Guild Wars 2

Look, after seeing the “changes” done to tempest for the next BWE & the fact that you need to look over TWENTY pages back to find a single dev response to any thief post/thread, thank the GODS that revenant is cool.

double sword, kitten mace/axe combos, and ACTUAL BALANCE FROM PLAYER IMPUT!?!?!

I know so many elementalists who are bailing out of their garbage ele/tempest profession due to lack of response… thief is the same way and its obvious. we get no response, no clarification, no communication, nothing. most of the people who will read this thread are maining thief and love this class like i do and have for YEARS since the first beta weekend event. but the destruction of professions like thief/lack of updates is absolutely appalling.

here comes the mass exodus from trash tier, forgotten about classes like thief to actually evolving and living classes like mezer, guardian, revenant.

here are some resources for actual ideas if any dev accidentally stumbles into our forums:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Left-in-the-Dark-an-Open-Letter-to-our-Devs/first#post5392102 – thief consensus on the class

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/State-of-Thief/first#post5391952 – current meta use of the thief class

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Face-it-Thief-sucks – how we all try to enjoy thief but immediately regret having faith in anet

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Which-Thief-Skills-Need-Improvements/first#post5389092vvvvvvvvvvv -ACTUAL feeback. some of the best ive ever seen actually. i commend everyone in this thread for doing the dev’s work for them. impressive stuff

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/What-I-d-like-to-see-when-Thief-gets-checked – some more EXTREMELY impressive balance suggestions. great work boys

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Plus-1-is-NOT-a-Role/first#post5392080 – how +1ing is not a profession, but an attribute

the last time a dev said anything in this wasteland: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief?page=21

Don’t forget Guard, we get the worst Elite spec ever alongside Eles and we will get nerfed kittence HoT will come out…

it actually makes me very sad to see people leaving thief. i always felt a kind of mutual understanding and comraderie from other thiefs. i built my 2 years of memories from this game playing solo, strict PVE Theif. the name for my theif became my internet and rave alias. and now i feel completely ignored by the devs unless they want to throw nerfs at me. this is not how you make a quality game.

Bloodyx.5946:

the last time a dev said anything in this wasteland: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief?page=21

not anymore

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/What-I-d-like-to-see-when-Thief-gets-checked – some more EXTREMELY impressive balance suggestions. great work boys

I’M FAMOUS WOOHOO!

Serious Thought.5394:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/What-I-d-like-to-see-when-Thief-gets-checked – some more EXTREMELY impressive balance suggestions. great work boys

I’M FAMOUS WOOHOO!

It was good kitten man. I don’t know why devs don’t respond to such great ideas with even a “we will take note of this” or something.

Did all the thief devs die? Like are they ok? I see revenant get constant feedback from Roy. I see elementalist (albeit terrible balancing and blatant ignoring of an entire community’s worth of feedback) they actually have a dev, who is alive and a human being with a brain and can type, doing balance. Necro clearly has great devs – they loved their update on the reaper/greatsword. same with guardian.

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

Edit: I’ve watched some twitch episodes with the Thief dev in it, and he seriously acts like his boss told him he is in charge of Thief balancing/specs etc. and he doesn’t want to. (ever have to do something you don’t want to? Did you give it 100% even though you didn’t want to do it? – that’s what it seems like to me with this dev)

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

Bloodyx.5946:

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

I have an elementalist and you have tools for any situation (something all classes should have but in their own ways), switch to earth to reflect projectiles and inflict bleed and cripple, fire to stack burning, wind for its situational purposes, water for healing, and the best underwater skills like cyclone. The only time I actually want to fight underwater is with an ele.

Bloodyx.5946:

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

He did Dragon Hunter and Tempest which IMO are the worst Elite specs for now (especially DH, holy kitten it’s bad).

As you can see my “face it – thief sucks” thread was deleted, the link in the original posters message is all the evidence left.

I think the thread had a pretty decent discussion going on about the classes problems.

Alas the mod infraction hammers came down on my twice today.

That’s the way the game is played. Marginalize a group for years at a time, then censure them when they have the audacity to speak up about it with anything but the most polite of language.

But hey, it just means we need to be on point and pickier about our rhetoric. But don’t stop posting… never stop posting.

Amineo.8951:

Bloodyx.5946:

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

He did Dragon Hunter and Tempest which IMO are the worst Elite specs for now (especially DH, holy kitten it’s bad).

really? grenth kitten it!

well, there goes half my hype…

Amineo.8951:

Bloodyx.5946:

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

He did Dragon Hunter and Tempest which IMO are the worst Elite specs for now (especially DH, holy kitten it’s bad).

oh gods………. this will be bad D8

Cynz.9437:

Amineo.8951:

Bloodyx.5946:

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

He did Dragon Hunter and Tempest which IMO are the worst Elite specs for now (especially DH, holy kitten it’s bad).

oh gods………. this will be bad D8

Even the name Dare Devil is bad (well if it’s the real name, but I’m sure it is).

Shiro Revenant sounds like every thing Thief should be.

Azure Prower.8701:

Shiro Revenant sounds like every thing Thief should be.

especially since the fixes Roy made post-bwe

I feel bad for you guys. The Karl McLain bulldozer has already smashed Guardian and Ele players into the ground. You’re next.

Black Box.9312:

I feel bad for you guys. The Karl McLain bulldozer has already smashed Guardian and Ele players into the ground. You’re next.

nah, it’s fine. we’ll just block it, uh, use an invulnerability.

hmm… I know! active dodging, acrobatics style!

well skritt…

Black Box.9312:

I feel bad for you guys. The Karl McLain bulldozer has already smashed Guardian and Ele players into the ground. You’re next.

Nice try, but we’re already in the ground.

In all seriousness, I know those elite specs seem pretty underwhelming so far, but they’re also on professions that are already fairly complete in their non-elite forms (especially Ele). Thieves are struggling just to get their profession to function on a basic level in more than one extremely narrow, over-emphasized niche.

Amante.8109:

Black Box.9312:

I feel bad for you guys. The Karl McLain bulldozer has already smashed Guardian and Ele players into the ground. You’re next.

Nice try, but we’re already in the ground.

In all seriousness, I know those elite specs seem pretty underwhelming so far, but they’re also on professions that are already fairly complete in their non-elite forms (especially Ele). Thieves are struggling just to get their profession to function on a basic level in more than one extremely narrow, over-emphasized niche.

Yeah but still, Elite spec were supposed to be Elite and add more strengh or good variation of gameplay to the class, which isn’t the case for Elem and DH for guards sucks way too much, it’s bad compared to all the other lines, I really won’t purchase HoT to get downgraded…

Dude, he didn’t know what the new traits were.

Expect nothing good to come from this reveal.

Amante.8109:

Black Box.9312:

I feel bad for you guys. The Karl McLain bulldozer has already smashed Guardian and Ele players into the ground. You’re next.

Nice try, but we’re already in the ground.

In all seriousness, I know those elite specs seem pretty underwhelming so far, but they’re also on professions that are already fairly complete in their non-elite forms (especially Ele). Thieves are struggling just to get their profession to function on a basic level in more than one extremely narrow, over-emphasized niche.

Guardian really hasn’t been anything special ever since the original bunker setup went out of fashion. Sure, Medi Guard could win fights, but the only thing it really did best was counter Thieves, who could just end up outmaneuvering them anyway because lol melee class with hardly any mobility and even less CC. Now Bunker Guard is back again it seems, but it’s still just as terrible at dealing damage as it’s always been.

As for PvE, I guess they’re pretty decent now with FMW, but PvE is still a trainwreck in general as far as balance is concerned.

Thieves, on the other hand, have been meta in PvP from day 1, and are only just now receiving competition for their role. Did the class get shafted with the spec update? Maybe a bit, but you guys really shouldn’t be throwing a fit over it. A good Thief player can still do just fine.

Like most in this forum, I’m not concerned with “doing fine” in a single preordained role. GW2 is ostensibly designed around player choice; I’d rather have more than one option on how to play my Thief (e.g., the tank, support, and/or condi builds that every other profession has).

Amante.8109:

Like most in this forum, I’m not concerned with “doing fine” in a single preordained role. GW2 is ostensibly designed around player choice; I’d rather have more than one option on how to play my Thief (e.g., the tank, support, and/or condi builds that every other profession has).

True, but being master of one role is better than being master of zero.

Amante.8109:

Like most in this forum, I’m not concerned with “doing fine” in a single preordained role. GW2 is ostensibly designed around player choice; I’d rather have more than one option on how to play my Thief (e.g., the tank, support, and/or condi builds that every other profession has).

I can’t see thief ever really being a tank, but Condition and support we should definitely have.

I meant tank as a generic descriptor of more durable builds. While Thief shouldn’t be able to melee tank like some heavy armor wearing professions, Thief SHOULD have higher durability options available. Right now defensive stats seem to add about .5 seconds longer to the “getting blown up” timer in sPvP, and your damage craters as a result.

Black Box.9312:

Amante.8109:

Like most in this forum, I’m not concerned with “doing fine” in a single preordained role. GW2 is ostensibly designed around player choice; I’d rather have more than one option on how to play my Thief (e.g., the tank, support, and/or condi builds that every other profession has).

True, but being master of one role is better than being master of zero.

What you say is true, it’s better to have one job than none. But it’s still not an excuse for the lack of diversity after nearly 3 years of “play your own way”.

Black Box.9312:

True, but being master of one role is better than being master of zero.

That kind of rationale is the worst type of shallow, sunny side up false optimism. At best, it represents misplaced idealism; at worst, it’s often a statement coming from someone not even representing the marginalized class in question, in an attempt to get them to shut up about their problems. Nothing has ever been solved by not talking about it, so I’m going to pass on that one.

Of course having “a” role is better than none… but it’s also a massive design failure if a class doesn’t have even one potentially viable role in sPvP. Fortunately, NO ONE fits that description, as GW2 is a game designed somewhat competently.

That’s where the chief complaint enters in… if other all the other classes can excel in 3-5 roles with a variety of trait and weapon choices, why should Thieves be forced into one role with one viable weapon choice? What is the silver lining in the cloud of the class that has the least diversity and build options in the game? We should be happy because things could somehow theoretically be worse for some other, even more worse off class that doesn’t actually exist? Get real.

Amante.8109:

Black Box.9312:

True, but being master of one role is better than being master of zero.

That kind of rationale is the worst type of shallow, sunny side up false optimism. At best, it represents misplaced idealism; at worst, it’s often a statement coming from someone not even representing the marginalized class in question, in an attempt to get them to shut up about their problems. Nothing has ever been solved by not talking about it, so I’m going to pass on that one.

Of course having “a” role is better than none… but it’s also a massive design failure if a class doesn’t have even one potentially viable role in sPvP. Fortunately, NO ONE fits that description, as GW2 is a game designed somewhat competently.

That’s where the chief complaint enters in… if other all the other classes can excel in 3-5 roles with a variety of trait and weapon choices, why should Thieves be forced into one role with one viable weapon choice? What is the silver lining in the cloud of the class that has the least diversity and build options in the game? We should be happy because things could somehow theoretically be worse for some other, even more worse off class that doesn’t actually exist? Get real.

You’re making the assumption that other classes can excel in multiple roles. In almost every case, that couldn’t be further from the truth. Most classes have literally ONE optimal build for PvE. It’s about tacking on the bare minimum as far as supportive traits/skills are concerned, and stacking damage, damage, damage. There is ONE optimal weapon set to use, other than maybe a ranged swap if you need it (in some cases just one weapon in general and not even a swap), and ONE specific rotation that might vary slightly based on whether the encounter is trash mobs or a boss.

PvP honestly isn’t much better. Meta Ele comp is celestial D/D. Guardian is offensively-challenged bunker. Engineer is rifle with grenades and tool kit. Mesmer is shatter burst. Running anything else is considered a liability from a competitive standpoint.

The update last month helped things out a bit, but role choice in this game is still only an illusion. Sure, you can play something else if you want, but in the end it’ll only be limiting your potential. The only difference between Thief and these other classes is that Thief players are only just now for the first time getting to know what it feels like to have to compete for that one role that you’re good at, and while it doesn’t feel good, any sort of outcry to other players is nothing more than preaching to the choir.