Guild Wars 2

For clarification my crit damage is 92% and my crit chance is 50% Attack is 3600-3700. I should NOT be doing 400 damage with FGS to a regen warrior who is built all defensively and out healing all the damage he is taking without even using his heal skill. Give Warriors Signet of Restoration and give Elementalists healing signet for 1 month, see how fast your Warriors cry foul play.

Glass Elementalist only doing 402damage versus a Warrior who hits for a lot more damage with a hammer while fully out regenerating the damage? This needs to be fixed, and not in a few months, but like now… This has gone on for to long and it is quite pathetic that every time I see a Dev playing the game it is on a Warrior… There is a reason why Warrior is so overpowered, stop playing the Warrior and try an Elementalist for 1 hour and you will QUIT your own game. Go full bunker if you’d like, still will not help you live versus that regen. 8% Reduction is not going to be enough, you need to nerf the warrior down to Elementalist state, actually nerf ALL classes to Elementalist state. sPvP community got Elementalist nerfed, how about they get other classes nerfed now?

Un-do all the nerfs you whack-a-moled onto the Elementalist because people kittened and complained about how the Elementalist was tickling them but wouldn’t die.

it’s not that bad. warriors are not that broken. I may be wrong but from a quick look at the log I’d say you got outplayed, you got cc’d and didn’t use a stunbreaker/didn’t have stability.

the only thing that I feel really broken with warrior is the auto stability on cc trait which really makes no sense, no class should have that. and warbanners, but for a whole other reason.

There are two sides to this, the one with people who play warriors and the other with people who play other classes.
Sadly the first side has more members.

Maskaganda.2043:

the only thing that I feel really broken with warrior is the auto stability on cc trait which really makes no sense, no class should have that. and warbanners, but for a whole other reason.

ya, try not standing still while he hammers the kitten out of you.

Warriors arnt OP, they are just a really good class. They have very few space holder or wasted skills.

they do need a balance on their mobility abilities, it comes to easily to them. Im fine with them having higher HP pool, Armor etc. But they should have to work a little bit to get that mobility.

this comes from a warrior btw.

Otaur.9268:

For clarification my crit damage is 92% and my crit chance is 50% Attack is 3600-3700. I should NOT be doing 400 damage with FGS to a regen warrior who is built all defensively and out healing all the damage he is taking without even using his heal skill. Give Warriors Signet of Restoration and give Elementalists healing signet for 1 month, see how fast your Warriors cry foul play.

Glass Elementalist only doing 402damage versus a Warrior who hits for a lot more damage with a hammer while fully out regenerating the damage? This needs to be fixed, and not in a few months, but like now… This has gone on for to long and it is quite pathetic that every time I see a Dev playing the game it is on a Warrior… There is a reason why Warrior is so overpowered, stop playing the Warrior and try an Elementalist for 1 hour and you will QUIT your own game. Go full bunker if you’d like, still will not help you live versus that regen. 8% Reduction is not going to be enough, you need to nerf the warrior down to Elementalist state, actually nerf ALL classes to Elementalist state. sPvP community got Elementalist nerfed, how about they get other classes nerfed now?

Un-do all the nerfs you whack-a-moled onto the Elementalist because people kittened and complained about how the Elementalist was tickling them but wouldn’t die.

i hear your frustration, but your ranting. refocus and try again.

glass isnt great as an ele nor is full bunker (bunker is for zerg busting/support hybrid, your not going to solo anything kitten a bunker, unless its a bad player or an uplevel). Find the balance. what weapon set are you running?, what traits, what utility.. and i swear if you say your running the new arcane heal for 1v1 im going to lol so hard.

staff should be able to escape a warrior, but you will almost never be able to take on heads up. D/D and S/D should be able to win most of their fights (call it 50/50, which isnt bad really)vs warriors, given equal stacks, buffs and abilities.

I used to get rolled kitten my ele all the time after the nerf bat, started running buff food and got my applied stacks and it balanced out. As i noticed all the warrior that face rolled me where buffed out the kitten and killing me in 3-4 shots.

Stick with it, cheer up and have fun. if you want to skirmish and roam in WvW, Ele just isnt the winning ticket right now.. see warrior, engi, mesmer or thief

Warrior is indeed strong, but this seems like more of a build issue. He’s stacked to be strong against the physical damage you are dealing. He’d probably have to run from condition builds with +duration.

I don’t see anything wrong with Warriors… they are one of my favorite targets to kill. I beat 95 % of the warriors I face one on one and I play a Engi :]

Whirl goes through the target and applies cripple. That’s not really the damaging attack to gauge numbers with. The auto-attack and teleported fiery rush is the only reason to pull out a FGS vs a warrior.

In your defense, warrior healing is way overpowered. I don’t know if a build exists for ele that can solo warriors right now (namely ham/bow or gs). We can’t negate or out-heal their dps, and we can’t cc/burst them.

@replies: He stated his class already. Saying you can beat them with another class doesn’t help him at all. Also, the only worthwhile condition an ele can use vs a warrior is a chill build. And even then: not good enough.

Ninjapotpie.6973:

I don’t see anything wrong with Warriors… they are one of my favorite targets to kill. I beat 95 % of the warriors I face one on one and I play a Engi :]

And Engineers being incredibly strong at 1v1ing in WvW has nothing to do with that? Nope!

Otaur.9268:

For clarification my crit damage is 92% and my crit chance is 50% Attack is 3600-3700. I should NOT be doing 400 damage with FGS to a regen warrior who is built all defensively and out healing all the damage he is taking without even using his heal skill.

So what is your armor? Let me guess :1700? or 1.5k.
And how do you know he is defensive build?

Momentous strike hitted me 5768.
Isn’t it the damage from reckless dodge?

It’s essentially impossible for an ele to beat a competent warrior in wvw. My ele is built fairly durable, 0/20/0/20/30 or standard 0/10/0/30/30 d/d… usually soldiers or cav armor with celestial trinkets. Boon duration for high protection uptime etc. Even if you are traited/geared defensively a warrior will tear through you. Then there are the super high healing condi bunker warriors… /shudder

Then I look at my warrior with almost full zerker on, almost 20k hp, ~2800 armor, way better healing, way better utilities… just makes me sigh. If warriors aren’t “OP” then they are very, very, very, very good right now.

Aside from Healing Signet and mobility, i’d say that warrior skills in general scale too well with Power. Autoattacks (GS and Hammer) doing 4-5k and Whirlwind Attack (which is also movement and evade) doing up to 3-4k per hit (compared to the measly 800 a Blurred Frenzy – which also self roots – does) is too much, no matter how offensively a character is built.

Didn’t bother to read most of the post…fairly obvious warrior burst is out of control cuz all alot of them do is run max survivability & then just spam whirlwind/hundred blades for crazy amounts of damage. As a thief…when I run max a survivability build….my role is relegated zerg troll/snares. Not so for warrior…That class is easy mode right now. Safe bet Izzy is playing warrior… One good thing about GW is the fact that builds & class dominance are cyclical. Eventually …we’re all gonna be kittening about Guardian burst.

Dear Anet please nerf, Ele’s because this one time I lost to one. Also please nerf Thieves, Guardians, Engineers, Mesmers, Necro’s because at some point I have lost to them as well.

the sad part is I don’t even play a warrior any more but the constant QQ’s …. get over it, you lost a fight.

It does bear mentioning that a warrior in full zerker gear has better defensive stats than an ele in full soldier’s (before allocating stat points for either character.)

That warriors can win take damage give damage have no problem with that is what warriors are meant to be ……but there ability to run away in heavy armor faster than light classes with speed adds is crazy.
Warriors are not meant to be olympic sprinters .

Warrior is very good when bad player fight against bad player.

I have most all classes and yes warriors are kinda out of control right now. Problem is anet takes to long to patch. Warrior is slowly becoming the flavor of the year. Warrior has hands down the best heal. I will take healing singet on any of my other classes pls. But that would be op right yet its not op on warrior. They have great mobility for being a heavy armor class. 8 second savage leap compared to say ride the lightning 40 second cd 20 if you hit somebody. Plus warrior have rush whirl and even earthshaker. All of the strong warrior traits are in the defense line. Warriors have way more stability time than most any class which is a major factor in wvw fights. Warriors can get some pretty insane stats since they are heavy armor and high health pool to begin with. Last mostly defensive built warriors can hit really hard with hammer even after the nerfs. I do considerably more dmg swinging a hammer with the 1 key on my warrior who is defensive built than my ele who is pretty glass cannony while using his abilities.

This isn’t a problem strictly against warriors but any class who runs a bunker style build.

If you take class running full glass cannon vs a class running full bunker, the bunker build will do more damage to the glass class, than the glass will do to the bunker which is a bit ridiculous.

This issue doesn’t crop up much because I think most people don’t run a full glass build, but for those that do should notice it. It does get mentioned here from time to time, and realistically it should be something Anet addresses.

Warriors obviously stand out due to their high damage output already coupled with their high armor and health pool. I’m ok with them having high damage with high armor, but realistically any class running full dps should be hitting a lot harder than a warrior (or any other class for that matter), in full bunker.

Basically full dps class should always do more damage to a target that isn’t in full dps. Right now, this is not the case.

The warrior has ridiculously long and telegraphed windups. Sure the running this is annoying but that is a roamer spec and several classes are every bit as slippery. The bunker warrior variety are indeed tough to bring down but hit like a wet noodle. Most warriors are really only strong around other players.

The only class build I have seen to date that has heavy damage and tough to kill is that somewhat new PU mesmer build focused around conditioning.

gpassucc.5961:

It’s essentially impossible for an ele to beat a competent warrior in wvw.

Only because they can escape a fight. We have an ele in our guild that will lay smack down on just about any warrior. At best a warrior can fight him to a draw. Just last night I ran into an ele from IoJ near SM that was a beast and would dismantle an average warrior.

DeadlySynz.3471:

This isn’t a problem strictly against warriors but any class who runs a bunker style build.

If you take class running full glass cannon vs a class running full bunker, the bunker build will do more damage to the glass class, than the glass will do to the bunker which is a bit ridiculous.

This issue doesn’t crop up much because I think most people don’t run a full glass build, but for those that do should notice it. It does get mentioned here from time to time, and realistically it should be something Anet addresses.

Warriors obviously stand out due to their high damage output already coupled with their high armor and health pool. I’m ok with them having high damage with high armor, but realistically any class running full dps should be hitting a lot harder than a warrior (or any other class for that matter), in full bunker.

Basically full dps class should always do more damage to a target that isn’t in full dps. Right now, this is not the case.

Again this^ Thief and mesmer are the only classes that to me seem to actually hit really hard when build glassy. All other classes just don’t seem to benefit from a glassy build. They still dont hit very hard and are now much easier to kill.

Chuck Zitto.2367:

DeadlySynz.3471:

This isn’t a problem strictly against warriors but any class who runs a bunker style build.

If you take class running full glass cannon vs a class running full bunker, the bunker build will do more damage to the glass class, than the glass will do to the bunker which is a bit ridiculous.

This issue doesn’t crop up much because I think most people don’t run a full glass build, but for those that do should notice it. It does get mentioned here from time to time, and realistically it should be something Anet addresses.

Warriors obviously stand out due to their high damage output already coupled with their high armor and health pool. I’m ok with them having high damage with high armor, but realistically any class running full dps should be hitting a lot harder than a warrior (or any other class for that matter), in full bunker.

Basically full dps class should always do more damage to a target that isn’t in full dps. Right now, this is not the case.

Again this^ Thief and mesmer are the only classes that to me seem to actually hit really hard when build glassy. All other classes just don’t seem to benefit from a glassy build. They still dont hit very hard and are now much easier to kill.

Anybody can test this to just with warriors.

A warrior in full berserker gear will auto attack for less damage against a warrior in full PVT gear and accessories.

I’ve tested this before with my buddy as I suspected something wasn’t right.

- My berserker warrior’s auto attack against his PVT warrior = 1100 -1800
- His PVT warrior’s auto attack against my Berserker warrior = 2100 – 3500

IMO, this isn’t right and is completely backwards. This isn’t a warrior issue, it’s a design/scaling issue between power and toughness.

DeadlySynz.3471:

Chuck Zitto.2367:

DeadlySynz.3471:

This isn’t a problem strictly against warriors but any class who runs a bunker style build.

If you take class running full glass cannon vs a class running full bunker, the bunker build will do more damage to the glass class, than the glass will do to the bunker which is a bit ridiculous.

This issue doesn’t crop up much because I think most people don’t run a full glass build, but for those that do should notice it. It does get mentioned here from time to time, and realistically it should be something Anet addresses.

Warriors obviously stand out due to their high damage output already coupled with their high armor and health pool. I’m ok with them having high damage with high armor, but realistically any class running full dps should be hitting a lot harder than a warrior (or any other class for that matter), in full bunker.

Basically full dps class should always do more damage to a target that isn’t in full dps. Right now, this is not the case.

Again this^ Thief and mesmer are the only classes that to me seem to actually hit really hard when build glassy. All other classes just don’t seem to benefit from a glassy build. They still dont hit very hard and are now much easier to kill.

Anybody can test this to just with warriors.

A warrior in full berserker gear will auto attack for less damage against a warrior in full PVT gear and accessories.

I’ve tested this before with my buddy as I suspected something wasn’t right.

- My berserker warrior’s auto attack against his PVT warrior = 1100 -1800
- His PVT warrior’s auto attack against my Berserker warrior = 2100 – 3500

IMO, this isn’t right and is completely backwards. This isn’t a warrior issue, it’s a design/scaling issue between power and toughness.

Why use bad gear? You could almost have 3k attack, 3k armor +20k hp and 80% or something crit dmg. No no i did craft full berserker ascended gear because it’s so good in cof1 and i can’t use anything else than that gear because it’s ascended gear.

Junkpile.7439:

DeadlySynz.3471:

Chuck Zitto.2367:

DeadlySynz.3471:

This isn’t a problem strictly against warriors but any class who runs a bunker style build.

If you take class running full glass cannon vs a class running full bunker, the bunker build will do more damage to the glass class, than the glass will do to the bunker which is a bit ridiculous.

This issue doesn’t crop up much because I think most people don’t run a full glass build, but for those that do should notice it. It does get mentioned here from time to time, and realistically it should be something Anet addresses.

Warriors obviously stand out due to their high damage output already coupled with their high armor and health pool. I’m ok with them having high damage with high armor, but realistically any class running full dps should be hitting a lot harder than a warrior (or any other class for that matter), in full bunker.

Basically full dps class should always do more damage to a target that isn’t in full dps. Right now, this is not the case.

Again this^ Thief and mesmer are the only classes that to me seem to actually hit really hard when build glassy. All other classes just don’t seem to benefit from a glassy build. They still dont hit very hard and are now much easier to kill.

Anybody can test this to just with warriors.

A warrior in full berserker gear will auto attack for less damage against a warrior in full PVT gear and accessories.

I’ve tested this before with my buddy as I suspected something wasn’t right.

- My berserker warrior’s auto attack against his PVT warrior = 1100 -1800
- His PVT warrior’s auto attack against my Berserker warrior = 2100 – 3500

IMO, this isn’t right and is completely backwards. This isn’t a warrior issue, it’s a design/scaling issue between power and toughness.

Why use bad gear? You could almost have 3k attack, 3k armor +20k hp and 80% or something crit dmg. No no i did craft full berserker ascended gear because it’s so good in cof1 and i can’t use anything else than that gear because it’s ascended gear.

It’s not an issue of what’s optimal; it’s an issue on how toughness scales vs power.

Two warriors vs each other, one in full berserker and one in full PVT gear. The PVT geared warrior does more damage, that simply isn’t right. Full dps gear should be doing more dps than any other gear that isn’t dps based.

Your not going to get 3K attack + 3K armor with 20k+ hp with an elementalist; but again, this isn’t a warrior issue.

You pit an classes up against one another, whether is Ranger vs Ranger, Ele vs Ele, Guard vs Guard, or Mes vs Mes… You put one in Berserker gear and the other in PVT gear, the PVT geared player will do more damage against Berserker gear. I don’t know if this was intentional on Anet’s part but, to me anyway, it doesn’t seem right.

Warriors are not OP. All of these threads and posts are by people who do not build their character properly, or play their class as well as it could be played (despite thinking their #1 in the game).

Here’s a fight I had today.

My party (we didn’t know each other, just a PUG)(Sea of Sorrows)
Lvl 80 Warrior. Sword/warhorn, greatsword. 50% DPS built. This was me.
Lvl 80 Thief. Dagger/pistol, shortbow. Zerker.
Lvl 42 Warrior. Axe/shield, greatsword. Don’t know stats
Lvl 33 Mesmer. Greatsword, staff. Don’t know stats.

Versus (4 from same guild + 1 random)(Maguuma):
Lvl 80 Warrior. Hammer, greatsword.
Lvl 80 Warrior. Hammer + something.
Lvl 80 Warrior. Hammer + something.
Lvl 80 Elementslist. Staff.
Lvl 80 Necromancer. Staff + axe focus.

4v5, and we won.
4v5 with 2 up levels, and we won.
4v5 with 2 up levels, versus 3 hammer warriors, and we won.
4v5 with 2 up levels, versus 3 hammer warriors, and ele and necro, and we won.

Yeah guys, warrior is sooooooooo overpowered.

What a joke.

Just because you lost, don’t blame the class. Blame yourself first, you might think you’re hot stuff…… but chances are….

Record yourself playing, and watch over it later to see your mistakes. I personally don’t do this, but I know for a fact you’ll get better at the game.

DeadlySynz.3471:

-snip-

Assuming both players are of average skill level. A person in full PVT verse a person of the same class in full zerk will never win. Will. Never. Win. Fact.

PVT is for pug map zerging/blobbing. It is garbage in roaming and small ops. PVT doesn’t do any damage.

If you can’t beat a player who is built for pug map zerging with a DPS build in a 1v1 then you need to re-evaluate your build and play style. This is not class imbalance, it is player skill level imbalance.

Ok to answer some of your questions. 1) I have 2300 armor and already told you my Attack / crit chance / crit damage. 2) I do 2-4k with lightning whip versus EVERY target EXCEPT Warriors. They are the one of 2 classes who can 2-3 shot my Ele. Thief being the other. To stop CC i had used AoE, + AoE traited for the extra protection and stability. However the amount of damage his CC abilities did 7-8k Earthshaker is over 50% of my health. I have almost 14k Health. Why is the Warrior the only “bunker” who can take a glassy builds damage and face tank it while out healing it, yet any other bunker can be killed. A Warrior even in the worst players hands can just run his/her hand over the keyboard and still wreck havoc on any Elementalist.

The warrior has ridiculously long and telegraphed windups.

Yes, that Whirlwind Attack taking out 50-75% of my health has an incredible long cast time, indeed…

Also, 5k autoattacks (which are not warrior exclusive, mind you), shouldn’t be possible at all imo.

Actually, i’m currently at a point where i just /shrug and /laugh at every warrior after he runs out of combat for 2 or 3 times against me.

Iavra.8510:

Aside from Healing Signet and mobility, i’d say that warrior skills in general scale too well with Power. Autoattacks (GS and Hammer) doing 4-5k and Whirlwind Attack (which is also movement and evade) doing up to 3-4k per hit (compared to the measly 800 a Blurred Frenzy – which also self roots – does) is too much, no matter how offensively a character is built.

Blurred frenzy also gives you evasion and you can cancel it anytime if you have a weapon swap available. Same with whirlwind. God forbid a class that is suppose to be the master of melee be good at doing damage with it. Also if you’re actually being hit by multiple GS and hammer autos you’re doing something wrong no matter what class you’re on. The autos are slow and easy to dodge just by walking. I’m by no means saying that warriors aren’t strong but they’re a class that THRIVES IN MELEE. They’re meant to take punishment and deal it right back. Also I’ve never seen a 4k+ auto with gs/hammer unless it was a crit in zerk gear.

I’ve said it time and time again the problem with warriors isn’t healing signet it’s cleansing ire and the defense tree. Also WvW would be better off not allowing consumables but that’s a completely different argument and irrelevant.

Otaur.9268:

Ok to answer some of your questions. 1) I have 2300 armor and already told you my Attack / crit chance / crit damage. 2) I do 2-4k with lightning whip versus EVERY target EXCEPT Warriors. They are the one of 2 classes who can 2-3 shot my Ele. Thief being the other. To stop CC i had used AoE, + AoE traited for the extra protection and stability. However the amount of damage his CC abilities did 7-8k Earthshaker is over 50% of my health. I have almost 14k Health. Why is the Warrior the only “bunker” who can take a glassy builds damage and face tank it while out healing it, yet any other bunker can be killed. A Warrior even in the worst players hands can just run his/her hand over the keyboard and still wreck havoc on any Elementalist.

Because ele is in a sad state of affairs and has been discussed to death and they need buffs.

I think that merciless hammer increasing damage by 25% might be a little too much.

Maliel.8362:

I think that merciless hammer increasing damage by 25% might be a little too much.

Hammer damage is increased when a foe is disabled. Reduces recharge on hammer skills.
“Disabled” refers to any effect that prevents character action. (Daze, Stun, Knockdown)

All 3 of which are completely irrelevant if you have stability/stunbreak not to mention that the moves that cause these for a warrior are extremely telegraphed. There is no reason in a 1v1 you can’t dodge earthshaker or backbreaker.

I’ve done a lot of personal testing between a guildie’s warrior and my ele in sPvP. We mostly make our builds as similar as possible to the builds we use in WvW but I usually love to build my eles as various hybrid builds, as eles hit like a wet blanket when full or near full bunker and glass just folds over in like 2 hits… My guildie also built his warrior as a hybrid but more on the DPS side using hammer/GS whereas I made a more offensive 0/15/10/15/30 D/D build for my ele. The result of many of these fights wound up being ties, though not to discredit my guildie, as he does play a great warrior, in some instances I was able to get great bursts on him that could get him down to maybe 25% health at times, though in order to sustain my damage to keep him from healing it back with his heal signet, I’d have to stick around in melee range auto attacking (which is only fairly effective in air attune, and even then doesn’t impact warriors that much unless it crits) until my burst skills got off CD again (in which most of us know ele weapon skill CDs on their biggest burst skills are just so long!) 90% of the time I can’t keep that pressure up because I’m so busy trying to avoid the retaliation of hammer stuns, and usually if I got caught in a full hammer chain, I’d be down to about 25% to 40% health from around full health so staying in melee range would be detrimental so I would be forced to kite and read his attacks. Unfortunately by the time I feel the hammer stun chain is over, he’s already recovered his HP back to about 60 to 75% health so I’d have to setup another perfect chain burst, which is too far and between for eles. I can forget about fighting and winning against him if he makes a build that leans more to the extreme bunker or extreme DPS or even extreme condi as I usually don’t last long as I can’t pressure the warrior hard enough without me taking gobs of damage as collateral.

The main problem eles have against warriors I feel is that eles lack much in sustainable damage (Mainly in auto attacks compared to almost all other classes) to really outDPS the regen of a warrior, as burst damage from eles usually aren’t enough. Even worse is the class’s direct lack of access to poison to be able to counter that problem. Perhaps if some of our earth skills incorporated some poison mechanics into them, warriors wouldn’t be as big of a threat to eles as they are right now, and it could also open up some viable ideas for condition build elementalists as well.

the wars speed
the wars hp regen
the wars hammer. damage/cc out of balance can’t have such huge damage with that much cc…. that is OP

the thief is at least squishy and the high damage is balanced by low hp.

the only thing a war can not do now is go in stealth . war out shines the thief easy right now

if having that much cc/ high damage. great condition clear . insane hp regen. insane land speed and heavy armor on top of it is not op .

u r worse than the thief class by far.

it is a joke how a war can (just stand there) "not doing a single thing "

and i am not talking about immune skills.

but still take mass damage from MANY people. (& still having balanced damage) just to happily walk away in clear view with a small army chasing them !
that is truly op!

Colt.9051:

I’ve done a lot of personal testing between a guildie’s warrior and my ele in sPvP. We mostly make our builds as similar as possible to the builds we use in WvW but I usually love to build my eles as various hybrid builds, as eles hit like a wet blanket when full or near full bunker and glass just folds over in like 2 hits… My guildie also built his warrior as a hybrid but more on the DPS side using hammer/GS whereas I made a more offensive 0/15/10/15/30 D/D build for my ele. The result of many of these fights wound up being ties, though not to discredit my guildie, as he does play a great warrior, in some instances I was able to get great bursts on him that could get him down to maybe 25% health at times, though in order to sustain my damage to keep him from healing it back with his heal signet, I’d have to stick around in melee range auto attacking (which is only fairly effective in air attune, and even then doesn’t impact warriors that much unless it crits) until my burst skills got off CD again (in which most of us know ele weapon skill CDs on their biggest burst skills are just so long!) 90% of the time I can’t keep that pressure up because I’m so busy trying to avoid the retaliation of hammer stuns, and usually if I got caught in a full hammer chain, I’d be down to about 25% to 40% health from around full health so staying in melee range would be detrimental so I would be forced to kite and read his attacks. Unfortunately by the time I feel the hammer stun chain is over, he’s already recovered his HP back to about 60 to 75% health so I’d have to setup another perfect chain burst, which is too far and between for eles. I can forget about fighting and winning against him if he makes a build that leans more to the extreme bunker or extreme DPS or even extreme condi as I usually don’t last long as I can’t pressure the warrior hard enough without me taking gobs of damage as collateral.

The main problem eles have against warriors I feel is that eles lack much in sustainable damage (Mainly in auto attacks compared to almost all other classes) to really outDPS the regen of a warrior, as burst damage from eles usually aren’t enough. Even worse is the class’s direct lack of access to poison to be able to counter that problem. Perhaps if some of our earth skills incorporated some poison mechanics into them, warriors wouldn’t be as big of a threat to eles as they are right now, and it could also open up some viable ideas for condition build elementalists as well.

Not to discredit you and your guildies tests, but sPvP is very limited compared to WvW stats

Warrior is definitely OP, but if a GC ele isn’t doing damage, then the GC ele isn’t playing correctly.

@Screensot in OP: The only thing that the screenshot proves is how weak FGS is without wall or teleport.

why nerf warrior? they are perfectly balanced. cough for a skilled player that can use only 1 button cough

You know this conversation is quite interesting, but how about we talk about warrior when NOT an elementalist? I keep seeing these arguments tied between warrior and elementalist, when its clear everyone agrees elementalist needs a buff period.

I see the main complaint isn’t with the damage or even the healing, its when the warrior has this untouchable healing, alongside the insane damage. One or the other seems fine, but not both

Mjgander.1905:

Ninjapotpie.6973:

I don’t see anything wrong with Warriors… they are one of my favorite targets to kill. I beat 95 % of the warriors I face one on one and I play a Engi :]

And Engineers being incredibly strong at 1v1ing in WvW has nothing to do with that? Nope!

So here’s a question…

What class is a good match-up for the ele…like what can it beat with no issue?

Otaur.9268:

Colt.9051:

I’ve done a lot of personal testing between a guildie’s warrior and my ele in sPvP. We mostly make our builds as similar as possible to the builds we use in WvW but I usually love to build my eles as various hybrid builds, as eles hit like a wet blanket when full or near full bunker and glass just folds over in like 2 hits… My guildie also built his warrior as a hybrid but more on the DPS side using hammer/GS whereas I made a more offensive 0/15/10/15/30 D/D build for my ele. The result of many of these fights wound up being ties, though not to discredit my guildie, as he does play a great warrior, in some instances I was able to get great bursts on him that could get him down to maybe 25% health at times, though in order to sustain my damage to keep him from healing it back with his heal signet, I’d have to stick around in melee range auto attacking (which is only fairly effective in air attune, and even then doesn’t impact warriors that much unless it crits) until my burst skills got off CD again (in which most of us know ele weapon skill CDs on their biggest burst skills are just so long!) 90% of the time I can’t keep that pressure up because I’m so busy trying to avoid the retaliation of hammer stuns, and usually if I got caught in a full hammer chain, I’d be down to about 25% to 40% health from around full health so staying in melee range would be detrimental so I would be forced to kite and read his attacks. Unfortunately by the time I feel the hammer stun chain is over, he’s already recovered his HP back to about 60 to 75% health so I’d have to setup another perfect chain burst, which is too far and between for eles. I can forget about fighting and winning against him if he makes a build that leans more to the extreme bunker or extreme DPS or even extreme condi as I usually don’t last long as I can’t pressure the warrior hard enough without me taking gobs of damage as collateral.

The main problem eles have against warriors I feel is that eles lack much in sustainable damage (Mainly in auto attacks compared to almost all other classes) to really outDPS the regen of a warrior, as burst damage from eles usually aren’t enough. Even worse is the class’s direct lack of access to poison to be able to counter that problem. Perhaps if some of our earth skills incorporated some poison mechanics into them, warriors wouldn’t be as big of a threat to eles as they are right now, and it could also open up some viable ideas for condition build elementalists as well.

Not to discredit you and your guildies tests, but sPvP is very limited compared to WvW stats

Spvp is possibly a lot more balanced than WvW simply because in WvW you can buff your stat’s to unreasonable heights thanks to food, and also runes and sigils that arent available in spvp..

Why would you test in a place with so many variables?

I agree than heal sig is slightly op, but allow me to list all of the flawed logic of this post.

1.) You seem to have failed to hit this warrior in your combat log with any significant attack. That isn’t going to help you win regardless of your heal skill.

2.) Wvw eles typically thrive in support roles. If you’re running a standard staff ele, you will help your zerg win fights, but will not win many 1v1’s and that’s okay. You are a necessary piece for the greater good.

3.) A havok ele should be equiped wither dagger dagger (cantrip build) or scepter dagger (fresh air) or something similar. Both of these builds have AMAZING 1v1 potential, stunbreakers mobility etc.

4.) When a warrior equips heal sig he sacrifices burst healing. He has no “fill up the red circle skill” any more.

5.) In wvw there are so many variables! Ascended gear? bloodlust? food? consumables? stacks?

crunchyraisin.6054:

4.) When a warrior equips heal sig he sacrifices burst healing. He has no “fill up the red circle skill” any more.

A Warrior doesnt need burst healing, and the healing signet has been a large part of what is wrong with warrior’s since it was overbuffed.

You dont need to stay on a point if you can just run away and be back at full health( though you also lose the point and kinda fail your team)..granted..that signet doesn’t help you when you fight engineer’s with the condi pressure they throw out.

Otaur.9268:

For clarification my crit damage is 92% and my crit chance is 50% Attack is 3600-3700. I should NOT be doing 400 damage with FGS to a regen warrior who is built all defensively and out healing all the damage he is taking without even using his heal skill. Give Warriors Signet of Restoration and give Elementalists healing signet for 1 month, see how fast your Warriors cry foul play.

Glass Elementalist only doing 402damage versus a Warrior who hits for a lot more damage with a hammer while fully out regenerating the damage? This needs to be fixed, and not in a few months, but like now… This has gone on for to long and it is quite pathetic that every time I see a Dev playing the game it is on a Warrior… There is a reason why Warrior is so overpowered, stop playing the Warrior and try an Elementalist for 1 hour and you will QUIT your own game. Go full bunker if you’d like, still will not help you live versus that regen. 8% Reduction is not going to be enough, you need to nerf the warrior down to Elementalist state, actually nerf ALL classes to Elementalist state. sPvP community got Elementalist nerfed, how about they get other classes nerfed now?

Un-do all the nerfs you whack-a-moled onto the Elementalist because people kittened and complained about how the Elementalist was tickling them but wouldn’t die.

Don’t worry. Allie already said they’re going to nerf all the other classes to bring them down to the Ranger level… because they can’t buff the Ranger to bring it up without chancing power creep. I can’t wait!

The feature patch isn’t even out yet and people are already complaining about the changes not being enough and this and that. Just wait and see.

the warriors cc/damage is out of control. and a sigil of force and paralyzation on a hammer will be insane as long as stun breakers r on a insanely long cool down and no one can deal with mass stun.

they took the stun breaker off the thief’s sword and broke the weapon set .it was the only way to deal with mass stun .

something needs to be done about mass stun or the damage that comes along with mass stun from the wars hammer . they out shine the thief easy right now
with insane speed insane hp regen .great condition clear. mass stun and huge damage to go with the mass stun . and heavy armor to top it off

stun breakers r on insanely long cool down times .
and some of the stun breakers can be canceled out by mass stuns
making a useless stun breaker with a long cool down :S

caveman.5840:

they took the stun breaker off the thief’s sword and broke the weapon set .it was the only way to deal with mass stun .

something needs to be done about mass stun or the damage that comes along with mass stun from the wars hammer . they out shine the thief easy right now
with insane speed insane hp regen .great condition clear. mass stun and huge damage to go with the mass stun . and heavy armor to top it off

stun breakers r on insanely long cool down times .
and some of the stun breakers can be canceled out by mass stuns
making a useless stun breaker with a long cool down :S

A unlimitedly spammable stun breaker on the WEAPON was overpowered. Please.

Thief has perma evasion, perma stealth, perma blind, perma vigor for dodges on top of the perma evades. Stealth has no counter play in the game.

My warrior has none of those. Can we give all of those to the warrior to make it fair? No, because that’s stupid.

Warrior has armour, hp , and some movement if BUILT for it.

Warrior is designed to be hit most of the time, which is why the armour and hp is how it is.

Thief is designed to NOT BE HIT, and this is why the class has a plethora of skills and traits that make it next to impossible to be hit, if you get hit as a thief it is your own fault.

I’d personally rather not take hits, than take them. Perma evade, perma blind, perma stealth, perma vigor dodges, let you ignore every single attack the enemy throws at you.

Where warrior is forced to take the condition spam from engis and Necro’s, forced to take direct hits from every other class, the thief doesn’t, the thief can dodge every single attack thrown at it, meaning it never gets cc’d, never gets conditions on it, never gets hit by big skills. Even if the thief does get conditions on it, it hides in uncounterable stealth and has them auto removed.

You see we can play this game both ways right? You’re pointing out things that the warrior is good at, but ignoring the things it does not have, that other classes have.

Classes and class balance is not black and white, it is multi faceted, and if you can’t see that you’re playing the wrong game. If every class was meant to be the same we wouldn’t have classes, we’d be ‘adventurer’, or ‘hero’ and we’d all have the same skills and weapons with no customization.

And please stop referencing this mythical 30/30/30/30/30 build with 5 weapon sets, as if it actually exists, I cringe every time I read a post that makes warriors out to be gods, and as though their hammer let’s them fly around the map. The lies and exaggeration get old.

Nearly every time someone asks the devs to fix a class, generally what they have in mind isn’t to make the class balanced but to fix them in the same way a vet “fixes” a dog that keeps humping people’s legs.

The screenshot in the OP is fairly hilarious:

1. He actually gets hit by Rush, which is notorious for being buggy as hell, not to mention very telegraphed
2. At the end, he takes almost three full rotations of the hammer autoattack. That’s a good 4+ seconds of just taking hits to the face without doing a thing
3. In all of this, the OP only got 3 hits in

That definitely looks like a l2p to me rather than a warrior being OP.

Olba.5376:

The screenshot in the OP is fairly hilarious:

1. He actually gets hit by Rush, which is notorious for being buggy as hell, not to mention very telegraphed
2. At the end, he takes almost three full rotations of the hammer autoattack. That’s a good 4+ seconds of just taking hits to the face without doing a thing
3. In all of this, the OP only got 3 hits in

That definitely looks like a l2p to me rather than a warrior being OP.

I thought it was obvious that a glass ele with 12k life would be doing nothing during those hammer attacks because he was in downed state. Only took 1 8k earthshaker and 1 4k hammer swing. If armor of earth would actually proc at 50% life, but it doesn’t. Also even without the stun, that is a ton of damage for a weapon that was “nerfed”. The point of the post was to show a defensively built warrior was doing more damage with a support weapon than the “elite” of the elementalist.

Otaur.9268:

Olba.5376:

The screenshot in the OP is fairly hilarious:

1. He actually gets hit by Rush, which is notorious for being buggy as hell, not to mention very telegraphed
2. At the end, he takes almost three full rotations of the hammer autoattack. That’s a good 4+ seconds of just taking hits to the face without doing a thing
3. In all of this, the OP only got 3 hits in

That definitely looks like a l2p to me rather than a warrior being OP.

I thought it was obvious that a glass ele with 12k life would be doing nothing during those hammer attacks because he was in downed state. Only took 1 8k earthshaker and 1 4k hammer swing.

Highest Earthshaker in the screenshot: 3,214
Highest Hammer Swing in the screenshot: 2,893

All I see in that screenshot is someone getting hit with Rush followed by Earthshaker, which is quite ridiculous as that’s two extremely telegraphed moves in a row.

Also even without the stun, that is a ton of damage for a weapon that was “nerfed”. The point of the post was to show a defensively built warrior was doing more damage with a support weapon than the “elite” of the elementalist.

Tell me, how did you arrive at the conclusion that this warrior was a “regen warrior”? Pretty much all warriors run with Healing Signet and 20 points into Defense, giving everyone a hefty amount of regen to start with.

Also, you have to realize that Warriors have a much, much higher base HP than an elementalist. This results in a lot of warriors running around with Cavalier stuff, which isn’t even close to being “defensive”.