Guild Wars 2

No mesmers aint op its the mw bug which is causing the problem with double dmg with the shatter cat build so its up to the devs to ix bugs not nerf stuff especially when they buffed shatters in the last patch… hehe

My mesmer is lvl57 i play mainly wvwvw as a glamour mesmer and luv it.

Simonoly.4352:

Sigh. I’m sorry OP but you have misunderstood a lot about the class and how it works. As many others have already said, roll a level 2 Mesmer in sPVP and you will quickly understand what other Mesmers are doing to beat you and therefore what you need to beat them.

If you haven’t got time to do that, I recommend asking on the Engineer forums how to combat Mesmers. I guarantee you there will be many people rolling Engineers who know exactly how to take down Mesmers with the skills available to them.

I’ve got to do this with guardians. I’m struggling to beat them even with using an elite.

1) CD between shatters wouldn’t matter. I don’t know what build could possibly spawn enough clones/phantasms to take full use / use of all 4, or even 2, shatters in the length of (in your case if the CD existed) 6 seconds. Not even the Scepter, a weapon made for clone spamming can only spawn 1 clone every 3.5 seconds, making the CD for shatters pointless.
2) Again, I don’t think Mesmers can. Yes we can usually spawn 2-3 clones at the start of a fight but once they’re gone we can’t spawn enough clones to take use of a shatter for another 15-20 seconds, depending on build and weapons.
3) Really? A small AoE attack!? Oh no! We have very little AoE going for us besides Chaos Wind, Chaos Storm (mainly buffs and conditions) and iBeserker… if we’re lucky.
The no targeting I ‘somewhat’ understand but Mesmers have to target a enemy to spawn clones and phantasms in the first place, and in sPvP or WvW they’re lucky enough to make it to the enemy with all the AoE that’s being spammed.
4) I half agree with this. Phantasms spawn where ever they want and can move around. With iWarden this sorta sucks because it doesn’t spawn between the Mesmer and the target (which would be nice ANet… hint hint) and requires us to reposition ourself to get use of the shield it provides. With clones they usually spawn on the Mesmer, except for Scepter which spawn at the target and I believe they should spawn at the Mesmer.
5) I like confusion, it’s the only condition going for the Mesmer. But it’s countered by the enemy not doing anything. This condition sucks in PvE because mobs don’t do much at all. In PvP it’s different cause you’re just spamming all the time. Control your spam or get condition removal because Mesmers don’t have much else going for them damage wise.
6) What about Portal? I’ve only ever used it maybe 5 times and that was because a idiot got stuck in a hole and I had to pull them out. In WvW I can’t really see much use for it. So 20 people moved from spot A to spot B… which they could’ve done in the first place… and faster cause of all the movement buffs each class got. Portal is fine the way it is and it’s most likely going to get nerfed again according to ANet.
7) Best elites? Not really. I don’t recall ever using my Mesmer Elites except for trying them out. Small bubble of quickness is nice though but not game breaking. Moa Morf is alright but the target can still fight back (at much reduced damage). Mass Invis, only useful in WvW… When people aren’t spamming skills, which tends to be never. A lot of Mesmers that I see tend to use their Racial Elites instead.

TheGuy.3568:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blurred_Frenzy is still the most OP piece of crap skill. Either other skill like it get brought up or it gets toned down (probably neither will happen).

So, because you don’t want to roll behind us or run a stunbreaker, we’re op. Could say the same for any other class if you don’t want to run a skill that prevents them from stomping you. It’s like going against a Necro with absolutely no Daze, Confusion, Condition/Boon Removal and expecting to come out on top.

First of all demanding that mesmers lose the ability to shatter and drop clones defeats the basis for the ENTIRE class. Secondly Engineers can have up to count it up to 20 WEAPON skills available at the drop of a hat with ZERO cooldown between swapping kits just the weapon skills are on cool down and if YOU PLAY the engineer right you can be doing damage and causing conditions SEVERAL conditions constantly. And add to this the tool belt skills which are the same idea as a mesmers shatter skills. Our clones do CRAP damage when they are out and the Phantasms have such A LONG pause between their attacks that once they attack they need to be shattered. So no mesmers are not OP and engineers are not UP they are the MOST versatile class in this game not to mention SUPPLY DROP which stuns drops turrets and med packs and that equals a dead Mesmer…guardian…thief…warrior…ele…necro…ranger… Have I made myself clear? And also I think mesmers are THE ONLY class that doesn’t really complain about thieves in WvW. So please learn your profession and understand that as an engineer you have access to some of the most damage dealing condition causing skills in the game.

Dark.6250:

No mesmers aint op its the mw bug which is causing the problem with double dmg with the shatter cat build so its up to the devs to ix bugs not nerf stuff especially when they buffed shatters in the last patch… hehe

My mesmer is lvl57 i play mainly wvwvw as a glamour mesmer and luv it.

See it much less, I think they stealth patched it the last update that said “fixed a bunch of bugs!”

Let’s try to tone this down a bit. Looks like people took it as a personal attack on them when I mentioned these things. So… Let me just say what I am really concerned with and try not to offend.

My biggest beef with the mesmer class is that they aren’t punished for shattering clones as they should be. Many builds actually encourage it. I like the idea of the class and played it in spvp and leveled a little.

Let me explain a bit further: Clones are cool idea, and they can be read through. I think the best player should be the one that mimics the clone, not a player than can toss them out like candy. If you do not think they can be spawned at a super rate, then I suggest you look for videos of it being done. I have seen it, and I am sure they are skilled players, but it still seems backwards. To me the shatters should be emergency buttons, and losing a clone should be a big deal to the mesmer. Ranger lose their pets, its their fault to some extent (and ranger is my #2 toon.) Engineers lose turrets easily and explode them on emergency vs picking them up. Granted the turrets are bad, but the idea is still solid I think. Necros lose pets, and it can be a very big deal to builds that revolve around them. You shouldn’t destroy your helpers unless you really need to. I would like to see the builds revolve more around phantasms and clones with good HP so players have to look for the right one. Guardian specced spirit weapons shouldn’t be undestructable as they seem to be either. If you choose a class that has a micro manage system of clones or what have you, then the class should be structured to support that system, not blow it up constantly in your face.

I would be open to a rework of the class myself that involved more about keeping clones alive for trickery and tankiness.

My OP was about playing on my Engineer, but I have played all classes and I know Engineer already has one leg in the hole. The burst control AoE shatter can be too much, and I think it should be toned down. Give the mesmers something to compenstate for it though.

we good mesmers? let’s shake hands ok?

As already said, the only problem there is now with mesmers is that bug with shatter burst, still have to figure out exactly whats that about…
I play a mesmer, and i play it as intended, without exploiting bugs, and my burst just doesnt instagib ppl usually (unless maybe they are kind of glass cannons standing there waiting for me to slap their kitten), but sometimes i met some mesmers able to do way more burst damage then me… and thats quite weird since gears are same for everyone in spvp…. so yeh there is something wrong with that.
I just hope it will get fixed without nerfing anything :\

To the op.
Dont expect people here listen to you because this is a mesmer forum.
When you get a class that can do a lot against all other classes the last thing you want is that class to be nerfed.
Forget this post and try to create one were all people see it to take advantage of the opinion of all classes, not only mesmers.
best regards.

as Engineer, every other profession looks OP

Esplen.3940:

TheGuy.3568:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blurred_Frenzy is still the most OP piece of crap skill. Either other skill like it get brought up or it gets toned down (probably neither will happen).

So, because you don’t want to roll behind us or run a stunbreaker, we’re op. Could say the same for any other class if you don’t want to run a skill that prevents them from stomping you. It’s like going against a Necro with absolutely no Daze, Confusion, Condition/Boon Removal and expecting to come out on top.

Lol from my whole post that’s what you read. Even though I agreed that mesmers really aren’t OP over all.

Its the evade (HB doesn’t have this) and the auto facing ( HB and PW don’t have). If you didn’t realize that what i was talking about you shouldn’t comment. You have got to realize nothing with that type of cool down evades that long nothing not even http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Death_Blossom. 2.5 seconds is a lifetime in PvP. And on top of that it Auto-faces so yeah kittening OP end of story.

BTW they don’t plan to change this at all so why the kitten do you feel it necessary to even point this out for discussion. I could say its out of line all day they aren’t going to touch it I even said that in my OP. Next time read the whole thing instead of looking for an argument. Read what I said. I proposed that they buff the 2 other skills to be inline with Frenzy ie auto facing or they nerf it to be inline with pistol whip and hundred blades.

Its players like you that make the rest of us think that mesmers are populated by players so defensive that actual skills that are out of line can’t even be discussed. No one is trying to teal your candy and I am so jaded I realize they aren’t going to touch it so take you defensive garbage elsewhere.

More than likely they will nerf something anyhow even though it’s mostly glitches and bugs that are causing issues with the profession. While I’d love for Illusions to stick around more that is completely counter intuitive to certain traits. You don’t HAVE to build a shatter build right now, I’ve run several others happily, but right now Shatter builds are just on top because of the Mind Wrack glitch. And no, the glitch definitely isn’t fixed, hence what the glitch really is, and it’s easy to reproduce if you know how to do it, and not related to traits at all.

Finally, one more point that I think should be addressed here, good Mesmer using the clones as a confusion element doesn’t happen because NPC names can just be turned off. It’s better to assume every player is at least as good as you are, and if you wouldn’t be fooled by a clone because it doesn’t have a name over it. . . well neither would your opponent. That said I use clones from dodging when I’m stealthed to get players to waste their cooldowns, which it often does (even when it happens to me) simply because there are so many ways to lose stealth early due to random AoE damage that you’ve done.

I would ask you dirtyshame to really look at the professions and ask questions. . . and if you think about it, you’ll probably find that the reason is more simple then just a certain set of profession skills.

dirtyshame.1863:

Let’s try to tone this down a bit. Looks like people took it as a personal attack on them when I mentioned these things. So… Let me just say what I am really concerned with and try not to offend.

My biggest beef with the mesmer class is that they aren’t punished for shattering clones as they should be. Many builds actually encourage it. I like the idea of the class and played it in spvp and leveled a little.

Let me explain a bit further: Clones are cool idea, and they can be read through. I think the best player should be the one that mimics the clone, not a player than can toss them out like candy. If you do not think they can be spawned at a super rate, then I suggest you look for videos of it being done. I have seen it, and I am sure they are skilled players, but it still seems backwards. To me the shatters should be emergency buttons, and losing a clone should be a big deal to the mesmer. Ranger lose their pets, its their fault to some extent (and ranger is my #2 toon.) Engineers lose turrets easily and explode them on emergency vs picking them up. Granted the turrets are bad, but the idea is still solid I think. Necros lose pets, and it can be a very big deal to builds that revolve around them. You shouldn’t destroy your helpers unless you really need to. I would like to see the builds revolve more around phantasms and clones with good HP so players have to look for the right one. Guardian specced spirit weapons shouldn’t be undestructable as they seem to be either. If you choose a class that has a micro manage system of clones or what have you, then the class should be structured to support that system, not blow it up constantly in your face.

I would be open to a rework of the class myself that involved more about keeping clones alive for trickery and tankiness.

My OP was about playing on my Engineer, but I have played all classes and I know Engineer already has one leg in the hole. The burst control AoE shatter can be too much, and I think it should be toned down. Give the mesmers something to compenstate for it though.

we good mesmers? let’s shake hands ok?

Lol hands shaken. And yes there are builds that revolve around keeping clones up but they reduce the attack time between phantasms by half. That means the ibeserker can do the AOE attack MORE often than a warrior could while possibly dealing similar damage. And the iDuelist can unload their pistols almost at the same rate as a thief. And if the mesmer gets three phantasms up because the phant summoning skills are ridic short with builds that encourage it… It would be almost as damaging as the shatter heavy MW builds. So yes mesmers do run the build that you speak of but some just prefer to drop the clones shatter usually mw first. And if they are dropping them like the should then in 3 more seconds you will get hit with CoF from a full stack of clones. And now usually comes the point when a mesmer will summon phantasms and try to keep them alive. Unless they need distortion to get out of jail free.

dirtyshame.1863:

Let’s try to tone this down a bit. Looks like people took it as a personal attack on them when I mentioned these things. So… Let me just say what I am really concerned with and try not to offend.

My biggest beef with the mesmer class is that they aren’t punished for shattering clones as they should be. Many builds actually encourage it. I like the idea of the class and played it in spvp and leveled a little.

Let me explain a bit further: Clones are cool idea, and they can be read through. I think the best player should be the one that mimics the clone, not a player than can toss them out like candy. If you do not think they can be spawned at a super rate, then I suggest you look for videos of it being done. I have seen it, and I am sure they are skilled players, but it still seems backwards. To me the shatters should be emergency buttons, and losing a clone should be a big deal to the mesmer. Ranger lose their pets, its their fault to some extent (and ranger is my #2 toon.) Engineers lose turrets easily and explode them on emergency vs picking them up. Granted the turrets are bad, but the idea is still solid I think. Necros lose pets, and it can be a very big deal to builds that revolve around them. You shouldn’t destroy your helpers unless you really need to. I would like to see the builds revolve more around phantasms and clones with good HP so players have to look for the right one. Guardian specced spirit weapons shouldn’t be undestructable as they seem to be either. If you choose a class that has a micro manage system of clones or what have you, then the class should be structured to support that system, not blow it up constantly in your face.

I would be open to a rework of the class myself that involved more about keeping clones alive for trickery and tankiness.

My OP was about playing on my Engineer, but I have played all classes and I know Engineer already has one leg in the hole. The burst control AoE shatter can be too much, and I think it should be toned down. Give the mesmers something to compenstate for it though.

we good mesmers? let’s shake hands ok?

Dude you you not think about what you write before you post? Mesmers do exactly what you are asking them to do. We manage our clones that is our major class mechanic….when we don’t have clones on the field we are boned which would mean we to get a penalty for shattering because we leave our self defenseless…we dnt “destroy our helpers unless we need to” and we do have emergency shatter buttons, f3 and f4. For someone who says they played the class you don’t seem like you were able to grasp the class’s play style at all.

If we dnt pop our clones or phantasms we lose most of our AOE ability as well. All other classes have tons of AOE from weapon skills or utilities but we do not, we get our AOE from our shatters.

So no hands are not shaken, dont complain about our mechanics and say we need a rework because we shouldnt be allowed to play our class the way its intended and then ask for a hand shake

i dont have problems with most mesmers….having played one myself it is not hard to figure out ways to counter them

dirtyshame.1863:

My biggest beef with the mesmer class is that they aren’t punished for shattering clones as they should be. Many builds actually encourage it. I like the idea of the class and played it in spvp and leveled a little.

This is probably the dumbest thing I’ve seen on these forums. Punishing a class for using it’s prime mechanic?

Right after Thieves get punished for stealth, ele’s get punished for changing attunements, and your beloved engineers get punished for changing kits or using toolbelt.

Yeah, like 3 second global, where nothing can be done. Kind of like what happens when mesmers blow almost all their cooldowns to summon every clone they can to pull this burst off, not to mention at least half their shatter cooldowns.

Fix the bug. Stop complaining about being terrible. Learn to deal with a best-case mesmer burst that can only be done once every ~45 seconds.

Sorry if this is a necro, but the kitten in this thread is intolerably ignorant, bordering on incompetent OP.

Hockmed.9417:

dirtyshame.1863:

My biggest beef with the mesmer class is that they aren’t punished for shattering clones as they should be. Many builds actually encourage it. I like the idea of the class and played it in spvp and leveled a little.

This is probably the dumbest thing I’ve seen on these forums. Punishing a class for using it’s prime mechanic?

Right after Thieves get punished for stealth, ele’s get punished for changing attunements, and your beloved engineers get punished for changing kits or using toolbelt.

Yeah, like 3 second global, where nothing can be done. Kind of like what happens when mesmers blow almost all their cooldowns to summon every clone they can to pull this burst off, not to mention at least half their shatter cooldowns.

Fix the bug. Stop complaining about being terrible. Learn to deal with a best-case mesmer burst that can only be done once every ~45 seconds.

Sorry if this is a necro, but the kitten in this thread is intolerably ignorant, bordering on incompetent OP.

+100000

Thank you!

yes mesmers are op and i played one. they get way too much dps to be able to stealth blink and target scramble. target scrambling being the worst. most fights with mesmers i spend 50% of the time either tabbing or trying to click on some tiny little midget amongst 4 people while they dish out loads of dps which they dont even have to be physically present for. gs/ibeserker/duelist should be much weaker

All the frustrated complainers should roll a mesmer, and then come back to these forums and report on exactly how OP they still think mesmers are.

This is assuming they are good players that know what they are doing in the first place.

Seems Anet Agrees, the latest patch notes say so.

Come on people, just use your brains and stop running around hoping that Mesmer’s gonna let you burst him, and I guarantee you that he won’t be so OP any longer.