Guild Wars 2

Pretty much the same thing for any class that can’t trait up both critical chance and critical damage on the same traitline. It’s difficult to get a build at 80 that gives high power/crit%/critDmg while preserving hp and toughness.

It builds on condition damage quiet well but a LOT of PvE running involves structures and/or timed runs where high DPS wins over high DoTs.

If you are having fun with it then you are having fun with it and I would suggest disbelieving folks that tell you it’s a “bad” class.

It’s not my build. Blame Maskaganda [https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/members/Maskaganda-2043] for such fun.

vid 1 – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tTIWYXabmM
vid 2 – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CPqe8YvFMQ
vid 3 – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NK35ZDjmE9A

You can hunt down the threads for those where he answers some of the questions brought up about it. In conversations with him I’ve discovered he’s running some ascended gear but you can get a close approximation to his build with

0/30/10/30/0
30 – pistol distance, 20% reduced pistol cooldowns, pistol shots pierce
10 – invisible if bound
30 – reduced elixer cooldown, elixer boons last longer, might on elixer throw/drink

Elixer H, Elixer B, Elixer S, Elixer U (or C or your choice), Supply Crate

carrion trinkets/chrys jewels
rampager armor
1 carrion pistol (earth sigil), 1 knights pistol (corruption sigil)
runes of the adventurer
guild backpack of the assassin with ruby orb
plate of fire flank steak + quality tuning crystal

Since posting that equipment suggestion I’ve switched in several pieces of knight’s armor to up the toughness I’m running with. It drops the power, precision and condition damage so you’ll really have to decide based on your own circumstances if that trade-off is worth it.

Happy hunting.

Felicela.2810:

Lanny.6987:

Your level 40 will die all the same to my condition build as your power build. [Snip…]

Agreed!

What do you use for your CD build?

Your level 40 will die all the same to my condition build as your power build. Might take a few seconds longer but I’ll be the last one standing. I say this being more often than not the last one standing when I face 80s.

As for clearing conditions I say please do. A condition Engineer will have them all back on you in the next sec to second and a half. Clear them again. And again. (Or if you are an Engineer and have 409 then three more times after that.) Last one standing.

I have run into people I cannot kill. Two guardians, a mesmer, and a necro (almost got her). We waved and moved on. Outside of that the fights can be long but eventually their hitpoints run out and mine don’t.

I can’t get a super high power build that has any survivability on an engineer (I lie. TankCat is roughly 85% of max power but I find it boring.) If all I can get is a condition build and be the last one standing that’s really good enough for me.

PS – All the things scaling your power build scale my condition build too. They get more HP and I get more HP. Power weapons hit harder as a percent of their base and so do mine. The only thing condition builds trade out is time. That’s not a trivial commodity but it’s not one I need to crater my enjoyment for either.

Casia.4281:

in wvw and pve, direct damage completely outpaces condition damage vs all targets.
Even high armored ones. And vs low armor it is a joke.
Hit a level 40 player with 1500 armor in WvW with 2800power and they implode.
Hit them with condition damage and… its the same as hitting a level 80.

And due to the multiple forms of + % hp buffs, in wvw. cond damage is again basically useless in wvw. realm, guild both give hp buffs. Orbs did as well.

Because stats are capped in spvp, its not as bad, and the equation is much more even.
Direct damage till mathematically outpaces condition damage. But we aren’t talking about 20k hits anymore.

Condition damage scales with level, and not gear directly.
And scales with only +duration. sortof. it also has the issue of being nullified post application.

While direct damage, has vulnerability, crit, crit damage, power, weapon damage, % damage traits. Runes that increase % damage, sigils that increase % damage.

toughness is inherently weaker then power due to the formula.
power/(toughness+armor)

I’m something like 1250 condition damage and normally don’t even add food if there isn’t enough movement in WvW to see some good fights. That leaves the 25 stack from sigil and I normally see 127 a tick on bleeds. Sometimes higher if HGH has kicked in well. Hitting 145 isn’t difficult fully invested with food and such and if I really want numbers I drop my toughness and switch to full carrion on armor.

The nice thing about the condition pistol/pistol elixer build is that if someone wipes away the conditions it doesn’t really matter. They are gonna be back up and ticking next shot.

mifbifgiggle.6713:

ShaunZ.1098:

mifbifgiggle.6713:

i get 145 ticks from bleeding

Based on your other engineer posts I think this is probably inaccurate, but what is your condition damage stat? You stated you are a mix of stats so this is suspect to say the least.

My build involves stacking might with hgh, which adds to the condition damage. my base cd is 1330. With the might i get it is raised quite a bit.

There is some argument to having a ratio of Hit Points / Armor of about 10. Without considering condition damage or healing received this is the point where hit points and armor are “equally effective”.

All the gory details — http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/60838-math-damage-reduction-toughness-and-vitality/

I used a few pieces of Knights in armor and 1 pistol to get the toughness but Rabid (or dungeon equivalent) would work if you want to hang onto your condition damage at the expense of power. Sadly there’s no Power/condition damage/toughness in the game.

Sorry to nitpick but at 50 crit damage every % of crit is another % of damage. Consider 2x damage (50 crit damage) and a 100% crit rate. Every attack would crit and you’d be doing 100% more damage than normal. So 10% more crit% with a 50 crit damage would improve damage (on average) by 10%.

Effective power = Power * (1 + Crit% * ( 1/2 + CritDmg/100 ))

With no crit damage it takes 2% of crit% to add 1% more damage.

Turning off the geek now and returning you to the regular discussion.

NickDollahZ.5348:

3) Scope – 10% crit when standing still will go a long way. Atleast a 5% damage increase with 50% crit damage

Rampagers? Yeah, that’s on my armor (or was) so didn’t need it on the pistol. At the time and outside of traits the pistol was my only source of toughness. I keep going back and forth on toughness. If I get hit by a zerg I’m dead. If I 1v1 or 1v2 then I’m hard pressed to notice any difference. The numbers say I should be taking about 15% less direct damage than with no toughness but I don’t really notice the (perhaps) extra hit or two I can survive in fights.

lindstroem.3601:

Dual Pistol with permanent quickness/vigor is plain and simple the funniest way to play the enigneer. And there are also different ways to play it, not only with elixiers only (my build is with Flamethrower, Slick shoes and Elixier R for WvW).

1 carrion pistol (earth sigil), 1 knights pistol (corruption sigil)

Best pistol set up is 2xDragonshot at the moment.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Food#Condition_Duration_2

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Talk:Condition_Duration

I believe you get at least one tick but can’t confirm.

I could be wrong but my take is that +condition duration, unless you can stack enough to add a full second of whatever condition you are applying, is best used to counter folks who are running -condition damage runes. Without DPS analyzers and any easy way to duel it’s very hard to test this stuff. At least I’ve never gotten enemies to hold still long enough (or sometimes live long enough) to make any detailed investigation.

Luckily outside of Melandru or Hoelbrek you don’t find many -condition damage runes. Melandru is awfully nice with the +tough though.

Penguin.5197:

Lanny.6987:

Keep in mind that while you increase condition duration in 1/4s increments you only get damage ticks in 1s increments. Bleeding is 2s, poison 2, blind 3, burning 3 or 1. So you’d need to get to +33% condition duration to see an extra tick of blind or long burn and you’d need to get to +50% condition duration to see an extra tick of bleeding or poison. This is why Runes of Melandru and other -condition duration are so popular. If you have no +condition duration then your condition applied automatically lose at least one tick which on a 2s condition means 50% damage reduction

I have never made condition build before, still working on mine and dont know about it much. But are you saying the first second does no damage at all?

Keep in mind that while you increase condition duration in 1/4s increments you only get damage ticks in 1s increments. Bleeding is 2s, poison 2, blind 3, burning 3 or 1. So you’d need to get to +33% condition duration to see an extra tick of blind or long burn and you’d need to get to +50% condition duration to see an extra tick of bleeding or poison. This is why Runes of Melandru and other -condition duration are so popular. If you have no +condition duration then your condition applied automatically lose at least one tick which on a 2s condition means 50% damage reduction.

Amadeus.5687:

Still waiting for them to fix Giver’s weapon’s, so I can run this setup for fun with 2x of them (giving 20% longer condition duration)! Btw Maska, in explosive trait line there is all ways the good old Icendiary Powder, how come you don’t like that one?

(Also, been looking for you to take you down ever since Piken ended in same WvsW match up as gandara, where do you hide!?!?)

Maskaganda has some ascended gear but you can get a close approximation (and what’s worked for me) with

carrion trinkets/chrys jewels
rampager armor
1 carrion pistol (earth sigil), 1 knights pistol (corruption sigil)
runes of the adventurer
guild backpack of the assassin with ruby orb
plate of fire flank steak + quality tuning crystal

I’ve tried throwing in a bit of Rabid to bring up the toughness but (for me) it drops the power and condition damage too much.

I suspect, Maskaganda, that you don’t see much of an interest in a guide because what you do doesn’t impress itself upon you as a specific set of tactics. Watching the videos and playing the build though here’s what I’ve picked up. Obviously your mileage may vary.

• In general F1 is your minor heal, B-thrown is minor damage increase, B-drunk is swiftness and damage. (With HGH all of these are adding might.) You might just get swiftness out of the first two but if you use them for the listed situations you’ll be right more than not.
• Face your opponent. (Harder than you’d think when starting out.)
• Open with static shot. It’s a blind.
• Try to save flame blast for when they are in your face. It’s a LOT more damage. That said take your best shot.
• Try to keep the range open.
• Strafe. Dodge. Move.
• Don’t forget glue shot.
• Better to use supply crate too early rather than wishing you had when you are dead.
• Use the supply create bandages.
• If using Elixer U better to use the field too early rather than wishing you had when you are dead.
• For keep defense switch Elixer C out for U. When they pull you off the wall when you can’t shoot over it and have to stand on it (because everyone’s Asura right?) Elixer S will get you home but Elixer C will get rid of all those nasty conditions you just picked up.
• Oddly you are often the one being pursued and giving ground. Use terrain and obstacles to your advantage.
• (My contribution) Load Bomb Kit instead of Elixer U underwater. Orbit someone dropping bombs (plus BoB) or drop a trail behind you to get away.
• You can tap F1, F2, F3 underwater several times to use a thrown elixer. First tap tosses it. Second breaks it.

Now if I could do all those as well as the videos show they can be done I’d be quite content with myself.

If you see anything I missed, Maskaganda, or I’m not thinking something through let me know. Otherwise you can forget the guide and just keep posting videos.

Pistol/Pistol Elixer build. Pick a target and follow them through the chaos until they are down. Bonus points for spiking your target when they have 2-3 of their side trying to res. For some reason this seems to upset folks so dropping a supply crate on them and a bunch of glue is usually called for at this point. Peel off to the flanks or if folks REALLY want to chat about the spike then go through your lines. Pick a new target. Rinse. Repeat. Best run today was doing that 8 times in one rather lengthy ZvZ. To be fair as the toys like elixer S (drunk and thrown) and supply crate get used there’s a bit of ranging from the backfield but as soon as they are back up you can zip right back in.

For every 20 condition damage
+1 bleed
+2 poison
+3 confusion
+5 burn

Another awesome vid. The build has been working great for me. Just wish I could stay on target like you can. More practice I guess.

Please keep the videos coming and I still want to see you put out a guide on Engi tactics.

JohnDied.3476:

Engineers on the other hand have no ways to mitigate damage (besides weak bomb heals) while we do our best damage closest to harm.

Um… what? Elixer H tossed gives random protection, regeneration, or swiftness and drunk the same. Elixer S tossed is stability or invis and drunk is 3s of total immunity to damage. You can take Formula 409 and every toss or drink clears a condition.

EVERY weapon and kit has some combo of blind, immobilize, cripple, chill and we can run 3 at a time if we want.

I’ll concede that if your definition of “mitigate damage” is “stand there and not get hurt” then you are correct. Otherwise not so much.

Traits. Duh. And at max CritDmg it’s a touch over 16 points per 1% extra damage so wins at any power level over 1600 (which you are probably going to have to have gotten all that CritDmg).

Thanks for corrections.

Math above seems a bit off.

For attacking a given armor 1% more damage from power is found with an additional CurrentPower/100 points. Crit % scales as a factor of crit damage. If a crit does double damage then 1% more crit adds 1% more dmg. Max possible crit damage is well above 105% (32 from trinkets, 16 armor, 10 weapons, 10 runes, 10 food == 78 or 2.28x normal) but you will do 1% more damage putting points into Perception with 2100/(CritDmg + 50) points.

You need a CritDmg of 50 for 21 points of Perception to add another 1% dmg. Until you have over 2100 Power it takes less than 21 points of Power to add 1% dmg. Unless you want the higher Crit % for sigils or other effects you should concentrate on power and add Perception and CritDmg where it doesn’t take away from other stats you are working on.