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Posted by: arrownin.3128

arrownin.3128

I don’t know how the MMR system works. All I do know is that ever since the new influx of PvPers came about from the April 15th patch, I have been having no little to no fun in tPvP. Maybe some of you share my sentiments.

Reasons why I am not having fun is primarily due to the matchmaking system. It just feels wrong. I feel like I’m going back to rank 1 whenever I go into a tournament match. I get paired with rank 10s, rank 20s, rank 5s. Even if they’re the best player ever, they still don’t know the intricacies of PvP, how and when to ress, how and when to finish, how and when to dodge or stun or etc. They might be good at PvP, but they are nowhere near as experienced, which really makes the matches boring, and unsatisfying to play. To compare to another game, League of Legends, sure you’d get a bad player every now and again, but if you got to Silver or Gold league, you would fight against more experienced players more often than not. (Although no matchmaking system is perfect, you’d get the occasional AWFUL player).

I think the reason why new players are joining tPvP can be explained easily. Rewards. Think about it, if you do hotjoin matches, youre limited to how many track chests you unlock, in tournament matches, you dont have a limit. In tPvP you also get the same amount of rank points, (or 200 less) if you lost the match, than you’d get in a hotjoin match win. What reason do new players have to join hotjoin matches to learn? NONE.

Not playing tournament games is the least rewarding thing you can choose in tPvP, even if you’re just learning how to press the F button to finish. It seems the game’s direction is actively driving these new players towards the tournament PvP scene. Which I might add, experienced PvPers would absolutely LOVE, if not for the fact us rank 50+ have to fight these new rank 1 players every single game.

And sure, we could actively teach these new players the ins and outs of tPvP, but to do that almost every other game? I personally didn’t come to tPvP to teach people how to play, I came to play in a competitive environment with people that know how to fight.

So suggestions from me: Make ranks 1-30 gain triple or double the rank points from doing hotjoins, and for pete’s sake unlock the chest tracks for hotjoin. Also make a better, REQUIRED tutorial to teach the players where the hotjoin guy is, where the tournament pvp guy is, and the DIFFERENCE between the two. Thanks for the read guys.

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Posted by: Caccis.9087

Caccis.9087

Yes!
Before i just went on normal Game Browser servers till I was Doly rank cause i did not see reason to try soloq. Now after patch i did heard from my friend you get tracks done so much faster soloq started to sound very nice, but after 10 matches i get dudes who have played even less than me(like srsly just started pvp) or i get some Dragon ranks vs me.

As someone who is Diamond in LoL i find this srsly kittend up and would like to know what kind of matchmaking this game has. I would love to learn this game but matches can be really random. : D

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Posted by: Chase.8415

Chase.8415

The reason I am having fun is because of the matchmaking system. This is amazing compared to random arenas in guild wars classic, where there was no ranking and the team without a healer always lost except in rare cases.

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Posted by: jportell.2197

jportell.2197

The reason I am having fun is because of the matchmaking system. This is amazing compared to random arenas in guild wars classic, where there was no ranking and the team without a healer always lost except in rare cases.

yeah except now you have people that play the dumbest tactics costing you the match.

For instance earlier today I had a soloque with a ranger that said “I’m going to solo far don’t come.”
I say in chat… “Please don’t just reinforce home and mid instead.” He replied that he knows he could do it and to just win the team fight… Well we win the team fight… He dies and because we needed our bunker to reinforce the team fight he had to leave home which got decapped and our ranger died.

So started the match out two capped…. I begged the ranger “We have mid please just help get home back and hold mid.” Once again the ranger ressed pushed far and died again…. Meanwhile he is raging at our entire team because we don’t have home back yet…. Well in a team fight on a capped point the advantage is almost always in favor of the team that has it capped. We didn’t want to pull our bunker off of mid to help the fight because then it would have been back capped (we couldn’t rotate anyone because the ranger insisted on pushing far solo over and over and over.)

At the end of the match our entire team is calling the ranger out for costing us and he is calling me out for being a “bad dragon rank” because I called him out on a stupid tactic that wouldn’t work.

TLDR: Pvp is not very fun right now because matchmaking is bad and people think they are MLG pros and can solo an MM bunker as a zerker ranger…. You can’t fix *S*T*U*P*I*D*

Johnny The Gray
GASM’s Bunker Mesmer

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Posted by: Rage.9723

Rage.9723

On the contrary when you get to a higher percentile rank matches seem to get harder. Ever since I started hovering around 90th percentile matchmaking rankings for tpvp arena, matches became much more intense.

You may need to get a higher percentile rank. What is your percentile on the leaderboards for tpvp arena?

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Posted by: jportell.2197

jportell.2197

On the contrary when you get to a higher percentile rank matches seem to get harder. Ever since I started hovering around 90th percentile matchmaking rankings for tpvp arena, matches became much more intense.

You may need to get a higher percentile rank. What is your percentile on the leaderboards for tpvp arena?

95% then i get more and more morons the higher i get. And then they do stupid kitten like that. So yeah… MMR is feels completely random as kitten and is kittening annoying.

Johnny The Gray
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Posted by: Rage.9723

Rage.9723

Best bet would be to start your own team then and practice and play with them for team arena.

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Posted by: Romek.4201

Romek.4201

MMR is fine – only problem is new player get paired to high

i feel (experience cause we cant know for sure^^) like new players start somewhere in 70-90% and this is way to high

when this new players have some lucky wins (first 3-5 games) cause enemy team suck more than they jump in top 1000 and its even more fail

NEW PLAYERS should start with 20% MMR and should not get more MMR than max 1% per win/lose for the first 50-100 games

this would give new players some time to learn basics and would not inflate there MMR and not inflate the MMR from other players farming this NEW Players

(edited by Romek.4201)

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Posted by: Teutos.8620

Teutos.8620

Well, unless we can see the numbers behind the MMR system, we can’t say, if the system works fine or not.

If almost everyone around you is inexperienced, you probably just overrate yourself, and you are matched perfectly fine.

This does not mean, that the system does not have problem, it does!
Personally I think the main problem is, that new players start somewhere in the middle, and since their rating is not yet settled, it fluctuates a lot. This means, that if they are extremely lucky the first few matches, they can end up in the top 10, on the other hand they can get extremely unlucky, get some 4v5s and end up at the bottom, having a hard time climbing up again.

This brings me to the next point: 4v5: Too many games are decided that way. Yes, we can’t force people to stay and play, but we can make sure, that at least everyone is there at the start: We need a ready check prior entering the match!^

Some very basic tipps for the soloq:

  • Use keybinds^
  • Set good targets, don’t start the fight trying to kill the bunker guard.
  • look at the minimap and try to count enemys, with that information you know where to support your teammates or if their backpoint is free
  • look at the teammates health bars
  • Ping on the minimap f.e. prior the temple buffs are spawning to signal teammates to go there
  • If there is time, use the teamchat to inform your teammates about the upcoming buff (11:30 upper, 8:30 both, 5:30 upper, 2:30 both again)
  • The orb + skyhammer cannon are important. If you don’t have an orb carrier at least deny them to take the orb.
  • There is no shame on playing something cheesy on skyhammer
  • Copy the build from a top players. Yes, once you are good enough, you should individualize the build, or take something uncommon, but most of the time people just run kittening builds, and think they are good. (F.e. Offguards with staff, Bunker with shield on Foefire or power ranger)
EU – Multiple times #1 SoloQ pre Dec 2014 (pure MMR based ladder)
Primoridal (S1) & Exalted (S2) & Illustrious (S3) Legend

(edited by Teutos.8620)

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Posted by: arrownin.3128

arrownin.3128

Well, unless we can see the numbers behind the MMR system, we can’t say, if the system works fine or not.

If almost everyone around you is inexperienced, you probably just overrate yourself, and you are matched perfectly fine.

This does not mean, that the system does not have problem, it does!
Personally I think the main problem is, that new players start somewhere in the middle, and since their rating is not yet settled, it fluctuates a lot. This means, that if they are extremely lucky the first few matches, they can end up in the top 10, on the other hand they can get extremely unlucky, get some 4v5s and end up at the bottom, having a hard time climbing up again.

This brings me to the next point: 4v5: Too many games are decided that way. Yes, we can’t force people to stay and play, but we can make sure, that at least everyone is there at the start: We need a ready check prior entering the match!^

Some very basic tipps for the soloq:

  • Use keybinds^
  • Set good targets, don’t start the fight trying to kill the bunker guard.
  • look at the minimap and try to count enemys, with that information you know where to support your teammates or if their backpoint is free
  • look at the teammates health bars
  • Ping on the minimap f.e. prior the temple buffs are spawning to signal teammates to go there
  • If there is time, use the teamchat to inform your teammates about the upcoming buff (11:30 upper, 8:30 both, 5:30 upper, 2:30 both again)
  • The orb + skyhammer cannon are important. If you don’t have an orb carrier at least deny them to take the orb.
  • There is no shame on playing something cheesy on skyhammer
  • Copy the build from a top players. Yes, once you are good enough, you should individualize the build, or take something uncommon, but most of the time people just run kittening builds, and think they are good. (F.e. Offguards with staff, Bunker with shield on Foefire or power ranger)

I highly doubt that I am overrating myself. I have a lot of experience in PvP in fact in my entire time playing since beta the thing I have done the most in my play time has been PvP. I create my own builds if I have understanding of the meta and the current state of balancing, and if I don’t understand the class at the time I copy builds. I don’t need advice, I already know what you’re talking about, and frankly I find it a bit grating that you are telling me parts of PvP that most experienced players already know about, even if you are offering the information in good heart.

I don’t think that 4v5 are the problem. If a 4v5 happens usually the team with 4 lets the team with 5 win, it’s not frustrating, and it’s over fast. Even if your team fights back, it’s usually over fast. The problem is that I’ve been REGULARLY paired with brand spankin new players that have JUST joined PvP. I’d say 30% of all my games include someone that has had less than an hour of experience in PvP. I do not want to go against rank 0-10 players, or players with 0 knowledge of PvP anymore. Nor do I want to team with them. It’s unfair to me, and to all of the PvP players of Guild Wars 2.

How would high level Fractals runners respond if someone who didn’t know anything about fractals joined their top tier group and messed up their run, without the option to leave the group or risk getting a 24 hour ban from Fractals? Imagine if these PvE’rs had this happen at a consistent basis? There would be an outcry. There’s a reason why there is agony and agony resist gear. To set a bar to have new players have to learn the ropes before joining the elite, and what bar do we have in PvP? None.

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Posted by: Geiir.7603

Geiir.7603

High level fractal runners would kick you if you didn’t do a good job. The mmr system should not put new players with veterans…

Melder – Thief

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Posted by: Level Ioo.2497

Level Ioo.2497

I would absolutely rather wait 5 minutes for a good match than to wait 30 seconds for a crappy one

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Posted by: Markus.9084

Markus.9084

I get paired with rank 10s, rank 20s, rank 5s. Even if they’re the best player ever, they still don’t know the intricacies of PvP, how and when to ress, how and when to finish, how and when to dodge or stun or etc. They might be good at PvP, but they are nowhere near as experienced, which really makes the matches boring, and unsatisfying to play.
(…)

Which I might add, experienced PvPers would absolutely LOVE, if not for the fact us rank 50+ have to fight these new rank 1 players every single game.

I like how everyone agree on this forum that ranks mean nothing and are never a proof of skill, and when it comes to QQ-ing about MMR, it’s the very first argument you have….

" OMG I’m 50+ and I keep being paired with 10s… Fix MMR PLZ"

(edited by Markus.9084)

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Posted by: arrownin.3128

arrownin.3128

I get paired with rank 10s, rank 20s, rank 5s. Even if they’re the best player ever, they still don’t know the intricacies of PvP, how and when to ress, how and when to finish, how and when to dodge or stun or etc. They might be good at PvP, but they are nowhere near as experienced, which really makes the matches boring, and unsatisfying to play.
(…)

Which I might add, experienced PvPers would absolutely LOVE, if not for the fact us rank 50+ have to fight these new rank 1 players every single game.

I like how everyone agree on this forum that ranks mean nothing and are never a proof of skill, and when it comes to QQ-ing about MMR, it’s the very first argument you have….

" OMG I’m 50+ and I keep being paired with 10s… Fix MMR PLZ"

While rank might not be a proof of skill, its proof of time spent in PvP. Time spent in most cases translates into skill, or at least an understanding of. I believe rank means something. Also don’t generalize the entire forum’s population in your argument and say “everyone” agrees on something, because that’s just untrue.

I start my argument with that because it is proof that the MMR is pairing inexperienced people with experienced people. I do not enjoy playing with inexperienced people. Furthermore, I’ve been trying to find out how much water your argument holds, but I can’t seem to find you on the leaderboards for solo queue or team pvp, on EU or NA servers. Been using this:

http://www.gw2score.com/PvP

(edited by arrownin.3128)

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Posted by: Markus.9084

Markus.9084

“Time spent in most cases translates into skill, or at least an understanding of”. I agree in most of the case (except for Skyhammer and arena farmers).
But the problem is :
time spent ==> Skill : yes
Skill ==> Time spent : no

For me the converse isn’t true : you might find good AND new players.

Furthermore, I’ve been trying to find out how much water your argument holds, but I can’t seem to find you on the leaderboards for solo queue or team pvp, on EU or NA servers. Been using this:

http://www.gw2score.com/PvP

Argumentum ad hominem now ? Wow, good rhetoric…