Guild Wars 2

We have been told that the changes to Critical Damage will mean that ‘pure crit’ builds will lose approximately 10% damage. In trying to create a new build for my Warrior today I came across a worrying fact when trying to build a high damage axe-based character.

The Sharpened Axes trait, beneficial for axe skills, lies in the Discipline trait line which uses Crit Damage in its stat set. In addition to this Axe Mastery in the Strength trait line improves critical damage while wielding an axe in your main hand. There is therefore a threefold nerf in Warrior axe builds when you include the nerf to equipment.

In times where Warriors are pressured into using a Greatsword, Axe builds receiving a nerf such as this really doesnt help build diversity. I wonder if there are any plans in place to address this issue along with Celestial equipment.

Wrong Forum. You should post in the warrior or profession balance forum.

Sharpened Axes will not be affected. It grants adrenaline on critical hit, which is not the same stat as crit damage %. As far as Ax mastery, it remains to be seen whether traits that add a percentage will keep that percentage or will be converted to Ferocity.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Sharpened Axes will not be affected. It grants adrenaline on critical hit, which is not the same stat as crit damage %. As far as Ax mastery, it remains to be seen whether traits that add a percentage will keep that percentage or will be converted to Ferocity.

The Sharpened Axes trait itself wont be affected no, but it is in the Discipline trait line. Anyone wishing to choose it (ie: those that want to use the max number of axe traits) will have to trait into a line that used to give 20% crit damage (master tier) but will now receive ferocity.

As for wrong forum, feel free to move.

Do warriors ever suffer?

Judge Banks.9018:

Do warriors ever suffer?

No, they have a stance to add immunity to that.

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

Judge Banks.9018:

Do warriors ever suffer?

No, they have a stance to add immunity to that.

They have stances in this game? Spoilers wooshSkill Categorization for the sake of Trait functionality does not make something other than a skill.

Wow. I hadn’t thought of that. You, OP, have my most sincere sympathies.

With love…all the rangers

On the other hand, this means that by filling out the Discipline line, you would now have the ability to free part of your item layout for actual survival stats. Maybe some toughness, to become more beefy? Some vitality, for even more hitpoints? Or, what about Heal Rating (‘Zealot’ Prefix), or even something that adds Condition Damage, or Duration.
With the ‘softcap’ being at about 10% under the current ‘crit cap’, it removes the long overdue ‘flat’ bonus and replaces it with a bonus that has a diminishing return.

Dont get me wrong, im one of the few Warriors that will welcome the changes to Crit Damage in general but it seems as though Axe Warriors will be hit harder than Greatsword Warriors. The pressure to use a Greatsword has always been there in PvE due to 100b being so kitten good so I did hope that I could eventually ditch it. With this balance update im not sure how its now possible because now there is even more reason not to trait into an axe build.

The crit change doesn’t effect axes more than any other weapon.

If you were running a zerk build your crit damage will be reduced by ~10%. They’re not changing power or precision just crit damage and how it scales.

You’ll have more crit damage in lower level areas but less in 80 areas.

Travis the Terrible.4739:

The crit change doesn’t effect axes more than any other weapon.

Focus more on the builds that GS and Axe Warriors use as opposed to the actual weapon stats themselves.

Axe build:
1) Sharpened Axes – a reduction in damage due to it being in the Discipline trait line.
2) Axe Mastery – a reduction in damage due to the trait itself.
3) The equipment nerf- Crit Damage reduction in general.

Greatsword build:
1) Slashing Power – no reduction in damage post-patch
2) Forceful Greatsword – no reduction in damage.
3) The equipment nerf- Crit Damage reduction in general.

Remember, they also said that zerker stats would still be best in slot for pure DPS – the difference in effectivity compared to other stats will be lower though.

Thereon.3495:

Axe build:
1) Sharpened Axes – a reduction in damage due to it being in the Discipline trait line.
2) Axe Mastery – a reduction in damage due to the trait itself.
3) The equipment nerf- Crit Damage reduction in general.

Greatsword build:
1) Slashing Power – no reduction in damage post-patch
2) Forceful Greatsword – no reduction in damage.
3) The equipment nerf- Crit Damage reduction in general.

Sharpened axes grants no extra damage be it critical or +% it’s just 20% recharge on axe skills and +2 adrenaline on a crit (seriously why is this here?) the discipline trait line for it will get nerfed so including this trait in your numbers here is just silly. Nerfing all berserker warrior builds (seriously they do spec into this trait line as well). Axe mastery is +10% critical damage so if it gets changed you lose 1% crit damage from it.

Now if you’re keeping track here, that’s 3% crit nerf on your axe traits assuming you only went 20 into discipline. THATS 3% FROM TRAITS. 2% from a traitline that people will lose as well not just you.

Assuming it’s a static 10% across gear and traits alike at 100% crit damage you’ll be down to 90% critical damage. 1% critical damage change to axes from their traits compared to other weapons for warrior which have no other traits that grant additional crit damage to weapons (seriously go look). This change doesn’t effect axes much more than other weapon available to the warrior now.

Now the change from crit damage to making it ferocity leaves doors open to make it a main stat on items like they said in the livestream so we might have better options in the future.

Really wish people would read before replying -.-

Sharpened Axes is in the Discipline trait line which gives passive bonuses to Burst recharge and CRITICAL DAMAGE. As for overall damage reduction this is besides the point. My original post is to bring attention to the fact that Greatsword builds in PvE are already the ‘must-use’ build for damage and nerfing Axe builds more than GS builds will do little to change that fact.

Also, just as a separate point, its been stated from some sources that it will be a 10% reduction in Crit Damage but from other sources that it will be a 10% overall damage reduction. Hoping its the former.

Thereon.3495:

Really wish people would read before replying -.-

Sharpened Axes is in the Discipline trait line which gives passive bonuses to Burst recharge and CRITICAL DAMAGE. As for overall damage reduction this is besides the point. My original post is to bring attention to the fact that Greatsword builds in PvE are already the ‘must-use’ build for damage and nerfing Axe builds more than GS builds will do little to change that fact.

AGAIN! That trait line change will not just effect axe warriors IT WILL EFFECT ALL WARRIORS. Counting this trait is completely useless. Besides if you want the most out of your dps in pve on a warrior you should be axe/mace with a greatsword in your off set to swap to for100blades, whriling blade, blade trail, and rush then swap back to axe for autoing because axe auto is faster and overall does more damage over time than greatsword will. Go test this in heart of the mists. Maybe you should “really wish for” yourself to read that again before replying.

2% crit damage change from that trait line at 20 discipline effects not just axe warriors who are that far into the traitline BUT EVERY WARRIOR who is in that trait line. The only change that effects axes directly here is the 1% crit damage (assuming 10% crit damage nerf across everything) you’ll lose from axe mastery. Counting sharpened axes in the discipline trait line is arguably dumb considering the fact that another trait that is used quite commonly is destruction of the empowered for the same trait cost.

Axes lose 1% crit damage but yet will still have the highest achievable crit damage among warrior weapons. 20 points into discipline for greatsword with the destruction of the empowered trait vs axe with 20 into discipline for sharpened axes will lose the same amount of crit damage here. So again COUNTING THIS TRAIT IS POINTLESS FOR THIS DEBATE.

I disagree as my point still stands- picking the two Greatsword specific traits will not result in a change post-nerf whereas picking the two Axe specific traits will result in a reduction in damage.

For the record I am a GS/Axe+Mace Warrior myself and only trait 15 into Discipline for the weapon swap minor trait. Overall damage WITHIN A PARTY is increased by taking Attack of Opportunity as opposed to traiting further into Discipline but this fact is neither here nor there.

Thereon.3495:

I disagree as my point still stands- the two Greatsword specific traits will not receive a nerf whereas the two Axe specific traits will both be affected by the change.

For the record I am a GS/Axe+Mace Warrior myself and only trait 15 into Discipline for the weapon swap minor trait. Overall damage WITHIN A PARTY is increased by taking Attack of Opportunity as opposed to traiting further into Discipline but this fact is neither here nor there.

Again taking into account, sharpened axes HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS. Seriously get this through your head. Where the trait sits will effect axe warriors no more than a pure greatsword build with destruction of the empowered. Both are 20 point traits. The crit damage nerf is an indirect nerf to EVERY SINGLE TRAIT IN THE DISCIPLINE LINE.

If you’re 20 points into discipline no matter what weapon axe, greatsword, hammer, bow, rifle, mace, or sword YOU’LL LOSE 2% CRIT DAMAGE. It’s not a nerf to axes IT’S A DIRECT NERF TO CRIT DAMAGE OVER EVERY WEAPON. Taking this trait into account is meaningless for this because it effects all weapons that spec into this tree NOT JUST AXES.

Now granted only players with main hand axe in 1 weapon slot will take this trait but there are other traits of “equal” value here as well. This trait is getting a nerf because it’s an axe trait in the discipline tree. Which is indirectly nerfing EVERY weapon that goes into this trait. You might as well say the 20% recharge on signets is being nerfed because you only get 9% for instead of the 10% you get now.

The only axe trait that is getting a direct nerf is axe mastery which is just 10% critical damage. Assuming its a 10% nerf to crit damage it’ll be worth 9% crit damage instead of 10.

Axe warriors will still have the highest crit damage because of the axe mastery trait before and after this change. As for the 2 axe traits being “nerfed” only 1 is getting a direct nerf the other indirect because of the traitline in which it currently sits but every weapon that goes 20 into discipline will be “nerfed.” So counting is pointless for the argument.

Axes will be fine they are and will still be the highest achievable critical damage of the warrior weapons.

This argument is comparing oranges to a truck.

This debate could go on forever so moving on….

Its all well and good stating that there could be an issue with the two axe traits but what would I do to rectify the issue? In my opinion (notice this word people!) the Greatsword is a weapon used far too often for Warriors in PvE and its about time it received some changes. I personally would swap positions for Forceful Greatsword and Sharpened Axes. Why would this help? It would be the Greatsword that receives the Crit Damage change plus it would have the added benefit of making people choose between Destruction of the Empowered and Forceful Greatsword instead of choosing them both. Axe damage gets a slight increase in the form of Crit Chance instead of Crit Damage, Greatsword gets a slight damage decrease in making people choose between traits. Numbers may have to be balanced of course.

….and this is where I get a torrent of abuse from Twilight/Sunrise/Eternity users!

It doesn’t matter. With the game mechanics the same, would you even consider rolling another gear set? Ask yourself that.

Well two main things come to mind.

1. That whole lol discipline thing, Travis has already anunciated that quite well
2. There’s no implication that the crit damage from axes will be reduced. The swords trait in Arms gives a straight 10% crit chance; why can’t the axe crit damage give 10% crit damage (i think it’s 10% don’t jump on me)?

Travis the Terrible.4739

What you dont seem to understand mate is that to get both greatsword traits you dont have to go into the discipline line at all hence no nerf

Just becouse greatswords usualy go into said line to get a extra damage boost ontop of what they already get is beside the point

To get both axe skills you have to trait in the said line and it get nerfed more then greatswords

Its true it would be fun if axes got something in same line with greatsword gaining power on crit’s instead of alittle extra adrenaline

good PVE axe warriors won’t be affected. pure axe will still be the better option for groups where you cap 25 might most of the time and where you don’t need evades from WWA.

this is because the best PVE warrior build has only 15 (or 5 if you do pure axe) points in discipline, and thus never take sharpened axes (useless trait), and the weakening of axe mastery won’t really do that much since it was always a really underwhelming trait. also, it’s likely that when ferocity change comes that 10% crit damage will be made up for (still a weak trait though).

I think people are talking about 30/0/0/10/30 builds, which are garbage now that you can’t get EA with 10 tactics. there is no reason to run builds with 30 discipline over 25 arms since crit damage is worth very little compared to a very strong 10% modifier.