Guild Wars 2

Ticket: 121227-003051 resolved thx Gaile Gray if you had anything to do with it
.
But now my problem is i can not play like i normally do without that fear of being ban out of no where for no apparent reason…
From what i gathered over the pass week or so, there is a chance of being banned for the following:
1) sending or receiving mail
2) typing in chat
3) withdrawing from guild bank
4) participating in WvW
5) killing or grinding monsters/events
6) Crafting/salvaging/buying from vendor
7) Logging in(game thinks you are being hacked)
temporary ban or a ban in error.. a ban is still a ban
It’s driving me nuts….

Pretty much what I fear at the moment. These are real concerns.

you’re missing:
8. buying gems and/or exchanging gems <—> gold on trading post
and
9. buying the game (havent seen much lately, but it was a popular topic a while back)

It is unfortunate that the amount of people who’ve exploited the game in one fashion or another has ruined the pleasure for the many people who play honestly, but now walk on egg shells for fear of doing anything wrong.

I was caught in the bot ban. I wasn’t botting, but I was in the Cursed Shores farming. Except for the rather obvious fact I wasn’t a bot (http://www.manylaughs.com/2012/11/09/guild-wars-2-6-reasons-im-an-obvious-bot/), I still got hit with the banhammer.

That made me change my playstyle. I stopped farming, almost completely, and I don’t go to the Cursed Shores like I used to.

While I understand the concerns about botting and exploits that affect the tp, I am concerned with the way ANet appears to handle these issues. The first (only?) response seems to be a “permanent” ban. Then it’s up to the player to appeal and get their account reinstated. I wonder how many people just walk away.

Are there suspensions? Are there warnings? Maybe a more tempered response is needed.

And it would be nice to get some sort of compensation after your wrongfully banned account was reinstated. So far, there’s not even a mea culpa. Heck, I’d settle for an apology.

I was about the post something along the same line. I’ve never been banned, but man it does make me really paranoid after reading post after post…

Sometimes I log in just to see if I still can lol

Oh and the fear of being hacked also…

That guy who bought the game and downloaded it, was logging in for the first time ever, and found he was already banned for RMT. That there made me lol. Obviously got hacked. We just don’t know all the facts though. How did he get hacked? But still it’s a real concern.

Oh, I want to add this:

One consequence of my ban, which directly affects ArenaNet, is I don’t spend real money in the gem store, anymore. Before the ban I easily spent more than $15 a month in the gem store, more than the monthly sub of other MMOs. The ban kinda soured me on the game, plus if there’s a possibility I’m going to get banned when I’ve done no wrong, I don’t really want to spend my money on the game.

So these bans and the way they handle them have had a monetary impact on ArenaNet, at least in my case.

This game bans people every 2 seconds, usually for a ridiculously miniscule reason. They expect everyone in the community to be filled with sunshine and love for guild wars but the bottom line is, the world doesn’t work this way and not everyone acts that way. They can go ahead and keep banning people, but guess what they are gonna be seeing a lot more people getting refunds, like myself, as we speak. I just got banned for defending my girlfriend from a troll. It literally took like 3 seconds for the ban to take affect. Meanwhile she is still in-game – being trolled. Good job arena net. Two customers gone, after she gets a refund too. Say goodbye to your player base. Won’t take long at this rate.

I had my name forcefully changed to that of my highest level/most logged character due to having the name Master Bei Shun and the corresponding character names: Master Bei Shun, Master Bei Tin, Master Bei Torre.

However, I used those names with the knowledge that at any given moment they could/would be revoked and have no problem with what happened happening.

I am posting this on my sons account as I guess when you are banned for one reason or another you are not even allowed to login and post. My account was just banned (terminated) with no explination other than it says I abused an ingame exploit. I got no email explaining what exploit I had abused, just a noticed my account was terminated when I tried to log in. I can not for the life of me think of any in game exploit I used justify the ban. How is someone suppose to defend themselves when no details are given about the ban.

The things that go through my mind.

Did I get banned for buying to many gems on the gemstore and trading them for gold?
Did I get banned for killing some mob that may have been bugged?
Did I get banned for crafting yellows and oranges and breaking them down for Globs of Ectos?
DId I get banned for ……………………………………. I have not a sigle clue other than my account is now been terminated and I can no longer log in.

Gaile Gray.6028:

Posting off-topic comments of meaningless value, and threads that have no relation to the topic at hand are not of value in this discussion.

I disagree. Players were suspended without any investigation from ANet team just because some other player reported them for inappropriate name even if they have done nothing wrong and their character names were fully legit. And this is what this topic is about. So those linked threads are in direct relation to the topic on hand.

Gaile Gray.6028:

Jules.5897:

This game bans people every 2 seconds, usually for a ridiculously miniscule reason. They expect everyone in the community to be filled with sunshine and love for guild wars but the bottom line is, the world doesn’t work this way and not everyone acts that way. They can go ahead and keep banning people, but guess what they are gonna be seeing a lot more people getting refunds, like myself, as we speak. I just got banned for defending my girlfriend from a troll. It literally took like 3 seconds for the ban to take affect. Meanwhile she is still in-game – being trolled. Good job arena net. Two customers gone, after she gets a refund too. Say goodbye to your player base. Won’t take long at this rate.

First, you were surely not “banned.” Bans are forever. At most, your account was suspended. But let’s talk about the important stuff: Did you report the harassment incident? When you were suspended, did you submit a ticket asking for a review?

Game moderation is a partnership, and we need to ask you to participate by letting us know the facts of the case and giving us the opportunity to correct any error that was made or any incomplete action that might have been taken.

In this case, if you reacted heatedly, and if you were reported, you may have been given a time out. If the team gets your explanation of the full details — details that are not readily apparent to them without communication from you — then this situation can be amended to be fair to all involved. But you need to give us that chance, and I cannot see that you did yet.

Actually I did…I submitted a ticket like an hour before I posted this. I’ve been awaiting a response…Don’t get me wrong I’m guilty as charged. But a 3 day ban right off the bat is not a reasonable punishment. You need to institute warnings before bans are handed out. And I’m not paying for a game that bans people outright who simply defend others in chat and aren’t aware at how strict you seem to want to be with foul language.

Also, call me crazy, but could there be thousands of players who AREN’T complaining on the forums, but having the same issue? /Gasp! Maybe it is Arenanet that should be considering that these little “molehills” are more like mountains.

It is just a point of view. Certainly any punishment dished out to me or any other player IS a mountain. But considering the numbers involved and the assumptions wrongfully claimed to show of the “big numbers” on the forums – it is a molehill.

zbrkesbr.4173:

Players were suspended without any investigation from ANet team just because some other player reported them for inappropriate name even if they have done nothing wrong and their character names were fully legit. And this is what this topic is about. So those linked threads are in direct relation to the topic on hand.

I only read the first thread, and there’s absolutely no indication of the case not being investigated by ANet or that the suspension was based on a single report. Maybe you should actually read the threads you’re referring to.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Why-am-I-being-asked-to-change-my-name/first#post1088786
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Why-am-I-being-asked-to-change-my-name/first#post1116311
So the name was clearly against the policy, but ANet was so kind to let it pass after a second review. The user is grateful and satisfied for a reason. I won’t even bother to read the second thread.

Shotz.4985:

I am posting this on my sons account as I guess when you are banned for one reason or another you are not even allowed to login and post. My account was just banned (terminated) with no explination other than it says I abused an ingame exploit. I got no email explaining what exploit I had abused, just a noticed my account was terminated when I tried to log in. I can not for the life of me think of any in game exploit I used justify the ban. How is someone suppose to defend themselves when no details are given about the ban.

The things that go through my mind.

Did I get banned for buying to many gems on the gemstore and trading them for gold?
Did I get banned for killing some mob that may have been bugged?
Did I get banned for crafting yellows and oranges and breaking them down for Globs of Ectos?
DId I get banned for ……………………………………. I have not a sigle clue other than my account is now been terminated and I can no longer log in.

Probably number 3.

They just did some mass bannings of people that were making snowflake jewlrey for one ecto and salvaging them to get 3 back.

Iruwen.3164:

So the name was clearly against the policy, but ANet was so kind to let it pass after a second review. The user is grateful and satisfied for a reason. I won’t even bother to read the second thread.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ34.pdf
Titles of works, names or pseudonyms of individuals cannot be copyrighted, but Anet included that part in naming policy for some reason.

Gaile,

I suspect that you are probably one of the most experienced players of the Guild Wars franchise, at ArenaNET (who else has their own custom minis? ), so I implicitly trust that you are working from the perspective of the players’ interests.

I know these are early days in what will hopefully be another 7 year adventure.

Over the whole time I played GW1, I never worried about being banned. I knew several people who probably SHOULD have been banned, but it didn’t seem like anyone was really paying attention. When I would make a report of someone being abusive in chat, I was always reminded that ArenaNET staff were really on the job. To me, this is how it should be. (ie: no police state, but response to community reports). I used to farm for Nick’s gifts every day in Pre.. sometimes for long periods of time. It just worked, and it worked well. Eventually, it was more time efficient for me to make my living with WTS/WTB, so I did that.. and made sometimes great deals and sometimes bad ones.. but it worked well.

Now, I’m in Guild Wars 2, and I’m afraid of my shadow. I’m afraid of getting DR’d for getting stuck on a batch of Cursed Shores foes who respawn faster than I can kill them all. I’m afraid of getting banned for moving inventory between my accounts (I have moved completed sets of minis without a peep of concern, which gives me the impression that eyes do indeed review these permabans before they are executed).

The number of real bans is small, and I suspect most are deserved, but from my perspective (can’t speak for everyone), the FEAR of losing an account I’ve already invested nearing 1000 hours on has burned a lot of the fun out of playing. Even the fear of in-game logic hurting my chances to be competitive in the drive for gold takes away from the fun.

Perspective is everything. Is there more factual information (ie: hard numbers) that ArenaNET can divulge, to comfort this fear in me (and the community, it seems) without giving away the secret sauce?

I’m willing and happy to put up with the teething pains, as this is the best game I’ve played in the 32 years I’ve worked with computers, but please don’t let the end result be a mouthful of screwed up teeth!

Thank you so much for being one of the ArenaNET team willing to take on the hard questions.

Allisa

Is it against the rules to buy materials on the Trading Post, crafting runes with them and then selling them in bulk? The whole snowflake incident has made me very concerned about it.

The fact that it’s just 200 of the 2 million accounts doesn’t soothe me, in fact, I find it strange that such a statement is used to justify this at all. Unlike the karma trader incident, this may not have been as apparent to people, especially considering the fact that the return chance was high but not 100% guarantueed.

So the least you can do to ease my worries is to answer my question.

zbrkesbr.4173:

Iruwen.3164:

So the name was clearly against the policy, but ANet was so kind to let it pass after a second review. The user is grateful and satisfied for a reason. I won’t even bother to read the second thread.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ34.pdf
Titles of works, names or pseudonyms of individuals cannot be copyrighted, but Anet included that part in naming policy for some reason.

They can include whatever they want in their policy. If they don’t like bananas and say that in the policy, you shouldn’t call yourself Banana Joe. If people don’t conform to their rules, it’s not ANet’s fault. This has nothing to do with actual laws. They’re probably doing this just to be on the safe side. But as you can see, they reviewed the case and it ended well. Problem solved.

Gaile Gray.6028:

I think you folks are looking at forum threads and seeing a mountain where there is merely a molehill. There are more than 2 million Guild Wars 2 accounts. Yes, 2,000,000+ accounts! With player volumes that high, there will be cheaters, exploiters, scammers, and of course, the occasional and deeply regretted error on our part, the unwarranted suspension or closure of an account. I don’t know of any system that doesn’t have some degree of false positives, but we are working to reduce those as much as possible.

………

The latter is not to say that we dismiss any appeal or that we never make a mistake. Everyone who submits a ticket is given a review (sometimes multiple reviews) and if we made an error, we reverse it. We review; we uphold or reinstate, as appropriate; and we try to improve so that we don’t make the same mistake again.

So when you see “I was suspended, and all I did was [this thing]” keep in mind that (1) the issue will be given a fair review and (2) you may not be seeing the facts of the case.

Here’s the problem I have, Gaile (good to see you in GW2, btw! It brings me waaay back when I see your name…). I would have been banned for the most recent crafting ‘exploit’ if I only had someone in my guild who figured it out early.

I don’t run numbers on the TP. I don’t figure out the math in detailed numbers like many people do. I would have just seen a way to make money and I would have gone for it without ever even considering that I was doing something wrong.

That definitely scares me a little. If, one day, a guild-mate says, “Hey, take advantage of these trading company prices and craft/salvage/Mystic Forge dynamics before the community catches on!” do I have to say no and ask ANet’s permission first?

I am an honest player and always have been but I could easily be banned right now. How can I feel free to just play without having to over-analyze everything I do when something like this (that I wouldn’t have recognized as an exploit) can get me banned?

This won’t impede my play style or anything but it’s certainly a little disconcerting, you know?

ThiBash.5634:

Is it against the rules to buy materials on the Trading Post, crafting runes with them and then selling them in bulk? The whole snowflake incident has made me very concerned about it.

The fact that it’s just 200 of the 2 million accounts doesn’t soothe me, in fact, I find it strange that such a statement is used to justify this at all. Unlike the karma trader incident, this may not have been as apparent to people, especially considering the fact that the return chance was high but not 100% guarantueed.

So the least you can do to ease my worries is to answer my question.

They clearly stated that those 200 people used the exploit extensively, hundreds and thousands of times. Those guys knew what they were doing or they wouldn’t have done it at all. So the action taken was well deserved.

Judas.5432:

Gaile Gray.6028:

I think you folks are looking at forum threads and seeing a mountain where there is merely a molehill. There are more than 2 million Guild Wars 2 accounts. Yes, 2,000,000+ accounts! With player volumes that high, there will be cheaters, exploiters, scammers, and of course, the occasional and deeply regretted error on our part, the unwarranted suspension or closure of an account. I don’t know of any system that doesn’t have some degree of false positives, but we are working to reduce those as much as possible.

………

The latter is not to say that we dismiss any appeal or that we never make a mistake. Everyone who submits a ticket is given a review (sometimes multiple reviews) and if we made an error, we reverse it. We review; we uphold or reinstate, as appropriate; and we try to improve so that we don’t make the same mistake again.

So when you see “I was suspended, and all I did was [this thing]” keep in mind that (1) the issue will be given a fair review and (2) you may not be seeing the facts of the case.

Here’s the problem I have, Gaile (good to see you in GW2, btw! It brings me waaay back when I see your name…). I would have been banned for the most recent crafting ‘exploit’ if I only had someone in my guild who figured it out early.

I don’t run numbers on the TP. I don’t figure out the math in detailed numbers like many people do. I would have just seen a way to make money and I would have gone for it without ever even considering that I was doing something wrong.

That definitely scares me a little. If, one day, a guild-mate says, “Hey, take advantage of these trading company prices and craft/salvage/Mystic Forge dynamics before the community catches on!” do I have to say no and ask ANet’s permission first?

I am an honest player and always have been but I could easily be banned right now. How can I feel free to just play without having to over-analyze everything I do when something like this (that I wouldn’t have recognized as an exploit) can get me banned?

This won’t impede my play style or anything but it’s certainly a little disconcerting, you know?

Hopefully I would have picked up this was an exploit had I considered the snowflake route which I did not, but I am still quite concerned how vague and blurred the lines are regarding the TP and economy. I enjoy buying materials in large quantities (150 gold at a time) and crafting with them. I have sold thousands of crafted items in the last couple of months. I liked doing this in Lotro, Eve and now GW2. I am concerned albeit only a little that I will stumble on something and get hammered.

Can you guys at ANet clearly state why salvaging rares for ectos is normally ok but on this occasion not. I have seen players give their views on Reddit and here but thats meaningless. I want clear direction from you so I have something to review against in the future.

thx

I disagree with the tactic’s Arenanet have employed,with this banning ,not everybody is aware that an exploit is an exploit! as well as that do your ArenaNet also realize that you should have moderators spamming all servers in bright RED writing maybe warning of such exploits if reported or discovered.
This a a Democracy not a Dictatorship and it seems banning long term players for this is Holy wrong – and I believe miss judged on the behalf of your company – for starters your company writes the codes, so therefore make the correct code so that exploits are not found .
If you leave a child in a candy shop and there is no one there what happens? I think you get the message.‘’’

Keep in mind banning for exploits like botting or 3rd party progs I agree,is fair and just but the economy is down to your DEV team and they should not punish players for there mistakes!
Also keep the thought that banning players who don’t even know there exploiting,as they don’t understand the game economy is also unjust,gold sellers ect should be your targets,banning good long term even GW1 original players is wrong !!! If the economy exploit was the fault of the shoddy coding by you DEV trade teams in crafting etc then they should be punished,or at least no Donuts or pudding for a day!

I also must remind you that there is a Fair trading agreement in the EU as well as the USA and due to mistakes by the coding team and players earning most of them innocently is unjust and unfair and a trading law that comes under the not Fit For Purpose act,nor do we have a trial without jury in most modern societies or at least a common decency for those to at least plea or have justice for them and there fellow players! !

This action can destroy long term Guilds players etc and fan bases as well as whole Guilds thus passing a rep around the community that GW2 ArenaNet has become a dictatorship,Avoid this game at all costs,you could be shot for even breathing!
Many who were not banned would leave as there friends were removed from the game,it is a — Gaming World not the Real World—,Did not the Bankers in the USA because of there greed destroy all our economies as well as the UK etc in real life,or don’t you guys feel the pinch or feel the action.

Change tactics, ArenaNet are losing touch with the community and a reminder not everybody reads the forums etc,so add Moderators and mass spam Warnings through servers
,‘’Common sense just seems not to be :Common sense anymore.’’
What worries me even more are these bans on a mass scale so that ArenaNet will hope a percentage% of those banned will buy another account? So therefore more revenue and cash for the CEO’s of the company’’Hmmm There’s a thought ‘’’ And as I sateted just a thought!

All my best
Happy New Year for 2013

Concept-Tech#

Gaile,

We go way back (though I doubt you remember and I had a different “handle” back then). So hello! Glad to see you’re still around.

I agree with most of what you said. However, 3 days (or more, and right now it is definitely more) is an unconscionable amount of time for an innocent player to languish in limbo, knowing they did nothing wrong and yet unable to prove it or worse yet, not having an opportunity to do so because no one has responded to their ticket.

Also, while false positives are low (not disputing that), the number of them does appear to be rising. This is either because bots have gotten smarter so they resemble real players more closely or, conversely, real players are beginning to resemble bots. We’ve done everything in the game – a lot of times – and now have single-minded purpose, don’t need to dodge as much, farm high value areas, don’t need to salvage items, etc. My small guild has seen 4 sanctions for botting in about 5 weeks; I believe all were erroneous and know beyond any doubt that at least 1 was – that is a 5-10% chance based on our active members. That isn’t statistically low and wasn’t a concern 2 months ago. Perhaps with less real bots, the false positives are more prevalent.

Regards,

Isis

Gaile, I can understand you do want to avoid as many false positives, and it is a neccesary evil. However, somewhere during my appeal (got banned for ‘botting/unattended gameplay a month ago) my ticket turned into a ’compromised account’ ticket.
I know that didn’t happen and I would have prefered an actual apology for handing out unwarranted bans instead of blaming it on something that is a lie.

@Ireniicus: I’m not familiair with this exploit, but I would guess it would have something to do with an ecto-generating loop. Other items don’t return your input, effectivelly taking materials out of the game during the process.

In part response to Warlock, if they were long term GW1, and GW2 players, then they would know an exploit when they saw it. Unless of course their brain cell count is below average and simply thought that getting more from less was a cool trick.

Secondly, if ANet is not ip banning these botters/exploiters, then they are doing it wrong and should not be profiting from what is ultimately their own coding mistake as you, Warlock, have pointed out.

Finally, Warlock’s suggestion is something that should seriously be considered by the development/moderator team and whoever else needs to consider it at ANet. When an exploit is brought to the attention of ANet, a MoTD should pop up for every player that logs in to the game, every time they log in, alerting them of the exploit in detail so they know to stay away until it is fixed. Anyone who attempts the exploit after the MoTD is in place should be ip banned WITHOUT review.

An example MoTD template:

MoTD: EXPLOIT ALERT:: Here are the details of the exploit, do not attempt to reproduce this in any way as the result will be an instant ip ban without review. Some people just suck and intended on getting ahead of others through exploiting a broken system.

Of course I would laugh uncontrollably at the last part if it was put in but that was just me being me. Warlock’s idea is a good one, use it.

Ryorak.4086:

In part response to Warlock, if they were long term GW1, and GW2 players, then they would know an exploit when they saw it. Unless of course their brain cell count is below average and simply thought that getting more from less was a cool trick.

Secondly, if ANet is not ip banning these botters/exploiters, then they are doing it wrong and should not be profiting from what is ultimately their own coding mistake as you, Warlock, have pointed out.

Finally, Warlock’s suggestion is something that should seriously be considered by the development/moderator team and whoever else needs to consider it at ANet. When an exploit is brought to the attention of ANet, a MoTD should pop up for every player that logs in to the game, every time they log in, alerting them of the exploit in detail so they know to stay away until it is fixed. Anyone who attempts the exploit after the MoTD is in place should be ip banned WITHOUT review.

An example MoTD template:

MoTD: EXPLOIT ALERT:: Here are the details of the exploit, do not attempt to reproduce this in any way as the result will be an instant ip ban without review. Some people just suck and intended on getting ahead of others through exploiting a broken system.

Of course I would laugh uncontrollably at the last part if it was put in but that was just me being me. Warlock’s idea is a good one, use it.

Do not mention ip bans ever again if you know nothing about them. They solve nothing and bring a lot more problems at the same time.

Announcing eyploits publicly so that anybody willing to exploit can start in real? Are you serious?

zbrkesbr.4173:

Ryorak.4086:

In part response to Warlock, if they were long term GW1, and GW2 players, then they would know an exploit when they saw it. Unless of course their brain cell count is below average and simply thought that getting more from less was a cool trick.

Secondly, if ANet is not ip banning these botters/exploiters, then they are doing it wrong and should not be profiting from what is ultimately their own coding mistake as you, Warlock, have pointed out.

Finally, Warlock’s suggestion is something that should seriously be considered by the development/moderator team and whoever else needs to consider it at ANet. When an exploit is brought to the attention of ANet, a MoTD should pop up for every player that logs in to the game, every time they log in, alerting them of the exploit in detail so they know to stay away until it is fixed. Anyone who attempts the exploit after the MoTD is in place should be ip banned WITHOUT review.

An example MoTD template:

MoTD: EXPLOIT ALERT:: Here are the details of the exploit, do not attempt to reproduce this in any way as the result will be an instant ip ban without review. Some people just suck and intended on getting ahead of others through exploiting a broken system.

Of course I would laugh uncontrollably at the last part if it was put in but that was just me being me. Warlock’s idea is a good one, use it.

Do not mention ip bans ever again if you know nothing about them. They solve nothing and bring a lot more problems at the same time.

Is there not a way to pinpoint any specific device (PC, phone, printer, anything connected to that network) THROUGH a network by ipv4 or v6. Routers issue an ip address(ipv4/v6) to the devices connected which depending on router and software can be static or dynamic ip addresses. I know there are safeguards in place that hackers regularly are able to bypass but I personally do not know the difficulties of obtaining these addresses.

It would be nice to know what you may know of this as that is where my knowledge of ip addresses stop. If you thought I meant network ip banning then that is my fault for not being more specific. I would think the devs/mods(if they even read my post) saw past network ip and knew I meant device ip as network ip bans would essentially screw over a lot of innocent players possibly connected to wifi of culprit players or whatever other hundred scenarios might occur

Michael.4791:

Announcing eyploits publicly so that anybody willing to exploit can start in real? Are you serious?

Well, the bad guys already know about it, let the innocents know so they do not “stumble” upon it thinking it a gift. And as I stated, ANY attempts at reproducing will result in a ban without review. Why NOT so serious?

Ok, just my two cents on this topic. (And sorry for my bad english I am a bit tired and not native.)

Until now I thought your banning policy was quite ok, not perfect but it did work and was always reasonable. Therefor I had not really a fear of being banned, because I thought things were transparent and if I work withing the rules I would be save.

I never had a ban. I once got a warning in the forum and I totally understood why I got the warning and tried to do not fall into that behaviour again.

But latly I got this fear of being banned. Mainly because of the whole snowflake incident. The problem here was that it took me very long to understand what excactly could be seen as an exploit here.
To understand what exploiting is you need an understanding how the game is supposed to work. And since I only started to salvage things for ectos I am fairly new to the mechanic and it is hard to understand how a proper salvage should look like and what kind of return is to expect.

I am sure most of the people who salvaged the snowflakes knew pretty well what to expect from a salvage, but this time it involved a new mostly untested material the snowflakes. When I would have run into this problem I would have thought it is supossed to work that way, because these things are new and it is hollyday stuff etc.

To get banned for this is really harsh. It is in fact so harsh that I now fear to run into an exploit and are not able to tell that it is one. This is highly irrational on my side like most fears are, but your handling in this case was so unfortunate that I can’t help but feel this way.

You know I really like your game and think that you do an overall good job on adressing these topics, but this time was just not really good.

Usually an exploit is easy to spot when you can gain a lot with little to no effort. You won’t get banned for running into an exploit. However you will when you abuse it like a madman.

As someone accused wrongly recently. It sucks, it sucks real bad. Happy to have my account back after being accused of botting. The ticket system needs some work though, having to go through banned to suspended to put in retail code to suspended to finally being able to play. I for one am worried that my farming habits(‘cuda aoe farmer) might just leave me in the same situation. What can I do its the best way I’ve found to make money out in the world solo.

Cardynalsyn.1045:

As someone accused wrongly recently. It sucks, it sucks real bad. Happy to have my account back after being accused of botting. The ticket system needs some work though, having to go through banned to suspended to put in retail code to suspended to finally being able to play. I for one am worried that my farming habits(‘cuda aoe farmer) might just leave me in the same situation. What can I do its the best way I’ve found to make money out in the world solo.

It is totally understandable how you would lose all hope for the system when that kind of thing happens. I bet you would pull your hair out of your head if in a day or two you got banned again in error.

Ryorak.4086:

zbrkesbr.4173:

Ryorak.4086:

In part response to Warlock, if they were long term GW1, and GW2 players, then they would know an exploit when they saw it. Unless of course their brain cell count is below average and simply thought that getting more from less was a cool trick.

Secondly, if ANet is not ip banning these botters/exploiters, then they are doing it wrong and should not be profiting from what is ultimately their own coding mistake as you, Warlock, have pointed out.

Finally, Warlock’s suggestion is something that should seriously be considered by the development/moderator team and whoever else needs to consider it at ANet. When an exploit is brought to the attention of ANet, a MoTD should pop up for every player that logs in to the game, every time they log in, alerting them of the exploit in detail so they know to stay away until it is fixed. Anyone who attempts the exploit after the MoTD is in place should be ip banned WITHOUT review.

An example MoTD template:

MoTD: EXPLOIT ALERT:: Here are the details of the exploit, do not attempt to reproduce this in any way as the result will be an instant ip ban without review. Some people just suck and intended on getting ahead of others through exploiting a broken system.

Of course I would laugh uncontrollably at the last part if it was put in but that was just me being me. Warlock’s idea is a good one, use it.

Do not mention ip bans ever again if you know nothing about them. They solve nothing and bring a lot more problems at the same time.

Is there not a way to pinpoint any specific device (PC, phone, printer, anything connected to that network) THROUGH a network by ipv4 or v6. Routers issue an ip address(ipv4/v6) to the devices connected which depending on router and software can be static or dynamic ip addresses. I know there are safeguards in place that hackers regularly are able to bypass but I personally do not know the difficulties of obtaining these addresses.

It would be nice to know what you may know of this as that is where my knowledge of ip addresses stop. If you thought I meant network ip banning then that is my fault for not being more specific. I would think the devs/mods(if they even read my post) saw past network ip and knew I meant device ip as network ip bans would essentially screw over a lot of innocent players possibly connected to wifi of culprit players or whatever other hundred scenarios might occur

They would simply ban the account. IPs these days tend to be a bit fluid or serve mass numbers of people.

The truth is one simple fact we are all different and not all understand the workings of the trade or the economy and what is an exploit like crafting using money to craft an object or jewel etc,armour etc and maybe salvaging and getting a return,in fact even losing in most cases, in the real World the Bankers and the big wigs done this to such an extreme knowing they were exploiting the banks economy and the system, they have destroyed many a lives and businesses not to mention countries.

You need moderators in this game World and you need Warnings flashed in game at random times not just on some blog or on a forum.
If an exploit is known then warn and report this you as a player to the ArenaNet team or you ArenaNet at least give those the option to choose to be greedy and over glutton knowing full well there exploiting and if so then a ban or if there warned through email or server flashed messages there given the chance to use there common senses and be honest and stop there action. .Don’t become a dictatorship or some great powerful finger on the button—— Work with the community !
You will destroy Guilds/ fans /and gamers/ by Your actions if appropriate measures advised by the community and gamers are not taken notice of.. ‘’Imagination is far greater then knowledge’’—Think ahead and treat your community with respect and fairness,if some fail to return that courtesy to you ,then by all means , use your banning power buttons!. I see a dark path for GW2 when the community is ignored !
By the way the input and the crawlers need not apply looking for Glory hunting from ArenaNet. Case closed in my view.
Change your policies and give fair Warnings. again not just on forums and blogs! But by real in game spammed messages..Common Sense yet again!

Concept Tech#

Destin.2458:

Ticket: 121227-003051 resolved thx Gaile Gray if you had anything to do with it
.
But now my problem is i can not play like i normally do without that fear of being ban out of no where for no apparent reason…
From what i gathered over the pass week or so, there is a chance of being banned for the following:
1) sending or receiving mail
2) typing in chat
3) withdrawing from guild bank
4) participating in WvW
5) killing or grinding monsters/events
6) Crafting/salvaging/buying from vendor
7) Logging in(game thinks you are being hacked)
temporary ban or a ban in error.. a ban is still a ban
It’s driving me nuts….

This.

It’s so strange to “play” a “game” that plants ban-mines all over. Heck just for saying that i’ll likely be banned.

The game can be fun and beautiful, so it’s a surprise to see such illogical and extreme measures taken.

Why fear the ban-hammer?
If you haven’t done anything wrong, submit a ticket and then you will have your account back in a few days or weeks, if you can’t wait that long I would advice you to take a break from pc/video-games and enjoy the real world.

When I was about 12 yrs old I played MUD and found an exploit, told about it to my friends and we used it, I was found out by a mod and got a warning and the exploit was no more. *Since I got a warning I learned that next time I find an exploit I will be more cautious … That’s one reason why warning’s are useless and an exploiter is deserved with a perma ban since ONE exploit can ruin the whole game for other serious players.

And it is very easy to know if something is a serious exploit like when you can duplicate an item, when you repeatedly can kill “normal” enemies with one blow and so on… As soon as you notice stuff like this, send a BUG.

Complaining about it makes you just look guilty, in my opinion.
I think that even if all wrongfully banned would find a way to post in the forums and fill it, it wouldn’t make the chance of you being wrongfully banned that high anyway.

*Edit: Being cautious about it doesn’t help iether, best way is to report exploits and not to use them.

I fear because every time i turn around people are exploiting.

Every fractal group i run has either skipped content or bugged a boss.

People i know are using mesmer portals to do things clearly not intended by the devlopers (why else would they have changed the portals recently).

I personally know people who were banned for mailing gold, yes they got unbanned but still very scary.

And i’m not even going to get into the snowflake thing seeing how the people who did it have been called a terrible person by gaile. I cant imagine how those players feel to have a company they loved and supported, some for years, spent money on, got friends to play, moved entire guilds here, became pillars of this community, only to have Anet call them terrible people who viciously attacked the economy.

You guys made a great game and managed to save face long enough to win your 2012 awards and keep your Q4 stock happy. But this is too scary for me.

I mean, is someone somewhere going to take a look at my game files someday and see that I took part in bugging the mossman two weeks down the line and ban me?

I will continue to play the game but i cant even begin to commit the kind of time and resources(money) I wanted to with this type of behavior going on.

Arenanet used to be so awesome. In Guild wars 1 i heard about the 10% solo underworld monk and used that “exploit” to bank a lot of ecto and craft the ever elusive obsidian armor. At one point I can only assume this became a big enough problem that Anet simply patched it out one day. No one was banned but clearly this was not working as intended and by todays definitions was an exploit. But instead of destroying the faith their player base had in them, they simply fixed it and moved on.

I shudder to think where guild wars and arenanet would be today if they took this stance back then. Chest runners, Underworld Solo players, Minion Factorys all banned for playing the game within what they thought were normal paramaters.

Arenanet used to not punish people for being creative and “figuring things out first”, they used to encourage it.

too scary for me guys, i’ll play but i’ll not commit anymore. I’m scared this post will get me banned so i’m deffinitely not posting anymore (because a guild mate did get a forum ban for questioning anets “claim” that only 200 accounts were banned).

It’s pretty unrealistic to claim you didn’t know you were exploiting as you did it repeatedly. There’s not a single situation I could imagine where you exploit unintentional multiple times. Claiming you’ll be suspended from the game for making critical posts in the forums is straight out ridiculous, not to mention a ban. People are going way over the top here. Being less consequent on ANet’s side would be a carte blanche for exploiters, severely damaging the economy.

Ryorak.4086:

Michael.4791:

Announcing eyploits publicly so that anybody willing to exploit can start in real? Are you serious?

Well, the bad guys already know about it, let the innocents know so they do not “stumble” upon it thinking it a gift. And as I stated, ANY attempts at reproducing will result in a ban without review. Why NOT so serious?

People will try, regardless of any warnings. And they will complain afterwards. Going that way would cause a real mess. Most people don’t know about exploits, I usually only know about them because of threads like this one, and it should stay that way.

Gaile Gray.6028:

First, you were surely not “banned.” Bans are forever. At most, your account was suspended. But let’s talk about the important stuff: Did you report the harassment incident? When you were suspended, did you submit a ticket asking for a review?

• - Gaile first of thanks for your efforts and time replying to everyone who is frustrated.
  -Secondly here I think it one of the big issues as this sounds similar to the issue i am currently facing. Someone comes along and insults/griefs people around you. You then reply back in defense ( given this was not the best thing to do but is probably a normal human response) after a minute or so maybe you just use the built in ignore function and try to avoid the person maybe go to a different area. This “griefer” probably not their first time around then reports us for our “half of the conversation” Now right or wrong we are then suspended for 72 hours while they walk away free to do this again to someone else. *

Game moderation is a partnership, and we need to ask you to participate by letting us know the facts of the case and giving us the opportunity to correct any error that was made or any incomplete action that might have been taken.

In this case, if you reacted heatedly, and if you were reported, you may have been given a time out. If the team gets your explanation of the full details — details that are not readily apparent to them without communication from you — then this situation can be amended to be fair to all involved. But you need to give us that chance, and I cannot see that you did yet.

• - Now we do as you advised and put in a ticket to explain our side of what happened when admittedly Anet can’t be expected to know without us advising them but see a 24-48 hour turnaround on the ticket. *

• So the end result the original troll/griefer gets no penalty and we even if anet helps us out get a 24-48 suspension. I think this is where a lot of frustration comes from. Also those of us that have been playing MMO’s for 10 + yrs are used to a different system where “minor offenses” or things that may have 2 sides to them get a warning or a 24 hour suspension first. A lot of the folks i see including myself have played these games for 10+ yr without even a warning let alone a suspension.*

• Again thanks for your time and effort on our behalf *
  

I’m not afraid of bans. That does not mean I’m sure to get no ban. It just means that I’m sure to survive a review if I get one.

I might be doing an exploit because I don’t know it is one. But because I would only use it to get armor or weapons for my characters, I would not use it several hundred times. There is a difference and I’m sure Anet sees it too. Doing something a couple of times to get as much items as you personally need is (according my opinion) not exploiting even if it involves an exploit. I know that this opinion leaves some room for discussions.

I might do an example: If I would have done the snowflakes, I would have done as much as I needed, but I would not have salvaged one of the results. So I would not have discovered the exploit at all. That is the way I do things in the game. I do what I need and I skip anything else. Something like that IMHO would never be enough to warant the ban hammer swinging my way.

I was banned on there Face book Page GW2 that is for speaking out, and speaking a truth no offensive words or rude comments just the truth and the facts shown by what route this company is heading,
It disgust me that they have banned years of dedicated fans and players maybe it is time to contact FTO or even pay a visit to the CEO’s or a visit to ArenaNet HQ and have face too face explanations of there hierarchy’’ which I think have over stepped the line — and there inner core of power.
This is the EU Base and from my End it is reminding me of some History we had many years ago,and some is still on going like protests and riots because of power and no voice,it also reminds me of a War kicked off by a dictatorship many tears ago were those had no voice or the words YOU WILL OBEY ! AND BE IN FEAR

To rule by fear is to create chaos! Which in turn will create a downfall! As already proven over and over

Okay all the above An over exaggeration on my behalf maybe’? but it’s still a thought!’’ END OF LINE……..

Concept Tech#