Guild Wars 2

I absolutely hate pets and AIs in this game. They’re all so slow, predictable, and STUPID from what I’ve experienced. They are somewhat helpful in pve, somewhat. But in any pvp areas, they are almost if not completely unreliable… NPCs being made of glass and having a tendency to walk straight into obvious certain death is annoying but at least its not severely handicapping a players potential. And then there’s the ranger… who’s gameplay mechanic relies extremely heavily on their pets. Pve is manageable, but anywhere else is complete hell. I don’t play dungeons very often, but I bet any AI-controlled companions from any profession will die just as easily as that 1 or 2 NPC that dived head first into death.

Let me expand! In pvp, the pets simply react way too slow to keep up with their targets in damage, range, mobility, and pretty much everything imaginable. Add in the fact that their F2 ability has a long cast time and frequently fails, lack of reliable control over pets, and their complete ignorance of giant red circles of death. We constantly see players walking past, jumping over, gently petting it on the head, and using it to skip rope.

Necromancers and Engineers suffer from bad AIs as well. Turret builds are mostly laughed at since utilizing them requires the target to have the same mindset of another AI. No problem in pve, but everywhere else… yeah… Minion master builds work but only because their minions just swarm their targets. Good luck winning as a minion master if you’re target specializes in aoe btw.

I don’t wvw much, but its quite obvious that everyone runs a mobility strong or support strong build. A fast evasive/stealthy killer if the player roams alone. But still, I will add in the fact that sacrificing so much utility slots for minion rather than stun breaks will guarantee instant death in wvw. Not that anyone would run a minion heavy build in wvw anyways.

I’ll be honest here. If arenanet decided to scrap these minions, pets, and etc… I would be OVERJOYED. As I see it, the rangers pet is more of a nuisance than any help (nerfing the ranger itself because they have a companion). Necromancers and engineers have way better builds than any of the MM and turrets build. But the biggest victims here are the rangers, I really wish arenanet would fix the pet or just completely scrap the whole mechanic because it’s just awful. Perhaps instead of using pets, rangers can learn their F1-F4 skills from observing nature and animals so they act more like utility skills. Or maybe make it so the pet isn’t something that follows you but a “summoned ally” that comes out, does its job, and disappears. But that’s just wishful thinking on my part. But I am pretty sure anything will be better than those pets.

yes im tired too. i main a mesmer and almost all of our ai suffers from bugs. i wish they would at least give me the option to have a non ai build, but mes has nothing left. clones attack random targets, die before they can shatter, phantasms are bugged out like iwarden, then ther is obstructed and los buggs everywhere, cannot cast a phantasm if enemy is on uneven terrain, i hate that clone shatters are my only aoe next to phantasm aoe and then all i have is chaosstorm as a real aoe….and im a kitten light armor class.
i understand that ai is hard to program, but seriously give classes like rangers and mes non ai build options for wvw raids, because that where both of us lack the most(ranger has it a little worse as he doesnt have veil)

Yes, I forgot to mention about mesmers. The clones and pantasms are only good against single targets. But I would argue that mesmers have it way easier off. Most of their illusions are meant to be sacrificed for better survivability or damage. Illusions dying are very common and isn’t really much of an inconvenience unless it’s a large scale battle. If your build don’t focus on illusions then they still serve as a nice decoy that can be easily replaced in 5-10 seconds. Mesmers have it easy since summoning illusions is second nature to them.

Rangers, turret engineers, and MM necromancers have it way worse than the mesmer since they don’t have that ability to quickly replace any fallen minions. If their pets die, they’re pretty much dead.

well yeah im talking from a wvw perspective and remember when the bug mad illusions die right away when target went into stealth? well this is pretty much the raid mesmer in wvw. our clones can be replaced yes, but they only deal dmg if a u shatter them or b u got them traited for clone death. i run power pu as condi mes is not viable in zergs at all.
phantasms cannot be easily replaced as they have a longer cooldown and due to multiple bugs (like los/obstructed bugs or iwarden that doesnt attack) or bling or out of range phantasms wont spawn properly.

i agree though that the bugged minions are terrible for necros and necro pets are a disaster. however necro mm build is the one build that kills me very quickly in spvp but that was before bug came back.

Perhaps they can make it so that your clones, minions, pet, etc… evade as you evade. Or at least give you a trait that does that.

I noticed that the necromancer f2-f4 is not there and I would suggest that those buttons would be perfect for minion control. The f2-f4 should be something along the lines of a toggle that determines how the AI behaves. F2 can determine aggressiveness and F3 will determine formation. F2: toggle 1 would make your minions stubbornly pursue your target while toggle 2 makes them stick close and surround the necromancer. F3: toggle 1 would make the minions stick close together like a “mini-zerg” while toggle 2 would make them disperse and cover a wider area. I’m not sure what to do with the F4 though.

I’ve also noticed that the ranger F3 and the combat toggle can be fused into one single toggle. Just put them both in the F3 key; toggle 1 would make your pet stubbornly pursue your target and toggle 2 will make your pet stick very close to you and avoid combat if at all possible. I imagine the F3 and combat toggle could also fuse with the F1 skill since my pet naturally attack whatever I’m attacking. If they would just fuse the f1, f3, and combat toggle it would free up a space for a second pet skill. That would redeem the pet for me just a bit, but only a little bit.

anyone who chose to play a lazy class that relies on computer doing the job for you, gotta deal with consequences

if it was up to me i would make them more of utility thing than main dmg source (like it is in many cases atm)

Cynz.9437:

anyone who chose to play a lazy class that relies on computer doing the job for you, gotta deal with consequences

if it was up to me i would make them more of utility thing than main dmg source (like it is in many cases atm)

what the hell? that is the dumbest thing i ever heard! i played this class since launch and no class is a lazy class. plus memser had a lot non ai builds before all the nerfs destroyed that.id rather have less ai. so u are saying that everyone should play war then?or do u want just punish people for choosing a class they like?seriously take your hate speech somewhere else!

Cynz.9437:

anyone who chose to play a lazy class that relies on computer doing the job for you, gotta deal with consequences

if it was up to me i would make them more of utility thing than main dmg source (like it is in many cases atm)

Such ignorance. Do you even play the ranger? Because if you do you would realize that both the pet and the ranger itself has horrible survivability. Damage obvious doesn’t come easy if we need to dodge and run all the time while warriors and guardians just stands there soaking everything up and still keep on attacking.

I won’t say I’m an expert, but I do play all 8 professions. I tend not to judge any profession till I’ve tried them out. So what about you? Have you ever played a ranger?

This is one of the reasons I never play minion/AI classes in MMOs. They are just terrible and annoying, besides promoting passive play and attracting the worst and laziest of players.

I’ve seen multiple wipes first hand, caused by Bearbow Rangers who couldn’t control their pets.

I made the mistake of creating a Mesmer and while the class is fundamentally fun, the constantly bugging Warden and the dumb and random Illusion AI really want to make be smash something at times.

I think mesmer clones are a good mechanic and ranger pet obviously needs better AI.

Other than that, please, remove AI.

As a fellow ranger, I completely understand your pain, sorrow and frustration with how the pet and its lackluster AI holds back this class.

But hey, let’s at least look on the bright side. If AI development for such a major company progresses so slowly, then the human race won’t have to worry about anything like an “Sentient/Sapient AI Terminator Revolt” for another 1500 years.

Detharos.3157:

As a fellow ranger, I completely understand your pain, sorrow and frustration with how the pet and its lackluster AI holds back this class.

But hey, let’s at least look on the bright side. If AI development for such a major company progresses so slowly, then the human race won’t have to worry about anything like an “Sentient/Sapient AI Terminator Revolt” for another 1500 years.

Searing Day is inevitable.

I’m not sure how they can implement ways to control the Mesmer illusions since there is absolutely no space left on the Mesmer skill bar to fit in some AI-control skills. The only way to improve the control is the improve the AI itself rather than the user interface and who knows how long and how hard it will be. One suggestion I would make is to cut out line of sight as a requirement for certain illusion skills. As long as you have your target targeted and you are in range, you will be able to use you illusion without being obstructed. Note that it’s only for certain skills. The scepter auto-attack still requires that projectile to land in order for the clone to be summoned.

The necromancer and ranger has room in their user interface for extra AI-control options. The necromancer is obvious since it’s F2-F4 are empty. The ranger’s F1 is the equivalent of the “engage combat” toggle and the F3 is the equivalent of the “avoid combat” toggle as far as I’m concerned. So why not just put them all into F1 as a single toggle skill. that will leave F3 open for a new and improved AI-control option or even a secondary pet skill.

If Arenanet actually follows the path I imagined (though highly unlikely), I wish that if we set our pets/minions/illusions/etc… to “defensive mode” then they would evade as we evade. This allows us another option to control our pet while giving the professions an emergency button in case their AI friend does something stupid.

I’m no programmer so I have no idea how hard it is to implement this kind of stuff. But I’ll assume my suggestions are way easier than to creating a new, smart, and reliable AI that can obey their masters like they’re reading minds.

Detharos.3157:

As a fellow ranger, I completely understand your pain, sorrow and frustration with how the pet and its lackluster AI holds back this class.

But hey, let’s at least look on the bright side. If AI development for such a major company progresses so slowly, then the human race won’t have to worry about anything like an “Sentient/Sapient AI Terminator Revolt” for another 1500 years.

This is just for fun. I read that nothing that’s ever programmed is truly random. Everything coded in any electronic device follows a specific pattern, a specific formula, a specific equation, etc… Free will (at least human free will anyways) is nothing like that. It’s irrational, chaotic, unpredictable, random, and well FREE! I don’t think any program can ever imitate true randomness and unpredictability since everything is using some sort of script. It’s like the results are built in to be rather then letting fate decide. So I don’t think a robot uprising will ever come to be unless we specifically program robots to uprise.

Novomundum.8325:

I’ll be honest here. If arenanet decided to scrap these minions, pets, and etc… I would be OVERJOYED. As I see it, the rangers pet is more of a nuisance than any help (nerfing the ranger itself because they have a companion). Necromancers and engineers have way better builds than any of the MM and turrets build. But the biggest victims here are the rangers, I really wish arenanet would fix the pet or just completely scrap the whole mechanic because it’s just awful. Perhaps instead of using pets, rangers can learn their F1-F4 skills from observing nature and animals so they act more like utility skills. Or maybe make it so the pet isn’t something that follows you but a “summoned ally” that comes out, does its job, and disappears. But that’s just wishful thinking on my part. But I am pretty sure anything will be better than those pets.

I agree with this last paragraph. I would LOVE and I mean LOOOOOOVVVVVEEEE if they scrapped the pet and gave ranger f1-f4 attunements.

selan.8354:

Cynz.9437:

anyone who chose to play a lazy class that relies on computer doing the job for you, gotta deal with consequences

if it was up to me i would make them more of utility thing than main dmg source (like it is in many cases atm)

what the hell? that is the dumbest thing i ever heard! i played this class since launch and no class is a lazy class. plus memser had a lot non ai builds before all the nerfs destroyed that.id rather have less ai. so u are saying that everyone should play war then?or do u want just punish people for choosing a class they like?seriously take your hate speech somewhere else!

That is just rude… it is fine if you disagree but you don’t have to be so offensive.

AI makes up for mistakes of bad players ( you can CC player, but pet still is attacking you; you go in stealth to get better position but pet still gives you out; you actually down the player but pet can eventually kill you too and if you both are in downed state, ai class will win etc.) but it is indeed burden for good players since AI can do only so much hence why i said pets should be more of utility than source of main dmg like it is for some classes/builds atm.

Why would any developer respond to this post when someone states their bias right at the top? Furthermore, what makes anyone think they are trying to achieve balance with they have such an obvious bias? I guess I’m wondering why anyone would make a thread like this because it isn’t going to elicit a response from developers.

Cynz.9437:

selan.8354:

Cynz.9437:

anyone who chose to play a lazy class that relies on computer doing the job for you, gotta deal with consequences

if it was up to me i would make them more of utility thing than main dmg source (like it is in many cases atm)

what the hell? that is the dumbest thing i ever heard! i played this class since launch and no class is a lazy class. plus memser had a lot non ai builds before all the nerfs destroyed that.id rather have less ai. so u are saying that everyone should play war then?or do u want just punish people for choosing a class they like?seriously take your hate speech somewhere else!

That is just rude… it is fine if you disagree but you don’t have to be so offensive.

AI makes up for mistakes of bad players ( you can CC player, but pet still is attacking you; you go in stealth to get better position but pet still gives you out; you actually down the player but pet can eventually kill you too and if you both are in downed state, ai class will win etc.) but it is indeed burden for good players since AI can do only so much hence why i said pets should be more of utility than source of main dmg like it is for some classes/builds atm.

well, sry, but u came across very rude yourself by calling people lazy because of their class choice. (“anyone who chose to play a lazy class that relies on computer doing the job for you, gotta deal with consequences”)
i liked mesmer and not because i expected it to be a pet class which it was turned into. u cant say people are bad players because of the class design. most of the players play multiple classes and good players will know all of them. mesmer is a 1v1 class, and u do need to know how to play it if u dont wanna die every 3 seconds.like i said before multiple times, most of the classes that depend on ai because of their design, would like to have another option. i want a non ai build on my mes, but anet made that impossible for me.
1, because of nerfs
2, because by design every single weapon has a phantasm and lots of them creat clones
3, because our main f1-f4 are all about shattering illusions wich means u need illusions for it if u dont trait for illusionary persona
4, because 80% of our traits revolve around phantasms,clones, shatters…ai

so how about u try to make a mesmer build without using any of that. try to play the class and enjoy all the bugs which we all have gotten used to by now. enjoy the fun of veilbot, no stability, terrible condi cleanse, squishyness,obstructed and los bugs, broken phantasms, and also enjoy trying to kill a warrior with a non pu, non glass build.

having an opinion is one thing, but calling people lazy for choosing a class and that they deserve the flawed design is not cool. thats why i called it a dumb comment. i was offended by your comment!

zapv.8051:

Why would any developer respond to this post when someone states their bias right at the top? Furthermore, what makes anyone think they are trying to achieve balance with they have such an obvious bias? I guess I’m wondering why anyone would make a thread like this because it isn’t going to elicit a response from developers.

Sorry if I offend you in anyway but I deliberately chose such a vulgar title in order to gain attention quick. And it worked on some small level I guess. Vast majority of people would just skip over anything that doesn’t catch their eye. The easiest way to grab the majority of people’s eye is with a vulgar, loud, and biased statement as you call it. Sure maybe the developers won’t take me seriously, but if the majority of players ignore me than the developers would ignore me as well.

Not sure if that was the best way of handling it prehap creating a thread that was for fostering discuss, not arguments would have been a start. Or you could have broke it down profession by profession and split the viewing a bit, nothing seems to stop anyone from doing so as we have seen from these new Sub-forum. Skritt they don’t even seem to merge as often as they once did.

Bran.7425:

Not sure if that was the best way of handling it prehap creating a thread that was for fostering discuss, not arguments would have been a start. Or you could have broke it down profession by profession and split the viewing a bit, nothing seems to stop anyone from doing so as we have seen from these new Sub-forum. Skritt they don’t even seem to merge as often as they once did.

There are so many discussions that break into arguments that I couldn’t count. In any case, it doesn’t matter how friendly you try to be there will always be that one person that makes everything a heated argument. And it’s not just gw2 or games in general, it’s everything. As long as it exists, there will be arguments about it.

This is my thought process behind making most of my threads now. I know it’s not exactly mature or well-thought out but it was better than my past methods, where everything I say is quickly dismissed as uninteresting and unimportant.