Guild Wars 2

BrunoBRS.5178:

data.4093:

warriorjrd.8695:

While I agree that the mesmer attacks should receive the same treatment, the only reason I can see why it’s like that is because those skills don’t deal direct damage, or damage over time. Ranger doesn’t have any skills that do damage that won’t reveal him, engi idk.

Actually rangers have entangle. I don’t think the attack does any damage, only the roots. So there is no valid reasoning to this- even caltrops isn’t nerfed in the same way. People can stay in stealth and do way more damage with caltrops than SB 4.

well caltrops can’t be reapplied infinitely. the person walks out of the caltrops and that’s that. but while you’re ticking for 400hps, the person is stuck poisoned, unable to heal properly and taking small damage ticks that keeps them stuck in combat.

then you’re full health, all cooldowns ready, and the person is not. it was a needed change.

facepalm

Choking Gas is also an AoE you can walk out of, an AoE with a 3 second poison attached to it, like Caltrops is 3 second double stack of bleeding. Unless they planned on also making Caltrops take you out of stealth (unlikely since it would destroy Uncatchable), the nerf to Choking Gas alone again makes no sense, especially by your example since just like with Caltrops, THE PLAYER CAN WALK OUT OF THE DAMAGE FIELD. Plus Caltrops CAN be used infinitely…Uncatchable makes you drop Caltrops every time you dodge.

evilapprentice.6379:

BrunoBRS.5178:

PopeUrban.2578:

You know, we could solve this with a trait.

Rupture Deadly arts, Grandmaster
When you apply bleed it is removed and you deal X damage to your target. This damage can not critically hit, but can be increased by boons and other attributes.

P/P problem solved, Deathblossom problem solved, caltrops usable by more specs, more interesting gearing options, etc. etc.

spec into bleed damage anyway. watch as your enemy melts instantly.

your trait suggestion is “bleeds get all ticks instantly, can’t be cleansed”. have you seen the numbers on those bleeds? hell, death blossom would become a murder machine. caltrops would hit harder than necro wells.

He said “X Damage” not “The bleed’s total ticks in damage”.

This

Dumping actual bleed damage would be super overpowered, which is why you’d need some balance tweaking to figure out the right amount of damage to equate per bleed.

The thinking was that it would convert bleeds to critless white damage that still penefits from +power, might, etc. like mug does. It would also have some synergy with signet of malice and on hit sigils as it’s technically an additional attack.

I don’t feel that it’s locking weapons behind a trait wall really, but rather than it’s a gimme for the thief’s poor base condition selection. However, if the question is one of forcing people to GM, it might work to have the damage ticks lowered uner GM level an thus put the trait lower, given the synergy it has with onhit type effects.

This wouldn’t 100% fix the damage issue P/P has, but it would give it additional sustain and utility options, espeically combined with ricochet, which might be another way to fix it up some, make P/P a tankier midrange spec (since, you know, it’s a midrange weapon already) rather than attempting to balance it around pure glass cannon unload.

PopeUrban.2578:

You know, we could solve this with a trait.

Rupture Deadly arts, Grandmaster
When you apply bleed it is removed and you deal X damage to your target. This damage can not critically hit, but can be increased by boons and other attributes.

P/P problem solved, Deathblossom problem solved, caltrops usable by more specs, more interesting gearing options, etc. etc.

I miss Signet of Deadly Corruption.

RyuDragnier.9476:

BrunoBRS.5178:

data.4093:

warriorjrd.8695:

While I agree that the mesmer attacks should receive the same treatment, the only reason I can see why it’s like that is because those skills don’t deal direct damage, or damage over time. Ranger doesn’t have any skills that do damage that won’t reveal him, engi idk.

Actually rangers have entangle. I don’t think the attack does any damage, only the roots. So there is no valid reasoning to this- even caltrops isn’t nerfed in the same way. People can stay in stealth and do way more damage with caltrops than SB 4.

well caltrops can’t be reapplied infinitely. the person walks out of the caltrops and that’s that. but while you’re ticking for 400hps, the person is stuck poisoned, unable to heal properly and taking small damage ticks that keeps them stuck in combat.

then you’re full health, all cooldowns ready, and the person is not. it was a needed change.

facepalm

Choking Gas is also an AoE you can walk out of, an AoE with a 3 second poison attached to it, like Caltrops is 3 second double stack of bleeding. Unless they planned on also making Caltrops take you out of stealth (unlikely since it would destroy Uncatchable), the nerf to Choking Gas alone again makes no sense, especially by your example since just like with Caltrops, THE PLAYER CAN WALK OUT OF THE DAMAGE FIELD. Plus Caltrops CAN be used infinitely…Uncatchable makes you drop Caltrops every time you dodge.

you must have some really poor understanding of how choking gas is being used from stealth right now if you can’t see why they did it.

you apply caltrops on top of the guy. guy walks out of it. 30 seconds of nothing happening, his heals tick fine, unless you apply two more mini caltrops at the expense of all your endurance (and if you’re burning endurance for freaking uncatchable on PvP, you won’t last long against a player with a brain).

now choking gas

you apply choking gas on top of the guy. guy walks off. you throw it again right before the poison runs out of time. guy walks off again. repeat it ad infinitum because choking gas has a fairly low initiative cost. guy can’t heal properly because he’s constantly poisoned, meanwhile you’re ticking for ~400hps and your skills are coming out of cooldown. when the fight starts over, the other player will be in a far inferior position than you.

Yeah the devs listen.
Too bad that they always listen to the wrong guys.

BrunoBRS.5178:

RyuDragnier.9476:

BrunoBRS.5178:

data.4093:

warriorjrd.8695:

While I agree that the mesmer attacks should receive the same treatment, the only reason I can see why it’s like that is because those skills don’t deal direct damage, or damage over time. Ranger doesn’t have any skills that do damage that won’t reveal him, engi idk.

Actually rangers have entangle. I don’t think the attack does any damage, only the roots. So there is no valid reasoning to this- even caltrops isn’t nerfed in the same way. People can stay in stealth and do way more damage with caltrops than SB 4.

well caltrops can’t be reapplied infinitely. the person walks out of the caltrops and that’s that. but while you’re ticking for 400hps, the person is stuck poisoned, unable to heal properly and taking small damage ticks that keeps them stuck in combat.

then you’re full health, all cooldowns ready, and the person is not. it was a needed change.

facepalm

Choking Gas is also an AoE you can walk out of, an AoE with a 3 second poison attached to it, like Caltrops is 3 second double stack of bleeding. Unless they planned on also making Caltrops take you out of stealth (unlikely since it would destroy Uncatchable), the nerf to Choking Gas alone again makes no sense, especially by your example since just like with Caltrops, THE PLAYER CAN WALK OUT OF THE DAMAGE FIELD. Plus Caltrops CAN be used infinitely…Uncatchable makes you drop Caltrops every time you dodge.

you must have some really poor understanding of how choking gas is being used from stealth right now if you can’t see why they did it.

you apply caltrops on top of the guy. guy walks out of it. 30 seconds of nothing happening, his heals tick fine, unless you apply two more mini caltrops at the expense of all your endurance (and if you’re burning endurance for freaking uncatchable on PvP, you won’t last long against a player with a brain).

now choking gas

you apply choking gas on top of the guy. guy walks off. you throw it again right before the poison runs out of time. guy walks off again. repeat it ad infinitum because choking gas has a fairly low initiative cost. guy can’t heal properly because he’s constantly poisoned, meanwhile you’re ticking for ~400hps and your skills are coming out of cooldown. when the fight starts over, the other player will be in a far inferior position than you.

That sounds like an utter waste of time doing it like that. Who in their right mind would do such a long thing, and who would even fall for it?

RyuDragnier.9476:

BrunoBRS.5178:

RyuDragnier.9476:

BrunoBRS.5178:

data.4093:

warriorjrd.8695:

While I agree that the mesmer attacks should receive the same treatment, the only reason I can see why it’s like that is because those skills don’t deal direct damage, or damage over time. Ranger doesn’t have any skills that do damage that won’t reveal him, engi idk.

Actually rangers have entangle. I don’t think the attack does any damage, only the roots. So there is no valid reasoning to this- even caltrops isn’t nerfed in the same way. People can stay in stealth and do way more damage with caltrops than SB 4.

well caltrops can’t be reapplied infinitely. the person walks out of the caltrops and that’s that. but while you’re ticking for 400hps, the person is stuck poisoned, unable to heal properly and taking small damage ticks that keeps them stuck in combat.

then you’re full health, all cooldowns ready, and the person is not. it was a needed change.

facepalm

Choking Gas is also an AoE you can walk out of, an AoE with a 3 second poison attached to it, like Caltrops is 3 second double stack of bleeding. Unless they planned on also making Caltrops take you out of stealth (unlikely since it would destroy Uncatchable), the nerf to Choking Gas alone again makes no sense, especially by your example since just like with Caltrops, THE PLAYER CAN WALK OUT OF THE DAMAGE FIELD. Plus Caltrops CAN be used infinitely…Uncatchable makes you drop Caltrops every time you dodge.

you must have some really poor understanding of how choking gas is being used from stealth right now if you can’t see why they did it.

you apply caltrops on top of the guy. guy walks out of it. 30 seconds of nothing happening, his heals tick fine, unless you apply two more mini caltrops at the expense of all your endurance (and if you’re burning endurance for freaking uncatchable on PvP, you won’t last long against a player with a brain).

now choking gas

you apply choking gas on top of the guy. guy walks off. you throw it again right before the poison runs out of time. guy walks off again. repeat it ad infinitum because choking gas has a fairly low initiative cost. guy can’t heal properly because he’s constantly poisoned, meanwhile you’re ticking for ~400hps and your skills are coming out of cooldown. when the fight starts over, the other player will be in a far inferior position than you.

That sounds like an utter waste of time doing it like that. Who in their right mind would do such a long thing, and who would even fall for it?

you’re telling me that, as a thief, you’ve never reset a fight?

it’s not like the enemy gets to choose whether to fall for it or not, we outrun them.

it became a big enough issue that the devs felt the need to nerf it. just because you don’t keep up with the different thief playstyles and tactics doesn’t mean it’s unfair. i mean, if it’s so stupid to poison someone from stealth, then surely it doesn’t affect you? and if it doesn’t affect you, why would you complain?

BrunoBRS.5178:

RyuDragnier.9476:

BrunoBRS.5178:

RyuDragnier.9476:

BrunoBRS.5178:

data.4093:

warriorjrd.8695:

While I agree that the mesmer attacks should receive the same treatment, the only reason I can see why it’s like that is because those skills don’t deal direct damage, or damage over time. Ranger doesn’t have any skills that do damage that won’t reveal him, engi idk.

Actually rangers have entangle. I don’t think the attack does any damage, only the roots. So there is no valid reasoning to this- even caltrops isn’t nerfed in the same way. People can stay in stealth and do way more damage with caltrops than SB 4.

well caltrops can’t be reapplied infinitely. the person walks out of the caltrops and that’s that. but while you’re ticking for 400hps, the person is stuck poisoned, unable to heal properly and taking small damage ticks that keeps them stuck in combat.

then you’re full health, all cooldowns ready, and the person is not. it was a needed change.

facepalm

Choking Gas is also an AoE you can walk out of, an AoE with a 3 second poison attached to it, like Caltrops is 3 second double stack of bleeding. Unless they planned on also making Caltrops take you out of stealth (unlikely since it would destroy Uncatchable), the nerf to Choking Gas alone again makes no sense, especially by your example since just like with Caltrops, THE PLAYER CAN WALK OUT OF THE DAMAGE FIELD. Plus Caltrops CAN be used infinitely…Uncatchable makes you drop Caltrops every time you dodge.

you must have some really poor understanding of how choking gas is being used from stealth right now if you can’t see why they did it.

you apply caltrops on top of the guy. guy walks out of it. 30 seconds of nothing happening, his heals tick fine, unless you apply two more mini caltrops at the expense of all your endurance (and if you’re burning endurance for freaking uncatchable on PvP, you won’t last long against a player with a brain).

now choking gas

you apply choking gas on top of the guy. guy walks off. you throw it again right before the poison runs out of time. guy walks off again. repeat it ad infinitum because choking gas has a fairly low initiative cost. guy can’t heal properly because he’s constantly poisoned, meanwhile you’re ticking for ~400hps and your skills are coming out of cooldown. when the fight starts over, the other player will be in a far inferior position than you.

That sounds like an utter waste of time doing it like that. Who in their right mind would do such a long thing, and who would even fall for it?

you’re telling me that, as a thief, you’ve never reset a fight?

it’s not like the enemy gets to choose whether to fall for it or not, we outrun them.

it became a big enough issue that the devs felt the need to nerf it. just because you don’t keep up with the different thief playstyles and tactics doesn’t mean it’s unfair. i mean, if it’s so stupid to poison someone from stealth, then surely it doesn’t affect you? and if it doesn’t affect you, why would you complain?

I mean who the hell stays in the same area if they see the thief just throwing out choking gas? Every opponent I fought that I did that against just immediately up and left the fight, disengaging with whatever moves they had to move fast. NOBODY falls for an obvious fight where the thief is only going to keep you in combat due to choking gas, and no thief I know would do it because it’s a waste of initiative against a single opponent.