Guild Wars 2

Engi is the strongest class right now. Engi and Ele need to be toned down a little, I think the main culprit is Celestial Amulet because power ele is fine and Condi PS engi is fine. Cele engi is ridiculous, IMO more OP than ele because of passive bleed burn and vuln procs along with easy perma poison and insane CC. With SD thief nerf it’s also basically the best tourney viable 1v1 build.

-Teef Teef Teef Teef

Even if engi was OP, they still require more skill to play than all of the current and previous OP builds, so i am perfectly ok with this.

Lifestealer.4910:

Even if engi was OP, they still require more skill to play than all of the current and previous OP builds, so i am perfectly ok with this.

i’m sure spvp is very hard when engineer is the most tailored profession for it in the whole game

unrelated: nerf incendiary powder

or at least give some counterplay to it other than just avoiding every single attack

Lifestealer.4910:

Even if engi was OP, they still require more skill to play than all of the current and previous OP builds, so i am perfectly ok with this.

I love how more options turn into “more skill”. Thats total garbage. If you just have non-stop skills at your disposal and a oh-crap button for every single situation thinkable doesn’t mean you’re a good player because you actually did that skill at that time.

Having more options and an array of skills at your disposal is like saying “hey a helicopter is harder to fly than a paper plane because helicopters have more buttons.” Take the necromancer as the paper airplane and hop on to see how far you can fly… and how easy it is to do so.

Bad logic. Bad cover-up. Its just disingenuous and quite frankly gets old to people who see right through that crap.

Did I seriously just see a necromancer complain about engineers? People are still complaining about IP despite the nerfs + eng’s weak pistol auto? O.o

The only nerf that I read in here that I agree with is nerf celestial since it provides too many stats compared to the others.

There seem to be reasons why things like this get posted in the prof balance instead of the structured pvp section in general…

It’s easy to fix the engineers, just prevent their turrets from working in capture point circles, like mist form or stealth.

This is a noob issue. When this thread was made we had the ToL, Engineers the second least played profession. Barely beating out Mesmer with only 2 more appearances in total.

Engineers OP? Well the players that are better than you dont seem to have a problem with it, infact they handle it so well Engineer is all but completely pushed out of higher end pvp.

You want to talk overpowered? Have a look at those Guardians, that every single team has and seems to need.
Im sure they are mandatory because they are so balanced.

TheDevice.2751:

Lifestealer.4910:

Even if engi was OP, they still require more skill to play than all of the current and previous OP builds, so i am perfectly ok with this.

I love how more options turn into “more skill”. Thats total garbage. If you just have non-stop skills at your disposal and a oh-crap button for every single situation thinkable doesn’t mean you’re a good player because you actually did that skill at that time.

Having more options and an array of skills at your disposal is like saying “hey a helicopter is harder to fly than a paper plane because helicopters have more buttons.” Take the necromancer as the paper airplane and hop on to see how far you can fly… and how easy it is to do so.

Bad logic. Bad cover-up. Its just disingenuous and quite frankly gets old to people who see right through that crap.

and then we have turret engis that require even less buttons than paper plane… with better end results than necro on helicopter

Xillllix.3485:

It’s easy to fix the engineers, just prevent their turrets from working in capture point circles, like mist form or stealth.

any half smart turret engi will place turrets around the point not on top of it

High skill floor and high skill ceiling. Unless you run turrets, but w/e. Engineer is fine. And I do not play one.

Engi is certainly not OP considering that any sort of condition spec can roll over the majority of their builds. Even well used CC specs are effective against rabid/celestial Engis due to the lack of stability. Sure, they often gain protection while being controlled but if you do it frequently enough there’s not a huge amount they can do.

What I don’t argue with is how imbalanced Celestial gear is. I can’t even bring myself to use it because so long as you have a variety of attacks it’ll just be better than any purist option like Zerker or Rabid. Builds like 3 Kit Engi, Dagger Eles, and Axebow Warriors are fairly well balanced if you use any non-celestial gear. The extra sustain it gives while not sacrificing much damage is absurd. Might stacking runes are also to blame even post nerf. It was never the bonus damage it was the duration that was the issue.

The actual class balance in the game now feels pretty good, but now gear is a huge problem.

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Aberrant.6749:

Did I seriously just see a necromancer complain about engineers? People are still complaining about IP despite the nerfs + eng’s weak pistol auto? O.o

The only nerf that I read in here that I agree with is nerf celestial since it provides too many stats compared to the others.

There seem to be reasons why things like this get posted in the prof balance instead of the structured pvp section in general…

IP will always be horrible design no matter how much it makes up for any damage shortfall in other areas. Shock horror people don’t appreciate playing around a nuke that can proc on functionally anything.

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

TheDevice.2751:

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

Taking an Elixir that is focused on cleansing conditions and not taking an offensive or defensive one such as Elixir B or S means you won’t be likely to be killing anything or being much use to anyone. Also of note, most of the condi removal you listed it only on* ONE TYPE OF BUILD*: Elixirs.

Med kit is OK but most of the time you want to quickly remove damaging conditions. With Drop Antidote you have to swap to the kit and then drop it. This means you’re spending a ton of time not damaging the enemy when you could take Healing Turret and only slightly disrupt your damage.

Automated Response was nerfed so hard it’s not really worth using unless you want to bring -condi duration runes and maybe a sigil dealing with removal as well. Even then it’s not a good trait anymore for the most part.

Fumigate is only on allies…so you’re making yourself look silly now. Try reading the skill/playing the class before posting something.

Your average Engi build depends on Healing Turret for removal or 409 and the cleanse on EG. Even with 409 you won’t generally bring 3 Utility Elixirs, at most you’ll have 3 utils and the heal. THis means that you have at most 6 condi removal. All these skills have relatively high CD and not only that but do you really wanna blow your Stability/Stealth just to remove ONE condi?

Now, it is possible for a high damage HGH Elixir build to burst down a condi build before being overwhelmed, but that is ONE type of build on the entire class. Even when Auto Resp was good it was only so on decap/tanky builds for the most part. You wouldn’t be able to go that far into that type of tree and expect to deal much damage.

Your post oozes ignorance, please do some research before posting things like this.

BurrTheKing.8571:

TheDevice.2751:

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

Taking an Elixir that is focused on cleansing conditions and not taking an offensive or defensive one such as Elixir B or S means you won’t be likely to be killing anything or being much use to anyone. Also of note, most of the condi removal you listed it only on* ONE TYPE OF BUILD*: Elixirs.

Med kit is OK but most of the time you want to quickly remove damaging conditions. With Drop Antidote you have to swap to the kit and then drop it. This means you’re spending a ton of time not damaging the enemy when you could take Healing Turret and only slightly disrupt your damage.

Automated Response was nerfed so hard it’s not really worth using unless you want to bring -condi duration runes and maybe a sigil dealing with removal as well. Even then it’s not a good trait anymore for the most part.

Fumigate is only on allies…so you’re making yourself look silly now. Try reading the skill/playing the class before posting something.

Your average Engi build depends on Healing Turret for removal or 409 and the cleanse on EG. Even with 409 you won’t generally bring 3 Utility Elixirs, at most you’ll have 3 utils and the heal. THis means that you have at most 6 condi removal. All these skills have relatively high CD and not only that but do you really wanna blow your Stability/Stealth just to remove ONE condi?

Now, it is possible for a high damage HGH Elixir build to burst down a condi build before being overwhelmed, but that is ONE type of build on the entire class. Even when Auto Resp was good it was only so on decap/tanky builds for the most part. You wouldn’t be able to go that far into that type of tree and expect to deal much damage.

Your post oozes ignorance, please do some research before posting things like this.

Because of fumigate? Really? Because you only have ONE type of build on the entire class that can counter conditions?

You’re agreeing that you have an entire set of skills that directly relate to condition removal. And this:

A.E.D..

Which they just added to help the poor engis with their ONE difficulty (if it even is that).

You’re the type of person who would make the argument that necro’s have some of the best stability in the game with the soul reaping gm trait. No.. Necro’s REALLY don’t have stability. Like REALLY don’t have it.

AND, there are several sigils and runes that counter conditions and I think only 1 rune set that offers stability (when under 10% health). The issue isnt even about there being an obvious weakness to the engineers class but you have a VERY skewed outlook on what a WEAKNESS really is. A REAL weakness is like a necro having no stability. THAT is a weakness. Engi’s have a slight problem with conditions. Thats all. It’s not detrimental to the class and does not keep them from being highly functional if not viable in all modes aside from perhaps pve.

A.E.D requires trating into it for it to have a decent CD…actually going down to 32 seconds from 40 is still not that great. Even then, it’s a heal that removes all damaging conditions only if you take lethal damge and it also has that high CD. I can’t even see me traiting into gadget reduction on my build that uses 2 of them. I don’t even USE A.E.D because of how clunky it is to use. It’s a cool idea but not a huge help.

Also no, I know Necro is weak to CC. I also know that a good Necro can Fear lock a CC player and corrupt their Stability when they try to get out of it. It’s a weakness they can overcome by being good. Did you also know that Engis most feared opponent is Necro? If you aren’t running Elixirs chances are you WILL lose if the Necro is even remotely good. Even when running Elixirs one screw up and your dead, especially if they do into the fight with Life Force. Did you also know that Engis have little access to stability as well? Once again the only skill that has that is Toss Elixir B. It’s also NOT a stun break/instant cast so you have to anticipate the CC for it to be effective is is generally only used to counteract the self knockback of Overcharged Shot. It also only lasts 4 and 3/4 seconds on around a 30 second CD. You picked a really bad counterargument there. Not that I’m denying it’s not an issue. Necro needs help in some areas but they should NEVER be complaining about Engis.

BurrTheKing.8571:

A.E.D requires trating into it for it to have a decent CD…actually going down to 32 seconds from 40 is still not that great. Even then, it’s a heal that removes all damaging conditions only if you take lethal damge and it also has that high CD. I can’t even see me traiting into gadget reduction on my build that uses 2 of them. I don’t even USE A.E.D because of how clunky it is to use. It’s a cool idea but not a huge help.

Also no, I know Necro is weak to CC. I also know that a good Necro can Fear lock a CC player and corrupt their Stability when they try to get out of it. It’s a weakness they can overcome by being good. Did you also know that Engis most feared opponent is Necro? If you aren’t running Elixirs chances are you WILL lose if the Necro is even remotely good. Even when running Elixirs one screw up and your dead, especially if they do into the fight with Life Force. Did you also know that Engis have little access to stability as well? Once again the only skill that has that is Toss Elixir B. It’s also NOT a stun break/instant cast so you have to anticipate the CC for it to be effective is is generally only used to counteract the self knockback of Overcharged Shot. It also only lasts 4 and 3/4 seconds on around a 30 second CD. You picked a really bad counterargument there. Not that I’m denying it’s not an issue. Necro needs help in some areas but they should NEVER be complaining about Engis.

No the fruits of my argument has clearly come in what you just said. Necros are the engi’s worst enemy right? That’s what the fear the most right? Your entire class is afraid of ONE build a necro has.. ONE build. That ONE build is a condition bomb build. Thats it. You just argued with me earlier about the ONE build issue yet necromancers are completely restricted to conditions. Oh what if they run power?! Wait do they have a power option? Why should necromancers even have a power option. Why cant the devs just remove power from their allotted attributes. All they are, are condition bombs. 1-trick pony’s.

Then if you say: “well GOOD necros can go power and blah blah blah” that also fractures your argument. Now necro’s in that respect aren’t the big bad boogeymeny of engineers.

All the condition removal I just put down simply stated that you have a means to remove conditions: you choose not to use them. You also said that you dont use elixer B.. which is too difficult to use apparently so why use it? I’m sure nobody is good enough to use that skill…. -_-

We’re talking about what a weakness really is. They original post i responded to claimed that engineers are completely useless vs condition builds and its just not true. The options are there and can very well be splashed in several builds even a turret build. And fear? Not only do you have elixer s but fear has 2 counters. No other cc can say the same. condition removal AND stability /stunbreaks.

I never said good Necros go power. Honestly power is easier to play than condi imo on necro. I never said Engis are afraid of just ONE of their builds, even power (you confused me here, even with the nerf Power Necro still hits hard) and MMs have enough conditions to be a threat even without a ton of stat points thrown behind them. Engis also generally hate Hambow or any CC build. While beatable in an open area avoiding a full Hammer combo while on point is just 1 mistake from being chained to death (no stability and all). 3 kit or 2 kit with Elixir S (rocket boots in WvW ) is the meta you generally see, it’s what the people here are generally complaining about. That is the spec that is weakest to conditions.

No one (reasonable) said that Engis have NO removal, it’s just that the removal is focused in the same area. Elixirs are great, but in PvP they may not be the most useful thing to run over a 3 kit build. That brings much more to a team fight. Nobody I know runes AR because it isn’t good anymore.

I also said that we often choose to use Elixir B over C because C/R is ONLY useful against conditions and taking it means DRAMATICALLY reducing your DPS which is what an HGH Elixir build is used for in most cases. Another issue in PvP for S is while it’s good for not dying you can’t contest a point for the time it’s active, which is a huge negative if you’re alone.

So yes, there are condi removal options, but you seem to be ignoring how subpar they are. Taking 3 total Elixirs + 409 is still only 6 removal, not that great and involves using Stability/Stealth when you may not want to. There’s having removal and then there’s having effective removal, big difference.

TheDevice.2751:

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

Oh, the good ol’ “I’ll list all the skillz to try to have a point” misleading argument without acknowledging the context, possible outcomes, variables, builds, or even the effect of the skills themselves.

TheDevice.2751:

Lifestealer.4910:

Even if engi was OP, they still require more skill to play than all of the current and previous OP builds, so i am perfectly ok with this.

I love how more options turn into “more skill”. Thats total garbage. If you just have non-stop skills at your disposal and a oh-crap button for every single situation thinkable doesn’t mean you’re a good player because you actually did that skill at that time.

Having more options and an array of skills at your disposal is like saying “hey a helicopter is harder to fly than a paper plane because helicopters have more buttons.” Take the necromancer as the paper airplane and hop on to see how far you can fly… and how easy it is to do so.

Bad logic. Bad cover-up. Its just disingenuous and quite frankly gets old to people who see right through that crap.

Firstly it really shows that you do not play an engineer. A celestial engineer while strong actually has alot more weak match ups 1v1, the guy that said celestial engineer is the best meta 1v1 build currently makes me laugh considering a shatter mesmer totally kittens on that spec, where as a pure condi engineer would do ok against it.

Engineer has more offensive options but less defensive options, lack of real condi clear, no stability, one long cd stunbreak means that they get punished hard for any screw ups unlike a d/d ele who has multitude of sustain/stunbreak/blinks/blocks (if they decide to take it). A celestial engineer has to also get right up peoples face to do majority of their damage, with the top mentioned weakness, it makes it a high risk/ high reward build. The only thing that makes them more forgiving is that they are pretty durable, decent base stats but it is by no means warrior level of durability even if you factor their blocks.

The main reason you have seen a popularity in celestial engineer is due to the fact that condi build has been pushed out of meta due to the abundance of ele/guardians in teams making any real condi build completely pointless. A celestial build is obviously not as reliant on condi to do its damage but in exchange it actually has more weak match ups than a pure condi engineer. Thieves actually has a better chance against a rifle built engi compared to the other p/s or p/p builds due to the fact that the IP trait and weapon swap condi are much weaker (and celestial rifle does not use geomancy sigil) which is what gives them the upper hand usually. If you don’t believe me, you can ask sizer about it.

and engineer is a high skill cap class (if you don’t use turrets but i like to think thats a class of its own) and as a result it should yield good power (not raw power like a warrior) but more options. This is the logic that has been used in any competitive moba games as well. A good example is invoker from dota 2, a high skill cap hero with lots of ability and can fulfill multiple roles, he can roam, assassinate, escape fights, initiate and chain CC enemies, snipe people from across the map etc, and if played right, is literally a god that can do anything and everything, solo carrying games easily. This is how games should be balanced, not this low skill requirement high reward cancer builds like d/d ele or s/d thief.

I would also like to point out in my final statement that celestial engi actually abuses the might stack the least out of all the current meta celestial builds, the average might you would get is around 6 compared to an ele who can achieve 15+ easily.

First off for any engine to perform at the same level of most other classes it requires a lot more effort and micro managing.

Secondly engi has massive weakness: they are very weak against condi and cc making them quite easy to focus. They are hard countered by necros.

Dont worry, you’ll have the last laugh when all the engineer players have carpal tunnel syndrome.

lol i must admit that by carrying spinal blade all day i will likely end up with my back hurting

Best AoE damage, best counter damage (because it can do damage while running away), best hp/s, AoE heal for team, AoE condi clear for team, way more skills = way more utility for every situation.

Engi is without a doubt the master class. It can does everything too well.

What is OP:
the hp/s
the aoe heals
the aoe nades dmg/condi dmg that work at ALL ranges
the fact they have like 29 skills while other classes have 17-19
no weapon swap cds
the best elite in the game (heals/dmg)
incendiary powder

Eurantien.4632:

Best AoE damage, best counter damage (because it can do damage while running away), best hp/s, AoE heal for team, AoE condi clear for team, way more skills = way more utility for every situation.

Engi is without a doubt the master class. It can does everything too well.

What is OP:
the hp/s
the aoe heals
the aoe nades dmg/condi dmg that work at ALL ranges
the fact they have like 29 skills while other classes have 17-19
no weapon swap cds
the best elite in the game (heals/dmg)
incendiary powder

So…you just really don’t like Kits, huh? Fair enough, neither do I. I prefer Gadgets and Turrets to Kits, and really just wish I could use a Hammer. Maybe, if the stars aligned and the ‘if you don’t have a Kit equipped, weapon swap just like other classes is allowed’ idea pulled through, Hammer and Rifle would be my go-to. Doubt I’ll ever know, since it’s been nine months since Anet said a single solitary word about that ‘all weapons for all classes’ thing at all.
That said, though? Don’t…don’t do the ‘they have too many skills!’ thing. That discussion has been had. Repeatedly, for a while, on the Engineer boards. Even I got in on it, because I’m not some kind of mystical exemplar of never bandwagoning.
…of course, while I was bandwagoning, I did end up trying to work out the largest potentially available number of skills for any class.
It’s not Quad-Kit Engineer.
The award instead went to Conjure Elementalist, with four Weapon bars of Attunements and four of Conjures for a total of forty-four skills, including the four Conjures, twenty of which could be shared and gave stat bonuses, in exchange for only lasting a certain number of shots.
Strangely enough, nobody gives them crap about having too many options, and almost half of those are built-in.

Eurantien.4632:

Best AoE damage, best counter damage (because it can do damage while running away), best hp/s, AoE heal for team, AoE condi clear for team, way more skills = way more utility for every situation.

Engi is without a doubt the master class. It can does everything too well.

What is OP:
the hp/s
the aoe heals
the aoe nades dmg/condi dmg that work at ALL ranges
the fact they have like 29 skills while other classes have 17-19
no weapon swap cds
the best elite in the game (heals/dmg)
incendiary powder

So basically everything about engi is OP?..can’t say im surprised tho that a guy that plays power ranger in its current form tries to shift attention away from his own class onto other classes. its not fooling anyone tho

Eurantien.4632:

Best AoE damage, best counter damage (because it can do damage while running away), best hp/s, AoE heal for team, AoE condi clear for team, way more skills = way more utility for every situation.

Engi is without a doubt the master class. It can does everything too well.

What is OP:
the hp/s
the aoe heals
the aoe nades dmg/condi dmg that work at ALL ranges
the fact they have like 29 skills while other classes have 17-19
no weapon swap cds
the best elite in the game (heals/dmg)
incendiary powder

You forgot to mention that their heal is pretty much uninterruptible with a 0.5s cast time.

Yup. Anet, please nerf the engineer. It is clearly ridiculously OP after the buff to flame thrower (only true buff they got last update)………………….All of the FT engineers taking over all 3 game modes is insane. They are every where. EVERY WHERE I TELL YOU.

By the way, how come we never see anyone playing warrior or ranger any more?

/end sarcasm

Lifestealer.4910:

Eurantien.4632:

Best AoE damage, best counter damage (because it can do damage while running away), best hp/s, AoE heal for team, AoE condi clear for team, way more skills = way more utility for every situation.

Engi is without a doubt the master class. It can does everything too well.

What is OP:
the hp/s
the aoe heals
the aoe nades dmg/condi dmg that work at ALL ranges
the fact they have like 29 skills while other classes have 17-19
no weapon swap cds
the best elite in the game (heals/dmg)
incendiary powder

So basically everything about engi is OP?..can’t say im surprised tho that a guy that plays power ranger in its current form tries to shift attention away from his own class onto other classes. its not fooling anyone tho

This is the idiocy I expected. There will be no way to argue with you, sadly. You’re just wrong.

@ Blackbeard, yes I did forget to mention the practically uninterruptable heal.

TheDevice.2751:

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

Do you even play engi? Fumigate doesn’t even remove conditions on the user. Did you just linked random skills?

I’d totally love to write a long and exhaustive post on how little you know about engineer (I’m not being rude, it’s just the plain truth) but it would take too much of my time and expert players already know what I would have written.

@Eurantien: yep, you listed the things engineers are good at, but you are ignoring the things engineers suck at. Like removing conditions, and breaking stuns, or gaining stability.

Everytime is the same old story: people making biased assumptions on everything. I don’t know why I’m even posting on the forums, I should just stop and give up on hoping people to show some form of objectivity.

Engi take far more effort and micro managing to perform at the same level as many other classes. Also engi have big weaknesses such as cc and conditions.

All classes are OP:-)

All classes are OP except thief, mesmer, ranger, and guardian. All the other classes are incredibly overpowered and need to be toned down. Also, engi isnt hard to play at all. Any half decent player can pick up engi and be fine with it. Its not that hard, all you do with cele engi is knockback, immob, nade spam, block if under pressure, and heal for 2/3 of your HP. Its faceroll even, with toolkit you have almost 20% invuln uptime cuz the only reliable unlbockable move (LS on thief) was nerfed.

I would rather say that Mesmers are currently way over the top with new damage increases, less Thieves/condi Necros playing and change to Sword #3.

Unless you’re a condi, tank or have tons of evasion and stealth, you’re going to have problems with loads of Mesmers playing currently.

Rym.1469:

I would rather say that Mesmers are currently way over the top with new damage increases, less Thieves/condi Necros playing and change to Sword #3.

Unless you’re a condi, tank or have tons of evasion and stealth, you’re going to have problems with loads of Mesmers playing currently.

/facepalm

Okay. Lol. Now I’ve heard that just about everything is OP, and that thieves and warriors are just so underpowered that they’re unplayable now. Wow.

- Apparently all engis are OP and need nerfed.
- celestial eles are OP and need nerfed
- meditation guardians are OP and need nerfed
- terrormancers are OP and need nerfed (lol, my personal favorite. The irony is a real kicker.)
- condition mesmers are OP and need nerfed
- power rangers are op and need nerfed

Yet, thieves and warriors still make up a huge chunk of the playerbase even post-patch. Something’s telling me our thieves and warriors want to return to being godmode ASAP lol.

shimmerless.4560:

Aberrant.6749:

Did I seriously just see a necromancer complain about engineers? People are still complaining about IP despite the nerfs + eng’s weak pistol auto? O.o

The only nerf that I read in here that I agree with is nerf celestial since it provides too many stats compared to the others.

There seem to be reasons why things like this get posted in the prof balance instead of the structured pvp section in general…

IP will always be horrible design no matter how much it makes up for any damage shortfall in other areas. Shock horror people don’t appreciate playing around a nuke that can proc on functionally anything.

If they wanted to buff eng’s other dmg to compensate for the removal of IP it would almost certainly be a net buff (I could pick another trait on my eng while keeping up high burn time without ip).

I would hardly call IP a “nuke”. My other classes can easily do more auto attack damage than my eng pistol aa + ip. I really don’t see the problem.

Warrior is OP

I was just dueling one on my ranger and he reflected pretty much all of my projectile burst and loaded me with conditions.
Every time I got distance on him he would leap stun and load me up with bleeds or block and run to me then eviscerate when i used my dodges.

Totally nothing I could do.
Nerf celestial warrs plox

Frenk.5917:

TheDevice.2751:

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

Do you even play engi? Fumigate doesn’t even remove conditions on the user. Did you just linked random skills?

I’d totally love to write a long and exhaustive post on how little you know about engineer (I’m not being rude, it’s just the plain truth) but it would take too much of my time and expert players already know what I would have written.

@Eurantien: yep, you listed the things engineers are good at, but you are ignoring the things engineers suck at. Like removing conditions, and breaking stuns, or gaining stability.

Everytime is the same old story: people making biased assumptions on everything. I don’t know why I’m even posting on the forums, I should just stop and give up on hoping people to show some form of objectivity.

the guy before you already mentioned fumigate and lets hear how much you can come up with that will show exactly how little i know. I’d like to see the lengthy post man

Oh wait.. it just ended at fumigate didn’kitten

Engineers are also the most finely tailored class in the game. They get so much attention its disgusting. It’s like vomitable. They are constantly being touched-up while other classes suffer real problems. Eventually, there will be absolutely nothing an engineer can think of complaining about. The issues engi’s bring up are like little snobby rich kids screaming that their chocolate cake didn’t have sprinkles on it.

I mean honestly, conditions? That’s your major issue? And apparently you can’t run certain clears because they’re just “too difficult” to use. Not only are there clears built in to your class but I already said that runes and sigils are available for condition defense. Yet thats not good enough.

Lifestealer.4910:

Even if engi was OP, they still require more skill to play than all of the current and previous OP builds, so i am perfectly ok with this.

Engi doesnt require any skill, what you talking about, it only has high skill ceiling.

TheDevice.2751:

Frenk.5917:

TheDevice.2751:

Khenzy.9348:

As long as Engineers are as weak as they are against conditions, they wont be as OP as you claim them to be.

Elixer C
Toss Elixer C
Cleansing Burst
Drop Andtidote
Tosss Elixer R
Fumigate
Cleaning Formula 409
Transmute
Automated Response

What?

Do you even play engi? Fumigate doesn’t even remove conditions on the user. Did you just linked random skills?

I’d totally love to write a long and exhaustive post on how little you know about engineer (I’m not being rude, it’s just the plain truth) but it would take too much of my time and expert players already know what I would have written.

@Eurantien: yep, you listed the things engineers are good at, but you are ignoring the things engineers suck at. Like removing conditions, and breaking stuns, or gaining stability.

Everytime is the same old story: people making biased assumptions on everything. I don’t know why I’m even posting on the forums, I should just stop and give up on hoping people to show some form of objectivity.

the guy before you already mentioned fumigate and lets hear how much you can come up with that will show exactly how little i know. I’d like to see the lengthy post man

Oh wait.. it just ended at fumigate didn’kitten

Engineers are also the most finely tailored class in the game. They get so much attention its disgusting. It’s like vomitable. They are constantly being touched-up while other classes suffer real problems. Eventually, there will be absolutely nothing an engineer can think of complaining about. The issues engi’s bring up are like little snobby rich kids screaming that their chocolate cake didn’t have sprinkles on it.

I mean honestly, conditions? That’s your major issue? And apparently you can’t run certain clears because they’re just “too difficult” to use. Not only are there clears built in to your class but I already said that runes and sigils are available for condition defense. Yet thats not good enough.

There is having access to them, and then also having reasonable access to them without destroying your build/role in a group. Eng is very vulnerable to cc and conds and were designed that way. If you try to be stronger against conds you wind up giving up too much and are weaker overall.

I would suggest that you go play an eng in pvp for a while to understand the basics of a class before coming onto the forums and talking about it.

P.S. Cleansing burst and antidote are mutually exclusive while they both technically exist, you can’t take both.

I think engies should get a small cd on their weapon kit skills. say something like 10 seconds. that’s about all that really bothers me with engi.

wildfang.9670:

I think engies should get a small cd on their weapon kit skills. say something like 10 seconds. that’s about all that really bothers me with engi.

not sure if troll or srs..

wildfang.9670:

I think engies should get a small cd on their weapon kit skills. say something like 10 seconds. that’s about all that really bothers me with engi.

How do you mean ‘weapon kit skills?’

If ‘weapon kit skills, meaning the weapon skills the kits give,’ there already are cooldowns. The ‘difficulty’ of running several kits largely originates in their management, as there’s no way of knowing which cooldowns are at what point without mods (that would get the player banned due to it giving them an advantage) except for memorization.

If ‘weapon kit skills, meaning the skills that equip the kits,’ that would pretty much kill current methods of kit usage, considering that kits are currently dependent on high APM, with the most effect coming from flipping between them (and the regular weapons) as the situation demands.
It would certainly destroy multi-kit builds, as nobody I can think of would choose to sacrifice more than one utility slot for a longer-than-normal cooldown weapon swap, normal being 9 seconds.

Engi happens to be one prof that has a high survivability, high AoE damage, and high utility.

It’s not the only profession like this, but it’s definitely God tier when driven by competent players with good mechanics (which is required to make the initial statement true).

Tool Kit, grenade kit, and elixir S should be run by any engineer that knows what they’re doing. These 3 utilities offer everything anyone could ask for in PvP, except boon removal.

These three utilities are so effective that VeeWee is the only engi capable of running without them, because of frandliness levels being off the charts.

Shockwave.1230:

These three utilities are so effective that VeeWee is the only engi capable of running without them, because of frandliness levels being off the charts.

Everyone complains about elixer s, nades, toolkit. Buuuut the real op build is gadget mortar engie.

TheDevice.2751:

Engineers are also the most finely tailored class in the game. They get so much attention its disgusting. It’s like vomitable. They are constantly being touched-up while other classes suffer real problems. Eventually, there will be absolutely nothing an engineer can think of complaining about. The issues engi’s bring up are like little snobby rich kids screaming that their chocolate cake didn’t have sprinkles on it.

Care to elaborate or explain or list a comparison to other profession on how they “get attention” ??

I mean, we all know your simply incorrect, but we would like you to lay out your misconceptions, so we know which route to take to educate you….we all know all you
really want is :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6q3em9s5I4c

You should read the Engineer sub-forum, everybody is laughing we are so OP!!!

engineer is not so much over powered, they just bring a lot to the table. They in essence do not require any sort of higher game play, they just represent what every profession could be taken to. In other words, warrior with 10 weapon skills and 3 utilities +heal+elite= far too easy. The human brain can easily keep track of 20 variables once.

The big probelm with engi is the player behind it. A skilled player who has played M.M.O’s for years and so forth is going to gravitate to builds like engineer because of how much they bring. They will use pulls, well placed turrets, or elixirs etc in an efficient way and rotate their skills well. However if the engineer could only take one kit and cool downs between swapping were longer, this forces the player to do the best with what they may be stuck on cool down with, or hold off using skills for more optimal moment because of prolonged cool downs. This essentially slows down the rotations.

But as it stands, you could nerf engineer any which way you like and an efficient player will still get respectable results with them. The issue is with how much they were given, and at this point there is no going back because of how unfair that would be to players who have invested heavily.

Rym.1469:

I would rather say that Mesmers are currently way over the top with new damage increases, less Thieves/condi Necros playing and change to Sword #3.

Unless you’re a condi, tank or have tons of evasion and stealth, you’re going to have problems with loads of Mesmers playing currently.

So…
Unless your a thief, ranger, engi, warrior or necro you might have problems with Mesmer?
Lol