Guild Wars 2

I would actually agree with this change if they had also adjusted Astral Force generation rates to compensate. No generation off full health allies makes more sense for the class but it was also a massive nerf that they didn’t balance out.

Seems like such little thought it being put into these changes.

So good druids get punished for actually dodging damage and having good positioning in group play. This change makes full support druids want to go hybrid, (Heal/Tank) or (Dps-condi/Heals), which other classes can do better. Druids will need to actually do some damage or take damage to get Celestial Avatar up and ready for burst healing.

what? why. WTH is going on with anet, with the previous change i started using things other than troll urgent, there were many options and builds to regen AF and now this? this make the whole class almost completely useless, the druid at least.

We all knew there was incoming nerf to AF.

This only effects PvE. Not sure how they can add ways for you to build AF outside combat without making it broken again.

I did almost nothing to PvP side, we still have CAF up when we need it and regens more or less same speed as before, I felt almost no change at all.

Interesting change. We have more sources of Astral Force generation. We have limited opportunities though. Astral Force has higher value, but is situationally easy to gain.

I’m thinking maybe TU is no longer the clear cut winner for AF gen from your heal. Anyone else?

jewishjoyride.4693:

Interesting change. We have more sources of Astral Force generation. We have limited opportunities though. Astral Force has higher value, but is situationally easy to gain.

I’m thinking maybe TU is no longer the clear cut winner for AF gen from your heal. Anyone else?

TU is even more necessary now, as other heals will bring you to full instantly and ticks of regen will no longer provide AF. TU continues to provide more AF by itself and through allowing your other sources of healing to actually give you AF.

Chimp.7946:

So sneaky, I was actually back on my Druid again after been torn between my Herald and Him. I love my ranger, with 1000+hours played. But, …

nevermind, Im to sad to write.

i was actually also enjoying the ranger once again when they changed AF some days ago, i changed to shouts and beastmaster since they could regen AF and there was more options. This is bad, this stuff doesn’t even regenerate at all lol, the only reason i see to use druid with DPS gear is for the 33% speed/movement trait lol. Unless you go full healer rout or something i dont see druid now been useful, i am no expert and could be wrong but i seen videos of elementalist (wooden potatoes actually) healing like crazy in the raid all while doing better damage so what is the point.

Anyway another example, open world PvE. Dragon stand to name one, i stay in the back, i rarely get damaged from ranger so now how will i regen AF if i dont get damage? i could use like AF like 2-3 times now in the 2 hour event, then what is the point of druid, would be better just using old builds with BM.

This is the worse nerf/change to rangers since the shortbow nerf back years ago which broke build, weapons and everything.I do hope this is some kind of sick joke, bug or something.

NemesiS.6749:

Chimp.7946:

So sneaky, I was actually back on my Druid again after been torn between my Herald and Him. I love my ranger, with 1000+hours played. But, …

nevermind, Im to sad to write.

i was actually also enjoying the ranger once again when they changed AF some days ago, i changed to shouts and beastmaster since they could regen AF and there was more options. This is bad, this stuff doesn’t even regenerate at all lol, the only reason i see to use druid with DPS gear is for the 33% speed/movement trait lol. Unless you go full healer rout or something i dont see druid now been useful, i am no expert and could be wrong but i seen videos of elementalist (wooden potatoes actually) healing like crazy in the raid all while doing better damage so what is the point.

Anyway another example, open world PvE. Dragon stand to name one, i stay in the back, i rarely get damaged from ranger so now how will i regen AF if i dont get damage? i could use like AF like 2-3 times now in the 2 hour event, then what is the point of druid, would be better just using old builds with BM.

This is the worse nerf/change to rangers since the shortbow nerf back years ago which broke build, weapons and everything.I do hope this is some kind of sick joke, bug or something.

Actually they conclude this change in a “Bug Fixes” section, which means AF generated from full health allies is a bug before.

allright. i got invited to a raid just now and i got to test this changes.

it felt really really bad. like i was able to keep them alive most of the time because i know what i m doing with my druid but thats it.
we lack dmg. i cant spam my dmg buffs cause i need it for the heal only. I cant change my weapon set to add some dmg because i dont generate AF at all without staff. and staff.. well lets be honest beside the 3rd skill the weapon design just suck. so i m forces to use a bad weapon 100% the time and i m still not effective as other people are.

“i can manage to keep people alive” just isnt enough with a 8minute clock where you need that extra dps aswell. beside that what about the aspect of fun?

raids are one thing. you can generate some af with staff in raids where people some people allways take dmg but what about other aspects of the game. like it might sound strange but i really enjoy my druid outside of raids in solo pve content. its just a bad decision to make druid only some sort of viable in raids and i guess 80% of the more casual players dont even play raids but might enjoy the druid playstyle itself.

i did “okay” but lets be honest. any other support can do better at this point and i m way more usefull open the support slot for like an auramancer or something else.

Lol!

So now they forced rangers to be self destructive and hurt themselves by jumping off of cliffs, walking into poison fields and whatnot, promoting zerker gear yet again so that you take more damage.

Well, I’ve been through all the stages of druid so far, will be interesting to see how things work when I get home from work tonight.

Anet – How do you want your druid today?

well at least they dont want people to craft expensive gear if they might need to salvage it afterwards again because there class suck.

soon we’ll be forced tu slot glyphs to gain af

you mean.. to use glypghs that mostly are useless beside some super super rare situations?

Glyphs are actually pretty cool.

Some tweaking needed for Glyph of Rejuvenation (Heal Glyph) on the heal numbers and maybe Glyph of Unity (Elite Glyph) to make it more efficient, but they’re very much okay. Oh and maybe make glyph of the waves a Blast Finisher.

Also fix seed of life. Both from CA and Traited Glyphs.

well ya thats another problem… they better just rework the entire spec i guess.
The seed of life. the thing that is good on paper but has such a huge delay that 99% of the people are not even where you planted it

Next patch I expect nerfs.

Rumor has it, Tuesday will be bringing around a batch of nerfs for all classes.

2g says only Druid is nerfed and DH is buffed.

ProtoMarcus.7649:

Glyphs are actually pretty cool.

Some tweaking needed for Glyph of Rejuvenation (Heal Glyph) on the heal numbers and maybe Glyph of Unity (Elite Glyph) to make it more efficient, but they’re very much okay. Oh and maybe make glyph of the waves a Blast Finisher.

Also fix seed of life. Both from CA and Traited Glyphs.

………maaaaan glyphs r just awfull (even when traited) when u need a condi cleanse u need it INSTANT not after 1-2sec, im talkin in a pvp situation but look in pve , who would run glyphs ??? core ranger is far way better in damage/buffs/survival if u dont play with a staff

At this point I don’t know why I’m still surprised. Of all classes to tweak they decided to hit the hammer on a class that needs a buff more than anything. GJ Anet. This is a total joke.

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

ProtoMarcus.7649:

Glyphs are actually pretty cool.

Some tweaking needed for Glyph of Rejuvenation (Heal Glyph) on the heal numbers and maybe Glyph of Unity (Elite Glyph) to make it more efficient, but they’re very much okay. Oh and maybe make glyph of the waves a Blast Finisher.

Also fix seed of life. Both from CA and Traited Glyphs.

………maaaaan glyphs r just awfull (even when traited) when u need a condi cleanse u need it INSTANT not after 1-2sec, im talkin in a pvp situation but look in pve , who would run glyphs ??? core ranger is far way better in damage/buffs/survival if u dont play with a staff

Glyphs are not only used to clean your conditions. If you are looking for a condition cleanse on them then they are awful, but instant daze and knockback CCs is useful to break bars or some other situations. Also you can give your allies Grace of the Land when you are not in CA.

Aylpse.6280:

Next patch I expect nerfs.

Rumor has it, Tuesday will be bringing around a batch of nerfs for all classes.

2g says only Druid is nerfed and DH is buffed.

why would i bet against that when there is a 95% chance that it will happen.

you know you reach the point where something is so bad that it becomes ridiculous and all you can do is laugh. well i’m there. every patch i look at the ranger nerfs and laugh wondering how will A-net nerf us next. how much lower can ranger/druid get. We went from good enough, to ok, to its a bad class, to holy kitten we can’t play this, to it’s dead jim, next step 6 feet under?

we have a pool going in my guild as to what aspect of the ranger/druid will get nerfed next. i made myself a good 20G for betting on this one “AF generation nerf”

Nier.6408:

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

ProtoMarcus.7649:

Glyphs are actually pretty cool.

Some tweaking needed for Glyph of Rejuvenation (Heal Glyph) on the heal numbers and maybe Glyph of Unity (Elite Glyph) to make it more efficient, but they’re very much okay. Oh and maybe make glyph of the waves a Blast Finisher.

Also fix seed of life. Both from CA and Traited Glyphs.

………maaaaan glyphs r just awfull (even when traited) when u need a condi cleanse u need it INSTANT not after 1-2sec, im talkin in a pvp situation but look in pve , who would run glyphs ??? core ranger is far way better in damage/buffs/survival if u dont play with a staff

Glyphs are not only used to clean your conditions. If you are looking for a condition cleanse on them then they are awful, but instant daze and knockback CCs is useful to break bars or some other situations. Also you can give your allies Grace of the Land when you are not in CA.

u don’t learn anything to me … specially the fact that glyphs aren’t at the same effectiveness than core ranger’s abilities u can’t deny it , who want to faceroll CC in solo content ? we can all do that that’s borring , in pvp/high content pve these will no longer see utilities compared to how overpowered the old skills feel now

Go S/A – LB Berserker build druid for pve, forget about the staff that is useless right now.

Its like WoW’s Holy Shock Paladin, “F… the healing, I want to do damage!”

mageladin retuuuuuuuuurns

This change is a step back!

I mean in every other games I have played the devs try to make the healer be more useful in term of support when they cannot heal (due to allies being at full health). A cool example would be the medic in TF2 with his over heal.

I mean wow, the Avatar form is not even that strong anyway. Plus you want to be in Avatar form when your team need healing… So after healing your team with Avatar’s abilities you can’t even generate energy.

Is Druid being balanced by two different people? We got some updates that allow Druid to generate more energy ooc and then some updates just strip the way we can generate energy ooc.

A step back? More like we moved forward one step, then backward 100 steps.

So….in less than a month Irenio completely destroyed Smokescale, nerfed staff AA and now he nerfed AF generation. I shudder to think of what will happen in a couple of months.

Looks like he can’t sleep well if his class is good at something, man is too afraid of overpowering his class, so he simply nerfing class to the ground…

…but oh well, I’m still hope that Druid will get much more love than Ranger before, but I’m starting to doubt…people do not change.

This was not a nerf, it was a bug fix.
I know you guys are angry about it, but it makes some sense in a logical way.

You gain AF by healing people. If these people have full health, do you really heal them? You don’t, Easiest proof is that you don’t see any green numbers on your screen. Why should a heal skill used on a player with full health count as heal?

It is like I would go to a random guy and ask him “Do you have cancer?”. If he is answering “No.” I would be able to say “Wow, I just cured cancer, I’m amazing!”

this wasn’t a bug lol , why would they now still allow regain of AF with SotW as exemple if the previous bug was exactly this but with AF regen while full health : non-sense it was clearly intended and then they stated it was too strong (understandable) so they nerfed it as hell as its worse than b4 3days ago.

hey we still have WHaO though right?

Anet are a complete joke. They have done nothing as of recent that has really made the majority of people happy. HoT is a waste of time, masteries are a waste of time, the Druid is a waste of time, PvP is currently a waste of time, dungeons and fractals also both a waste of time. Shame it’s too late to get a refund, or wait… was that planned?

Kodama.6453:

This was not a nerf, it was a bug fix.
I know you guys are angry about it, but it makes some sense in a logical way.

You gain AF by healing people. If these people have full health, do you really heal them? You don’t, Easiest proof is that you don’t see any green numbers on your screen. Why should a heal skill used on a player with full health count as heal?

It is like I would go to a random guy and ask him “Do you have cancer?”. If he is answering “No.” I would be able to say “Wow, I just cured cancer, I’m amazing!”

While it was a bug fix, it was something the Devs could have examined closely and learned from. While it was in play, CA was a lot more readily accessible and worked a lot better with the regenerative traits of a Ranger’s core build. Druids didn’t have to be dependent on the staff for AF generation through sustained Solar Beam and could run GS, S+A/T or anything else. It encouraged diversity.

Now, its arguable that Celestial Avatar was TOO accessible. Thats fair – Druid and CA were meant for burst healing instead of being a sustainable med kit. That could have easily been answered by leaving the mechanics as it were and just adding a lengthier cooldown post-transformation. Even if the Astral Force charged from regen or healing, there would still be some downtime where CA is unusable. You would still have to time its use properly, because if kitten hit the fan afterwards, you/that individual/the party could be in for a bad time.

…but instead, they just implemented this fix and left us high and dry with a difficult to access elite. You absolutely NEED the staff now if you want to have CA ready in a relatively timely manner, and there’s no reasonable way to prep CA before a fight like how one could stack Might or other buffs.

If it weren’t for glyphs still being decent, I’d just drop the Spec altogether tbh.

they should give us back the good AF gain and up the astral form’s cd to 20-30 sec , that would be very good , because here the problem is to get astral form way too fast , and druidic clarity fits a lot with it in pvp > ground nerfing

I am convinced CA form needs to be a stance held until downed. This would require some changes, but this is the best way to go.

AF generation should be spread equally among all things when the Druid trait line is in the build.

Less gimmicks Irenio, and more quality gameplay. Also, read this if you haven’t for more general ideas…

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Healing-design-real-talk-updated/first

Thanks!

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

up the astral form’s cd to 20-30 sec , that would be very good

Lol “good”? I think not. Another thoughtless suggestion.

SoftLight.2175:

anet do you plan on some necro changes like.. “you only gain lifeforce while attacking a target that is full health”? just so i know if i can safely reroll back to my necro without wasting time on theorycrafting setups for our raid and whatsoever… just pls lemme know. like was allway talking nicely about your work lately but this thing right now is the first time i regret buying the addon to be honest…

At least you only theorycrafted.

I made the mistake to apply my theorycrafting and tweak it after every nerf/change. I crafted and switched stats on ascended gold sink 6 times since druid release. I’m done and I should get an achievement for it: “Deep kittened by ANet” – 10 AP.

OGDeadHead.8326:

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

up the astral form’s cd to 20-30 sec , that would be very good

Lol “good”? I think not. Another thoughtless suggestion.

it would be not good to be obvious but far way better than it is right now

Can we just, I don’t know.. Be done with this kind of bullkitten?

You know, whatever. November has given me other games to play. With this “druid flavor of the week” it doesn’t matter wether you’re gone for a week or a month.

Rogue Potato.4723:

hey we still have WHaO though right?

Anet are a complete joke. They have done nothing as of recent that has really made the majority of people happy. HoT is a waste of time, masteries are a waste of time, the Druid is a waste of time, PvP is currently a waste of time, dungeons and fractals also both a waste of time. Shame it’s too late to get a refund, or wait… was that planned?

Games …. a waste of time.

No point complaining I can’t see much changing….

And for their next trick, they’ll make Ancient Seeds worthless.

Earix.5684:

SoftLight.2175:

anet do you plan on some necro changes like.. “you only gain lifeforce while attacking a target that is full health”? just so i know if i can safely reroll back to my necro without wasting time on theorycrafting setups for our raid and whatsoever… just pls lemme know. like was allway talking nicely about your work lately but this thing right now is the first time i regret buying the addon to be honest…

At least you only theorycrafted.

I made the mistake to apply my theorycrafting and tweak it after every nerf/change. I crafted and switched stats on ascended gold sink 6 times since druid release. I’m done and I should get an achievement for it: “Deep kittened by ANet” – 10 AP.

“Deep kittened by ANet” -10 AP. Fixed that for you, they kittened you after all, why shouldn’t they take 10 AP away from your with this Achievement :-P

hahaha this is a joke. We get a buff and everyone happy just so we could get a huge nerf 2 days after the buff. AN really likes to mess with the rangers feelings. Just as I thought WHaO is any good (because of the regan) and SOTW is even better now they are just garbge. Especially because you gain AF based on healing ticks so getting you to full health with WHAO is just useless. I wonder how hard it would be to gain AF if we didnt have TU.
Lets just call CA the legendary form and call it a day.

I guess thats because nobody in Abjured plays Ranger.

ANET, Please get feedback from top Ranger players before making any changes. Changes like this really feels bad.

It is sooooooo sad to see DH are better rangers than “Ranger” itself.

Really done what you guys are up to !!!!

Substance E.4852:

deception.7239:

When the raid patch hit, astral force was way too easy to generate and you could use it everytime you want only limited by the cooldown.

So?

It was finally fun to use again.
It did not need a nerf by the very virtue that is wasn’t breaking any game mode.

yeah the most OP thing we could do was play stronghold lol

This change is bad.

By brining healing power you charge less af because its based off ticks of healing not the actual amount healed. Additionally because you heal more with having healing power you hit the full health gate quicker, and more often. Thus you are gated from your own mechanic by building to support it. The less healing power you have, the more you will be able to enter CA and heal( and more than likely heal more because the majority of the healing is base).

This change is backwards. It works against people building for support.

The only way to fix this is to revert the change or make AF generations directly scaled off of healing power and/or the amount healed.

Shadelang.3012:

On this change. I remembe reading before that druid was meant to be a burst healer NOT a sustain healer. Ventari revenants and things like aura tempests are the sustained healers.

If that is there plan. Then we should be making suggestions on how to make that a reality.

How do we make druid a burst healing class while still having ventari revenants and aura tempests be MORE effective as sustain healer. And no buffing those two through the roof isn’t the awnser.

Well for starters anet could stop making changes like this that punish having healing power. Someone who builds healing power, who heals more, is gated more from the very mechanic that is supposed to allow us to be a burst healer.

The issue here isnt the fact that druid is a burst healer. The issue is that it is gated from its own identity/mechanic patch after patch. We have seen this with out of combat degen, we have seen this with just out right nerfing the generation, we have seen this with buffing our base heals out of CA. Now with gates on generation of full hp targets. Every single patch is 1 step forward and 3 steps back.

How do we promote druid to be more of a burst healer?
Simple reduce the length of CA and increase the scaling on heals in CA. This makes us more valuable by allowing us to be in CA more often, and put out larger heals.

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

up the astral form’s cd to 20-30 sec

To any one that suggests this, or a stance, etc making this longer promotes bad play. CA is supposed to be burst healing. 20-30+ secs is sustained healing not burst. Our CA skills have a worthwhile rotation of 8 seconds and you should never need to be in CA longer than 10 seconds. Out side of heals, you contribute nothing the majority of time your in CA. The point I am trying to make here is its intended that you don’t sit in here. Increasing the duration only promotes bad play.

If you want to camp a healing mode, you have the wrong class; you should be either a water ele or a ventari reverant. Those two are structured to be sustained healers.

Eval.2371:

The less healing power you have, the more you will be able to enter CA and heal( and more than likely heal more because the majoirty of the healing is base).

This change is backwards. It works against people building for support.

+1

Pretty much, and only goes to show the class of development/design.

Devs, take a break. It seems you’re exhausted. Get some fresh blood to pick up where you left things, as they just might see things from another perspective and come with a bunch of new, fresh ideas. Really, you ought to.

They WHaO’d us once again

I will give them another week or so to fix this, or at the very least iron out the creases. If they do not, i will be contacting anet about a refund/change on my set of ascendeed minstrel armor and weapons.

i dont tuink they intended to punsish full support specs in this way. zerker af generation should not be better than minstrel.

maybe they can link af generation to healing power ss a simple solution. The more healing power you have the faster it generates.

Zatoichi.1049:

I will give them another week or so to fix this, or at the very least iron out the creases. If they do not, i will be contacting anet about a refund/change on my set of ascendeed minstrel armor and weapons.

I might also end up contacting them for a refund/change on my ascended minstrel and zealot WvW sets.

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

they should give us back the good AF gain and up the astral form’s cd to 20-30 sec , that would be very good , because here the problem is to get astral form way too fast , and druidic clarity fits a lot with it in pvp > ground nerfing

The CD on CAF should absolutely not be 20-30 seconds, given that entering CAF already sacrifices a Druid’s DPS for healing (it does not serve as a bonus on top of regular gameplay—it signifies a priority change). There is no amount of healing that can make up for 20-30 seconds without access, because players have a limited health pool. This high of a CD will make other healing-centric builds (aura-share Tempest, Ventari Revenant) FAR superior to Druid with regard to healing, since they are not locked out of their healing at any point, and can heal when their allies need it—not when some arbitrary period of time has passed.

For trait purposes, Berzerk Mode has a 15 second cooldown, an Adept-tier trait that is a stunbreak + (single) condition clear, with a competing trait that gives Berzerk Mode a 10s CD (and no stunbreak/condition clear). There is no reason why CAF can’t match this, especially since CAF already is not a straight-up upgrade to use off-CD like Berzerk Mode, but a strategic resource.

Scrimschaw.5784:

Roy Dreadstorm.2093:

they should give us back the good AF gain and up the astral form’s cd to 20-30 sec , that would be very good , because here the problem is to get astral form way too fast , and druidic clarity fits a lot with it in pvp > ground nerfing

The CD on CAF should absolutely not be 20-30 seconds, given that entering CAF already sacrifices a Druid’s DPS for healing (it does not serve as a bonus on top of regular gameplay—it signifies a priority change). There is no amount of healing that can make up for 20-30 seconds without access, because players have a limited health pool. This high of a CD will make other healing-centric builds (aura-share Tempest, Ventari Revenant) FAR superior to Druid with regard to healing, since they are not locked out of their healing at any point, and can heal when their allies need it—not when some arbitrary period of time has passed.

For trait purposes, Berzerk Mode has a 15 second cooldown, an Adept-tier trait that is a stunbreak + (single) condition clear, with a competing trait that gives Berzerk Mode a 10s CD (and no stunbreak/condition clear). There is no reason why CAF can’t match this, especially since CAF already is not a straight-up upgrade to use off-CD like Berzerk Mode, but a strategic resource.

As i mentioned in the other thread, full condi clear versus 1 condi clear are on two totally different levels of power, not to mention zerker and druid are such different roles i dont believe a comparison of traits between both of them is totally appropriate.

Considering how anet thinks, If we want CA on such a low Global CD, 10 seconds lets say as some have suggested, how can we not expect a nerf to druidic clarity? Down to as low as 2 or 3 condi clears, instead of a full clear. if were making apples to appes comparisons, why should we expect any better of a trait?