[PvP] Ele's Meta-Viable? Give them Revealed
Giving elementalists a readily available way to debuff enemies with revealed would be a solid boon to the profession and introduce more build diversity.
no….
stealth classes have their survival and dmg balanced around stealth, if eles had revealed debuff on demand, nobody would play stealth classes anymore
besides meta is currently condi tanks + petting zoo, not stealth….
[Teef] guild :>
No, just not what we need IMO. Should not be going the path of hard counters.
Ele’s just need more survivability, that’s all. They have the lowest health/armor and have no base survivability mechanics like stealth or clones. Not helping is how telegraphed so many of the abilities are with long cast times, and many flat-out useless abilities (scepter autoattacks, shatterstone, etc).
Build diversity is also terrible…you either play some kind of half-baked bunker that is vastly inferior to anything else, or full-glass where you get 1-shotted. Being forced to slot Cantrips just to postpone dying by a few extra seconds just feels pathetic.
The class just doesn’t make any sense in SPvP.
LOL that’s the last things ele need. Also it wouldn’t change ANYTHING about their (non-)viability in pvp.
Giving elementalists a readily available way to debuff enemies with revealed would be a solid boon to the profession and introduce more build diversity.
NO!!
The only classes who should get Revealed are Ranger and Necros.
Eles have more than enough thief counters. Counters that works also against Nonstealth thieves.
-Charr Thief-
It’s good to be bad!
I think the last thing we need is rock paper scissor classes. If there is going to be a way to apply revealed it has to be universal (i.e. hitting a thief when stealthed, or certain conditions -I always wondered how the burning thief was able to hide-).
Giving elementalists a readily available way to debuff enemies with revealed would be a solid boon to the profession and introduce more build diversity.
We really don’t need more anti-stealth.
If needed, do something about stealth directly. Don’t create unnecessary rock/paper/scissors situations, you’ll anger the “all skill based”-crowd. :P
Giving elementalists a readily available way to debuff enemies with revealed would be a solid boon to the profession and introduce more build diversity.
NO!!
The only classes who should get Revealed are Ranger and Necros.
Eles have more than enough thief counters. Counters that works also against Nonstealth thieves.
What? Thieves are pretty hard ele counters.
Giving elementalists a readily available way to debuff enemies with revealed would be a solid boon to the profession and introduce more build diversity.
NO!!
The only classes who should get Revealed are Ranger and Necros.
Eles have more than enough thief counters. Counters that works also against Nonstealth thieves.What? Thieves are pretty hard ele counters.
eles can nuke thief as fast lol
[Teef] guild :>
eles can nuke thief as fast lol
Stealth can interrupt the instant air burst, evasion and high, fast damage can counter squishy elementalists pretty hard, and boon stealing on top of it is just brutal (elementalists are heavily reliant on boons).
Currently, thieves hard counter almost every other glass cannon build in the game by hitting faster than then, getting out-of-nowhere opening strikes (which is deadly on squishy builds), and stripping (worse: stealing) their main defensive sources.
Thieves are pretty much the anti-glasscannon Glasscannons.
What eles need is a buff to survivability and a nerf to meteor shower.
eles can nuke thief as fast lol
Stealth can interrupt the instant air burst, evasion and high, fast damage can counter squishy elementalists pretty hard, and boon stealing on top of it is just brutal (elementalists are heavily reliant on boons).
Currently, thieves hard counter almost every other glass cannon build in the game by hitting faster than then, getting out-of-nowhere opening strikes (which is deadly on squishy builds), and stripping (worse: stealing) their main defensive sources.
Thieves are pretty much the anti-glasscannon Glasscannons.
Actually GC mesmers are the anti-glasscannon class right now.
What eles need is a buff to survivability and a nerf to meteor shower.
why?
because a build with no dueling nor small scale fights capabilitis can use a single skill once in 3 minutes that will deal noticeable damage on people standing still 5+ seconds in a spot?
A PvE player is supposed to avoid a 1-2 second 1 shotting aoe.
A WWW player is considered uncapable of avoiding a 5,75 second aoe for half his health.
No, reduce ride the lightning cooldown instead.
Yes, give ele’s a reveal. Stealth really needs more counters and eles are a good choice for that.
I think the last thing we need is rock paper scissor classes. If there is going to be a way to apply revealed it has to be universal (i.e. hitting a thief when stealthed, or certain conditions -I always wondered how the burning thief was able to hide-).
+1
I agree with hitting the thief in stealth should make him revealed. I wouldn’t go as far as a condition because a lot of thieves condition cleanse comes from stealth so it like 2 hard counters(not being able to stealth and not being able to cleanse).
Elementalist
#Ele
Hard counters are a big no-no. Ele’s already got a hard counter to the Conditions meta (diamond skin) we don’t need even more rock-paper-scissors gameplay like that atrocity.
S/I/F engineer Z/R/D guard
One of my friends plays with a D/D Ele, and man he’s impossible, high survivability, hits like a truck, yes, even after all the nerfs you’ve gotten recently, point is, elementalists (at least dd ones) do have their ways to survive and deal high damage, but the skill ceiling is sky-high, besides him I have seen really few D/D eles that represent a menace (playing as guardian/thief), as for stealth, you have to deal with it the way every other profession has to, this guy I’m talking about EAT thieves, its not even funny.
What eles need is a buff to survivability and a nerf to meteor shower.
why?
because a build with no dueling nor small scale fights capabilitis can use a single skill once in 3 minutes that will deal noticeable damage on people standing still 5+ seconds in a spot?
3 minutes? You must have some serious lag.
and it isn’t about standing still for 3 minutes. It’s about holding a point in PvP or fighting in a group in WvW.
What eles need is a buff to survivability and a nerf to meteor shower.
why?
because a build with no dueling nor small scale fights capabilitis can use a single skill once in 3 minutes that will deal noticeable damage on people standing still 5+ seconds in a spot?
3 minutes? You must have some serious lag.
and it isn’t about standing still for 3 minutes. It’s about holding a point in PvP or fighting in a group in WvW.
He’s referring to the meteor+tornado shower combo, which is what most people kitten about (I’m not exactly sure why), and does have an irreducible cooldown of 3 minutes.
The skill has so many drawbacks, it’s hard to see why anyone would want to nerf it. In sPvP, it crits for roughly 3k per hit in full zerker without tornado, and around 5k with tornado, which is frankly not out of line at all when you consider the other drawbacks of the skill, and the fact that getting good damage out of this requires the sacrifice of all of your survivability.
It has a 3.5 second cast time, during which you are rooted and dance around enough that anyone with half a brain could figure out what you are doing (provided they already haven’t seen the giant balls of fire falling from the sky). It even has a built in delay and build-up time, meaning to use it you have to be reasonably certain both that you won’t get interrupted or that your target might decide to move ten feet.
These mechanics make it so that you will never be able to use it while on point, or even while anyone know’s you’re there.
Not to mention a build with no survivability, no serious dueling capabilities, no real ability to hold a point for fear of light breezes that might kill you, and long cooldowns should probably get something in return.
Protip: If you notice an elementalist dancing around and fire coming out of the sky, get off the kitten point for half a second.
What eles need is a buff to survivability and a nerf to meteor shower.
why?
because a build with no dueling nor small scale fights capabilitis can use a single skill once in 3 minutes that will deal noticeable damage on people standing still 5+ seconds in a spot?
3 minutes? You must have some serious lag.
and it isn’t about standing still for 3 minutes. It’s about holding a point in PvP or fighting in a group in WvW.
He’s referring to the meteor+tornado shower combo, which is what most people kitten about (I’m not exactly sure why), and does have an irreducible cooldown of 3 minutes.
Tornado buffs your stats, making meteor shower hit silly hard.
What eles need is a buff to survivability and a nerf to meteor shower.
why?
because a build with no dueling nor small scale fights capabilitis can use a single skill once in 3 minutes that will deal noticeable damage on people standing still 5+ seconds in a spot?
3 minutes? You must have some serious lag.
and it isn’t about standing still for 3 minutes. It’s about holding a point in PvP or fighting in a group in WvW.
He’s referring to the meteor+tornado shower combo, which is what most people kitten about (I’m not exactly sure why), and does have an irreducible cooldown of 3 minutes.
Tornado buffs your stats, making meteor shower hit silly hard.
It still doesn’t merit the complaints it gets. It’s super obvious and pretty avoidable, and pretty much the only use for tornado.
I’d rather eles get more debuffs through access to 1) boon removal and 2) more cover conditions like poison or torment.
But I actually feel that restoring some of that old condition removal ability would help them more.
(edited by Navzar.2938)
Revealed won’t help much against non-stealth classes.
If they are to be king of versatility, they need stealth as well, right? Underwater smoke field doesn’t count as it’s not a part of soloQ or TPvP. They could benefit from some sort of mechanism to protect their scrawny behinds. Give them unique teleports or unique CC.. something useful.
I wish they would remove Elemental Attunement, Evasive Arcane and Cantrip utility skills and THEN judge the profession based on the remaining options. It wager it would let you see things in a different light. The idea that arcane (primarily), water (for vitality, condition removal and healing) and Cantrips is vital and basically mandatory for builds that just want a bit of staying power in PvP is incredibly sad and despair-inviting.
Ele’s just need more survivability, that’s all. They have the lowest health/armor and have no base survivability mechanics like stealth or clones.
Abundance of healing skills and regen used to be a very good form of ele survivability but then all of them were decided to get nerfed altogether – SoR, Cleansing Water, Cleansing Wave, even the ability to heal while in Mist Form. They are now finally deciding to unnerf SoR in PVP. Let’s see how things go from there though.
But yeah, nerfing the survivability mechanics of a class will have drastic impact. And in the future patch, if mesmers DE nerf goes through, I don’t know what will happen to that class.
I’m fine with direct counters such as Revealed debuff accesible for all classes in the form of Utilities since these will basically be choices the player has to make in order to actually be effective against certain classes. But I really don’t think this is the solution for eles to be viable again. As has been said, it’s the sustain that’s the issue.
later. It doesn’t care that I’m there.”