Guild Wars 2

PvP has a running trend right now, every single warrior is using Berserker Stance with Endure Pain to survive longer. There is no real drawback other than recharge.

However, as annoying as it is, Warriors are not the issue with abusing glass with invincibility.

For those that is in a lot of top tier PvP, you know there is no worse offenders than Necromancers and Engineers.
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The Tool Kit Gear Shields 20 second (16 if you’re a smart engineer) recharge, making it the lowest in the game. Making it very difficult to focus when they can switch at anytime to pop their invincibility, yes, it’s blocking but the fact remains you are immune to all incoming damage.

Then Necromancers Deathshroud, it’s not invincibility technically but you are still blocking your health bar. Now, this wouldn’t be a big issue if they are allowed to do insane damage thanks to Deathly Perception.

Not to mention the condition spam that these two classes to deal out. A combination of conditions, high damage and the lowest invincibility recharge makes these two classes the go to damage dealers.
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I’m not going to go into skill balancing, that’s not the point.

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

It GREATLY limits high end PvP to favor classes with low recharge, damage denying skills that can dish out major damage.

The getting of out damage for X seconds free buttons with high damage needs to end for every class.

Why is it abuse to actively mitigate damage? Why is invulnerability only a problem on glass cannons? Why is Necromancer having two life bars overpowered?

Blocking isn’t the same as invulnerability. There are attacks that are unblockable. It’s your choice whether or not to take them.

Necromancer has two life bars, yes. And they don’t get easy access to aegis, vigor, blocks, general mobility, or INVULN. The class you specifically called out is probably the class with the LEAST amount of “get out of jail free cards.” You didn’t even call out the right class if your beef is with glass + damage mitigation.

Nova Stiker.8396:

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

It GREATLY limits high end PvP to favor classes with low recharge, damage denying skills that can dish out major damage.

The getting of out damage for X seconds free buttons with high damage needs to end for every class.

All the Glass Warriors with Berserker Stance & Endure Pain, all the Glass Engineers with Toolkit… all the Glass Necromancers with deathly perception.

What kind of burst meta are you playing in? Because surely it’s quite different than the one that everyone else is playing in. I would love to be playing GW2 in your world.

I rarely ever see Berserker amulet Warriors in high end tPvP – they’re mostly all soldier’s amulets. And even when they are Berserker, good luck calling one ‘glass’ with 20-30 pts in the Defense trait line as a given, with insanely high condition removal.

Glass Engineers simply don’t exist in competitive tPvP. Countered too hard by Thieves, Warriors, and Necromancers.

Glass Necromancers don’t exist in competitive tPvP either. Deathly perception? It might be good if you could actually run that build without getting mowed down by Thieves and Warriors.

It’s freaking hard to survive on a glass Engineer, Warrior, or Necromancer. Even with the active defenses that you would have torn to the ground. You’re calling out the professions with a few decent ‘get out of jail’ cards, but with overall the fewest? Look at all the active defense abilities Mesmer has, but it’s in a below-par state right now in tPvP too. These are needed for the professions to work, or be considered as a candidate for a successful glass cannon build.

I know that your problem is specifically with the active defense skills (Berserker Stance, Death Shroud, Gear Shield, Decoy), etc. Unfortunately if you mess with these things, then the glassy underdogs that depend on using these abilities with fast reflexes fall even farther behind.

I think that a better area to focus on are the blatantly over-represented defensive traits. Straight up tanky damage focused builds are what’s wrong, not the legitimate glass cannon builds that require proper cooldown management and twitch reflexes to survive.

The tPvP game has all-together lost the need to build glassy. Every player is risk-adverse when building their character, and the state of balance is that there simply isn’t enough benefit to building glassy. The tPvP experience has lost the feature of protecting/peeling for your squishy backliners. Right now, it’s all about cramming the most damage and control on to a basic foundation of super strong defensive traits.

Basically, active defense – good, straight up tanky damage builds – bad. At the same time, there has to be introduced counterplay to the active defense abilities (which is slightly lacking), but it’s a complex issue.

TLDR, I disagree with your vision/goals strongly, and feel that if you nerf active defenses, you only increase the lifespan of our current ‘safety’ meta. Which could be hopefully shifted back to a burst oriented meta.

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

It GREATLY limits high end PvP to favor classes with low recharge, damage denying skills that can dish out major damage.

The getting of out damage for X seconds free buttons with high damage needs to end for every class.

Glass Engineers simply don’t exist in competitive tPvP. Countered too hard by Thieves, Warriors, and Necromancers.

Glass Necromancers don’t exist in competitive tPvP either. Deathly perception? It might be good if you could actually run that build without getting mowed down by Thieves and Warriors.

I stopped reading after that. I’m talking about competitive PvP, not hot join.

tPvP is NOTHING but either glass/decap engineers, glass power necros, a single thief and one or two bunker guardians.

Now, thieves are definitely good for stopping any glass build but it’s part of the meta. You want to have one thief spiking people

There is also no such thing as a Warrior mowing in tPvP. I stomp Warriors all the time on my ‘underpowered’ Elementalist. Nerf pin down and boom, Warriors balanced and I might leave Lyssa Runes, the reduction/change to Healing Signet is utterly pointless in my opinion.

If you are a glass necromancer or engineer getting stomped by warriors, that is sad.

Like ArenaNet said, you can have high damage or high defense but you cannot have high damage and defense.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

It GREATLY limits high end PvP to favor classes with low recharge, damage denying skills that can dish out major damage.

The getting of out damage for X seconds free buttons with high damage needs to end for every class.

Glass Engineers simply don’t exist in competitive tPvP. Countered too hard by Thieves, Warriors, and Necromancers.

Glass Necromancers don’t exist in competitive tPvP either. Deathly perception? It might be good if you could actually run that build without getting mowed down by Thieves and Warriors.

I stopped reading after that. I’m talking about competitive PvP, not hot join.

tPvP is NOTHING but either glass/decap engineers, glass power necros, a single thief and one or two bunker guardians.

Now, thieves are definitely good for stopping any glass build but it’s part of the meta. You want to have one thief spiking people

There is also no such thing as a Warrior mowing in tPvP. I stomp Warriors all the time on my ‘underpowered’ Elementalist. Nerf pin down and boom, Warriors balanced and I might leave Lyssa Runes, the reduction/change to Healing Signet is utterly pointless in my opinion.

If you are a glass necromancer or engineer getting stomped by warriors, that is sad.

Funny how you don’t know who this “guy” (Chaith) you’re replying to is since you’re talking about competitive tPVP.

I’ve haven’t seen a single Power Engi for the past week in tPVP. Most are decap/bunkers while there are some condi nades build. Eles? They’re basically considered “dead” in tPVP because they’re countered really hard by thieves (shatter mesmers are getting fewer too). There have been a lot more HamBow warriors too and I wouldn’t call them glassy because they have at least 20 points in Defense paired with natural Heavy armor and high HP while dishing out strong damage.

Kyon.9735:

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

It GREATLY limits high end PvP to favor classes with low recharge, damage denying skills that can dish out major damage.

The getting of out damage for X seconds free buttons with high damage needs to end for every class.

Glass Engineers simply don’t exist in competitive tPvP. Countered too hard by Thieves, Warriors, and Necromancers.

Glass Necromancers don’t exist in competitive tPvP either. Deathly perception? It might be good if you could actually run that build without getting mowed down by Thieves and Warriors.

I stopped reading after that. I’m talking about competitive PvP, not hot join.

tPvP is NOTHING but either glass/decap engineers, glass power necros, a single thief and one or two bunker guardians.

Now, thieves are definitely good for stopping any glass build but it’s part of the meta. You want to have one thief spiking people

There is also no such thing as a Warrior mowing in tPvP. I stomp Warriors all the time on my ‘underpowered’ Elementalist. Nerf pin down and boom, Warriors balanced and I might leave Lyssa Runes, the reduction/change to Healing Signet is utterly pointless in my opinion.

If you are a glass necromancer or engineer getting stomped by warriors, that is sad.

Funny how you don’t know who this “guy” (Chaith) you’re replying to is since you’re talking about competitive tPVP.

I’ve haven’t seen a single Power Engi for the past 2 weeks in tPVP. Most are decap/bunkers. Eles? They’re basically considered “dead” in tPVP because they’re countered really hard by thieves (shatter mesmers are getting fewer too). There have been a lot more HamBow warriors too and I wouldn’t call them glassy because they have at least 20 points in Defense paired with natural Heavy armor and high HP while dishing out strong damage.

Chaith can never beat me in a duel and you cannot either. I know that for a fact.

What other build exists for Engineers that is viable other than decap or glass? Condition with Rabid? Utterly pointless, not when your grenades can land 30 seconds of poison and hit 6k, why have extra defense when you have Gear Shield on a 16 second recharge? Rabid or Berserker, that isn’t going to change the thief spiking you in his combo.
Sorry to say, you’ve been playing with and against a lot of bad engineers.

I also don’t know where your comment on Ele’s and Warriors came from. What I was getting at is Warriors fall off that skill can outplay them no matter what they use. Easy to master, falls off late.

That doesn’t mean they are useless, it does mean if you had a choice between a power necro or hambow, the choice is sadly obvious.

Nova Stiker.8396:

I stopped reading after that. I’m talking about competitive PvP, not hot join.

There is also no such thing as a Warrior mowing in tPvP. I stomp Warriors all the time on my ‘underpowered’ Elementalist. Nerf pin down and boom, Warriors balanced and I might leave Lyssa Runes, the reduction/change to Healing Signet is utterly pointless in my opinion.

If you are a glass necromancer or engineer getting stomped by warriors, that is sad.

Well you might want to read the rest of my post, because I am not talking about hotjoins. If you are a top player on EU than what I’m saying applies less to you, but right now, assuming I can draw experience as a high ranked player on NA.

I don’t really know how to respond to what you are saying because every word that you uttered was batsheit’ crazy. But I will attempt..

“tPvP is NOTHING but either glass/decap engineers, glass power necros, a single thief and one or two bunker guardians.”

On NA, tPvP is nothing but a Bunker Guardian, Soldier’s Hambow Warrior, Carrion Spirit Ranger, Berserker Thief, and the 5th is often a Carrion Dhuumfire/Terror Necro, a second Warrior, or a Rabid Engineer.

I’m 4th on the NA Team leaderboards, and I’ve fought every team on NA, and did my best to be in every NA tournament in the last 4 months, and rarely do you see a variation from that template above.

• There’s a huge difference between a Glass Engie and a Decap Engie. The only person who consistently plays Glass Engie that comes to mind in NA who could compete in Tournaments is Woodstock. Decap Engis we’ve seen, yes. Teams that run them often run one instead of a thief, like I said, if at all.

• I haven’t seen a glass Necro in a big tournament in months, man. I don’t even know who would do that. Dhuumfire/Terror/Master of Terror/Carrion Amulet is all that exists in NA, and Necros aren’t typically top picks despite having many strengths.

• No team in NA currently would consider 2 bunker Guardians.

• Your announcing that your Ele stomps the crap out of Warriors all the time leads me to believe that I am just buying into a convincing troll. The only Ele that I’ve seen in NA tournaments in the better part of a year was Chubbz on his staff support build, with Apex Prime.

• Nerf Pin Down and ‘boom’, Warriors balanced. Ok brah, whatever you say. Many disagree with that assessment, myself included.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith can never beat me in a duel and you cannot either. I know that for a fact.

LOL’d at this comment..

Nobody has called your dueling skills into question, there, sparky, we’re talking about the disturbing lack of knowledge you possess about tPvP meta builds and strategies.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Kyon.9735:

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

It GREATLY limits high end PvP to favor classes with low recharge, damage denying skills that can dish out major damage.

The getting of out damage for X seconds free buttons with high damage needs to end for every class.

Glass Engineers simply don’t exist in competitive tPvP. Countered too hard by Thieves, Warriors, and Necromancers.

Glass Necromancers don’t exist in competitive tPvP either. Deathly perception? It might be good if you could actually run that build without getting mowed down by Thieves and Warriors.

I stopped reading after that. I’m talking about competitive PvP, not hot join.

tPvP is NOTHING but either glass/decap engineers, glass power necros, a single thief and one or two bunker guardians.

Now, thieves are definitely good for stopping any glass build but it’s part of the meta. You want to have one thief spiking people

There is also no such thing as a Warrior mowing in tPvP. I stomp Warriors all the time on my ‘underpowered’ Elementalist. Nerf pin down and boom, Warriors balanced and I might leave Lyssa Runes, the reduction/change to Healing Signet is utterly pointless in my opinion.

If you are a glass necromancer or engineer getting stomped by warriors, that is sad.

Funny how you don’t know who this “guy” (Chaith) you’re replying to is since you’re talking about competitive tPVP.

I’ve haven’t seen a single Power Engi for the past 2 weeks in tPVP. Most are decap/bunkers. Eles? They’re basically considered “dead” in tPVP because they’re countered really hard by thieves (shatter mesmers are getting fewer too). There have been a lot more HamBow warriors too and I wouldn’t call them glassy because they have at least 20 points in Defense paired with natural Heavy armor and high HP while dishing out strong damage.

Chaith can never beat me in a duel and you cannot either. I know that for a fact.

“Fact” without proofs? Ok, I’m done here in this thread. Seems like you’re just QQ’ing cuz you got owned. Nothing good comes out from people with this kind of attitude.

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

The point is, low recharge invincibility + glass cannon builds has to end as skilled players know exactly when and how to abuse their get out of damage free cards and return favor with massive damage.

snip

All the Glass Warriors with Berserker Stance & Endure Pain, all the Glass Engineers with Toolkit… all the Glass Necromancers with deathly perception.

What kind of burst meta are you playing in? Because surely it’s quite different than the one that everyone else is playing in. I would love to be playing GW2 in your world.

snip
snip

I know that your problem is specifically with the active defense skills (Berserker Stance, Death Shroud, Gear Shield, Decoy), etc. Unfortunately if you mess with these things, then the glassy underdogs that depend on using these abilities with fast reflexes fall even farther behind.

I think that a better area to focus on are the blatantly over-represented defensive traits. Straight up tanky damage focused builds are what’s wrong, not the legitimate glass cannon builds that require proper cooldown management and twitch reflexes to survive.

The tPvP game has all-together lost the need to build glassy. Every player is risk-adverse when building their character, and the state of balance is that there simply isn’t enough benefit to building glassy. The tPvP experience has lost the feature of protecting/peeling for your squishy backliners. Right now, it’s all about cramming the most damage and control on to a basic foundation of super strong defensive traits.

Basically, active defense – good, straight up tanky damage builds – bad. At the same time, there has to be introduced counterplay to the active defense abilities (which is slightly lacking), but it’s a complex issue.

TLDR, I disagree with your vision/goals strongly, and feel that if you nerf active defenses, you only increase the lifespan of our current ‘safety’ meta. Which could be hopefully shifted back to a burst oriented meta.

I, too, wish to live in a world where glass Power Engi is viable and does not get put in a dumpster as soon as a Thief or Condi Necro or Soldier’s Hambow Warrior or Spirit Ranger or heck, even Mesmer shows up.

Only reason why glass Ele is viable right now is due to the speed of the burst with Fresh Air. In this game with glass v glass matchups, whoever bursts faster lives; and Rifle Power Engi takes significantly longer to unload than Zerker’s S/x Fresh Air Ele.

Playing a “40 second” build for Elementalist with 30 Air, 10 Earth, 30 Arcana (Bolt to the Heart, Air Training, Fresh Air, Stone Splinters, Renewing Stamina, Elemental Attunement, Evasive Arcana) with Ether Renewal, Cleansing Fire, Lightning Flash, Arcane Shield; I can unload the following in <5 seconds:

• Start Earth, Rock barrier, Hurl, Earthquake, LF in middle of Earthquake animation, hope for no Stability
• Switch to Air, Blinding Flash, Lightning Strike, Cleansing Fire
• Switch to Fire, Fire Grab, Phoenix, Ring of Fire, hope for crits
• Switch to Air for Arc lightning/Lightning Strike from Air 15.
• Hope opponent falls over.
  • Opening range is ~900, stunbreaker reserved, RTL reserved, Updraft reserved. Dragon’s Tooth should come back up in ~7-8 seconds at this point and coupled with Updraft, should be able to guard corpse in absence of overwhelming condi cleave.

Playing SD Engineer: (I run 30 Firearms with Sitting Duck, Rifle Mod, Modified Ammunition, 20 Alchemy for Invigorating Speed, Protection Injection, 20 Tools for Speedy Kits, Static Discharge). Utilities are Med Kit, Tool Kit, Rifle Turret, Utility Goggles. Time for combo is ~7-8 seconds due to heavy, heavy casts and aftercast animations.

• Utility Goggles and Analyse to open for Fury and 10 Vulnerability
• Net Shot to CC, hope for no dodges.
• Throw Wrench for more Vulnerability
• Jump Shot to CC’d target, hope for no interrupts or -Condition duration runes or cleanse in mean time
• Rifle Turret, Blunderbuss, doubletap Detonate and Surprise Shot
• Hope opponent falls over.
  • Opening range is <600. Stunbreaker burned Gear Shield Reserved. No poison uptime and no strong Interrupts.

I would actually say that in this instance glass “40 second ele” has more going for it than glass Engineer. Longer opening range, shorter time to burst, overall less risk due to uninterruptible RTL. Neither build has the capability to securely stomp, which is to be expected. I’m not seeing the problem here, Nova Stiker.

play a glass cannon necro, see how fast your DS is taken from you, then complain about them being invincible.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith can never beat me in a duel and you cannot either. I know that for a fact.

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith can never beat me in a duel and you cannot either. I know that for a fact.

I was changing my traits when you jumped me!
No bowing, I didn’t even swap from my bloodlust weapon, I get it, can’t win without cheating, it’s okay I understand you’re bad.

When you stop running I’ll be happy to duel you again.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith.8256:

Nova Stiker.8396:

Chaith can never beat me in a duel and you cannot either. I know that for a fact.

I was changing my traits when you jumped me!
No bowing, I didn’t even swap from my bloodlust weapon, I get it, can’t win without cheating, it’s okay I understand you’re bad.

When you stop running I’ll be happy to duel you again.

I can’t stop laughing

10/10 would read again

I love it when people who gloat too much are served reality via a quaggan spike.

Big explosions guaranteed.

Chaith, you are beautiful.

Much love for Chaith.

@Chaith start streaming again please