Guild Wars 2

Serious question, I play as a thief and consider myself to be pretty decent at it, I have tried all the “OP” builds and none of them are any good against ppl who knows what they are doing. Trying backstab glass cannon now for a bit and it feels pretty balanced, good guardians and warriors demolish me, not even funny.

What MIGHT be OP is the venom share builds though, with rock dog sigil and shadowtrap a thief can have 4 pets and running 2000 toughness with decent power and damage. A little early to tell but might be to powerful.

In a nutshell .. they lost in pvp because they didn’t do one of MANY things to counter a thief. Instead of learning how the game works .. they do what WoW has taught them .. cry until it gets fixed to appeal to the masses. Dodging or carrying a stun breaker is too much trouble.

What’s “OP” from a thief is their ability to stealth all the time, and their capabilities to disengage fights very easily. There is no “OP” damage builds, people are just bad when they get stomped on the most basic full damage build.

I’m actually abit scared of the recent patches. Ppl cried about HS spam , it got nerfed. Ppl cried about PW spam, it got nerfed. Now the whiners starts focusing on backstab and LDB, I feel ANET is listening to them and might render the thief a useless class. And as others have stated before, nerfing PW damage wasn’t the right way to go about it.

1) Rendering issue primarily in wvw causing thieves to appear later than intended (though still targetable)
2) CnD -> Steal -> Signet -> Backstab combo hitting for lolomgwtf

Everything else is OK

Pretty much what Kintari said. We’re having a rendering issue in WvW where it takes 2 or so seconds for the server to actually register we’ve come out of stealth, by that time we can simply re-stealth.

CnD>Steal>Signet>Backstab is currently hitting VERY high amounts of damage, now that is what our class is based around but it’s almost insta gibbing in some cases or leaves target A with way to little health to actually duke it out with the thief after the initial backastab

@edamber – Interesting thought on the 4 pets but thats a rare scenario. Sure its possible but your thief CD is on a 180second CD, Rock Dog is what a 5% chance? And the trap requires a very dumb person to first walk over it. For those stars to all align at once is …rare, but possible I suppose.

I have tried a venom/toughness build (Deadly Arts/Shadow Arts/Acro) though but I found myself not considered a threat. Sure I could take some hits and distribute some poisons (ice drake is amazeballs) but my damage output was remedial at best. And the worst part, 0 stealth abilities besides CnD (withdraw for mobility and break root, and 3 venom skills).

As sad as it is…ive tried sooooooooooo many different builds. Seriously probably over 30. Am now approaching rank 30 in PvP and there are 2 builds I keep going back to. Condition based focused on LDB and a ‘cannon’ build that focuses on high burst with slightly less ‘glass’ (22k hp, pain response, RFI, 1k toughness, etc).

If you’re playing a class almost exclusively focused on DPS and you arent doing DPS you’re not doing your job. There are pros and cons to both but I just dont think ‘thieves’ and ‘toughness’ go together if you want to be viewed as a threat. Just my 2 cents.

I go Sword/pistol, rock dog procs pretty often though. I don’t rely on TS. You’ll be amazed how many ppl walk over shadow trap. If everything is up I can 1v3-5 easily. Pretty nice with 19k hp and 2k toughness too. I sacrifice alot of mobility though, more of a brute thief that can take a few hits and deal decent damage, mesmers are easymode with this build.

Until they fix condition we I will be running that one in sPVP and backstab in WvWvW.

You don’t exactly have to be viewed as a threat to still be a target.

From what i notice, there’s PLENTY of DPS specced players. I’ll run with the intention of using combo fields, sharing snare and basilisk venoms, running refuge to provide lifesteal / regen on stealth / revives…

It may not be the type of gameplay that most people are looking for but i’m sure that’s why DPS specs are something that is always available as opposed to tanks / supports.

I think thief is fine aside from the nerf on P/W. The only things that might need to seriously be tweaked is Quickness and perhaps the Assassination Signet.

@edamber – What do you mean by fix condition?

I think thief is fine aside from the nerf on P/W. The only things that might need to seriously be tweaked is Quickness and perhaps the Assassination Signet.

That’s the truth of it. Quickness and Assassin’s Signet take mediocre attacks and make them seem OP. The signet isn’t too bad, it only lasts for one attack and is only a 50% increase. But Quickness is a 100% increase that lasts for several seconds, and affects more than just raw damage.

Beside backstab thieves are not OP, if they stand still for literally 2 sec with a greatsword warrior they will drop dead. And i’m talking about exotic warrior vs exotic thieves, seriously a thief can get pwned by just the freaking auto attack from the greatsword.

@Revelstroke:
I think that’s one of the fundamental problems with the thief class. He’s hard to play if you’re focusing on stealth, utilities, and conditions to win the day. He’s super easy if you just go DPS.

And as a DPS build, I’d love to be seen as ‘not a threat’ … most of the time people ignore everything around them and come after me like a rabid dog once I start combat.

Achieving same result if not better with less effort and skill than other class. Ability to run glass cannon build to maximize your damage while having excelent survival and get away abilities.

To all moaning thieves, I dare you to roll glass cannon elementalist and be as effective as glass cannon thief.

Thief class will be nerfed, it is inevitable and when that happens. True thief players will remain and still shine, while rest of the garbage (which is majority) will move to next fotm.

VictorTroska.3725:

Achieving same result if not better with less effort and skill than other class. Ability to run glass cannon build to maximize your damage while having excelent survival and get away abilities.

To all moaning thieves, I dare you to roll glass cannon elementalist and be as effective as glass cannon thief.

Thief class will be nerfed, it is inevitable and when that happens. True thief players will remain and still shine, while rest of the garbage (which is majority) will move to next fotm.

Honestly the best part about the moaning thieves on these forums is when they say “X didn’t need a nerf, why, I don’t even use X and I’m an awesome player!”

Alright…so what are you whining about? Go be awesome somewhere…

Thieves are taking hits in the damage department because Anet has underestimated the defensive capabilities of stealth and shadowstep. No matter how you build, you still have high mobility and confusion that work in your favor as a thief…so why not go easymode DPS as much as possible?

The better thieves are the ones that don’t come here and cry every time there’s a nerf to an OP skill, because they understand and properly take advantage of stealth and shadowstep instead of using them as a crutch for a glass cannon.

Hell I remember tons of bads calling for perma-stealth and talking about how steal sucks. Where’s all that gone? The bads have all focused on the nerfing going on.

Redscope.6215:

Honestly the best part about the moaning thieves on these forums is when they say “X didn’t need a nerf, why, I don’t even use X and I’m an awesome player!”

Alright…so what are you whining about? Go be awesome somewhere…

Thieves are taking hits in the damage department because Anet has underestimated the defensive capabilities of stealth and shadowstep. No matter how you build, you still have high mobility and confusion that work in your favor as a thief…so why not go easymode DPS as much as possible?

The better thieves are the ones that don’t come here and cry every time there’s a nerf to an OP skill, because they understand and properly take advantage of stealth and shadowstep instead of using them as a crutch for a glass cannon.

Hell I remember tons of bads calling for perma-stealth and talking about how steal sucks. Where’s all that gone? The bads have all focused on the nerfing going on.

I don’t use S/P in PvP, only in PvE. It’s really silly that my 3 ability has absolutely no use what so ever. I could simply use my 5 to evade hits like i would with my 3 and just auto attack and save initiative since auto attack does the same, if not, MORE damage.

How can you justify that damage nerf when, clearly, it wasn’t the problem to begin with?

We’re not saying to leave our class alone, what most people are saying is to take a look at what SHOULD be nerfed / tweaked instead of blindly slapping heavy handed nerfs that don’t solve the problem.

Redscope.6215:

The better thieves are the ones that don’t come here and cry every time there’s a nerf to an OP skill, because they understand and properly take advantage of stealth and shadowstep instead of using them as a crutch for a glass cannon.on.

And on the flip side, the better players don’t come here and cry every time they get killed by a thief, because they understand how to play their class and counter accordingly.

The ""OP"" part of the thief is people who stack no toughness and no anti-burst CDs.

/thread

As stated earlier, thief is pretty agile and move quickly in and out of stealth then back to stealth before anyone notice.

I was up against 1 last night and before I know it, i was lying on the floor fighting for my life and seconds later thief disappear. That’s the major trait for thief.

Pop out, kill and hide again > win!

Any profession can stack offense like crazy and down people in a few seconds, what makes thieves different is a thief’s mobility means they can choose their fights much more easily. The ability to engage targets of opportunity and stealth/leave against poor odds mitigates a glass cannon setup far more than any other profession is able to. The solution to this? Not sure. Design direction and profession ambiance support thieves having high-mobility and lots of stealth, but perhaps it was a poor design decision to place both of those within the same class.

The class can essentially go full glass cannon with little draw backs because stealth is so powerful. Along with high mobility, crazy ridiculous damage, it is difficult to get a hit in before dying. A warrior that goes class cannon will die before he reaches his target. A thief can kitten around all day and just waltz away if things get sticky.

People act as if we can Stealth like a Rogue in WoW.

We can’t. There are a very limited number of abilities that allow us to Stealth and glass-cannons don’t typically have very many of those.

A Warrior glass-cannon on the other hand will have both 80% more HP + Heavy Armor to compensate for the lack of Stealth.

Thieves seem OP to bad players because:

1. Most of their abilities are very straightforward
2. Initiative allows Thieves to repeatedly use the same abilities over and over again which looks cheap and cheesy to many players.
3. They don’t understand the Stealth Mechanics and hence consider it OP.

smiljem.4632:

The class can essentially go full glass cannon with little draw backs because stealth is so powerful. Along with high mobility, crazy ridiculous damage, it is difficult to get a hit in before dying. A warrior that goes class cannon will die before he reaches his target. A thief can kitten around all day and just waltz away if things get sticky.

Nope.
Warrior has Endure Pain and Defy Pain, you gotta be a really really terrible Warrior to die before you reach your target.

Red Falcon.8257:

smiljem.4632:

The class can essentially go full glass cannon with little draw backs because stealth is so powerful. Along with high mobility, crazy ridiculous damage, it is difficult to get a hit in before dying. A warrior that goes class cannon will die before he reaches his target. A thief can kitten around all day and just waltz away if things get sticky.

Nope.
Warrior has Endure Pain and Defy Pain, you gotta be a really really terrible Warrior to die before you reach your target.

Heck just go Engineer and you can get the same burst – at 1200 range – without sacrificing defense.

Rendering issue that thieves don’t know about since they always see their toon.

i dont get this whole OP thing about stealth.

it only lasts for 2 seconds, 3 if you have it traited. and there are only a few ways to enter stealth. sure its a great tool, but other classes have similar tools to help them survive. dont even get me started on mesmers or guardians.

i admit i sometimes feel sorry for players when i smack them dead in one second, but i use all my traits and utilities to achieve that 1 massive hit.

Other classes don’t have “similar tools” unless they have stealth, which only one other profession realistically does. Block, evasion, and temporarily invulnerability are defensive countermeasures, but none of them are in the same league as stealth for completely removing the ability to target the incoming threat or outgoing target.

It is considered generally bad game design to punish players without giving them proper feedback, which is why so many FPS have adopted obvious trails for sniping weapons and “kill cams” to demonstrate to the dead player who their killer was and where they were attacking from. Dying quickly to a powerful combo can be frustrating, but dying quickly to a powerful combo that was impossible to see coming is far more frustrating. It gives the victim a feeling of futility and doesn’t promote properly learning how to expect, avoid, and counter those tactics. sPvP does a better job than WvW at giving information on who killed you and how, and it mitigates the frustration of those engagements.

Regardless of whether stealth is balanced or not, counterable or not, low-feedback deaths have always received heavy backlash in gaming, and it won’t stop here. A WvW death log might help alleviate some of these issues.

I love going to thief/rogue forums whenever new games come out.

It’s hilarious to watch all the QQ’ing from people and the reveling they do when rogues get nerfed. All because they’ve been poorly playing MMOs for years and never discovered its better for the overall health of a game if people learn to counter tactics rather than cry for them to be nerfed.

The P/W nerf did’t even fix P/W, but you don’t care because you saw a nerf in a patch note next to your most disliked class, keep crying you scrubbly scrubs.

Thief isn’t my main because I find there isn’t enough diversity in the class to keep me interested. The thing I love about GW2 is the diversity that a lot of the classes have. Thief really has none. I have played with a lot of builds and as others have said previously found that there are basically 2 or 3 builds that really work. Even the other classes, primarily Necro and Ranger, that are constantly, and legitimately, complaining about not having enough flavor to their class are much more fun to play than the blandness that is Thief.

I had hoped with Anet championing GW2 as a game who’s focal point is competitive pvp would go about adjustments from a more grounded point of view, but they have shown the same knee jerk reaction to crying from bads on forums that has plagued the MMO community for so long.

Honestly if even a game where PvP is clearly the focal point refuses to stress skill and adaptability as the primary countermeasure to builds and continues to just nerf, talking in regards to all classes here not just Thief, heavy handedly in a reactionary manner then there is no point in even playing.

The fact that they would focus on nerfing abilities that are easily countered by something such as paying attention, dodging, or a simple CC breaker while there are other classes that are pretty much floundering and have a serious identity crisis, yes I’m looking at you again Ranger, is a joke to me.

VictorTroska.3725:

Achieving same result if not better with less effort and skill than other class. Ability to run glass cannon build to maximize your damage while having excelent survival and get away abilities.

To all moaning thieves, I dare you to roll glass cannon elementalist and be as effective as glass cannon thief.

Thief class will be nerfed, it is inevitable and when that happens. True thief players will remain and still shine, while rest of the garbage (which is majority) will move to next fotm.

I dare you to roll a glass cannon thief and have the same level of access to CC, healing and AoE as an elementalist. Then you can roll a support thief and compare him to a support ele. THEN you can roll a tanky/survival thief and compare him to tanky/survival ele.

Oh, the thief class doesn’t do support or tank/survival as well as ele? Thieves should be pissing and moaning on the Ele boards for more combo fields, AoE, heals, stability, protection, and CC (most of which is built right into their weapon skills). Right?

Or maybe its that they’re different classes with different strengths and weaknesses… but that’s so simple, how could anyone overlook it?

If you’re trying to defend Assassin Signet + BS, then you’re obviously trolling. If you’re one of those thieves who know the restealth bug in spvp then you’re obviously trolling.

No one should be able to, not even a glass cannon, should be able to hit you for 10,000+ damage with backstab on a person with 3,000 armor. I play a necro and I don’t have access to all the good cc breakers or even a fear that lasts longer than 1 second. Thieves atm are the BEST at what they do. They’re not the best 1v1ers but they will kill anyone they choose with AS+BS when roaming.

We just for fun ran the pure glasscannon AS+BS and started 100-0 every possible profession within 2-4 seconds. We will be posting videos about this. So people can see how real this is.

I don’t want thieves to be overnerfed, but no class should be able to global a full on tank. For necromancers my cc breakers are on an incredibly long cd, so i don’t have them up a good amount of the time.

Nothing really OP about thieves. A good knockdown is ALL a warrior needs to kill a thief. Glass cannons are glassy, what can I say.

I’ve fought some pretty good Necromancers, I’d say their lifesteal ability is much more imba than stealth …

Minx.7521:

Nothing really OP about thieves. A good knockdown is ALL a warrior needs to kill a thief. Glass cannons are glassy, what can I say.

I’ve fought some pretty good Necromancers, I’d say their lifesteal ability is much more imba than stealth …

Lifesteal more imba than stealth… You have to be one of the only people who even thinks that. They leech at most 34-50 health per HIT.

Met a couple of necros that just refused to die it was 2 necros vs Ranger + thief + mesmer. they owned us

Let me elaborate:
A random mesmer, Ranger and I were camping on top of the well’s mouth in WvW jumping puzzle waiting for people to come up. We kill most of the people. There’s 1 necro down there, and we keep throwing whatever we can down at him (downs most people). His friend came up behind us. The necro in well didn’t die, jumped up, and killed all 3 of us. Just read that necros can return condition damage. I guess returning the dmg + lifesteal is imba.

It’s been said before but just to Pile On:

Render issues exciting stealth, this allows thieves to run a perma-stealth (Basically) where they can attack, burst and re-stealth without them ever showing up visually on your screen.

Combination damage of Abilities of immobilize, pistols whip, back-stab, ect ect mean that is nearly impossible to escape. Popping a stun breaker doesn’t break the immobilize (allowing you to be re-stuned vs pistolwhip ect ect)

The above combo’d with 6k Mug, 8-13k backstab (against high toughness toons) and 3k CnD to escape back into stealth.

There are some abilities and classes that can escape this, namely ones with bubbles or teleports but there are a good chunk of professions out there that just take it and there is nothing you can do about it.

And that is not a good thing.

There are a good chunk of professions that a thief can’t do anything about it if in BS setup also. I’d consider it a rock paper scissors situation then, which is just what different classes is all about. Otherwise you could just use one singular class and be done with it. :P

the sad thing is anet will listen to them most people just can´t handle a class that can stealth, like in wow the rogue is actually the most useless class in the game but still noobs are whining about how op they are

thief is not OP,

players just dont realize the value of having toughness and vitality on their stat, and mindlessly building a glass cannon spec, and feels like that they should win most of the time,

(mind you im a ranger, but built moslty in survival and vitality,)

the key is react fast, so that you will not eat their entire damage

As far as i could see. People that whine about thief needs to develop an IQ higher than 1 digit.

Honestly,

How do you balance damage output when you have some people running around with 9k HP and some people running around with 30k.

I think they need to normalize health pools a bit better.

Actually, people complain about everything. When i run backstab build, they yell “NERFFFFF” in /w. When i run Sword/dagger, they still yell “NERFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF”. And when i use Pistol/dagger dagger/dagger for condition build, they still yell the same nonsense. I don’t consider myself MLG or something, it is just they are bad. If you want to see who is OP, play tPVP, i wonder how many thieves you will see by the 2nd and 3rd match.

glassiest of cannon classes ^.^ no need to nerf our spells more. considering making 2 mistakes = we’re down, we’re pretty nerfed already :P

Kiirin.3418:

If you’re trying to defend Assassin Signet + BS, then you’re obviously trolling. If you’re one of those thieves who know the restealth bug in spvp then you’re obviously trolling.

No one should be able to, not even a glass cannon, should be able to hit you for 10,000+ damage with backstab on a person with 3,000 armor. I play a necro and I don’t have access to all the good cc breakers or even a fear that lasts longer than 1 second. Thieves atm are the BEST at what they do. They’re not the best 1v1ers but they will kill anyone they choose with AS+BS when roaming.

We just for fun ran the pure glasscannon AS+BS and started 100-0 every possible profession within 2-4 seconds. We will be posting videos about this. So people can see how real this is.

I don’t want thieves to be overnerfed, but no class should be able to global a full on tank. For necromancers my cc breakers are on an incredibly long cd, so i don’t have them up a good amount of the time.

And this brings up any topic about a thief. I’m playing mesmer I’m about to 1v1 a Guardian it’s just a battle of endurance. As long as he/she keeps killing my clones And illusions I’m going to continue to keep my distance and slowly bring him down.

Warrior, same thing with exception I use my block skills and pop a clone after I block.

Rangers? Feedback bubble when they start rapid firing at me and make them kill themselves.

Elementailist….. Throw a cripple illusion, confusion stack and just have my pistol illusion kill them off. (Actually bring them down the fastest for some reason)

Necro’s (Hardly see them but I’m sure they drop the same.)

Engineers- Same issue has Rangers I just feedback and take them out

Thiefs- . . . The moment I see them stealth (I’m playing zomg zomg better dodge now and how he is already attacking me.) Using pulse wave to make sure he isn’t near me again. Oh wait. kitten he restealth I can’t target him so now I’m using my stealth simply because I CAN’T target him. If I can’t target him, none of my defensive skills are enabled for use. Once my stealth is down I’m a sitting suck.

you don’t have to be a sitting duck. you can be a moving duck! run in circles or somethin backstab’s hard because 1) meelee 2) have to stab in back :P

Minx.7521:

you don’t have to be a sitting duck. you can be a moving duck! run in circles or somethin backstab’s hard because 1) meelee 2) have to stab in back :P

You forgot the fact that untraited stealth movement is slow, so once the initial closer is dodged the thief likely won’t catch up for a backstab unless they drop stealth or use a shadowstep of some kind (which has an accompanying graphical indicator, even if the thief is stealthed. When people lose track of the thief due to stealth they tend to think that means the thief could be anywhere superfast, when generally thief mobility is greatly lowered during stealth.

It is easy for someone who has played a thief to say “Just read their movement and anticipate their likely location to kill them in stealth”, but after practice you really can usually figure out where the thief is or where they’re headed based on the situation. Stealth is far from invulnerability, especially in obvious situations like a thief stealthing for a stomp/revive (they’re next to the downed guy), using shadow’s refuge (the vast majority of the time they’re still standing in it), heading through an obvious chokepoint (just AE the chokepoint), or closing on you (they’re going to be somewhere between where you saw them last and exactly where you are). It is a good thief’s job to make themselves harder to read, but many thieves are getting away with terrible and predictable behavior because people just throw up their hands when they lose their target and start picking their nose.

Minx.7521:

you don’t have to be a sitting duck. you can be a moving duck! run in circles or somethin backstab’s hard because 1) meelee 2) have to stab in back :P

Well duh…I am moving around. There was literally ONE skill I could depend on fighting a thief but I literally a window of killing a thief if it didn’t I had to go back on the offensive…Turning them into a Bird. Half the time if I turn them into the bird and don’t kill them, they flee. (Worse mistake anyone can do is chase after them…) So I let that person flee and I carefully watch them run away before I leave.

I think most classes have a knockdown spell of some sort :P For me, I can pretty much get away with anything with my utilities + shortbow <3 BUT the pain piles when i’m knockeddown. As for mesmers, if you can’t beat em, run away, pop out 2 illusions, then use ur invis to run away

I really don’t understand the problem with AS + BS….

What exactly is the problem here?

Are you kittening crying because a glass thief counters other glass classes, and you can’t run your glass cannon build, and be unstoppable, so you have to target the counter for glass cannon builds?

Plain and simple, a glass cannon thief is a counter to any other glass cannon class. Period. That’s it. That’s what we do, people.

You know, when I am running around in sPvP and I am set up for backstabs, maybe 1/4 people I AS + BS on take more than 7-8k damage. That’s a pure dps spec, as well. Out of those 1/4, about 1/4 of them will make it here to the forums to kittening cry about it.

What happens to the other 3? They are people like me who realize “that’s what I get for running a glass cannon build. Touche. I’ll be ready next time”

I challenge any of you crybabies to run a GC thief build, and truly be effective with it.

It requires a certain style of play, and believe it or not, it’s not always as easy as it sounds to “pick your fights”. Sometimes you’re stuck with what you got, and if that, what you got, happens to be you engaging in a fight outside of stealth against a survivable class that knows what they’re doing…. well then that’s GG. Every time.

Thieves kill people, and they do it effectively. That’s our role, people.

Why is it so wrong that we are able to slip into a 2 v 2, correctly pick your target, and put em to the ground instantly, THE WAY YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO AS A THIEF, thus changing the battle in our teams favor, but it’s absolutely ok for a guardian to walk into the same fight, full heal everyone on his team, and turn it in his favor? Something seems wrong with that picture.

Seriously, crybabies, give it a try. I have a feeling you will be sorely disappointed in how often you will get caught, snared, stunned, etc outside of stealth, and how once that happens there isn’t kitten you can do but die… and die much faster than you are able to kill someone.

@Genocide
No i’m saying a GC thief with AS/BS shouldn’t be able to global a 3k armored profession who tries to build tanky and sacrifices damage to be more tanky.

Also i only talk in the context of tPvP, on Khylo where it is about divide and conquer there is no profession better than the thief to basically kill someone in 2 seconds and then run to the next point while the bunker stomps.

If you are seriously saying that 11k backstab is fair on a 3k armored player then I guess I have much more to learn about fighting against thieves. Either way my team like any high tier team is now also running a AS+BS roaming thief until they’re somewhat tweaked.

I cannot agree AS+BS is neccesary in Khylo i as daze thief, i can tottaly nulify bunker guardian if i manage to steal+ land 1 hit out of stealt ,, it adds up to 8 second daze + scorpion wire and you just kitten their defender if he tries to defend or is forced to leave point, which is still a win. However ive seen Engis outperform that with insane knockback skills.

Genocide.8275:

I really don’t understand the problem with AS + BS….

What exactly is the problem here?

Are you kittening crying because a glass thief counters other glass classes, and you can’t run your glass cannon build, and be unstoppable, so you have to target the counter for glass cannon builds?

Plain and simple, a glass cannon thief is a counter to any other glass cannon class. Period. That’s it. That’s what we do, people.

You know, when I am running around in sPvP and I am set up for backstabs, maybe 1/4 people I AS + BS on take more than 7-8k damage. That’s a pure dps spec, as well. Out of those 1/4, about 1/4 of them will make it here to the forums to kittening cry about it.

What happens to the other 3? They are people like me who realize “that’s what I get for running a glass cannon build. Touche. I’ll be ready next time”

I challenge any of you crybabies to run a GC thief build, and truly be effective with it.

It requires a certain style of play, and believe it or not, it’s not always as easy as it sounds to “pick your fights”. Sometimes you’re stuck with what you got, and if that, what you got, happens to be you engaging in a fight outside of stealth against a survivable class that knows what they’re doing…. well then that’s GG. Every time.

Thieves kill people, and they do it effectively. That’s our role, people.

Why is it so wrong that we are able to slip into a 2 v 2, correctly pick your target, and put em to the ground instantly, THE WAY YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO AS A THIEF, thus changing the battle in our teams favor, but it’s absolutely ok for a guardian to walk into the same fight, full heal everyone on his team, and turn it in his favor? Something seems wrong with that picture.

Seriously, crybabies, give it a try. I have a feeling you will be sorely disappointed in how often you will get caught, snared, stunned, etc outside of stealth, and how once that happens there isn’t kitten you can do but die… and die much faster than you are able to kill someone.

It has been shown again and again that this is not true. A backstab thief can pretty much kill everyone not going full bunker and those are brought low enough that Heartseeker can finish them off easily.

And the only chance to defend yourself against that is guessing correctly when the thief is going to combo or, when you have not noticed the thief getting into range, using the right ability within <1 second and that small chance was only patched in 2 weeks ago. If you do not manage that you are dead. No other class boasts this much of killing power coupled with the lack of defenses against it which is also coupled with a lot of survivability on the side of the thief thanks to stealth.

And in PvP everyones job is to kill other characters, thieves are just much, much better than most other classes which is pretty much the definition of OP.

Pushing 3 buttons to get 20k instagib from far range (C&D→STEAL→BS), and then stealth finally drops after you start stomping on a non glass cannon Ele.