Guild Wars 2

Elementalists:

• As some posters have said, if you want to improve Water Trident’s support, you need to increase its radius, and maybe but not necessarily the projectile speed too, first. As it is, the skill will rarely hit moving allies, making it poorer at support than as as self-heal.
• I want to say again that cleansing water trait, at its current state, is not working very well, nor will it get magically better by giving regen to Water Trident. Players won’t wait 5 seconds after switching to water to cast water trident. Players won’t pick this trait for the sake of a 20 second cooldown water trident. And more importantly, players won’t pick this trait to stack with many sources of regen, because the hidden cooldown is hard to track of, and makes the effect unreliable. This trait needs a revert more than anything, but if for some reason you feel you can’t do it, a 3 second cooldown would tone down the problem (it wouldn’t completely fix it, however).

Guardian – Like most (all?) here, I think Litany of Wrath is at odds with other meditations; it should be instant. If that seems too powerful, just tone it down a bit, say enough to make up with the GS healing trait.

Engineer – AED has similar problems; It is classified as a Gadget and yet there are almost no traits that affect this ‘skill’ group (plus the mechanics are wonky, even for a Gadget). The lack of traits alone can discourage many from taking this skill, when HT/MK/EH all have reasonable heals and are traitable (to various degrees). If there’s no possibility for a deep-look at Turrets this pass (hint!), then please consider re-working some of their traits to affect Gadgets instead.

General – I think it is extremely important that you release a new statement regarding where you intend to take the various classes’ roles. And not as some followup post in the patch notes, like last time: Please release a Dev Blog or schedule a series of vids that clearly define what the the roles will be for the classes (and, perhaps, the three game modes too!) after the upcoming changes. This will give us a much better ‘100 ft view’ of the situation, while still giving you the opportunity to keep specific plans close to your chest.

Sungak Alkandenes.1369:

General – I think it is extremely important that you release a new statement regarding where you intend to take the various classes’ roles. And not as some followup post in the patch notes, like last time: Please release a Dev Blog or schedule a series of vids that clearly define what the the roles will be for the classes (and, perhaps, the three game modes too!) after the upcoming changes. This will give us a much better ‘100 ft view’ of the situation, while still giving you the opportunity to keep specific plans close to your chest.

Yes, please!

Xaylin.1860:

Sungak Alkandenes.1369:

General – I think it is extremely important that you release a new statement regarding where you intend to take the various classes’ roles. And not as some followup post in the patch notes, like last time: Please release a Dev Blog or schedule a series of vids that clearly define what the the roles will be for the classes (and, perhaps, the three game modes too!) after the upcoming changes. This will give us a much better ‘100 ft view’ of the situation, while still giving you the opportunity to keep specific plans close to your chest.

Yes, please!

We’ve been asking what the Ranger is supposed to do for a year straight. I was surprised when they actually answered this question in the Ranger PvE blog they did. You know what the answer was? The Ranger is the GW2 pet class. That was their intended role. Who cares that the pet mechanic hasn’t actually worked for a year… it was still a pet class.

I would absolutely LOVE an overview of each class and what ANet feels their intended role was, if they’ve met their expectations, and in which way the class has fallen short.

There are too many players playing too few classes.
Warriors and Guardians are overpopulated (pvp and WvW)
Mesmers and Rangers are underpopulated.

Increasing the desirability of underplayed classes should be a key theme of the balance patch as should be reducing the desireability of overplayed classes.

the rangers’ sword rooting problem which design team promised to improve at live stream is missing, do you changed your mind or something?

cos I am badly expecting that change, too bad that I ignore all changes for ranger on note.

may I ask when will we have some more news about the changes programmed to be in the next balance patch?

Karl McLain.5604:

Profession Changes

[… stuff]

Warrior:
Our changes for warrior focus on providing telegraphs to stronger skills and to reduce the passive benefit gained from Healing Signet.

• Healing Signet: Reduced the passive heal by 8%.
  • We’re looking for ways to incentivize using Healing Signet’s active without increasing overall sustain. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this.
• Pin Down: Added a telegraph animation to the skill. Increased the cast time from 1/4 second to 3/4 second.

I have an idea for healing signet that harkens back to the GW1 roots:

Passive: heal x HP per second (whatever it is currently healing for), but take double damage from physical attacks (reduce toughness/ armor by x% or x magnitude).

Active: Heal (x * 16) over the next 8 seconds (should be about 6000, so about 1.2k a second), but turns off the double damage. (the reason for x* 16 over 8 seconds is if they take 20% off signets will increase the efficacy of the active).

In this setup the warriors gain no more sustainability, but turns off a negative of the passive. There is also 2 reasons to use the active since it gets rid of double damage and does not give less healing. This should also make some of the other warrior healing skills more appealing by giving healing signet a downside.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Can we have a balance patch where people see the necromancer as a class that people want to play, and not as a balance problem for the other classes?

Because I’d really like to play my necromancer. But my favorite class has slowly become more and more neutered, and less fun to play since release. Unbalances in PVE are enlarged by the complete pvp focus of the majority of the changes for the necromancer. So while in pvp it seems like the necromancer is slowly moving towards being more balanced, in PVE it seems exactly the opposite. The necromancer in PVE seems to be moving from inefficient, to down right bad.

Just what I wanted to say. I feel that I am being forced to play either the conditionmaster (don’t like it, hate the condition cap and always feel like every condition put on by my team mates is cutting my contribution to the fight) or play DS, and sorry I find that boring (only 5 abilities available and all have long cds).

Well I don’t really get the point of giving feedback here.
We get so little to discuss about …
It was said that there were tons of great other changes coming to ranger and others … but we aren’t allowed to see them.

So basically, this is like “hey we listen to your feedback but you can only talk about 20% of the update, for the rest, we don’t care about your opinion”

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

But we never see any dev in the necromancer forum. Do they even know it exists?

Not so long ago Mark Katzbach closed a thread. It’s still something.

Healing Signet active won’t be useful until it’s necessary to use it. So if the passive heal remains predominately better than the active, no warrior will use the active.

My suggestion:
Change the passive to healing on hit. Something where players can deprive the warrior to force the use of the active heal.

For example say the 8% reduction beings the heal to 350 hp/s.
The passive would be On hit receive 350 hp at a max rate 350 hp/s.
The the active could then be buffed accordingly and warriors would be achieving the same healing as long as they are able to stay in the fight. An attempt to run would no longer regenerate their hp without being proactive in a fight and the passive being on hit gives classes the chance to force the warrior to use the active be depriving hits while kiting.

A lot of classes are already like this and it would ultimately achieve the desired out come, placing an incentive to use the active.

Some time ago at the spvp forum, I was one of the people that defended that the main problem behind cantrips was the fact that all of them were stun breakers.

I still think this was a “problem”, but following the removal of stun breaking from the cantrips, I feel that it created more problems than it fixed. First, all cantrips were already designed around stunbreaking in mind, so they feel unnatural without it. Second, the compensation buffs done only make the problem with the ele’s near uncounterable instant burst worse (Lightning Flash), were not enough (cleansing fire’s CD), and might come at the risk of making the cantrip traits too strong (if, for example, cleansing fire or armor of earth ever get their CD further toned down someday).

It’s one of those situations where balancing came at the cost of fun. And I wonder, can’t there be a different approach? RTL, cleansing water’s trait cooldown, Mist Form’s utility skills lock-out and the removal of stun breaking from cleansing fire all contributed to removing depth and fun out of those effect, for the sake of “better” balance.

But I believe that different approaches can be taken, and for the cantrips specifically, I have identified another problem: there are way too many traits that promote bringing as many skills of the same utility type as possible. This, in my opinion, is not ontributing positively to this game’s balance, even though it more clearly defines the identity of builds. A spirit ranger is good because it stacks as many spirit traits and spirit skills as possible in a single build. Else, it wouldn’t be good. A triple cantrip ele is good for the same reasons, and so on for many other professions. This makes many utility skills individually bad, for the sake of not being too strong when stacked to the limit.

Looking back at cantrips, I wonder: was the problem the fact that all cantrips were stun breakers, or was the problem the fact that the game promoted triple cantrip builds way too much? Because, if the game promoted, say, a single cantrip or two per build only, all of them being stun breakers would not be a bad thing, would it? And so I wonder: was the problem the utility skills, or the traits?

I believe traits that affect utility skills need a different design approach. There should exist less traits that buff all skills that share the same type, and more traits that buff the next skill used of a specific type.

Let’s imagine the following scenario:

• Mist Form: functionality reverted so players can use utility skills while in mist again. Cooldown increased from 75 to 90 seconds to compensate.
• Cleansing Fire: functionality and cooldown reverted to previous state. 50 CD, stun breaker.
• Lightning Flash: functionality and cooldown reverted to previous state. 50 CD, stun breaker, less damage.

And now balancing the game under a new approach:

• Soothing Disruption trait: revamped.
  40 CD cooldown.
  The NEXT cantrip you use heals yourself (around 1500-2000), and applies 10 seconds of regeneration and vigor.

The “next” here being the KEY design factor.

It’s a mechanic that I also see used often in Magic: The Gathering, and it works wonders.

And so I ask you developers: wouldn’t the game be funnier this way?

Let’s think about it. Because this trait would only benefit a single cantrip this way, players would not feel “forced” to go triple cantrip when using it. This would open space for one or for two free utility slots. More so when we take into account that those traits would also exist for other utility types.

• Inscription (revamped)
  30-40 CD
  The NEXT glyph you use applies an aura on you depending on your attunement.
• Shard of Ice (revamped)
  15 CD cooldown
  The NEXT signet or arcane skill you use applies 5 stacks of vulnerability for 8 seconds, and 3 seconds of chill.

This would promote a lot of new, unique build combinations through a smart mix of different utility types, and the “triple cantrip – triple stun break” problem of old would no longe be a big problem. But what if players decided to still equip three cantrips? Well, they would still be weaker than the old overpowered cantrips, because they would no longer have access to the old soothing disruption + cleansing water trait combination.

Of course, traits that affect all of the same type would still exist (like cantrip mastery), but there would simply be less of them.

So, the main question I ask is, wouldn’t this bring back the fun and depth of some of the old skills, while keeping balance in check?

Better yet, it would tone down the problem with spamming. There would exist less boon spamming in this context, and as we look at other professions at a similar situation, the spamming problem would also be toned down. Even better, this could create new playstyles. For example, offensive Lightning Flash strategies would probably want to use LF a bit differently if they were to pick the new trait.

i just want more aoe on my mes. i wanna be more than a veilbot. remember that drege turret in eb? yeah something like that that deals dmg and does a short daze(def shorter than that turret). u know like a real aoe for a light armor class.
i would give anything for aoe that is not ai based. i would love to be less ai, less 1v1, less dueling and a little more light armor class like.
or at least give us an option to spec for ai less aoe for wvw. (btw would be great if rangers could do that too so their pet is not the main thing for them in wvw. ai in general is very bad in wvw) it would be soo much fun if i could contribute more than just the stupid veil and tw in wvw. u can actually remove veil too. im starting to really dislike this skill.
u know like necros can build without having minions, mes and rangers should be able to fight without the ai. ai is great and very very powerful in spvp, but in wvw it is terrible.
if u guys bring out new weapons, i’d like an aoe weapon. no 1v1. aoe only. like the necro has the staff with all the marks, the mes needs something like that.

I agree, ICDs on traits usually work much better because they don’t force “full commitment”. They are ok with just 1-2 such skills. They still work alright with more skills, sure. More stable results. But even just one can work out ok.

Sungak Alkandenes.1369:

I think it is extremely important that you release a new statement regarding where you intend to take the various classes’ roles. And not as some followup post in the patch notes, like last time: Please release a Dev Blog or schedule a series of vids that clearly define what the the roles will be for the classes (and, perhaps, the three game modes too!) after the upcoming changes. This will give us a much better ‘100 ft view’ of the situation, while still giving you the opportunity to keep specific plans close to your chest.

Exactly… I would say brillant.
Seriously this is exactly what we need.
If they do the job seriously (role for each profession on each game modes at a competitive level.) they will definitively acknowledge the need of major adjustments.
This is why I fear it won’t be done.

Shadowfall.6543:

Karl McLain.5604:

Profession Changes

[… stuff]

Warrior:
Our changes for warrior focus on providing telegraphs to stronger skills and to reduce the passive benefit gained from Healing Signet.

• Healing Signet: Reduced the passive heal by 8%.
  • We’re looking for ways to incentivize using Healing Signet’s active without increasing overall sustain. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this.
• Pin Down: Added a telegraph animation to the skill. Increased the cast time from 1/4 second to 3/4 second.

I have an idea for healing signet that harkens back to the GW1 roots:

Passive: heal x HP per second (whatever it is currently healing for), but take double damage from physical attacks (reduce toughness/ armor by x% or x magnitude).

Active: Heal (x * 16) over the next 8 seconds (should be about 6000, so about 1.2k a second), but turns off the double damage. (the reason for x* 16 over 8 seconds is if they take 20% off signets will increase the efficacy of the active).

In this setup the warriors gain no more sustainability, but turns off a negative of the passive. There is also 2 reasons to use the active since it gets rid of double damage and does not give less healing. This should also make some of the other warrior healing skills more appealing by giving healing signet a downside.

I’m not a warrior so keep that in mind as I say this. But the double damage idea is too much. As much as I would like to see healing signet useless, this would be absolute over kill. I don’t think added a debuff to a heal is ideal for any professions heal. Essentially, so proactive play needs to be added to the heal. As I’ve read countless times, HS is rewarding warriors without any skill or effort. Add that skill and effort by making it on hit instead of a steady per second. I am not familiar with every single professions healing options, however, I don’t know of any profession aside from warrior that is gaining hp/s without any proactive effort.

Shadowfall.6543:

Karl McLain.5604:

Profession Changes

[… stuff]

Warrior:
Our changes for warrior focus on providing telegraphs to stronger skills and to reduce the passive benefit gained from Healing Signet.

• Healing Signet: Reduced the passive heal by 8%.
  • We’re looking for ways to incentivize using Healing Signet’s active without increasing overall sustain. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this.
• Pin Down: Added a telegraph animation to the skill. Increased the cast time from 1/4 second to 3/4 second.

I have an idea for healing signet that harkens back to the GW1 roots:

Passive: heal x HP per second (whatever it is currently healing for), but take double damage from physical attacks (reduce toughness/ armor by x% or x magnitude).

Active: Heal (x * 16) over the next 8 seconds (should be about 6000, so about 1.2k a second), but turns off the double damage. (the reason for x* 16 over 8 seconds is if they take 20% off signets will increase the efficacy of the active).

In this setup the warriors gain no more sustainability, but turns off a negative of the passive. There is also 2 reasons to use the active since it gets rid of double damage and does not give less healing. This should also make some of the other warrior healing skills more appealing by giving healing signet a downside.

I actually dig this, Troll Unguent with a twist.

Stogzlol.4795:

Shadowfall.6543:

Karl McLain.5604:

Profession Changes

[… stuff]

Warrior:
Our changes for warrior focus on providing telegraphs to stronger skills and to reduce the passive benefit gained from Healing Signet.

• Healing Signet: Reduced the passive heal by 8%.
  • We’re looking for ways to incentivize using Healing Signet’s active without increasing overall sustain. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this.
• Pin Down: Added a telegraph animation to the skill. Increased the cast time from 1/4 second to 3/4 second.

I have an idea for healing signet that harkens back to the GW1 roots:

Passive: heal x HP per second (whatever it is currently healing for), but take double damage from physical attacks (reduce toughness/ armor by x% or x magnitude).

Active: Heal (x * 16) over the next 8 seconds (should be about 6000, so about 1.2k a second), but turns off the double damage. (the reason for x* 16 over 8 seconds is if they take 20% off signets will increase the efficacy of the active).

In this setup the warriors gain no more sustainability, but turns off a negative of the passive. There is also 2 reasons to use the active since it gets rid of double damage and does not give less healing. This should also make some of the other warrior healing skills more appealing by giving healing signet a downside.

I’m not a warrior so keep that in mind as I say this. But the double damage idea is too much. As much as I would like to see healing signet useless, this would be absolute over kill. I don’t think added a debuff to a heal is ideal for any professions heal. Essentially, so proactive play needs to be added to the heal. As I’ve read countless times, HS is rewarding warriors without any skill or effort. Add that skill and effort by making it on hit instead of a steady per second. I am not familiar with every single professions healing options, however, I don’t know of any profession aside from warrior that is gaining hp/s without any proactive effort.

When I wrote double damage that was a reference to the warriors in GW1, a % of toughness reduction or just a flat toughness reduction (say -500 toughness) would work. The Devs could do the math to figure out the best approach. The thing that matters is that having a relatively serious drawback to Healing signet, with an active to get rid of it would turn a passive ability into an active.

Now instead of never hitting that button the warrior would have to choose… hmm now that I have taken 10k damage should I use the active heal to keep me going or just duck and cover to wait things out. Now hitting the button is now an active choice, because hitting the button gives them the same healing power and faster, but with the knowledge that there is going to be some downtime of no heals.

Shadowfall.6543:

Stogzlol.4795:

Shadowfall.6543:

Karl McLain.5604:

Profession Changes

[… stuff]

Warrior:
Our changes for warrior focus on providing telegraphs to stronger skills and to reduce the passive benefit gained from Healing Signet.

• Healing Signet: Reduced the passive heal by 8%.
  • We’re looking for ways to incentivize using Healing Signet’s active without increasing overall sustain. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this.
• Pin Down: Added a telegraph animation to the skill. Increased the cast time from 1/4 second to 3/4 second.

I have an idea for healing signet that harkens back to the GW1 roots:

Passive: heal x HP per second (whatever it is currently healing for), but take double damage from physical attacks (reduce toughness/ armor by x% or x magnitude).

Active: Heal (x * 16) over the next 8 seconds (should be about 6000, so about 1.2k a second), but turns off the double damage. (the reason for x* 16 over 8 seconds is if they take 20% off signets will increase the efficacy of the active).

In this setup the warriors gain no more sustainability, but turns off a negative of the passive. There is also 2 reasons to use the active since it gets rid of double damage and does not give less healing. This should also make some of the other warrior healing skills more appealing by giving healing signet a downside.

I’m not a warrior so keep that in mind as I say this. But the double damage idea is too much. As much as I would like to see healing signet useless, this would be absolute over kill. I don’t think added a debuff to a heal is ideal for any professions heal. Essentially, so proactive play needs to be added to the heal. As I’ve read countless times, HS is rewarding warriors without any skill or effort. Add that skill and effort by making it on hit instead of a steady per second. I am not familiar with every single professions healing options, however, I don’t know of any profession aside from warrior that is gaining hp/s without any proactive effort.

When I wrote double damage that was a reference to the warriors in GW1, a % of toughness reduction or just a flat toughness reduction (say -500 toughness) would work. The Devs could do the math to figure out the best approach. The thing that matters is that having a relatively serious drawback to Healing signet, with an active to get rid of it would turn a passive ability into an active.

Now instead of never hitting that button the warrior would have to choose… hmm now that I have taken 10k damage should I use the active heal to keep me going or just duck and cover to wait things out. Now hitting the button is now an active choice, because hitting the button gives them the same healing power and faster, but with the knowledge that there is going to be some downtime of no heals.

I think Anets goal is to still make the heal desirable, but not OP. What you want would just make warriors use anything but Healing Signet. If they entirely remove the desire to use Healing Signet, warriors will just have one viable heal left; Healing Surge. So again, changing it so it’s not granting HP/s regardless of what the warrior is doing. No other class is granted this luxury. By making it heal on hit, warriors have the potential to still maintain the same level of healing they are currently getting if they can maintain attacks. Stuns, knock downs, knock backs, fears, kiting would effectively stop the warrior attacking for a duration in which the warrior wouldn’t be PASSIVELY receiving heals. In which case, the warrior would possibly be forced into using the active during a situation where the warrior isn’t able to maintain attacks to their target.

Sustained with a downside.

Mesmer iMage phantasm need a buff, atm torch is only good for its “presitge” attack. The phantasm is weak compared to other phantasm both in pve and pvp.

A better condition or a CC "daze, fear " etc would make up for its low dmg output.

DiogoSilva.7089:

Stuff

I don’t really like your ideas. They are working against interesting and controlled gameplay imo.

The cantrips don’t need to be reverted. Mist Form could use a lower CD + snare removal however. And when it comes to it, I would like to see Lightning Flash have a 30 sec CD with reduced/no damage and increased range to benefit the elementalist universally. Staff and focus could use a little mobility love. Anyhow..

I am mostly opposed to your trait ideas, as they promote too much randomness. Triggering of effects that is beyond your control is not a positive thing and doesn’t contribute to skillful play.
Instead of triggering effects randomly, try looking at ways to improve skills you activate as a player and preferrably without CDs, like Soothing Disruption and Spell Slinger. They are reliable in that they’ll trigger everytime you use a cantrip, making the effect a controlled action with no ‘chance factor’.

If you want people to use the Healing Signet active, you have to make the active use appealing. Right now you’re just making the passive less attractive, and the two things are not the same ( not saying you can’t do both to it. ) I’m doing the following math based on my own warrior ( 0/30/10/30/0 traits, Knight’s armor, Wurm runes, assassin trinkets, ) so the exact numbers aren’t universal. Also, I’m mainly a PvE player ( some WvW, no PvP. )

If you want to drop the passive regen, fine, but that still doesn’t give me reason to use the active ( Hmm, 20 seconds of no regen, so instead of losing 4600 net healing over that time, I only lose 4000? ) Healing Surge does 10k healing every 30 s, but we’re freaking out about Healing Signet doing 12K in that time just because it can’t be interrupted? Even the proposed changes will only drop the Signet to 11K in that time period, and it still can’t be interrupted, so what is that supposed to solve?

Healing Signet already has a decent counter: Poison. Poison applied by an 800 Condition Damage player drops the Signet to 265 healing while doing 164 damage. That 100 healing every second is minuscule compared to normal incoming damage ( not to mention other conditions like bleeding and especially burning. ) In these situations there’s absolutely NO incentive to trigger the signet for a paltry 3.2K heal ( 2.1K if under poison. )

If you want warriors to use the signet, put something on the active that’s useful in situations where you need burst healing.

• Have it remove two conditions in addition to the burst heal. Mending removes three and heals, Signet of Stamina removes all, so removing two conditions isn’t too much. Alternately, have it remove up to three conditions and burst heal dependent on the conditions removed, say 1K for each condition.
• Have it grant vigor for 5 – 10 seconds. If we’re losing our regen, then give us some extra dodging while we’re getting out of a tough spot. Vigor doesn’t stack with other endurance regen effects and you’re looking at revamping endurance and dodging here anyway, so it’s not like this can be abused for perma-dodging.
• Give it a stun break, perhaps in addition to the Vigor above. If you’re worried about abuse here, increase the cool down to 30 seconds.

Any of those changes, with or without the regen nerf, make it more attractive to actually use the Signet. But it seems like this is mainly a PvP problem, so why apply the “fix” to PvE as well? I agree, getting 400 hp / second makes it difficult for other players to win one-on-one. But in PvE, particularly big events, dungeons, and the like, even with the signet, a regen banner, Knight’s armor, and Wurm runes ( 2800 armor, 23K HP, ) I can still go down pretty fast because you’ve got legendaries and or hordes of swarmers pecking you to death. Same can happen in in the larger, crazier WvW battles where dodging all the layered AoE effects and condition fields is nigh impossible. If the problem is PvP/WvW Warriors that can soak up too much damage while dishing out it back out, then split the skill. Cut the WvW regen by 10% and the PvP by 20% if you want. But I’ve not seen the regen making me invulnerable in PvE, so I don’t think that’s the problem ( though I would like to see some different benefits on the active Signet other than a near meaningless burst heal. )

Now, for a bit of a rant, to all the people complaining about “set-it-and-forget-it” signets requiring “no skill,” get over yourselves. Just because someone doesn’t want to hit the 6 key every 20 seconds doesn’t mean they’re idiot players with no skill. You can teach a monkey to punch buttons and go through attack progressions, but that doesn’t make it “skill.” Skill is in the mind, not the fingers. Skill is seeing events and situations and being able to react and respond to it. Picking signets for their passive use means you’re limiting yourself in the number of skills you’re going to use, meaning you have to focus more on the few remaining skill slots you have. And in the case of Warriors, the Deep Strike trait rewards you for not activating signets. Really, this whole argument boils down to, “They’re not playing the game the way that I think it should be played, therefore they’re either cheap or a worse player than I am.” Grow up.

Being another condition clear is also the wrong thing to add to Healing Signet’s active. All that does is guarantee Mending never sees play at all. Warriors already have some of the best condition cleansing in the game (despite that supposedly being a weakness of them).

Equipment Elements ( crit damage, sigils, and runes. )
I don’t mind these changes provided they are handled well. The change in sigils I’m actually excited for. However the other two are tricky.

My biggest complaint with crit multipliers right now is when my characters get scaled down in level and their crit damage goes from 50% to 2% bonus while my crit chance stays the same. I’m not saying percentages have to stay the same for all levels ( though that would be nice, ) but such drastic changes hurt some character builds in the lower level dungeons where we can’t count as much on our burst damage. If Ferocity solves the scaling problems, I can work with it. Just remember some players spent a lot of time, effort, and money in getting berserker and assassin gear, and they’d be very upset if the gear becomes worthless. Also, when you samy damage output is lowered by 10%, do you mean crit damage is lowered, or all damage averaged out will be lowered?

As for Runes, I really want to know details on these changes. I don’t care for blanket statements saying you’re reworking them, I want to see numbers ( or ballpark figures, ) and I think a lot of other players do too. Again, like crit damage, some people put a lot of money into runes and would rather not see them fall apart.

Dodging, Endurance, and Vigor
You’ve mentioned that you’re reducing dodging across the board and I think that’s a mistake of thinking “one size fits all.” I think classes ought to have different scales of dodging ability based on their play style. Warriors and Guardians are meant to soak damage more than avoid it. Rangers, Thieves, and Mesmers are supposed to be mobile skirmishers and misdirection fighters so they should be able to dodge more often. Engineers and Necros are somewhere in between. Ele can be a difficult one to classify because they could be a dodger, or they could rely on their magic to prevent the damage. I think each class should have an endurance regen rates specific to the class. Then adjust armor and damage absorption to match. Those classes that are mobile should be more difficult to hit, but when they are it should hurt them substantially.

As for class changes:

Elementalist
I like these, but I still don’t think people will bother with Armor of Earth. Protection, stability, and stun break every 75 seconds is not terribly desirable. Cut the CD to 60 or increase the duration to 15 and we might have something here. Otherwise I’m perfectly content with my Arcane 20 Elemental Attunement that gives me protection every ~15 seconds.

I know some people have been asking for the Sandstorm to be a whirl finisher, but I think that Glyph of Storms should have combo potential for all four attunements:

• Firestorm – Fire field or projectile finisher
• Ice Storm – Ice field or projectile finisher
• Lightning Storm – Lightning field or blast finisher
• Sandstorm – Smoke field or whirl finisher.

Mesmer
I’ve no problem with Critical Infusion. You’re getting vigor half the time instead of all the time.

Jaron.8103:

- cut-

Except that poison would need a constant uptime to reduce the passive healing of the signet, compared to any other healing skill. Any other healing skill gets its heal dropped by even a second of poison, as long as it is applied just before the activation.
And it isn’t like warriors can’t easily remove that poison with cleansing ire…

Engineer
1. Move kit damage to ascended gear levels
2. Make Turrets “Assist” Player using his target
3. Combine traits in Explosions and Firearms to allow greater build diversity
4. Give Gadgets a second toolkit effect.
5. Toolkit abilities should remove 1 condition.
6. Standing in glue should give engineer stability.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Being another condition clear is also the wrong thing to add to Healing Signet’s active. All that does is guarantee Mending never sees play at all. Warriors already have some of the best condition cleansing in the game (despite that supposedly being a weakness of them).

Fair point on that. You could drop it a single condition removal, or keep it at two and remove the burst heal. Mending clears three, which in most cases is a complete purge.

Manuhell.2759:

Except that poison would need a constant uptime to reduce the passive healing of the signet, compared to any other healing skill. Any other healing skill gets its heal dropped by even a second of poison, as long as it is applied just before the activation.

Um, you’re saying it’s easier to time a 1 sec poison skill juuust before someone activates a heal skill than it is to hit a Warrior with any one of 5 – 10 sec poison skills and have the regen for those seconds almost nullified? Yeah, poison affects all heal skills, but the one-shots can also be fired off around poison durations. The regen is constant, so you can’t wait to kick it off right when the poison is gone. You’re acting like you have to have a permanent hard counter for everything, and that’s not necessary. With the number of direct poison skills and combo fields available to Rangers, Thieves, and Engineers, it’s not terribly difficult to nullify the regen long enough to either kill them or make them retreat.

Manuhell.2759:

And it isn’t like warriors can’t easily remove that poison with cleansing ire…

And it isn’t like you can’t just reapply it afterwards… Seriously, what’s the point of saying that? It’s like Magic:TG players complaining about a creature because it “still dies to Doom Blade.”

Jaron.8103:

Now, for a bit of a rant, to all the people complaining about “set-it-and-forget-it” signets requiring “no skill,” get over yourselves. Just because someone doesn’t want to hit the 6 key every 20 seconds doesn’t mean they’re idiot players with no skill. You can teach a monkey to punch buttons and go through attack progressions, but that doesn’t make it “skill.” Skill is in the mind, not the fingers. Skill is seeing events and situations and being able to react and respond to it. Picking signets for their passive use means you’re limiting yourself in the number of skills you’re going to use, meaning you have to focus more on the few remaining skill slots you have. And in the case of Warriors, the Deep Strike trait rewards you for not activating signets. Really, this whole argument boils down to, “They’re not playing the game the way that I think it should be played, therefore they’re either cheap or a worse player than I am.” Grow up.

There is a level of skill to use your heal properly in situations that warrior doesn’t have. The only skill to Healing Signet is using your mobility skills to make a run for it when the situation starts to get too hot.

Monkey’s can hit buttons, but they aren’t going to be successful in GW2 pvp hitting buttons.

Poisons are not a counter to HS. GS/LB 20/0/20/0/30 (includes cleansing ire), H/LB 0/20/20/0/30 (includes cleaning ire), S/S/LB 0/25/20/10/15, builds will vary more for condi warrior (includes cleansing ire). I don’t know if you’re catching on here, but all primary warrior builds are running cleaning ire for condi clear. Not to include utilities such as Signet of Stamina (total condi clear), Berserker Stance (8 second condi immune), Shake it off! (removes 1 condi, low cool down, can trait for more), how about running lysaa runes with Signet of Rage to include Tactics VI making it a 48 second CD for another total condi removal. These are all common among most or all warrior builds. Warriors should be the last class to complain about conditions and they are not at all a con for warriors.

Bottom line, I’m tired of bad warriors insulting the community and for some reason thinking warriors are hard. Warrior is the lowest skill capped class in PvP. When I play my warrior, the better portion of them in Solo and Team Q can’t bring my health below 90%. Warrior is inherently appealing and easy to play for new players. There is no problem with that. Healing Signet’s active still needs to be toned down or even a complete over haul of the ability.

Jaron.8103:

Um, you’re saying it’s easier to time a 1 sec poison skill juuust before someone activates a heal skill than it is to hit a Warrior with any one of 5 – 10 sec poison skills and have the regen for those seconds almost nullified? Yeah, poison affects all heal skills, but the one-shots can also be fired off around poison durations. The regen is constant, so you can’t wait to kick it off right when the poison is gone. You’re acting like you have to have a permanent hard counter for everything, and that’s not necessary. With the number of direct poison skills and combo fields available to Rangers, Thieves, and Engineers, it’s not terribly difficult to nullify the regen long enough to either kill them or make them retreat.

Like poison grenade and choking gas? Guess what, they’re getting nerfed with the balance patch, how strange.
And a warrior will never have anything near a permanent poison…

Jaron.8103:

And it isn’t like you can’t just reapply it afterwards… Seriously, what’s the point of saying that? It’s like Magic:TG players complaining about a creature because it “still dies to Doom Blade.”

…as he can just remove it afterward as well, even just with cleansing ire. Or all the ways described in the post above this.

For a class that should weak versus conditions by design, sure they’ve got many ways to deal with them.

Jaron.8103:

Um, you’re saying it’s easier to time a 1 sec poison skill juuust before someone activates a heal skill than it is to hit a Warrior with any one of 5 – 10 sec poison skills and have the regen for those seconds almost nullified? Yeah, poison affects all heal skills, but the one-shots can also be fired off around poison durations. The regen is constant, so you can’t wait to kick it off right when the poison is gone. You’re acting like you have to have a permanent hard counter for everything, and that’s not necessary. With the number of direct poison skills and combo fields available to Rangers, Thieves, and Engineers, it’s not terribly difficult to nullify the regen long enough to either kill them or make them retreat.

While you are right that not every skill needs a hard counter you got to expect people discussing a counter when you bring it into the discussion . The healing power of Healing Signet is a lot stronger than that of other heals and the fact that it can’t be interrupted is an issue although many people deny that.

When talking about Poison as a counter I got to agree with Manuhell. It is not true that Poison counters the Signet more than other heals. While it is very difficult to apply Poison just in the moment a heal is casted it is easy to predict when a heal will be used. Exactly. Heals are used when your health is low.

Other people already did the math. You need a 50% Poison uptime to bring the hps of Healing Signet down to Healing Surge. Meaning, even at 50% Poison up time Healing Signet will perform like Healing Surge without Poison without the need of being casted. Therefore, I personally do not feel that Healing Signet is weaker to Poison than other heals.

And as you said yourself: Only Engineers, Rangers and Thieves have the potential to keep up Poison that constantly. That’s 3 out of 8 classes. It only applies to specific weapon sets or utilities. And even if those classes can achieve a high Poison up time in certain builds and reapply it quite frequently the Warriors can also remove it very frequently making an +50% uptime difficult. Poison does help against but does not counter the Signet.

‘Poison counters Healing Signet’ is constantly mentioned for justifying the over the top HPS and functionality of the Healing Signetalthough it is far from being true. I do think that the active needs a buff but I really doubt that the 8% nerf to the passive is a sufficient solution.

Stogzlol.4795:

…

<3

Thank you for taking that entire post, fixating on one thing, and completely ignoring the rest.

Stogzlol.4795:

There is a level of skill to use your heal properly in situations that warrior doesn’t have. The only skill to Healing Signet is using your mobility skills to make a run for it when the situation starts to get too hot.

You’re neglecting the fact using the Signet means you’re foregoing more robust healing skills that can do more than just regen, such as refill adrenaline, purge conditions, or act as a damage inverter. It does affect the rest of your gameplay. You’re also implying that healing skills in other professions are inherently more difficult to pull off correctly. Do you have quantifiable evidence that this is the case? You want to claim one or the other is better. I simply say they’re differing methods with each offering its own list of pros and cons.

Stogzlol.4795:

Poisons are not a counter to HS. GS/LB 20/0/20/0/30 (includes cleansing ire), H/LB 0/20/20/0/30 (includes cleaning ire), S/S/LB 0/25/20/10/15, builds will vary more for condi warrior (includes cleansing ire). I don’t know if you’re catching on here, but all primary warrior builds are running cleaning ire for condi clear. Not to include utilities such as Signet of Stamina (total condi clear), Berserker Stance (8 second condi immune), Shake it off! (removes 1 condi, low cool down, can trait for more), how about running lysaa runes with Signet of Rage to include Tactics VI making it a 48 second CD for another total condi removal. These are all common among most or all warrior builds. Warriors should be the last class to complain about conditions and they are not at all a con for warriors.

Congratulations, you’ve shown that Cleansing Ire is a good response to condition application. And? Did I complain that Warriors had poor condition removal? Did I not already agree the regen was problematic in PvP? Did I not explicitly state that I played almost exclusively PvE and was offering my opinions from that specific viewpoint?

Stogzlol.4795:

Bottom line, I’m tired of bad warriors insulting the community and for some reason thinking warriors are hard.

Three things here. One, you’re assuming, or at least inferring, that I am a “bad warrior.” Two, you’re saying I’m insulting the community. Three, you’re saying I’m claimed playing Warrior is hard. In regards to the first, that may be your opinion, but the second and third are blatantly false as I did neither of those things.

Altogether that’s a wonderful double standard you have there. You insult other players, call them bad, and that’s fine, dandy. But the second they retaliate suddenly their behavior is unacceptable? Nice . . .

Take a break guys, we’re on the same side here (hope Anet is too)!!!!

Anyway, as far as we know, we’re just speculating here. I would like to have more often some sort of feedback from the guys of Anet, at least letting us know if some of us really came up with workable ideas.

Having a moderator popping in from time to time only to say “Hey guys! Nice ideas, keep it up!” isn’t enough for me: which are the good ideas you mentioned? Point them out so we can focus on debating about these propositions and, maybe, give a little constructive help! Having tons of people generating and discussing new ideas can be inspiring, even if most of us haven’t got the technical expertise devs have.

We’re brainstorming for free, hope it helps in someway cause by now it seems to me we’re just talking to each other.

Malcastus.6240:

DiogoSilva.7089:

Stuff

I don’t really like your ideas. They are working against interesting and controlled gameplay imo.

The cantrips don’t need to be reverted. Mist Form could use a lower CD + snare removal however. And when it comes to it, I would like to see Lightning Flash have a 30 sec CD with reduced/no damage and increased range to benefit the elementalist universally. Staff and focus could use a little mobility love. Anyhow..

I am mostly opposed to your trait ideas, as they promote too much randomness. Triggering of effects that is beyond your control is not a positive thing and doesn’t contribute to skillful play.
Instead of triggering effects randomly, try looking at ways to improve skills you activate as a player and preferrably without CDs, like Soothing Disruption and Spell Slinger. They are reliable in that they’ll trigger everytime you use a cantrip, making the effect a controlled action with no ‘chance factor’.

Hello Malcastus.

I understand your reasons, but I don’t think I’ve ever implied that those effects should be triggered randomly. I dislike randomized effects too. The idea behind my suggestions was to promote more builds that use more than a single skill type, and if the cooldown of the trait is not higher than the utility skill itself, it will always trigger.

I can understand that it might feel more unreliable when you pick those kind of traits and more than one utility skill of the affected type, but at their current state, when there exists way too many traits that affect all skills of a specific utility type, then it creates balancing problems, and in order to keep the entire build viable, the utility skills are usually – and have been – nerfed.

For example, cleansing fire is good when you have all cantrip traits equipped, but it’s rather crappy by itself since the stun breaker was removed. 3 condi-cleansing every 40 seconds is almost irrelevant in a meta that can fill you with over 5 conditions every few seconds. And even regardless of meta, it’s unflexible because you can only use it against condi builds now – while it used to be more flexible before. However, anet will have a really hard time buffing this skill, if they ever do, because it comes at the risk of making a fully-traited CF too strong.

In other words, too many traits like those pidgeonhole those utility skills to very specific builds, and keep them underwhelming everywhere else. By decreasing how many traits like those exist, the skills themselves are free to become a bit stronger, and be used in more builds more often.

First, thank you for a direct, rational reply. I honestly appreciate it.

Xaylin.1860:

While you are right that not every skill needs a hard counter you got to expect people discussing a counter when you bring it into the discussion . The healing power of Healing Signet is a lot stronger than that of other heals and the fact that it can’t be interrupted is an issue although many people deny that.

I’ve never once said the regen isn’t problematic in PvP. And if you read my first post, you’ll also see I already said simply dropping the regen 8% doesn’t address the interrupt issue so it won’t fix much of anything.

Xaylin.1860:

And as you said yourself: Only Engineers, Rangers and Thieves have the potential to keep up Poison that constantly. That’s 3 out of 8 classes. It only applies to specific weapon sets or utilities. And even if those classes can achieve a high Poison up time in certain builds and reapply it quite frequently the Warriors can also remove it very frequently making an +50% uptime difficult. Poison does help against but does not counter the Signet.

I didn’t mean to say poison is a hard, absolute counter to the Signet. If that’s how it came off, I’ll correct myself. I meant it to mean that all other things being equal, poison does a good job of negating signet when you also figure in normal damage from other attacks and other conditions. As you say, those three classes need specific focus on poison to keep it up. But isn’t it also true that it takes a fairly specific build of Warrior to continually purge the condition?

Xaylin.1860:

‘Poison counters Healing Signet’ is constantly mentioned for justifying the over the top HPS and functionality of the Healing Signetalthough it is far from being true. I do think that the active needs a buff but I really doubt that the 8% nerf to the passive is a sufficient solution.

Again, I’m not defending the Signet as is in PvP. I’ve never done so. And I’ve also said that dropping the regen by 8% will not address much of anything.

Elementalist

STAFF…

Fireball: +10% damage
Frozen ground: Chilled 3sec (basic)
Lightning surge: Cast time 1 seconds
Eruption: Cast time 1 seconds

SCEPTER…
Dragon’s tooht: Can be used without target
Shatterstone: Esplodes after 1,5 seconds
Lightning: Daze 1/4 seconds
Hurl: Immobilize 1 seconds

FOCUS…
Flamewall: Cast time 1/2
Comet: Cast time 1/2
Gale: CD 45 seconds

UTILITY…
Glyph of renewal: CD 150 seconds
Singet of fire: Cast time 1/2 seconds
Signet of water: Cast time 1/2 seconds

TRAIT…
Conjured: Additional charges 15
Burning precision: CD 1 seconds
One with air: Totally useless. To be redone

Sorry, but with these changes you get improvements in light use weapons little used. Also some skills become decent … as Hurl, I find it absurd that stick has 2 CC of Air … and 0 on Heart staff. In addition, the portion One with air and totally useless … can anyone talk?

Google translator

By improving the time cast of some abilities, increases the survival of the elementalist without go to modify HP, strokes etc. … of course this does not solve all the problems … but at least all the weapons become more playable.

Sorry, but with these changes you get improvements in light use weapons little used. Also some skills become decent … as Hurl, I find it absurd that stick has 2 CC of Air … and 0 on Heart staff. In addition, the portion One with air and totally useless … can anyone talk?

Jaron.8103:

Thank you for taking that entire post, fixating on one thing, and completely ignoring the rest.

I forgot to include this. “Picking signets for their passive use means you’re limiting yourself in the number of skills you’re going to use, meaning you have to focus more on the few remaining skill slots you have.” Lol

Jaron.8103:

You’re neglecting the fact using the Signet means you’re foregoing more robust healing skills that can do more than just regen, such as refill adrenaline, purge conditions, or act as a damage inverter. It does affect the rest of your gameplay.

Soooo… You think Mending, 5,915 HP and 3 Condi’s on a 20 Second CD has something on Healing Signet? No. Just no. Healing Surge, gives about 2,000 less healing per 30 seconds. Also, that’s only if you save you’re adrenaline to heal which semi eliminates the usefulness of cleansing ire. Again, no. Defiant Stance, sorry, I’m just going to laugh the fact you said it.

Jaron.8103:

You’re also implying that healing skills in other professions are inherently more difficult to pull off correctly. Do you have quantifiable evidence that this is the case?

Not being able to heal under crowd control, cast times, interruptions, and the practice of avoiding damage since we don’t have a constant heal flowing regardless if we are running away.

Jaron.8103:

You want to claim one or the other is better. I simply say they’re differing methods with each offering its own list of pros and cons.

I’m sorry, are you trying to tell anyone on this forum Healing Signet has a heal that is near competitive to the amount of healing received and how it’s received?

Jaron.8103:

Healing Signet already has a decent counter: Poison. Poison applied by an 800 Condition Damage player drops the Signet to 265 healing while doing 164 damage. That 100 healing every second is minuscule compared to normal incoming damage ( not to mention other conditions like bleeding and especially burning. ) In these situations there’s absolutely NO incentive to trigger the signet for a paltry 3.2K heal ( 2.1K if under poison. )

“800 Condition Damage player” I’m sorry I didn’t realize NPC’s were refereed to as “players.” I also wasn’t aware Anet released data such as this NPC has 800 condition damage, in fact, I’m pretty sure they don’t. So this comment is taken in relation to PvP. Additionally, you stated “Healing signet has a decent counter: Poison” I argued it wasn’t with a trait that is not skipped in any warriors build.

Jaron.8103:

Three things here. One, you’re assuming, or at least inferring, that I am a “bad warrior.”

I haven’t met a good warrior who defends Healing Signet.

My suggestion would be to stay very liberal with the way amulets work in sPVP!

1) Let them be items where people can spend points with certain restrictions:

How should this work now:

Stat’s can be maxed to the same value like the ones that already exist in this system.

But you don’t have to spend so much if you don’t like. I, for my part, would create a system comparable to the Gw1 system where it gets more and more expensive the more you put into one stat!

Btw, add condition duration as a counterpart to ferocity… i can’t believe how zerker’s should get the option to max their effect but condition classes can’t do so using the amulet.

What are you afraid of people?

If someone wants to go full support let him do so for god sake!

This system would be really transparent compared to the current one and would also encourage more people to think about what they actually want to achieve with their character.

Cheers,
Nachtfuchs

I don’t understand why the defense to HS is to always use poison to negate its affect. Not all classes have access to poison to do that so that recommendation/argument is invalid. That and the fact that the heal itself is passive and can’t be interrupted is a huge deal because that means it starts its heal right when the warrior is damaged. No other class has that and the fact that the other signet heals require clones up, per cast, per attack hit means that they are already inferior to the HS design. So why should warriors get the laziest heal in the game and make all the other classes work for their sustain?

The only recommendation I can make or support is that HS becomes on hit so that it’s on par with the other signet heals. If Anet is hellbound on keeping it passive I’d say make the passive increase per adrenaline level such as:

Stage 1: 200 HP/s
Stage 2: 300 HP/s
Stage 3: 400 HP/s

That way if combined with cleansing ire/adrenal health/blahblah wars would have to decide weather they want to take that HP/s hit for the condition cleanse. So that at least that would be the drawback to it instead of none, which it currently has. Also the adrenaline gain altogether would have to be adjusted since it’s way too easy to obtain.

Jaron.8103:

First, thank you for a direct, rational reply. I honestly appreciate it.

You’re welcome.

Jaron.8103:

I didn’t mean to say poison is a hard, absolute counter to the Signet. If that’s how it came off, I’ll correct myself. I meant it to mean that all other things being equal, poison does a good job of negating signet when you also figure in normal damage from other attacks and other conditions. As you say, those three classes need specific focus on poison to keep it up. But isn’t it also true that it takes a fairly specific build of Warrior to continually purge the condition?

I didn’t take it that way . But some people behave like Poison is the miracle solution to overcome the Healing Signet. It is not. In practice the Healign Signet simply is at no disadvantage when compared to other heals like proposed by others.

Yes, it is not impossible to overcome the HPS of a Healing Signet. And of course, there are other sources of damage. However, this also is the case for other heals which just happen to have a lower HPS and can be interrupted. It still leaves the Healing Signet as the winner.

The odds of encountering perma Poison is pretty low because of the availability across classes. Additionally, the respective classes are forced to bring specific weapons making it even more unlikely. Because of the condition heavy meta Warriors are likely to have condition removal anyway. Always. Of course, you could argue that Warriors are forced to take 20 Defense and one or two specific utilities. But that still leaves them with a lot of flexibility trait, weapon and utility-wise. While a specific rudimentary set up is very common there is a rather small limitation when it comes to build diversity of the Warrior. And this rudimentary set up is kitten good. Even if they encounter perma Poison a Warrior will be well equipped to survive it.

But yet again: Poison is no ‘counter’ for the Healing Signet. It is at no real disadvantage when compared to other heals. Discussing the availability and counterability of (perma) Poison when using the Healing Signet is a bit mood. It simply doesn’t make the difference some people believe it does.

Dhuumfire change is long overdue, but Incendiary Powder (engy trait) does the exact same thing and is more accessible, so it needs to be changed as well. Introduce some reliable activation for the user and opportunity for counterplay for the opponent in the same manner that your change for Dhuumfire should bring.

I have just about given up on ANet’s ability to balance the Thief class. I hope you can surprise me with whatever Thief-related change you’re not ready to talk about with the next patch, but I’m keeping expectations low…

Change the horrible Elemental trait Burning Precision while you are at it. It is a Burn on crit trait as well, although it is a very weak one.

Whatever changes Eles end up getting need to accomplish the following:

1) Enable the Ele to fulfill a role—ANY role—in SPvP. At the moment, it is outclassed tremendously by the other professions at bunkering (Guardian/Warrior), roaming (Thief), team fighting (Necromancer/Spirit Ranger/Engineer), and 1v1ing on nodes (Mesmer/Thief/Engineer/Necromancer) to name a few roles. An Ele needs to be babysat by a teammate at all times, because he will melt very quickly when focused—and he will almost always be the prime target once noticed. As it stands, he is more of a liability than an asset to his team, plain and simple. It’s not enough to say “Oh, but Ele is the jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none class”; that will ensure that the Ele never again sees the light of competitive play again. Heck, Engineers and, hilariously, Warriors fulfill the jack-of-all-trades role a heck of a lot better at the moment.

2) Enable an Ele to reliably spec for damage without losing every single bit of defense, or conversely to reliably spec for defense without sacrificing all offensive potential. Eles have been pigeonholed into Water/Arcana/Cantrips for far too long, with mediocre results. They need better INHERENT defensive mechanics that do not require heavy Trait investment to function to begin with. Sure, make these mechanics (whatever they end up being) improve with Traiting, but don’t make them dependent on Traiting to even be useful.

I know this was lacking in the details department, but I think it still needs to be said.

Two more ideas for thief to give back some of the utility of S/D and S/P thieves and hopefully reduce some of the FS/LS spam.

1) Revert LS to steal 2 boons, but reduce the damage to a (.65) or (.5) multiplier. In this manner, thieves would have to use the AA chain to deal damage and using the FS/LS chain would interrupt the chain which would not let the thief reach full damage. This would cause the thief to have to use regular dodges to not reset the chain as well. Hopefully this would cut down on the #3 spam.

2) Revert infiltrators return to instant cast, but reduce the return range to 600 and leave the rollover only available for 7-10 seconds. This would allow for some of the previous juking that could be done with the thief, bringing it in line with illusionary leap/swap but without giving it the stunbreak and leap finisher.

P Fun Daddy.1208:

style.6173:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

style.6173:

Insanity.5174:

Elementalist.
Again the proof that you don’t want to hear a kitten about this class.

Thousands of topics about :
Revert the Ride The Lightning nerf.
Revert Cleansing water trait nerf.
Revert Cleansing wave trait nerf.
Revert Elemental Attunement trait nerf.
Buff Focus skills.
Buff Arcane shield,3 blocks every 75 seconds,wow.
Buff Glyphs.
Buff Signets.
Changing lingering elements trait because is useless.
Conjurer weapons like engi’s kits.
Buff Arcane Precision.grandmaster trait,wow.

You have NEVER talked about buffing any of this things,ty,really.

8% healing signet nerf,seriously?
how is possibile playing against a warrior that heals 1k every second.
how is possibile playing against a thief s/d that makes to you 3k-4k of autoattack,perma evades.
After 1 year of this stupid meta and after this “balance” notes i understand that there are no hopes for this game about pvp,do what you want with your broken game,i’m out like others already did it.

Don’t forget about the other side of ele changes that are needed as well. There needs to be an AOE circle for meteor shower and it needs to do less damage.

I agree eles need buffs, but they also need the two changes above as well.

They are removing tornado+meteor shower, you can stop complaining about it now.

You see that where?

and that still doesn’t resolve the no circle issue. Anyway, this skill is fine in WvW and PvE, but needs a nerf in conquest. It takes zero still to sit far away and launch meteor shower against someone who is defending a point.

I agree that it needs a circle, but the only use the skill has in sPVP is to force people off a point for seven seconds. It’s hardly overpowered.

Except in a team fight it means you lose the point. That means meteor shower is OP.

Dalanor.5387:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RwKNkwcEZo

Yeap very informative, devs have it so right……….

Over all this balance patch is a buff to sigils/ runes (maybe a great nerf to over all rune usage) and nerf/minor change to every class but elementalist. Too bad it leaves the game stale but I guess we can play around with various new combinations of sigils and current specs, while we wait for actually pvp/ pve content to come along rather than fillers mostly from pve.