If they nerf FGS, then 100b must be nerfed as well. As that skill is HEAD AND SHOULDERS above the rest of the dps spectrum (apart from fgs). Same for axe (warrior) auto attack. Time to nerf 100b.
Oh wait, anet is biased towads warriors, can’t nerf them. They can’t even nerf, the most op leap in the game they have: Rush. Nerf RTL on squishy ele ok? Yes (anet). Nerf half cooldown, further moving leap with swiftness on warrior? No thanks. Yet warrior have best hp, armor in game + lot of condi removal/resistance + some of best healing skills in game.
If they nerf FGS, then 100b must be nerfed as well. As that skill is HEAD AND SHOULDERS above the rest of the dps spectrum (apart from fgs). Same for axe (warrior) auto attack. Time to nerf 100b.
Oh wait, anet is biased towads warriors, can’t nerf them. They can’t even nerf, the most op leap in the game they have: Rush. Nerf RTL on squishy ele ok? Yes (anet). Nerf half cooldown, further moving leap with swiftness on warrior? No thanks. Yet warrior have best hp, armor in game + lot of condi removal/resistance + some of best healing skills in game.
1st, they are nerfing 100blades
2nd, it’s not that great DPS wise, it’s a big number but over a pretty decently long animation
3rd, I can outdps a warrior without using FGS on my Ele pretty easily
Also Guardian Whirling Assault is more DPS than 100b. It’s just less hits and over a shorter timeframe (which is why it’s higher DPS).
Toss in mobility and Whirl Combo and the only reason why people run Warrior is because it’s such a snooze (GS3 = Roll, 2 Rolls + Roll Signet + Endure Pain + Healing Signet + Blocks + Low Weapon Swap + Rinse and Repeat).
I can kite Lupicus in Phase 2, get myself out of combat, heal to full (while still kiting Lupicus) and wait for my team to get back to the fight as a Warrior. I don’t think any other profession can do that.
When something grants an advantage, especially one that players rely on, it seems peoples rationality is clouded and will try to use anything they can to justify it.
This thread is a great example of this. Any rational person should be able to see that the FGS is out of line with the balance of other weapons.
Using portals to bypass a jumping puzzle and claim the reward is another good example. People were so attached to it when that aetherblade jumping puzzle was released that they couldn’t fathom the issue of players bypassing the content to claim the reward.
FGS is hard to use? I’m not sure how putting an enemy against a wall and pressing 4 is hard.
I do agree that we need new PVE content and that dungeons are stale, but that doesn’t stop FGS from being stupidly overpowered thanks to something that was clearly not intended.
Errrrr, the skill requires the condition that the boss stack at a wall to achieve maximum dps
I would say pve is more broken than this skill. The mob is basically too stupid to sidestep to side to avoid most of the damage,
kite mob to wall.
remove defiant stacks.
apply long stun.
FGS rush.
even if they added mobility to mobs, the damage the skill does is so absurd that you can clean a boss in just a few seconds. as it is, people would just find other ways to use the skill, no matter how advanced the AI. heck, you can do it on downed players on PvP, or on mobs on PvP (guild lord, svanir, chieftain), or structures (gates, treb). do you want the trebuchet to dodge out of the way as well?
ahhh, i get your point. For wvwvw, you arent really alone.
I dont know what to say about pvp
people would just find other ways to use the skill, no matter how advanced the AI. heck
I actually dont mind that people will try to abuse as much as they can. I mind that it became too easy to abuse it because mob ai sucks
not even just WvW. battle of khylo and legacy of the foefire are two maps where a team that doesn’t have a FGS vs a team that does is at a disadvantage.
Nerf modern healthcare. It clearly violates intended-by-the-developer laws of natural selection. Even the weakest can reproduce nowadays which ruines the balance and fun. Hurr.
They should definitely nerf the damage potential from fiery rush. It’s an exploit that only works against npc’s.
Saying this makes dungeon runs longer is a poor argument. Many bosses are being trivialized because they can be bursted. FGS greatly increases the potential to burst down bosses.
At the beginning of a boss fight, players have a large amount skills with long cooldowns, that enables them to survive face tanking the boss the few seconds it takes to bring it down. This burst strategy requires preparation, but it comletely lacks in-combat reactive decisions. Hence it trivializes boss fights to a very rigid sequence of actions, which is a bad thing.
There are ways to make the weapon viable without making it OP against bosses right next to a wall.
If PvE is stale then isn’t it nice that something changes?
If PvE is stale then isn’t it nice that something changes?
Not when it’s just the weapons themselves that are changing. The content itself stays the same and we repeat the dull encounters that we have for ages, just slower than before. I don’t see how that’s nice.
Honestly if I was a developer I also wouldn’t bother with dungeon community because many of you seem to complain about every single change, while also of course, complaining about how nothing ever changes.
(edited by Wethospu.6437)
When they take the easy way out and don’t bother to address a problem from its source and simply nerf damage then yes, I consider that failure.
And if they made huge reworks and changed lots of encounters you would probably still be complaining how things take longer to kill and how annoying mechanics prevent you bursting everything down in less than 30 seconds.
So why would they bother?
That’s quite the assumption. Care to explain why you seem to be under the impression that I apparently want everything to be as easy as possible?
I’d totally report Assassin Zero, but it seems you no longer can, too many reports already or something. Heh.
Anyhow, I think FGS4 should be changed, so this might be good. If nothing else for a simple reason: It’s incredibly unintuitive how you utilize it. More so some classes – Mesmer for example – can gain a lot from autotargeting, so having to turn it off is problematic at times.
At the very least, the #4 skill should become the flame line directly. Without all the hoops to jump through.
Honestly if I was a developer I also wouldn’t bother with dungeon community because many of you seem to complain about every single change, while also of course, complaining about how nothing ever changes.
Oh a lot of things change, but never where it should be!
They put so much resource into LS. Yet this content is temporary. They think it is innovative. They are convinced that it will make this game stand out. But they are wrong! In many respects, WoW had a lot of Living Story aspects. But it was filled with permanent content. The replayability was strong, so the game lasted.
Gw2 developers have no idea what they will do for LS2.2 … Do you realise this? They can’t even plan ahead! They are barely surviving on a “daily” basis if you see what I mean. They are like nomads, forward fleeing.
History showed that the sedentary prevailed.
If I was a developer I would stop removing content and start adding permanent features instead.
Oh a lot of things change, but never where it should be!
Of course. And removing a major player-skill balance hurdle is also “never where it should be”. Ahem.
They put so much resource into LS. Yet this content is temporary. They think it is innovative. They are convinced that it will make this game stand out. But they are wrong! In many respects, WoW had a lot of Living Story aspects. But it was filled with permanent content. The replayability was strong, so the game lasted.
Uh huh.
That’s a bit of a shabby comparison. If you look at the media, LS (and WvW) are what makes GW2 stands out. That part paid off, they got unique things to be talked about in the media. You may not like them as a gamer, yes.
And well… there’s a lot of things in favour of having an actually fleeting story. It can actually appear to be a story, instead of a static world. LS1 didn’t really capitalize on it much until the last 4-5 patches, but LS2 so far does it well. They should have changed the Grove permanently, granted. Missed opportunity.
If you consider how many MMOs with permanent content additions failed (versus the ones which succeeded to stay alive) and then compare games with temporary PvE content, don’t you think your argument is difficult to prove?
WoW is a serious outlier. It’s difficult to compare stuff to WoW, because you cannot become a “WoW 2.0”. It adds that GW2 very very specifically was designed to not even try that, major components were based on wanting to do something entirely different, because they accepted that people liking WoW are already playing that.
While I disagree with maybe 50% of ANet’s decisions since launch, that design was rather clever. It was the major fault of many WoW-copycats, failing to realize that someone who likes WoW won’t drop their major investment there to play your exactly-the-same game.
So, be different, attract a wholly different crowd.
If they nerf FGS, then 100b must be nerfed as well. As that skill is HEAD AND SHOULDERS above the rest of the dps spectrum (apart from fgs). Same for axe (warrior) auto attack. Time to nerf 100b.
Oh wait, anet is biased towads warriors, can’t nerf them. They can’t even nerf, the most op leap in the game they have: Rush. Nerf RTL on squishy ele ok? Yes (anet). Nerf half cooldown, further moving leap with swiftness on warrior? No thanks. Yet warrior have best hp, armor in game + lot of condi removal/resistance + some of best healing skills in game.
This is so far out there I don’t even know why I’m replying.
100B dps is getting nerfed.
It’s not even close to what a staff camping ele can output.
It roots you in place.
Please stop asking for things that are obviously wrong.
That’s quite the assumption. Care to explain why you seem to be under the impression that I apparently want everything to be as easy as possible?
You don’t but most others sure do.
Because you do hard content once or twice for the sake of doing it and then you want your content to be easy and predictable so you can learn to quickly farm it and make the money you want.
Example :
Did I do Liadri ? Yes.
Did I like the fight? Sure.
Did I touch it again after getting the mini and achievement? You bet I didn’t.
Hard content will always be done and left alone unless it’s balanced with very good rewards – which they obviously don’t want to do ( See FOTM rewards) since then there’d be a pretty big discrepancy between what a good players can earn in terms of gold/day and what a not so good player can earn.
And apparently they don’t want to go down that road.
I didn’t even read the comments above me nor gonna bother, this is to OP.
The reason why fgs ruins pve is because the ONLY thing that keeps it competitive are records and tournaments.
EVERY record out there can be beaten with 4 ele’s and a 5th class for whatever ele’s can’t do.
That’s just bad and boring to watch.
Not to mention that unskilled players call themselves elite now due to being able to rush into a wall and kill a boss before 3 aegis’s run out.
The moment they’ll have to dodge more than twice in a record then that’s when we’ll see who can actually claim and hold records.
I miss the days when people knew how to do mossman normally….now all i see is bug him underwater or fgs, they don’t even know that you can do it normally.
Same story goes for so many other bosses and it’s just sad.
Also, you’re saying 100b will be new meta, with that 5% nerf it won’t be anywhere near it and the adrenaline nerf so just stop picking on warriors just cause your precious fgs will be useless aside from skipping trash in arah p2 now.
So yea nerfing and removing fgs from pve will make tournaments and records interesting to do AND watch again.
Can’t you guys read? 100b 5% damage nerf, is transfered to the 8th hit. So basically the nerf is neutralized by the end attack damage boost. The only time 100b is nerfed, is when not finished, but how hard is it in pve not to finish a 100b… not very hard no? Thus 100b pve damage is not nerfed. And even if you count the nerf 5% means nothing. Still head on shoulders above other dps. Same for axe auto attack chain.
+ F1 skill greatswod is getting massive boost. from seeing that 5k aoe damage in video it suggest 1,5-2,5% better overall damage and in aoe cone…. What’s to hate here.
only true nerf is adrenaline.
Btw i’m not against fgs nerf. If they make the 4-6 aoe fields into one (so you can’t stack 6x damage), then i’m ok with it. Try use FGS nr 4 (untargatted) on a non moving small mob. ONLY ONE FIELD will touch the mob. My best results so far with that is 4×950 damage per second. For an elite and a very temp skill (4 sec), that’s really not op. What we dont need, is the whole skill transferred into a useless leap (if you target mob as it is now). 1x 2k damage per 10 sec, is completely useless on ele. There’s tons of skills that do more damage then this. Elite unworthy.
It’s the 24*900 damage that must be nerfed. Nothing else. But knowing anet they will nerf it the wrong way (aka nerfing woth the field stacking + the base damage, making the skill superior useless).
(edited by Phoebe Ascension.8437)
FGs is nerfed because it’s pve dps meta. Nothing beats it. And they want to get rid of this meta. So what you think is gonna happen next? new meta. New nerf. 100b will be on the list (that is if Anet stops their bias towards it). If we already consider FGS nerfed (not worth to use anymore in speedruns), what do you think will be the dps meta? Anything other then 100b/axe warrior? Doubt it. Wich basically confirms it will be head and shoulder (like FGS is now) about rest of dps spectrum. Wich calls for a nerf (by Anet logic, not mine, i’m just following their logic, if something is a lot better then rest it has to be nerfed at all cost).
Can’t you guys read? 100b 5% damage nerf, is transfered to the 8th hit. So basically the nerf is neutralized by the end attack damage boost.
No its not. They are nerfing the earlier hits by 5% but the final hit will remain the same. Its an overall slight nerf. But its less than 5% thanks to the final hit remaining unchanged. The whirlwind nerf is a bit more substantial. I think its fairly reasonable considering how easy warrior is to play however.
Nike mentioned, that the warrior will lose 2,5% of his current dps
I’m looking forward to the FGS nerf,allthough I don’t think it gets much more interesting or harder. You just pick up less one ele , deal less dmg but you’ll be much safer, than a squishy 3-4 ele group. So it won’t be that big deal.
On the other hand, some new tactics will be interesting to build.
I just hope we won’t see now more virgin hammerguard -2 warrior – groups. To watch it was just like… no risk no fun
(edited by dominik.9721)
I don’t think anyone opposed to this change has considered that FGS isn’t inline with ‘reasonable’ damage output to other classes in the game. That alone is reason enough to change it, regardless of what risks/restrictions are associated with using it. It’s the same reason the crit chance got focused … as a way to maintain control over damage output. When something is in a league of it’s own, nothing can be done to balance it. It deserves the nerf.
(edited by Obtena.7952)
Wich calls for a nerf (by Anet logic, not mine, i’m just following their logic, if something is a lot better then rest it has to be nerfed at all cost).
That’s generally the logic of any game developer.
Positive outliers are to be nerfed, negative outliers are to be buffed. Baseline is either moved iteratively (by making the buffs/nerfs smaller/larger than they’d have to be), or moved indirectly by changing the target (in this case, PvE mobs).
Mind you, that changes the baseline (and yeah, we really need PvE changes). While plenty class mechanics would only start working once PvE AI is better, PvE mobs have an autoattack and dodge AEs and cleanse each other and health is adjusted, that would still make FGS 4 deal too much damage to targets near a wall compared to other ways to generate damage.
That’s why the two balance mechanics (baseline and outlier balancing) can exist independent of each other. One sets the target, the other tries to get everyone to perform according to it.
Question: Is the skill working as intended?
Answer: No.Question: Are people abusing the mechanic and it having unintended consequences?
Answer: Absolutely. It’s therefore an exploit.I honestly don’t know why we’re even arguing these facts. They’re facts. ANet tried to fix this in the past for WvW and PvP for these very reasons but Fiery Rush remains. The fact that it trivializes PVE or that PvE would be boring without these exploits is irrelevant.
You seem to be perfectly aware of what is intended or not, are you a dev by any chance?
Are you? Nub !
TIL Fgs is prefeclty fine and stacking up to 4 eles is healthy for the gameplay and is enjoyable.
Can’t you guys read? 100b 5% damage nerf, is transfered to the 8th hit. So basically the nerf is neutralized by the end attack damage boost. The only time 100b is nerfed, is when not finished.
The irony is killing me.
Produce the post that says 100b is going to have a buff on the last hit.
The livestream said it will remain the same. As in, 5% decrease for every hit -except- the last.
That’s a nerf. Y’wanted a nerf? there ya go.
Other laughs I had:
Nerf RTL on squishy ele ok?
some of best healing skills in game.
(edited by Azure The Heartless.3261)
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