I like how you just decided what things should and shouldn’t do. That’s a convincing argument. I won’t argue you’re numbers, other than to say that your comparisons aren’t very meaningful. It’s amusing that acknowledging power cleaves in the 10K range doesn’t seem to bother you at all … in fact you say it like that’s just normal play … but 4K conditions … how ruinous.
You sound really ignorant right there. I said power dps builds do burst dps from 2k-10k your every hit isnt a 10k. Power damage scales depending on how much armor, vitality and healing power based your enemy is. If you against a minstrel ele with power build you are not killing it.
Then I also said condition damage do dps 4k to insta down someone and conditions do 4k+ per tick. It doesn’t take much to keep reapplying conditions on your target.
What you did was, you took 4k from conditions and 10k from power while ignoring everything else I said and tried to prove that power is still superior. No it isn’t with the continuous buffs to condition dps power is lacking in every single way.
If you don’t understand how the game plays don’t comment on it
There also a lot of verily in the skills it self. Short power dmg skill tend to do much less dmg and scale worst with power where slower skills and longer cd skill tend to hit harder. Condis do the same dmg even if the skill is on a low cd or long short cast time or long and bleed is still a bleed.
In a lot of way condis kills different types of attks because if your just applying a condi at the end of the attk then all the wind up hit boxes etc.. mean next to nothing when it doing the same effect as say a 1 spam. That the problem with condis they water down all the skills in the game to an auto attk if your auto attk is not doing most of your condi then your not playing your condi class right or the class is not that good at condis.
Look at burn ele for raids it sits in fire and spams all of its skills the sec they come off of cd. Every thing on the burn ele is effectually an auto attk. Now take a power dmg ele (even in raid) the ele now needs to relay think about its rotation and it must swap atuments to get the most out of it effect.
If they are going to make ele a ammo base class with GoEP and the new arcain power they need to make the charged used up per attk interval (so a Paoe a charged is used per pule) not per person hit. I think that would go a long way to making ele very effective in wvw and open pve not so important in spvp and raids. A kind of you become a conjurer wepon added effect.
The meta are being pushed to only one dmg type its hard to just have fun if every one is running all in condi builds for wvw (where i think most ppl would have fun well for me).
You got to at least run 1 to 3 hard counters to condis or your going to die in secs never a fun thing. All the worst if you class needs to build a set way to do this.
Raids are the worst of meta builds and benchmarks out side of betting a boss the first time its more of a grind.
Open pve is ok all the better with storys. Some times it feels like a chore to do open pve but for the most part the first time is always enjoyable.
Spvp all about meta teams if you have fun dominating ppl that great if your being dominated its not so great.
In pvp (spvp / wvw) what it comes down to is being able to build crazy set up and have them work on some level with out being one shot/condi to death in secs. As for pve its about being able to do new things and minimizing having to do the same thing over and over.
I have a feeling you just out played these ppl the build / wepon / class you where playing was not important. Very impressive.
Rev getting condition buffs just made it super strong… like 50 stacks of torment on single target so easily.. its ridiculous
Sry all is lost.
Because every one running condis and unless you have a bot rev at your feet your going to die with in sec of a fight because there no amount of condi clear that can deal with the chilling death spam or burning spam in the game atm.
Dual boxing is legal if you pc can run gw2 2 times your good.
Oddly no one has brought this up but i think it fits.
How wvw players are moving over to the condi meta.
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I think raids in general is making the game most hostile. Though DPS benchmarks and healing benchmarks and def / hp benchmarks are never a helpful thing for a positive community.
At one point Anet was fearful of power creep and shouts where a power creep of cantrips but was able to help out your full pt. So they gave them a cast time. But Anet seemed to comply forget about the core classes just tempest has not been buff to reflect that new mind set comply.
I don’t know about hidden. Long before Heart of Thorns released, the Devs spoke about how the new maps/content would be more condition-centric.
Regardless, sometimes the Devs share what they are thinking about with upcoming balance patches, and sometimes they do not. I’m not sure which method receives more, or less, feedback. /shrug
Its one or the other they have a aim that they are trying to get or they are just throwing random things out there and hope something sticks (as in if the class is underused throw it an op effect and see what happens). I am just hopeful there mindfulness behind there choose of updates for the classes and how they have added in each elite spec and made though elite spec viable not so much the core classes.
So, do these ‘class tags’ change with each (or some) balance patch? How does that help a new player? Doesn’t seem any different than having Professions without a ‘class tag’. If these ‘class tags’ had been there since launch, the Elementalist would have had a power(?) tag, a new person would have spent much time and effort leveling, gearing, learning the Profession and ‘tag’, then balance changes happen, and the Elementalist’s tag changes to condi(?).
Unless one expects there to never be another balance patch, I’m not sure what advantage these ‘tags’ would be.
Maybe but it seems Anet has an ideal of how these classes should play and what rolls they should play keeping this info hidden not helping out any one.
Ele is a good example of what wrong (also realy all i know) Ele is the mages the pureset mages in ideal it should do the highest spike dmg or mages dmg in the game or at least highest dps (odd to see a mages class not doing high spike but dmg is dmg) at the same time its able to support (as mages do) but to build support on ele you need to go high tankly making your mages class more of a solder type of class not the mages. The same thing could be said for condi dmg dps builds (the oddly highest dps ele can pull off atm) as it tends to be a more tankly build. Its only power dmg where ele can be that ideal mages but its the weakest build ele has atm.
Ele maybe a mages but it is often build like a melee tank.
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Ele has been a mainstay in the meta since what 2014? Every time we see Anet change things we get the “Sky is Falling” threads from players about ele’s.
If they were some how nerfed out of the meta then so be it since they’ve been there for 3 years straight now.
p.s. FYI no class in the history of GW2 has been more OP then Ele. Remember 4x Ele winning a tournament with a bunch of no names beating pros? I do.
Its not about the sky falling its about how mindless the buffs / nerfs are. If you want to nerf ele protection up time you need to do more then kick one sec off of aura protection you need to deal with the underlining problem namely tempest’s protection up time. Ele core has been ok its tempest that is pushing it over the top in both def and akk. If you only go after the core ele your not fixing the power creep your simply making the power creep bigger.
Just to get this straight: the changes have made Power a loser or are Power and Condi more even?
For the most part power is the loser and condi is even more stronger after the update.
I get its both dps but condi comes with its own utility effect where power dmg is still only getting any type of utility from the attk having a condi in it self.
I get back to my ideal adding in tags for classes the game has been pushed into a roll game nearly a 3 type class game due to raids and elite specs. Is it that bad to be up frond about all of this?
My ideal of ele is a mages class that dose mostly dmg with support not a tank class who can take hits. If i am wrong then i am wrong. A new player needs to know at some level what they are getting them self into when they chose to level up a class.
I get what your saying but i am trying to point out that Anet is killing the play as you want for a lot of classes (i only realty know ele.) Ele was once the power dmg class that could down ppl with power dmg alone. Now its a heal bunker that also seems to have support that adds condi effects on other ppl. Anet has effectively make the arcain line work for one utility well and they are acting as if the other arcain utility are not even there.
I want my staff power ele back and to be on par with tempest air overload or at least condi dmg for over all classes. What ele is today is a must run tempest and every update after HoT has killed the core class to the point of making tempest the only real dmg line the class can take.
You have no idea, do you? Obsi flesh and earth protection aren’t that big of a deal.
As a zerk scepter focus ele I’d be more afraid of the fact that there is NO MORE PROC SIGILS = 30% of the damage is gone.
yeah, I meant it that way Im weak anyway and they still nerfing it more, but not adding something good. Fire skills of focus are really useless.
It baffles me why people think Ele was weak before patch. It definitely feels more challenging now. They nerfed skills across the board. Part of trying to dial down power creep
Ele as a bunker support never been bad but that is the last thing a class must play as before its comply out of the meta or viable for game types.
The power creep added was though tempest and its line NOT the core ele and they keep nerfing the core ele because of this. If they wanted to dial down the power creep they NEED to nerf tempest or the very power creep not the old things to fit the new.
What they are doing now is super shorted sighted and is going to be a problem down the rode for these mostly temp fixes that make ele viable now that will most likely lead to not being viable later on.
Ele cant do condi dmg because of atuments so they add in condi bust both aoe support and self condi. So now ele can be some what viable with condis but these are on charges and charges do not work well with aoe. As they drop the condi dmg on these effects it going to become more worthless on aoe skills and in a lot of ways the aoe and paoe of the ele skills tend to get in the of ele out put for condis.
So not fixing the fact condis are so locked in places with atuments a major core ele problem they are simply adding in counter productive and short sighted tools that only work in the moment that are going to get nerfed over time. The nerfs see to be aimed at the core ele to fix these op effects too making it even more of an issues over time.
The balancing with ele is a joke a bad one.
And it was nerf but they just simply nerfed the full line of arcain utility not just arcain power (all though i think chill on reapers is far better then they burn could ever be well for wvw.)
It seems from the last set of nerf anet has an ideal of HOW we should be playing these classes. As in the newest thing they add in the update is how they want use to play them. I can only talk to ele but it seems Anet wants ele to support only with both condi share and healing but they keep nerfing the core class to do so. So Anet you want us to play the way you see the classes you need to tag them with there rolls.
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At the rate they are destroying core ele i am not sure if there going to be any thing left for the “Weeb” line to use. I am kind of shocked they just make it a requirement to by the next expansion to even play ele any more.
Well they just nerf a GM arcain line trait because of one utility arcain power. Arcains are one of the most underused utility ele has and all but one effect arcain power is not worth using and they just nerf it for every thing. Anet has no ideal what they are doing at all with ele.
This is what i am talking about nerfing the core class just because they added in power creep in another way. Destroying the ele foundation because of the new things they added in.
Anet is comply unwilling to fix old effects to be viable they simply want to cover over there old error with new things.
What i do not get is why do they keep adding in effects that punish an ele for trying to maximized its skills aoe.
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""Arcane Power: The number of stacks this ability applies has been reduced from 5 to 4.
Elemental Surge: The duration of burning this ability applies has been reduced from 5 seconds to 4 seconds."Yep, already nerfed. I feel like a mesmer again.
Nothing like mesmer at least mesmer has a few tools that make them impossible to comply nerf ele is the weakest class in the game and Anet aims to keep it that way. Ele is at best a one trick class that can only build to do one thing well every thing else is lost because of it and often makes it seem viable. Its going to get nerf agen mark my words and every thing going to suffer because of it. They just nerf a GM trait that is weak on any other arcain skill BUT arcain power. So they did not just nerf the use of arcain power they nerfed the super underused arcain set.
Anet has no ideal what they are doing any more.
""Arcane Power: The number of stacks this ability applies has been reduced from 5 to 4.
Elemental Surge: The duration of burning this ability applies has been reduced from 5 seconds to 4 seconds."Yep, already nerfed. I feel like a mesmer again.
Nothing like mesmer at least mesmer has a few tools that make them impossible to comply nerf ele is the weakest class in the game and Anet aims to keep it that way. Ele is at best a one trick class that can only build to do one thing well every thing else is lost because of it and often makes it seem viable. Its going to get nerf agen mark my words and every thing going to suffer because of it. They just nerf a GM trait that is weak on any other arcain skill BUT arcain power. So they did not just nerf the use of arcain power they nerfed the super underused arcain set.
Anet has no ideal what they are doing any more.
I wasn’t aware fire DD was even a thing. If you’re using a glass build on an ele, your first mistake was getting in melee range of a necro. The same goes for a fire/air ele. If a necro gets up to you in melee range as a fire/air staff ele, then that’s entirely your fault.
It’s not a glass build, it has 17k health and 2600 toughness for DD, go check out 7s build on this forum. Only FA ele is perhaps glass but even then most run marauder getting up to 18k health and usually get nearly 2.5k armour from either food, runes, trinkets or rock barrier.
1. The range on DD is 300-400 not counting tickle me Elmo vapour blades.
2. Necros, both kinds, have 900-1200 range.So yeah nice try at making it sound like a L2P issue, sadly what you put was full of garbage. As I say anything but bunker eles have a hard time vs conditions at the moment, if the elite spec doesn’t bring ok clearing or resistance they you will have to run water attunement and water trait line to survive.
For the record I don’t think the new spec should be immune to conditions of have a cleanse all every 5s. Ele does need enough to be able to survive the silly condition meta we have now which at the moment ele has a hard time dealing with outside of its bunker build and would be impossible if you didn’t have water attunement.
2,600 armor is low unless you have perma protection or high healing power.
Only FA might have lower than 100% protection uptime, both almost certainly have 75% on any sensible build. The DD version runs gnashblade food so that’s -10% damage straight off the top.
Also in what world are we saying 2.6k is low?! Zerg guardians might have 3.2k most have about 3k.
Most non ele classes hit hard even with out high power. 2.8k seems about right to me well that what i tend to aim for (you lose a lot of dmg though).
Just more nerfs to the core ele because tempest has every thing or is simply an ele +1. So if the core ele has it and the tempest has it too then duration and dmg numbers become messed up.
Right now burning is too much in raids its going to get hit on ele soon. Ele is up in wvw this will make it worst and odds are hit spvp to a point all because tempest (tankly support that dose good to best dmg for ele) add on too much more to the core of ele.
This is going to hit the next elite spec all the one behind it. Anet needs to stop nerfing core ele realty all core classes because of power creep they added in with the elite spec. They NEED to nerf the elite spec it self.
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Chill hybred necro with an arcain support ele / frost bow i think one necro can take on a group.
I wasn’t aware fire DD was even a thing. If you’re using a glass build on an ele, your first mistake was getting in melee range of a necro. The same goes for a fire/air ele. If a necro gets up to you in melee range as a fire/air staff ele, then that’s entirely your fault.
It’s not a glass build, it has 17k health and 2600 toughness for DD, go check out 7s build on this forum. Only FA ele is perhaps glass but even then most run marauder getting up to 18k health and usually get nearly 2.5k armour from either food, runes, trinkets or rock barrier.
1. The range on DD is 300-400 not counting tickle me Elmo vapour blades.
2. Necros, both kinds, have 900-1200 range.So yeah nice try at making it sound like a L2P issue, sadly what you put was full of garbage. As I say anything but bunker eles have a hard time vs conditions at the moment, if the elite spec doesn’t bring ok clearing or resistance they you will have to run water attunement and water trait line to survive.
For the record I don’t think the new spec should be immune to conditions of have a cleanse all every 5s. Ele does need enough to be able to survive the silly condition meta we have now which at the moment ele has a hard time dealing with outside of its bunker build and would be impossible if you didn’t have water attunement.
2,600 armor is low unless you have perma protection or high healing power.
The thief trait ‘Pulmonary Impact’ needs a 5 second ICD… Or Headshot needs to cost 2 more initiative
yeah let’s nerf core spec for no good reason!
They need to undo all the core nerfs that they did at the start of HoT and balance the Elite specs by changing the elite spec only. Or we are going to have worthless cores that only are usable due to the Next elite spec coming out that the game is not ready for.
Ele kind of a mess now its op in raids up in wvw and i do not know in spvp. Its so going to get another nerf because of burning (all be it if burning all it has that nothing in wvw or spvp but because mobs cant clear for some reason its op and will be treated as such in all game types).
Anet realty has no ideal what they are doing.
So it sounds like its going to be called a weeb hehe weaver with a lot of ddr looking moves. Core ele in such a mess now in all game types i am not sure if this is going to work unless mantras are high def skills and the elite spec is going to have its own self support / def.
well traited GoEP ist a 20s stunbreaker that does add a condie burst and a boon. Maybe the untraited version is a bit weak but not shure.
Sadly only fire is worth it with GoEP now removing weakness and cripal from it was not a good ideal. Over all removing its icd per person and stronger version of condis and going more over a charge system was a realty bad ideal. Arcain power only works because its aoe now but charges on an aoe class dose not work out well.
Its like they made arcain viable for one utility and one utility only. Its odd that they would do this when the other arcain skills are one hit. The differences is kind of crazy.
I do not comply understand can the arcain power give ppl the condi effects if the ele has elemental surges?
Yes, and the allies’ applications will be based on your stats. Their applications are also affected by your attunement.
So endless root chill or the super burn. That seems a bit much.
Dose duration effect it too?
It dose odd so ele is now the best support class for reapers i guess. Chill arcain power crits chill and crit dmg all rolled into one super crazy death ball or reapers / ele.
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Make sure you have the most condis on you before you do that. I cant wait ppl yelling at ppl to get out of there way because “if you don’t have clears don’t get in the way or epi shot.”
I still think the time bomb eip would of been a lot better.
I just think a fast fight that end fast base off of who playing better (power dmg ) and the long fights that gives ppl lots of room to make errors but tends to drag out fights is not better and tends to become unfun to play vs and to play with (condi dmg).
Condi dmg classes players and builds are boring.
I do not comply understand can the arcain power give ppl the condi effects if the ele has elemental surges?
Most eles weren’t over 90% HP most of the time anyway, so I don’t think it’s that much of a nerf.
5% dmg nerf is kind of big and it shows that anet dose not know what going on in the meta of there own game. Most power players are using seaweed so nerf it but they forget most players are condis players and are running condi duration food.
Duration nerfs on defensive skills/traits. It just gives enemies a larger window to kill you. I would say its justified as long as thief/dh/warrior got a decent power nerf.
So about that condi nerf and ele’s condi def?
I haven’t really read other classes stuff tbh. I will look at it later
No update in that i am talking about the lack of ele dmg mitigation vs condi protection is nice but over all it dose nothing for most of the dmg in the game now as in condli dmg.
Ele got a 25 sec 5 stack of burning but that about all glyph will do now because every thing else on it is bad.
Over all more core ele nerfs because of tempest class. That the spvp nerfs to ele.
Not realty seen it in action yet but i images its going to get overshadow by the vomit of rainbows coming out of every one most of the time. If you could reflect it i think you would have a real counter play to it. Other then that a timer for epidemic triggering would of been far better an easier to add in.
The problem is they are trying to normalized the game and the power creep they added in though nerfing the core classes more so then the power creep it self or the elite spec. I am talking mostly about ele but i think this has happen to some level on the other classes. But ele core has been nerfed over and over because of what tempest can do. Its like trying to fix your home being too tall by dig out your foundation. These nerfs are going to be there for the next eleit spec and are going to be more impact-full to the game then anet realizes because of this.
There are no “power and condi players”. There are power and condi builds. I have characters built on power and others built on condi. What gets me mad isn’t that “power is no longer king”, it’s that they’ve nerfed the underperformer. It makes no sense and it’s bad for the balance.
There are according to anet when they talk about power players using only one type of food and not realizing that most of the condi players are many more and using the same food too.
Power not been king for well over 2? years now to only nerf a food now for pure power dmg players is a heartless kick to some one who is already down.
No need, unlike you I like Tempest. Though I’m fairly sure I could run core ele in a raid. It’s not optimal, but then, as it is Tempest isn’t either. I have zero interest in PvP, so can’t help you there.
That the point “not optimal” you can run any thing you want in most game types rvr not so much even spvp to a point needs to have a set build but if you cant run core ele as the same level as a tempest there IS something wrong. The worst of it is that core ele is out dmg by tempest even though tempest is better at being tankly and was made with the ideal of being harder to kill then the core ele.
Lets get back to what i am talking about core classes getting nerf because of there elite spec. Ele protection from aura got nerf because of tempest added auras and added protection effects. If anet realty had a problem with protection up time then they should of nerf the protection from overloads or made aura effects on tempest have longer cd. Now we will have to deal with this nerf on to the next elite spec because it was the core ele that was nerf.
Anet has got to take there hands off of the core classes and stop trying to fix there power creep they added in though elite spec this way but should look at the elite spec and nerf them. Its like trying to dig out part of your foundation to make shorten your home.
Also what they did to glyph of elemental power is unforgivable. This was the only changes they had made on ele over the last 4 years that was good an icd per person on a good set of condi effects for ele. Now its burn only condi effects that gets 5 stacks and is on a 25 sec cd. No one going to use it for the bleed no one going to use it for the chill or vanablitly. Anet realty messed up this time and i hope they pay for it dearly.
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Repeating it over and over again won’t make it true. I’ve said it – if you don’t like it, don’t play it. Don’t give me that bs about core ele “not being a class”. If you like it, you’ll play it and squeeze the most out of it. In WvW I still see many eles run core specs with no tempest. I understand it is easier to complain on forums than acquiring the relevant skill, but it’s also unproductive.
So go run your core ele in raid or spvp and come back to me and tell me how well you did.
The best thing i can say is your fooling your self into thinking core ele still viable. You need to take a long hard look at your game play and the lines you chose and compare that to other classes and how it would changes if you used tempest.
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Duration nerfs on defensive skills/traits. It just gives enemies a larger window to kill you. I would say its justified as long as thief/dh/warrior got a decent power nerf.
So about that condi nerf and ele’s condi def?
Ele condi effects got hit in the last update too charges are the worst effect that you can tie to an aoe class. The icd per person was the only thing in the ele kits that worked with aoe and now that gone.
And to make things worst ele core got another nerf because of tempest having perma protection. Tempest is the WORST thing to happen to ele.
See today update and tell me why dose anet leave ele with the lowest hp / def in the game?
Because we don’t have the lowest defense in the game. We are actually pretty high in defense when you know how to play the class. They even nerfed our defensive uptime in PvP because it was too effective. People who know how to play elementalist could keep defenses up almost endlessly.
Because ele the ONLY class with protection? Also because power dmg did not just get a major nerf and protection works so well vs condis?
Its simple and for something you can say for all classes condis have been given major buffs but hp for classes are the same as if the condis have not be buffed. If you change one thing but not the other your causing problems so classes with the least hp suffer the worst.
Any class who can do condi dmg because power dmg just got another 5% dmg nerf in wvw.
See today update and tell me why dose anet leave ele with the lowest hp / def in the game?
Seems like its a nerf on power dmg over all and over all a nerf on ele skills the hell is anet thinking?
Side note this is what i been talking about all this time on these forms the reason why the wvw / ele community not been in a complete uproar is comply beyond me.
@Panda.1967
Well most of that is wrong. Scpter hits faster with its auto, most of the dagger and staff skills hit low dmg compared to classes like war and thf even ranger. Staff has realty good mobility oddly due to burning retreat. I would not call having to run off hand dagger for most of the mobility of main hand dagger a fair thing to say (scpter/dagger has nearly the same mobility as d/d).
The point i am trying to make is that atuments lock you into a type of skills. You cant burn out side of fire and you cant heal that well outside of water unlike weapons for other classes they end to have cover all moves having both a power hit condi hit and def skills. That is ok its just there no reason for it if your in fire you realty do not do more dmg then other classes you simply do the SAME if not less dmg and that a major balancing problem. If your in fire you give up a lot of def tools and all your getting back in dmg = to that of other classes who are giving up nothing.
Conjure weapons are a joke for the most part and you cant leap on to walls….
Your giving a free pass to nearly all the classes in the game but the ele class who has the lowest def and hp in the game. Ele is a mages and as a mages it should have the lowest def / hp in the game but it should have the best dmg in the game and nothing you have said proves that. A lot of classes hit faster and harder they even have far better mobility and active def. The only thing ele has now is its healing and even that is something you can pull off with other classes. As things stand ele is nearly a non class.
and that goes right back to my earlier statement… you lack a proper understanding of how the elementalist works. Unlike other classes who have the capacity to do multiple things but must be focus built into each category… an elementalist has the ability to fill multiple roles at any given moment. We may not have the highest damage, strongest crowd control, best healing, or even the highest sustain… but we do have the highest versatility. Elementalists are by design the most versatile class in the game.
The Tempest elite spec allows you to focus more in one area or another, but at the end of the day you’re still more versatile than anyone else. Even without tempest you can still focus build towards one area over another for some fairly impressive damage outputs or even some extraordinary healing… but you do so knowing that you’re versatility will keep you from being on equal ground with other classes in that area.
That the thing it realty cant fill more then one roll because GW2 was a game made for not filling rolls so most classes are very much able to do every thing all the time. Now with HoT they tried push rolls and they did as tempest has made ele into mostly a support with a tack on dmg effect (sadly the only thing that makes it viable in raids). Ele in its 4 atuments is simply another class in gw2 it just cant do them all at the same time unlike other classes who have the ability to do every thing at any time.
If any thing ele is the least versatile class in gw2. It may of been some what able to do every thing when the game first came out but a lot of that has been watered down by adding more effects to other classes and out right nerfing what ele has as a class.
And the worst thing though all the changes to the class of ele armor and hp has been left unchanged for the most part. Out of all the dmg added and buffs to condi dmg hp for players has stayed the same. Back when your only stacking condis where confusion and bleeds and there was no torment. Gw2 is an incomplete game where part of it has been left with no real fixes and other parts have been adding more and more. A lot of skills are still bast off of the first build of the game that made them so out dated that they tie into effects that use to be there but no longer are such as channeled effects from ele and buffs for using though channeled effects Zephyr’s Focus and Obsidian Focus.
You could even talk about crafting crits from wvw buffs and hp +% that are in the game yet do not effect the game at all. There so many things that were taken out or simply left with out updating them to the game we have now. Mist form use to have a chill on it frost bow use to have a reg on it if you build for it.
@Panda.1967
Well most of that is wrong. Scpter hits faster with its auto, most of the dagger and staff skills hit low dmg compared to classes like war and thf even ranger. Staff has realty good mobility oddly due to burning retreat. I would not call having to run off hand dagger for most of the mobility of main hand dagger a fair thing to say (scpter/dagger has nearly the same mobility as d/d).
The point i am trying to make is that atuments lock you into a type of skills. You cant burn out side of fire and you cant heal that well outside of water unlike weapons for other classes they end to have cover all moves having both a power hit condi hit and def skills. That is ok its just there no reason for it if your in fire you realty do not do more dmg then other classes you simply do the SAME if not less dmg and that a major balancing problem. If your in fire you give up a lot of def tools and all your getting back in dmg = to that of other classes who are giving up nothing.
Conjure weapons are a joke for the most part and you cant leap on to walls….
Your giving a free pass to nearly all the classes in the game but the ele class who has the lowest def and hp in the game. Ele is a mages and as a mages it should have the lowest def / hp in the game but it should have the best dmg in the game and nothing you have said proves that. A lot of classes hit faster and harder they even have far better mobility and active def. The only thing ele has now is its healing and even that is something you can pull off with other classes. As things stand ele is nearly a non class.
How can ele have an average hp pull when its the lowest in the game. Health pools are only effective if you have high def boons like protection and blut dmg -% (as there not condi -% on ele its a purely anty power effective hp pool).
Ele is a mages it should have lowest hp and def but it should be doing THE best dmg in the game. Dmg is very lacking for ele in both condi and power and a major lack of anty dmg mitigation of boon strips and unblockables. The problem is all the other classes do too much dmg for there hp / def as well as there anty dmg mitigation has been stack on the non mages classes for “reason.”
Staff ele should be the end all be all aoe dmg scepter ele should be the end all be all signal target dmg. Dagger should be the all in risk reward wepon. Non of this is true atm.
That’s because you seem to lack a proper understanding how how the elementalist works. Unlike most classes, our weapon choice doesn’t determine our AoE or ST effectiveness… they determine our range and attack rate. Dagger’s are for Ele’s who want to be close range and attack fast, Scepter is for mid rage average attack rate, and Staff is for long range but slower attacks… over all the damage output of all 3 is mostly on par with eachother in both AoE and ST. Out Attunements on the other hand affect our AoE and ST effectiveness. Fire and Earth are strong on AoE while Air is strong on ST… Water tends to be balanced between the two and more focused on healing anyways… Earth has a strong focus on defensive powers as well.
As a result, an elementalist that actually understands how to best utilize their attunements does in fact have a rather high effective HP. Utilizing damage mitigation from Earth and healing from Water to provide a rather sizable health buffer to counter the fact that our HP is the lowest in the game.
Ok.. So what is it that dagger who are melee to near melee ranged on a mages class who has low hp and def? Why should the risk be greater but reward lower for an mages class to in close then say a war who can do better dmg over all and last longer AND have the chose of getting a ranged attk? Ele is a mage right why would dagger make them giving up there ranged dmg and over all reward?
Scepter is a pure burst dmg wepon who happens to have a big dmg aoe hit phoenixes. Its also ele’s true condi dmg wepon.
Staff is its aoe control weapons with some slow attks that do not hit all that hard.
Your living in a dream if you cant see these real problems for a mages class who has the lowest hp and def but also has some of the worst dmg choose in the game.
Your argument seems to think ele is able to use all of its weapons and atuments at the same time. Your locked into one wepon and one atument at a time. Focese may have great anty dmg but it means nothing if you do not have one equipped. Having ranged attks on scepter and staff maybe great but it means nothing if you have a dagger main hand. I want you to ask your self when in wvw and your d/x ele what do you do when you come up to an objective at what point is it ok for the mages class to be unable to deal with things at a ranged and your melee or solders class are able to swap from melee to ranged on the fly. And lets not get into to having REAL dmg in that tools to deal with dmg mitigation of both counter boons and blocks.
How can ele have an average hp pull when its the lowest in the game. Health pools are only effective if you have high def boons like protection and blut dmg -% (as there not condi -% on ele its a purely anty power effective hp pool).
Ele is a mages it should have lowest hp and def but it should be doing THE best dmg in the game. Dmg is very lacking for ele in both condi and power and a major lack of anty dmg mitigation of boon strips and unblockables. The problem is all the other classes do too much dmg for there hp / def as well as there anty dmg mitigation has been stack on the non mages classes for “reason.”
Staff ele should be the end all be all aoe dmg scepter ele should be the end all be all signal target dmg. Dagger should be the all in risk reward wepon. Non of this is true atm.
It only need elemental surge, arcane power and some random moves, I use it with Overload Fire in my hybrid build.
I’m waiting for the build..
You need to make it worth it is to run condi dmg gear / weapons condi duration food etc.. arcain line tempest line and more then likely fire line. You need arcain power some other arcain move signet of fire and glyph of elemental power the heal can be any thing but more then like you want to run it arcain too as for the eleit fire GS is your best bet. As for wepon scpter is best chose with off hand any thing. You can get away with main hand dagger but its super riskily. You cant run staff. You will NEED to camp fire atument all day effectually forgetting 3/4 of your class in doing so.
Tell me how is this not all in? For ele to pull this off well your going to need to not use most of your skills spam 1 all day and use your utility as soon as they come up with no realty rotation or timing.Other class at least get to use there off hand effects and there utility more then just mindless spam. Ele to be viable as things stand you nearly have to forget most of your atuments as in they become pass over atuments that you happen to have and only jump in for a sec to use one or 2 skills or non at all. If you sat down and gave ele one atument but cdr and other + effects the ele class would be better off then having all 4 of its atuments because of just how bad Anet has messed up with the ele class.
I mostly play staff support ele in wvw (its a bit of an odd ball build but i am getting crazy lag spikes in wvw these days so i need more passive heals then any thing) and i sit in water all day long fire and air are mostly pass overs earth to a point too. My ele would be better if i just had water atument and another wepon set. Atuments are more getting in the way of playing ele as a class then helping.
Pure burning monster.
one look from a mesmer or necromancer and you would die
Well ya its a silly build just trying to show how ele needs to build all in to be viable where other classes don’t.
Any way fixing icd both to stop over stacking of effects and to make them work with aoe as in icd per person would fix a lot of things about gw2.
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