Guild Wars 2

after about 4 hours of testing the siphoning mechanic with many, many builds, i have come to the conclusion that it’s always a non-beneficial mechanic. this is assuming that siphoning is used to “top off”, and to give a decent HP return over the duration of one long fight.

combined with +healing and regen, siphoning does not give enough HP back. u can siphon with crits, on hit, with wells, yet the HP return remains paltry, unnoticeable. in general, attrition via siphoning/healing/DS just doesnt work. currently, the best strategy is to build life force as fast as possible for DS. if siphoning is meant to keep us topped off until we start up the next DS, it is a failure.

this leads me to my final point. the attrition necro is the worst of its class. thieves, engies, eles are vastly superior in whittling people down while regening. in addition to having vastly superior mobility. lack of stability makes life a lot more difficult.

i would like to see siphoning increased by 100% at least. meaning that when i slice someone with my dagger i siphon at least 60-70 HP, instead of 30 or so. dagger #2 could use a 30-50% buff as well, even if traited.

dagger is a lot of fun to play on the necro. but it just doesnt work. my necro is at her best when i stack as much vit and toughness as possible, and generate life force as efficiently as possible. perhaps this is due to burst being totally out of control right now.

sadly, i cannot play the necro i wanna play. but this is an all-too-familiar feeling which ive had across of most GW2 professions. is there any end in sight to broken builds and bad balance?

I agree that siphoning health is very weak. I’ve noticed it since beta that even in pve you basically keep the same health if you siphon health (incoming damage >= health gained). I’ve read that siphoning trait is bugged, but still even if it was working properly I don’t think that it would change something significantly.

The best results were with having minions siphon hp, siphoning with every hit + sigils of vampirism (long story short – everything you can throw in siphoning), and still best case was if you were losing hp little by little.

Given that siphoning is one of the necromancer signature skills, it’s a bit disappointing to see that this feat performs so bad.

Maybe if minions didn’t die constantly, and maybe if they remembered to attack every time, then maybe daggers would be a viable option.

But those things don’t happen, so roll a thief, or use a staff like the rest of us….

but keep the dagger for siege things, and stuff you can’t kill with a staff.

The Siphon Mechanic and/or traits that affect it are bugged. The healing doesn’t scale at all with damage or with healing power so there is no gear benefit to siphon whatsoever. The second issue is reverse scaling where siphon traits get < 0 and start healing mobs.

So yes there is clearly something wrong with Life Siphon. Minions also don’t siphon health correctly using the minion traits partly because minion AI is also broken making the problem seem even worse.

But when the AI gets fixed and the math for Siphon Life gets patched there will no longer be a problem.

I will point out though that in a team fight wells + life siphon isn’t horrible when you combine with staff 2 and condition to boons well. I have been successfully running life siphon wells since beta, they need to be stronger for sure, but they need to balance that with fixing minions and how the minion healing life siphon numbers will stack up when minions aren’t busy with logical loops and sight seeing adventures.

XiL.4318:

The second issue is reverse scaling where siphon traits get < 0 and start healing mobs.

That information is outdated, it was fixed in the November patch.

In PvE and WvW a life siphon build works fine.
Life leech runes/sigils, power/precision/toughness gear, omnomberry pies, axe/focus
and dagger/dagger as weapons.

sPvP is a different matter though, since you lack the food and knight’s gear has
vitality instead of toughness there.

1:57

it’s not supposed to be OP so as to make all of your regained health completely offset damage taken. use it well, and it is a strong addition to a necro.

and this was BEFORE the patch.

The issue I see with siphoning is that it has diminishing returns when you spec for it rather than giving more benefit the more you go into it. If you were to go a full siphoning build versus a necromancer who picks it up as a suppliment, you would heal for just about the same ammount of not less in the long run.

I believe the main cause of this is that all of the utilities and weapon traits a blood necromancer would use are crammed into the same tree. However most other specs can find useful traits in other trees quite easily. (minion masters can use spite and blood, well necromancers can get staff from death and wells from blood, even well placement from curse. ect)

If the dagger traits were moved to a different tree I could see the blood necromancer being in a better spot. Maybe if dagger traits were in soul reaping or something.

I can’t edit my post so I’m just gonna reply again. Siphoning isn’t supposed to heal faster than damage, it’s supposed to simply slow down the rate you take damage. You also need to keep in mind that when you siphon you deal as much damage as you heal. So if you were to hit the enemy with the axe 2 for the 8 x hit and siphon for 25 per hit, that’s a bonus 200 damage on top of 200 HP healed.

If you take Vampiric Rituals, the Death Magic tree is interesting right away.
Since you are using wells, might as well let them grant protection.

If your build depends on on hit effects, increasing the number of hits makes sense as
well. Dagger2 and Axe2 are great for that. Then Dark Armor would be another
interesting Death Magic choice.

If Death Magic isn’t what you want and you’d rather do some more damage instead,
Spite and Soul Reaping can offer you almost permanent fury and more critical
damage.

In PvE, you can already heal yourself for 6-7k life every 8/12 seconds without ever
touching your healing skill. While having 3.4k armor during channels.

^exactly. even if you choose to cap blood magic (which i personally will never do)

you have 40 trait points left over.

most of our useful traits are found at the 20-point mark. (imo our grands are not that appealing)

but still, you stated it yourself, a necro w/ some blood magic can siphon just as well as a max-siphon necro.

I find that to be a huge bonus. use it, mix it in.

@Sheobix

If you think our Siphon heal is good, enought, maybe you didn’t try other bunker class.

With any other bunker build, I had so much more survivability then my siphon necro.

Take the Ranger bunker build, with about 700 healing, regenration build, I can survive 2-3 ennemy at the same time for quit a long time. 1 vs 1 are never ending fights. I regen around 200-300 hp sec. I have nearly infinite dodge. More armor. I also have spirit that cast protection 50% of my hit, and a pet that can take damage for me.

With my necro, I have 38 hp a hit. Since bunker build doesn’t resolve around crit, I don’t take the crit siphon traits. So I can go minions siphon. If they hit (half the time) that’s around 60-90 hp more. If they aren’t dead yet.

I can get a burst of healing with wells if I’m specced for it, but thats like 5 sec of healing? for about 1k if you are inside. And I can have 1 well at most if I use minion. Most of the time you ether choose minions or wells.

So right now I’m with a subpar healing were you have to HIT the ennemy (bad again Thief, and they are 50% of the population) when my ranger can just chill and heal for 200 hp.

But wait! Necro does have Dead Shroud! If you have any LF, because in sPvP most of the time you won’t have much. This will hold for around 3-4 sec. You don’t have any vigor source, maybe one. You usually don’t have any protection source in that build. You have no other way to mitigate damage.

Overall, I’m having a hard time explaining how bad the necro bunker build is if you compare to others. You have to try it to feel it.

Engi Bunker, Ranger Bunker, they are twice as effective as necro.

Since our regen resolve around HITTING people to heal, and we don’t have anything else to mitigate except our DS, we should receive a lot more HP par hit. Right now our regen from siphon is lower then a Ranger regen, which is on 100% of the fight.

if you find a pure necro bunker to be lackluster compared to a pure bunker other class, don’t roll your necro to only bunker… you’re wasting the rest of the potential.

min/maxing a necro, once again, i say is not a good idea.

our siphoning is easy to cap out with 20 points in blood and a sigil. use it WITH other strengths in a build… you’ll find yourself doing solid bunkering + lots of other things.

I find Bunker necro to be better without the Sipphon health traits.

If you use the well healing + Well of blood + DS heavy, you can survive a lot better then relying on siphon heal.

Oh and you just said it, that’s one of the issue for the necro. If you go full Bunker, you won’t be effective. You won’t have any damage output.

While on my Ranger, if I go full bunker, I still get a viable condition damage output. Getting +300 cond damage fron speccing bunker help a lot.

Sheobix, I know you playing a lot with necromancer. But you really think that a 38 hp par hit, is viable if you compare to a 120 hp/sec AUTOREGEN + a 100% up regen of about 100-200 hp? We have to hit something, not them.

Kardiamond.6952:

Sheobix, I know you playing a lot with necromancer. But you really think that a 38 hp par hit, is viable if you compare to a 120 hp/sec AUTOREGEN + a 100% up regen of about 100-200 hp? We have to hit something, not them.

It’s not an either/or proposition. Necros can get permanent regen too, and near permanent protection at the same time, while still siphoning health, with a much more effective 6 heal, plus death shroud.

Bunker engis are very strong though, but that’s largely due to a bug.

Care to show me the build for perma protection and regen? It’s not that I don’t trust you, I’m just not aware of it.

Thanks!

Edit : I checked a traits builder, and our only source of protection comes from Wells. 3 sec of protection on 45 traited traited wells.

Kardiamond.6952:

Care to show me the build for perma protection and regen? It’s not that I don’t trust you, I’m just not aware of it.

Thanks!

Edit : I checked a traits builder, and our only source of protection comes from Wells. 3 sec of protection on 45 traited traited wells.

Permanent regen is as simple as staff 2 with some boon duration, but it becomes more flexible and forgiving when combined with mark of evasion and focus offhand on second set.

Near permanent protection:
4 wells, 30 in death magic, ritual of protection, ritual mastery, 2 earth/4 grove or 2 grove/4 earth, last gasp.

Each well = 4.75s protection

4.75/32 + 4.75/36 + 4.75/48 + 4.75/48 = 47.8% uptime.

4 rune = 4.75s protection (6.5 before last patch)

4.75/30 = 15.8% uptime

15.8+47.8 = 63.6% uptime

Last gasp = 9.75s protection

9.75/60 = 16.3% uptime

63.6 + 16.3 = 79.9% uptime.

You can drop 5 from death magic and only lose 0.4% uptime if you want. If you’re not going to half health, you don’t need the extra 16.3% uptime to win btw. That doesn’t include vulnerability conversions from well of power either, but that’s probably counteracted by the 25% chance to proc once the ICD is up on the 4rune delaying it a few seconds. You could go higher using well of suffering instead of darkness if you wanted. You could go higher still by using the two spectral skills that give protection and spectral mastery instead, but you lose all the well utility. With the grove/earth procs of last patch, I think the highest I could figure out was 97-98% uptime, but the build sucked :P

Is there anyone really going with 4 well in spvp?

And what about your damage?

Like you said, the build prolly sucked, because everything was focused around having protection with wells.

Most other bunker build can do it without having to sacrifice all abilities. Elem, Guardian, Ranger just to name few.

Before going any further in that discution, I will test more bunker build for the necro.

But the original post was about siphon heal, and except well heal that can be good, other sipphon seems to be unreliable. Well in my experience.

Mammoth.1975:

Near permanent protection:
4 wells, 30 in death magic, ritual of protection, ritual mastery, 2 earth/4 grove or 2 grove/4 earth, last gasp.

Is there room for Spectral Wall? That alone can give — if you are able to stay near your wall and are able to move — 25% protection uptime. Wall gives 5 sec protection when you go through it, but stays up for 9 seconds, so you can move through it a second time after the first protection has dropped, gaining a second 5 seconds. With a 40-second cooldown. Enemy vulnerability does stack, so running through it twice gives them a 20-stack of vulnerability. And it’s an Ethereal Field, so Putrid Mark would give Chaos Armor. (We need a Leap Finisher and another Blast Finisher!)

@Druitt

Spectral Wall is a wonderful utility. I don’t understand why not more people use it. You can stack quit a lot of vuln on somoene.

Tho I something have a hard time getting my protection buff. Like if I cast it near myself, it seems like I have to walk off, then walk back in.

Kardiamond.6952:

Is there anyone really going with 4 well in spvp?

And what about your damage?

Like you said, the build prolly sucked, because everything was focused around having protection with wells.

Most other bunker build can do it without having to sacrifice all abilities. Elem, Guardian, Ranger just to name few.

Before going any further in that discution, I will test more bunker build for the necro.

But the original post was about siphon heal, and except well heal that can be good, other sipphon seems to be unreliable. Well in my experience.

Not usually, most builds with wells run 2 or 3. I run 3 on one build but switch in a fourth against double melee.

The build that is focused around having protection with wells is actually pretty strong, although largely pointless with portal in its current state. Oh, and don’t forget that ritual of protection affects allies, so it’s pretty strong even if you’re not building to bunker. The weak build was the spectral one.

I hope you’re not talking about running wells as some kind of ‘sacrifice’ btw.

Are you talking about WvW or sPvP?

I personnally never run a build without CC breaker, so that’s why for me 4 well is out of question.

And I’m not a fan of Mass well, simply because higher level everyone will counter your well by just moving out of it and knocking you back.

Since DD Ele is the new flavor of the month, knock back are quit frequent.

I might also be bad with Wells, don’t like their stil. In WvW I use Well of suffering (not sure the name) and spectral Wall. That’s about it

I think the effective range of Spectral wall is larger than it appears, so if you cast it too close, you’re already standing in it and not going through it like they want you to.

Maybe it should also tick, say 3 times in 9 seconds, so that if you stood in it you could still get the buff/debuff.

Kardiamond.6952:

Are you talking about WvW or sPvP?

I personnally never run a build without CC breaker, so that’s why for me 4 well is out of question.

And I’m not a fan of Mass well, simply because higher level everyone will counter your well by just moving out of it and knocking you back.

Since DD Ele is the new flavor of the month, knock back are quit frequent.

I might also be bad with Wells, don’t like their stil. In WvW I use Well of suffering (not sure the name) and spectral Wall. That’s about it

I run 2 builds with no stunbreak actually. The ‘bring a stunbreak or lose’ rule is more of a guideline if you have deathshroud. If I fail to dodge something like bulls, I can afford to facetank 100b no sweat, even without DS. Thieves are pretty much laughable. And that’s with a balanced build, not a full tank.

Against better teams I run a glassier build, and for that I bring a stunbreak. Stats won’t save you from a coordinated spike. 100b sure. Time warped 100b+backstab+shatter while immobilized and dazed, probably not.

Sheobix.8796:

it’s not supposed to be OP so as to make all of your regained health completely offset damage taken. use it well, and it is a strong addition to a necro.

and this was BEFORE the patch.

lolwut? i appreciate your posts, and correct me if im wrong, but do you even do any spvp? and youre showing me life transfer, not siphoning.

Sheobix.8796:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_wrqBWFZDw

1:57

it’s not supposed to be OP so as to make all of your regained health completely offset damage taken. use it well, and it is a strong addition to a necro.

and this was BEFORE the patch.

Anyone know what runes and sigil he uses? the amount of HP he regen is impressive.

striker.3704:

I can’t edit my post so I’m just gonna reply again. Siphoning isn’t supposed to heal faster than damage, it’s supposed to simply slow down the rate you take damage.

yep, this is exactly what i said on my post. this is the general idea behind it.

striker.3704:

So if you were to hit the enemy with the axe 2 for the 8 x hit and siphon for 25 per hit, that’s a bonus 200 damage on top of 200 HP healed.

these are paltry amounts that add nothing to your survivability. for example, in 10 slices of my dagger, i’ll siphon about 400 HP and it will take about 5 seconds. this is half of someone’s autoattack. get my drift?

Rannulf.9417:

Anyone know what runes and sigil he uses? the amount of HP he regen is impressive.

he’s regenerating life force, not HP =S

Panhauramix.2784:

I think the effective range of Spectral wall is larger than it appears, so if you cast it too close, you’re already standing in it and not going through it like they want you to.

Maybe it should also tick, say 3 times in 9 seconds, so that if you stood in it you could still get the buff/debuff.

I actually hate all wall-type effects because their targeting line is so fidgety when near you. I’d prefer if they simply dropped at your feed, aligned across your character (long-ways aligning with your shoulders/feet), and if you don’t move you are considered to be “inside” of it so you could Finish easily, but have it trigger when you leave it so running straight forward would give you the boon.

I am of the opinion that life siphoning is fine as is (I don’t play sPvP, by the way). I believe that it is intended to compliment a build and not be the focus of one. I feel this way because I have tried so very hard to make a primarily siphon-focused necro. In the end it wasn’t working out – I did very well in medium length fights, but most of the time I would get burst down by Thieves or Warriors, or lose the attrition war to a more tanky build. So siphoning is now a secondary focus of my build and I am doing so much better. Coming out of a 1v1 or 2v1 fight with less than 1000hp remaining, which happens relatively often, justifies my decision to use siphons and feels awesome to boot. Anyway, the point is that siphoning is fine as a “backup” thing to have in your build.

I don’t think the necromancer is made to min-max, as Sheobix said. Other classes who focus into one thing are better than a necromancer also focusing into that one thing. There are better bunkers, better bursters, better condition application, better condition damage classes than necro. The necro’s strength is in having strong performance at two or three of such things at the same time, and all of the best necro builds I’ve seen take advantage of that.

@lettucemode

That’s the point exactly.

The issue is, a bunker necro in sPvP will only be able to take damage, and nothing more.

A Ranger bunker can take damage too, and still be able to output a fair amount of damage.

Our only Bunker with ok damage build is a Bunker MM, but that mean not focusing on Wells, and using bugged AI minions.

Dulon.9347:

XiL.4318:

The second issue is reverse scaling where siphon traits get < 0 and start healing mobs.

That information is outdated, it was fixed in the November patch.

In PvE and WvW a life siphon build works fine.
Life leech runes/sigils, power/precision/toughness gear, omnomberry pies, axe/focus
and dagger/dagger as weapons.

sPvP is a different matter though, since you lack the food and knight’s gear has
vitality instead of toughness there.

Siphons still hit < 0 with reverse scaling, and Vampire builds in PvP are the only viable support/bunker without pet AI fixes.

But tell me more.

XiL.4318:

Dulon.9347:

XiL.4318:

The second issue is reverse scaling where siphon traits get < 0 and start healing mobs.

That information is outdated, it was fixed in the November patch.

In PvE and WvW a life siphon build works fine.
Life leech runes/sigils, power/precision/toughness gear, omnomberry pies, axe/focus
and dagger/dagger as weapons.

sPvP is a different matter though, since you lack the food and knight’s gear has
vitality instead of toughness there.

Siphons still hit < 0 with reverse scaling, and Vampire builds in PvP are the only viable support/bunker without pet AI fixes.

But tell me more.

Step 1: go to level 1 area
Step 2: use any vampiric ability
Step 3: realize your mistake

And about the pvp… if you ever experienced WvW with omnomberry pies and a
proper life siphon build, you just feel weak without it.

That probably means those pies are overpowered.

this thread is only for spvp discussion. wvw =/= competitive pvp.

nerva.7940:

this thread is only for spvp discussion. wvw =/= competitive pvp.

You may want to make that explicit in either the thread title, or even the body of the post. As it is, nothing in the OP really indicates that you’ve narrowed the scope of this thread to structured player versus player.

common sense. wvw isnt really pvp.

nerva.7940:

common sense. wvw isnt really pvp.

Here, I’ll try the post again. With slight editing for emphasis.

nerva.7940:

this thread is only for spvp discussion.

You may want to make that explicit in either the thread title, or even the body of the post. As it is, nothing in the OP really indicates that you’ve narrowed the scope of this thread to structured player versus player.

nerva.7940:

common sense. wvw isnt really pvp.

There are 3 modes to this game. You should call out what mode you’re talking about to be clear. You say, “common sense” but it is obvious that many people have addressed you from WvW and PvE perspectives. Favor clarity over pride when communicating.

Siphoning will never be fixed. It can’t be, for the simple reason that there’s too many other abilities out there that regen generic health that aren’t bound to necros. Regens, instant heals… but also sigils and runes and boons.

A necro ability that did significant healing on top of that would potentially outheal damage if someone maxxed out the other options. Remove lifesteal sigils and runes, and there will be play-balance room to give necros a decent leech. But that won’t happen.

That’s why in my opinion DS exists. Designers are free to give you significant rates of LF regen only because they exercise such tight control over how it’s generated. No one else can help you, equipment doesn’t directly give LF, etc. It’s the only non-stacking regen.

yea, im just saying, why even put it in the game if it adds diddly squat to your efficacy.

Manticore Five.9867:

Siphoning will never be fixed. It can’t be, for the simple reason that there’s too many other abilities out there that regen generic health that aren’t bound to necros. Regens, instant heals… but also sigils and runes and boons.

A necro ability that did significant healing on top of that would potentially outheal damage if someone maxxed out the other options. Remove lifesteal sigils and runes, and there will be play-balance room to give necros a decent leech. But that won’t happen.

I really disagree with this.

First of all, never be fixed is a little extreme. It’s a continuous thing. Why not tweak the numbers up and see what happens? If people aren’t speccing it atm it means it’s not OP and if it improves to an extent at least it might be a viable option. You also have to keep in mind that if people spec lifesteal then it means they’re losing the utilty of whatever they put those traits into before (altho to be fair a lot of necro traits suck already).

Secondly, is it really the end of the world if you can’t, or have great difficulty killing some player 1v1 or 1v2/3? I’ve played games where players were unkillable, sure it made them quite unbeatable 1v1 but their dmge was low and you could stalemate it or escape. If it becomes a big issue why not just change the way points flip? I have wayyy more issues with kitten burst builds than unkillable builds. and the unkillable attrition builds should definitely be on classes like guardian or necro who can’t escape easily. even if life siphon were viable and healed a lot more, it is predictable that ppl would just go: “oh dagger siphon, lol interrupt” “cc him to death he got no stability”.

People have already been outhealing damage. Hence all teh qq about bunker builds.
I think the water field + 3 blast finisher or w/e of ele is a lot more significant than 200hp/sec or whatever you can get from life siphon. I think life siphon probably adds up to less than heal specced regen currently.

@Manticore Five

It could be true, if other class didn’t have abilities that could outheal damage.

Elem, Guardian, Rangers and Engineer (the bunker class I tried in spvp) can all outheal damage in combat.

And I feel that developper took DS as an excuse for balancing us. Sorry, but DS is not as good as people think to tank. Once somoene damage you, your LF will drain really really fast. And in sPvP you don’t have any easy LF source.

Siphon life doesn’t seems to be a traits useful alone. I only use it when I have no other choice and I need to go in the blood trait line. It can still heal for a bit, but it subpar to other heal form others classes.

I discovered a cool thing about siphoning today. I always wondered what those little extra damage numbers were on my attacks – they fly off quickly and diagonally, maybe some of you have noticed them too. I was reading some stuff on reddit and apparently that is actual bonus damage added to your attacks from the siphoning. So if you hit a target for 300 damage, and have Vampiric on, you will actually do 325 damage. Also this extra damage isn’t reduced by anything, I remember it happening to the ancient karkas during the event even though my attacks were doing zero damage. Apparently you can kill the seals in the Cliffside fractal (the one where you free the colossus) without the hammer by doing this.

nerva.7940:

striker.3704:

I can’t edit my post so I’m just gonna reply again. Siphoning isn’t supposed to heal faster than damage, it’s supposed to simply slow down the rate you take damage.

yep, this is exactly what i said on my post. this is the general idea behind it.

striker.3704:

So if you were to hit the enemy with the axe 2 for the 8 x hit and siphon for 25 per hit, that’s a bonus 200 damage on top of 200 HP healed.

these are paltry amounts that add nothing to your survivability. for example, in 10 slices of my dagger, i’ll siphon about 400 HP and it will take about 5 seconds. this is half of someone’s autoattack. get my drift?

Rannulf.9417:

Anyone know what runes and sigil he uses? the amount of HP he regen is impressive.

he’s regenerating life force, not HP =S

Um, no. That was regenerating health points. It was a precision-based proc’ing vamp necro.

regenerating LF is done through Dagger1 and staff1. I ALSO do that well in that vid.

get it right.

also, the thread title is “Siphoning Not a Beneficial Strat. At all”

I see no disclaimer saying this is only for a sPvP standpoint.

as for sigils, i was using sigil of earth, and omnomberry buff for extra 66% crit proc siphoning

bumping this thread for siphoning justice

a 100% increase to amount siphoned is all i really ask for. so after 10 slices of the dagger, you get about 1k HP back, which is perfectly reasonable. and it should scale with healing.

I PvE’d @ headstart only to get rid of the uprank arrow in wvw; now all I do is T/SPvP.

I’ve played with Siphon builds since the patch fix for it. I still prefer my 10 (V):20 (III, IV):10 (VI):0:30 (II, X, XII) D/F+Staff build.

I’ll tinker with a vamp spec here &there but until +heal power scales with siphons (well, crit, on-hit) I will keep mashing my 5s DS spamming power build. Its legit for bunker and situational burst.

I’d play MM more but minions are outright broke.

lol there was a patch to fix siphoning? that was…unnoticeable. im kinda worried now.

you have to add proper runes, gear and even foods and such to get the proper effect all while balancing your damage ouput.

nerva.7940:

lol there was a patch to fix siphoning? that was…unnoticeable. im kinda worried now.

The fix was to prevent reverse scaling from being downleveled to heal enemies instead of harm them. It was not a buff to make it worthwhile.

LastDarkness.7390:

you have to add proper runes, gear and even foods and such to get the proper effect all while balancing your damage ouput.

this.

the blood traits aren’t there to give us an easybutton way of regenerating 100% of all damage taken in.

If you increased the healing of siphoning by another 100% (even after the 50% effectivity trait) and you want 1k after 10 hits, which is 3.3 chains from dagger1, plus you add consume (which heals anywhere from 7-12k for me) plus if you put in rampager’s gear to crit often, you put in crit-siphon trait, which does A LOT, plus the siphon-on-hit minor trait, plus the well siphoning trait… plus use omnomberry ghosts to give AN ADDITIONAL siphon on crit effect….

you’re asking them to unbalance us? Look, siphoning may lack the potential to be a center for someone’s pvp build, but it shouldn’t be. If you design something in a way that it can’t be killed because all it’s designed to do is regenerate health…

Well, we’d be the new thieves. just trait all into blood, grab a bloodlust sigil and autoattack all day. drop wells and let them suck people dry.

imho, even though i’m a huge fan of the siphoning line and want to see it get buffed just as much as the rest of us, I don’t think a 100% increase is justifiable.