Guild Wars 2

Hello I created guild <We Do Not Pay[FEES]> this guild is for people who would like to save some money by avoiding TP’s 15% fee. They will trade via guild bank because emails may disappear(it happens,you marked my friend as gold seller when he sent some golds to friend for 200g in bank achievement and your system stopped that email and he never received those golds,only your message with explanation that you think he is gold seller ..bla…bla…bla)
My question : Is this guild against your rules of conduct/user agreement or something like this? Before I start inviting players I would like to know if I can get banned because of this and If it’s against your rules,I will delete this guild of course. Thanks for reply

Shouldn’t be against the rules. But do not expect any sort of help if someone scams you or get scammed.

nice so i can without problem organize this, FYI we want to make this awesome guild because game lacks Trading straight player-to-player.

Thanks for Answer, Can be closed now.

So of a player in a guild with withdrawal privileges takes out an item they aren’t supposed to, ANet is going to step in? I thought ANet doesn’t get involved in guild politics. If this is allowed then you would be openning the door to other such breaks of agreements with who can take o it what from a guild bank or trove.

Not that a scammer shouldn’t be punished, but a trading guild shouldn’t have an exception to the polocy on not getting involved in guild politics.

Seera.5916:

So of a player in a guild with withdrawal privileges takes out an item they aren’t supposed to, ANet is going to step in? I thought ANet doesn’t get involved in guild politics. If this is allowed then you would be openning the door to other such breaks of agreements with who can take o it what from a guild bank or trove.

Not that a scammer shouldn’t be punished, but a trading guild shouldn’t have an exception to the polocy on not getting involved in guild politics.

I don’t thnk you understood Talon’s post. He said it’s not agenst the rules, but they are not going to get involved if a trade goes bad.

Really it wouldn’t be hard to set up. Every one gets put in a rank that only has deposit privileges and then when two people agree to trade they both deposit the items to trade and the leader withdraws and delivers the item to complete the trade.

If you guys wounder about Trading Guild i want to make, read more here :
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Trading-Guild/first#post4580408

simplesimon.2084:

Seera.5916:

So of a player in a guild with withdrawal privileges takes out an item they aren’t supposed to, ANet is going to step in? I thought ANet doesn’t get involved in guild politics. If this is allowed then you would be openning the door to other such breaks of agreements with who can take o it what from a guild bank or trove.

Not that a scammer shouldn’t be punished, but a trading guild shouldn’t have an exception to the polocy on not getting involved in guild politics.

I don’t thnk you understood Talon’s post. He said it’s not agenst the rules, but they are not going to get involved if a trade goes bad.

Really it wouldn’t be hard to set up. Every one gets put in a rank that only has deposit privileges and then when two people agree to trade they both deposit the items to trade and the leader withdraws and delivers the item to complete the trade.

Ah, yes, misread it.

Being in guild format personally makes me less likely to risk player to player trade.

Outside of a guild, at least the person who scammed me can be punished. Within a guild, it’s not something that ANet polices. Both the scammer and the intended party had withdrawal privileges, and ANet doesn’t get involved with guild politics.

Make sure your security is top-notch. Advertising you may have items of much worth in your Guild bank may attract those of questionable scruples.

Remember, if your account, or anyone who has access to the Guild bank’s account is compromised, the CS Team will not replace any items/gold lost.

Good luck.

I think this is quite a cool idea. If you manage to pull this through properly, it would be very cool to see you “entering the trade market”.

Evon Gnashblade does seem to have monopoly on all trades around Tyria, and runs quite the capitalisic regime. Think about the amount of gold he profits on his trades in total.

If you get a new trading company up and running, with a reputation for quick and 100% scam-free trades, it would seem Evon finally gets some competition.

Only one thing: please don’t do this for free. Just make it cheaper than going through Evan (say: 5%?). After all, if you can offer players a cheaper alternative without reduced quality, why shouldn’t you benefit from it?

I wish you the best of luck!

it whouldnt be free but 1-2% should be nice for profit, the problem is for now, build a trust, and it cant start without atleast 1 trade that whould be sucessfull so player A and B whould recomend it to their friends and so on…

also Thanks For Support !

As Talon has said, it’s not against the rules to setup a guild like this, and they do not forbid “gentleman’s agreements” between different players who want to trade items outside of the TP. However, if something goes wrong, they will not take action to give players the items/money they are owed. (Although they will ban scammers.)

It basically comes down to “trust”. If you intend to be the final arbiter of trades (e.g. all guild members can deposit into the guild bank, but only you can withdraw gold/items to send to the respective players), then somebody not holding up to their end of the bargain is not an issue. Of course, the question then is whether these random guild members can trust YOU; other games are rife with examples of players who setup long-established trading guilds or consortiums, some of them running for years on end, before the leader suddenly goes rogue, steals everything, and then blocks everybody. (EVE Online is notorious for this.) I’m not saying that this is your long-term intention, but this is a risk that anybody who uses your trading guild needs to be aware of.

The other factor is time. If you intend on being the final arbiter, there will eventually be times where you simply cannot be online to facilitate trades. Do these other players have to wait until you’re on? What if you’re never online at a time they are? (This is important, because the buyer or seller might change their mind and want to cancel the transaction.) If the guild becomes popular enough, this could result in a huge backlog, and eventually players might decide the lack of fees is just not worth the lost time in waiting. (And judging by the TP’s behaviour, there are a LOT of players who want instant gratification, price be kitten ed.) If you eventually branch out and hire trusted officers to arbitrate in your stead, then you’re also opening additional points of risk for the guild; any one of those officers could eventually go rogue. (Or they get hacked and the hackers break into the guild bank and steal everything.)

So again, while all of this is “legal”, the risks and complexities involved means that I’ll stick with the TP for my trading. Other players are free to make their own decision after they are educated about the risks.

[Middle-Man]
atm The only middle-man whould be me, and thats why im sure no scam whould happend , ofc looking for another trustfull leader will be hard but for now i got idea that middle-man whould have to deposid cash advance but in other guild which whould be only for cash advance,items/golds that wasnt delivred ( player B disappears in midle of trading while not picking his items/golds, after he returns he will get it ) and he cant withdrow it without my permission so if he scams i will be able to repay it by his cash advance, and by his cash advance he whould be able to trade ( for example : new middleman puts a 500g in Special Guild (Trading Guild Bank)as a cash advance, for now he can make transactions where both item and golds have same or less value like his cash advance so this whould solve any possible scam that middle-man may do, if middle-man whould like to leave, he whould recive his cash advance back ofc.
Also we are not (and we cant) forcing any popular/trustfull,commander player to do this, its up to them if they whould like to do this so dont write stuff like * who whould do that, why they whould do this etc tec…*
Also i dont think that alot of transactions request whould came to point where i couldnt do it alone. This Idea will require alot of time and patience to became that popular and you guys already writen it.

[Transactions]
There was said that stuff with low fees whould be no problem for players to put on TP and stuff with high fees whould not be trusted to guild. Yes you got point there BUT
I can say that for everyone is fee diffrendly insignificant, some rich guy with 10k golds will not care about fee, but guy who just droped dusk it means alot, he has to literarly farm to just put that item on TP.
I whould start with low stuff, like skins/T6 mats/and items under 500g ofc if someone will trust me that much i will mange any transaction and after every succesful transaction made by middle-man ( me ) , he (me ) will grow in trust becouse player A and B will recomend it to their friends and so on, the thing is, its not just nice for seller that he can trade without fees but also its nice for buyer (seller will offer his stuff for less golds than on TP so buyer has intrest to buy it this way )
The next thing that was pointed was that player who whould like to trade whould have to wait until player B and middle-man whould have time to make transaction, yes this is very likely to happen and you are right, but its up to seller,buyer if they wants to save golds and wait or save time and lose golds, you may say that item they want to trade can change in Price but even there he whould lose more money on fee than selling it a bit lower in guild.
This whould work trough mail or direct whisper to me about transaction player A and B wants to make.
[Security]
Inculpatus cedo.9234 :: What ensures this website is secure? How will anyone know the information placed there is legitimate? Who will do the background checks, and how would they be able to, anyway? ::
Nice point, you got me there but now Im thinking about puting informations about middle-man on forum here or on any other forums like this one
On web could be things like general information, a video where it shows how it works, and also orders and offers made by people, so someone wants to buy Winters LB skin, he whould check the web and see that someone is offering it, so he joins guild and contacts seller and middle-man

[Trust]
I know, you are traying to say that this idea is impossible because there whould be trust issue , but after few succesful trades , the Trust for our guild whould grow up to the point where none whould belive about geting scamed in our guild.
I sow alot of LFG where people are offering or demand precusors/skins/weapons so this whould be solve for it

jezz had to copy this from my post in general discussion.

Per other posts in this forum, Anet will pursue and punish those that break agreed upon transactions (as long as proof of scamming exists), but will NOT correct the transaction itself (no reimbursements or refunds for items or gold lost).

Buyer (or Trader) beware!

This is a horrible idea, BTW. The minute you believe you won’t be scammed and “trust” a large transaction is when it will happen. You have been warned.

Best case senerio is you loose lots of gold and items while your dishonest guild members get suspended or perma-banned. I guess eventually you will have several honest victims to trade with….the question is if it’s worth it for a 15% fee that the game actually NEEDS to control the economy?

Brother Grimm
Answer me then, how is it possible that people still Trade via mail ? In LFG u can find people selling precusors,skins and even legendaries..
This guild whould be compromise for those who whould like to trade without any worries and whoud pay less fee ( 1-2%), and in my main post about this guild, i have writen whole system that i guess you havent read.. Trades in guild whould be recorded and saved so later people can look and see that it actualy works..

I dont care about Economy control BS, i dont like to pay such big fees while im selling, the game is already grind as hell , and you have to grind even to sell your dem item… think about that, yes trust isuee is biggest problem for start but i will make sure that it wont happen.
Please before you write anything like : scam or stuff like that, think about it,this is what evryone has in mind , no need to rewrite this 1000x times..

Gold sinks are not BS. The game’s economy would crash without Gold sinks. Fortunately, not many will risk player-to-player trading, thus avoiding the game’s largest Gold sink.

HHunter.5094:

Brother Grimm
Answer me then, how is it possible that people still Trade via mail ? In LFG u can find people selling precusors,skins and even legendaries..
This guild whould be compromise for those who whould like to trade without any worries and whoud pay less fee ( 1-2%), and in my main post about this guild, i have writen whole system that i guess you havent read.. Trades in guild whould be recorded and saved so later people can look and see that it actualy works..

I dont care about Economy control BS, i dont like to pay such big fees while im selling, the game is already grind as hell , and you have to grind even to sell your dem item… think about that, yes trust isuee is biggest problem for start but i will make sure that it wont happen.
Please before you write anything like : scam or stuff like that, think about it,this is what evryone has in mind , no need to rewrite this 1000x times..

You can not make sure that a scam won’t happen. There is no way you won’t be able to. Especially once you start hiring other middle men. But it could still happen beforehand.

Here’s a situation:

Bob is a scammer. But he knows it won’t be easy to scam one person whose been forewarned about scams. So he initiates trades with mid-ranged priced items. To build up trust. And then he’ll periodically do tons of trades in a short period of time. To build up the expectation that he’ll do lots of trades in a short period of time. He tells you and any other officer that he just really hates the TP fees.

He soon earns the trust of you, other officers (if any), and the regulars. Soon you need a new officer (either to fill a time spot or to replace a time spot filled by a retiring middle man). You choose Bob. He seems trustworthy, he’s done tons of trades with you and has given no red flags that he’s a scammer.

Bob behaves himself for a while, to build up that he’s trustworthy as a middle man, even doing a few BIG priced items (like a couple of legendaries) until he’s put in charge of the transaction of a legendary for gold when the other officers aren’t around. The two parties deposit the gold and the legendary, Bob then withdrawals them himself (he needs this power to move the items should one party be mia) and leaves the guild.

How would you stop a person like Bob? Someone who gave off no signs he was a scammer until he showed his true colors by running off with a ton of gold and a legendary.