Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Chrispytoast.3698

Chrispytoast.3698

PvE:

  • Direct Damage – One of the best because mobs do not move or defend well (Great)
  • Condition Damage – Only bleeds, difficult to reach 25 stacks (OK/Good)
  • Healing – Not great but can keep you alive for the most part (OK)
  • Boons – Good attacking boons helps kill things faster (Good)
  • Defense – Mobs attack slow so blocking and dodging key attacks is easy (Good)
  • Sustain – Able to kill things quickly and OK heals (OK/Good)

PvP

  • Direct Damage – Attacks either root the Warrior or are telegraphed and easy to dodge (OK)
  • Condition Damage – Conditions are easily removed by players (Bad/OK)
  • Healing – Worst in PvP (Bad)
  • Boons – No defensive boons (OK)
  • Defense – Protective skills have long cooldowns that may save you in one fight but will die in next. (Bad/OK)
  • Sustain – LolWut? – Warrior will lose a 1v1 against almost any competent player of a different profession. (Bad)

Totals
PvE: Good
PvP: Bad/OK

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Posted by: Rissou.7213

Rissou.7213

Is it just me? But I think our shout healing is pretty good healing.

1500-2200 healing per shout x3 every 20 second, depending on healing power, so thats an extra 4500-6600 heal ontop of normal heal.

If we just had protection boon, then we would be monsters ^^

Thief.

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Posted by: Rissou.7213

Rissou.7213

Well yeah, I guess. But I think shout healing is OK, not as BAD as chrispytoast says in his PvP summary!

Thief.

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Posted by: Tyrion.4259

Tyrion.4259

Hi Rissou that’s not the point which really isn’t captured above. Nicknamenick was mentioning something else to line up the warrior’s strengths and it’s really the opportunity cost. If we spec to be shout heal we get impacted elsewhere. We loose too much utility and are pigeon-holed to be a weak support healer with no real down strength.

It’s not as black and white as Chrispytoast lines it up.

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Posted by: Grounder.7381

Grounder.7381

warrior feels kinda heavy and sluggish when played compare to other classes.
the high dmg numbers the warrior produce are kinda enticing.
the warrior survivability compare to classes that can produce protection feels pale in comparison..
under pressure, i actually feels weaker when playing a warrior compare to playing other classes… and a used few resource usually means death, or running around like a chicken..

(edited by Grounder.7381)

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Posted by: Daecollo.9578

Daecollo.9578

its 1020 healing without healing power.

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Posted by: Opynn.2936

Opynn.2936

Healing shouts warrior is just bad.
You waste 30 points in Tactics to get useless minor traits – 1 stack of might when you revive someone whoa! and thats for 25 points spent ( 25!). To be effective healer you want to take Lung Capacity. And then you end up using your shouts to heal not to use their primary effect- FGJ should be used before fight, Shake it off should be used to break stun or remove anoying condition, On my mark before fight (or to maximize burst). And than you realize that guardian can heal better and you are just guardian wannabe and you should reroll and make guardian.

Gettin back to topic.
Warrior master of mele combat in a game where everyone have can move away by the use of dodge. You get gap closers that are clunky, buged and affected by condtions that slow you down. You are a Warrior- big( or if asura- small) bag of hp slowy moving to your foe bombarded by deadly dots. You get class specific trait line with Brawn- awesome 3% more damage to your burst skill that you will better not youse becasue you will lose silly regen, 12% more damage and 9% critical chance. You get high hp and high tougness but other classes get protection boon and just laugh at your silly 3k armor.

You are a warrior and other classes envy you because you can farm cof p1 lika a boss.

I love my warrior. In fact i dont have any other lvl 80. Im getting close to 1700h. I think i have some mental disorder.

Opyrr[GoT] Warrior

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Posted by: BossFi.6917

BossFi.6917

I don’t play warrior but I kill them faster than any other class in a 1 v 1. Something is seriously wrong with warrior. I think they need more base health or something.

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Posted by: Chrispytoast.3698

Chrispytoast.3698

I don’t play warrior but I kill them faster than any other class in a 1 v 1. Something is seriously wrong with warrior. I think they need more base health or something.

More health is pointless when you can do nothing to protect it.

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Posted by: Aarean.5398

Aarean.5398

I don’t play warrior but I kill them faster than any other class in a 1 v 1. Something is seriously wrong with warrior. I think they need more base health or something.

More health is pointless when you can do nothing to protect it.

I beg to differ. If they made our base hp pool 50k i think we could handle 1v1s better! Maybe challenge equal skilled players

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Posted by: Daecollo.9578

Daecollo.9578

I don’t play warrior but I kill them faster than any other class in a 1 v 1. Something is seriously wrong with warrior. I think they need more base health or something.

More health is pointless when you can do nothing to protect it.

I beg to differ. If they made our base hp pool 50k i think we could handle 1v1s better! Maybe challenge equal skilled players

Well, our trait’s secondary stats are so horribly placed around our trees that we don’t even make up for it. Brawn does absolutely nothing yet we have to place at least 20 points in discipline to be worth anything. That is -200 in stats (-2000 health.) right there…

Greatsword warriors ‘must’ get 25 in arms tree, that is -250 in stats (2500 health.) right there…

Not many other classes have useless stats they can’t relocate or place.

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Posted by: Chrispytoast.3698

Chrispytoast.3698

I am pretty sure that most Warriors do not want to be turned into the Dungeon mobs that have super high health but are not challenging at all. Players want to have their personal skill affect the gameplay. I want to be able to use abilities at the right time to save my life and not be a sitting duck afterwards.

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Posted by: Lahm.7056

Lahm.7056

There’s no use trying to compete with a Guardian’s sustainability because that’s their trademark, not the Warrior’s.

I found the best way to keep myself alive is by avoiding/negating damage all together instead of investing in ways to sustain myself (banner regen, shout heals, healing signet passive, etc) with Endure pain trait and utility skill version and an offhand shield, those used at the right moment will do a lot more than the best sustain we could ever have.

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Posted by: Forzani.2584

Forzani.2584

Healing shouts warrior is just bad.


You are a warrior and other classes envy you because you can farm cof p1 lika a boss.

I love my warrior. In fact i dont have any other lvl 80. Im getting close to 1700h. I think i have some mental disorder.

Now that made me laugh

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Posted by: Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

its 1020 healing without healing power.

It’s 1192 without healing power.

Also, it heals allies.

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Posted by: Daecollo.9578

Daecollo.9578

its 1020 healing without healing power.

It’s 1192 without healing power.

Also, it heals allies.

Oh yeah sorry. I just wanted to state that it wasn’t 2-3k, Yes it does heal allies but the problem is it takes 30 in a tree.

Guardians have abilities that heal allies just from there autoattacks, which heal for the same if not more then shout heals do when both have no healing power.

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Posted by: Warlord.9074

Warlord.9074

Your looking things wrong, you dont spec to be healing warrior, you play as if you were just a healing warrior. When you spec to that you spec yourself to a well armored, fairly powered cc warrior with strong physical damage migitation, ok condition removal and access to regenerate health to himself and his allies at required time with minimal effort. Plus support warrior can also give wings(vigor/swiftness) to those in party who have not included them in their own builds.
I cant see how any class lacks survivability if it is able to solo highlevel champions and bosses with melee weapons.
If you only see healing power from cleric stats then your other eye must be closed.
I also use oftenly build that makes me paper with sharp edges and i use build that makes me last and keep everyone around me alive including myself. So im just quessing that either your builds does not work or you have not completely embraced its potential yet.

Your wrong and this is why.

Point #1
“fairly powered cc” On paper in practice the power is weak, becasue you have sacrificed all of your power to heal for 1k per shout. You have picked up in the process many useless minor traits wasting your potential. Your weapon swaps are very slow. Causing a majority of your attacks to be auto attacks. probably with a hammer which is very slow. You have a aoe immobilize but thats not really stopping compitent players. You have earth shaker but your burst skills have long cool downs. you have a single target knockdown and an aoe knock back thats not stopping anyone with stability or stun breakers. you have an aoe fear thats on an 80 sec CD and again its not stopping competent players. Adding this all up its not as good in practice as in reality.

Point #2 Condition removal. You have condi removal but besides shake it off it only removes 1 condi. If you remove immobilize and get immobilized again after that you will get shut down. There is no prioritization in the condi removal if you have a blled and a chill on you a lot of cases it will remove the bleed not the chill for example. You still end up getting shut down.

Point #3 the traited warhorn skills are great but that has nothing to do with being a shout build.

Point#4 becasue all of the reasons I stated above most warriors are moving away from shout builds to melandru builds.

Point#6 Once you go a shout build you are married to those utilities and that armor and you cannot fill any other roll you cannot remove conditions without that spec. you have caused yourself to have no utility and less damage and a way to remve condis that doesn’t that great but that works. You have basically kitten yourself for subpar condi removal and bad healing that wont really stop you from getting bursted down.

“Just press 2 to win all the dps was us cuz we’re a
warrior and we’re the best class” Eugene

(edited by Warlord.9074)

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Posted by: Air.3154

Air.3154

I just find ridiculous that in a game where everybody can be everything warriors can’t be tanky for nothing.

i have nearly 3k toughness yet i still get 2shotted by dungeon bosses or by vets and champs. It’s ridiculous.

We have no protection and our defensive traits are laughable, not to mention our only defensive skill with a shield lasts barely 3 seconds and takes over 20 seconds to recharge :\

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Posted by: Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

I love how people will pick apart a build saying what it can’t do, ignore what it can and then blame the class for their shortcomings.

Granted, I think Warrior could use some help in some departments, but the least you guys could do is admit you just aren’t very good at playing the class or that a well played warrior can do the things you say it can’t period.

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Posted by: ThirtyOne.3976

ThirtyOne.3976

The Warrior in my view is in nowhere near as a bad place as people make out, they have great survivability with very little repercussions and the damage ain’t half bad either. The problem is the Warrior lacks a lot of versatility when trying to make better use of their strengths, which is something no other class suffers as much as the Warrior. I actually think the Warrior is better for most users when they try to increase the range of it’s versatility rather than sticking to one or two acts.

I’ll never say it’s a players fault, I don’t genuinely know how good they are at playing the game, but I will say don’t be afraid to try and work around your own shortcomings rather than the classes. Everyone is different, just like those who swear by shout healing, or melandru runes for condition draining, they found those things work for them. My own personal killer is conditions, I detest having lingering conditions that I can’t clear or being controlled via immobilize or chill, so I run shouts clear conditions and warhorn conversion, and often find I’m a fair survivor in group warfare being fairly mobile support and damage. My point is I cover my own hinderance so I can remain effective as I’d like.

Save my heart tomorrow.

(edited by ThirtyOne.3976)

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Posted by: Varonth.5830

Varonth.5830

Your wrong and this is why.

Point #1
“fairly powered cc” On paper in practice the power is weak, becasue you have sacrificed all of your power to heal for 1k per shout. You have picked up in the process many useless minor traits wasting your potential. Your weapon swaps are very slow. Causing a majority of your attacks to be auto attacks. probably with a hammer which is very slow. You have a aoe immobilize but thats not really stopping compitent players. You have earth shaker but your burst skills have long cool downs. you have a single target knockdown and an aoe knock back thats not stopping anyone with stability or stun breakers. you have an aoe fear thats on an 80 sec CD and again its not stopping competent players. Adding this all up its not as good in practice as in reality.

Point #2 Condition removal. You have condi removal but besides shake it off it only removes 1 condi. If you remove immobilize and get immobilized again after that you will get shut down. There is no prioritization in the condi removal if you have a blled and a chill on you a lot of cases it will remove the bleed not the chill for example. You still end up getting shut down.

Point #3 the traited warhorn skills are great but that has nothing to do with being a shout build.

Point#4 becasue all of the reasons I stated above most warriors are moving away from shout builds to melandru builds.

Point#6 Once you go a shout build you are married to those utilities and that armor and you cannot fill any other roll you cannot remove conditions without that spec. you have caused yourself to have no utility and less damage and a way to remve condis that doesn’t that great but that works. You have basically kitten yourself for subpar condi removal and bad healing that wont really stop you from getting bursted down.

I hate to repeat this over and over and over, but Hammer isn’t that much slower. It’s ~10% slower then greatsword autoattack, but on the same time it deals:

  • 28.7%
  • 28.7%
  • 33.3%

more damage than the greatsword autoattack.
So the actual DPS is higher on Hammer autoattack then it is on GS autoattack.

Since you are speccing into tactics, you give up no traitpoint when taking the warhorn convert trait, a reason why shout healing often goes hand in hand with warhorn condi remove.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNBiYDbE0J5t5x6hJOAcKok6RbwFX6hYslGA-TkAA0CvIySllLLTWyssZNQA

Yes, you can actually use valkyrie’s because with unsuspecting foe, you get a 81-88% chance to critical strike stunned foes.
I should note, that the Sigil of Paralyzation actually adds 1s to Earthshaker not 15% (well 15% would be worthless, as it wouldn’t affect any skill), so it becomes a 3s AoE stun.

It also allows for different modifications. Want more sustained/burst damage? Well switch out leg specialist for empowered (2% per boon, basically you get damage boosts like eles but without the low base damage).

Want to use your burst skills less often but have boonhate? No problem, not change in traitpoints needed.

More Signet use? Well 2 possible choices to change.
More shouts but less condi remove/boon giving from warhorn? Also available.

You can also switch your second weapon. Sword is the maximum mobility option with good control via Flurry.
Mace is the maximum CC option with another 3s stun (sigil again) and 1s daze.
Axe is the maximum DPS option, with Eviscerate and probably the highest autoattack damage (which you could also use after stunning the enemy via earthshaker, for extreme critrate).

And don’t forget, your shouts aren’t just heals for you. They give you good boons, with long durations (30% bonus duration). They give those to allies (and there are classes and builds with really bad access to fury). You are also healing these allies. And you are removing conditions aswell.
That build is not made for bunkering. It is made to clear a guarded point, even if guarded by multiple enemies with your team.

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Posted by: Lorelei.3918

Lorelei.3918

Kill Shot Warrior – A nightmare in WvW if he targets you. Can crit for 20K+ and can follow it up with significant dps. Excellent Mobility.

Longbow Warrior – Massive AoE output, vicious dps when built right. Good team support via shouts/banners. Excellent Mobility.

Axe warrior – A nuclear warhead that goes BOOM and people die. Excellent Mobility.

Hammer Warrior – A essential part of any zerg, the hammer warrior is a line breaker that kittens enemy zergs ability to use skills or get away. So-So mobility.

Greatsword warrior – Used to be very good. Not so much anymore thanks to quickness nerf and people getting wise to them.

You want to know something….

Many classes are stuck with just 2 or 3 viable builds. I just listed 5 and there are many variations of each of these. I feel like your entire rant came from you trying to trot a GS warrior into pvp and getting your rear end handed to you.

You pvp long enough you will know when to dodge, and then our vigor access becomes important. You will also come to understand that immobilize = death and we are one of the best classes at escaping them. We also apply them liberally. We have access to stability, another key defensive boon. What good is protection if you spend a entire fight sitting on your butt? What good are heals if all of your team mates have died around you? Sustain shmustain, maintain initiative and control the fight and you won’t even need to heal. Most people play in a very cowardly way as if dying had any real repercussions. If you are a warrior you should be feckless, fearless, and ready to do as much damage as you can to the enemy as fast as you can to as many as you can. Do that and even if you lose the battle, the war will be won.

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Posted by: Warlord.9074

Warlord.9074

Your wrong and this is why.

Point #1
“fairly powered cc” On paper in practice the power is weak, becasue you have sacrificed all of your power to heal for 1k per shout. You have picked up in the process many useless minor traits wasting your potential. Your weapon swaps are very slow. Causing a majority of your attacks to be auto attacks. probably with a hammer which is very slow. You have a aoe immobilize but thats not really stopping compitent players. You have earth shaker but your burst skills have long cool downs. you have a single target knockdown and an aoe knock back thats not stopping anyone with stability or stun breakers. you have an aoe fear thats on an 80 sec CD and again its not stopping competent players. Adding this all up its not as good in practice as in reality.

Point #2 Condition removal. You have condi removal but besides shake it off it only removes 1 condi. If you remove immobilize and get immobilized again after that you will get shut down. There is no prioritization in the condi removal if you have a blled and a chill on you a lot of cases it will remove the bleed not the chill for example. You still end up getting shut down.

Point #3 the traited warhorn skills are great but that has nothing to do with being a shout build.

Point#4 becasue all of the reasons I stated above most warriors are moving away from shout builds to melandru builds.

Point#6 Once you go a shout build you are married to those utilities and that armor and you cannot fill any other roll you cannot remove conditions without that spec. you have caused yourself to have no utility and less damage and a way to remve condis that doesn’t that great but that works. You have basically kitten yourself for subpar condi removal and bad healing that wont really stop you from getting bursted down.

I hate to repeat this over and over and over, but Hammer isn’t that much slower. It’s ~10% slower then greatsword autoattack, but on the same time it deals:

  • 28.7%
  • 28.7%
  • 33.3%

more damage than the greatsword autoattack.
So the actual DPS is higher on Hammer autoattack then it is on GS autoattack.

Since you are speccing into tactics, you give up no traitpoint when taking the warhorn convert trait, a reason why shout healing often goes hand in hand with warhorn condi remove.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNBiYDbE0J5t5x6hJOAcKok6RbwFX6hYslGA-TkAA0CvIySllLLTWyssZNQA

Yes, you can actually use valkyrie’s because with unsuspecting foe, you get a 81-88% chance to critical strike stunned foes.
I should note, that the Sigil of Paralyzation actually adds 1s to Earthshaker not 15% (well 15% would be worthless, as it wouldn’t affect any skill), so it becomes a 3s AoE stun.

It also allows for different modifications. Want more sustained/burst damage? Well switch out leg specialist for empowered (2% per boon, basically you get damage boosts like eles but without the low base damage).

Want to use your burst skills less often but have boonhate? No problem, not change in traitpoints needed.

More Signet use? Well 2 possible choices to change.
More shouts but less condi remove/boon giving from warhorn? Also available.

You can also switch your second weapon. Sword is the maximum mobility option with good control via Flurry.
Mace is the maximum CC option with another 3s stun (sigil again) and 1s daze.
Axe is the maximum DPS option, with Eviscerate and probably the highest autoattack damage (which you could also use after stunning the enemy via earthshaker, for extreme critrate).

And don’t forget, your shouts aren’t just heals for you. They give you good boons, with long durations (30% bonus duration). They give those to allies (and there are classes and builds with really bad access to fury). You are also healing these allies. And you are removing conditions aswell.
That build is not made for bunkering. It is made to clear a guarded point, even if guarded by multiple enemies with your team.

Hammer is not only slower but its auto attacks are slower. This is the biggest deal breaker on the hammer. Guess what both 100blades, and Eviscerate do more damage in 1 skill than a hammer does in every singe skill combined. I dont know where you get your math from.

B: Hammer doesnt have nearly as many damage modifiers. Hammer cant stack might on critical for one. Hammer is absolutely slower and does less damage than an Axe and a GS. In fact Rifles do more damage than hammers even.

“Just press 2 to win all the dps was us cuz we’re a
warrior and we’re the best class” Eugene

(edited by Warlord.9074)

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Posted by: Lalangamena.3694

Lalangamena.3694

Kill Shot Warrior – A nightmare in WvW if he targets you. Can crit for 20K+ and can follow it up with significant dps. Excellent Mobility.

Longbow Warrior – Massive AoE output, vicious dps when built right. Good team support via shouts/banners. Excellent Mobility.

Axe warrior – A nuclear warhead that goes BOOM and people die. Excellent Mobility.

Hammer Warrior – A essential part of any zerg, the hammer warrior is a line breaker that kittens enemy zergs ability to use skills or get away. So-So mobility.

Greatsword warrior – Used to be very good. Not so much anymore thanks to quickness nerf and people getting wise to them.

You want to know something….

Many classes are stuck with just 2 or 3 viable builds. I just listed 5 and there are many variations of each of these. I feel like your entire rant came from you trying to trot a GS warrior into pvp and getting your rear end handed to you.

You pvp long enough you will know when to dodge, and then our vigor access becomes important. You will also come to understand that immobilize = death and we are one of the best classes at escaping them. We also apply them liberally. We have access to stability, another key defensive boon. What good is protection if you spend a entire fight sitting on your butt? What good are heals if all of your team mates have died around you? Sustain shmustain, maintain initiative and control the fight and you won’t even need to heal. Most people play in a very cowardly way as if dying had any real repercussions. If you are a warrior you should be feckless, fearless, and ready to do as much damage as you can to the enemy as fast as you can to as many as you can. Do that and even if you lose the battle, the war will be won.

quoted for truth.

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Posted by: Varonth.5830

Varonth.5830

Hammer is not only slower but its auto attacks are slower. This is the biggest deal breaker on the hammer. Guess what both 100blades, and Eviscerate do more damage in 1 skill than a hammer does in every singe skill combined. I dont know where you get your math from.

B: Hammer doesnt have nearly as many damage modifiers. Hammer cant stack might on critical for one. Hammer is absolutely slower and does less damage than an Axe and a GS. In fact Rifles do more damage than hammers even.

Ingame numbers and frapsing every single autoattack, using the actual amount of frames of the attack animations. This is the most accurate you can measure attack speed.

And yes, hammer doesn’t have 2 traits to improve it’s damage, but even with those two traits, and well you are giving up 2 traits, the actual DPS of a greatsword is still lower.

Regarding Eviscerate, I will just add the numbers of one autoattack chain:
668+668+891 = 2227
Eviscerate 3 Bar on the same warrior = 2023

Relative numbers = 2227/2023 = 1.10 = 110%

It does however deal less damage than a full 100B. But how common is it to hit a full 100B on a player. And don’t forget, the hammer chain does have 0 cooldown. The rest of the hammer is on it to support the #1 chain. That’s why it is a sustained damage weapon. Because it’s actual damage can be applied over and over and over… non stop mid damage.

Hammer doesn’t have the burst of 100b, but it has higher sustained. Due to the fact, that it already has stun and knockdown on the weapon itself, you don’t have to take stuff like bull’s charge for example. So you can actually take utilities which help you survive longer, and use the sustained damage of your hammer more effectively.

By no means, I ever said it is a burst weapon.
And not everyone has to burst. Phantasm mesmers, all sort of condi builds, basically any Ele, even guardians… they all are sustained DDs, who will deal damage over time, and if they get their target to a certain percentage they have access to small burst, often paired with stuns/immobilize.

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Posted by: Warlord.9074

Warlord.9074

Dont think so my average eviscerate is 8k with knights gear a melandru runes. Someone on here just posted a vid of hitting 12k eviscerates in spvp think again. The biggest thing you are forgetin is players who don’t spec shouts can spec much more points in precision str and crit damage. the auto attack on and axe is 1/4 1/4 1/2 mace is 1/2 1/2 1/2 you are also leaving out whirlwind attack on GS which can hit very high.

The last part you are leaving out is a hammer warrior is easily the easyest target becasue they are the most sus-acceptable to be kited.

“Just press 2 to win all the dps was us cuz we’re a
warrior and we’re the best class” Eugene

(edited by Warlord.9074)

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Posted by: Varonth.5830

Varonth.5830

Dont think so my average eviscerate is 8k with knights gear a melandru runes. Someone on here just posted a vid of hitting 12k eviscerates in spvp think again. The biggest thing you are forgetin is players who don’t spec shouts can spec much more points in precision str and crit damage. the auto attack on and axe is 1/4 1/4 1/2 mace is 1/2 1/2 1/2 you are also leaving out whirlwind attack on GS which can hit very high.

The last part you are leaving out is a hammer warrior is easily the easyest target becasue they are the most sus-acceptable to be kited.

You don’t take the eviscerate number you see when hitting something. There are far too many variables, which modify the damage, like toughness and your actual dice role on the damage (you know, your weapon have variable damage, and you can crit between X and Y damage).
The actual damage done to target is higher then those 668 and 891. I can crit between 2-3.5k without the hammer damage trait. My highest hit from the third skill in the chain was a 4k crit so far (again without hammer trait, but with Empowered). The same target also got crit 3k crits from the other attacks, so 3k+3k+4k ~= 10k.

That would equal an ~9k eviscerate on the same target, in the same moment. The eviscerate would have been a bit lower, but faster applied to the target (but at the cost of the adrenaline). That is why this is called a burst, and the other one is sustained.

You compare tooltip damages to get the relative strength between skills. The tooltips don’t care for stuff like the different possible damage numbers or vulstacks on your target, or crit/non crit (most important factor).

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Posted by: Forzani.2584

Forzani.2584

I trust tooltips as much as my local politician.

When someone uses the word ‘Meta’, a kitten dies. Don’t do it.

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: shimzor.6057

shimzor.6057

Kill Shot Warrior – A nightmare in WvW if he targets you. Can crit for 20K+ and can follow it up with significant dps. Excellent Mobility.

Longbow Warrior – Massive AoE output, vicious dps when built right. Good team support via shouts/banners. Excellent Mobility.

Axe warrior – A nuclear warhead that goes BOOM and people die. Excellent Mobility.

Did i get this? Rifle, LB and Axe have Excellent mobility?

OP already said PVE is good, warrior is bad in PvP.

Many classes are stuck with just 2 or 3 viable builds. I just listed 5 and there are many variations of each of these. I feel like your entire rant came from you trying to trot a GS warrior into pvp and getting your rear end handed to you.

You pvp long enough you will know when to dodge, and then our vigor access becomes important. You will also come to understand that immobilize = death and we are one of the best classes at escaping them. We also apply them liberally. We have access to stability, another key defensive boon. What good is protection if you spend a entire fight sitting on your butt? What good are heals if all of your team mates have died around you? Sustain shmustain, maintain initiative and control the fight and you won’t even need to heal. Most people play in a very cowardly way as if dying had any real repercussions. If you are a warrior you should be feckless, fearless, and ready to do as much damage as you can to the enemy as fast as you can to as many as you can. Do that and even if you lose the battle, the war will be won.

BTW, have you ever tryed PvP (crossed swords then click on “go tohearth of the mist”)?

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Lighter.5631

Lighter.5631

you missed PvE high end like fotm 40 + and it should be like this

Direct Damage – One of the best because mobs do not move or defend well (Great)
Condition Damage – Only bleeds, capped at 25 and other profs have bleeds too (OK)
Healing – Ok heal (OK/Good)
Boons – No defensive boons (OK)
Defense – Protective skills have long cooldowns that may save you in one fight but will die in next. (Bad/OK)
Sustain – LolWut? no protection no evade nothing (Bad)

“i think it’s an underserved nerf. now we have to slot a stun breaker??”
“berserker stance clears all CC on you and you’re still immune to CC for 8 seconds”
-Excalibur.9748

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Navzar.2938

Navzar.2938

Well if you’re running healing shouts, you’ll probably being running cleric’s gear right? So you’ll be healing around 2k a shout. I don’t think the trait itself is bad, it’s pretty decent for a grandmaster level. The problem is that the minor traits in that line kind of suck.

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Warlord.9074

Warlord.9074

Well if you’re running healing shouts, you’ll probably being running cleric’s gear right? So you’ll be healing around 2k a shout. I don’t think the trait itself is bad, it’s pretty decent for a grandmaster level. The problem is that the minor traits in that line kind of suck.

Right so not only is your dps and your weapon dps bad but now your dps is just awefull becasue your weaning clerics gear. GG you can have all the healing in the world but if you cant kill anyone than it makes no difference. And get kited and ganked. I really think your warrior should stick with the zerg becasue its the only thing saving you from death and its killing everything for you.

“Just press 2 to win all the dps was us cuz we’re a
warrior and we’re the best class” Eugene

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

Condition Damage – Only bleeds, capped at 25 and other profs have bleeds too (OK)

There are only 4 damaging conditions, 3 of which that are actually good at dealing damage…
Confusion: really only Engineer and Mesmer can use these effectively.
Poison: doesn’t do much damage regardless of condition damage boosting.
Bleed: warrior can be set up to apply this well.
Burn: longbow does this pretty nicely too.

So what exactly is with the complain of “only bleeds” for?

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Warlord.9074

Warlord.9074

Condition Damage – Only bleeds, capped at 25 and other profs have bleeds too (OK)

There are only 4 damaging conditions, 3 of which that are actually good at dealing damage…
Confusion: really only Engineer and Mesmer can use these effectively.
Poison: doesn’t do much damage regardless of condition damage boosting.
Bleed: warrior can be set up to apply this well.
Burn: longbow does this pretty nicely too.

So what exactly is with the complain of “only bleeds” for?

My biggest gripe about bleeds a condition builds in general. For a warrior to get decent condition damage to make the condition damage viable. It loses raw DPS. Once that happens and a warrior applies lets say a 25 stack blled to an enemy, the enemy then clears the condition. Now were are at the stage where you cant just re apply the 25 stacks of bleed becasue you threw everything out there to get it. And you dont have raw dps or basic attack damage. So its veryy gimpy to build they way.

I have tried this build in wvw. It may work fine in PVE becasue mobs dont clear conditions but in pvp it doesnt work

“Just press 2 to win all the dps was us cuz we’re a
warrior and we’re the best class” Eugene

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Navzar.2938

Navzar.2938

Well if you’re running healing shouts, you’ll probably being running cleric’s gear right? So you’ll be healing around 2k a shout. I don’t think the trait itself is bad, it’s pretty decent for a grandmaster level. The problem is that the minor traits in that line kind of suck.

Right so not only is your dps and your weapon dps bad but now your dps is just awefull becasue your weaning clerics gear. GG you can have all the healing in the world but if you cant kill anyone than it makes no difference. And get kited and ganked. I really think your warrior should stick with the zerg becasue its the only thing saving you from death and its killing everything for you.

Bunkers generally don’t kill things, yet they’re still one of the best archetypes for pvp.
Anyway, what I was trying to say is that the healing shouts trait itself isn’t too bad (although a small buff wouldn’t hurt), it’s the tactics line leading up to it that doesn’t contribute enough.

(edited by Navzar.2938)

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Lighter.5631

Lighter.5631

Condition Damage – Only bleeds, capped at 25 and other profs have bleeds too (OK)

There are only 4 damaging conditions, 3 of which that are actually good at dealing damage…
Confusion: really only Engineer and Mesmer can use these effectively.
Poison: doesn’t do much damage regardless of condition damage boosting.
Bleed: warrior can be set up to apply this well.
Burn: longbow does this pretty nicely too.

So what exactly is with the complain of “only bleeds” for?

lets ignore confusion and poison not like warriors have that. if you choose to burn people lets see how many stacks of bleed you can apply, well not like you can apply alot of bleeds anyway since its capped at 25 and everyone else can apply bleed too

“i think it’s an underserved nerf. now we have to slot a stun breaker??”
“berserker stance clears all CC on you and you’re still immune to CC for 8 seconds”
-Excalibur.9748

(edited by Lighter.5631)

Warriors Strengths and Downfalls

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Posted by: Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

Condition Damage – Only bleeds, capped at 25 and other profs have bleeds too (OK)

There are only 4 damaging conditions, 3 of which that are actually good at dealing damage…
Confusion: really only Engineer and Mesmer can use these effectively.
Poison: doesn’t do much damage regardless of condition damage boosting.
Bleed: warrior can be set up to apply this well.
Burn: longbow does this pretty nicely too.

So what exactly is with the complain of “only bleeds” for?

My biggest gripe about bleeds a condition builds in general. For a warrior to get decent condition damage to make the condition damage viable. It loses raw DPS. Once that happens and a warrior applies lets say a 25 stack blled to an enemy, the enemy then clears the condition. Now were are at the stage where you cant just re apply the 25 stacks of bleed becasue you threw everything out there to get it. And you dont have raw dps or basic attack damage. So its veryy gimpy to build they way.

I have tried this build in wvw. It may work fine in PVE becasue mobs dont clear conditions but in pvp it doesnt work

A lot of people make the mistake when making a bleed build to aim for max bleed stacks and bleed damage. You don’t need max duration, you don’t need max condition damage nor do you need to focus on getting max stacks to utilize bleed well. You can balance bleed/condition with direct damage for good results. No reason you can’t do 1.5 to 2k crit autos that bleed for 110 dmg per stack…you can also put in a side-focus on condition duration to force people to cleanse while still getting off good direct damage.

Condition Damage – Only bleeds, capped at 25 and other profs have bleeds too (OK)

There are only 4 damaging conditions, 3 of which that are actually good at dealing damage…
Confusion: really only Engineer and Mesmer can use these effectively.
Poison: doesn’t do much damage regardless of condition damage boosting.
Bleed: warrior can be set up to apply this well.
Burn: longbow does this pretty nicely too.

So what exactly is with the complain of “only bleeds” for?

lets ignore confusion and poison not like warriors have that. if you choose to burn people lets see how many stacks of bleed you can apply, well not like you can apply alot of bleeds anyway since its capped at 25 and everyone else can apply bleed too

In PvE? Unless there’s a Necromancer (and even then, not always), it’s not common to have even half stacks for the majority of fights. Most people use direct damage and if they have bleeds, they run off quickly. Not that I’m advocating bleed builds in general, but it’s underutilized. If you decide to utilize them, it’s not all that common something has 25 bleed on them (until your bleed build comes in, of course).