Guild Wars 2

Hi,

I really like the thought of a zerg healer in WvW, but I’m having a hard time figuring out – exactly – how a Ventari healer compares to say the Druid?

Does the clunkyness of the tablet make healing a zerg near impossible?

TL:DR
Which class if the best zerg healer?

Druid is at the moment as it provides some very nice burst heals, ventari sadly cannot compare to it at this time

Druid wins by far, the heals he can provide in a short amount of time is just insane with out any trouble.

Druid had amazing heals that Ventari can’t compare. However, Ventari does have a moveable projectile block which is amazingly good in its own way, but it’s situational.

The projectile block is really useful (IMO this is one of the few places where it’s worth using at the current energy cost) but in the HPS departmemt we are a bit low.

Projectile block can be used to protect against ranged pressure and almost all sieges.

I say Revenant is last place of the three healers.

Druid > Tempest > Ventari

Ventari is great, when traited, to give massive AoE blinds and long duration reflect. I also enjoy using the elite to knockback and daze while providing healing drops. It’s very…Niche for group use, but I wouldn’t say it’s a bad legend at all.

theyre both great. Druid is uh-maze-in as a healer, while ventari imo has an awful traitline and its meh at healing, but the projectile destruction is godlike in the situations its useful

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

The issue is hte outgoing healing one doesn’t do enough either because of the range (low to high not skill range) of ventari’s base heals. Ventari CAN’T perform the kind of emergency heals a druid can with lunar impact. The bad part is in most runs your going to need that. My suggestion was more to repurpose that trait to provide the kind of emergency healing ventari is lacking.

Sustained healing is all well and good. But bosses are desgined with highs and lows. SOMEONE is going to get spiked.

Edit: Ventari does more than enough healing to sustain a group when its going well. And Ventari Jalis is good for keeping the damage the raid takes down. But it lacks the oh kitten heals for when things go wrong. Which in a well designed boss fight SHOULD happen. Or atleast the threat of something going wrong should always be there.

Edit 2I don’t want to just take up another post spot) What I meant by the above is that as long as the group only requires sustained healing then ventari is fine. Though in that case there are better heal options available. And your losing out on ALOT of damage youd be getting if that revenant went dps. So what your getting by taking a ventari healer in its current form may not be worth what your giving up when you could just take a druid that can also boost the raids dps.

I agree with you that we lack a proper burst heal though NH should provide that.
My opinion is that part of the rebalancing should include removal of cast time for sumoning and moving and removing the delay in movement.
All radius should be increased by 40 (except PS) and
NH should have the baseheal reduced by 20% increase scaling to 1 (from .6)
Remove the delay and put a 1 sec cast this way our CC weakness would be preserved.

In other news druids astral force generation just got gutted making the gap between ventari and druid that much smaller….yay?

Shadelang.3012:

In other news druids astral force generation just got gutted making the gap between ventari and druid that much smaller….yay?

i think you mean got buffed… AF generates from all sources of regen now, including even regen food.

scerevisiae.1972:

Shadelang.3012:

In other news druids astral force generation just got gutted making the gap between ventari and druid that much smaller….yay?

i think you mean got buffed… AF generates from all sources of regen now, including even regen food.

Given that rangers get easely perma regen…

Knighthonor.4061:

I say Revenant is last place of the three healers.

Druid > Tempest > Ventari

Tempest is well below Druid and Ventari. Ventari is a pretty good sustain healer actually. Mantra-spamming mesmer is a pretty decent sustain healer as well.

Actually Astral force can no longer be generated on full targets. It hurts there generation alot more than people think.

Shadelang.3012:

Actually Astral force can no longer be generated on full targets. It hurts there generation alot more than people think.

still a net improvement compared to release.

scerevisiae.1972:

Shadelang.3012:

Actually Astral force can no longer be generated on full targets. It hurts there generation alot more than people think.

still a net improvement compared to release.

Not really. Before you knew you would have it ready when kitten hit hte fan. Even if it was akward. Now however the only way to generate astral force is to actually play badly. I.E. your rewarded? for taking damage. Which means if you start a fight after using your astral force in a previous fight you now have to thread the needle on taking damage and healing it.

It also punsihes the use of your heal skill. As using your heal skill is much less efficient at generating astral force than allowing regeneration to passively tick. Healing yourself to full will actually hurt you in the long run as you wont have astral force when you need it.

All in all. Druids will now have low sustained healing. But high burst healing. Which is okay balance wise. Cause that leaves tempests and ventari revenants in the sustained healing roll.

However this is a pretty negative shift in gameplay quality for druids as they require other people to take damage and NOT heal themselves in order for druids to use there class mechanic.

So relatively speaking. Its polarized druids into the burst heal roll but made it akward for them at the same time. As they require people to take damage without a sustain healer being present.

It means that ventari revenant or a aura tempest and a druid are now mutually exclusive.

Eh, the two problems with Ventari Revenant vs. Druid is that the second one heals AND bring unique damage modifiers for the whole group, which isn’t the case of Ventari Revenant.

As for the second reason, I would really, really, really, really love if new Minstrel’s gear did not have that stupid Toughness stat and had Power or even Condition damage instead. Herald is potentially the best candidate for this set as we benefit greatly from boon duration and we could be way more useful, but…

Minstrel’s gear has no offensive stat. Which means it’s useless in raids. kittening useless. And that Toughness makes us overaggro the boss.

So we wear Zealot’s gear. And in Zealot’s gear, Druid is more useful.

Rym.1469:

Eh, the two problems with Ventari Revenant vs. Druid is that the second one heals AND bring unique damage modifiers for the whole group, which isn’t the case of Ventari Revenant.

As for the second reason, I would really, really, really, really love if new Minstrel’s gear did not have that stupid Toughness stat and had Power or even Condition damage instead. Herald is potentially the best candidate for this set as we benefit greatly from boon duration and we could be way more useful, but…

Minstrel’s gear has no offensive stat. Which means it’s useless in raids. kittening useless. And that Toughness makes us overaggro the boss.

So we wear Zealot’s gear. And in Zealot’s gear, Druid is more useful.

I reccomend trying Commanders Stat gear if your going purely for the buffing aspect. My ranger runs a self might build using it and I can promise the investment is worth it for boon duration. It won’t be a healing build obviously. But it will be a very good offensive support build.

Shadelang.3012:

Rym.1469:

Eh, the two problems with Ventari Revenant vs. Druid is that the second one heals AND bring unique damage modifiers for the whole group, which isn’t the case of Ventari Revenant.

As for the second reason, I would really, really, really, really love if new Minstrel’s gear did not have that stupid Toughness stat and had Power or even Condition damage instead. Herald is potentially the best candidate for this set as we benefit greatly from boon duration and we could be way more useful, but…

Minstrel’s gear has no offensive stat. Which means it’s useless in raids. kittening useless. And that Toughness makes us overaggro the boss.

So we wear Zealot’s gear. And in Zealot’s gear, Druid is more useful.

I reccomend trying Commanders Stat gear if your going purely for the buffing aspect. My ranger runs a self might build using it and I can promise the investment is worth it for boon duration. It won’t be a healing build obviously. But it will be a very good offensive support build.

I know about Commander’s stat and might try it someday, but that change to Minstrel’s or addition of new stat would make healing Revenant a very good pick, mostly for that Protection and beefed Regeneration uptime Druid can’t compete with.

I healed Vale Guardian as Ventari Rev both in BWE3 and now in live. Conclusion is the same. Ventari Rev has excellent sustained healing, and can constantly pump out enough to keep everyone alive — until something goes wrong. Rev has no burst healing and cannot correct for a mistake. If you fall behind, you’ve got a struggle ahead of you. Druid has burst healing in spades, allowing a raid to recover from a spike, plus enough regular healing that it renders Ventari Rev second-rate. If there is ever a call for two healing-oriented characters in a fight, Rev could play second fiddle, but that’s not likely to happen.

Ventari Rev has sustained healing but no recovery. Druid has both. I shelved the Rev and play a different role.

Ocosh.5843:

I healed Vale Guardian as Ventari Rev both in BWE3 and now in live. Conclusion is the same. Ventari Rev has excellent sustained healing, and can constantly pump out enough to keep everyone alive — until something goes wrong. Rev has no burst healing and cannot correct for a mistake. If you fall behind, you’ve got a struggle ahead of you. Druid has burst healing in spades, allowing a raid to recover from a spike, plus enough regular healing that it renders Ventari Rev second-rate. If there is ever a call for two healing-oriented characters in a fight, Rev could play second fiddle, but that’s not likely to happen.

Ventari Rev has sustained healing but no recovery. Druid has both. I shelved the Rev and play a different role.

I currently have a thread in the ranger forums working to have druid further commited to its burst here role so it stops pushing aside sustained healers. The idea should be that they work together. Not be mutally exclusive.

As a quick note for the OP, your meantion of of HPS in your title makes me think a suggestion might be in order.

Most of the time, when raid healing, the important thing isn’t the raw math; it’s what you can do in a clutch situation when your people are in a bad spot. Heal per second is only going to be ideal when topping off HP or handling a steady outpouring of damage (like a perma poison). In this game, a lot of the healing your characters need can already be done on your own, since everyone has access to a potent heal in their own right. That places the “healer” role in GW2 very firmly in a spike heal sort of situation most of the time, at least in the way Druid was designed. The rest of the time, they can or should be doing something based on team enhancement, DPS, or preferably both.

There isn’t anything outright wrong with sustain healing. It takes some of the urgency out of the work of a burst type healer, after all, and on a guardian you can run sustain healing by equipping the elite signet and just existing near your team or hitting things near a Necro who has the right blood magic traits. I just don’t think everyone needs to run a pure healing build, or else the DPS of a party will plummet from an outpouring of cleric’s gear and damage checks will begin to fail.

Ventari is useful, but its primary usefulness right now comes from its reflect ability. Oddly, it’s heals seem to benefit most in the open world and/or solo. This comes from a player who has climbed to 80 and primarily used Ventari because it’s still really fun.

Shadelang.3012:

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

The issue is hte outgoing healing one doesn’t do enough either because of the range (low to high not skill range) of ventari’s base heals. Ventari CAN’T perform the kind of emergency heals a druid can with lunar impact. The bad part is in most runs your going to need that. My suggestion was more to repurpose that trait to provide the kind of emergency healing ventari is lacking.

Sustained healing is all well and good. But bosses are desgined with highs and lows. SOMEONE is going to get spiked.

Edit: Ventari does more than enough healing to sustain a group when its going well. And Ventari Jalis is good for keeping the damage the raid takes down. But it lacks the oh kitten heals for when things go wrong. Which in a well designed boss fight SHOULD happen. Or atleast the threat of something going wrong should always be there.

Edit 2I don’t want to just take up another post spot) What I meant by the above is that as long as the group only requires sustained healing then ventari is fine. Though in that case there are better heal options available. And your losing out on ALOT of damage youd be getting if that revenant went dps. So what your getting by taking a ventari healer in its current form may not be worth what your giving up when you could just take a druid that can also boost the raids dps.

If i compare the strongest heals of my Ventari to Druid, both in same gear Lunar Impact ended up around 4500 while Natural Harmony was around 3500 (on allies).

You can fire off 2 Lunar Impacts before Avatar goes into CD, 3 if you are fast and lucky.

That is 9000 Health in 10 Seconds, with another 10 Seconds CD. Natural Harmony has a delay of 2s and a CD of 2s. That is basically 3500 Health in 4 Seconds. That is 7000 Health after 10 Seconds, BUT there is no Cooldown of 10 Seconds before we can heal again. So we are looking at 9000 Health in 20s with (only) Lunar Impact compared to 17500 Health in 20s from Natural Harmony.

Another Thing Ventari has over the Druid in Raids is Energy Expulsion. It is a great Knockback against the Balls with basically no Cooldown.

Shadelang.3012:

Ocosh.5843:

I healed Vale Guardian as Ventari Rev both in BWE3 and now in live. Conclusion is the same. Ventari Rev has excellent sustained healing, and can constantly pump out enough to keep everyone alive — until something goes wrong. Rev has no burst healing and cannot correct for a mistake. If you fall behind, you’ve got a struggle ahead of you. Druid has burst healing in spades, allowing a raid to recover from a spike, plus enough regular healing that it renders Ventari Rev second-rate. If there is ever a call for two healing-oriented characters in a fight, Rev could play second fiddle, but that’s not likely to happen.

Ventari Rev has sustained healing but no recovery. Druid has both. I shelved the Rev and play a different role.

I currently have a thread in the ranger forums working to have druid further commited to its burst here role so it stops pushing aside sustained healers. The idea should be that they work together. Not be mutally exclusive.

Problem with current raid design is, you can hardly even spare 1 spot for healer. There’s simply too much DPS required and too little sustained raid-wide pressure to justify bringing another healer. So one has to cover is and probably tank/dps, too.

Druid is bound to staff, revenants are not and they have 2 stances

Rym.1469:

Shadelang.3012:

Ocosh.5843:

I healed Vale Guardian as Ventari Rev both in BWE3 and now in live. Conclusion is the same. Ventari Rev has excellent sustained healing, and can constantly pump out enough to keep everyone alive — until something goes wrong. Rev has no burst healing and cannot correct for a mistake. If you fall behind, you’ve got a struggle ahead of you. Druid has burst healing in spades, allowing a raid to recover from a spike, plus enough regular healing that it renders Ventari Rev second-rate. If there is ever a call for two healing-oriented characters in a fight, Rev could play second fiddle, but that’s not likely to happen.

Ventari Rev has sustained healing but no recovery. Druid has both. I shelved the Rev and play a different role.

I currently have a thread in the ranger forums working to have druid further commited to its burst here role so it stops pushing aside sustained healers. The idea should be that they work together. Not be mutally exclusive.

Problem with current raid design is, you can hardly even spare 1 spot for healer. There’s simply too much DPS required and too little sustained raid-wide pressure to justify bringing another healer. So one has to cover is and probably tank/dps, too.

The thing is druids can more readily go hybrid between offense and defense gear. Or even pure offense gear and help heal when theres an emergency. Especially since grace of the land is still a dps increase to the raid. So it is possible to have both.

Edit: You are right though about current raid design making it hard to justify two spots like that. I made my assumption under a view of raiding that most people most likely don’t share. Ill attempt to rectify that in future statements on the subject.

On that note however. Even if they stay mutally exclusive it doesn’t really effect the rest of my statement on the subject.

NapTooN.6283:

Shadelang.3012:

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

The issue is hte outgoing healing one doesn’t do enough either because of the range (low to high not skill range) of ventari’s base heals. Ventari CAN’T perform the kind of emergency heals a druid can with lunar impact. The bad part is in most runs your going to need that. My suggestion was more to repurpose that trait to provide the kind of emergency healing ventari is lacking.

Sustained healing is all well and good. But bosses are desgined with highs and lows. SOMEONE is going to get spiked.

Edit: Ventari does more than enough healing to sustain a group when its going well. And Ventari Jalis is good for keeping the damage the raid takes down. But it lacks the oh kitten heals for when things go wrong. Which in a well designed boss fight SHOULD happen. Or atleast the threat of something going wrong should always be there.

Edit 2I don’t want to just take up another post spot) What I meant by the above is that as long as the group only requires sustained healing then ventari is fine. Though in that case there are better heal options available. And your losing out on ALOT of damage youd be getting if that revenant went dps. So what your getting by taking a ventari healer in its current form may not be worth what your giving up when you could just take a druid that can also boost the raids dps.

If i compare the strongest heals of my Ventari to Druid, both in same gear Lunar Impact ended up around 4500 while Natural Harmony was around 3500 (on allies).

You can fire off 2 Lunar Impacts before Avatar goes into CD, 3 if you are fast and lucky.

That is 9000 Health in 10 Seconds, with another 10 Seconds CD. Natural Harmony has a delay of 2s and a CD of 2s. That is basically 3500 Health in 4 Seconds. That is 7000 Health after 10 Seconds, BUT there is no Cooldown of 10 Seconds before we can heal again. So we are looking at 9000 Health in 20s with (only) Lunar Impact compared to 17500 Health in 20s from Natural Harmony.

Another Thing Ventari has over the Druid in Raids is Energy Expulsion. It is a great Knockback against the Balls with basically no Cooldown.

Very true with energy expulsion, I sometimes brought ventari just for that job alone.
There’s a major flow in your calculation for Natural Harmony: you can’t fire 10 of them in a row…

Gaaroth.2567:

NapTooN.6283:

Shadelang.3012:

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

The issue is hte outgoing healing one doesn’t do enough either because of the range (low to high not skill range) of ventari’s base heals. Ventari CAN’T perform the kind of emergency heals a druid can with lunar impact. The bad part is in most runs your going to need that. My suggestion was more to repurpose that trait to provide the kind of emergency healing ventari is lacking.

Sustained healing is all well and good. But bosses are desgined with highs and lows. SOMEONE is going to get spiked.

Edit: Ventari does more than enough healing to sustain a group when its going well. And Ventari Jalis is good for keeping the damage the raid takes down. But it lacks the oh kitten heals for when things go wrong. Which in a well designed boss fight SHOULD happen. Or atleast the threat of something going wrong should always be there.

Edit 2I don’t want to just take up another post spot) What I meant by the above is that as long as the group only requires sustained healing then ventari is fine. Though in that case there are better heal options available. And your losing out on ALOT of damage youd be getting if that revenant went dps. So what your getting by taking a ventari healer in its current form may not be worth what your giving up when you could just take a druid that can also boost the raids dps.

If i compare the strongest heals of my Ventari to Druid, both in same gear Lunar Impact ended up around 4500 while Natural Harmony was around 3500 (on allies).

You can fire off 2 Lunar Impacts before Avatar goes into CD, 3 if you are fast and lucky.

That is 9000 Health in 10 Seconds, with another 10 Seconds CD. Natural Harmony has a delay of 2s and a CD of 2s. That is basically 3500 Health in 4 Seconds. That is 7000 Health after 10 Seconds, BUT there is no Cooldown of 10 Seconds before we can heal again. So we are looking at 9000 Health in 20s with (only) Lunar Impact compared to 17500 Health in 20s from Natural Harmony.

Another Thing Ventari has over the Druid in Raids is Energy Expulsion. It is a great Knockback against the Balls with basically no Cooldown.

Very true with energy expulsion, I sometimes brought ventari just for that job alone.
There’s a major flow in your calculation for Natural Harmony: you can’t fire 10 of them in a row…

Energy expulsion is indeed a very good point. But lunar impact and natural convergence are also very powerful BreakBar breakers. I also tried to take into account the amount of energy that the tablet consumes when it is moved and used.

However. He is correct that the gap between the tablet burst heal and the druid lunar impact aren’t as big as I had originally estimated (it took some time to test it) However the frequency at which you can use it drops the gap down significantly. As well as the lack of potential healing through water fields (but for the purpose of argument im going to assume 1v1 scenarios. Not group/combo/finisher scenarios because a druid becomes more bloated the larger the number of allies around there.) So on the aspect of his original topic which is the base healing in relevance to its scaling with healing power. He is infact correct. Though I don’t feel it overcomes the general differences between the two builds.

Shadelang.3012:

Gaaroth.2567:

NapTooN.6283:

Shadelang.3012:

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

The issue is hte outgoing healing one doesn’t do enough either because of the range (low to high not skill range) of ventari’s base heals. Ventari CAN’T perform the kind of emergency heals a druid can with lunar impact. The bad part is in most runs your going to need that. My suggestion was more to repurpose that trait to provide the kind of emergency healing ventari is lacking.

Sustained healing is all well and good. But bosses are desgined with highs and lows. SOMEONE is going to get spiked.

Edit: Ventari does more than enough healing to sustain a group when its going well. And Ventari Jalis is good for keeping the damage the raid takes down. But it lacks the oh kitten heals for when things go wrong. Which in a well designed boss fight SHOULD happen. Or atleast the threat of something going wrong should always be there.

Edit 2I don’t want to just take up another post spot) What I meant by the above is that as long as the group only requires sustained healing then ventari is fine. Though in that case there are better heal options available. And your losing out on ALOT of damage youd be getting if that revenant went dps. So what your getting by taking a ventari healer in its current form may not be worth what your giving up when you could just take a druid that can also boost the raids dps.

If i compare the strongest heals of my Ventari to Druid, both in same gear Lunar Impact ended up around 4500 while Natural Harmony was around 3500 (on allies).

You can fire off 2 Lunar Impacts before Avatar goes into CD, 3 if you are fast and lucky.

That is 9000 Health in 10 Seconds, with another 10 Seconds CD. Natural Harmony has a delay of 2s and a CD of 2s. That is basically 3500 Health in 4 Seconds. That is 7000 Health after 10 Seconds, BUT there is no Cooldown of 10 Seconds before we can heal again. So we are looking at 9000 Health in 20s with (only) Lunar Impact compared to 17500 Health in 20s from Natural Harmony.

Another Thing Ventari has over the Druid in Raids is Energy Expulsion. It is a great Knockback against the Balls with basically no Cooldown.

Very true with energy expulsion, I sometimes brought ventari just for that job alone.
There’s a major flow in your calculation for Natural Harmony: you can’t fire 10 of them in a row…

Energy expulsion is indeed a very good point. But lunar impact and natural convergence are also very powerful BreakBar breakers. I also tried to take into account the amount of energy that the tablet consumes when it is moved and used.

However. He is correct that the gap between the tablet burst heal and the druid lunar impact aren’t as big as I had originally estimated (it took some time to test it) However the frequency at which you can use it drops the gap down significantly. As well as the lack of potential healing through water fields (but for the purpose of argument im going to assume 1v1 scenarios. Not group/combo/finisher scenarios because a druid becomes more bloated the larger the number of allies around there.) So on the aspect of his original topic which is the base healing in relevance to its scaling with healing power. He is infact correct. Though I don’t feel it overcomes the general differences between the two builds.

In a standard Ventari rotation (by using all your energy then swaping) you can use NH twice and movement 5 times. Also druid benefits a loooooooooooot more from outgoing healing and HP.

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

Gaaroth.2567:

NapTooN.6283:

Shadelang.3012:

Varezenem.2813:

Shadelang.3012:

EditL: This is generally for PvE. PvP ventari has its own issues that need to be worked out.

Ventari’s healing is split into two parts which make it difficult to use reliably. The heal procs from the tablet itself. And the drops a ventari specced revenant can produce on use of the tablet. (One of the grandmaster traits)

You can control where the tablet heals. But you cant control where the shards themselves drop. Which makes it difficult to use them to support allies. Also to make the most of it your allies have to be looking FOR those shards.

Ventari’s sustained healing potential is high. As its capable of dropping those shards continuously. However the actual effectiveness is limited because theres no way to guarantee the people that get those shards are the ones that need them. And you can’t generate them fast enough to aid 10 people in a raid.

From what I can tell a support revenant is meant to work in two general parts. Mitigation and Recovery. Ill use vale guardian as an example as its the only boss I have used this setup on.

Jalis works very well for mitigating damage the grp takes in risky situations. You can use it to cover some of your people if you knwo your not going to make it to the aoe site in time. Also if people get low you can use jalis to lower teh damage they take for a bit to buy time for there healing to come off cooldown.

Once the dangerous moment has passed and its under control you can move back to ventari and help them all recover from the damage tehy have taken.

Its not a pure healing setup like druid. Its a bit more complicated than that. Infact I would argue that for the purposes of raid fighting it might be TOO complicated.

I would change the item drop grandmaster that instead of releasing a pickup on use. The tablet targets the lowest health ally nearby and instead pulses additional healing to that ally. The player would still need to be near the tablet to benefit. But there not looking at the ground searching for healing drops instead of looking at the bosses mechanics.

For healing many allies IMO this GM is useless you are better of getting the outgoing healing one. This trait is at its strongest for bubker builds specially in SPvP.

The issue is hte outgoing healing one doesn’t do enough either because of the range (low to high not skill range) of ventari’s base heals. Ventari CAN’T perform the kind of emergency heals a druid can with lunar impact. The bad part is in most runs your going to need that. My suggestion was more to repurpose that trait to provide the kind of emergency healing ventari is lacking.

Sustained healing is all well and good. But bosses are desgined with highs and lows. SOMEONE is going to get spiked.

Edit: Ventari does more than enough healing to sustain a group when its going well. And Ventari Jalis is good for keeping the damage the raid takes down. But it lacks the oh kitten heals for when things go wrong. Which in a well designed boss fight SHOULD happen. Or atleast the threat of something going wrong should always be there.

Edit 2I don’t want to just take up another post spot) What I meant by the above is that as long as the group only requires sustained healing then ventari is fine. Though in that case there are better heal options available. And your losing out on ALOT of damage youd be getting if that revenant went dps. So what your getting by taking a ventari healer in its current form may not be worth what your giving up when you could just take a druid that can also boost the raids dps.

If i compare the strongest heals of my Ventari to Druid, both in same gear Lunar Impact ended up around 4500 while Natural Harmony was around 3500 (on allies).

You can fire off 2 Lunar Impacts before Avatar goes into CD, 3 if you are fast and lucky.

That is 9000 Health in 10 Seconds, with another 10 Seconds CD. Natural Harmony has a delay of 2s and a CD of 2s. That is basically 3500 Health in 4 Seconds. That is 7000 Health after 10 Seconds, BUT there is no Cooldown of 10 Seconds before we can heal again. So we are looking at 9000 Health in 20s with (only) Lunar Impact compared to 17500 Health in 20s from Natural Harmony.

Another Thing Ventari has over the Druid in Raids is Energy Expulsion. It is a great Knockback against the Balls with basically no Cooldown.

Very true with energy expulsion, I sometimes brought ventari just for that job alone.
There’s a major flow in your calculation for Natural Harmony: you can’t fire 10 of them in a row…

Energy expulsion is indeed a very good point. But lunar impact and natural convergence are also very powerful BreakBar breakers. I also tried to take into account the amount of energy that the tablet consumes when it is moved and used.

However. He is correct that the gap between the tablet burst heal and the druid lunar impact aren’t as big as I had originally estimated (it took some time to test it) However the frequency at which you can use it drops the gap down significantly. As well as the lack of potential healing through water fields (but for the purpose of argument im going to assume 1v1 scenarios. Not group/combo/finisher scenarios because a druid becomes more bloated the larger the number of allies around there.) So on the aspect of his original topic which is the base healing in relevance to its scaling with healing power. He is infact correct. Though I don’t feel it overcomes the general differences between the two builds.

In a standard Ventari rotation (by using all your energy then swaping) you can use NH twice and movement 5 times. Also druid benefits a loooooooooooot more from outgoing healing and HP.

Indeed Ventari traitline is a little poor with some exceptions, Druid has a LOT more flavour and utility