdefensive counter attacking playstyle that is exceedingly effective in pvp, but completely unnecessary in pve. For a pve build, take a look at my supporting phantasm build instead.

@Pyroatheist
I looked that up… and it’s almost exactly what I use (a Power-based Phantasm build). Except I use Sword/Pistol instead of Great Sword, and thus, the 10 Domination goes into Dueling for Sharper Images and Duelist’s Discipline. XD

Suzut.4905:

@Pyroatheist
I looked that up… and it’s almost exactly what I use (a Power-based Phantasm build). Except I use Sword/Pistol instead of Great Sword, and thus, the 10 Domination goes into Dueling for Sharper Images and Duelist’s Discipline. XD

In that build, I’ll swap between any combination of staff, greatsword, sword/focus and sword/pistol as the situation demands, also changing the inspiration traits to best suit my current weaponset and utilities. Duelists discipline wasn’t worth it since I don’t always use the pistol, and sharper images is of course objectively worse than the 15% bonus damage from domination.

Right, I can see how Great Sword would want the 10 Domination instead. But being able to summon iDuelist every 12 seconds, as well as a stun, from outside most enemy AoE is pretty useful.

Also, iDuelist stacks bleed very efficiently with a high crit rate, and it bypasses defenses, so I would not underestimate how much damage it can do in a PvE situation. I remember someone actually did a mathcraft for it a few months ago.

Suzut.4905:

Right, I can see how Great Sword would want the 10 Domination instead. But being able to summon iDuelist every 12 seconds, as well as a stun, from outside most enemy AoE is pretty useful.

Also, iDuelist stacks bleed very efficiently with a high crit rate, and it bypasses defenses, so I would not underestimate how much damage it can do in a PvE situation. I remember someone actually did a mathcraft for it a few months ago.

Sharper images actually does increase the iDuelists damage by about 30%, but no other phantasm has that sort of increase, so it ends up being a net loss, especially with the iWarlock, which hits like a fully loaded truck in that build (7k+).

Just a question about the iLeap with TC.

Do you ever have problems landing this against a kiting build as it has a short range?

Nearly have all the gear, and will be taking my new Immortal build into W3 this weekend.

pahldus.1678:

Just a question about the iLeap with TC.

Do you ever have problems landing this against a kiting build as it has a short range?

Nearly have all the gear, and will be taking my new Immortal build into W3 this weekend.

Never have problems, because of a nifty effect that you might have missed the explanation for. You can detonate the curtain, and the combo field will still be there. This allows you to get the interrupt/cc on a slippery person, and also get that combo field finisher.

I got a question would grabbing (Chaotic Transference) +5% toughness converted to cond damage be worth dropping the (Confusing Cry) cry of frustration grants retaliation trait?

Anacopoulus.1539:

I got a question would grabbing (Chaotic Transference) +5% toughness converted to cond damage be worth dropping the (Confusing Cry) cry of frustration grants retaliation trait?

Seeing as the key to the damage the build does comes largely from retaliation, I doubt that would be a good choice. The main damage dealer for this build is retaliation and it being up 100% of the time. If you drop Confusing cry, you drop nearly half your damage output for a small gain in condition damage. Don’t confuse this for a confusion build.

While pahldus’ analysis is spot on, it doesn’t actually answer the question posed, mainly because the question posed makes absolutely no sense.

You ask about dropping confusing cry for chaotic transference. However, chaotic transference is the 25 minor trait in chaos, a line that this build already has 20 points in. Therefor, you would only need to take 5 points out of either inspiration or illusions to get chaotic transference.

Unfortunately, this is where we run into problems. 20 points in inspiration provides warden’s feedback, which is responsible for a massive amount of the utility and defense in my build. 30 points in illusions is illusionary persona, which is arguably even more important than warden’s feedback. Neither of these traits are possible to remove and still have this build be at all functional.

That being said, what pahldus mentioned is extremely accurate. This is primarily a retaliation build, with confusion only functioning as a burst finisher once someone has been adequately scared into spamming skills. Also, since confusion stacks intensity sharply, no large amounts of condition damage are necessary to make it highly effective.

Pyro, what leggings did you take? I grabbed all the Karma Exotics I could with soldier stats, which consists of 5/6 armor pieces. Currently there are no Karma Exotics with soldier stats that I can see listed, unless there’s a typo somewhere. I have been slowly farming up Badges of Honor to obtain my Invaders Leggings, UNLESS you can suggest another option.
I am currently at 5/6 Melandru, which until I can pull that 6th, I’m not lasting as long as this build should :-)

Daemonne.5018:

Pyro, what leggings did you take? I grabbed all the Karma Exotics I could with soldier stats, which consists of 5/6 armor pieces. Currently there are no Karma Exotics with soldier stats that I can see listed, unless there’s a typo somewhere. I have been slowly farming up Badges of Honor to obtain my Invaders Leggings, UNLESS you can suggest another option.
I am currently at 5/6 Melandru, which until I can pull that 6th, I’m not lasting as long as this build should :-)

Soldiers stats are actually the easiest to get. They come from hotw(ugh), se(ugh), but also from ac. A few quick runs of ac will get you a full set in no time, then I just bought the runes off the trading post.

@Daemonne, you can get Soldier’s armor from dungeons as well – AC, SE, HotW.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Equipment_acquisition_by_stats#Dungeons

Dungeons suck.

EasymodeX.4062:

Dungeons suck.

Get a good guild and do them with friends. Particularly as a Mesmer, because having a good Mesmer in a party makes things easier like no other class can.

I’d prefer to randomly complain about dungeons on forums than actually do a dungeon.

Edit: I did AC story mode once with my guild and it stretched the limits of my patience for wasting time. Never set foot in one again DX.

Story modes and dungeon explore mode (where you actually get the tokens needed to buy gear) are pretty different creatures. Most exp modes you can skip or speed thru a lot of content.

Can the explorable modes be completed back to back? SideQ: can fractals? E.g. no lockout timers.

Pyroatheist.9031:

EasymodeX.4062:

Dungeons suck.

Get a good guild and do them with friends. Particularly as a Mesmer, because having a good Mesmer in a party makes things easier like no other class can.

Get a good mesmer and a good guardian in the group, and it’s a cake walk. The rest of the team can be PUG trash, and you still won’t have issues.

EasymodeX.4062:

Can the explorable modes be completed back to back? SideQ: can fractals? E.g. no lockout timers.

Dungeons have three (Arah has more) explorable modes you can do each day for a guaranteed 60 tokens each path. More tokens if you kill some of the mini bosses who drop bags of wondrous goods which give three tokens. So if you do all three exp paths of AC you can get 180 tokens a day. If you run the same path of a dung more than once a day you get 20 tokens instead of 60.

@Easymode:
Fractals are a bit different. At the end of each fractal boss there is a chest that gives fractal relics based on fractal level. You can do these any amount of times. No lockout.

There is also a bonus amount that shows up at the end of the bonus fractal, but you can only get this once per day.

TY all for random PvE infodump.

Lots of good info here, but there’s a bit missing, particularly with fractals.

On even numbered difficulty levels in fractals, you get a 4th bonus fractal with the jade maw. After this fractal, you’ll get a daily chest containing extra relics, and a chance at a ring or a fractal weapon skin depending on the difficulty. This chest is linked to the 10 level fractal tier system, so you can get a chest for each 1-9, 10-19, 20-29, etc. all in the same day. You can run as many fractals as you want consecutively with no diminishing returns, you just won’t get the daily chest again.

With exp mode dungeons, you get a base reward of 20 tokens. If it is your first run of that path that day, you get 40 bonus tokens for a total of 60 tokens. This first run of the day thing is tied to your character, not the account, so you can get on an alt and achieve the 60 tokens again for a path you already ran.

I just spent 2 hours of my life in AC exp and it was the dumbest kittening 2 hours I’ve spent in GW2. kitten the dungeons.

AC has been racheted up, and is no longer a cakewalk. HotW path 1 can be complete in 15-20 minutes with a decent group doing a speed run. If you have multiple level 80’s each can run the dungeon once to get the 60 tokens.

pahldus.1678:

AC has been racheted up, and is no longer a cakewalk. HotW path 1 can be complete in 15-20 minutes with a decent group doing a speed run. If you have multiple level 80’s each can run the dungeon once to get the 60 tokens.

Ac is just as easy as before, and actually faster because every mob and boss has significantly less hp. It is more interesting with fun mechanics though. If any of you guys want a good run, just toss me a pm ingame at some point, and I can run you through it.

Note: path 3 is bugged, the npc doesn’t work properly, so avoid that unless you are really experienced with it.