Guild Wars 2

Nike.2631:

JahRo.6432:

It wasn’t for full damage. It was to maximize crit damage, while giving up little. I’m not angry about PvE, since anything in PvE is full zerk anyway. This is for WvW only. What kittenes me off is that I spent time and money theorycrafting only to render it sub-par.

So what will you be shifting to?

Dunno yet, waiting to see how it turns out. Hopefully something else will make up for the celestial loss. I’ve only used a few pieces, so it’s not as bad as (s)omeone with a lot, but it’s still frustrating.

JahRo.6432:

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Can anobody list the stats for a 2h or 1h celestial weapon here? It’s the only celestial piece i don’t have, And i would like to use that to complete my math behind it.

2h celestial is 83 all stats, 11% crit damage. The nerf will increase all stats to ~88 and reduce the crit damage to ~6

Then total stat outcome by celestial is even lower then 600, effectively making the boost even lower then my ancitipated 36.

Also you people seem to forget trait crit damage will get a nerf too. 30% becomes 20%. This affects a lot of celestial build also i think.

Since we got to compare apples to apples and I wanted to do the complete math anyways: Lets go into the math to see how it all play out shall we?

First traits: I used full zerk traits http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgAQJArKEBI9AAAAo0DAAAAA-zEBBYjBMRtIasqaER1qkYAA-w (so max power, precision line) to get the biggest effect possible. Afterall: Only crit damage is effected so you need to crit for it to have any effect at all. No runes are taken since those are unaffected by the imminent changed they’ll be making to runes and will have the same effect on all gears anyways.

The math then:
-full celestial with the 6% boost will give 497 stats on all gear (up from 469 now).
-Trait lines will change also, so 30% crit damage will become 300 ferocity=20 crit damage.

Offensive:
-797 ferocity/15=53.13 crit damage vs the 91 that same set gives now. However you can’t translate that 1 on 1, since with full celestial you don’t crit all the time right?
-Since precision increases by 28, that has an effect on crit chance also: 42% (rounded down from 42.43) vs 41%
-Power also has an effect for direct damage: 28 increase so 1713 power.

So how will dps change? Let’s use a target with 2800 armor (heavy target golem).
Tooltip damage = (average weapon strength) * Power * (skill-specific coefficient) / (level-based Armor value)

Old situation: 1685*1000*/2800=601.79
41% crit chance with 2.41 crit damage multiplier: so 0.41*2.41*601.79+0.59*601.79=949.69

New situation: 1713*1000/2800=611.79
42% crit chance with 2.03 crit damage: 0.42*611.79*2.03+0.58*611.79=876.45

Result being: 876.45/949.69= a 7.71% loss in dps. a whooping 2.29% less then zerkers lose, but then again 7.71 loss to any gear not having crit damage on it. So what do we gain on them?

Defensive(EHP):

Though not a perfect way it is a common practice to use this formula EHP=HP*Armor/10000
Needless to say it ignores healing and condition damage.
EHP old: 4650.37
EHP new:4772.38
a 2.6% increase in EHP.

The tricky part:

Healing power and Condition damage. Given the way both works it’s almost impossible to make a proper calculation here. Various conditions give different % increases and healing power effects vary on the skill you use. Also there are traits that trigger on crit, which (though minor) are effected by the crit chance increase aswell.

Conclusion:
All in all one could argue that given the most zerk-ish version (traits) of a celestial build the change leads to a guaranteed:

-2.6% increase in EHP, compared to all other gear types
-A 7.71% decrease in direct damage compared to all gears that got no crit damage at all
-A 2.29% increase in dps compared to gears with crit damage
+a skill depending increase in condition damage and healing power.

Again: I’d have wanted it to be a bit higher myself since pending on what class and build you use it can be a lot. On the other hand: The less you got invested in the traits that give crit chance/crit damage the lesser the cons will become, while keeping the positive stat increases. I seriously doubt everybody using full celestial is specced with full zerk traits. The above is the least likely and the biggest casualty of this change. The reality will be less worse.

Edit:
I want to add 1 thing to this after some consideration and motivate why the 6% raw stats boost is a flaw in the way the devs thought about this:

-Where we were at before this change: secondary stats give 745 stat points putting celestial at 62.95% ((469/745)100%) on all stats.
-Where we will be after this: (497/745)100%=66.71%

The effective compensation we are getting therefore isn’ t 6%, but only 3.76%. To make it a proper 6% statsboost and keep the position of celestial intact it should be an increase of 44 points (9% on celestial stats) for the full set or 6% of the secondary stat for other gears.

Celestial getting hit hardest, we are talking more than 100% nerf in critical damage and only 6% buff to stats. Dont forget that celestial got ripped of magic find back then, without any compensations ! Enought is enought !

All celestial gear should get option to change stats once !

So with new patch celestial gear will have these stats; (current stats > new stats)
Helm
21 all stats, 3% crit damage > 22 all stats (1,5% crit damage)
Shoulders
16 all stats, 2% crit damage > 17 all stats (1,1% crit damage)
Vest
47 all stats, 6% crit damage > 50 all stats (3,3% crit damage)
gloves
16 all stats, 2% crit damage > 17 all stats (1,1% crit damage)
leggings
31 all stats, 4% crit damage > 33 all stats (2,2% crit damage)
boots
16 all stats, 2% crit damage > 17 all stats (1,1% crit damage)
back item
22 all stats, 3% crit damage > 23 all stats (1,5% crit damage)
ring
43 all stats, 6% crit damage > 46 all stats (3,1% crit damage)
earring
38 all stats, 5% crit damage > 40 all stats (2,7% crit damage)
amulet
54 all stats, 7% crit damage > 57 all stats (3,8% crit damage)
1h weapon
42 all stats, 5% crit damage > 45 all stats (3% crit damage)
2h weapon
83 all stats, 11% crit damage > 88 all stats (5,9% crit damage)

Pls Anet, srsly, reconsider only 6% buff, it´s way to low.

6% huh, ok so I’ll lose 15% crit damage and gain +10 all stats (on a full set)? I would love to have some of what Roy and the hippie guy have been smoking because that thing is obviously potent enough to melt brains.

I mean you just took a set that takes 30 days to make and trashed it.

Cause of the danger the math got lost here: please read and if you can be so kind respond to this topic https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/Celestial-stat-compensation-mistake/first#post3792040.

Celestial can easily be made in such way that it’s keeping it’s balance compared to other gears. It only takes a minor tweak.