Guild Wars 2

I know for a fact nobody really cares that this died, besides the Ghost Thieves themselves.

Who are probably going to complain that they spent countless hours and money PvEing and upgrading gear and trinkets to ascended all for their precious build to be ripped apart. But does anyone really care in the end honestly? Was Ghost Thief healthy for each game type? What benefit did it truly serve, other than succeeding in being a menace to people.

I’ve never had much of a problem with G.T’s (Ghost thieves) because when ever you encounter a GT just condi cleanse and run to water, their build ends or is extremely limited while in water, and is basically just a regular condi thief in water, with limited stealth abilities, even when traited.

What I find concerning is now there is a problem in the WvW thread talking about “Fast stomping” and how it should be removed or nerfed. How many more things does a Thief need to be given just to be taken away at a later date? In terms of the traps I would “Up” the damage by alittle for compensation.

Thoughts?

That was the clueless build of all time, thanks Anet.

I’m disappointed they didn’t look at stealth stacking and nerfed traps in a way which will hurt non ghost thief builds.

I don’t run traps but I know people do use them…and this will serve to limit their use once again.

Ahh, ANet… Removing damage from Thief traps due to it causing issues, only to re-add them again, in an attempt to appease complaints and serve to try and get rid of ONE troll build.

I’ve been running a Power trap build for god knows how long, utilizing the Trap trait to stack Might + Vuln in order to set up burst from Stealth. Tripwire was my main CC, it did its’ job. It didn’t need the damage tacked back onto it in a kitten manner. None of the traps did. They picked the wrong solution to the issue that was at hand.

EDIT : After playing around with the traps for a bit, while I hated it at first, I’ve come to love it, somewhat. While I don’t agree that it was the solution, the added damage does help prep for some Power burst, and the delay allows for just enough time to prepare said burst.

I ran traps in my condi build, but no perma stealth. I’d burst like a medi guard: heal>steal>cancel heal with weapon swap for geomancy sigil. This is pretty much dead now, which is a shame.

Don’t get me wrong, ghost thief needed to die. But the traps counting as a strike ought to have been sufficient, no?

Kawloon Fuathach.3807:

They picked the wrong solution to the issue that was at hand.

^ This. Stealth stacking was the issue.

Jugglemonkey.8741:

I ran traps in my condi build, but no perma stealth. I’d burst like a medi guard: heal>steal>cancel heal with weapon swap for geomancy sigil. This is pretty much dead now, which is a shame.

Don’t get me wrong, ghost thief needed to die. But the traps counting as a strike ought to have been sufficient, no?

Kawloon Fuathach.3807:

They picked the wrong solution to the issue that was at hand.

^ This. Stealth stacking was the issue.

Nope. Not being revealed while applying and maintaining lethal conditions was the issue. That is what this (poorly) fixed. Please don’t bring your misguided gripe with the core mechanic into this.

ArenaNet making a sloppy, poorly thought out reactionary nerf? Nawwwww

Turk.5460:

Jugglemonkey.8741:

I ran traps in my condi build, but no perma stealth. I’d burst like a medi guard: heal>steal>cancel heal with weapon swap for geomancy sigil. This is pretty much dead now, which is a shame.

Don’t get me wrong, ghost thief needed to die. But the traps counting as a strike ought to have been sufficient, no?

Kawloon Fuathach.3807:

They picked the wrong solution to the issue that was at hand.

^ This. Stealth stacking was the issue.

Nope. Not being revealed while applying and maintaining lethal conditions was the issue. That is what this (poorly) fixed. Please don’t bring your misguided gripe with the core mechanic into this.

If you read my post, you’d see I said geomancy sigil, so I’d be revealed when spiking anyways. That, and my complaint was with the interaction with steal being changed due to the arm time, which makes it much harder to actually land traps, not with the traps causing reveal.

Please try to read the post before commenting next time, makes you look less silly

Finally dead thieves find peace and stop haunting wvw fields.

Good riddance. Now, if only they reverted that clunky cooldown on abilities while in stealth which never really affected GT to begin with.

Jugglemonkey.8741:

Turk.5460:

Jugglemonkey.8741:

I ran traps in my condi build, but no perma stealth. I’d burst like a medi guard: heal>steal>cancel heal with weapon swap for geomancy sigil. This is pretty much dead now, which is a shame.

Don’t get me wrong, ghost thief needed to die. But the traps counting as a strike ought to have been sufficient, no?

Kawloon Fuathach.3807:

They picked the wrong solution to the issue that was at hand.

^ This. Stealth stacking was the issue.

Nope. Not being revealed while applying and maintaining lethal conditions was the issue. That is what this (poorly) fixed. Please don’t bring your misguided gripe with the core mechanic into this.

If you read my post, you’d see I said geomancy sigil, so I’d be revealed when spiking anyways. That, and my complaint was with the interaction with steal being changed due to the arm time, which makes it much harder to actually land traps, not with the traps causing reveal.

Please try to read the post before commenting next time, makes you look less silly

Just because I didn’t feel the need to snip your quote doesn’t mean I was replying to the entire post from start to finish. Please try to understand basic logic and context clues before commenting next time, makes you look less silly.

Turk.5460:

Jugglemonkey.8741:

Turk.5460:

Jugglemonkey.8741:

I ran traps in my condi build, but no perma stealth. I’d burst like a medi guard: heal>steal>cancel heal with weapon swap for geomancy sigil. This is pretty much dead now, which is a shame.

Don’t get me wrong, ghost thief needed to die. But the traps counting as a strike ought to have been sufficient, no?

Kawloon Fuathach.3807:

They picked the wrong solution to the issue that was at hand.

^ This. Stealth stacking was the issue.

Nope. Not being revealed while applying and maintaining lethal conditions was the issue. That is what this (poorly) fixed. Please don’t bring your misguided gripe with the core mechanic into this.

If you read my post, you’d see I said geomancy sigil, so I’d be revealed when spiking anyways. That, and my complaint was with the interaction with steal being changed due to the arm time, which makes it much harder to actually land traps, not with the traps causing reveal.

Please try to read the post before commenting next time, makes you look less silly

Just because I didn’t feel the need to snip your quote doesn’t mean I was replying to the entire post from start to finish. Please try to understand basic logic and context clues before commenting next time, makes you look less silly.

Well you should be more specific then lol xD

Honestly I fail to see how the gripe is misguided when the thief can just change traps out to other skills that allow them to apply condis while stealthed. That, and the fact you really don’t need permastealth in full marauder to begin with, let alone trailblazer or dire.

Sure, the update killed that specific build, which is good for the game as a whole. Changing how stealth stacks or how SA works would have been sufficient to balance the build without nerfing everything associated with traps though.

Edit: Just to be clear, meta D/P with dash doesn’t need any stealth taken off of it. What I’m thinking of is a change that puts a cap on stealth so you can’t stealth indefinitely using D/P with bound or SA, and making SA more active in how it works so it doesn’t encourage camping in stealth to begin with. ANet were pretty crazy to buff needle trap in the last balance patch though, so this is probably a pipe dream.

They did this in response to a few things I kept mentioning IMO.

Those were the ability to use hidden thief in the typical Ghost thief build , and the on trigger effect that would occur with a steal with a venom build.

IE one can no longer preload trap on steal and have it land on steal due to the one second delay and this ensures added venom procs did not occur.

While this compromises many existing Ghost Thieves, the build itself can still exist in the non trap variant.

It will make traps much less usable overall and I do hope the damage component is significant. The issue with thief versus other trap users the DH (and lesser extent ranger) can still drop traps directly where they happen to be fighting and have them proc on an enemy in that circle while a thief no longer can. 1 second arm time to trigger is a LONG time in game terms.

IMO a poor and unblanced solution to the problem. Put a 1 second trigger delay on the DH traps just as example and see how many are now able to get out of the traps range before they trigger it.

Damage didn’t look that significant to me but the multiplier might be decent? Probably not though.

I feel a one second delay on trigger for Ranger and DH traps warranted so I can get out of their area of effect when I see them being set. That or the Thief is dropped to the same time as Ranger (.5 second) and the DH traps be given arming time to trigger.

The tooltips show minimal dage off the trigger so these traps underperform in comparative terms given they are not persistent on trigger and do not cover as wide an area as other traps.

up the activation time to two seconds. I am one of the rare power (hybrid) thief trappers that uses no stealth except from traps to get a short stealth and set up the next strike and i don´t want my 2 seconds superspeed + stealth to reposition ruined after one second :-).

I find downed state and stomping as very good tactics for WvW. It’s like in real war, you try to insure as many as can and then finish them of. I would remove rallying completely.

I heard that the only reason this was actually nerfed was because someone soloed a raid boss with it.

As someone who used traps extensively, they should have added damage to prevent perma stealth builds. But what they weren’t supposed to do was add this 1 second delay.

It makes traps unreliable as a source of damage. Yes, you can still make a trap bomb if you have time to set it up for someone to walk into it, but they are now made totally useless as an offensive tool and nobody is gonna bring skills that make ~20% of your skill bar unusable when you are the one that is on the offensive (which is a thief’s role).

All in all, bad thought out solution, which made entire skill line obsolete, to a problem, which exploited bad skill mechanics

what concerns me is that it´s 1 second not 2 …. Either its none or it´s 2 but one is bad because it doesn´t synergize with traper rune. Adding the damage is OK and adding delay + damage is actually good but this 1 second is basically also hindering non ghost nice builds. To say i use a power based thief with traps for stealth windows so is can save ini for strikes and do it out of steals. I don´t hide it´s just for repositioning. I even don´t care for the traps damage much might and vulnerability heps to hit harder….
Well i don´t use thief much annyway but regardless of class i dislike nerfing that hit nice builds. Those things reduce diversity.

While not having spent enough time on it yet, the effectiveness of my p/d trapper has dropped significantly. I can deal with the damage on trap trigger but that one second arming time , coupled with that small area a trap covers makes them unreliable. Simply put the guy sees you lay the trap , even at his feet and he can just walk away.

The irony is that in order to use these traps now so they can not just be avoided, one is better off using them in a perma stealth build so the enemy not aware it being laid so as to allow you that extra 1 second for it to arm.

Impairing daggers are now a better choice for non stealth sacking builds meaning another core build compromised forcing more into DD.

I am now tempted to switch over to a stealth stacking (d/p) condition build wherein I do not use traps at all maintaining stealth even as I apply bleeds , poisons and confusion. 2 or three of these working together can wreck anyone who has low condition cleanse and never leave stealth.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

I heard that the only reason this was actually nerfed was because someone soloed a raid boss with it.

Well it certainly wasnt due to 5 years of constant complaints over OP permastealth in WvW, we know that much.

Anyone with a lick of ability to play this game even moderately well doesn’t care one way or the other about this.
It was a stupid build. Not overpowered per se, but annoying to deal with and (as I understand it) not even that fun to play.
People can probably still “ghost”, but to maintain the build the condition bomb won’t be as heavy. That is, even less viable.

~ Kovu

I hear Anet buried it next to Spirit Rangers

Anet can u give back the ghost trappers their stealth? Not our fault people suck against them. People whining because they cant kill them need to get good. I run a perm stealth theif in pvp and now i cant because people whining about notbeing able to kill them. in that case, you will take away engi gyro for stomping in down state right? take away grave digger OP damage from necros, warriors with that OP stun etc,. I mean, people complaining about not being able to take on trapper theifs is the exact same of what i am saying about other toons that i have that cant take on other classes becuase theyre too OP. people can whine just like I am but we did this work for our theifs and we get screwed.

saberz.2946:

Anet can u give back the ghost trappers their stealth? Not our fault people suck against them. People whining because they cant kill them need to get good. I run a perm stealth theif in pvp and now i cant because people whining about notbeing able to kill them. in that case, you will take away engi gyro for stomping in down state right? take away grave digger OP damage from necros, warriors with that OP stun etc,. I mean, people complaining about not being able to take on trapper theifs is the exact same of what i am saying about other toons that i have that cant take on other classes becuase theyre too OP. people can whine just like I am but we did this work for our theifs and we get screwed.

Pretty sure you copied/pasted most of this from your WvW comment.

Knowing you play this build makes all the more sense. As someone once said, onlyu those that play it will argue it. To also quote my WvW post vs yours, this build is Toxic to WvW and in shed of this new light, its also toxic to the already toxic PvP. (Kinda funny actually as in the WvW thread, I pointed out your PvP toxicity before I saw this thread…nailed it)

I admit I played GT in WvW as a gimmick for a small period of time, got boring fast and learned to play a real build. A lot more satisfaction and pride downing someone using a real build than a fake gimmick one (inb4, my mallyx rev loves playing with ghost teefs, small effort, big payoff…tip for those that are looking for a nice counter play).

All this means is that you can either a.) Adapt and tweak the build or change it entirely, or b.) could complain on multiple forums. Imo learning to play a real build would be more rewarding as a player. If you need build ideas, look me up. I am maining a teef and can delete most builds pretty quick. Ill also help spar/practice until you get good.

About the 1second arm time. I believe all traps in the game should have an arming time. Arming time on traps make sense. IRL I would never run up to a bear in the wild and try to place a trap under it, I would place the trap and lure him into it.

@DH teleporting under someone’s feet and dropping a 0sec cast time insta-proc trap that critical hits for 12million damage is bullkitten.

IRL Trying to throw a trap doesn’t make sense either, it could land upside down on the ground and be useless.

That being said, thief traps need a bigger trigger zone, and I’m a bit drunk.

godmoney.6025:

About the 1second arm time. I believe all traps in the game should have an arming time. Arming time on traps make sense. IRL I would never run up to a bear in the wild and try to place a trap under it, I would place the trap and lure him into it.

@DH teleporting under someone’s feet and dropping a 0sec cast time insta-proc trap that critical hits for 12million damage is bullkitten.

IRL Trying to throw a trap doesn’t make sense either, it could land upside down on the ground and be useless.

That being said, thief traps need a bigger trigger zone, and I’m a bit drunk.

I’d be fine with the arming time if our traps were circles like the other classes, it just seems rather inconsistent all round when compared with DH traps now. But hey, that’s the game I guess.

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

saberz.2946:

Anet can u give back the ghost trappers their stealth? Not our fault people suck against them. People whining because they cant kill them need to get good. I run a perm stealth theif in pvp and now i cant because people whining about notbeing able to kill them. in that case, you will take away engi gyro for stomping in down state right? take away grave digger OP damage from necros, warriors with that OP stun etc,. I mean, people complaining about not being able to take on trapper theifs is the exact same of what i am saying about other toons that i have that cant take on other classes becuase theyre too OP. people can whine just like I am but we did this work for our theifs and we get screwed.

Pretty sure you copied/pasted most of this from your WvW comment.

Knowing you play this build makes all the more sense. As someone once said, onlyu those that play it will argue it. To also quote my WvW post vs yours, this build is Toxic to WvW and in shed of this new light, its also toxic to the already toxic PvP. (Kinda funny actually as in the WvW thread, I pointed out your PvP toxicity before I saw this thread…nailed it)

I admit I played GT in WvW as a gimmick for a small period of time, got boring fast and learned to play a real build. A lot more satisfaction and pride downing someone using a real build than a fake gimmick one (inb4, my mallyx rev loves playing with ghost teefs, small effort, big payoff…tip for those that are looking for a nice counter play).

All this means is that you can either a.) Adapt and tweak the build or change it entirely, or b.) could complain on multiple forums. Imo learning to play a real build would be more rewarding as a player. If you need build ideas, look me up. I am maining a teef and can delete most builds pretty quick. Ill also help spar/practice until you get good.

OK but they have trapper runes with the 6th rune giving stealth for 2 seconds when laying a trap, therefore if i am fighting in wvw or pvp and i lay a trap i expect to get my stealth, due to the runes giving me it. It’s not my fault people condiser GT always in wvw, there is pvp as well. Or hell in PVE if we use it there too. People whine and kitten too much because they cant fight. gotta make fighting a GT fair. OMG get over yourself quit your kittening and get good. kitten

saberz.2946:

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

saberz.2946:

Anet can u give back the ghost trappers their stealth? Not our fault people suck against them. People whining because they cant kill them need to get good. I run a perm stealth theif in pvp and now i cant because people whining about notbeing able to kill them. in that case, you will take away engi gyro for stomping in down state right? take away grave digger OP damage from necros, warriors with that OP stun etc,. I mean, people complaining about not being able to take on trapper theifs is the exact same of what i am saying about other toons that i have that cant take on other classes becuase theyre too OP. people can whine just like I am but we did this work for our theifs and we get screwed.

Pretty sure you copied/pasted most of this from your WvW comment.

Knowing you play this build makes all the more sense. As someone once said, onlyu those that play it will argue it. To also quote my WvW post vs yours, this build is Toxic to WvW and in shed of this new light, its also toxic to the already toxic PvP. (Kinda funny actually as in the WvW thread, I pointed out your PvP toxicity before I saw this thread…nailed it)

I admit I played GT in WvW as a gimmick for a small period of time, got boring fast and learned to play a real build. A lot more satisfaction and pride downing someone using a real build than a fake gimmick one (inb4, my mallyx rev loves playing with ghost teefs, small effort, big payoff…tip for those that are looking for a nice counter play).

All this means is that you can either a.) Adapt and tweak the build or change it entirely, or b.) could complain on multiple forums. Imo learning to play a real build would be more rewarding as a player. If you need build ideas, look me up. I am maining a teef and can delete most builds pretty quick. Ill also help spar/practice until you get good.

OK but they have trapper runes with the 6th rune giving stealth for 2 seconds when laying a trap, therefore if i am fighting in wvw or pvp and i lay a trap i expect to get my stealth, due to the runes giving me it. It’s not my fault people condiser GT always in wvw, there is pvp as well. Or hell in PVE if we use it there too. People whine and kitten too much because they cant fight. gotta make fighting a GT fair. OMG get over yourself quit your kittening and get good. kitten

But why are you even arguing for a Ghost Thief build?, and using “Get good” in the same argument? I’m serious trying to understand. Are you trolling or something? There are ways to counter GT build. But who has the time, energy, and supply count to always be prepared for one. (reveal trap)

saberz.2946:

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

saberz.2946:

Anet can u give back the ghost trappers their stealth? Not our fault people suck against them. People whining because they cant kill them need to get good. I run a perm stealth theif in pvp and now i cant because people whining about notbeing able to kill them. in that case, you will take away engi gyro for stomping in down state right? take away grave digger OP damage from necros, warriors with that OP stun etc,. I mean, people complaining about not being able to take on trapper theifs is the exact same of what i am saying about other toons that i have that cant take on other classes becuase theyre too OP. people can whine just like I am but we did this work for our theifs and we get screwed.

Pretty sure you copied/pasted most of this from your WvW comment.

Knowing you play this build makes all the more sense. As someone once said, onlyu those that play it will argue it. To also quote my WvW post vs yours, this build is Toxic to WvW and in shed of this new light, its also toxic to the already toxic PvP. (Kinda funny actually as in the WvW thread, I pointed out your PvP toxicity before I saw this thread…nailed it)

I admit I played GT in WvW as a gimmick for a small period of time, got boring fast and learned to play a real build. A lot more satisfaction and pride downing someone using a real build than a fake gimmick one (inb4, my mallyx rev loves playing with ghost teefs, small effort, big payoff…tip for those that are looking for a nice counter play).

All this means is that you can either a.) Adapt and tweak the build or change it entirely, or b.) could complain on multiple forums. Imo learning to play a real build would be more rewarding as a player. If you need build ideas, look me up. I am maining a teef and can delete most builds pretty quick. Ill also help spar/practice until you get good.

OK but they have trapper runes with the 6th rune giving stealth for 2 seconds when laying a trap, therefore if i am fighting in wvw or pvp and i lay a trap i expect to get my stealth, due to the runes giving me it. It’s not my fault people condiser GT always in wvw, there is pvp as well. Or hell in PVE if we use it there too. People whine and kitten too much because they cant fight. gotta make fighting a GT fair. OMG get over yourself quit your kittening and get good. kitten

I understand your logic for wanting for stealth from traps , however you are fighting a lost fight and getting defensive when someone offers help. Again I am offering my help if you need some to adapt to this change…or stay stuck in this mindset and be miserable and whine and complain…either way its up to you. This is a positive change for the health of WvW (and in a way PvP). It was a form of abusing a mechanic and the game developers have a right to change that. You also got to admit that it was a form of abuse…if you can’t, then I guess I am done trying to help you as clearly you refuse to accept reason.

What did you expect? o.O

The Ghost Thief was annoying af, but not because of the traps, because of the perma stealth and what does ANet do? Well, we should have seen that coming.

stealsth not stacking and it would have been done …

@jugglemonkey Yeah I think thief traps need to be brought inline with DH and ranger and have them made bigger circles. That’s what I meant in my post with ‘bigger trigger zone for thief traps’.

The people on the forums advocating for ghost trapper thief rights must understand they were essentially playing a rampant exploit carry-me-because-im-lazy build and saying ‘git gud and use stealth traps’ just shows their ignorance. Be a man, grow some balls and play a build that other players (who don’t have access to reveal) don’t have to spend in-game currencies to counter.

Thea Cherry.6327:

What did you expect? o.O

The Ghost Thief was annoying af, but not because of the traps, because of the perma stealth and what does ANet do? Well, we should have seen that coming.

Every other MMO has LITERAL perma stealth on a toggle, but the forums whine up and down that through comboing skills together and careful tracking of cooldowns players can use the definitely-not-permanent nature of the stealth mechanics in this game to keep a 100% uptime on it.

It is a shame that a whole bunch of classes don’t have some kind of revealing mechanic built in to their class that could counter thief stealth. It’s a shame that thief itself isn’t so dreadfully squishy and lacking in defensive skills, utilities and stability or resistance that it melts like a paper doll in a rainstorm if anything actually manages to hit it out of stealth or evades. Grow up. The problem with ghost thief was, flat out, that they could do consistent and heavy damage while staying stealthed. That no longer exists. Thief as it stands is easy to counter if you spend eight seconds learning their class mechanics, and you don’t even need currency for a reveal trap. Hell, if every Dragonhunter in the wvw went preloaded with the revealing trap BUILT IN TO THEIR CLASS for just a week, there would be no stealth thieves in wvw at all for months.

Wolfric.9380:

stealsth not stacking and it would have been done …

Nah man, that would be logical thinking, we don’t do that stuff around here. Better make entire skill type obsolete instead…

Sojourner.4621:

It is a shame that a whole bunch of classes don’t have some kind of revealing mechanic built in to their class that could counter thief stealth.
[…]Thief as it stands is easy to counter if you spend eight seconds learning their class mechanics[…]

(The rest of your post didn’t make too much sense)
Just want to highlight that reveal skills are really bad as long as thief is still build around stealth. And you of course know because you took 8 seconds to learn the class.

ETA: And yes my point that D/P has got too much and too easy access to stealth still stands. It’s no use to try to destroy D/P thief with reveal skills while not working on D/P itself. I just wanted to set that straight so that the devs don’t get any ideas.

But but but I love being revealed…revealed training ftw

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

But but but I love being revealed…revealed training ftw

Yeah very likely one of anets excuses to justify reveal skills. Unfortunately it’s not that easy, but I get I can’t get that into anyone’s head.

There should just be more opportunities for the thief to capitalize on being revealed, and many of the stealth traits should be changed to be applied upon gaining stealth, not just staying in it. This would let thieves balance stealth/reveal play well and reward not camping either styles which is largely either unfun (stealth stacking) or one-dimensional (reveal stacking for extra bonuses). A reveal skill should be used to deny stealth and nothing more, not to just shut down a majority of an existing class. And that class should have the opportunity to combat the further ailments of being revealed if it hinges its build on stealth.

One single revealed-oriented trait (RT) competing with one of the best traits in the game (Panic Strike) for an ounce of extra damage isn’t doing anything for anyone outside of PvE DPS environments. That was what I was trying to accomplish with my elite, but ANet insists on further punishing attempts to reveal oneself.

DeceiverX.8361:

There should just be more opportunities for the thief to capitalize on being revealed, and many of the stealth traits should be changed to be applied upon gaining stealth, not just staying in it. This would let thieves balance stealth/reveal play well and reward not camping either styles which is largely either unfun (stealth stacking) or one-dimensional (reveal stacking for extra bonuses). A reveal skill should be used to deny stealth and nothing more, not to just shut down a majority of an existing class. And that class should have the opportunity to combat the further ailments of being revealed if it hinges its build on stealth.

One single revealed-oriented trait (RT) competing with one of the best traits in the game (Panic Strike) for an ounce of extra damage isn’t doing anything for anyone outside of PvE DPS environments. That was what I was trying to accomplish with my elite, but ANet insists on further punishing attempts to reveal oneself.

Zomg i would LOVE to have both.

Also, I would suggest to add something to teh Shadow Arts traitline to make it more used in non-ghost builds…

Second Chance: No cooldown on failed Stealth Attacks.

This would make some DPS builds consider using SA for this alone.(or hell, get rid of the CD to begin with)

out of curiousity, any thieves still attempting to use traps in there builds? If so, how?

I have a DA TR DD build I play on occasion that uses the needle trap on heal trait, but no trap utilities.

I have only one thief build i use on ocasion. It´s a trap build using traps for stealthing to save ini for attacks (or disengage). So i don´t use any other stealth only from traps to break target and reposition. It´s a maurauder P/P (SB) build using traper rune. The build is to be mobile and kite. The only thing i dislike is that the trap´s arm time is shorter then the 2s stealth, which might lead to earlier reveal and i miss my sneak attack. I don´t care to much about the traps damage acually the damage on trip is quite nice for my build ….

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

DeceiverX.8361:

There should just be more opportunities for the thief to capitalize on being revealed, and many of the stealth traits should be changed to be applied upon gaining stealth, not just staying in it. This would let thieves balance stealth/reveal play well and reward not camping either styles which is largely either unfun (stealth stacking) or one-dimensional (reveal stacking for extra bonuses). A reveal skill should be used to deny stealth and nothing more, not to just shut down a majority of an existing class. And that class should have the opportunity to combat the further ailments of being revealed if it hinges its build on stealth.

One single revealed-oriented trait (RT) competing with one of the best traits in the game (Panic Strike) for an ounce of extra damage isn’t doing anything for anyone outside of PvE DPS environments. That was what I was trying to accomplish with my elite, but ANet insists on further punishing attempts to reveal oneself.

Zomg i would LOVE to have both.

Also, I would suggest to add something to teh Shadow Arts traitline to make it more used in non-ghost builds…

Second Chance: No cooldown on failed Stealth Attacks.

This would make some DPS builds consider using SA for this alone.(or hell, get rid of the CD to begin with)

This was the entire premise of my Deadeye elite spec proposal. Some community members unfortunately do not want this out of blatant disinterest in any amount of use of the Revealed mechanic, and the idea gained little momentum as a result.

Unfortunately I no longer see what I proposed as being feasible given the stealth attack ICD negating much of the consistency of revealed-and-re-stealth-based builds, since a failed stealth attack to reveal oneself then requires the burning of initiative on another weapon skill to trigger the effects, which innately hurts the profession’s usability. Simple buffs to the effects can’t resolve this, either, as then it ends up overbearing when it does work. I think this would be the most balanced and fun way to both play as and against the thief, but many disapprove of the notion of not just camping one or the other.

Sadly ANet is fixated on its intentions with the thief and is not willing to make concessions for the sake of general gameplay improvements and build diversity.

Xtinct.7031:

out of curiousity, any thieves still attempting to use traps in there builds? If so, how?

I have a DA TR DD build I play on occasion that uses the needle trap on heal trait, but no trap utilities.

Ive seen a couple condi teefs use needletrap and some try to be a condi ghost teef. Mainly saw it on some perma evade condi builds…still skillless but still prefer to fight that than ghost.

I still try it on my p/d condi thief premised on lots of in and out of stealth. It harder then before as I get far fewer traps to trigger than I used to.

Not being able to use it while right on top of an enemy does hurt the build and there many more that just dodge through the ones laid. I will give it a bit more time to adjust playstyle then might well drop traps entirely.

babazhook.6805:

I still try it on my p/d condi thief premised on lots of in and out of stealth. It harder then before as I get far fewer traps to trigger than I used to.

Not being able to use it while right on top of an enemy does hurt the build and there many more that just dodge through the ones laid. I will give it a bit more time to adjust playstyle then might well drop traps entirely.

Same here, used them on p/d condi build. Now they are unreliable, at best, as a source of damage. I’m probably gonna swap them in favor of evade condi build because they are not worthy to have them on skillbar as they are right now

I have been playing with a Venom/Trap build with high stealth and it is nuking most players right now. The ability to condi up a player passively is very strong and unblockable. Its rotational condi is stronger than Ghost Thief as well. Not as annoying to fight against but more deadly.

Straegen.2938:

I have been playing with a Venom/Trap build with high stealth and it is nuking most players right now. The ability to condi up a player passively is very strong and unblockable. Its rotational condi is stronger than Ghost Thief as well. Not as annoying to fight against but more deadly.

Yo, how are you landing the traps on moving targets with the delay? Or are you laying the trap and kiting someone to hit it prior to your weapon burst.

Xtinct.7031:

Straegen.2938:

I have been playing with a Venom/Trap build with high stealth and it is nuking most players right now. The ability to condi up a player passively is very strong and unblockable. Its rotational condi is stronger than Ghost Thief as well. Not as annoying to fight against but more deadly.

Yo, how are you landing the traps on moving targets with the delay? Or are you laying the trap and kiting someone to hit it prior to your weapon burst.

Use teleports during the trap-laying animation. Shortbow 5 at max distance can also be used since the projectile has a flight time and the trap can be casted during the arrow’s flight and laid on impact (which has no animation since the arrow has already been shot), which if it’s on a player, will trigger the trap. Then kite using P/D’s powerful disengage via Shadow Strike, etc.