Guild Wars 2

Gaile, my account has been banned my brother’s account has been banned my friend and her 2nd account also been banned. I am guessing for the same false-positive. My plea to you is that instead of giving this is final responses could you please work with the folks that get false banned faster.

This is my 2nd time being false banned and first time i remember you were the one that talked with me and thank god you are a helpful person and seen the false and unbanned me however the first people that responded did NOT.

I just want to lose as small time as possible due to this, could you please tell me what exactly we can do to prove our innocence as in what details we can provide?

My guess is that these cheat programs also involve logging in to multiple accounts for some reason which you guys have said MANY times is allowed as long as we manually control them.

I am losing my sleep over this, so i am sorry if this post is a bit weird or badly written. I just wish you could take over my ticket again but i know you cant do that everytime.. just any tips on how to actually get to talk with a senior GM?

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

The same thing happened to me with this wave of bans. I have not used any form of program to cheat or give myself any form of advantage that any other player can do. I don’t know how your software goes about detecting cheats, but this must be a false positive in many cases, and oddly timed with the launch of Heart of Thorns when everyone is working hard to grind their masteries spending prolonged hours logged into the game doing events, running around, gathering, etc.

After spending $100 on the Collector Edition, I would never even think about putting my account in jeopardy by using an external program. To my understanding macro’s are allowed to be used but not to give the player an advantage, so using a double click macro before “consume all” was added to essence would be acceptable, or playing a musical instrument.

I would really like my ticket and account to be examined and someone to talk to directly because I have been falsely banned, and I too have been here before when Foxfire Clusters were the “in thing” to gather. Banned for “botting” which was false back then as is my use of external programs in such a matter to break the rules of conduct.

I put in a ticket at the time it happend and i got a generic reply that with googling i found someone had been sent the same reply 2 years ago copyed and pasted word for word like my ticket wasnt even looked at or a chance to prove that i did nothing wrong just you are perma band end of story

This is my alt acc as my account dosn’t have access to the forms.

Gaile Gray.6029:

If you did not receive the e-mail, or if you have further questions, you’re welcome to contact Customer Support to inquire about your account.

So one of us got a 2nd reply just now saying:

we are confident that our detection systems are accurate, Subsequent tickets will be closed without response.

And yet still there is zero information on what cheat we are supposedly done. You are making this expansion a horrible experience now…

Same story happened few weeks ago also with tons of false positives it seems

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3osv8k/just_got_my_account_closed_inappropriately/

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3oswu8/got_all_my_accounts_banned_and_it_doesnt_make/

Thank you Zaron, gives hope to see they got it fixed after trying hard enough. So far my friend got we will close all tickets you open and i got * we are confident* TWICE! without telling anything else.

I dont know how the support works and how they are taught but it is really a horrible feeling to be accused of something like cheating and then being told repeatedly they won’t look into it.. only to get them to look into it.

I always tell people to be polite when making support tickets..as i tell them they are human beings too but.. do they forget we are also human beings, with real emotions?

The decision to terminate the account is final. The details that lead to the termination of the account were thoroughly reviewed by our team prior to taking action, and we maintain absolute confidence in our conclusion. Multiboxing is a violation of our Terms of Serviced and not something that we allow, as of this time we will not be un-banning your account.

The support is now telling me lies or you have changed your stance on multiboxing without telling us.

Next edit: Now i am being accused of automation of gameplay by the GM instead of altering files – because i told them the only things i do is multibox and i turn my mousewheel up and down into clicks to open bags lead to a reply that says

“You told us you use programs to automate gameplay”.. is this for real?

This is their stance on Multiboxing, and has been since Day 1 as far as I’m concerned.

Chances are if you are multiboxing, whatever application you used to launch GW2 multiple times is getting flagged right now. This is something that the GW2 team needs to look into, and give community feedback on.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Policy-3rd-Party-Programs-Multi-Boxing-Macros/first#post1532762

Dual- or Multi-Boxing

You may use more than one account at the same time.
You may use more than one computer at the same time.
You must be actively playing on each account.
And as stated above, you may not program your keyboard to perform functions on more than one account at a time.
a. For example, if you press W on your keyboard to move forward, a single character on a single account should move forward. The keystroke or mouse click should not perform functions on more than one account.

sirsquishy.8531:

This is their stance on Multiboxing, and has been since Day 1 as far as I’m concerned.

Chances are if you are multiboxing, whatever application you used to launch GW2 multiple times is getting flagged right now. This is something that the GW2 team needs to look into, and give community feedback on.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Policy-3rd-Party-Programs-Multi-Boxing-Macros/first#post1532762

Dual- or Multi-Boxing

You may use more than one account at the same time.
You may use more than one computer at the same time.
You must be actively playing on each account.
And as stated above, you may not program your keyboard to perform functions on more than one account at a time.
a. For example, if you press W on your keyboard to move forward, a single character on a single account should move forward. The keystroke or mouse click should not perform functions on more than one account.

And i do exactly this. I used 2 accounts on same pc and i manually controlled them by alt-tab pressing between the 2 windows in borderless windowed mode.

I am really feeling down atm, because i am at the mercy of some random person that refuses to let my ticket go further. Changes their words and uses my words against me by twisting them.

I sent them the file i use to open 2 clients, told them i use my mousewheel to click open bags as the only thing that could be considered automation EVER. And result was that i was not told ANY detail, and instead of being banned for one thing now i was told i am being banned for automation cause i said i use mousewheel to click open bags.

I dont know what we need to do to gain attention from a GM that is capable of changing false bans.. everybody tells they keep trying till they get to a senior GM otherwise you are out of luck yet i was told that they’ll instantly close ANY tickets i make on this matter. I never got that chance to get a 2nd review..

tyu.9470:

sirsquishy.8531:

This is their stance on Multiboxing, and has been since Day 1 as far as I’m concerned.

Chances are if you are multiboxing, whatever application you used to launch GW2 multiple times is getting flagged right now. This is something that the GW2 team needs to look into, and give community feedback on.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Policy-3rd-Party-Programs-Multi-Boxing-Macros/first#post1532762

Dual- or Multi-Boxing

You may use more than one account at the same time.
You may use more than one computer at the same time.
You must be actively playing on each account.
And as stated above, you may not program your keyboard to perform functions on more than one account at a time.
a. For example, if you press W on your keyboard to move forward, a single character on a single account should move forward. The keystroke or mouse click should not perform functions on more than one account.

And i do exactly this. I used 2 accounts on same pc and i manually controlled them by alt-tab pressing between the 2 windows in borderless windowed mode.

I am really feeling down atm, because i am at the mercy of some random person that refuses to let my ticket go further. Changes their words and uses my words against me by twisting them.

I sent them the file i use to open 2 clients, told them i use my mousewheel to click open bags as the only thing that could be considered automation EVER. And result was that i was not told ANY detail, and instead of being banned for one thing now i was told i am being banned for automation cause i said i use mousewheel to click open bags.

I dont know what we need to do to gain attention from a GM that is capable of changing false bans.. everybody tells they keep trying till they get to a senior GM otherwise you are out of luck yet i was told that they’ll instantly close ANY tickets i make on this matter. I never got that chance to get a 2nd review..

Being banned for a mousewheel makes no sense at all, especially since their detection system never detected it. They failed miserably if you are to be believed. I doubt it’s simply a case of IP address, since if they did that, that’d be insane. Some places 1 IP address is a whole town, a whole housing complex, a whole huge building. I don’t think they’d be insane enough to just go off IP address alone, and if they did, shame on them. :S

But will you answer any tickets? because I have a ticket opened since 7 days ago, and I´m still waiting for an answer, account suspended, no email explaining the reason, nothing… this support is top class eh…

If you have had no response after the automated ‘Thank you for your inquiry’ email, then you can post your ticket number in the Sticky above, ‘Tickets for Review’.

If you did not receive the automated response, you can peruse the Sticky FAQ above regarding ‘Not Getting our Emails’.

Good luck.

Ah, well…there’s your second review. =/

Chris Cleary.8017:

tyu.9470:

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

Could you please tell me what cheat i used? Yes you have permission to publicly shame me – because i have not cheated. Also i do not own 9 accounts, i own 2. The only time i logged in more than the 2 is:

Log in to my friends account (1) to do their daily – log in to another friend’s account (2) because she couldnt find potion of pvp reward she got herself.

So in total i have been into 4 accounts in the last god knows how many months.

Oh and almost forgot the 1st friend’s acc that i logged – i logged 4 times in a row in same 5 minutes because we wanted to test why i always get sms authentication even if i click remember this network. Like i can give you all the details really.. i have not cheated – i do not even know WHAT cheat you talk about.. why is support so afraid of saying what cheat it is so far? If you are so sure…

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Ah, well…there’s your second review. =/

Yeah.. and still no word on what cheat they are talking about. i don’t even own 9 accounts.

tyu.9470:

Chris Cleary.8017:

tyu.9470:

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

Could you please tell me what cheat i used? Yes you have permission to publicly shame me – because i have not cheated. Also i do not own 9 accounts, i own 2. The only time i logged in more than the 2 is:

Log in to my friends account (1) to do their daily – log in to another friend’s account (2) because she couldnt find potion of pvp reward she got herself.

So in total i have been into 4 accounts in the last god knows how many months.

Oh and almost forgot the 1st friend’s acc that i logged – i logged 4 times in a row in same 5 minutes because we wanted to test why i always get sms authentication even if i click remember this network. Like i can give you all the details really.. i have not cheated – i do not even know WHAT cheat you talk about.. why is support so afraid of saying what cheat it is so far? If you are so sure…

There’s your cheat. You’re not supposed to play someone else’s account. Only the accounts that you own. It’s in the TOS.

Seera.5916:

tyu.9470:

Chris Cleary.8017:

tyu.9470:

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

Could you please tell me what cheat i used? Yes you have permission to publicly shame me – because i have not cheated. Also i do not own 9 accounts, i own 2. The only time i logged in more than the 2 is:

Log in to my friends account (1) to do their daily – log in to another friend’s account (2) because she couldnt find potion of pvp reward she got herself.

So in total i have been into 4 accounts in the last god knows how many months.

Oh and almost forgot the 1st friend’s acc that i logged – i logged 4 times in a row in same 5 minutes because we wanted to test why i always get sms authentication even if i click remember this network. Like i can give you all the details really.. i have not cheated – i do not even know WHAT cheat you talk about.. why is support so afraid of saying what cheat it is so far? If you are so sure…

There’s your cheat. You’re not supposed to play someone else’s account. Only the accounts that you own. It’s in the TOS.

Ehhhhhhh? Account sharing is something thats widely done. It is nowhere “cheating”. It is obvious he is talkin about some kind of cheat ive supposedly done on 2 accounts and that i own NINE accounts. I dont even…

tyu.9470:

Seera.5916:

tyu.9470:

Chris Cleary.8017:

tyu.9470:

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

Could you please tell me what cheat i used? Yes you have permission to publicly shame me – because i have not cheated. Also i do not own 9 accounts, i own 2. The only time i logged in more than the 2 is:

Log in to my friends account (1) to do their daily – log in to another friend’s account (2) because she couldnt find potion of pvp reward she got herself.

So in total i have been into 4 accounts in the last god knows how many months.

Oh and almost forgot the 1st friend’s acc that i logged – i logged 4 times in a row in same 5 minutes because we wanted to test why i always get sms authentication even if i click remember this network. Like i can give you all the details really.. i have not cheated – i do not even know WHAT cheat you talk about.. why is support so afraid of saying what cheat it is so far? If you are so sure…

There’s your cheat. You’re not supposed to play someone else’s account. Only the accounts that you own. It’s in the TOS.

Ehhhhhhh? Account sharing is something thats widely done. It is nowhere “cheating”. It is obvious he is talkin about some kind of cheat ive supposedly done on 2 accounts and that i own NINE accounts. I dont even…

So if everyone widely goes around and bots, that suddenly makes it ok?

Just because everyone does it doesn’t mean it’s not against the TOS.

Seera.5916:

tyu.9470:

Seera.5916:

tyu.9470:

Chris Cleary.8017:

tyu.9470:

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

Could you please tell me what cheat i used? Yes you have permission to publicly shame me – because i have not cheated. Also i do not own 9 accounts, i own 2. The only time i logged in more than the 2 is:

Log in to my friends account (1) to do their daily – log in to another friend’s account (2) because she couldnt find potion of pvp reward she got herself.

So in total i have been into 4 accounts in the last god knows how many months.

Oh and almost forgot the 1st friend’s acc that i logged – i logged 4 times in a row in same 5 minutes because we wanted to test why i always get sms authentication even if i click remember this network. Like i can give you all the details really.. i have not cheated – i do not even know WHAT cheat you talk about.. why is support so afraid of saying what cheat it is so far? If you are so sure…

There’s your cheat. You’re not supposed to play someone else’s account. Only the accounts that you own. It’s in the TOS.

Ehhhhhhh? Account sharing is something thats widely done. It is nowhere “cheating”. It is obvious he is talkin about some kind of cheat ive supposedly done on 2 accounts and that i own NINE accounts. I dont even…

So if everyone widely goes around and bots, that suddenly makes it ok?

Just because everyone does it doesn’t mean it’s not against the TOS.

Using any kind of automated clicks is against TOS, using any kind of curse words is against TOS and so on. You are just blurring the water atm – please. I really want to know what cheat he is talkin about here.

tyu.9470:

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Ah, well…there’s your second review. =/

Yeah.. and still no word on what cheat they are talking about. i don’t even own 9 accounts.

They’re not going to publicly tell you the cheat because that would also publicly reveal a flaw/exploit in their game before they’re able to get an ironclad fix on it. They never reveal exploits/cheats/3rd party programs unless they are 100% sure it has been dealt with (as well as ALL users being punished).

And they really don’t have to tell you what you have done. You know what you did. Denial is not just a river in Africa.

Yes yes you all love to believe im a cheater i get it – i am not though i’ll be ignoring you guys,

Chris, please. I do NOT own 9 accounts there is a mistake here.

Although you might not “own” 9 accounts, the software has to assume you do. Think about a situation like this – a cheater owns 2 accounts, one legit and one for fun. The one for fun will always be connected through a VPN on a somehow or other ‘faked’ Windows’ GUID to avoid having anything linking the two accounts together. Then one day he forgets to hide his real GUID (or use a VPN).

At that point, in the eyes of anti-cheat, you are considered the same person. How does someone differentiate the above from someone who logs in to a friend’s account? They can’t. VPNs are useful for more than just masking identity (draconian school firewalls that have DPI running on HTTP/S traffic, carrier’s peer’s with GW2’s datacenter overloaded, etc), and GUID gives the illusion of different machines. That’s why the clause about account sharing is in the ToS – so there is no ambiguity.

Otherwise that cheater would be able to do the exact same complaining as above in hopes of getting unbanned without spending extra $$.

Even if someone is cheating with 2 accounts it seems ridiculous to me to ban everything of theirs.

Imagine if someone had 10 books. 8 were purchased, 2 were stolen. The police go in and take away all 10 books. It just doesn’t seem right imo

Fermi.2409:

Even if someone is cheating with 2 accounts it seems ridiculous to me to ban everything of theirs.

Imagine if someone had 10 books. 8 were purchased, 2 were stolen. The police go in and take away all 10 books. It just doesn’t seem right imo

If someone cheat on 1 or 2 account might cheat in future on other account. Just a cheater get caught so lose all game privilege. I do not want a cheater to play GW2 at all because they damage game for all player and can not be trusted to not cheat more. If I go to gambling casino and cheat I would get permanent ban from casino. They would not say you can come back but can not play gambling game you cheat on but can play other game.

deltaconnected.4859:

Although you might not “own” 9 accounts, the software has to assume you do. Think about a situation like this – a cheater owns 2 accounts, one legit and one for fun. The one for fun will always be connected through a VPN on a somehow or other ‘faked’ Windows’ GUID to avoid having anything linking the two accounts together. Then one day he forgets to hide his real GUID (or use a VPN).

At that point, in the eyes of anti-cheat, you are considered the same person. How does someone differentiate the above from someone who logs in to a friend’s account? They can’t. VPNs are useful for more than just masking identity (draconian school firewalls that have DPI running on HTTP/S traffic, carrier’s peer’s with GW2’s datacenter overloaded, etc), and GUID gives the illusion of different machines. That’s why the clause about account sharing is in the ToS – so there is no ambiguity.

Otherwise that cheater would be able to do the exact same complaining as above in hopes of getting unbanned without spending extra $$.

So you are saying because i logged in to another account for less than a few hours from my IP which is static and has been the same for my accounts – and they used a cheat i am banned as well?

But… there is chat logs between both these accounts and me that shows we are different people – hell just 2-3 days ago we were doing an adventure together (catching bugs). How on earth does someone control 3 accounts at same time to do such complex things as that adventure.

I am just saying while you may be correct, there are ways to see if we are the same person or not. Hell, i can even tell you when we met with eachother just this year.. they are new members to my guild :/

I would like to show my support for tyu aswell. It seems to me that he is a victim of a mixup.

Qugi.2653:

Fermi.2409:

Even if someone is cheating with 2 accounts it seems ridiculous to me to ban everything of theirs.

Imagine if someone had 10 books. 8 were purchased, 2 were stolen. The police go in and take away all 10 books. It just doesn’t seem right imo

If someone cheat on 1 or 2 account might cheat in future on other account. Just a cheater get caught so lose all game privilege. I do not want a cheater to play GW2 at all because they damage game for all player and can not be trusted to not cheat more. If I go to gambling casino and cheat I would get permanent ban from casino. They would not say you can come back but can not play gambling game you cheat on but can play other game.

They allow you to buy new accounts, your analogy is wrong. I will not be buying but yeah wanted to tell you that. This is a sad sad day for me.. sigh.

Don’t know might get new account banned too.

Also I thought banned account could not post on forum. So maybe you have another account not banned.

tyu.9470:

So you are saying because i logged in to another account for less than a few hours from my IP which is static and has been the same for my accounts – and they used a cheat i am banned as well?

Exactly. Whatever’s being used to detect it doesn’t care how long or who. IP may only be part of it, if at all, hence why I mentioned Windows unique crypto GUID. The “owner” of the accounts is flagged as the same.

tyu.9470:

But… there is chat logs between both these accounts and me that shows we are different people – hell just 2-3 days ago we were doing an adventure together (catching bugs). How on earth does someone control 3 accounts at same time to do such complex things as that adventure.

I’m not saying the method is perfect. It never will be, which is why they sometimes get reviewed. I’m only giving an example why automated (and even manual similarity checking) would flag you as cheating.

tyu.9470:

I am just saying while you may be correct, there are ways to see if we are the same person or not. Hell, i can even tell you when we met with eachother just this year.. they are new members to my guild :/

The problem is how long it would take to manually review chat, guild, and every other associated log with every banned account. Just not feasible.

Qugi.2653:

If someone cheat on 1 or 2 account might cheat in future on other account.

So now you’re looking to punish people for what they might do? What’s next, punishing thought crime?

Two accounts violated the rules; they should be punished. However, the rest have done nothing wrong by Gaile’s own admission. How is it fair to punish those accounts for something they haven’t even done?

And, while I’m sure this has been considered, they may not even be the dude’s accounts. I would hope that they thought of the fact that one person could have 5 accounts on the same IP or 5 people could have 5 accounts on the same IP because they share a computer.

Fermi.2409:

The same person with two accounts violated the rules; they should be punished.

Fix that for you. Cheater hurt game and cost Anet money because they have to pay for employee to look for cheater pay for employee to program software to catch cheater and pay support for time talking to cheater when they send support ticket say they did not cheat.

For a time me and my roommate gamed on the same computer on different accounts. How is it being checked that, it is infact 2 ppl using this computer?

Glad to know opening Guild Wars 2 through Steam does not terminate my account (I open through Steam for in-home streaming).

Kyson.5289:

For a time me and my roommate gamed on the same computer on different accounts. How is it being checked that, it is infact 2 ppl using this computer?

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Cryptography\MachineGuid

edit: sorry, misread. That’s why they would be flagged as the same person.

Kyson.5289:

For a time me and my roommate gamed on the same computer on different accounts. How is it being checked that, it is infact 2 ppl using this computer?

It wasn’t his friend logging on his computer, he actually said he logged into his friend’s account on his computer. That is a HUGE difference.

And we don’t know his whole story.

So..instead of reviewing it they just say they’ll not respond to any tickets i open. That is just kittenty man.

I’m not giving up anytime.. they have to review this. And you see how 1 line from Chris showed more than 10 replies in tickets. They kept telling me i altered game files or multiboxed and automated both false, then tell me that they wont reply anymore.

I hope he’ll take more of his time to help me out..

Qugi.2653:

Fermi.2409:

The same person with two accounts violated the rules; they should be punished.

Fix that for you.

Which is where the disagreement lies. Banning all of someone’s accounts accounts because they broke the rules on some of them is ridiculous with a couple of possible exceptions (for example, abusing exploits on one account to feed gold/materials to a main account).

Say I have 3 accounts and decided to share one with a friend. I get caught. Do I deserve to have all of my accounts banned or just the one that was shared/had the rules broken? Personally, I’m solidly in the “just the one account, if at all” camp. The ToS are agreed to on a per account basis; how can they be applied across multiple accounts?

Ellieanna.5027:

It wasn’t his friend logging on his computer, he actually said he logged into his friend’s account on his computer. That is a HUGE difference.

Just taking things at face value, that’s interesting that it would get his account banned at all; if anything, I’d think it would be the friend’s account. Not that they’d even be able to get you for account sharing unless you’re a moron and admit to it ingame or the login location of the account bounces around the country at a rate faster then it’s possible to travel and they have some reason to look at it.

Qugi.2653:

Fermi.2409:

The same person with two accounts violated the rules; they should be punished.

Fix that for you. Cheater hurt game and cost Anet money because they have to pay for employee to look for cheater pay for employee to program software to catch cheater and pay support for time talking to cheater when they send support ticket say they did not cheat.

fair enough. But i think a better analogy would be this: if a person commits money fraud or something like that. He does not get all of his money/property taken away, nor does the law prohibit him from ever owning money or property ever again.

Fermi.2409:

Say I have 3 accounts and decided to share one with a friend. I get caught. Do I deserve to have all of my accounts banned or just the one that was shared/had the rules broken? Personally, I’m solidly in the “just the one account, if at all” camp. The ToS are agreed to on a per account basis; how can they be applied across multiple accounts?
.

Yes because if you cheat and share account to you violate ToS twice.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/legal/guild-wars-2-user-agreement/

Additional License Restrictions – You acknowledge You will not directly or indirectly:

sell, sub-license, rent, lease, grant a security interest in, borrow, lend, loan, network or engage in any activity that could in any way transfer or provide others access to any Service, Content, Game, or parts thereof, including but not limited to any serial code number, access key or the like.

Also ToS say Anet can ban other account.

Whether or not You wish to terminate an Account, ArenaNet may, modify or delete Your Account as well as any other Account ID, Account Display Name, ArenaNet Message Board ID, Character ID, Team, and/or characteristics related to an Account ID for a breach of this agreement, such actions escalating with the severity of the breach. Minor violations of this agreement may result in a warning. Termination of an Account under this provision also terminates any license granted by ArenaNet under this agreement but does not affect any other provisions of this agreement.

I think we have not enough evidence to decide either way. We are just the baying mob.

But I do think that if someone is found cheating they need to lose all their accounts. They have to take a hard line on this stuff to send the message to anyone else who might be considering crossing the line.

I highly doubt they ban for account sharing.. i have never heard a single example of that.

The main problem here is that i have never cheated and funny enough i dont even have a REASON to cheat, i just enjoy the game and can afford whatever.

I have also helped make a community – lead them for months just because they told me not to stop. I ended up being mentioned in the song “Silverwastes Serenade” (anet used other song from them on their hot launch stream even) and all that.

I helped people, i went out of my way to make something good out of this game instead of just playing it. There are many people on europe side that can vouch for this.

All this does not prove that i have not cheated but surely it is at least enough to have a second look at this decision. I really feel bad, couldnt sleep and now hardly eating my dinner. It really hurts to see the company i love banning me from the game i love and ending a part of my life. I am attached to this game not only for gameplay but for people in it too. The risk for cheating is well not worth the reward for me at this point and that is obvious to anyone that wants to take a look at my account

Fermi.2409:

Which is where the disagreement lies. Banning all of someone’s accounts accounts because they broke the rules on some of them is ridiculous with a couple of possible exceptions (for example, abusing exploits on one account to feed gold/materials to a main account).

Make F2P account, send just enough to level to 80, go 1vZerg in WvW and win a few times, get banned, repeat with new account. Ad infinitum. We don’t have access to the logs so our best guess can only come from tyu’s word (which may or may not be true).

Fermi.2409:

Say I have 3 accounts and decided to share one with a friend. I get caught. Do I deserve to have all of my accounts banned or just the one that was shared/had the rules broken? Personally, I’m solidly in the “just the one account, if at all” camp. The ToS are agreed to on a per account basis; how can they be applied across multiple accounts?

You were the one that originally agreed to the ToS, not your friend. It’d still be account sharing.

Fermi.2409:

Ellieanna.5027:

It wasn’t his friend logging on his computer, he actually said he logged into his friend’s account on his computer. That is a HUGE difference.

Just taking things at face value, that’s interesting that it would get his account banned at all; if anything, I’d think it would be the friend’s account. Not that they’d even be able to get you for account sharing unless you’re a moron and admit to it ingame or the login location of the account bounces around the country at a rate faster then it’s possible to travel and they have some reason to look at it.

Instead of having the 9 accounts tyu logged in to, it likely would’ve ended up with the accounts his friend logged in to banned. As for catching account sharing, see my copy/paste of an easy to read registry key that’s unique for each Windows installation.

tyu.9470:

I highly doubt they ban for account sharing.. i have never heard a single example of that.

Yep. It’s not the account sharing itself that get’s you banned, but it’s what identifies the perceived owner. And if that owner is deemed cheating, you are banned through it.

tyu.9470:

All this does not prove that i have not cheated but surely it is at least enough to have a second look at this decision.

Pretty much this. All I can say is hopefully it does get a second look, and that the best way to not get banned like this in the future is to not log in to other accounts.

Thanks for all the support too, i know it is hard to believe a stranger’s words. I really do not want to lose my account and my brother’s (which are the only 2 that i use for my own gains – i have never taken something out of any other account i only logged to help 2 friends.. i dont know what the other 5 accounts are).

And Gaile, Chris i am sorry that i logged in to help my friends when they asked me to. I will not do this anymore if necessary.. but i swear to you i have not gained any kind of gold or item from these supposedly other accounts of mine and you can see this for yourself.

Fermi.2409:

Qugi.2653:

Fermi.2409:

The same person with two accounts violated the rules; they should be punished.

Fix that for you.

Which is where the disagreement lies. Banning all of someone’s accounts accounts because they broke the rules on some of them is ridiculous with a couple of possible exceptions (for example, abusing exploits on one account to feed gold/materials to a main account).

Say I have 3 accounts and decided to share one with a friend. I get caught. Do I deserve to have all of my accounts banned or just the one that was shared/had the rules broken? Personally, I’m solidly in the “just the one account, if at all” camp. The ToS are agreed to on a per account basis; how can they be applied across multiple accounts?

Ellieanna.5027:

It wasn’t his friend logging on his computer, he actually said he logged into his friend’s account on his computer. That is a HUGE difference.

Just taking things at face value, that’s interesting that it would get his account banned at all; if anything, I’d think it would be the friend’s account. Not that they’d even be able to get you for account sharing unless you’re a moron and admit to it ingame or the login location of the account bounces around the country at a rate faster then it’s possible to travel and they have some reason to look at it.

You missed the very important part of my post, so I’ll say it again.

We don’t know the whole story.

Somone else claimed that they were innocent in a gold scheme. He was friends with a gold seller. Went to that persons house, logged in his account. Even send gold back and forth. And feels he was banned wrong.

We don’t know the whole story.

The guy you are trying to defend could be lying out of his teeth.
Anet could have found accounts with the same name, birthday, IP use. And banned all of those.

We don’t know the whole story.

Fermi.2409:

Even if someone is cheating with 2 accounts it seems ridiculous to me to ban everything of theirs.

Imagine if someone had 10 books. 8 were purchased, 2 were stolen. The police go in and take away all 10 books. It just doesn’t seem right imo

Not at all. It is a SERVICE, not a property. You -the player- have to agree to the service terms in order to utilize the service.

A better example would be if someone purchased season pass to a football team’s games. The then get banned from the home team stadium for drunken rowdiness that also gets them booted mid-game on the season opener. They would NOT get a refund for any of their additional tickets for the season pass, that is for sure (although they could try to scalp them, illegal as that is).

Now when they say that you -the player- can get permanently banned from the game, they do mean you -the individual user- can get banned. Which is to say that when you’re caught cheating on one of multiple accounts, that reflects that you -the player user- are a cheater who they do not want playing their game with ANY account. Period.

I bet that whoever owns the dirty account you logged in to can answer where the other 4 clean + 1 dirty account come from; chances are it’s a group of two or three people who frequently share them. By sharing you ‘associated’ yourself with it.

(Of course, like Elieanna said, that’s assuming what’s said here is all truthful)

Fermi.2409:

Which is where the disagreement lies. Banning all of someone’s accounts accounts because they broke the rules on some of them is ridiculous with a couple of possible exceptions (for example, abusing exploits on one account to feed gold/materials to a main account).

Say I have 3 accounts and decided to share one with a friend. I get caught. Do I deserve to have all of my accounts banned or just the one that was shared/had the rules broken? Personally, I’m solidly in the “just the one account, if at all” camp. The ToS are agreed to on a per account basis; how can they be applied across multiple accounts?

Interesting stance on this matter, almost as if accounts should be considered as self acting beings? Personally I am of the opinion that “Accounts” don’t cheat by themselves, it is the person behind the account that cheats. And cheaters are to be sanctioned. So if the cheater owns several accounts the sanctions should also be of effect on all accounts (what an appropriate sanction is for each situation then is a different discussion).

And indeed, ToS/User Agreement are confirmed per account: confirmed and entered in to by the customer (individual person). An account is merely one of the subjects of the ToS. It is not a party to the agreement, the customer (individual person) however is. So if a customer (individual person) owns 10 accounts, cheats on one account, then it is still a breach of ToS by the customer (individual person) and as such the customer (individual person) puts all it’s accounts at risk by doing so.

So let’s not pretend that it is the account that is doing something that is not allowed and that other accounts of the same person should not be effected: it is the person behind the account that is doing this.

Chris Cleary.8017:

tyu.9470:

I am sure you’ll agree that false positives happen EVERY time you do ban waves no matter how much you try to check.

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

So you’re banning the person, not the account(s) ?

tyu.9470:

I highly doubt they ban for account sharing.. i have never heard a single example of that.

They probably don’t. But when account sharing makes it difficult for ANET to tell if an account is owned by a known cheater or not, ANET isn’t going to try and tell the difference. Either way the accounts owner broke the rules and thus the person deserves a ban.

DoctorDing.5890:

I think we have not enough evidence to decide either way. We are just the baying mob.

Many of us have been through similar discussions enough times to know that cheaters regularly lie about why they were banned to try and get sympathy from the community.

Have a read of the people complaining about being banned for inoffensive names if you want to see examples of such lies.

Chris Cleary.8017:

Cheating on 2 of your 9 accounts got all 9 of them banned.

How do you determine which accounts belong to the same user?

I am also concerned with the whole, this is final attitude, and not giving users a chance to defend themselves, or even telling them what exactly they are accused of. I am sure you could find in 9 out of 10 users is violating the TOS in some way; half aren’t aware of it or are using something to prevent killing there left mouse button, or software that came with there mouse/keyboard etc.