Poor Rangers :(
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Ummm no.
From the start of the game, Anet’s vision was to replace the MMO Holy Trinity (hard trinity – tank, dps, healer) with their own “Soft Trinity” DPS, Support, Tank. With Support includes both offensive (crowd control, snare, debilitating conditions, etc.) and defensive (heal, block, reflect, etc.)
actually that is wrong: yeah they wanted to replace “holy trinity of mmo” with their own “trinity” but it was “damage-control-support” – where there was no tank as a role because everyone were supposed to “swap aggro” between themselves instead of single player tanking boss for the whole time….
where damage was damaging oponents control was all the kind of CC and support where boons, condi removals, etc.
and apart of that I love one thing in this thread:
how people totally ignore how much positioning druid requires to actually heal anything – apart from celestial avatar form which actually have ground targeted heal which is only skill that could be “spammable” like that which requires at first to build up astral energy – sun beam? dude needs to be on the line of ray between you and mob you atack – whisp? heals only when it pass through allies while orbiting a foe
staff 3rd? its on quite a cd and I’d not call it ability able of “spam your heals”
staff 4th? not even a heal
staff 5th? – timing and positioning from both you and your teammates.
so no. druid is neither healbot nor “spamming all your heals”
as for op – I’d really happily say you what I think abotu you and your post right now but by doing so I’d probable violate some forum rules so I won’t say it out loud….
“-Shield is meant to be broken!”
“-and on this occasion I keep mine plate armors”
discussion about offensive/deffensive playstyles
“-and on this occasion I keep mine plate armors”
discussion about offensive/deffensive playstyles
Oh, I’m not disagreeing… Again, what I am saying is that the only way a druid will be brought is that if it is required to have that much healing. Zerks bring just enough CC and support to get the job done (I think I said this already in the bolded parts above)… or they have fantastic DPS. Eles and guards can already bring fantastic healing… so… Yeah. Moot point.
right so you are compairing a STAT SET to a Druid skill set , thats not how it works , the class may bring lots of heal skills those skills also Damage so it won’t be a " required" thing it will be a Optional thing its up the group not if its Required! you are getting close to Zerker Elitism saying its only going to be taken because its Healing is Required get over yourself.
Again, you don’t understand. It’s more than a stat set. Saying “zerker” is merely branding to a build that does, yes, use zerker stats… but sure, go ahead and believe whatever you want and remain ignorant and keep that straw-man to yourself.
By the way, those damages on those heal skills are utter garbage.
I don’t really care if you call me Zerker Elitist or whatever to make yourself feel better. Fact remains the goal of encounters is to kill things, just like it will be in raids. There are people like yourself who won’t mind spending many many hours in the same instance and then there will be people like me who want to get it done and over.
Speaking from a PVE-only point of view…
(edited by TheFantasticGman.9451)
Oh, I’m not disagreeing… Again, what I am saying is that the only way a druid will be brought is that if it is required to have that much healing. Zerks bring just enough CC and support to get the job done (I think I said this already in the bolded parts above)… or they have fantastic DPS. Eles and guards can already bring fantastic healing… so… Yeah. Moot point.
right so you are compairing a STAT SET to a Druid skill set , thats not how it works , the class may bring lots of heal skills those skills also Damage so it won’t be a " required" thing it will be a Optional thing its up the group not if its Required! you are getting close to Zerker Elitism saying its only going to be taken because its Healing is Required get over yourself.
Again, you don’t understand. It’s more than a stat set. Saying “zerker” is merely branding to a build that does, yes, use zerker stats… but sure, go ahead and believe whatever you want and remain ignorant and keep that straw-man to yourself.
By the way, those damages on those heal skills are utter garbage.
I don’t really care if you call me Zerker Elitist or whatever to make yourself feel better. Fact remains the goal of encounters is to kill things, just like it will be in raids. There are people like yourself who won’t mind spending many many hours in the same instance and then there will be people like me who want to get it done and over.
Where is the proof that meta builds save hours? As long as people find a balance of playstyle fun and effective then it should not be a big deal, this is an still an mmo/rpg therefor should be able to have the choice in freedom of your character instead if only choosing between 2 builds that someone else made and specific groups in the community approve of, isnt that partly what guild wars 2 is about anyways?
Oh, I’m not disagreeing… Again, what I am saying is that the only way a druid will be brought is that if it is required to have that much healing. Zerks bring just enough CC and support to get the job done (I think I said this already in the bolded parts above)… or they have fantastic DPS. Eles and guards can already bring fantastic healing… so… Yeah. Moot point.
right so you are compairing a STAT SET to a Druid skill set , thats not how it works , the class may bring lots of heal skills those skills also Damage so it won’t be a " required" thing it will be a Optional thing its up the group not if its Required! you are getting close to Zerker Elitism saying its only going to be taken because its Healing is Required get over yourself.
Again, you don’t understand. It’s more than a stat set. Saying “zerker” is merely branding to a build that does, yes, use zerker stats… but sure, go ahead and believe whatever you want and remain ignorant and keep that straw-man to yourself.
By the way, those damages on those heal skills are utter garbage.
I don’t really care if you call me Zerker Elitist or whatever to make yourself feel better. Fact remains the goal of encounters is to kill things, just like it will be in raids. There are people like yourself who won’t mind spending many many hours in the same instance and then there will be people like me who want to get it done and over.
Where is the proof that meta builds save hours? As long as people find a balance of playstyle fun and effective then it should not be a big deal, this is an still an mmo/rpg therefor should be able to have the choice in freedom of your character instead if only choosing between 2 builds that someone else made and specific groups in the community approve of, isnt that partly what guild wars 2 is about anyways?
ironicly the fact is a speed running group of full zerkers (in old content) gets runs cleared in 5-10mins , vs other groups which take 10-20mins Not much difference at all! if you have time to sit and play a hour or two of gw2 a extra 10mins means nothing , its a game and should be fun the zerker meta makes thing feel like a flipping job grinding out money / gold every day doing these dungeons over inflating the TP ect its not Healthy for the game End point! every other MMO Failed due to over farming or TP prices going too high or having too much gold in the system , its not a matter of time / gold income or its a zerker or a druid at that , its the point that this guy thinks zerker meta will be the meta still when only 3-4/10 people will be running that Stat combo.
times change so should this guys point of view , killing things fast is not a Requirement and that is the problem with zerker meta too , it effects everything in game.
and I’m tired of the PvP crowd thinking that GW2 PvP isn’t any less casual then PvE but meh what you going to do
The only difficult thing about level 50 fractals is to keep yourself calm when the reward rng screws you over the 5th day in a row. But meh, what you gonna do.
ironicly the fact is a speed running group of full zerkers (in old content) gets runs cleared in 5-10mins , vs other groups which take 10-20mins Not much difference at all! if you have time to sit and play a hour or two of gw2 a extra 10mins means nothing , its a game and should be fun the zerker meta makes thing feel like a flipping job grinding out money / gold every day doing these dungeons over inflating the TP ect its not Healthy for the game End point! every other MMO Failed due to over farming or TP prices going too high or having too much gold in the system , its not a matter of time / gold income or its a zerker or a druid at that , its the point that this guy thinks zerker meta will be the meta still when only 3-4/10 people will be running that Stat combo.
times change so should this guys point of view , killing things fast is not a Requirement and that is the problem with zerker meta too , it effects everything in game.
I’ve seen the type before. These sorts of people are so used and attached to what they know (the meta) that they completely reject even the idea that it might change and will cry in outrage the loudest if/when it does.
Oh, I’m not disagreeing… Again, what I am saying is that the only way a druid will be brought is that if it is required to have that much healing. Zerks bring just enough CC and support to get the job done (I think I said this already in the bolded parts above)… or they have fantastic DPS. Eles and guards can already bring fantastic healing… so… Yeah. Moot point.
right so you are compairing a STAT SET to a Druid skill set , thats not how it works , the class may bring lots of heal skills those skills also Damage so it won’t be a " required" thing it will be a Optional thing its up the group not if its Required! you are getting close to Zerker Elitism saying its only going to be taken because its Healing is Required get over yourself.
Again, you don’t understand. It’s more than a stat set. Saying “zerker” is merely branding to a build that does, yes, use zerker stats… but sure, go ahead and believe whatever you want and remain ignorant and keep that straw-man to yourself.
By the way, those damages on those heal skills are utter garbage.
I don’t really care if you call me Zerker Elitist or whatever to make yourself feel better. Fact remains the goal of encounters is to kill things, just like it will be in raids. There are people like yourself who won’t mind spending many many hours in the same instance and then there will be people like me who want to get it done and over.
Where is the proof that meta builds save hours? As long as people find a balance of playstyle fun and effective then it should not be a big deal, this is an still an mmo/rpg therefor should be able to have the choice in freedom of your character instead if only choosing between 2 builds that someone else made and specific groups in the community approve of, isnt that partly what guild wars 2 is about anyways?
ironicly the fact is a speed running group of full zerkers (in old content) gets runs cleared in 5-10mins , vs other groups which take 10-20mins Not much difference at all! if you have time to sit and play a hour or two of gw2 a extra 10mins means nothing , its a game and should be fun the zerker meta makes thing feel like a flipping job grinding out money / gold every day doing these dungeons over inflating the TP ect its not Healthy for the game End point! every other MMO Failed due to over farming or TP prices going too high or having too much gold in the system , its not a matter of time / gold income or its a zerker or a druid at that , its the point that this guy thinks zerker meta will be the meta still when only 3-4/10 people will be running that Stat combo.
times change so should this guys point of view , killing things fast is not a Requirement and that is the problem with zerker meta too , it effects everything in game.
I completely agree and its the same for any mmo really, but I dont usually see people exaggerate to that extent by saying hours for example that does not even remotely make sense.
I don’t think zerker is going away for new content either. If it does, Sinister will replace it. Why? After the 1000th time you’ve done the first raid, do you really want it to take longer than it has to? No. That’s why those of us who’ve done thousands of fractals run zerker. We’ve learned the content. We know how to survive with the least amount of healing. Same thing will happen to raids. The only way for this to happen is for content to be constantly changing and significantly. We will, as a whole, take the least amount of defensive support needed to complete content. That’s why we even have a zerker meta in the first place.
get out of that mind set because the current content is easy to learn , easy to dodge, easy to use Damage metigation procs , protection blinds ect , the HoT content will bring mobs that ignore blinds , ignore direct damage, some will even ignore Condi damage or have mechanics that swap between the two , yes for some zerker is a decent stat set but it won’t be the End off all being the best in the content comming up , you can learn all the content you like but the fact is Unavoidable damage is comming no matter how much active defence you have there is a limit to how much you have which is why Support is being buffed , increased .
Dungeons were believed to be incredibly difficult at release, too.
Zenos, I’m not going to go round-and-round with you. Time in an instance is important to some, and some it’s not. It’s simple. I said that already. 10 minutes doesn’t matter to you but it does to me. I’m sorry you can’t wrap your mind around that concept that people value things differently. Some of us can and will run the high dps builds in HoT, some can’t and won’t. It is what it is. Birds of a feather will flock together and cut asunder those whom are different. That’s the way it has been and always will be as it is human nature. I will run raids with those of similar time value who don’t want to spend all day in an instance if they don’t have to. Hyper is right. Dungeons were thought to be incredibly difficult when first introduced, and now look. Those who don’t learn the content will fail regardless of gear or builds. Those who learn the content will move on to high dps builds because they can. Raids will be no different than dungeons, mark my words.
Speaking from a PVE-only point of view…
Zenos, I’m not going to go round-and-round with you. Time in an instance is important to some, and some it’s not. It’s simple. I said that already. 10 minutes doesn’t matter to you but it does to me. I’m sorry you can’t wrap your mind around that concept that people value things differently. Some of us can and will run the high dps builds in HoT, some can’t and won’t. It is what it is. Birds of a feather will flock together and cut asunder those whom are different. That’s the way it has been and always will be as it is human nature. I will run raids with those of similar time value who don’t want to spend all day in an instance if they don’t have to. Hyper is right. Dungeons were thought to be incredibly difficult when first introduced, and now look. Those who don’t learn the content will fail regardless of gear or builds. Those who learn the content will move on to high dps builds because they can. Raids will be no different than dungeons, mark my words.
good luck with that bosses won;’t stand in one place long enough.
It’s not even about the time. Zerker meta also gives something to the players: high damage, high numbers.
That is a kind of rewards in itself because the game in general rewards damage. You never get rewards for critically heal yourself for 10K.
So when you play and you see you chain a 20K attack on a boss is somehow a kind of reward. That’s why players always tend to be damage oriented with the least of vitality/armor your skill allows you to play with.
There is a clear example of this: Tome of Courage (the Avatar is Tome of Courage 2.0) was depreciated and scrapped because it had no use. It did not work then and i foresee it will not work now.
Avatar will be a popin – Drop skill#5 – popout.
Maybe some #1 to heal all around.
Raids are supposed to be difficult. That means the raid will need healer but also DPS. And Rev and Ele are better balanced than Druid for that task . Even guard can be also and strong healer with a decent DPS output.
The complains are not about the healing theme, they are because it is only a healing theme.
Zenos, I’m not going to go round-and-round with you. Time in an instance is important to some, and some it’s not. It’s simple. I said that already. 10 minutes doesn’t matter to you but it does to me. I’m sorry you can’t wrap your mind around that concept that people value things differently. Some of us can and will run the high dps builds in HoT, some can’t and won’t. It is what it is. Birds of a feather will flock together and cut asunder those whom are different. That’s the way it has been and always will be as it is human nature. I will run raids with those of similar time value who don’t want to spend all day in an instance if they don’t have to. Hyper is right. Dungeons were thought to be incredibly difficult when first introduced, and now look. Those who don’t learn the content will fail regardless of gear or builds. Those who learn the content will move on to high dps builds because they can. Raids will be no different than dungeons, mark my words.
good luck with that bosses won;’t stand in one place long enough.
Bosses have patterns them moving has nothing to do with it.
Zenos, I’m not going to go round-and-round with you. Time in an instance is important to some, and some it’s not. It’s simple. I said that already. 10 minutes doesn’t matter to you but it does to me. I’m sorry you can’t wrap your mind around that concept that people value things differently. Some of us can and will run the high dps builds in HoT, some can’t and won’t. It is what it is. Birds of a feather will flock together and cut asunder those whom are different. That’s the way it has been and always will be as it is human nature.
Hey, speak for yourself – we’re not all like that.
I simply don’t do group PVE in this game, because of the elitism and because I find the encounters poorly designed and the game, in general, prejudiced against ranged.
Some people, however, are supportive, kind, helpful and free-spirited enough to run with whatever they get, in a random situation.
But, you are correct, SOME people are how you describe, especially in these type of games, for some reason.
I don’t know if it’s the demographic, or just the typical mindset of a certain type of MMO player, or what, but yeah…
So they will find the meta, sooner or later and if they are given free rein to pick and choose, as they are now, they will exclude those who don’t follow it (just as they do now).
Sad, but true.
This is why I think we also need a random group option, for both dungeons and raids, for those of us who just prefer to run with what we get, even if it takes a little longer, or (shock, horror!) even fails, sometimes.
…oh and one more thing:
It’s all very well you only running with people who have already learned the content and run the meta, but the truth is that games like this have a natural turnover.
So, if everyone refuses to run with the newer and/or more individualistic players, they will end up just leaving and that is precisely the way that games like this, eventually, die.
“Turns out when people play the game, they don’t admire your feet at all.” sephiroth
(edited by Tigaseye.2047)
Zenos, I’m not going to go round-and-round with you. Time in an instance is important to some, and some it’s not. It’s simple. I said that already. 10 minutes doesn’t matter to you but it does to me. I’m sorry you can’t wrap your mind around that concept that people value things differently. Some of us can and will run the high dps builds in HoT, some can’t and won’t. It is what it is. Birds of a feather will flock together and cut asunder those whom are different. That’s the way it has been and always will be as it is human nature. I will run raids with those of similar time value who don’t want to spend all day in an instance if they don’t have to. Hyper is right. Dungeons were thought to be incredibly difficult when first introduced, and now look. Those who don’t learn the content will fail regardless of gear or builds. Those who learn the content will move on to high dps builds because they can. Raids will be no different than dungeons, mark my words.
good luck with that bosses won;’t stand in one place long enough.
Bosses have patterns them moving has nothing to do with it.
moving has everything to do with the New bosses, you’ll need Decent Hp sustain between phases , even if people remember the patterns, a full beserker team increases the chances of Failing by a lot if grouped with players that have not spend hours learning the Raid or the content most of the players will only be there to see the content not grind out for legendary armour , i guarantee to myself its not as simple as Dps phase>glider out that would be tooooo easy.
you have break bars to contend with which means taking slower Dps weapons like hammer ect more time > more damage taken > more sustain hp required = more focus on Balanced builds to challenge the content.
the old methods won’t work dps>burn them down like we do atm with Teq won’t be in raids but it will be a core Feature of Jungle world bosses because its open PvE they can’t make that too hard but Raids no limits to its Difficulty.
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