Guild Wars 2

Conncept.7638:

Bringing this up because of a change that may occur on the december 10th patch (stickied above) has made a matter which has been important since launch even more important.

Attunements are supposed to be the ele equivalent of weapon swapping are they not?

Why then are they affected by chill and proc confusion? More often than not elementalists have to switch attunements to cleanse, if they do not have cleansing wave (a trait which will possibly be made more difficult to obtain on december 10th), attempting to cleanse confusion kills them, as the confusion procs upon attunement swapping as if it is an ability rather than a weapon swap. Additionally, chill does far more than slow the skills on recharge, its affecting attunements prevents you from getting to skills you haven’t even used yet.

Now I’m all for something being done about cleansing wave, if a trait is flat-out required for every single build in a class, something needs to be done about it. But this needs to be fixed first or the attunement swap changes coming on the 10th may be all for naught as every player is forced in to the water tree just to keep from constantly dying to conditions.

1st bolded part: because when elementalist start spending trait points, the f1-f4 “attunement swaps” ALSO become spells. and it’s the spell status that triggers confusion and chill side effects. all of the elemental 15 point minor traits convert the swaps into spells, and so does elemental attunement trait. any other trait that triggers off of attunement swap also changes the swap into a spell.

2nd bolded part: what do you mean? do you mean that chill is affecting the recharge of attunement swapping to just the element you swapped into? or do you mean slowing the recharge of the global attunement swap? or do you mean slowing the recharge of the weapon skills associated with the attunement you just swapped into?

what i think you’re saying: because chill affects the cooldown of water attunement when i swap into water attunement, i lose the ability to use the water weapon skills i haven’t used because i immediately swapped out of water (because i only wanted the AoE condition removal), because the water weapon skills are now gated behind a longer recharge to get back into water attunement (because of chill).

Guhracie.3419:

Conncept.7638:

Guhracie.3419:

I’d say the fact that you can swap to four weapon sets as opposed to the general 2 weapon sets balances out things like confusion/chill affecting it.

That makes no sense, elementalist is the bottom tier class right now in every single game mode. We can use a staff in WvW, and give people conjures in dungeons, that’s pretty much all we have at this point that competes with any other class in usefullness. Having 20 abilities versus 10 does not add to our power in any way shape or form, it just adds to the complication of playing, which I and a lot of players like and consider fun, but which we would appreciate not punishing us for playing correctly, for example, trying to remove a condition causing the condition to kill us.

Azure Prower.8701:

Also why isn’t this in the elementalist forums?

Because it’s largely about the Dec 10th changes which were discussed here in GD and are currently stickied at the top of the page.

I don’t really like how elementalists play, so I’m not an expert on them. However, the ability to swap between 20 abilities doesn’t help you out at all? Really? You see no benefit to having twice as many available abilities as the rest of the professions?

Also, I’m in no way arguing that it’s fair or that it’s working, and I can’t change how the profession plays as I don’t have an Anet tag. I was merely offering a suggestion that makes sense to me. Especially given that I used to main an engineer, who can have up to four different weapon kits, at the cost of all their utility slots.

i am responding to the bolded part , about the misconception that elementalists have twice the skills of other classes. most people forget to add in the fact that many melee weapons have chain-skill-auto-attacks. many people totally ignore the class mechanic skills of other classes (like death shroud, guardian virtues, mesmer shatters) that also add abilities to the classes. sure, ele’s have 20 weapon skills, but other classes’ f1-f4 skills are just as powerful. the guardian virtues are basically 4 free signets. engineer kits provide them with even MORE weapon skills than ele’s have. sure, ele’s can fill their utility bars full of conjures, too… but lumping a general statement that ele’s always run with twice as many skills available is an insult to every other class in the game. in my bacon deficient opinion of course.

my other biggest gripe about elementalist. (sorry for the double post, but this is actually a separate topic) is that our 25 point traits are the same as traits that other classes get at 10 points.

for example:

earth 25… +10% damage when endurance is full… ranger can choose this at 10 points in skirmishing (precision)

water 25… +2% damage per active boon… warrior gets this at 10 points in strength. (i think it’s strength)

fire 25… +10% damage against burning targets… compared to 10 point investment in earth to receive +20% duration for bleeding, and +5% damage to bleeding targets.

my biggest problem with elementalist right now, is that i feel like i’m being forced to play melee…. yet there are no melee spells, no melee weapons. (even dagger / dagger is usable at 600 range. melee is less than 200)

to explain:
evasive arcana gives a spell at the END of a dodge roll. most of those spells damage foes or apply conditions. i thought the point of dodging was to get away from your foe, to avoid attacks. now this trait wants me to use my escape and evade mechanic basically as an offensive leap INTO melee combat.

fire 5:
is only useful in melee, when i’m struck. elementalist has the lowest hit points of any class, the best defense is to not get hit. given a choice to dodge roll, knockback, blind, burning retreat, or any other plethora of evades / control skills at ele disposable, why in Tyria would i let something hit me? just to apply a 1 second burn to them? that’s no trade off. fire 5 needs to be A ) buffed, and B ) made into a 10 point trait so i’m not forced to take it when it’s useless as a ranged playstyle. and c ) something else should take fire 5 place that is actually useful 100% of the time i’m attuned to fire.

fire 15:
is another trait that wants me to play melee style. it only hits enemies close to me. at least air 15 hits target at range. at least water 15 heals nearby allies, which is useful in both melee and ranged playstyles. so again, when my playstyle is defined by staying at range, how does this trait benefit me at all?

i use staff because i want to play at range, and both my fire 5 and 15 traits do not benefit my playstyle in any way shape or form. neither does evasive arcana. now, i just stop at 20 arcana so that’s not really an issue, but speccing 30 in fire gives me 2 wasted traits, when i should have 6 useful ones.

you know, since you’re balancing thieves around their stamina regen, and decided to increase base stamina regen, why not just make elemental attunement a base part of elementalists? you’re already balancing elementalists around that one trait, and making everything else weaker because of it, except that you’re buffing thieves by giving them a base passive, while nerfing elementalists by forcing every one of us to spend more points in arcana.

instead of forcing everybody to choose between their class mechanic trait lines or something else… why not auto grant the class mechanic line? (ele-arcana, warriors- discipline, rangers- beastmaster, etc) THAT would open up more build diversity than any other change you could possibly make.

JonPeters.5630:

I still believe there is work to be done at the grandmaster tier in Fire at the very minimum and that Air and Water are the only truly good grandmaster choice right now. There are also still a handful of just terrible traits that will still get looked at, but we felt like we were already bordering on changing too much.

i feel the same way for the most part. fire needs a lot of work. i trait fire because of role playing, but it feels like i could trait air or water and it wouldn’t make more of a difference on the damage.

as for changing too much, don’t worry about that. i think i can speak for the majority of elementalist when i say we’d rather relearn the class if it means we gain viability other than dagger / dagger. which i refuse to use. absolutely despise that playstyle on an ele. we need more damage options. and buffing fire could just be the solution for that, if it’s done right.

i quoted myself from the main feedback thread, below, but edited in some ideas for new 25s.

Forgotten Legend.9281:

ELEMENTALIST

1) why not combine elemental attunement and lingerig elements? this would be the new arcana 15.

2) move Conjurer to Arcana to fill the hole left by elemental attunement, because there is only ONE trait for conjures, and it doesn’t make sense in fire line, as there are 5 conjures spread over all 4 elements. (and no Arcane Conjure)

3) i don’t really understand having defensive traits in the fire line, especially fire 5. i’d much rather fire 5 be changed to give power per level while attuned to fire, or +300 range while attuned to fire. leaving defensive selectable traits is fine, allowing for choices of course. the 5, 15, and 25 should all be offensive traits.

4) the elemental 15 traits basically turn attunement swap buttons into spells. and then there are master traits that add extra effects to the attunement swaps, by adding AoE boons. i’d much rather see those 15s rolled into a single arcana master trait, because in my opinion, that would be much more useful than evasive arcana (see point 6 below.) combining all the 15s and all 4 of the master traits that buff the F1-F4 keys could be a grandmaster trait. and would really then feel like a grandmaster of attunement swapping.

5) after freeing up the 15s, the 25s would be moved into the 15 slots, because frankly, the 25s are copies of other classes’ ADEPT traits. (+10% damage while endurance is full, +10% damage while target has x condition) and then new elemental 25s would be made. that would be useful no matter what attunement you’re in. for example, all projectiles pierce targets. all projectile spells launch +1 projectile. all fields last longer. combos you finish do +20% more damage. spells have 33% chance to become projectile finishers. +x AoE targets

6) i don’t understand the reasoning for grandmaster arcana traits at all. evasive arcana is a copy of a master trait for every other class. and in my opinion, is not worthy of grandmaster status. and it feels more like it belongs in Earth, as earth line seems to be the defensive line. the other one only affects 5 utility skills, which means a grandmaster trait is wasted on at most, 3 skills on a skill bar, more likely 2 or 1. i’ll never trait 30 arcana as long as we have such weak grandmaster traits.

EDIT: i just realized, that if Evasive Arcana gained a spell at the start of a dodge roll (in addition to at the end of a dodge roll), it would actually be useful for defense. and would then merit grandmaster status.

ELEMENTALIST

1) why not combine elemental attunement and lingerig elements? this would be the new arcana 15.

2) move Conjurer to Arcana to fill the hole left by elemental attunement, because there is only ONE trait for conjures, and it doesn’t make sense in fire line, as there are 5 conjures spread over all 4 elements. (and no Arcane Conjure)

3) i don’t really understand having defensive traits in the fire line, especially fire 5. i’d much rather fire 5 be changed to give power per level while attuned to fire, or +300 range while attuned to fire. leaving defensive selectable traits is fine, allowing for choices of course.

4) the elemental 15 traits basically turn attunement swap buttons into spells. and then there are master traits that add extra effects to the attunement swaps. i’d much rather see those 15s rolled into a single arcana master trait, because in my opinion, that would be much more useful than evasive arcana. combining all the 15s and all 4 of the master traits that buff the F1-F4 keys could be a grandmaster trait. and would really then feel like a grandmaster of attunement swapping.

5) after freeing up the 15s, the 25s would be moved into the 15 slots, because frankly, the 25s are copies of other classes ADEPT traits. (+10% damage while endurance is full, +10% damage while target has x condition) and then new elemental 25s would be made. that would be useful no matter what attunement you’re in. for example, all projectiles pierce targets.

6) i don’t understand the grandmaster arcana traits at all. evasive arcana is a copy of a master trait for every other class. and in my opinion, is not worthy of grandmaster status. the other one only affects 5 utility skills, which means a grandmaster trait is wasted on at most, 3 skills on a skill bar, more likely 2 or 1. i’ll never trait 30 arcana as long as we have such weak grandmaster traits.

just a reminder… The Pact did not BUILD Fort Trinity. the fort was already there, looking at the northeast shore of Orr. Trahearne suggested supplying the fort as a means to launch the assault against the undead as a forward command post. and the player character simply names it “Fort Trinity.”

as for Arah… i would love another explorable zone in Orr. there seems to be enough space for at least 3 more zones there, possibly as many as 6, not counting the Scavenger’s Causeway. i think it would be simple enough to code it so that once you complete Arah Story Mode Dungeon, access would be granted to the rest of Orr.

Vizier Khilbron was turned into a Lich when he used Abaddon’s forbidden magic to repel the Charr invasion. in other words, the now dead former god Abaddon turned him into a Lich.

that’s not to say that Zhaitan couldn’t have turned someone into a lich, however. i imagine that the undead dragon would have had that power.

as for that bad joke above… isn’t “The Monotones” the band that Ben Stein started?

hmmm, so Livia might still be alive and wandering around Tyria… i hope Palawa Joko doesn’t recruit her for his evil schemes… that would depress me into a meteor-nado rage…

#bacon

now if only we had a ground target option of “instant cast on target”

well, how about this: remove all the 15 point traits from the elemental lines, combine them into one trait, and make that new trait the 15 point arcana trait. and then make new traits for the 15 pointers in the all 4 of the elemental trait lines.

and give us some traits to buff our summons!

yeah, ele traits really are weak compared to other classes. i mean really. ele gets 25-point traits that match other classes’ 10-point traits… meaning of course, that adept level other classes get access to traits that ele’s have to be grandmaster to get. example? +10% damage when endurance is full. ele: 25 point earth. ranger: 10 point skirmish.

awge.3852:

Spitu.8657:

Entangle is still to easy to escape.

They seriously need to fix this, the only way for it to be viable is to stack it with multiple conditions. What they should do is to make it work so that the vines will continue to root you; unless you escape the area where the Entangle was casted. You can make it a max of 5 targets at a time, but a continuous 15 second pulse of rooting or something like that every 3 seconds. If this seems overpowering compared to the current use, then make it a grand master trait then in Nature Magic.

Dropping this off in the suggestion forum, the rest is up to the devs.

doesn’t the tooltip say that, in order to escape, the vines must be destroyed? if anyone is able to escape without destroying the vines, that is a seriously game-breaking bug.

making character classes more powerful in PvE with PvE-only buffs.

a) for example, giving the class mechanic trait line for free (ie elementalist arcana traits, ranger’s beastmaster, etc) ie the class doesn’t have to spend trait points to earn the class mechanic stats and traits in PvE.

or

b) giving each class a new pVe trait line that is autogranted as teh class levels up

sorry, but other classes can swap weapons, therby swapping roles, mid combat.

elementalist, once in combat, is stuck with a certain role based on the weapon. if ele is supposed to be the jack of all trades, the damage skills need to do more damage. especially the auto attacks. swapping attunement for elementalists should be equivalent to swapping weapons for other classes, but it’s not even close.

hmm, for my ele… in PvE… conjures and summons should not have a 60 second time limit. conjures are already limited by charges. they’re not Tequila (Tquatl) they don’t need a DPS time limit. summons, even with more HP, disappear after 60 seconds anyway, so what’s the point? they don’t even explode when they die.

when Ele’s switch attunement, both conjures and summons should spread the elemental boons and elemental attunement spells as though they were the elementalist. basically for a double dose of the fire explosion, the speed boost, heal, etc. they would all act as sources for the “nearby” allies. allies near both the ele, and the conjured weapons, and the summoned elementals would all the the boons / buffs, and all enemies nearby the elementalist, and the conjured weapons, and the summoned elementals would all suffer from the damage.

look at the mesmer illusions, they’re limited only by “in-combat”. otherwise, the mesmer keeps spawning them and decides when to sacrifice them for other effects.

look at the necromancer monions. they get summoned, and stay till they are beaten in combat or consumed by the necromancer for other effects.

look at the elementalist summons. they die after 60 seconds no matter what. and when they die, nothing happens. no other effects. the elementalist can’t consume them for other effects. it’s a waste of two skills. one of them is elite?! and has a 3 minute cooldown. considering the NON elite one has a 45 second cooldown, the elite should be better somehow. and it’s not.

well, ANET is the only MMO company out there that doesn’t put weekly locks on the dungeons, and then complains that people are farming the dungeons too much…

well, how about staff /fire/ 3 skill (flame burst?) missing when the auto-attack fireball hits… they have the same range, except fireball is a projectile, while flame burst only requires line of sight…

wow… just wow…

glyph of renewal was the only reason i was able to complete several personal story instances on my elementalist. it’s bad enough that all our elites suck and our utility skills don’t offer any flavor or DPS… (sorry, but as squishy as ele’s are, we should have perma pets, like Rift) it’s really sad that ele’s have the smallest HP pools AND the lowest DPS…

warning spoilers abound*****

i think part of the trouble… is that we’re simply told by our order leader… that trahearne did something really important for said leader. and that’s it… and then we help trahearne along his path of the wylde hunt, and then as soon as his quest is over, bam, he’s done. “here, take over the pact commander, and good look taking out zhaitan!”

i actually semi respected him for raising a glass with me to Tybalt every now and then throughout my story, especially since he helped Tybalt and me rescue Demmi from her father’s agents by sneaking her out of lion’s arch… but then to just simply quit once he accomplished his wylde hunt? that would have made a LOT more sense if he was almost fatally wounded during “against the corruption”… but that obviously wasn’t the case… after everything we’d been through… i rather felt abandoned, even if he did basicly step down as marshall…

i chose order of whispers because my elementalist human character became rather infatuated with Anise, and the order of whispers pretty much use the same tactics Anise does: lure the enemy into a trap.

my charr warrior, on the other hand, is intimidating and spins around in a cloud of axes grumbling incomprehensibly. by the way, it was the only job he could find after they recast his most famous television role: the tazmanian devil on looney toons. so, yes, he’s going into the vigil.

well, i see i was robbed… doubly so…

after completing victory or death, one party member linked 3 exotic level 80 medium armour pieces that he/she won as rewards. was a medium armour class, and the party leader.

i, an elementalist, won a masterwork hammer, a masterwork medium armour piece, and a masterwork light armour piece.

if the party leader gets all the nice loot, and nobody else does, something defenitely needs to be fixed.

these are from the exotic bags obviously…
all the boss chests gave me were “fine” junk.

i suppose i’ll have to slow down then… think i’ll just complain about the Mouth of Zhaitan fight or something…