Guild Wars 2

Lorelei.3918:

I get those things for free from traits.

One day I will find a way to become rich from exploiting peoples’ inability to understand the concept of getting something for free.

Let’s try and calm down, everyone. The arguments are out there for everyone to think about and evaluate. My take on the last posts is: everything you choose to implement into your build is a tradeoff. There are choices that are easy to dismiss (rampager zerg wellmancer), choices that are harder to figure out (minmaxing crit damage modifier – as crit damage doesn’t have a fixed stat value), and choices that come down to personal playstyle and interpretation of the game’s situation and possibilities. I’m far from agreeing with everyone on their opinions, but I’d like to keep this as a platform for everyone to offer their views. There’s been suggestions that I can’t take seriously in the least so I don’t get into discussions with the posters. There’s just nothing to gain for anyone; no insight for me, no basis for a fruitful discussion and I don’t want to ‘educate’ people into following what I think is right.
So yeah, let’s get back to the topic. I like how it went so far, there has been a lot of valuable input and food for thought.

I was switching my sigils around yesterday night to see which ones go best with my gear/build setup :
Stamina (complete energy refill, no icd as far as I can tell)
Restoration (heal on kill)
Blood (heal on crit, 2s icd)

I logged off with Stamina in both mainhands and as far as I remember Blood in my warhorn. I’d prefer Restoration on offhand, but the two on-kill ones seem to block each other. And surprisingly enough I liked stamina refill sooo much better than health gain.
One thing I’m gonna try is Restoration&Blood on axe/warhorn to dive in and gain as much health as possible from doing what necros do, and Stamina on staff for DS – where healing doesn’t work anyway and which has a better damage modifier untalented – to make an escape and make use of the DS skills.

Stamina is incredible if you frontline and push into/through the head of the zerg. It offers mobility that I didn’t know was available to necromancers – as long as your midline/backline can finish some targets off. And it allowed me to be much more reckless than usually (or much more alive even with my balls to the wall playstyle).

What are your sigils of choice and what do you like about them?

well doesn’t work well in wvw (unless you pop it under a massive size zergs) because normal people are still human (no matter how stupid they look) and will roll out the well as soon as you pop it.
dagger is by far better than axe since it have immobilize which is the only thing that make wells viable. but dagger range are so restrictive and syphon live is somewhat a kitten to make it worth it.
this build relied on team play and you will be a kitten if you are somewhat lagging behind your zerg. i personally think a wellomancer should sport staff (more aoe, more utilities)
tried it once, didn’t like it since it is very dependent to other people and in a pug zerg you will be always left behind

Bawi.9541:

Balekai.6083:

Edit 2: Didn’t have time last post to figure out the Runes/Sigils, but this is what I came up with for an optimal version of your build (switched the rares/exotic trinkets to ascended and used ascended weapons), focusing on damage, vitality and toughness:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBmQDbkRrSvTTTjfTBIz46nnew94iDLIqwwA-j0xAofBZCCMJKQZvioxWGLiGryGT9SEVLFwFLjA-w

I tried the trait setup today with my gear and I gotta say, I think I found my favorite wellmancer build right there. kittening love it! Parasitic Bond + Omnomberry Compote makes for a veeeery fun experience in Plague Form :O
Without Chilling Darkness I find myself using Plague#3 more than Plague#2, which has its own benefits I guess.

Is the focus on power better than crit chance and crit damage?

morrolan.9608:

Bawi.9541:

Balekai.6083:

Edit 2: Didn’t have time last post to figure out the Runes/Sigils, but this is what I came up with for an optimal version of your build (switched the rares/exotic trinkets to ascended and used ascended weapons), focusing on damage, vitality and toughness:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBmQDbkRrSvTTTjfTBIz46nnew94iDLIqwwA-j0xAofBZCCMJKQZvioxWGLiGryGT9SEVLFwFLjA-w

I tried the trait setup today with my gear and I gotta say, I think I found my favorite wellmancer build right there. kittening love it! Parasitic Bond + Omnomberry Compote makes for a veeeery fun experience in Plague Form :O
Without Chilling Darkness I find myself using Plague#3 more than Plague#2, which has its own benefits I guess.

Is the focus on power better than crit chance and crit damage?

Power adds directly to attack, which is used to calculate your damage effectiveness vs. a targets armor (which is made up of toughness and armor pieces). The more Power you have the better your damage scales against lighter and heavier targets. Criticals give you 150% more damage when they proc on your damage output. Critical Damage adds to that 150% more damage. That’s why Power, Critical Damage, Critical chance + Might stacks together increase damage almost exponentially and do more spike damage than any other gear set for most classes.

Now having a bit less power and a good amount of critical chance (say Knights armor) will overtake most non-critical power builds, but may fall behind pure power primary stats (like Soldiers) the heavier the target is. I see this with my Knights/Cavalier/Celestial Phantasm Mesmer.

If you want to focus on two defensive stats like a Soldiers build, focusing on pure power is going to be your best bet, because the benefits of mixing and matching for 20%ish critical chance here and 30% critical damage there aren’t going to help you much as you sacrifice mitigation/survivability. Which is what you’re going for Soldiers in the first place, not for the damage.

Best to just focus on getting as much power as you can, while keeping the defensive stats as high as possible and forget about criticals. Or in the case of some classes with access to lots of natural condition proc, go condition + two defensive stats instead. Because for classes like Necros, we can get a lot of damage out condition damage as a sole offensive stat.

This is the build I am using with gear. Pretty sure this is what Ascii posted a while ago in what he was / is using.

Looking for some feed back, thoughts and observations. I am fairly happy with the build. For Roaming I tend to switch out for a more condition heavy build but this is what I use for zerg and general game play.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQUQNBmODbkRLcPTzSjfPBIz46nnU494xMGeZA-j0xAYfBZCTgICwJwioxWGLiGr2GTFTEVDA-w

Balekai.6083:

If you want to focus on two defensive stats like a Soldiers build, focusing on pure power is going to be your best bet, because the benefits of mixing and matching for 20%ish critical chance here and 30% critical damage there aren’t going to help you much as you sacrifice mitigation/survivability. Which is what you’re going for Soldiers in the first place, not for the damage.

So what do you think of Ascii’s wellomancer build in that regard? Attack below 3000 but high’ish crit chance, damage and toughness.

Just try to maximize effective power:
effective power = power * (critchance * (1.5+critdamage) + (1-critchance))
with critchance and critdamage as decimals (e.g. 54% would be 0.54)

Armor class does not matter, it scales the same for every level of armor.
And Ascii has done a good job in that regard

morrolan.9608:

Balekai.6083:

If you want to focus on two defensive stats like a Soldiers build, focusing on pure power is going to be your best bet, because the benefits of mixing and matching for 20%ish critical chance here and 30% critical damage there aren’t going to help you much as you sacrifice mitigation/survivability. Which is what you’re going for Soldiers in the first place, not for the damage.

So what do you think of Ascii’s wellomancer build in that regard? Attack below 3000 but high’ish crit chance, damage and toughness.

I would need a link, but again it probably suffers from the same pros/cons as my Mesmer damage wise (designed my Mes around 2750 attack, 2800 armor, 50% critical chance and 70% critical damage), since it sounds as if Ascii is aiming for the same type of stats. Against light to medium armored foes it will do very good damage. Against bunker or very high armored characters the DPS starts to fade compared to higher power levels. When I get might stacks the damage becomes amazing again. My Mesmer partially gets away with this because of high damaging phantasms. Necro however already suffers from issues with low base damage skills except for a few (including WoS).

That said, a more mix and match armor set with critical chance, damage and toughness should be good. Necros have a lot of health anyways to soak up conditions. It’s just a more offensive build with less survivability.

The question is when you’re tying to create a hardy build while still having good damage, is it worth trying to fit precision + critical damage and related traits into a build? Or is it better to just go straight Soldiers for example to reap the benefits of very high vitality, toughness and power? One has to take these things into account, especially when when making a build for a specific purpose. In this case a very very tanky and hard to kill WvW zerg power Necro build that also hits somewhat hard and can sustain itself.

Bawi.9541:

Just try to maximize effective power:
effective power = power * (critchance * (1.5+critdamage) + (1-critchance))
with critchance and critdamage as decimals (e.g. 54% would be 0.54)

Armor class does not matter, it scales the same for every level of armor.
And Ascii has done a good job in that regard

If you’re talking about Ascii’s build’s armor, I completely agree. It’s a damage sponge.

If you’re talking about its damage efficiency, I have to disagree It’s actually unbalanced with an extreme bias toward precision that far outpaces power. I think the reason it succeeds so well is because it leverages this high crit chance into sustain from Vampiric Precision and Sigils of Blood.

Nagato no Kami.4980:

Bawi.9541:

Just try to maximize effective power:
effective power = power * (critchance * (1.5+critdamage) + (1-critchance))
with critchance and critdamage as decimals (e.g. 54% would be 0.54)

Armor class does not matter, it scales the same for every level of armor.
And Ascii has done a good job in that regard

If you’re talking about Ascii’s build’s armor, I completely agree. It’s a damage sponge.

If you’re talking about its damage efficiency, I have to disagree It’s actually unbalanced with an extreme bias toward precision that far outpaces power. I think the reason it succeeds so well is because it leverages this high crit chance into sustain from Vampiric Precision and Sigils of Blood.

Oops, I mistook the link posted above as asciis setup because it had ‘his’ trait setup. You’re right, ascii uses power=precision… Either you’re right and/or he’s calculating with 20+ might stacks in mind at all times anyway (or I’m giving him too much credit and the gear setup sucks big time :>)

Point for point, it’s clear that power always grants the highest damage yield. However, in the context of wvw, it’s not just about sustained damage that dictates everything because people avoid and mitigate attacks. Thus, the damage spikes with high crit chance and damage can be very effective at downing people the fastest in big fights. And a wellmancer is about delivering really big damage spikes combined with miscellaneous effects.

The Ascii build was meant for commanding, and it provides high survivability and utility while maintaining the ability to put forth decent damage. So the precision does increase some overall dps while increasing survivability without going all out blocky tank.

With the upcoming change to Deadly Strength, it’s going to be even more effective soon.

Bawi.9541:

Nagato no Kami.4980:

Bawi.9541:

Just try to maximize effective power:
effective power = power * (critchance * (1.5+critdamage) + (1-critchance))
with critchance and critdamage as decimals (e.g. 54% would be 0.54)

Armor class does not matter, it scales the same for every level of armor.
And Ascii has done a good job in that regard

If you’re talking about Ascii’s build’s armor, I completely agree. It’s a damage sponge.

If you’re talking about its damage efficiency, I have to disagree It’s actually unbalanced with an extreme bias toward precision that far outpaces power. I think the reason it succeeds so well is because it leverages this high crit chance into sustain from Vampiric Precision and Sigils of Blood.

Oops, I mistook the link posted above as asciis setup because it had ‘his’ trait setup. You’re right, ascii uses power=precision… Either you’re right and/or he’s calculating with 20+ might stacks in mind at all times anyway (or I’m giving him too much credit and the gear setup sucks big time :>)

I think what he tried to do was raise damage through precision/crit damage while upping sustain via precision/toughness. It’s a valid strategy because of the healing procs. There are more builds with a lot more sustain and there are builds with a lot more damage but it is a build that finds a strong middle ground. It’s beautifully balanced, really (although he would greatly increase his damage by running Bloodlust instead of the Sigil of Accuracy).

That being said, although I feel that it’s a very good front line necro build (given enough guardians in the party to provide stability) I honestly think it’s a sub-optimal command build. IMO, a stronger command build would look something closer to this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBHhZakRrTvSTTjfPBIVA7pHePu4UPWH9zB-jUyAofBRCTgICgJwioxWGLiGryGT9mUNsgsBvIa1SBwkwI-w

I think a build like this is superior for commanding because it retains much of the precision that procs siphons while adding significantly to the sustain through the added vitality and DS pools not to mention Ritual of Protection. It also brings its own stability through FitG which adds another survival/command tool. It has sacrificed a bit of armor (less efficient than the HP, though) and a lot of offense (GT wells, staff CD, Banshee, etc) to get here but I feel the tradeoff is worth is. Commanding isn’t about getting the most bags or dishing out damage, it’s about sustain and leading the zerg where it needs to go and this build does that better, I think.

It is, however, hard to give up potential bags though. -_-

ugh, Take 2 since I got an error last time. Hate that! :P

Are you guys referencing the build I linked? Not sure if that is Ascii’s or not, might be I don’t remember. Gear might have changed a bit but if it is his build then I would have directly copied it.

I noticed that a lot of the builds here seem to prefer pure Soldiers gear. Is there a reason for this? Is precision that bad? Can someone explain their reasons as to why you guys seem to believe this?

In my build I am running knights with zerker weapons. Precision is clearly a main stat I use. I am always looking to improve so I look forward to input.

I am not a commander, I don’t feel comfortable leading. But I do play on the front lines of the zerg.

KOPPER.1458:

ugh, Take 2 since I got an error last time. Hate that! :P

Are you guys referencing the build I linked? Not sure if that is Ascii’s or not, might be I don’t remember. Gear might have changed a bit but if it is his build then I would have directly copied it.

I noticed that a lot of the builds here seem to prefer pure Soldiers gear. Is there a reason for this? Is precision that bad? Can someone explain their reasons as to why you guys seem to believe this?

In my build I am running knights with zerker weapons. Precision is clearly a main stat I use. I am always looking to improve so I look forward to input.

I am not a commander, I don’t feel comfortable leading. But I do play on the front lines of the zerg.

Here is Ascii’s current Wellomancer build:

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBHhZakRLcvSTTjfPBIz46nnU494xMGeZA-jUCBoiCiEGBiIAMBqIaslRFRjVbDTFjIq2cORG0DrWKAmEGB-w

You can keep an eye on any changes he may make to it by following his Twitch channel here: http://www.twitch.tv/gw2ascii

Keep in mind, as mentioned above, that Ascii’s focus on Crit, while certainly having damage in mind, is also used to leverage the on crit sustain effects of Sigils of Blood and Vampiric Precision.

However, this thread got me thinking differently about Crit Chance:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/Damage-Power-Precision-and-Golden-Ratios/first#post2851306

If you subscribe to this person’s theories, it means Ascii’s Power to Precision ratio is rather inefficient when it comes to raw damage output. The ratio in his build is 1.136 (assuming 25 stacks of Bloodlust), where a ratio of 2.032 (2 to 1 Power to Precision) is optimal at his level of Crit Damage (again based on the analysis theory). But again, raw damage is not the sole purpose of Crit Chance in Ascii’s build. Sustain plays a part as well.

So given the above, PVT is the best choice to gain Power as a primary stat but also gain effective health stats. I’ve chosen to mix some PVT into my Power/Stability WvW build, along with Zerk weapons and a hefty dose of Cavalier’s.

Here is the build I’ve been running lately in case you’re interested: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNBHhZakRrbvSTTjfPBApY3ajUM8yUPKH9zB-j0CBYfCi0HBiIAM7RQMBSZtMqIasabYKXQqYDp2cWRzgWoWKAmEGB-w

My build basically takes Ascii’s play style and overall role, but reduces the focus on crit chance for sustain and instead has a higher Death Shroud focus with a bit more raw damage. Death Shroud plays a larger role in my survivability than crit based sustain and raw Armor.

I’m currently playing around with ways to get 25 DM to leverage the buff to Deadly Strength in the patch next week, but I’m not sure the trait tradeoffs will be worth it.

I’ve noticed you use 1 zerker ring and energy sigils over blood? Reason?

KOPPER.1458:

I’ve noticed you use 1 zerker ring and energy sigils over blood? Reason?

I was playing with Sigils for awhile. I’m currently back to Blood. The zerker ring was used to get me to my goal of 2,000 Power without losing other offensive stats.

Mostly great discussion so far; lots to think about.

Build

20/10/25/15/0

This is for WvW mostly zerging, some roaming.

Weapons are Axe/Dagger with Staff for long range bombing. I have emphasized sustain with the 15 points in Blood for siphons and the 5pt Spite ability in addition to Sigils of Blood and Restoration, axe damage and passive stats with 25 Death which will add 190 power or so come next Tuesday. I also have good Marks but not faster regen of them. Death Shroud is very deemphasized, essentially just for defense and shroudhopping for Retaliation and to drop annoying conditions.

I’m not sure about the Sigil of Restoration, it has its moments and there is a lot to be said for a lot of toughness + health regen, but Sigil of Force might just be better. My guildies and I go back and forth on Fire vs Blood also for big fights.

It is a crying shame to not get Curses 15 for a shroudhopping build with +25% boon duration, but I can’t find the points for it.

This is what I am testing now, it will get better on 12/10 and the new heal could be very good for this spec.

@Liquid
I have a homemade damage calculator and according to it, your build does much better damage than Ascii’s (about 4-6% depending on the weapons set). This calculator also shows damage optimality and it indicates you still have a bias toward precision. On Ascii’s build, this imbalance in compensated for by siphon procs but your build has none of these — it is very much a damage-centric build. As such, I’d recommend switching the Sigil of Accuracy for Bloodlust. At 25 stacks, it will increase damage by 10%. The added power also brings your ratios between power, precision and crit damage closer together. I worry a bit about the armor on this build being on the light side but it is very well constructed and achieves nice damage while preserving the passive defense combo of Melandrus and Lemongrass. Additionally, if you ran Reaper’s Might, your damage could jump to obscene levels for a tank.

Impressive work.

@Xenth
Your build does excellent damage that becomes outstanding with full Bloodlust. As far as optimality goes, it has a distinct bias toward precision — almost entirely due to (comparatively) low crit damage. If you had something near the 84% Liquid does, your numbers even out more. But, there’s give and take to everything, right?

While your build has more armor and slightly higher HP than Liquid, his has greater survivability thanks to FitG (which is also the source the extra crit damage) and 30% more LF points. But, you still preserve those passive defense items I love so IMO, I’d say that your survivability is still very high.

My only real criticism is that Signet of Locust is a bit of an iffy choice. Everyone in a zerg runs at about the same speed and there’s usually plenty of swiftness to spare.

Lastly, about Furious Demise, I think you’ve made a good choice in staying where you are. If you borrowed the points from, say, Death, you’d up your damage by over 10% while in Fury but otherwise hit about 3% softer outside of it. On balance, you’re ahead. However, if you do this while replacing Locust with SoS, you’d have an overall gain in damage while losing only 50 toughness to get it. This won’t be valid after the Dec 10th patch, though.

In any event, these are both superior builds, gentlemen. I think I’m going to steal a few of these ideas and test them out over the weekend.

Nagato no Kami.4980:

@Liquid
I have a homemade damage calculator and according to it, your build does much better damage than Ascii’s (about 4-6% depending on the weapons set). This calculator also shows damage optimality and it indicates you still have a bias toward precision. On Ascii’s build, this imbalance in compensated for by siphon procs but your build has none of these — it is very much a damage-centric build. As such, I’d recommend switching the Sigil of Accuracy for Bloodlust. At 25 stacks, it will increase damage by 10%. The added power also brings your ratios between power, precision and crit damage closer together. I worry a bit about the armor on this build being on the light side but it is very well constructed and achieves nice damage while preserving the passive defense combo of Melandrus and Lemongrass. Additionally, if you ran Reaper’s Might, your damage could jump to obscene levels for a tank.

Impressive work.

Just for clarity sake, myself and Ascii both have swap Warhorns with Bloodlust sigils on them that we equip to 25 stacks, then swap to the weapon with Accuracy.

Regarding Reaper’s Might, I have it traited sometimes, depending on the situation, but what I linked is kind of my general all around zerg set up. Having that extra source of Retal uptime in addition to Axe #3 can add some decent extra damage in a zerg fight with a lot of damage flying around, and it’s pretty rare for me to sit in DS spamming Life Blasts enough to get more than 2 or 3 might stacks.

When I do trait Reaper’s Might, I usually pair it with Unyielding Blasts and Deathly Perception for maximum impact.

@Liquid
I didn’t know that swap thing worked. Thanks for the tip.

Liquid.9672:

When I do trait Reaper’s Might, I usually pair it with Unyielding Blasts and Deathly Perception for maximum impact.

Indeed, the holy trinity of damage for power necros. When I decide to run it, I usually give into the temptation of slotting Blood is Power for a ten stack head start. When I’m feeling especially silly, I slot SoS as well. No versatility but the Lifeblast damage is fun.

Loving 0/20/0/20/30 atm , with full zerker/cav gear and trinkets. Idea is to shroud dance for stab/fury and use staff/axe with either dagger or horn until wells are called for – drop the bomb then straight into plague

@Jal
You should put it into an editor so we can see it. Sounds interesting.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.0|6.5g.h17.0.0.0|7.1c.h1h.g.1c.hz.0.0.0|1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r|2v.0.2s.0.2v.0.2v.0.2s.0.1c.67|0.k63.0.k68.u28b|15.1|3r.4d.4a.4b.4f|e

Bear in mind I play in an organised WvW guild that runs 20-25 in it’s raids. Timed burst etc is called for . I have’t made any videos myself, but you can see the kind of thing we do here:

POV is another necro in guild running very similar gear and spec – I’n in his group for a lot of the fights (Jalari) and you can see just how often I have fury/stab when needed by shroud dancing, then launching into dps cycles

Jal.5894:

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.0|6.5g.h17.0.0.0|7.1c.h1h.g.1c.hz.0.0.0|1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r|2v.0.2s.0.2v.0.2v.0.2s.0.1c.67|0.k63.0.k68.u28b|15.1|3r.4d.4a.4b.4f|e

Bear in mind I play in an organised WvW guild that runs 20-25 in it’s raids. Timed burst etc is called for . I have’t made any videos myself, but you can see the kind of thing we do here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7stt5EAJyfs

POV is another necro in guild running very similar gear and spec – I’n in his group for a lot of the fights (Jalari) and you can see just how often I have fury/stab when needed by shroud dancing, then launching into dps cycles

This is sort of a damage-oriented well build. I like the way it tries to deal good damage while still trying to retain survivability through the passives like Lemongrass, its own stability and just enough armor to prevent it from being easy rallybait. It’s a bit to backline-ish for my play style (which is probably not as effective as this style, to be honest) but I can see how effective a few of these working together can be… a mass well bomb of boon strip, chill, blind. Wreck a hammer train. Personally, I’d be tempted to run SWall instead of WoS for increased disruption/dwell time on the other wells.

Very nice. Thanks for sharing.

Nagato no Kami.4980:

Jal.5894:

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.0|6.5g.h17.0.0.0|7.1c.h1h.g.1c.hz.0.0.0|1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r|2v.0.2s.0.2v.0.2v.0.2s.0.1c.67|0.k63.0.k68.u28b|15.1|3r.4d.4a.4b.4f|e

Bear in mind I play in an organised WvW guild that runs 20-25 in it’s raids. Timed burst etc is called for . I have’t made any videos myself, but you can see the kind of thing we do here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7stt5EAJyfs

POV is another necro in guild running very similar gear and spec – I’n in his group for a lot of the fights (Jalari) and you can see just how often I have fury/stab when needed by shroud dancing, then launching into dps cycles

This is sort of a damage-oriented well build. I like the way it tries to deal good damage while still trying to retain survivability through the passives like Lemongrass, its own stability and just enough armor to prevent it from being easy rallybait. It’s a bit to backline-ish for my play style (which is probably not as effective as this style, to be honest) but I can see how effective a few of these working together can be… a mass well bomb of boon strip, chill, blind. Wreck a hammer train. Personally, I’d be tempted to run SWall instead of WoS for increased disruption/dwell time on the other wells.

Very nice. Thanks for sharing.

In an ideal setup with 25, we’d have 4-5 Necros using this – the aoe burst is insane. This is where WOS comes into play – with the amount of lockdown we have with our eles and the chill from our Necros we can normally burst down a clump of people with 1 stacked burst cooldown. The main issue with this spec is the lack of stunbreak – but then again with Melandru runes and lemongrass the stuns barely last anyway.

In the video, towards the end you can see me go down when I make a mistake and try to res one of our eles. If I’d played this right, I should have been further south and keeping the aoe pressure on the south of the bridge before pushing for the res. With DS as a ‘get out of jail’ tool, I really only end up using prolongd DS when attempting to burst down multiple downed foes

toying with axe / warhorn
and D/D mostly because I love my skins but scared that staff is simply too good for well necro.

thoughts on this? I know a few of you use D/D but what sort of build favors this?

Maybe you guys can give me some suggestions. I normally main a mesmer and it’s great fun for roaming but I want to do something a little different when running with the random zerg or a guild group as we’re often going up against larger numbers and thought I might put my necro to some other use but crafting lmao.

Anyway, this is what I was thinking of running: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQRBHbhG2IkWmelmnG/eCY6B3jLeUhhpe4e5nD-jUCBYLDimiI0EGBKNqIasFhFRjV1ATraR1aYA+DMa1SBUuyI-w

But after reading this thread I’m wondering if my notion of getting hp back thru crits and siphoning, not having very high armor or power, might be a little off and something more like Lorelei’s might be better. Suggestions?

KOPPER.1458:

toying with axe / warhorn
and D/D mostly because I love my skins but scared that staff is simply too good for well necro.

thoughts on this? I know a few of you use D/D but what sort of build favors this?

I use Axe/Dagger and Dagger/Horn while roaming, but when I am in large battles I use Staff, it is too good with the range and AE.

@Jal
I figured ele stuns would be used in conjunction with the well bomb (and probably mes Null Fields, I’d imagine). Your guild must see a lot of feints as enemies try to draw out your initial boon strip rotations. If the hammer train gets hit by it, the fight’s pretty much over.

@Kopper
Your instincts are right. The staff has too much utility to not carry and without it you can’t help with basic necro duties like wall and siege clearing. But, if you like the dagger, don’t be afraid to run it. Axe 3 is great but IMO the dagger auto attack is better than axe 1 or 2 and synergizes with warhorn nicely.

@Kazhiel
The problem with this build is that it’s got massive healing with no group support skills, massive vitality with no toughness and massive crits without power. In short, it’s all over the place. But, that’s sort of understandable as you main a mesmer. The only thing I could optimize on a mes build is the speed at which it died. And I do.

I am the worst mesmer in NA.

In any event, the first thing you should do is figure out what you want your build to do. Necros are very versatile in the number of viable builds they can run but, generally speaking, there isn’t much versatility within a particular build. Necro builds pretty much do one thing. Zerg tanks don’t solo well, condi roamers don’t zerg well, etc. Once you figure out what you want, then you can begin to make a build.

Jal.5894:

In an ideal setup with 25, we’d have 4-5 Necros using this – the aoe burst is insane. This is where WOS comes into play – with the amount of lockdown we have with our eles and the chill from our Necros we can normally burst down a clump of people with 1 stacked burst cooldown. The main issue with this spec is the lack of stunbreak – but then again with Melandru runes and lemongrass the stuns barely last anyway.

In the video, towards the end you can see me go down when I make a mistake and try to res one of our eles. If I’d played this right, I should have been further south and keeping the aoe pressure on the south of the bridge before pushing for the res. With DS as a ‘get out of jail’ tool, I really only end up using prolongd DS when attempting to burst down multiple downed foes

This is almost the exact trait setup I am running at the moment, having recently swapped Vampiric Precision out for Transfusion – if you’re running midline and in range of your train, it gives off a nice 2.5k-3k top off heal to them with a zero healing power gear setup, which is quite nice.

Only difference is I run Path of Midnight for a quicker turn around on the DS skills, and my axe sigil is fire along with my staff. I’m in the same situation of running in an organised WvW guild with similar numbers with a focused spike style setup, and I couldn’t agree more about how nuts the burst is if executed properly.

I’ll run Spectral Armor if the enemy train is chunky and I’m getting pumped by it though…

Jal.5894:

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/necromancer/?5.0|6.5g.h17.0.0.0|7.1c.h1h.g.1c.hz.0.0.0|1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r|2v.0.2s.0.2v.0.2v.0.2s.0.1c.67|0.k63.0.k68.u28b|15.1|3r.4d.4a.4b.4f|e

Bear in mind I play in an organised WvW guild that runs 20-25 in it’s raids. Timed burst etc is called for . I have’t made any videos myself, but you can see the kind of thing we do here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7stt5EAJyfs

POV is another necro in guild running very similar gear and spec – I’n in his group for a lot of the fights (Jalari) and you can see just how often I have fury/stab when needed by shroud dancing, then launching into dps cycles

I use the same build, but with more celestial gear, but that´s more or less a matter of taste. Imo best choice when running in organized guild squads. I use this also for gvg´s.

Nagato no Kami.4980:

@Kazhiel
The problem with this build is that it’s got massive healing with no group support skills, massive vitality with no toughness and massive crits without power. In short, it’s all over the place. But, that’s sort of understandable as you main a mesmer. The only thing I could optimize on a mes build is the speed at which it died. And I do.

I am the worst mesmer in NA.

In any event, the first thing you should do is figure out what you want your build to do. Necros are very versatile in the number of viable builds they can run but, generally speaking, there isn’t much versatility within a particular build. Necro builds pretty much do one thing. Zerg tanks don’t solo well, condi roamers don’t zerg well, etc. Once you figure out what you want, then you can begin to make a build.

Stay alive and run thru the middle of things dropping wells and being annoying. I ran the build last night but with a few differences, had transfusion and I found I didn’t like the targeted wells and changed that trait to gain life force on crit so as much as I was critting I could be in ds a whoole lot lol. Worked fairly well but I need more testing. I think today I will switch out the axe and focus for a staff. At some point I’m going to get a soldier set and experiment with just being a strait up tank thru armor and vit.

Kazhiel.8194:

Stay alive and run thru the middle of things dropping wells and being annoying. I ran the build last night but with a few differences, had transfusion and I found I didn’t like the targeted wells and changed that trait to gain life force on crit so as much as I was critting I could be in ds a whoole lot lol. Worked fairly well but I need more testing. I think today I will switch out the axe and focus for a staff. At some point I’m going to get a soldier set and experiment with just being a strait up tank thru armor and vit.

Sounds like we have the same play style. XD