Guild Wars 2

Hey so after the black powder nerf to x/p #5 and the s/d nerf to skill #3 i decided to go back to the good old d/d.

A lot of people have split views on shadow arts tree, some clamming its just as cheese as playing p/d, some say its for training wheel’s where as the other side people say its a very good trait line and that “its needed” to play d/d. i agree to some extent on the needing the s/a tree but not all of it at least. this build is not new, nor should it be thet I come up with.
I wanted to play burst d/d but with out going to glass so I tried to make it as high statted across the bored as possible. (good toughness with vitalty, strong crit chance and high crit dmg and high power)

I have not yet played with the grandmasters traits yet but that might be next.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMp2plOx7J8PNRLBtd03wL4bI6+gAA-T1TBABWqGQg7P8wDAgSVIi4IAclykuUacjKIYpEqSVCwTfwiKBX4QAkjqCAcCACAgAcz2MASoFau5Nv5Nv5NLFggKjA-w

I could of gone for the power/crit food but i felt i had enough crit dmg so i went for the extra vitialty with power food.

Now i have only been in wvw once with this, and it had a lot more dps then what x/6/6/x/x does but obviously it lacks the sustain from shadows rejuvenation, my back stabs alone does nearly an extra 1k dmg compared to the other build (this was on an npc guard)

anyway what do you guys think on this version of d/d and has anyone tried 0/6/6/2/0 and go with POI in acro with strength runes?

A popular (at least temporarily) build that arose after the change to ferocity used 0/6/5/3/0 with strength runes (not added into link) for good might stacking from the SA and PoI from acro. You should be able to maintain 10 stacks of might easily IIRC.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMpyplOx7J8PNhQBt9pDQB4NDPovVA-T1TBABWqGQg7P8wDAgSVIi4IAclykuUacjKIYpEqSVCwTfwiKBX4QAkjqCAcCACAgAcz2MASoFau5Nv5Nv5NLFggKjA-w

The build’s pretty good – like really good, and far better than most of what I’ve seen. I’m one to agree with you on the food sometimes, but it depends on the situation. Definitely run frittes if I’m doing anything more than picking off single targets and want the extra burst for laughs. I personally do not like haste and would suggest furious retaliation instead since haste’s bonuses are often negligible and proc too early in the fight to mean anything.

I dislike SA due to last refuge. Being forced into revealed by a skilled opponent is a terrible thing. I aim for consistency as much as possible. High points in SA imho are crutch/cheesy specs which just raise the skill floor and lower the ceiling.

I run D/D stab with the highest possible burst damage build in the game tweaked and played slightly for reliability. I have some issues with conditions but ultimately try my best to just not get hit. It offers enough bonus health to usually get past a few ticks should I get hit at all. My biggest issue lies in the new PU mesmer scepter builds because HiS does not remove torment and I have no other cleanses and rely heavily on mobility. The success with a lot of training is the highest I’ve had playing any other class/build just because most players cannot survive the initial burst or panic and misplay/try to turtle and sustain beyond that point. Displayed below is my gear situation with the build. I rarely engage with SoS blown and use it as a clutch bomb-avoidance blind if I absolutely have to since the mobility bonus is far superior to the might stacking. Obviously the numbers would be increased further with more ascended gear.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMpypNOxzJ8PNxLhs9nTr8btuLCA-T1SBABP8AAi4QAc1+jSlbUDALlV4pDYRlgootYhjEQOq+AwJAIAACA38m38m38mFCQwWA-w

That’s nice

Except for the part where any competent Condition user absolutely demolishes you

Thieves with no SA are simply loot bags in WvW.. sad but true

I find myself without too many problems, though. Usually I’m able to dodge through the applications and end the fight before they can lay them on and sustain. The problem only amplifies if I get immobilized after blowing dodges or simply misplay and then bombed with conditions. I try to do my best to avoid these situations and perform fairly well overall. Thieves have a loss-loss situation with condition removal since LR procced intentionally at the right time by a good player can literally cause the fight to end right then and there. Without LR, I would even further consider the SA line and take the damage hit just because of that necessary condition removal. Because of LR I find SA to be too unpredictable in performance because it becomes so dependent on how knowledgeable your enemy is about stealth and exactly what they do as you enter stealth. My build might be glassy, but it has no dependencies like that which imho makes the build more functional than people give it credit.

Though I won’t deny every now and then I yell in chat about condition damage sources being ridiculous. But I think a lot of people agree with me there and overall it doesn’t really have to do with the build of my character as much as the other. Scepter PU mesmer and P/D thief are a little out of control haha.

But to each his own. Players should pursue their best characters and play them in ways they find themselves the most effective. We can only point out certain synergies or make suggestions based upon supposed style.

Regarding competent Condi user most of the time when you get Condi bombed its game over regaurdless of full sa or not.

Thank you, I did change the trait as you suggested and it works out alright q
Actually, played it some more last night and its a blast

And regarding last refuge, yes its an kitten of a trait and I only have issues while playing d/d

Well in WvW Ive been trying out d/d recently and played about with traits, you don’t necessarily need SA, but it helps with your sustain.
I’ve found it fun Traiting into trickery and long reach as a gap closer at least, especially after the influx of LB rangers.

It really depends on what you want to do. If you roam solo or in big zerg you can go full damage and who cares.
If you want to do some small group roaming a full damage/might build will screw up heavily your teammates as you’ll be forced to retreat/die quickly and you don’t have much to give them

I personally don’t like the ALL OR NOTHING philosophy of going full damage, i’d rather have sustain and imho taking 6points in SA just works great.
It also depends whom you’re going after. Good players won’t have such big problems in making you fail your CnD / basilisk venom and there’s where you need sustain and a backup plan to fall down to

If all you want to do is jumping people from behind then it’s a whole different story, imho i’d put 6pts into DA as both panic strike and revealed training do a great job in instagibbing enemies

DeceiverX.8361:

The build’s pretty good – like really good, and far better than most of what I’ve seen. I’m one to agree with you on the food sometimes, but it depends on the situation. Definitely run frittes if I’m doing anything more than picking off single targets and want the extra burst for laughs. I personally do not like haste and would suggest furious retaliation instead since haste’s bonuses are often negligible and proc too early in the fight to mean anything.

I dislike SA due to last refuge. Being forced into revealed by a skilled opponent is a terrible thing. I aim for consistency as much as possible. High points in SA imho are crutch/cheesy specs which just raise the skill floor and lower the ceiling.

I run D/D stab with the highest possible burst damage build in the game tweaked and played slightly for reliability. I have some issues with conditions but ultimately try my best to just not get hit. It offers enough bonus health to usually get past a few ticks should I get hit at all. My biggest issue lies in the new PU mesmer scepter builds because HiS does not remove torment and I have no other cleanses and rely heavily on mobility. The success with a lot of training is the highest I’ve had playing any other class/build just because most players cannot survive the initial burst or panic and misplay/try to turtle and sustain beyond that point. Displayed below is my gear situation with the build. I rarely engage with SoS blown and use it as a clutch bomb-avoidance blind if I absolutely have to since the mobility bonus is far superior to the might stacking. Obviously the numbers would be increased further with more ascended gear.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMpypNOxzJ8PNxLhs9nTr8btuLCA-T1SBABP8AAi4QAc1+jSlbUDALlV4pDYRlgootYhjEQOq+AwJAIAACA38m38m38mFCQwWA-w

Wholeheartedly disagree with you about the trait critical haste. It is much better than furious retaliation IMO, but most WvW builds I see agree with you and opt for furious retaliation instead. Sure, sometimes it procs at inopportune times, but with hidden killer it often procs on my backstab, allowing me to get in a lot of aa chain burst after, really upping my damage. also, while Furious retal isn’t bad, if using hidden killer it is redundant for back-stabs, though still useful. I just really like quickness, and even though its just 2 seconds, it sure adds a bunch of burst.

Btw I like your full burst build, have you tried flanking strikes instead of thrill of the crime? Thrill of the crime likely has better DPS, but flanking strikes certainly has better BS burst. However I can see the swiftness helping to actually land the backstab. (might be one of those reliability tweaks you mentioned).

95% of the time I prefer thrill of the crime as well, but with a full burst build like yours flanking trike may put you over the edge to literally 1 shot people. There is also a food that has 200 power for 30s after killing enemy (mosquitos count!) + 70 ferocity. Definitely worth playing around with (expensive though). I’d be very interested in hearing what you backstab for with that trait/food. Doubt any zerk ele could survive just 1 backstab.

To the OP: Love you build as far as traits/utilities/concept. But with hidden killer/backstab I think sigil of fire is superior to sigil of force. also, that soldiers coat makes me nauseous- replace with valk/cav or zerk! (id go valk for full power ferocity, dont need a lot of precision). a valkyrie coat would give you like +5% crit/backstab damage for the price of 70something toughness, well worth imo

To each his own, though. I disagree with haste because I find my targets (in WvW) are usually already dead by the time I would expect to gain quickness, and the fury can stack off of ToTC and carry over to another target, in which case everything about it is wasted. With a less-bursty build, however, I can see the reasons to take it as those AA’s would help substantially if you’re already glued to your target.

I take ToTC due to its overall incredible usefulness. You’re definitely correct in that it has to do with reliability, though :P

My initial reasoning to take it because it provides the buffs on cast, not when mug/steal hits, therefore allowing CnD to crit substantially more often thus dealing much, much higher numbers in the rotation on average. It also lets the follow-up hits get amplified vastly helping boost DPS. The swiftness was appealing initially because one of my close friends played a guardian and it provided AOE swiftness while his was on cooldown to let us cross maps faster. The one stack of might is just icing on the cake :P

With fire/force, it’s really difficult. I still prefer force since it bolsters mug + CnD + stab and all of the subsequent hits in between procs, and again I’m really one for reliability, but it’s definitely up for discussion.

Missed the soldier’s coat; unless there’s something I’m not aware of regarding such small toughness increases, I would also suggest moving it to valkyrie as it’ll make you more durable to conditions than cavalier’s and the toughness hit is arguably not worthwhile.

Hey again guys. Just to clear some things up here.

Indeed the coat was chosen for a reason. There is has been some discussion’s that I have hearing about how toughness works and a good sweet spot is to aim for 2500 armor for the highest income % dmg reduction, 2600 is like 8% even less dmg income and going up to 2800 is even stronger. After 3200 -3500 the % reduction is minimal. Anyway my point is that @ 2500 armor I will take a lot less then 2400 and as I said I feel I have more then enough burst with my current crit dmg and power so I decided to try out the pheory of 2500. Although I don’t have my target of 2500, the wvw bloodlust is nearly always up which boost’s all stats slightly.

As for the fire vs force. I would of taken fire if not I didn’t already have the 15% dmg buff from dagger training and the 10% vs targets with condition’s. With force I get a 20% dmg buff.

You guys may hit harder but my back stabs still inflict some nasty dmg, I managed to back stab for 10k and cnd for 6.8k on an enermy thief.