Guild Wars 2

So, this seemed like the best place to post this question. I don’t play much of the classes that do more other-people-healing effects, heh, so I am not sure of the answer.

So… which class does the best healing for others besides themselves? Staff Water ele? Guardian? Something else?

It depends. I believe Guardians are on top if you include their elite, although Necromancers are pretty high up there (would be #1 probably if Renewing Blast wasn’t so awful to use), with Rangers and Elementalists as well. However just healing isn’t usually enough, since things like Protection bring you more effective healing, and if you want to get past just healing I think Guardians do it the best, bringing a lot of extra support along with their heals, followed by Elementalist.

Combat Healer.

Guardian is the best, followed by Elementalist at a distant second.

I want to say mantra mesmers because their traited mantras can heal almost as much as a guard’s meditation. The best part is that they have a mantra that recharges in two seconds I believe so they can keep heals up as much if not better than a guard. They can also provide AoE regen via illusions by traiting for it.

yolo swaggins.2570:

I want to say mantra mesmers because their traited mantras can heal almost as much as a guard’s meditation. The best part is that they have a mantra that recharges in two seconds I believe so they can keep heals up as much if not better than a guard. They can also provide AoE regen via illusions by traiting for it.

i actually play a mantra healer in zergs :-3
with mantra of recovery and mantra of pain you can constantly spam them meaning you’re healing all allies around you for 2,5k every 3 secs, you can also grab dwayna runes for 50% uptime regen! :-3

i also love playing shout warrior though, 4 AoE condi removals and over 9k AoE healing every 20 seconds :-3

for zergs i’d imagine regen banner warrior is pretty effective since the area is so huge and you’d be apply constant regen to so many people

In zergs, Necros probably hit the title of “best healer,” as that’s where Renewing Blast can function decently. Pumping out 1k heals every second in a line while still dealing decent damage is quite possible. Then you get Transfusion doing an AoE heal of 5k+ on a 40 second cooldown (while increasing your own death shroud and dealing AoE damage). While people don’t like Light fields, a Healing specced necro can heal for more with Well of Blood than any other healing skill in the game (potentially preventing via projectile/whirl finishers cleansing conditions).

Interesting.

The reason I asked is I was speculating on a possible group heal specced character using the new nomad’s armor stats. However, since healing is secondary, maybe Cleric’s or Apothecary’s might be better, depending on the class.

Liewec.2896:

yolo swaggins.2570:

I want to say mantra mesmers because their traited mantras can heal almost as much as a guard’s meditation. The best part is that they have a mantra that recharges in two seconds I believe so they can keep heals up as much if not better than a guard. They can also provide AoE regen via illusions by traiting for it.

i actually play a mantra healer in zergs :-3
with mantra of recovery and mantra of pain you can constantly spam them meaning you’re healing all allies around you for 2,5k every 3 secs, you can also grab dwayna runes for 50% uptime regen! :-3

i also love playing shout warrior though, 4 AoE condi removals and over 9k AoE healing every 20 seconds :-3

for zergs i’d imagine regen banner warrior is pretty effective since the area is so huge and you’d be apply constant regen to so many people

Banner regen is pretty nice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqyrd-yZeZ8
This is from a long time ago before ascended armor was out. You can now push regen boons to 500-600hp/s for 20-25 people with the buffed runes and sigils.

Morfedel.4165:

Interesting.

The reason I asked is I was speculating on a possible group heal specced character using the new nomad’s armor stats. However, since healing is secondary, maybe Cleric’s or Apothecary’s might be better, depending on the class.

be wary,

Being a group styled “healer” for a small army (zerg) is very useful. however take some hard looking at healing power and if it even scales with your chosen skills. You may be better off with just a soldier set, or even knights.

Banner Regen Warriors are a very interesting support set up for large groups in WvW I personally think. Not only does your banners have a helpfull regen. but hey suddenly everyone is hitting harder with your conveniently placed banner of discipline and strength.

Unfortunately for Banner Warriors, regeneration is fairly bad as your main source of support, when basically any healing build can upkeep 100% regen uptime, often with a single skill.

Liewec.2896:

yolo swaggins.2570:

I want to say mantra mesmers because their traited mantras can heal almost as much as a guard’s meditation. The best part is that they have a mantra that recharges in two seconds I believe so they can keep heals up as much if not better than a guard. They can also provide AoE regen via illusions by traiting for it.

i actually play a mantra healer in zergs :-3
with mantra of recovery and mantra of pain you can constantly spam them meaning you’re healing all allies around you for 2,5k every 3 secs, you can also grab dwayna runes for 50% uptime regen! :-3

i also love playing shout warrior though, 4 AoE condi removals and over 9k AoE healing every 20 seconds :-3

for zergs i’d imagine regen banner warrior is pretty effective since the area is so huge and you’d be apply constant regen to so many people

what the hell is your healing power on that shout warrior to get 9k heals from three shouts? Also anything relying on the regen boon in wvw will not be effective because that boon will be overwritten by somebody else with the same boon. ie: you throw 1000 healing power regen on 5 people, 5 seconds later somebody with 100 healing power gives regen to the same 5 people. For the first 5 seconds the regen will go with your healing power, but after the other guy gave out his, lower healing power regen, the regen will tick for less, completely negating any remaining time yours had left.

You need instant heals in wvw, something like empower, guardian dodges, warrior shouts, water blasts, etc. If we’re talking about guild play, than I would say guardian is the best healer when they are traited to do so. However, if we assume the blasts from the eles water fields count towards the eles healing, than ele can very easily be a better healer than the guardian. This is all from a wvw guild play perspective, it would be different in other game modes.

I had not thought about that,

the overwrite of regen etc. that brings up a good point. Given that a “healer” type character is really only effective in WvW. That is something to really take into account.

a faster burst styled heal would be far more effective. particularly if you have a handful of people doing it.

for smaller groups engineers can pump out some massive aoe healing 800+ a sec aoe and then 10-18k burst aoe healing every 20-40 seconds depending on utilities, also comes packed with heaps of extra utility.

i will second that.

best “healing” i have had in game came from an Engineer and a well timed turrent.

slightly off topic….
the more i think about it. i am begining to wonder if NEcromancers And Engineers were orginally created to be WvW classes. Everything about them fits very well into the large scale “warfare” type.
(shrug) meh,

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Difficult to say, depends on metric. In raw healing a bomb engineer should win out after they buffed the scaling, but it’s often not practical healing.

Mesmer mantra heal effectiveness is just good vs pvd under ac raining.. Cuz u will nothing need to do than heal..

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Eles bring much more than just healing, they bring AOE damage and CC, arguably more CC than a guardian depending on what weapon the guard takes.

warriorjrd.8695:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Eles bring much more than just healing, they bring AOE damage and CC, arguably more CC than a guardian depending on what weapon the guard takes.

I know they do, didn’t mean to imply otherwise :p but the high uptimes on stability and protection from a guardian are just invaluable and unmatched making them a better choice overall. not to mention the heavy armor makes them much tankier too.

in theory you could go 4 in earth but then you’d have to give up 2 in arcane :\

warriorjrd.8695:

what the hell is your healing power on that shout warrior to get 9k heals from three shouts?

i count “shrug it off!” in there too, because you will never be in combat and not have conditions constantly applied, (the shake it off that it triggers is affected by Vigorous shouts and lung capacity so it will heal every 20 seconds and remove 2 conditions if you have soldier runes)
each shout does around 2,3k healing, 2,3k x 4 = 9,2k :-3

it also makes you an amazing bunker considering you have adrenal health and healing signet both ticking for huge amounts and you have plenty of condition removal :-3

Morfedel.4165:

Interesting.

The reason I asked is I was speculating on a possible group heal specced character using the new nomad’s armor stats. However, since healing is secondary, maybe Cleric’s or Apothecary’s might be better, depending on the class.

if you gonna play nomads the ONLY classes able to deal damage with that will be BM ranger (you can go regen BM 02066, need some help to get rid of condies, but otherwise you are good) or you must play minionmancer. NO OTHER PROFESSIONS WILL DEAL GOOD DAMAGE WITH THAT ARMOR.

BM ranger can do upwards of 12k single target bursts, minion mancer i am no familiar with, but minions is minions, they will work.

Liewec.2896:

warriorjrd.8695:

what the hell is your healing power on that shout warrior to get 9k heals from three shouts?

i count “shrug it off!” in there too, because you will never be in combat and not have conditions constantly applied, (the shake it off that it triggers is affected by Vigorous shouts and lung capacity so it will heal every 20 seconds and remove 2 conditions if you have soldier runes)
each shout does around 2,3k healing, 2,3k x 4 = 9,2k :-3

it also makes you an amazing bunker considering you have adrenal health and healing signet both ticking for huge amounts and you have plenty of condition removal :-3

You do not know what “huge amounts of regen” is before you play regen ranger. If you think your warrior with its measly 650-750hp/sec HP is “a lot” then say hello to my ranger who can get 2130 hp/sec

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

Guardian is the ultimate supporter class for sure, BUT, with the nomads armor it will be just that, 100% support and next to NO damage. The guard is very well balanced, however that means you gotta choose between DPS and support, hybrid solutions means you lose self sustain over time, while self sustain comes at the cost of group support.

Depending on size of the group, a spirit + regen + BM ranger in nomad can grant you everything you need EXCEPT stability and boon strips. Now, the best solution for a sustained healing backbone of a group is 1x guard and 1x ranger. The guard does the “burst heals” and stability alongside some cleansing. Ranger will be able to further support at cleansing, and maintain about 350-670 HP/sec on the group depending on spirit uptime. The ranger will also provide fury from WH, a water field, 3x AOE condi cleanses, one being a total wipe, two being 2x and 5x condies removed. Protection can be granted through spirits or a DPS boost through burning

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

I’m unconviced by that. Geyser alone has half the cooldown and is a water field. In a group situation that water field will heal for a whole lot more than the slight difference in the ammount directly healed between an aquatic benevolence geyser and healing breeze. Besides, shelter is pretty much mandatory for a (wvw) guardian.

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

I’m unconviced by that. Geyser alone has half the cooldown and is a water field. In a group situation that water field will heal for a whole lot more than the slight difference in the ammount directly healed between geyser and healing breeze. Besides, shelter is pretty much mandatory for a guardian.

Shelter is not mandatory, its a option.

When you factor in water fields then that is not elementalist healing, who ever does the blast is considered the healer not the elementalist.

I think its a bit far fetched to believe that elementalist is even close to guardian’s healing ability. Elementalist heals are pretty much limited to their weapon sets and a few limited trait options. While guardian has healing on weapon sets, traits and utilities.

You can view a comprehensive list of guardian healing here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0As5Q5haUqZ8edHJPaGhRNk9BN2VWaWw4QzByamtXNXc&usp=sharing#gid=0

You can also view the ally healing.

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

I’m unconviced by that. Geyser alone has half the cooldown and is a water field. In a group situation that water field will heal for a whole lot more than the slight difference in the ammount directly healed between geyser and healing breeze. Besides, shelter is pretty much mandatory for a guardian.

Shelter is not mandatory, its a option.

When you factor in water fields then that is not elementalist healing, who ever does the blast is considered the healer not the elementalist.

I think its a bit far fetched to believe that elementalist is even close to guardian’s healing ability. Elementalist heals are pretty much limited to their weapon sets and a few limited trait options. While guardian has healing on weapon sets, traits and utilities.

You can view a comprehensive list of guardian healing here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0As5Q5haUqZ8edHJPaGhRNk9BN2VWaWw4QzByamtXNXc&usp=sharing#gid=0

You can also view the ally healing.

the elementalist can blast the water field too but you can’t consider things in a vacuum. just because the green numbers don’t come from the ele when others blast, the ele is still the source of the water field. stuff gets healed because the ele did something.

You don’t need to tell me about guardian traits and skills. I play both my guardian and ele as support with very similar gear setups, the ele massively outheals the guardian, trust me, it really isn’t a competition; I could just autoattack with staff water 1 for 900+ aoe hp every 3/4 sec; not that I do it often, but its a possibility when needed.

BUT I rarely get to play the ele as guardian is a superior choice most of the times (in a 5 man wvw group) ; as I said before, by itself healing doesn’t mean much, you need to bring some more stuff to the group. And while the ele brings some nice fields, aoe, cleanses, cc and some boons… stab and protection from a guard plus the innate tankiness of heavy armor makes it a way better choice generally.

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

I’m unconviced by that. Geyser alone has half the cooldown and is a water field. In a group situation that water field will heal for a whole lot more than the slight difference in the ammount directly healed between geyser and healing breeze. Besides, shelter is pretty much mandatory for a guardian.

Shelter is not mandatory, its a option.

When you factor in water fields then that is not elementalist healing, who ever does the blast is considered the healer not the elementalist.

I think its a bit far fetched to believe that elementalist is even close to guardian’s healing ability. Elementalist heals are pretty much limited to their weapon sets and a few limited trait options. While guardian has healing on weapon sets, traits and utilities.

You can view a comprehensive list of guardian healing here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0As5Q5haUqZ8edHJPaGhRNk9BN2VWaWw4QzByamtXNXc&usp=sharing#gid=0

You can also view the ally healing.

the elementalist can blast the water field too but you can’t consider things in a vacuum. just because the green numbers don’t come from the ele when others blast, the ele is still the source of the water field. stuff gets healed because the ele did something.

You don’t need to tell me about guardian traits and skills. I play both my guardian and ele as support with very similar gear setups, the ele massively outheals the guardian, trust me, it really isn’t a competition; I could just autoattack with staff water 1 for 900+ aoe hp every 3/4 sec; not that I do it often, but its a possibility when needed.

BUT I rarely get to play the ele as guardian is a superior choice most of the times (in a 5 man wvw group) ; as I said before, by itself healing doesn’t mean much, you need to bring some more stuff to the group. And while the ele brings some nice fields, aoe, cleanses, cc and some boons… stab and protection from a guard plus the innate tankiness of heavy armor makes it a way better choice generally.

I disagree entirely, ele can heal better at range…that’s about it.

A few guard healing abilities that affect allies:

1. Communal defense + Pure of Heart
2. Selfless Daring
3. Faithful Strike
4. Writ of the Merciful
5. Healing Breeze
6. Merciful Intervention
7. Empower
8. Battle Presence with Vor
9. Shield of Absorption/Detonate
10. Sanctuary

If elementalist could out perform guardian with support (this includes heals and boons) then guardian would have no role. But this is clearly not the case.

When you mention healing with ele you can only mention it coming from a couple sources, because that’s all ele has. When I talk about healing with guardian I’m pointing out how their healing capability comes from a multitude of sources. Notice I didn’t even factor in tome of courage.

I agree with what you are saying about healing not being much own its own. Its the combination of many different elements that provides the group sustain. Healing is just one of the mechanics.

maybe I expressed myself wrong, I dont think ele can outperform a guardian in support. guardian is a much better choice for support overall. my 5 man group almost always runs 2 support guards and very rarely a support ele because of it.

but when it comes down to pure outgoing healing, the new trait just puts eles in another league from my experience. it’s not about the number of skills it has available to heal, just how they work: going into water and then doging will give allies some 8k hp +525~ hps without wasting a single skill. and if someone is in need of a burst heal? drop one of two water fields and blast away.

8k dodge roll? What?

Aza.2105:

8k dodge roll? What?

water attunement + dodge roll. 2x 3900~, once for attuning to water, once for dodging. considering about 1k healing power, benevolence stacks, monk runes and aquatic benevolence as I have on my ele.

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

8k dodge roll? What?

water attunement + dodge roll. 2x 3900~, once for attuning to water, once for dodging. considering about 1k healing power, benevolence stacks, monk runes and aquatic benevolence as I have on my ele.

So the amount of healing skills/sources does matter then?

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Aza.2105:

Maskaganda.2043:

Im pretty sure you can’t outheal a staff ele with the new water gm trait. add in some benevolence sigil and monk runes and you’re looking at 40%+ outgoing heals.

between soothing mist and regen alone my ele does over 500hps to others. attuning to water and dodging does some 8k heal and its doable every 10 seconds. geyser does about 1900 per tick, 3 ticks. and then there’s both water fields, blastable by both you and your allies.

However, healing by itself is pretty meaningless, at least in wvw. You need to bring something else to the group besides healing alone. A guardian will be capable of having great healing while providing everything you need in a group with the exception of fury; no other support class/build gets close to that, especially in regards to stability.

Guardian’s healing breeze out does every ally heal elementalist has in its entire skill set. I’ll say this again, ele is not even close to the amount of healing guardian can do. The only time they have a advantage is at range since guardian isn’t a ranged class.

I’m unconviced by that. Geyser alone has half the cooldown and is a water field. In a group situation that water field will heal for a whole lot more than the slight difference in the ammount directly healed between geyser and healing breeze. Besides, shelter is pretty much mandatory for a guardian.

Shelter is not mandatory, its a option.

When you factor in water fields then that is not elementalist healing, who ever does the blast is considered the healer not the elementalist.

I think its a bit far fetched to believe that elementalist is even close to guardian’s healing ability. Elementalist heals are pretty much limited to their weapon sets and a few limited trait options. While guardian has healing on weapon sets, traits and utilities.

You can view a comprehensive list of guardian healing here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0As5Q5haUqZ8edHJPaGhRNk9BN2VWaWw4QzByamtXNXc&usp=sharing#gid=0

You can also view the ally healing.

I disagree entirely, ele can heal better at range…that’s about it.

A few guard healing abilities that affect allies:

1. Communal defense + Pure of Heart
2. Selfless Daring
3. Faithful Strike
4. Writ of the Merciful
5. Healing Breeze
6. Merciful Intervention
7. Empower
8. Battle Presence with Vor
9. Shield of Absorption/Detonate
10. Sanctuary

If elementalist could out perform guardian with support (this includes heals and boons) then guardian would have no role. But this is clearly not the case.

When you mention healing with ele you can only mention it coming from a couple sources, because that’s all ele has. When I talk about healing with guardian I’m pointing out how their healing capability comes from a multitude of sources. Notice I didn’t even factor in tome of courage.

I agree with what you are saying about healing not being much own its own. Its the combination of many different elements that provides the group sustain. Healing is just one of the mechanics.

That is wrong on so many levels. Guardians are necessary for the melee train in wvw, warriors cannot survive without guardians.. A basic guardian set up gets heals on dodge, empower, staff 2, and that’s it. The rest of the quick heals come from warrior shouts and water blasts. Just because a guardian CAN go full healer, doesn’t mean it would ever be the most effective. An ele can support with almost as much condi cleanse as a guardian, provide the vital water fields, as well as bring AOE damage and CC to a group. You may not count the blasts from the ele’s fields as the ele’s heals, but the blasts only happened because of him/her dropping the water.

In wvw guild play Elementalist heals more than a guardian.

warriorjrd.8695:

That is wrong on so many levels. Guardians are necessary for the melee train in wvw, warriors cannot survive without guardians.. A basic guardian set up gets heals on dodge, empower, staff 2, and that’s it. The rest of the quick heals come from warrior shouts and water blasts. Just because a guardian CAN go full healer, doesn’t mean it would ever be the most effective. An ele can support with almost as much condi cleanse as a guardian, provide the vital water fields, as well as bring AOE damage and CC to a group. You may not count the blasts from the ele’s fields as the ele’s heals, but the blasts only happened because of him/her dropping the water.

In wvw guild play Elementalist heals more than a guardian.

I’m failing to see how I’m wrong on so many levels…….

If ele could take over guardians role as support, then guardian wouldn’t be sought out to provide support for groups. I see what you are saying and I’m not disagreeing with most of what you are saying but..

It seems to me that the basic guardian build that you have in mind does not heal more than general ele wvw build. This maybe true but this does not mean ele heals for more, it just means the build they run provides more healing than the basic guardian build. Selfless daring, empower, and orb of light are only a small fraction of guardian’s healing capabilities.

I totally disagree with the statement of ele being able to provide as much condi removal for allies as guardian. From my understanding of each class, its not even close. But as I said, it might be true for specific guardian builds but not all.

I want to make it known that I’m speaking in general about class mechanics, were as you are talking about specific builds.

Aza.2105:

warriorjrd.8695:

That is wrong on so many levels. Guardians are necessary for the melee train in wvw, warriors cannot survive without guardians.. A basic guardian set up gets heals on dodge, empower, staff 2, and that’s it. The rest of the quick heals come from warrior shouts and water blasts. Just because a guardian CAN go full healer, doesn’t mean it would ever be the most effective. An ele can support with almost as much condi cleanse as a guardian, provide the vital water fields, as well as bring AOE damage and CC to a group. You may not count the blasts from the ele’s fields as the ele’s heals, but the blasts only happened because of him/her dropping the water.

In wvw guild play Elementalist heals more than a guardian.

I’m failing to see how I’m wrong on so many levels…….

If ele could take over guardians role as support, then guardian wouldn’t be sought out to provide support for groups. I see what you are saying and I’m not disagreeing with most of what you are saying but..

It seems to me that the basic guardian build that you have in mind does not heal more than general ele wvw build. This maybe true but this does not mean ele heals for more, it just means the build they run provides more healing than the basic guardian build. Selfless daring, empower, and orb of light are only a small fraction of guardian’s healing capabilities.

I totally disagree with the statement of ele being able to provide as much condi removal for allies as guardian. From my understanding of each class, its not even close. But as I said, it might be true for specific guardian builds but not all.

I want to make it known that I’m speaking in general about class mechanics, were as you are talking about specific builds.

Cleansing water with healing rain = 2 condi/sec. Water attune +dodge= two condi removed. It’s not as much as a guardian, but it’s close. The reason you were wrong, is because looking at the statement I bolded, you are under the impression a guardian is taken into wvw purely for heals and support. It’s astonishing you think that an ele could ever replace a guardian just because it could theoretically outheal a guard. An ele is a ranged class, it’s not meant for the melee train. That’s like saying because ele’s outheal a shout warrior we don’t need any shout warriors.

They both heal, but do many, many other things aside from that. Just because one outheals the other does not mean it would ever replace it. So using the argument that because guardians are still used, therefore they heal more than ele’s is completely irrelevant and doesn’t support what you’re trying to say at all.

Also, as I said before, just because a guardian CAN outheal any other class, doesn’t mean that will necessarily be beneficial. The weapons a guardian uses in wvw are always staff + hammer or greatsword. That weapon set already eliminates some of your healing sources. Merciful intervention would never be taken over stand your ground, hold the line, or purging flames. Most guardians take shelter over healing breeze for obvious reasons. This leaves you with very few heals left, but also allows you to do much more.

What I’m trying to say is, sure a guardian can potentially heal the most, but if they spec for that, they won’t do much else. Where as an ele can heal and support as well as do other things. So yes, in a sense you are right, but a guardian like that would never be used and would be borderline useless in a guild scenario.

So all in all; theoretically a guardian heals for more, realistically however, the ele heals for more.

warriorjrd.8695:

The reason you were wrong, is because looking at the statement I bolded, you are under the impression a guardian is taken into wvw purely for heals and support. It’s astonishing you think that an ele could ever replace a guardian just because it could theoretically outheal a guard.

I never was thinking this, but you assumed this was what I was saying. Its not.

What I’m trying to say is, sure a guardian can potentially heal the most, but if they spec for that, they won’t do much else. Where as an ele can heal and support as well as do other things.

Yes. But ele can always do other things. They are the kings of versatility. But you can sort of see what I’m saying here. I’m not comparing build vs build since there is no guarantee everyone is running the same build. I’m looking at it from the perspective of the class mechanics.

For example looking at the class mechanics, I can say guardian’s torch out performs any all condi removal ele has. 9 conditions removed on a 15 sec cd. But you do not see a lot of players run a torch to do this.

Also, I’m not looking at it a wvw point of view. I’m looking at it in general.

I don’t know how people could argue a guard could heal as well as an ele. An ele’s healing is insane, people prefer guards for the 100% protection uptime.

…and a guard can do two roles, tank and healer, where a healing spec’d ele is only good for healing.

Ele’s water fields are the best heals an organized group could wish for, with each and everyone of them you can refill everybody’s health while a guardian can only heal 5 people each time.

In a small and unorganized group I would prefer a guardian, but just because it’s easier and doesn’t require other people to recognize when and where to blast, leap and stand.

In terms of WvW (where you actually need mass healing), eles are amazing. Yes, guardians are strong too, but they have different roles, IMO. Guards are very much wanted for their stabilities and other protective boons, whereas when it comes to straight healing, I’m pretty sure a support ele could outdo them.

I use PVT gear on my ele with Water runes (1300-1400ish AoE burst heal to other players every time I use a heal skill, 1000-1100ish self-heal, not counting the actual heal skill), the Aquatic Benevolence trait, along with the other support traits. Arcane Brilliance on your own water field both gives a blast heal (using your healing power, so if you’re support-oriented, the blast can be quite strong), and if you use Water runes, you get a second burst heal. Since people are usually stacked when you throw down a water field, other players benefit from both of these.

With Aquatic Benevolence (and Benevolence sigil, if you use one – personally I don’t), and eles are pretty massive healing machines. And while other people’s blasts on your water field may not be as strong as your own, it’s still your water field that’s allowing them to AoE heal – no water field, no water blast heals – and the water field itself heals as well.

Personally, I wouldn’t base class choice on who can pump out the most heals overall, though. Guardians and eles have very different playstyles, and one (or both) won’t be for everyone. It comes down to what you, specifically, prefer.

This is all from a WvW perspective. I wouldn’t consider a full heal build in PvE for any content.

I would say:

Best Single/Small Group Healer: Necromancer. By far. If you have allies in front of you your Renewing Blast may be enough for them to facetank many things. Over 1400 spammable heal still doing okay damage + 100% uptime on regen, burst heals with Life Transfer, supporting party by cleansing conditions on regular basis not even counting Well of Blood. + Can survive many, many things on it’s own.

Best Group/Zerg Healer: Elementalist. No doubt. Water Fields, unique healing HoT, 47,5% increased outgoing healing and much more.

Best Support: Guardian. That’s a support profession. Also, the easiest to heal/support with.

Carighan.6758:

Difficult to say, depends on metric. In raw healing a bomb engineer should win out after they buffed the scaling, but it’s often not practical healing.

Yup exactly you have to take in consideration the application of said healing. It bit more awkward on engi when compared to a guard or ele.

Ele is by far the better dedicated healer after the big feature patch.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fFAQFAWnMIShD25AWPAdEGADwIHDeBfQRBgyHhbQPA-TFyDABMcBAIUJolq/80+DXp8DPdAA8AAcTDRAAEgduzAwP/5P/5P/Z/cn/cn/8nlC4bhRA-w
That is a full healing based build that will also deal ok damage and very survivable. your auto attack in water alone heals 1.5k every 3/4 secs. between regen and soothing mists you heal another ~1.5kish+ a sec, add in water fields, dodges, etc and you heal for way more than a guard while still having the great cc’s and decent damage. While you can’t run with the hammer train as closely as a guard can you will not die unless their train is all over your face at which point it’s skill. If your willing to run closer to the train you can move 2 from arcana and air to earth for the ability to give lots of stab(~3 secs every ~10secs) and more protection uptime than a guard can give(guards give 5secs every 28 secs if traited from HTL).

PS: while D/D isn’t as much support as staff it can still heal a lot and live in most hammer train fights but becomes much more difficult in higher tier wvw.

Qualification: Main guard and ele in wvw skill groups for over a year.

Morfedel.4165:

So, this seemed like the best place to post this question. I don’t play much of the classes that do more other-people-healing effects, heh, so I am not sure of the answer.

So… which class does the best healing for others besides themselves? Staff Water ele? Guardian? Something else?

With ranger you can maintain a constant 1.3k healing per second on allies in range if you really go for it (this WILL be using sigils of benevolence) and have the fastest rezzes in the game. They can also apply a large uptime on vigor, protection, swiftness, fury, and regen.

Last I checked necromancers are still kings of raw healing numbers from their traited life bast + Blood of Well + traited death shroud 4. Idk what all else they bring, but the healing is absolutely ridiculous (well of blood heals for 10.4k to allies in sPvP).

There’s also Mesmer, which pretty much heals in spurts after interrupting or shattering as well as boons everywhere. I don’t know much on the build, I’ve just seen it used once or twice and it was highly effective.

Then you’ve got ele and guardian.

If you want to know the ranger build just PM me, I’ve been perfecting it since like beta, and it trivializes a lot of encounters.

Ezeriel.9574:

…and a guard can do two roles, tank and healer, where a healing spec’d ele is only good for healing.

This is not correct. I run full heals staff ele and I can guarantee you I will match the tanking of a full tank guardian every time. If you think this ele can’t tank it’s not being played right.

Whether one would prefer an ele or a guradian to support a group depends on the group composition. A guardian gives out a lot of valuable boons that the ele can’t match, but the ele provides greater healing along with water fields and frost armor.

As for the question in the thread, if you are looking for the best healing in WvW then ele is it. The ele provides the water fields that allows very larger groups to heal efficiently while at the same time providing significant burst heals and regen to smaller groups. It also provides 70-100% uptime on protection depending on how it’s played.

To play as efficient in healing as the ele, the guardian has to play a less efficient playstyle: trading out shelter for breeze, using the elite to get another heal off, waiting a few seconds for a heal to go off on empower, aiming a slow moving projectile, consuming dodges, and standing on top of the target to pop a shield.

On the other hand, the ele really only needs to be close to the target and do 1 dodge roll with an attune swap to get off a large heal along with a large heal over time. The other heals require very little effort and minor levels of communication. The ele also has superior positioning in order to get heals off having both better range and better mobility.

Rym.1469:

I would say:

Best Single/Small Group Healer: Necromancer. By far. If you have allies in front of you your Renewing Blast may be enough for them to facetank many things. Over 1400 spammable heal still doing okay damage + 100% uptime on regen, burst heals with Life Transfer, supporting party by cleansing conditions on regular basis not even counting Well of Blood. + Can survive many, many things on it’s own.

Best Group/Zerg Healer: Elementalist. No doubt. Water Fields, unique healing HoT, 47,5% increased outgoing healing and much more.

Best Support: Guardian. That’s a support profession. Also, the easiest to heal/support with.

actually, you could argue that ranger with water spirit and shouts could and most likely would challenge ele on healing over time. Seeing as up to 15 persons at a time can gain the spirit buff as they move in and out of range. That would be 1k HP healed for each person + the healing spring + regen ticking 350-720 (if running elite spirit). Thus the ranger can, in an over time perspective, drastically outheal the ele due to ele cooldowns and casting and all that.
One can argue that since ele has two waterfields they can heal more, but the two waterfields together last as long as one ranger water field so that discussion is rather…. pointless.

Prysin.8542:

Morfedel.4165:

Interesting.

The reason I asked is I was speculating on a possible group heal specced character using the new nomad’s armor stats. However, since healing is secondary, maybe Cleric’s or Apothecary’s might be better, depending on the class.

if you gonna play nomads the ONLY classes able to deal damage with that will be BM ranger (you can go regen BM 02066, need some help to get rid of condies, but otherwise you are good) or you must play minionmancer. NO OTHER PROFESSIONS WILL DEAL GOOD DAMAGE WITH THAT ARMOR.

BM ranger can do upwards of 12k single target bursts, minion mancer i am no familiar with, but minions is minions, they will work.

Liewec.2896:

warriorjrd.8695:

what the hell is your healing power on that shout warrior to get 9k heals from three shouts?

i count “shrug it off!” in there too, because you will never be in combat and not have conditions constantly applied, (the shake it off that it triggers is affected by Vigorous shouts and lung capacity so it will heal every 20 seconds and remove 2 conditions if you have soldier runes)
each shout does around 2,3k healing, 2,3k x 4 = 9,2k :-3

it also makes you an amazing bunker considering you have adrenal health and healing signet both ticking for huge amounts and you have plenty of condition removal :-3

You do not know what “huge amounts of regen” is before you play regen ranger. If you think your warrior with its measly 650-750hp/sec HP is “a lot” then say hello to my ranger who can get 2130 hp/sec

Its actually more like around 1250-1300hps. 2130hps is a spike regen phase when you have troll unguent and elite spirit running. 1250-1300hps is with cooldowns factored in, which is still amazing, but its not far off from warriors coz banner regen builds tick for the same amount but with less investment.

But thats just self-sustain. Lets move on to group heals.
Theoretically, a full-on banner warrior can grant regen boons to 24 (excluding self) people at once.
This potentially amounts to around 2700hps (or 4000hps if you include self-sustain) given that there are 24 other people around you.

Of course, there isn’t always gonna be 24 people running around you, so it really depends on the situation. Rangers will obviously tick higher in smaller groups and in single encounters given that they have the elite spirit, but also keep in mind the spirits and pets are vulnerable and have cds. There are other classes that can probably bump out heals more consistently and reliably.

So again, it depends if we’re talking about best healer in a zerg? Self-sustain? Or 5 man groups?

Prysin.8542:

Rym.1469:

I would say:

Best Single/Small Group Healer: Necromancer. By far. If you have allies in front of you your Renewing Blast may be enough for them to facetank many things. Over 1400 spammable heal still doing okay damage + 100% uptime on regen, burst heals with Life Transfer, supporting party by cleansing conditions on regular basis not even counting Well of Blood. + Can survive many, many things on it’s own.

Best Group/Zerg Healer: Elementalist. No doubt. Water Fields, unique healing HoT, 47,5% increased outgoing healing and much more.

Best Support: Guardian. That’s a support profession. Also, the easiest to heal/support with.

actually, you could argue that ranger with water spirit and shouts could and most likely would challenge ele on healing over time. Seeing as up to 15 persons at a time can gain the spirit buff as they move in and out of range. That would be 1k HP healed for each person + the healing spring + regen ticking 350-720 (if running elite spirit). Thus the ranger can, in an over time perspective, drastically outheal the ele due to ele cooldowns and casting and all that.
One can argue that since ele has two waterfields they can heal more, but the two waterfields together last as long as one ranger water field so that discussion is rather…. pointless.

The part about the water fields is semi-true, however don’t forget geyser has a direct heal, something healing spring doesn’t have. Also having two water fields can often times be better than one, because that means you have two opportunities to blast, which in turn results in more healing. The only good thing about healing spring’s long duration is more condi cleanse, regen up time, and ofc more time to potentially blast. The water spirit is indeed a strong healer for the ranger but if we really want to talk potential ele staff 1 can heal upwards of 1k with high healing power, each attack, as well as the passive regen from water attunement, swapping to water attunement, and then ofc dodging in water attunement. And to top it off, with ele’s new water grandmaster trait: aquatic benovolence, and ele can easily be the best healer in game if it wants to.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fFAQFAmmMIS1DGADwI3CeBfQRBgyHhbQPA-TlRDABGqEcPdAYq+TU7PklyPAeAABAQAev7BA/8n/8n/8n9zf+zf+zfWKgvFGB-w

A build like this for example (not viable at all, just showing what an ele COULD do) has an additional 35% outward healing to allies. That means each water AA will heal for 1200, each geyser will heal for 5400 before blasts, and regen on allies will tick for just under 500, on top of soothing mist which will tick for 250, and that’s before dodges and the actual attuning to water itself.

Aquatic benevolence alone shuts out any competition really.

Sigil of stamina + 2.25k selfless daring
the lols were great

This is my preferred healing style guardian. Of course, a few things can be moved around, but this makes quite a few people very, very happy.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQNApeWlsApVo1CxTI0ENhDBl5OqP2VYEb4yAMAA-TFyDABM8EAIUJolq/80+DXp8DgDBAe6Ds4EAEAABwP/5P/5P/ZkCorlRA-w

Monk