Guild Wars 2

Imo the health pool is wayyyyy too low.
Warrior – same armor, more mobility and more health?
when looking at the base health without adding vit armor, guardians have 11k health, and warriors about 20k.
With such a low mobility that guards got, what makes up for the low health pool?
I think its just unbalanced, and guards need atleast 15k base health, otherwise its just a joke for a meele without much mobility to have such a low healthpool.
just my opinion, what do you guys think?

I wouldn’t mind guardians getting some buff to their healthpool size. I think if they were in the 15k healthpool tier they would have a few more builds opened up to them that would allow for better build diversity (that applies to any class though really). Guards can do just fine at their current healthpool though, so buffing their healthpool could end up making them too strong and subsequently make them nerf worthy. It would be interesting to see how buffing their healthpool would work out.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/Base-HP-Why-the-differences/page/2#post3867164

Had a decent discussion going on this. The tier of health pools are ok, but the drastic differences between the min and max is a big issue. It basically makes certain stat sets to be far better than others for that profession, which does not promote build diversity.

godz raiden.2631:

I wouldn’t mind guardians getting some buff to their healthpool size. I think if they were in the 15k healthpool tier they would have a few more builds opened up to them that would allow for better build diversity (that applies to any class though really). Guards can do just fine at their current healthpool though, so buffing their healthpool could end up making them too strong and subsequently make them nerf worthy. It would be interesting to see how buffing their healthpool would work out.

Saying that guards got good survivability is a lie, yeah sure… if you spend all your traits on tough and vit maybe a nice survivablity, but what if we want abit different build,
Guardians long range weapons are bad, the mobility isnt there, warriors got more cc removal, Warrior is better than guardian almost in every aspect, when you look at guards downsides you realise that its the class with the most downsides.
The real OP unkillable is Warrior with regen build, got nice dmg, with regen of over 1k hp every 3 sec, and can have 30k hp+, while guard will be with same tough, much less healing over time, and yeah dmg kind of same with 20k hp only.
Yeah well mesmers and ele obviously got low health pool, they are long ranged, but guard is close range and you have to chase down enemies, ele will just run away spamming condi dmg on the way and you got nothing much to do with such low healthpool.

If you want moar health, ArenaNet has introduced a fantastic new GM trait : +3k hp, yay. Otherwise http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Barbarian%27s_Amulet.

Guardians are actually pretty good.

ProRulez, if you think elementalist are ranged, you should play one :

-main dagger ele (d/d or d/f) is not ranged at all
-scepter ele needs to come close range to burst, otherwise it doesn’t deal that much damage
-staff ele is ranged but gets eaten by anything with teleports or ranged attacks

Oh actually nevermind, I just read the end of your message “ele will just run away spamming condi damage on the way”…condi eles, yay xDD

That alone conveys that you are quite clueless because condition elementalist is not a thing ^^

Uhtameit.2413:

If you want moar health, ArenaNet has introduced a fantastic new GM trait : +3k hp, yay. Otherwise http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Barbarian%27s_Amulet.

Guardians are actually pretty good.

ProRulez, if you think elementalist are ranged, you should play one :

-main dagger ele (d/d or d/f) is not ranged at all
-scepter ele needs to come close range to burst, otherwise it doesn’t deal that much damage
-staff ele is ranged but gets eaten by anything with teleports or ranged attacks

Oh actually nevermind, I just read the end of your message “ele will just run away spamming condi damage on the way”…condi eles, yay xDD

That alone conveys that you are quite clueless because condition elementalist is not a thing ^^

Yeah i didnt play ele personaly, my brother did, ofc i was over saying it just to make the point, but my brother had the ele setup you said, that is not ranged, you have lots of mobility. so will be no prob to run away.
Is there any WvW PVE version of this amulet/ power-pre-vit stats?

ProRulez.5207:

godz raiden.2631:

I wouldn’t mind guardians getting some buff to their healthpool size. I think if they were in the 15k healthpool tier they would have a few more builds opened up to them that would allow for better build diversity (that applies to any class though really). Guards can do just fine at their current healthpool though, so buffing their healthpool could end up making them too strong and subsequently make them nerf worthy. It would be interesting to see how buffing their healthpool would work out.

Saying that guards got good survivability is a lie, yeah sure… if you spend all your traits on tough and vit maybe a nice survivablity, but what if we want abit different build,
Guardians long range weapons are bad, the mobility isnt there, warriors got more cc removal, Warrior is better than guardian almost in every aspect, when you look at guards downsides you realise that its the class with the most downsides.
The real OP unkillable is Warrior with regen build, got nice dmg, with regen of over 1k hp every 3 sec, and can have 30k hp+, while guard will be with same tough, much less healing over time, and yeah dmg kind of same with 20k hp only.
Yeah well mesmers and ele obviously got low health pool, they are long ranged, but guard is close range and you have to chase down enemies, ele will just run away spamming condi dmg on the way and you got nothing much to do with such low healthpool.

You’re sounding oddly bent out of shape about me saying guardians have good survivability. I’m not wrong. They do. You have access to a lot of healing, blocking, vigor for dodge rolling, invulnerability, aegis, and boons. There’s a reason guardian and warrior don’t have exactly the same strengths: diversity.

Also, not sure why you are grouping mesmers and eles into the same “low hp” healthpool bracket. Lowest Tier = Ele, Guard, Thief / Middle Tier = Engineer, Mesmer, Ranger / Highest Tier = Necro, Warrior.

You can’t expect every class to have the same access to mobility and range (which seems to be your biggest concern, despite the title of this thread). Even if guards had a larger healthpool, it wouldn’t make much of a difference if you’re dying due to being kited.

Using elementalist really isn’t a good idea, yes they have more mobility but they have a healthpool just as low as the guardians’. The lack of mobility could be justified by the heavy armor (not to be neglected, a glass guardian with meditation will usually have 2k4 armor while a glass ele will have 1k8 armor) plus the many ways guardian possesses to nullify bursts (Renewed Focus, Shield of Wrath, Shelter).

godz raiden.2631:

ProRulez.5207:

godz raiden.2631:

I wouldn’t mind guardians getting some buff to their healthpool size. I think if they were in the 15k healthpool tier they would have a few more builds opened up to them that would allow for better build diversity (that applies to any class though really). Guards can do just fine at their current healthpool though, so buffing their healthpool could end up making them too strong and subsequently make them nerf worthy. It would be interesting to see how buffing their healthpool would work out.

Saying that guards got good survivability is a lie, yeah sure… if you spend all your traits on tough and vit maybe a nice survivablity, but what if we want abit different build,
Guardians long range weapons are bad, the mobility isnt there, warriors got more cc removal, Warrior is better than guardian almost in every aspect, when you look at guards downsides you realise that its the class with the most downsides.
The real OP unkillable is Warrior with regen build, got nice dmg, with regen of over 1k hp every 3 sec, and can have 30k hp+, while guard will be with same tough, much less healing over time, and yeah dmg kind of same with 20k hp only.
Yeah well mesmers and ele obviously got low health pool, they are long ranged, but guard is close range and you have to chase down enemies, ele will just run away spamming condi dmg on the way and you got nothing much to do with such low healthpool.

You’re sounding oddly bent out of shape about me saying guardians have good survivability. I’m not wrong. They do. You have access to a lot of healing, blocking, vigor for dodge rolling, invulnerability, aegis, and boons. There’s a reason guardian and warrior don’t have exactly the same strengths: diversity.

Also, not sure why you are grouping mesmers and eles into the same “low hp” healthpool bracket. Lowest Tier = Ele, Guard, Thief / Middle Tier = Engineer, Mesmer, Ranger / Highest Tier = Necro, Warrior.

You can’t expect every class to have the same access to mobility and range (which seems to be your biggest concern, despite the title of this thread). Even if guards had a larger healthpool, it wouldn’t make much of a difference if you’re dying due to being kited.

I accidently typed mesmer instead of thief beacause i was think of the mobility while typing about the health pool.
anyway, maybe this is all feeling like this beacause warrior is just way too OP in all matters.

Guardians are rly OP.

They are apex 1v1 when played well, with great mobility and much more team fight synergy than a warrior. If this game gets competitive again you’ll see players run them.

Perdix.8641:

Guardians are rly OP.

They are apex 1v1 when played well, with great mobility and much more team fight synergy than a warrior. If this game gets competitive again you’ll see players run them.

They’re great 1v1, but they are not apex, they lose ground/control when they get condi overloaded or stunlocked/CC’d, or swarmed. They have alright combat mobility and even decent mobility with GS/S+X. If this was a troll post though you got me. If not well bolded is wrong. :P

Perdix.8641:

Guardians are rly OP.

They are apex 1v1 when played well, with great mobility and much more team fight synergy than a warrior. If this game gets competitive again you’ll see players run them.

Are you for real? And that’s an honest question….guardians OP 1 v1 ? Man, the lack of knowledge on these forums, especially when it comes to guardians is amazing.

Look, guardians are decent in PVE. They are good in WvW zerg warfare because we can support really well, especially with AH. Same with bunker guardians, when there are other team mates around to benefit from our boons and our might stacking AH.

But…..1 v 1 we are sub par. Bunker do hardly any damage and depend on retaliation. In order to do damage we have to go meditation. But we have no soft cc so we can be easily kited. Also, our low HP as a med guard makes us prone to condis. We can take condi removal utilities, but then we lose gap closers and extra damage. Anet decided to give us an extra 3000 HP in the Honor line, but of course med guards don’t go all the way down the Honor line so that doesn’t make sense.

For some reason Anet wants dps guards to go condi, but of course we only have one condi (burn) and that will never work.

That’s the truth of the matter….we are pigeon holed into bunker and support. If you want to dps/roam as a guardian you are much better off playing a warrior.

Maybe you should use scepter on your medi guard.

I play both guardian and warrior in both zerging as roaming. And I have multiple builds for both, ranging from zerker to full on tank. And I can say without a doubt in my mind that guardian is more tanky than a warrior in both zerging as roaming. Way easier to survive on a guardian than a warrior.

There is a big health difference, but healthpool only brings you so far, if you can’t heal it back up than it is useless. And guardians still heal way better than a warrior.

There is a new grandmaster trait coming for guardian that gives you 3k bonus health, you have to give up some healing for it, but that seems fair to me. Buffing their base health to 12k would be for me the maximum as guardian already is such a powerful class.

Health pool is a very small piece of the puzzle. godz raiden has the right of it: Guardians are very survivable even with their small pool. What makes up for the small health pool:

Abundant protection availability
Decent stability availability
Abundant Aegis/Block
Strong condi cleanse
Strong healing
Multiple Blind sources

Chaining Blind + Aegis/Block + Protection is a really strong offensive for Sword+Focus/Greatsword Guardians. I’ve fought a few, and it’s very good in 1v1, at least against the build I run around with.

I don’t see why they need more health. I also don’t think giving them more health will give them more build diversity, as I’d think the strong builds would just get stronger. Though maybe they wouldn’t get strong enough to put them out of whack while giving a group of others the boost they need. I have a difficult time arguing for giving Guards more survivability, though. And I really think this “low HP” argument is the silliest thing ever.