Guild Wars 2

Here’s your overpowered specs. Plan to balance the game one day?

Engineer – Balthazaar rune, rabid stats, incendiary powder, doom sigil, nade kit, tool kit.
Engineer – Celestial stats, tool kit, elixir s, nade kit, rifle.
Engineer – Tank stats, full turrets or elixir gun, heatseeking rocket turret on ledges.

Elementalist – Undodgeable/reactable burst with fresh air.
Elementalist – Celestial stats, strength/hoelbrak runes, 6 in arcana.

Warrior – Celestial hambow/axebow with strength/hoelbrak runes and might stacking.

Thief – Sword dagger acro with air/fire sigils and the most invuln spam in the game.

Mesmer – Greatsword#1 spam with air/fire sigils on.

Ranger – Berserker builds (arguably) have more utility than any other berserker builds and give way too much damage for how easy it is to play. Why in the kitten would you buff ranger longbow auto attacks?

Ranger – Bunker condi ranger with pets that are almost impossible to kill off.

Air/fire sigils in general.

Hint! Celestial is not the cause of imbalance. A big culprit is blast finishers and battle sigil.

Kind of.
Hell yeah.
Sure.

Kind of.
Hell yeah.

Nope. Just nerf cele.

Nope. Just nerf air/fire & change Steal.

Again, just nerf air/fire + fix skill canceling on spartial surge.

Is this for real? What utility? Just no.

Sure, though the pets are extremely easy to kill, but you don’t have to kill them, chill/cripple is just enough.

Yes.

Then why is it only a problem when used with celestial? It hadn’t been a problem before. Celestial is the problem.

Ah, the woes of smallscale PvP in MMOs. There are specialized games for smallscale team PvP though, MOBAs have seen a spectacular rise in the past years.

DanSH.6143:

Then why is it only a problem when used with celestial? It hadn’t been a problem before. Celestial is the problem.

Funny, when the Ferocity change came everyone complained that this will make Celestial rubbish. And now suddenly it’s overpowered? Might-stacking is the problem. Always has been, just more pronounced now that people realized you can just take free overall stats because your might spam fixes the offence for free.

Again though, heh, smallscale PvP issues. Shouldn’t the devs focus on larger underlying issues first? Like:

• PvE AI in general.
• Pathing.
• Pets in general.
• Runes/Sigils vs character power?
• Overall design goals/balance of traits and trait lines?
• Stat balance in general?

The stuff the OP comments about sounds like such microscopic problems by comparison…

They’re gonna be meta builds no matter what happens. The best you can hope for is that every class gets some sort of meta build that can compete reasonably well with a decent amount of the other popular builds. Short of giving every class the exact same stats and exact same skills, there will always be counters to thing and certain builds will be more prevalent. So until there comes a day when you can just randomly throw points into any tree and still be successful with any weapon/utilities, there will be builds that are either slightly or much stronger than others.

Nerf cele, see the rise of already somewhat prevalent tanky turret engineers. Ele may or may not fall into complete garbage like it was for a long time depending on the severity of the nerfs. Hambow was popular even before cele changes, now it just has more stopping power. People never stop complaining about thieves. “Stealth is OP, learn to dodge noob”, new spec arises, “Stop evade spamming noob” despite the fact that if you take out stealth and evades, thief literally has no form of damage mitigation except blinds and some weapon sets don’t even have that, so yeah, I’m sure nerfing their core damage mitigating skills will take them out of the meta.

lol you guys dont realise how bad this game will be if they nerf fire/air. It will take forever to kill people because of high sustain or many ways to avoid damage.

A duel between 2 thieves cannot end without fire and air sigils. Stop making stupid stupid suggestions.

The only build that is Overpowered is celestial elementalist. And even the cele ele is not that OP its just too useful compared to other builds.

glock.6590:

lol you guys dont realise how bad this game will be if they nerf fire/air. It will take forever to kill people because of high sustain or many ways to avoid damage.

A duel between 2 thieves cannot end without fire and air sigils. Stop making stupid stupid suggestions.

The only build that is Overpowered is celestial elementalist. And even the cele ele is not that OP its just too useful compared to other builds.

Then we’ll enter the age of Decap Engi. No one needs to kill each other so long as we can stop them from getting points long enough to run out time :D

OP. You claim those are over powered specs, yet you listed no specs. You listed gear and occasionally one trait.

It may also help of you explained why you think each is OP. I might also aid in conversation, if you state it as your opinion, instead of disingenuously declaring your opinion as it it were a statement of fact.

Can’t agree more with Carighan … What you guys demand here is microbalancing which is just impossible to do in a game where base-stats between different classes already vary by 1000+ points and for example gear/build can passively add up to 700 stat-points just by (more or less) doing nothing but spamming spells. +10% damage here, +50% crit chance there, perma-boons, absurdly high procc-chances and low CDs on passive effects … the numbers in this game are just ridiculous. This is why spammy builds and/or AI-builds dominate the game. Compare it to other games where balancing changes are done in the range of 0,0X%. This is how you can reach perfection in game balance, not by implementing something like diamond skin …

But at least every class seems to have at least one viable spec atm, which is nice.

So, my view has always been gamers will find what works best in a given situation and abuse it as much as they can. Playing whack a mole won’t necessarily solve problems, but it will kill build diversity and potentially remove classes from higher tier play (there have been points where engineer, elementalist, and warrior were all considered non-competitive).

The OP proposes that the problem stems from blasting fire fields, sigil of battle, sigil of air, and sigil of fire. Carighan agrees with the ease of might stacking as a source problem in game balance, but contends that there are more core underlying problems then x is stronger than y because z.

I am inclined to agree with Carighan, but am curious as to what solutions could be offered. Obviously, fixing basic troubles such as necro minions not attacking should be a first priority, but would rebalancing from the ground up create a more stale environment? Would it need to be balanced so everyone is equal and can do the same things in different ways, or so that each class remains really good at certain things?

I think what most people ask for is the first. No one likes to be outperformed because x class has better skills to zerk with or y has more damaging conditions. Perhaps allowing things like condition guardians and eles to be more viable would satisfy more people. But then, classes begin to blend together more and the individual feel of a class could be lost.

I suppose the most prudent question is would you rather have each class feel more unique with strengths and weaknesses, or each class be able to perform in each role on a fairly equal level?

It is always such a good indicator if someone is unexperienced in the game if they think power ranger is too good.

It appears easy to play and it is certainly easy to noobstomp but being any efficient versus good players is incredibly hard to the point of no one actually playing power ranger at top level.

I noticed that no necromancer things made it on your list. You wouldn’t happen to be the terrormancer that complained my D/D thief had too many “invulns” tonight, would you?

…And the lack of QQ about meditation dps guards kinda gives away which cheese-builds OP prefers

But sadly, builds alone give no perma-win guarantee.
Player-skill does, which is why this thread exists xD

So OP. You play necro huh?

Arantheal.7396:

…And the lack of QQ about meditation dps guards kinda gives away which cheese-builds OP prefers

But sadly, builds alone give no perma-win guarantee.
Player-skill does, which is why this thread exists xD

I’m sorry, but I don’t find meditation guards to be an overpowered build like the ones that I listed. One reason? I can kill meditation guards on a mad king rune sword/shield hammer celestial warrior. Not a very optimal build. If a meditation guard is owning you, you probably need to learn to play. Here’s a hint: Leap away 600ft or so once they start their burst, then jump back in.

If you think that terror necromancers are overpowered (a build that I’ve played like twice) then you have skill issues. Want to know the counter to reapers protection? CC the necromancer from afar or cc them when you have stability on. It’s that simple.

If you don’t understand how builds like balthazaar rabid doom/geomancy incendiary powder nade/tool kit engineers are overpowered then it’s because you haven’t fought any. Is it impossible to beat them? No. A diamond skin ele or a necromancer specced fro full condition transfer can kill them, sometimes. Does that mean it’s not broken because it can be killed? No, that’s not how balance works.

If you take a look at every overpowered build that people are running, they all use some of the following: Doom sigil, geomancy sigil, battle sigil, air sigil, fire sigil, energy sigil, celestial stats, high burn uptime, invulnerabilities/blocks, mobility.

One of the strangest things that I have ever encountered is a meditation guardian with doom/geomancy sigils on. In the sense of theorycrafting and how builds should synergize, that doesn’t even make sense and shouldn’t even be a thing. Kind of like how necromancers shouldn’t have access to confusion, yet in WvW they do with perplexity runes.

robertul.3679:

So OP. You play necro huh?

or guardian )

Zefrost.3425:

If you don’t understand how builds like balthazaar rabid doom/geomancy incendiary powder nade/tool kit engineers are overpowered then it’s because you haven’t fought any.

Or, it could be that your not very good against them………….Your argument that because I, or anyone else, does not have difficulty defeating them, in the same manner that you do, that they haven’t encountered any, is very accusatory in its presumptions. All your doing is inviting the counter argument that if you do not understand how it is not over powered, then you need to learn to build and play to counter it.

Your argument is to make accusations, instead of making a comprehensive explanation, detailing what about it makes it over powered. That, to me, suggest you have no actually explanation, beyond the fact that the build is strong against you specifically, how you play, and the build you run.

coglin.1867:

Zefrost.3425:

If you don’t understand how builds like balthazaar rabid doom/geomancy incendiary powder nade/tool kit engineers are overpowered then it’s because you haven’t fought any.

Or, it could be that your not very good against them………….Your argument that because I, or anyone else, does not have difficulty defeating them, in the same manner that you do, that they haven’t encountered any, is very accusatory in its presumptions. All your doing is inviting the counter argument that if you do not understand how it is not over powered, then you need to learn to build and play to counter it.

Your argument is to make accusations, instead of making a comprehensive explanation, detailing what about it makes it over powered. That, to me, suggest you have no actually explanation, beyond the fact that the build is strong against you specifically, how you play, and the build you run.

I have no problem beating rabid balthazaar engineers on a necromancer that uses dagger off-hand, staff, plague signet and well of power. That does not mean that the build isn’t overpowered.

I already explained why the current overpowered builds are the way they are, in the engineers case it’s: high burn uptime, blocks/invulns and doom/geomancy sigils. Poison is supposed to be something that you use skillfully, not just “another condition” that you try keep on the opponent 100% of the time; this is exactly what geomancy and doom sigils do. Engineers built this way are done so to try and maintain poison, bleed and burning on the opponent 100% of the time while overloading them with other conditions on the side.

You don’t see people complaining about leeching or blood sigils. This is because they don’t define an entire build. Doom/geomancy give conditions to classes that aren’t supposed to have 100% uptime of these conditions.

What would I do to doom/geomancy?:
Sigil of Geomancy – Nerf the bleed stacks from 3 to 1 because it’s AOE.
Sigil of Doom – Remove it and perplexity runes from the game entirely.
Incediary Powder – Add skilled play to it like how dhuumfire is on lifeblast now.

Avoid the sigil change some classes are better or weaker at some things then others I need doom sigil for my condi guard,mesmer,thief,war the sigils can add what’s missing it doesn’t have to boost what’s already there. Stuff don’t get removed in gw2 will they compensate?…nope.

Runes for every boon and condition ,perplexity will stay just like strenghg runes. Who choses dhuumfire anymore? They nerfed with no revert of what happen before…Counters exists just because the conquest meta doesn’t want them doesn’t mean the builds have to be nerfed to fit your lacking spec.

Keep it real here. Condition duration exist for all conditions. Can a spec build condi spam? Yes but can a spec build cleansing spam? Yes…deal with it use your conquest meta.

Zefrost.3425:

I already explained why the current overpowered builds are the way they are, in the engineers case it’s: high burn uptime, blocks/invulns and doom/geomancy sigils. Poison is supposed to be something that you use skillfully, not just “another condition” that you try keep on the opponent 100% of the time; this is exactly what geomancy and doom sigils do. Engineers built this way are done so to try and maintain poison, bleed and burning on the opponent 100% of the time while overloading them with other conditions on the side.

What build? All your posting is gear. I have yet to see you list a single build yet. What trait set up are you referring to? How long have you played the build your complaining about?

How are you suggesting players are not using “poison skillfully”?

What is wrong with using gear to maintain as much uptime on bleed/burn/poison as possible? Isn’t that the point when running conditions? To me, your point here is about as rational as complaining a CC build stacks as much CC as possible or that a direct damage build is stacking gear to get as much direct damage as possible.

Zefrost.3425:

You don’t see people complaining about leeching or blood sigils. This is because they don’t define an entire build. Doom/geomancy give conditions to classes that aren’t supposed to have 100% uptime of these conditions.

I don’t? I could have sworn I have. I sure am glad you are here, to tall us what we have or havn’t seen and discussed ourselves. I do not know what I would do without you here to dictate to me and transparently others, what we think. Perhaps it is best for everyone if you stick to speaking for yourself?

Zefrost.3425:

What would I do to doom/geomancy?:
Sigil of Geomancy – Nerf the bleed stacks from 3 to 1 because it’s AOE.
Sigil of Doom – Remove it and perplexity runes from the game entirely.
Incediary Powder – Add skilled play to it like how dhuumfire is on lifeblast now.

Personally, I feel sigil of geomancy and doom is absolutely nothing. They both only work on weapon swap. One is single target, the other is small, close range, AoE, and I do not see in any way how you have demonstrated them to be OP.

As to incendiary powder, I doubt comparing it to dhuumfire is a wise route. I agree it needs some sort of function change so that it is not entirely passive.

Is that usually how you present yourself?

Indeed I wouldn’t mind it in sPvP. (<-Referring to perplexity runes)
Got to love when folks think they are so special, that they can presume to speak for me, you, and the rest of the community. Particularly when they speak so incorrectly.

Coglin:

So, your pressumin to claim to speak for every players mentality and perspective?

It is clear that you main engineer or at least play it more often that you do other classes. Due to how you think everyone is wrong other than you, your opinion is biased in the perspective of general game balance.; you even defend the existence of perplexity runes.

Unless you can actually admit that there are faults and balance issues, then you are, basically, just wrong.

I can at least admit when something in my own class that I main is imbalanced. Is there currently anything about the necromancer that is imbalanced? Not really; not on the scale of what these other builds do. In WvW? Yes, there are overpowered necromancer condition builds. Again, this is because of the spam of 100% uptime on conditions that Anet has created.

The only real build that anyone complains about is fear necromancers, but all you need to do is bait out reaper’s protection and save a stunbreaker/stability for corrupt boon.

If you don’t know what builds I am referring to that are imbalanced and you need me to explain every little detail about them because you don’t understand, then our conversation is finished.

Present myself? You mean by requesting that you stop suggesting you speak for the community by saying everything in definitives and using “we”, “everyone”, and “us”? Then sure. that is precisely how I present myself. As an individual who speaks for myself with my opinion, who dislike others presuming to speak for me or others. Sorry if it offends you, that I dislike posters who appear to have difficulty with builds that I do not, presuming to speak for me.

So what if I defend the existence of perplexity runes? I do not find the particularly strong or difficult to deal with.

Feel free to quote any post in which I state there is not imbalance in the game at all. Simply because I disagree with most of what you claim is imbalanced is not reason to try to claim I am saying anything other then what I am. It kind of makes me wonder if you couldn’t muster up evidence to support your opinion, so you resorted to back handed comments at me instead, but that is just my assumption.

The fact that I agreed with you in respect to incendiary powder, and suggested the fact that it was passive, indicated a balance issue, would have tipped you off that I feel balance is not perfect. It is interesting that You avoided mentioning that, and how I agreed with you specifically.

Why do you use all the regurgitated buzz words? How are condition attacks “spammed” any more then direct damage attacks are? Are you suggesting that direct damage builds spend time sitting idle? That doesn’t make any sense to try to demonize one form of damage when you have offered no evidence that it does more damage then the other.

Personally, I do not feel “fear” necromancers, as you put it, are OP at all. I often use it to give myself stability.

Of coarse I do not know what builds you are referring to. Nor do I know if anyone else does. You have made a solid effort to avoid mentioning them. You only mention gear. Possibly because you do not know what they are? If that is the case, it falls to reason that you are crying OP about builds you do not understand. I am simply speculating, but it seems rather likely. Particularly after I asked you how long you have played each of the builds, in two separate post, and you avoided the question.

So yes, please, if you are so confident specific builds are OP, please list the build and not just the gear. As well, please break down what about the builds are OP? Simply crying OP while not showing any damage or control comparisons of any kind, is just as accusation with no supportive evidence. Most of which, my personal experience disagrees with.

While we suspect that the OP is a necro or a guard, we may be wrong…

What we know for certain is that the OP’s weakness is all the things he has listed, so if you ever meet him in solo’q or in WvW, just roll with one of those options he provided and it should be an easy day for you!

Like, reading these forums can help one make a build that terrorizes the most amount of people in battle – based on what’s being QQ’ed about.

Since you don’t understand what builds are overpowered in the game, I have done you the service of creating one of the builds to help you learn:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQJAqelUUpkr1XxELseNCbBNqxI6NWlO+5IEgkC-TJRHwAV2fIwJAIZZAAPAAA

Like, reading these forums can help one make a build that terrorizes the most amount of people in battle – based on what’s being QQ’ed about.

Yes, if every engineer ran this (which is more overpowered than turrets) then the QQ would be through the roof. There is not counterplay to this kind of build.

Doubtful.

Personally. I like fighting that build. It had extremely weak condition cleanses, mediocre toughness, low hit points, and 1 stun break on a 60s cool down. Personally, I have always done well against the average player in that generic meta build, because I build and play outside the box.

You are continuing to presume your limits represent me. My s/s+LB warrior thrives against that build. My d/d wells necro thrives against that build. My thief builds would do so, so. My mesmer would probably struggle. My LB/GS ranger would do okay. My shout guardian would do well. My D/D ele build would do well. and so on and so forth.

So how long have you played that build? I played it, and almost all of the builds in the OP as they become popular, to feel them out for myself, and learn their weaknesses.

It probably works in my favor that I leveled each profession within the first 6mo of release to learn all of the professions.

Perhaps familiarizing yourself with the other professions by playing them, and learning to think out side the box, and play/build outside the box, would benefit you greatly as well.

Creld.8702:

I suppose the most prudent question is would you rather have each class feel more unique with strengths and weaknesses, or each class be able to perform in each role on a fairly equal level?

Genuinely the former.
This is because I feel that balance feels much more “fitting” in games such as Team Fortress II or DAoC, where classes were intentionally built to not be balanced against each other at all so that they’ll have to rely on one another to cover weaknesses.

This also allows more multi-facetted design. If classes have to always have parity, adding new effects is difficult because you always have to find per-class-design implementations of the given effect or at least something giving parity against it.
If you instead go the opposite directly and intentionally create strongly counterable imbalance where a multi-branching multi-circle Rock-Paper-Scissors system weaves through all the classes, you can easily add a new effect to a class where it fits the most from a lore point of view.

As far as the general balance goes, the reason I listed those underlying issues is because I feel that while fixes to these will temporarily create a much less stable balance environment, then basing balance changes upon them would be more sensible as the amount of unintended consequences and limitations is reduced.
Currently, there’s a fair amount of “wonky” things about the game. Far before reaching a per-class view. Removing these first clears the fog and allows to zoom in to per-class issues.

It also follows the idea that bigger imbalances have to be cleared first to accurately predict the outcome of smaller balance change (to avoid avalanche effects where a small change ends up imbalancing a larger system).

If they are destroying you then you should be using them, Zefrost.

yolo swaggins.2570:

If they are destroying you then you should be using them, Zefrost.

But yolo, he has too much pride to use such cheap tactics… And also he might blindly be in love with one build….

(I’m not picking on you dude, I’ve done the same thing in another post too to you. Just pointing out the “noob” reasoning behind why he’s not using it and I know you probably have seen the same reasoning elsewhere. Just speeding up the process of killing this QQ thread.)

Zero Day.2594:

yolo swaggins.2570:

If they are destroying you then you should be using them, Zefrost.

But yolo, he has too much pride to use such cheap tactics… And also he might blindly be in love with one build….

(I’m not picking on you dude, I’ve done the same thing in another post too to you. Just pointing out the “noob” reasoning behind why he’s not using it and I know you probably have seen the same reasoning elsewhere. Just speeding up the process of killing this QQ thread.)

I know. :P

Your pseudo-quest to prevent me from destroying worlds with logical-illogical fission will end in failure, however. Nobody can stop the great Dr. Yolotor!

Zefrost.3425:

Since you don’t understand what builds are overpowered in the game, I have done you the service of creating one of the builds to help you learn:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQJAqelUUpkr1XxELseNCbBNqxI6NWlO+5IEgkC-TJRHwAV2fIwJAIZZAAPAAA

Like, reading these forums can help one make a build that terrorizes the most amount of people in battle – based on what’s being QQ’ed about.

Yes, if every engineer ran this (which is more overpowered than turrets) then the QQ would be through the roof. There is not counterplay to this kind of build.

No counterplay? Here we go:
60s cd on the only stunbreaker it has, without any stability.
CC-spam it to death with the class you like the most.

1.5k nade range? DA FUG !??!!?one1
luckely they are not effective on range, so kite the engi around and pew pew him if you don’t have cc’s.

ermagherd, it has cc’s.
blind, block, or do something radical for a change: dodge.

ermagherd, all these condis.
nades has a fancy tooltipp, but again: low effective range. Break combat, reset and clear condis. Or stay in combat and condi-sapm the engi. You know what this build does not have: effective cleanse.

Seriously, there are some powerful builds out there, and there is a reason why they are considered meta: because they synergize well within their class. But none of the builds (gear-lists) you’ve posted are overpowered, they just happen to be effective, even more so in the hands of a skilled player.
Is it the fault of a skilled player that you can’t compete with them?
Guess what: Nope.

I consider none of that to be OP.
Only thing I consider overpowered is PU mesmer. “Bruh I’m so leet, watch me stack torment and confusion stealth and blink away”.
Somewhere in this thread while I was scrolling I even read someones comment on medi guard being cheese and just rofl’d so hard. Nope. Anyways,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJL4Y3aGPuA

Arantheal.7396:

Zefrost.3425:

Since you don’t understand what builds are overpowered in the game, I have done you the service of creating one of the builds to help you learn:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQJAqelUUpkr1XxELseNCbBNqxI6NWlO+5IEgkC-TJRHwAV2fIwJAIZZAAPAAA

Like, reading these forums can help one make a build that terrorizes the most amount of people in battle – based on what’s being QQ’ed about.

Yes, if every engineer ran this (which is more overpowered than turrets) then the QQ would be through the roof. There is not counterplay to this kind of build.

No counterplay? Here we go:
60s cd on the only stunbreaker it has, without any stability.
CC-spam it to death with the class you like the most.

1.5k nade range? DA FUG !??!!?one1
luckely they are not effective on range, so kite the engi around and pew pew him if you don’t have cc’s.

ermagherd, it has cc’s.
blind, block, or do something radical for a change: dodge.

ermagherd, all these condis.
nades has a fancy tooltipp, but again: low effective range. Break combat, reset and clear condis. Or stay in combat and condi-sapm the engi. You know what this build does not have: effective cleanse.

Seriously, there are some powerful builds out there, and there is a reason why they are considered meta: because they synergize well within their class. But none of the builds (gear-lists) you’ve posted are overpowered, they just happen to be effective, even more so in the hands of a skilled player.
Is it the fault of a skilled player that you can’t compete with them?
Guess what: Nope.

I know that you think you are outsmarting me by posting every counter that there is to a build, but if a build is too strong, then a build is too strong.

That engineer build isn’t as weak to conditions as your imagination thinks it is. Transmute is 4 conditions cleansed per minute and since good engineers aren’t going to blow their turret up vs heavy conditions, they cleanse ~6 conditions more per minute. What saves them from eating other conditions, is blocks, evades, blinds, invulnerability, stealth and CC. You don’t need to have condi cleanse to be resistant against conditions.

Their other counter to conditions? Applying so much pressure on an opponent that they have to play defensively, not offensively.

A cele ele can technically be beaten (though never will in the hands of a skilled player). Please, tell me the counters of a cele ele or how a cele ele is not overpowered, because it can be beaten.

@OP:

Most of those are not overpowered. There are currently only 3 specs and 1 runeset that need adjustment.

D/D cele ele: There is no way an ele should be the best point defender in the game. It is just too strong

Turret engi: Not great against coordinated teams, but that said, ALL of hot join, ALL of solo queue, and 75% of team queue is uncoordinated. Needs a reduction.

Nade engi: Cele engi is just too good in general. Needs a bit of a reduction

Nightmare runes: Way too strong with the way fear procs.

Aren’t you basically saying that every class is overpowered?
I haven’t come across one class that is vastly inferior in PVP. I’ve been wrecked by every class in the game. It usually comes down to the skill of the player moreso than the build they use. Furthermore, You may find that you have trouble with certain builds if you run a specific build and playstyle, but that doesn’t mean that the opposing class is overpowered. You can’t expect to beat every other class/build with just one build and playstyle.

And here I was feeling that when I was capable of countering multiple aspect of a build, in multiple ways, that it was far from OP. I guess the new rule must be that one can simply declare it OP and it is a fact. E en given that is can be countered in several aspects, several ways. I guess that makes skilled or even solid game play OP by definition.

The game is balanced my frands!

Teef has spoken

Zefrost.3425:

Arantheal.7396:

Zefrost.3425:

Since you don’t understand what builds are overpowered in the game, I have done you the service of creating one of the builds to help you learn:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQJAqelUUpkr1XxELseNCbBNqxI6NWlO+5IEgkC-TJRHwAV2fIwJAIZZAAPAAA

Like, reading these forums can help one make a build that terrorizes the most amount of people in battle – based on what’s being QQ’ed about.

Yes, if every engineer ran this (which is more overpowered than turrets) then the QQ would be through the roof. There is not counterplay to this kind of build.

No counterplay? Here we go:
60s cd on the only stunbreaker it has, without any stability.
CC-spam it to death with the class you like the most.

1.5k nade range? DA FUG !??!!?one1
luckely they are not effective on range, so kite the engi around and pew pew him if you don’t have cc’s.

ermagherd, it has cc’s.
blind, block, or do something radical for a change: dodge.

ermagherd, all these condis.
nades has a fancy tooltipp, but again: low effective range. Break combat, reset and clear condis. Or stay in combat and condi-sapm the engi. You know what this build does not have: effective cleanse.

Seriously, there are some powerful builds out there, and there is a reason why they are considered meta: because they synergize well within their class. But none of the builds (gear-lists) you’ve posted are overpowered, they just happen to be effective, even more so in the hands of a skilled player.
Is it the fault of a skilled player that you can’t compete with them?
Guess what: Nope.

I know that you think you are outsmarting me by posting every counter that there is to a build, but if a build is too strong, then a build is too strong.

That engineer build isn’t as weak to conditions as your imagination thinks it is. Transmute is 4 conditions cleansed per minute and since good engineers aren’t going to blow their turret up vs heavy conditions, they cleanse ~6 conditions more per minute. What saves them from eating other conditions, is blocks, evades, blinds, invulnerability, stealth and CC. You don’t need to have condi cleanse to be resistant against conditions.

Their other counter to conditions? Applying so much pressure on an opponent that they have to play defensively, not offensively.

A cele ele can technically be beaten (though never will in the hands of a skilled player). Please, tell me the counters of a cele ele or how a cele ele is not overpowered, because it can be beaten.

every class has the option to pack blinds / blocks / invuln. and increased endurance-regen. Seriously, if you build sucks against the mentioned one, you have exactly 2 options: craft a better build / compensate with skill.

Exactly zero of the builds you’ve listed don’t have any counter-play, and a d/d cele ele is most vulnerable to condis IF you interrupt arcane renewal. So your chance to condi-spam a cele ele just depends on your own skill, specifically if you can bring up the patience to save your cc’s for the most tremendous moments or not.

People spam you with “l2p” for a reason: It is YOUR responsibility to time your attacks accordingly to the situation, and if you fail to do so, you have no right to complain about people that plain and simply outplay you.

Yes, I get bashed a lot by these builds, and rightfully so. They are effective ways to keep in the “flow” of your class, but once I figure out how the player behind the build ticks (specifically if he’s lickly to panic or not) I usually dominate meta-build runners for the rest of the fight.
And against people who know their stuff I have even chances, resulting in a couple of stomps for them, and a couple of stomps for me.
PvP is about outsmarting your opponent and I’ve yet to see a build that so ridiculously overpowered that one can not call it structured-pvp anymore.

I’d like a moderator to finally close this thread since it is just another cesspool of baseless assumptions, non-constructive critique (refer: QQ) and bare of any innovative ideas.