We will use glints kid to mentally abuse kralkatorrik into submission, and use him to fight of either Jormag or Primordus. Both Dragons involved in the fight will be beaten into such a weakend state and forced to go hibernate, in doing so their energy will seep into the ley-lines stirring Bubbles/Steve into existence. During the time of his migration we will venture forward into toward Cantha and find Kuunavang. Rytlock will talk to Kuunavang using Shiro and persuade him to join us.
It will culminate in a pokemon style fight to the death. Leading to most of the magical energy in the world in disarray. This will allow the ancient races to recover their power and energy (and in the case of the jotuns, intelligence). However, all this magic will also attract Lazarus the Dire as he seeks to condemn all the generations from here till the end of time. This will ultimately force Livia out of hiding and we will have a so you think you can Mance special with the judges being Logan, Anise and Zojja.
But what they don’t know is this is all according to Mr.Sparkles plan of dominating the world and killing off all meatbags.
I’m convinced it doesn’t exist.
Even though i know it does. Much like precursor drop rates.
Play fractal
Do daily
Use level up Tome on level 80 character.
Not sure if possible, but in the interest of self improvement would it at all be possible to have a set of metrics to compare yourself to a baseline per each raid fight (Similar to PvP’s End of Match Report) ?
Not looking for actual grades but something as simple as
Stats
Damage Dealt to Boss
Damage Dealt to Ads
Damage Mitigated (Blocks /Dodges/ Invluns)
Healing Done to Allies
Boons Applied to Allies
Mechanical Proficiency
Times Teleported
Times Egged
Times Hit by Flame Wall
Times you took Excess Lightning damage
Illuminated Floor Panel Damage
Turrets Killed
Just as an example.
Join a guild, it’s typically the easiest way. That said you still need to play with them and make yourself known to them…to many people join guilds to raid and remain quiet and faceless and wonder why it’s hard to start.
If guilds aren’t your thing however, but you feel capable and think you’re build ready you can always sit in LFG for 4 hours until someone needs you.
The constant fight that is
- Balance
- WvW
- Communication
Everything else as far as in game content is trivial by comparison.
They invited a PvE guild ?
Sounds familiar…… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LhvuomaJaY
Looks like the design decisions flow down from the top.
Initial thoughts
Look at all these fabulous banners.
Secondary thought…We can hardly have balance with what we have now, lets not confuse them any further.
I’m pretty sure every class can do HoT story..
This is correct. I’ve run HoT story on every class. Some solo, some with guildies who had issues.
Biggest thing to keep in mind is, if you are having trouble ask for help from your guild or someone on your friendslist.
I did fractals nearly daily the past 1-2 moths and got about 6 ascended boxes, 2 weapon boxes, one precursor, one golden fractal skin 3-4 fractal skins and a lot of ascended rings, infused and non infused. Additionally, i make routhly 20-25g for all 3 tiers of fractals.
This is very rewarding. Besides: others I play with had similar drops.
That’s nice.
You want to hear my experience with fractals.
Pre-HoT i was getting a box/skin every other day. Rings Daily
Post HoT i’m lucky to get a box/skin once every 2 weeks. Rings are roughly every other day.
Anectdotal evidence that is contradictory leads me to believe RNG is RNG. Before you ask if my pLvl is above 50….it’s well above 50 and has been since HoT shipped as fractals and masteries where pretty much all i did.
I’ve been soloing my fractal adept daily. When I do the aquatic fractal, if I get eaten by the boss he resets. I know this has to do with how Anet had changed the mechanics for him and Mossman to reset while being out of combat, but this seems like an oversight, since I’m still in combat while being digested
It’s funny they fixed this but couldn’t take the time to address the 0 AR bug.
Had that happen today, fun times.
- They do not clearly communicate, make official post about what they consider exploit.
It can’t get more clear than this.
Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.
As for the rest of your post, it honestly doesn’t matter. The community can do what it wants in this case and either kill Mossman regularly or by exploit and the exploit will get fixed eventually regardless. No one can make them work faster, no fixing this issue isn’t a priority, and no I don’t think it should be. It doesn’t ruin Fractals because you can just as easily make groups with friends or pubs to do any other Fractals you want. I did 66/68/69 the other day just for fun. It went great.
The only thing I’m pushing here is that some people don’t seem to acknowledge that this is an exploit when it’s about the most obvious exploit ever.
Actually it can be a lot clearer than that, as its talking about a very specific instance and not what an exploit actually is or how they define it as it relates to their game.
Believe it or not, not all exploits are clear cut and most of what people are calling / using quotes from aren’t what the standard definition of an exploit is.
Also, at some point everyone is exploiting by the standard definition of the word. They are all taking advantage of the opponents weakness. Sorry AI has inbuilt limitations, but punishing the players for that is not ideal. If anything you should be thanking your player base for showcasing those flaws so you can build around it in your next project. Making each project better than the last by learning from your critical mistakes.
Yes the market is crashing, by design.
You can thank the economic changes to the game that made raw gold more valuable than goods.
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
Doesn’t matter when it comes to what the game considers a valid path when using skills.
Do you have any idea how utterly arbitrary that system is ?
Because it’s really bad at detecting actual pathing.
Some things do tend to get in the way of it but it is more or less reliable. One can assume that jumping onto the rocks and then onto the tower would not provide a valid path. Similarly the same with the Mossman in regards to the posts/roof/etc.
You know what they say about assuming right ?
Incase you want to argue this, it goes to show that “No Valid Path” isn’t what you claim to be. The way it detects valid pathing is horrible.
Jumping onto a platform, which cannot be reached by enemies, there would be no valid path. This is also common when trying to lose aggro such as in AC. Just because someone says that they assume, doesn’t preclude what they state from being true. It’s fairly easy to test this as well.
I have no idea what you’re trying to show with that video as it is marked private. Horrible is an exaggeration. You would think that if it were horrible we would see many more posts complaining about it.
That platform can be reached by MKII….so again what point are you trying to make here ?
Video is now properly unlisted. That’s on me.
As for there being more complaints, clearly you missed the huge firestorm that was the forums when the tried to “fix” this around 5 months ago…. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/On-Shadowsteps-and-No-Valid-Path
Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.
So you’re going to cherry pick quotes now ?
Also lets point out that this boss doesn’t move. So again that whole quote while a cute attempt is utterly invalid.
Not cherry picking. Whether it moves or not doesn’t matter. Your position is dependent on that if the player can still take some damage then it isn’t an exploit. The quote shows that you are wrong. It also shows a situation almost exactly like Golem Mark II and calling it an exploit.
It shows a case that’s nothing of the sort like it.
The MKII can and will still attack players that are on that platform. Furthermore it never attempts to path at all. These two facts alone discredit that scenario of them remotely being the same.
That entire quote is about you being above a boss, and it moving to attack and being unable to fight back. Notice that in that quote it is directly referencing mob pathing, not player pathing. Making your claim earlier and this quote a joke.
You’re expecting an example to be 100% exact which will never happen. There will be no quote that will 100% match that of Golem unless it is one specifically addressing it. What you can use is a little critical thinking and see in the example that a bug was being abused which is why it was considered an exploit.
For golem, the bug is that the players on the tower should be dealing zero damage like, for example, they would in AC when standing on the wall while attacking the spider hatchlings before the spider queen.
About that critical thinking,
Lets analyze why it’s taking damage….
If you look at the MK, guess where its hitboxes lie…..
If you guessed on the same plane as the tower you win.
Critical thinking done. The players aren’t above the mob, therefore not exploiting.
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
Doesn’t matter when it comes to what the game considers a valid path when using skills.
Do you have any idea how utterly arbitrary that system is ?
Because it’s really bad at detecting actual pathing.
Some things do tend to get in the way of it but it is more or less reliable. One can assume that jumping onto the rocks and then onto the tower would not provide a valid path. Similarly the same with the Mossman in regards to the posts/roof/etc.
You know what they say about assuming right ?
Incase you want to argue this, it goes to show that “No Valid Path” isn’t what you claim to be. The way it detects valid pathing is horrible.
Jumping onto a platform, which cannot be reached by enemies, there would be no valid path. This is also common when trying to lose aggro such as in AC. Just because someone says that they assume, doesn’t preclude what they state from being true. It’s fairly easy to test this as well.
I have no idea what you’re trying to show with that video as it is marked private. Horrible is an exaggeration. You would think that if it were horrible we would see many more posts complaining about it.
That platform can be reached by MKII….so again what point are you trying to make here ?
Video is now properly unlisted. That’s on me.
As for there being more complaints, clearly you missed the huge firestorm that was the forums when the tried to “fix” this around 5 months ago…. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/On-Shadowsteps-and-No-Valid-Path
Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.
So you’re going to cherry pick quotes now ?
Also lets point out that this boss doesn’t move. So again that whole quote while a cute attempt is utterly invalid.
Not cherry picking. Whether it moves or not doesn’t matter. Your position is dependent on that if the player can still take some damage then it isn’t an exploit. The quote shows that you are wrong. It also shows a situation almost exactly like Golem Mark II and calling it an exploit.
It shows a case that’s nothing of the sort like it.
The MKII can and will still attack players that are on that platform. Furthermore it never attempts to path at all. These two facts alone discredit that scenario of them remotely being the same.
That entire quote is about you being above a boss, and it moving to attack and being unable to fight back. Notice that in that quote it is directly referencing mob pathing, not player pathing. Making your claim earlier and this quote a joke.
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
Doesn’t matter when it comes to what the game considers a valid path when using skills.
Do you have any idea how utterly arbitrary that system is ?
Because it’s really bad at detecting actual pathing.
Some things do tend to get in the way of it but it is more or less reliable. One can assume that jumping onto the rocks and then onto the tower would not provide a valid path. Similarly the same with the Mossman in regards to the posts/roof/etc.
You know what they say about assuming right ?
Incase you want to argue this, it goes to show that “No Valid Path” isn’t what you claim to be. The way it detects valid pathing is horrible.
Jumping onto a platform, which cannot be reached by enemies, there would be no valid path. This is also common when trying to lose aggro such as in AC. Just because someone says that they assume, doesn’t preclude what they state from being true. It’s fairly easy to test this as well.
I have no idea what you’re trying to show with that video as it is marked private. Horrible is an exaggeration. You would think that if it were horrible we would see many more posts complaining about it.
That platform can be reached by MKII….so again what point are you trying to make here ?
Video is now properly unlisted. That’s on me.
As for there being more complaints, clearly you missed the huge firestorm that was the forums when the tried to “fix” this around 5 months ago…. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/On-Shadowsteps-and-No-Valid-Path
Standing on a rock/ledge/platform while the boss attempts to hit you from below (yes there are some bosses that still have abilities that hit you), is a problem with pathing and the boss not resetting when it can’t reach the target. This is exploiting a bug.
So you’re going to cherry pick quotes now ?
Also lets point out that this boss doesn’t move. So again that whole quote while a cute attempt is utterly invalid.
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
Doesn’t matter when it comes to what the game considers a valid path when using skills.
Do you have any idea how utterly arbitrary that system is ?
Because it’s really bad at detecting actual pathing.
Some things do tend to get in the way of it but it is more or less reliable. One can assume that jumping onto the rocks and then onto the tower would not provide a valid path. Similarly the same with the Mossman in regards to the posts/roof/etc.
You know what they say about assuming right ?
Incase you want to argue this, it goes to show that “No Valid Path” isn’t what you claim to be. The way it detects valid pathing is horrible.
Jumping onto a platform, which cannot be reached by enemies, there would be no valid path. This is also common when trying to lose aggro such as in AC. Just because someone says that they assume, doesn’t preclude what they state from being true. It’s fairly easy to test this as well.
I have no idea what you’re trying to show with that video as it is marked private. Horrible is an exaggeration. You would think that if it were horrible we would see many more posts complaining about it.
That platform can be reached by MKII….so again what point are you trying to make here ?
Video is now properly unlisted. That’s on me.
As for there being more complaints, clearly you missed the huge firestorm that was the forums when the tried to “fix” this around 5 months ago…. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/On-Shadowsteps-and-No-Valid-Path
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
Doesn’t matter when it comes to what the game considers a valid path when using skills.
Do you have any idea how utterly arbitrary that system is ?
Because it’s really bad at detecting actual pathing.
Some things do tend to get in the way of it but it is more or less reliable. One can assume that jumping onto the rocks and then onto the tower would not provide a valid path. Similarly the same with the Mossman in regards to the posts/roof/etc.
You know what they say about assuming right ?
Incase you want to argue this, it goes to show that “No Valid Path” isn’t what you claim to be. The way it detects valid pathing is horrible.
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
Doesn’t matter when it comes to what the game considers a valid path when using skills.
Do you have any idea how utterly arbitrary that system is ?
Because it’s really bad at detecting actual pathing.
Wait are people so blind as to not know there’s a simple path on the backside of the tower to jump onto, you know within sight line ?
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
I wasn’t referring to an intentional jumping puzzle. It’s one that pkayers did (a sequence of actions) to get to a safe spot.
Poor map design or unintended areas of immunity are not an excuse to exploit.
LoS and using height is not the same.
Using terrain to your advantage has been an integral part of games since they started making them. Only recent gamers see this as an exploit. I’m sorry but if the games geometry allows for such actions to exist, then it’s not on the players but on the designers ultimately.
So if the terrain allowed them to skip an entire boss then it’s not the players’ fault for taking advantage of it but the developers for not preventing that from happening in the first place?
In three characters.
YES.
Well there’s no point is continuing this with you further. It has been stated by Anet that this is an exploit and we have seen plenty of evidence of people banned for doing things like this. Whether you agree with it or not doesn’t matter.
You’re right, my opinion is exactly that. However, given the quote from a dev the very thing being complained about in this thread is not an exploit. You can be struck by the Boss which invalidates the claim of an exploit.
As per intent and design, this still falls on the designer. If they really wanted to prevent exploiting (skipping) in this case how hard is it to have a simple script check the state of the first boss and not spawn the next set of adds/bosses until its dead ? It’s almost like dungeons could have benefited greatly from being instanced dynamic events.
You can twist is however you want. You’d still be wrong as it would be considered an exploit. Would action be taken against you for the one at golem? Probably not.
I assume you would think that Anet was completely at fault in the following link below and the players involved were innocent. After all, it was Anet that messed up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/151wsw/punishment_for_the_snowflake_jewelryexploiters/
You know after that very incident they actually came out and said it was their mistake and they shouldn’t have been that harsh on players right ?
I mean i get it you want to defend anet tooth and nail here, but sometimes the buck really does stop with the content producers.
It was the first widespread exploiting and they decided to give people a second chance. Those that were banned had to contact customer support and also delete all items/currency they got as a result of that exploiting.
Just because it was not a permanent ban doesn’t mean that it was not an exploit. So I really have no idea why you brought up that they gave the option to revert it to a 72-hour ban. This has nothing to do with whether it was an exploit or not.
I also do not know why you brought up me defending Anet in your post. Nothing has been about defending Anet.
You honestly believe that they changed the policy on a whim because it was wide scale and not because in hindsight they realized they made an egregious mistake ?
I’m sorry, but not only does your comparison not fly, but it’s about as relevant as my pointing out how much you love to flock to defend anet and not actually question the policies in place.
I’ve shown that the policy, as stated by Robert as applied to this case doesn’t constitute exploiting. You can still be struck and take damage.
Your move.
Perhaps you should do a little reading into what happened. They decided to give players a second chance if they emailed support and also removed the gains that they received from this exploit. If they did not remove those gains, the perma-ban would be reinstated.
And as I said before, this as nothing, that’s right, nothing to do with whether something is an exploit or not.
The point of the examples were to show exploits that occurred within game that were directly called exploits by Anet. You claimed that anything that a player could do in-game would never be considered an exploit and it was just poor programming. Obviously you were wrong. Golem Mk II is no different although it’s something they will likely not take action against on players.
That is actually not what i claimed. What i said is if people use terrain to their advantage in combat, it’s not an exploit. It’s using the designed combat area, as intended.
This was clearly taken to heart by the raid design team as you can see the boss fights in the raids are all Arena’s that are flat, and have no terrain that can be used to their advantage.
Yeah, now then you want to talk actual exploits, things that actually give players an unfair advantage or ill-gotten gains then i’m more than willing to discuss what merits that.
Talk to the npc for any cliffside fractal hammer not spawning.
For Aetherblade have one person wait at the end near the door, and the rest relog. Ellen will respawn at the last person.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
I wasn’t referring to an intentional jumping puzzle. It’s one that pkayers did (a sequence of actions) to get to a safe spot.
Poor map design or unintended areas of immunity are not an excuse to exploit.
LoS and using height is not the same.
Using terrain to your advantage has been an integral part of games since they started making them. Only recent gamers see this as an exploit. I’m sorry but if the games geometry allows for such actions to exist, then it’s not on the players but on the designers ultimately.
So if the terrain allowed them to skip an entire boss then it’s not the players’ fault for taking advantage of it but the developers for not preventing that from happening in the first place?
In three characters.
YES.
Well there’s no point is continuing this with you further. It has been stated by Anet that this is an exploit and we have seen plenty of evidence of people banned for doing things like this. Whether you agree with it or not doesn’t matter.
You’re right, my opinion is exactly that. However, given the quote from a dev the very thing being complained about in this thread is not an exploit. You can be struck by the Boss which invalidates the claim of an exploit.
As per intent and design, this still falls on the designer. If they really wanted to prevent exploiting (skipping) in this case how hard is it to have a simple script check the state of the first boss and not spawn the next set of adds/bosses until its dead ? It’s almost like dungeons could have benefited greatly from being instanced dynamic events.
You can twist is however you want. You’d still be wrong as it would be considered an exploit. Would action be taken against you for the one at golem? Probably not.
I assume you would think that Anet was completely at fault in the following link below and the players involved were innocent. After all, it was Anet that messed up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/151wsw/punishment_for_the_snowflake_jewelryexploiters/
You know after that very incident they actually came out and said it was their mistake and they shouldn’t have been that harsh on players right ?
I mean i get it you want to defend anet tooth and nail here, but sometimes the buck really does stop with the content producers.
It was the first widespread exploiting and they decided to give people a second chance. Those that were banned had to contact customer support and also delete all items/currency they got as a result of that exploiting.
Just because it was not a permanent ban doesn’t mean that it was not an exploit. So I really have no idea why you brought up that they gave the option to revert it to a 72-hour ban. This has nothing to do with whether it was an exploit or not.
I also do not know why you brought up me defending Anet in your post. Nothing has been about defending Anet.
You honestly believe that they changed the policy on a whim because it was wide scale and not because in hindsight they realized they made an egregious mistake ?
I’m sorry, but not only does your comparison not fly, but it’s about as relevant as my pointing out how much you love to flock to defend anet and not actually question the policies in place.
I’ve shown that the policy, as stated by Robert as applied to this case doesn’t constitute exploiting. You can still be struck and take damage.
Your move.
ITT people that can’t play thief saying thief sustain is bad.
If you want to look at it objectively, thief has to put more into their sustain than any other class.
Meaning their sustain by comparison is bad.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
I wasn’t referring to an intentional jumping puzzle. It’s one that pkayers did (a sequence of actions) to get to a safe spot.
Poor map design or unintended areas of immunity are not an excuse to exploit.
LoS and using height is not the same.
Using terrain to your advantage has been an integral part of games since they started making them. Only recent gamers see this as an exploit. I’m sorry but if the games geometry allows for such actions to exist, then it’s not on the players but on the designers ultimately.
So if the terrain allowed them to skip an entire boss then it’s not the players’ fault for taking advantage of it but the developers for not preventing that from happening in the first place?
In three characters.
YES.
Well there’s no point is continuing this with you further. It has been stated by Anet that this is an exploit and we have seen plenty of evidence of people banned for doing things like this. Whether you agree with it or not doesn’t matter.
You’re right, my opinion is exactly that. However, given the quote from a dev the very thing being complained about in this thread is not an exploit. You can be struck by the Boss which invalidates the claim of an exploit.
As per intent and design, this still falls on the designer. If they really wanted to prevent exploiting (skipping) in this case how hard is it to have a simple script check the state of the first boss and not spawn the next set of adds/bosses until its dead ? It’s almost like dungeons could have benefited greatly from being instanced dynamic events.
You can twist is however you want. You’d still be wrong as it would be considered an exploit. Would action be taken against you for the one at golem? Probably not.
I assume you would think that Anet was completely at fault in the following link below and the players involved were innocent. After all, it was Anet that messed up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/151wsw/punishment_for_the_snowflake_jewelryexploiters/
You know after that very incident they actually came out and said it was their mistake and they shouldn’t have been that harsh on players right ?
I mean i get it you want to defend anet tooth and nail here, but sometimes the buck really does stop with the content producers.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
I wasn’t referring to an intentional jumping puzzle. It’s one that pkayers did (a sequence of actions) to get to a safe spot.
Poor map design or unintended areas of immunity are not an excuse to exploit.
LoS and using height is not the same.
Using terrain to your advantage has been an integral part of games since they started making them. Only recent gamers see this as an exploit. I’m sorry but if the games geometry allows for such actions to exist, then it’s not on the players but on the designers ultimately.
So if the terrain allowed them to skip an entire boss then it’s not the players’ fault for taking advantage of it but the developers for not preventing that from happening in the first place?
In three characters.
YES.
Well there’s no point is continuing this with you further. It has been stated by Anet that this is an exploit and we have seen plenty of evidence of people banned for doing things like this. Whether you agree with it or not doesn’t matter.
You’re right, my opinion is exactly that. However, given the quote from a dev the very thing being complained about in this thread is not an exploit. You can be struck by the Boss which invalidates the claim of an exploit.
As per intent and design, this still falls on the designer. If they really wanted to prevent exploiting (skipping) in this case how hard is it to have a simple script check the state of the first boss and not spawn the next set of adds/bosses until its dead ? It’s almost like dungeons could have benefited greatly from being instanced dynamic events.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
I wasn’t referring to an intentional jumping puzzle. It’s one that pkayers did (a sequence of actions) to get to a safe spot.
Poor map design or unintended areas of immunity are not an excuse to exploit.
LoS and using height is not the same.
Using terrain to your advantage has been an integral part of games since they started making them. Only recent gamers see this as an exploit. I’m sorry but if the games geometry allows for such actions to exist, then it’s not on the players but on the designers ultimately.
So if the terrain allowed them to skip an entire boss then it’s not the players’ fault for taking advantage of it but the developers for not preventing that from happening in the first place?
In three characters.
YES.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
I wasn’t referring to an intentional jumping puzzle. It’s one that pkayers did (a sequence of actions) to get to a safe spot.
Poor map design or unintended areas of immunity are not an excuse to exploit.
LoS and using height is not the same.
Using terrain to your advantage has been an integral part of games since they started making them. Only recent gamers see this as an exploit. I’m sorry but if the games geometry allows for such actions to exist, then it’s not on the players but on the designers ultimately.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Very little and rarely. Just because you can take some damage, doesn’t exclude it from being an exploit.
Let’s say it were possible to get onto the wall’s in Lupe’s room by a simple jumping puzzle. You can damage him but only one of his attacks reaches you. That attack poses minimal risk to you. Would that be an exploit? According to your post above, it would not.
What if for VG you could damage it while stacked on one of the pillars (or some other safe spot) but able to mitigate the damage from the green circles. Since you still could take damage, had you not mitigated it from the green circles, would it be an exploit or not? You’re able to avoid damage from all of its other attacks.
Would i personally consider anything you listed an exploit ? No.
It would be poor map design. Why would you design boss encounter area’s with jumping puzzles or area’s of immunity to begin with ?
Players using LoS or Height to their advantage, is not exploiting its smart gameplay.
How’s it not an exploit when you can stand on the boxes (and tower) to avoid nearly all damage but still be able to damage the golem? It’s really no different to the exploits people used to use in AC with the stairs, and then that ledge, to beat the bosses.
Just for the record, standing in a place where you can hurt the boss but the boss can’t hurt you back / can’t fight back is considered an exploit, and we are working on a solution for that problem. As is exploiting terrain like teleporting through walls/closed doors, and getting under/above the map to skip content and get to a place where you can take advantage of bugs or events not requiring previous completion in the order of events (skipping directly to Giganticus lupicus from the start of the arah explore chain for instance).
These are things we patch and fix as we discover them and figure out solutions for. As I have said before, if you see something say something by emailing this alias: Exploits@arena.net
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Exploits-and-Glitching/page/2#post1213057
Because using that very definition, it wasn’t. You could be knocked back and still take damage.
Quickness and slow are animation effects.
Poison is a condition specifically designed for reduced healing therefor rallying is slower by 33% (look at poison tooltip, it says 33% reduced healing effects) why would it not consider rallying as a healing mechanic when you’re healing?
The skills however state reviving…not rallying. I mean if we’re going to play the semantics game, those aren’t the same things.
If thief is running IP / SA sustain is no issue. If not they have very little to self sustain with.
On a side note did they ever fix the withdraw heal scaling being 33% lower than it’s supposed to be ?
They can work, though i would believe you would run a condi/hybrid tank since you’ll generally be a field bot.
Alchemy + Scrapper makes you stupidly tanky if you have boons on you. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Iron_Blooded + http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Plate_of_Mussels_Gnashblade have good synergy for it.
With decent block timing (Hammer 4 / Gear Shield) you should be fine to tank.
About hammer evades, if next to target you don’t move. The evades are all cast point blank.
I don’t think so…I’m not going to rule it out, but our tank is fairly solid.
Even they were at a loss for words when it happened. I’m kinda leaning toward just pathing in general being off for VG fights.
Noticed another issue today during a run where the Red Guardian during phase 2/4 ran outside the arena boundary. I think this has more to due with the change to the Pylon locations and arena wall in general. Thankfully it did not lead to a reset but it was worrying.
Whichever class has the most AI.
It didn’t happen in our last run which was
1x Chrono (tank)
1x Herald
1x Druid
1x Viper Ranger
2x Viper Necro
1x PS Warrior
2x Tempest
1x Daredevil
The week prior when it did happen the composition was
1x Chrono (tank)
1x Druid
1x PS Warrior
2x Viper Warrior
2x Herald
1x Daredevil
1x Tempest
1x Reaper
I know it wasn’t the PS warrior pulling agro during rez because no one was down.
Outside of that i can’t really help narrow it down.
The TL;DR i’m making here if you will is neither solution is healthy, but i’d rather if given the option take the power creep as the content is already trivial for most raiders / raiding guilds in the short term.
Again, this is not about “raiders” or non-raiders. It’s about a way of approaching game design and developement. GW2 does not allow for big bursts of power creep. You either introduce power creep and makes parts of the game obsolete or you keep powerlevels constant and try to redesign the game on this level.
In the long term i’d like to see a shift away from the current raid design, and more emphasis be put on player/mob interaction (similar to what thad said above) and less on the traditionally hit it harder till its dead approach. A refresh on the mechanics that allow from more distinct play patterns to emerge is always the better option for any content imo.
That is the exact opposite of power creep. You can’t first make content obsolete by inrtoducing power creep, then redesign it. Well technically you could if you are willing to redesign the entire pve content there is (much like Blizzard did with Cataclysm where they redesign big parts of the vanilla world). That would be so expensive though that the more sensible approach is to keep power creep in check and redesign off of that – ergo classes that are to powerful need to get nerfed instead others buffed. Unless you’ve had a huge update and all the classes are severly underpowered compared to the current pve content, then you could bring the weaker ones up.
I don’t think you’re quite grasping it. Given 2 evil’s of Power Creep or Constantly horrible balance cycles involving nothing but nerf bats, while not addressing the route of the problem (mechanical complexity) i’ll take power creep. This is my personal opinion while being fully aware power creep is bad.
What i’d rather see is changes to the current raids design. It is ultimately too simplistic, which causes certain outliers as far as DPS specific power creep is concerned. This will help in addressing the perceived notion of power creep because you wont be incentivized to take 3-4x (top dps classes) as they may or may not be useful in the content.
As is, people are already saying “raids” are easy… So really what’s the harm in them being “easier”, especially given there’s a new release coming in the next 3 months time ?
Again though at what point during those 3 years of balance did we not have “Power Creep”. It’s about the only way outside of gutting classes that Anet knows how to address balance. It’s never small numerical tweaks to bring all the roles in line with a desired base performance standard.
This is what i’m getting at here, you can say it’s bad and i’ll agree it’s bad but it’s what we have as far as balance goes. Take your pick something that’s ultimately fun for players, or a bunch of more of what’s going down in the mesmer subforum of complaints about how their class specialization got gutted and left for not.
Thaddeus already answered this nicely, but I just wanted to add a bit.
Your logic is flawed. You assume (correctly at this point) that players enjoy buffs more than nerfs. That is correct. You further assume that this extends to the game in general, and that is where you are wrong. While players might enjoy classes being brought on par via buffs instead of ners, the resulting powercreep makes the game as a whole easier, more boring and cuts enjoyment severly. Now most traditional MMOs counter this by making items obsolete or adding futher levels to the level cap thus reseting the power creep and starting the process anew. Both of those don’t work in GW2 thus all people are left with is more and more obsolete content.
One could argue that what’s actually hampering enjoyment of the game isn’t the classes. It’s the lack of frequent meaningful updates. One can even take the recent Shatter Rework as proof of this. Multiple maps were filled and people are out there doing it more frequently because of changes to it.
If we look back at the games history we can see this is fairly common, infact one would argue more so in bringing players back to doing old “trivial” content than any single balance update ever could.
So to argue that content being easier and trivial due to balance while technically correct isn’t the only reason for it being trivial lest we want to forget that age and repetition also kill content.
Oh I absolutely agree. Now if you could explain how this point relates to balance and power creep changes?
Ever heard the proverb:“Two wrongs don’t make a right?”
Just because the game is lacking meaningful, consistent upgrades of fresh content does not mean that balance and power creep should get out of hand. Just as repetition of content and experience, while also responsible for eventually making the game easier, do not justify power creep. It’s just two sides to a coin which both need to be adressed.
Now if you are arguing that class buffs should work as short term “fun boosts and motivators” for players, sure that would work. I agreed with you on the fact that buffs in general are fun for players. Unfortunately I disagree that this is anything else than a short term solution, since the medium and longterm effects, as explained earlier, have a negative effect on the games enjoyment.
The TL;DR i’m making here if you will is neither solution is healthy, but i’d rather if given the option take the power creep as the content is already trivial for most raiders / raiding guilds in the short term.
In the long term i’d like to see a shift away from the current raid design, and more emphasis be put on player/mob interaction (similar to what thad said above) and less on the traditionally hit it harder till its dead approach. A refresh on the mechanics that allow from more distinct play patterns to emerge is always the better option for any content imo.
The Glorious armor set is like so cool!
Im happy you like this but you look like a scrawny viewtiful joe, a broke power ranger and an unemployed random final fantasy knight.
Hey now I’m all for your crusade, but the moment you dis viewtiful joe we got problems.
Again though at what point during those 3 years of balance did we not have “Power Creep”. It’s about the only way outside of gutting classes that Anet knows how to address balance. It’s never small numerical tweaks to bring all the roles in line with a desired base performance standard.
This is what i’m getting at here, you can say it’s bad and i’ll agree it’s bad but it’s what we have as far as balance goes. Take your pick something that’s ultimately fun for players, or a bunch of more of what’s going down in the mesmer subforum of complaints about how their class specialization got gutted and left for not.
Thaddeus already answered this nicely, but I just wanted to add a bit.
Your logic is flawed. You assume (correctly at this point) that players enjoy buffs more than nerfs. That is correct. You further assume that this extends to the game in general, and that is where you are wrong. While players might enjoy classes being brought on par via buffs instead of ners, the resulting powercreep makes the game as a whole easier, more boring and cuts enjoyment severly. Now most traditional MMOs counter this by making items obsolete or adding futher levels to the level cap thus reseting the power creep and starting the process anew. Both of those don’t work in GW2 thus all people are left with is more and more obsolete content.
One could argue that what’s actually hampering enjoyment of the game isn’t the classes. It’s the lack of frequent meaningful updates. One can even take the recent Shatter Rework as proof of this. Multiple maps were filled and people are out there doing it more frequently because of changes to it.
If we look back at the games history we can see this is fairly common, infact one would argue more so in bringing players back to doing old “trivial” content than any single balance update ever could.
So to argue that content being easier and trivial due to balance while technically correct isn’t the only reason for it being trivial lest we want to forget that age and repetition also kill content.
It’s all a side effect of the recession the economy is in.
Raw gold is simple worth more than any single item any speculator was holding onto.
I’ve noticed a few issues with what appear to be scripting/pathing.
Generally it will happen in the last phase after the first break bar, the boss will 180 as if to place teleport stones, not place them continue walking but walking the wrong direction (I.E toward blue and not toward the tank, whose in the green sector).
If i get a video of this i’ll post it later.
If you honestly believe the game was balanced for 3 years prior to HoT, you are as delusional as they come.
I fully well know power creep, is bad. Yet, we have nothing but power creep to get due to the course the game has laid out with specializations.
I wrote : ‘’3 years of balance down the drain’’
You read : ‘’3 years of a balanced game’’
Good job.
It’s not because Anet continue to put Power Creep in the game that’ll stop complaining about it. The day I stop complaining about will be either because I stopped playing the game and to come on the forum or the day they will stop doing it. I know that the first one will probably happen before, but well it’s life, nothing I can do about it.
Again though at what point during those 3 years of balance did we not have “Power Creep”. It’s about the only way outside of gutting classes that Anet knows how to address balance. It’s never small numerical tweaks to bring all the roles in line with a desired base performance standard.
This is what i’m getting at here, you can say it’s bad and i’ll agree it’s bad but it’s what we have as far as balance goes. Take your pick something that’s ultimately fun for players, or a bunch of more of what’s going down in the mesmer subforum of complaints about how their class specialization got gutted and left for not.
Power Creep is more fun for players than nerf bats.
Power Creep is an cheap and easy way to balance things out while giving unaware players something to cheer up. Power Creep is one the worst thing game designer can do, especially since most player will be happy with it when they introduce it until it destroy part of their game. But players ain’t able to see the correlation so game design can get away with it.
Nerf bats is also a bad design decision. It essentially mean that they did a very bad balance decision and they need to fix it. In theory it’s as bad as a power creep, but it’s so unpopular that game designer try to use it as little as possible, meaning that it never really affect as much negativaly a game as power creep.
Good game designer should know their power curse and balance things around that power curse. Buffing when it’s below it and nerfing when it’s over it. Ideally, not doing some huge swing around it like they did with Thief. From the highest dps with support to almost no role, to one of the highest dps against but with no support. All of that in the span of a couple of months. And why is that? Mostly because of the huge power creep from HoT with debalanced everything and got 3 years of balance down the drain.
If you honestly believe the game was balanced for 3 years prior to HoT, you are as delusional as they come.
I fully well know power creep, is bad. Yet, we have nothing but power creep to get due to the course the game has laid out with specializations. You can say tweak or tune, x/y. But ultimately that never happens. It would be more likely to happen if we actually had regular (monthy/bi-weekly) balance updates….However that is far from the case, which leads to huge cyclical changes to playstyles and balance.
Ask yourself how many condi warriors you saw outside of shout heal, PvP/WvW in the last 3 years ? Most people wouldnt have seen it now its common place. It opened up the floodgates to something people found fun. Was it OP, slightly. But now all that’s happened is we’ve replace that with Ele, Necro, Theif.
Guess what your next balance cycle is going to contain drastic swings towards….If it doesn’t i’ll take my hat and eat it.
Instead of asking other professions to be nerfed, how about asking your profession to be buffed?
Anybody? No? Oh well…
Because if you only buff, it’s just a big power creep. GW2 is already plague with power creep, we don’t want more of it.
Power Creep is more fun for players than nerf bats.
Welcome to medium armor, would like a trench coat or a trench coat ?
Oh, you’re a human female, how about some sideboob, with a helping of tight leather pants instead ?
Do Thieves and Necros actually bring something to the party other then damage?
Not really…they can but its not the best.
The problem here is, do the raid encounters require anything other than damage ?
From my perspective the answer is no. While having the support is nice, it’s not required. If raids had more complex mechanics, then maybe we’d see some diversity when it comes to optimizing runs. The other end of the spectrum is also possible if they take the mechanical requirements too far obviously.
Dragon ball/bash has no ties to anything.
I’m not agreeing with OP here, but the Lunar Festival is based on the Chinese New Year.
It’s based on the Canthan New Year*
disclaimer Cantha is based on all asian cultures, not just chinese.
Power Creep may be bad for the game, optimized runs might not be helping it….However nerfing every “strong build” probably isn’t any healthier for the game.
Personally i’d much rather them open up more options by tweaking other classes numerically to be on par with Necro/Thief than go back to gutting each strong build.