Guild Wars 2

calavel.6249:

Ganathar.4956:

Don’t say extra skills because we have already been over this, ele skills are generally inferior, with longer cooldowns and have to be comboed. Sadly this doesn’t only apply to weapon skills but it applies to utilities as well.

No, we have not been over this. You say ele skills have unusually long cooldowns, I say this isn’t true (apart from utilities). I’ll be more specific: Lots of ele weapon skills have short to average cooldowns compared to similar classes. The worst offenders are off-hand skills in general but there is nothing unusual about this. Mesmer and necro have long CD weapon skills as well (especially offhand), compare the skill lists. This is a feature of scholar classes, they are less spammy but each skill has greater potential when used right.

I looked at the wiki. It is true that necros and to a lesser extent mesmers have some high weapon skill cooldowns but eles have higher cooldowns across the board. Feel free to check. Also, from these 3 classes ele is the only one that has several 45 – 50 second cd weapon skills. In addition, many of the low cooldown ele weapon skills are very well telegraphed.

There is also a part of my argument that you didn’t address. The fact that many of the ele weapon skills are functionally inferior to those of other classes. Here is a very good example.

Eles have Windborne Speed in staff while warriors have charge in warhorn.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Windborne_Speed
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Charge_%28warrior_skill%29

Charge is simply better. The only thing that windborne speed has over charge is that it has a cast time of 1/4 instead of 1/2

calavel.6249:

No, we have not been over this. You say ele skills have unusually long cooldowns, I say this isn’t true (apart from utilities). I’ll be more specific: Lots of ele weapon skills have short to average cooldowns compared to similar classes. The worst offenders are off-hand skills in general but there is nothing unusual about this. Mesmer and necro have long CD weapon skills as well (especially offhand), compare the skill lists. This is a feature of scholar classes, they are less spammy but each skill has greater potential when used right.

I think most our skills have pretty long cooldowns, are less powerful overall, and don’t have a great deal of control/mobility.

I’m not trying to convince you, like I said. I’m telling you my set of facts.

I can appreciate you stand on the other side of the argument. You’re one of two people thus far who are against this change, which really would have no consequence on the game.

What we’re asking for is access to our other weapon sets at a normal pace. We’ll be affected the same by chill as every other class in that we won’t have access to skills we recently used, but if we were specifically saving a control skill for example, and we switched, that skill is locked out for an abnormally long time. We’re not gaining any edge by having our attunements unaffected by chill. We’re not seeing any unfair bonuses. Just access to — like you said — a well planned out battle.

I like to reserve certain things or time things out, as — like you said — we have to plan well and play smart. We can’t plan for chill. Plain and simple.

If you still disagree you disagree. That is all. No point in arguing further

Mbelch.9028:

If you still disagree you disagree. That is all. No point in arguing further

Fair enough. I guess it all comes down to whether you think it’s fair that a condition can mess with a class mechanic (that doubles as swap). If it’s any consolation I would consider this a serious problem if we were talking about bleed or some other endlessly-spammable-by-most-classes condition. Since it’s chilled, I still think it’s mostly a necro/ele/weird spirit ranger vs. ele problem and not a large overall balance issue. And speaking of necros, everyone knows they are completely broken condition-wise. Can’t be long until something gets changed there.

Fair enough there.

Every class has access, and many can maintain perma chill via condi duration, runes and sigils. But not many go for it.

But even in small teams, spvp, gvgs and zergs chill is a reality. I don’t want anything to change with that. I think it’s an interesting condition (certainly better than torment >_> don’t get me started) and deserves to stay around.

I don’t think they’ll change much about necro, and runes and sigils make this condi prevalent in 1v1s, so I hope this change occurs.

Thanks for presenting a different view on the argument.

I’d really love for ANet to give a comment to us on how they feel.

“They can build for it but they don’t use it because Spirit/Bunker is far more useful in pvp. As for WvW, everybody knows how underpowered they are.”

So, you’re saying that a spirit ranger can run a chill spec build around one spirit skill with a 40 sec cd ?

“I’m on a server with two of the best rangers who play the game. They can maintain perma chill. I’m mostly a WvWer and there are some nasty perma chill ranger builds out there. Spirits are less effective in WvW.”

I’ve never seen a chill spec ranger (i’ve played my ranger for 2,700 hours and i mostly play solo roaming/small scale if we need those types of arguments).

- One weapon skill among 30+ can chill ( 3 sec based on a 10 sec cd).
- You can use two pets with same f2 ( between 2 or 3 sec based for 20/30 cd) with pet swapping cd.
- One trap or one spirit skill wich are not in the same spec. (30 and 40 sec cd).

Bunker can maintain a high poison pressure and high burning pressure, yes. But there is no viable chill spec for ranger like necro can do.

borya.2964:

“They can build for it but they don’t use it because Spirit/Bunker is far more useful in pvp. As for WvW, everybody knows how underpowered they are.”

But there is no viable chill spec for ranger like necro can do.

This is what I’m saying. They have good access to Chill Condition through Axe and utility skills along with sigil of hydromancy so they can build for it but it is not viable because they’re better off with other builds. Same goes with elementalist, they can build for chill skills (dagger/focus plus Water Signet and sigil of hydromancy) but they’d be good for nothing but chill. The reason why it is viable to necros is because their Chill skills goes along with their viable builds.

Why does that little detail matter?

And I’ve watched the perma chill ranger build wreck people in WvW. Just call up Tanbin and ask him.

That little detail isn’t important. Chill is prevalent and every class can access it frequently enough that ele is affected in a good deal of fights.

I have always thought eles should be immune to or lose a condition that matches the attunment they are in.

example

fire attunment, cant be set ablaze or swapping to removes burning.
water, cant be chilled
air, cant be crippled
earth, weakness

this is just a quick example, but i think it would be an interesting trait possibility. even if you needed to go 5 to 15 deep into each element to get that ability.

Valinor.9647:

I have always thought eles should be immune to or lose a condition that matches the attunment they are in.

example

fire attunment, cant be set ablaze or swapping to removes burning.
water, cant be chilled
air, cant be crippled
earth, weakness

this is just a quick example, but i think it would be an interesting trait possibility. even if you needed to go 5 to 15 deep into each element to get that ability.

Immunity to burning would be very powerful since burn is arguably one of the nastier conditions. Maybe as a major trait it would be balanced. Cripple immunity also seems very powerful but I’m all for the rest.

That trait was brought up before I think on page two.

It’s an interesting idea, but not necessarily a fix for what I perceive this problem to be.

If the trait were to work, I’d say it would need to cure X condition and make you immune to it while in that element.

Air should be less powerful like blind. (This would also help a little with missed RTLs, blind can be applied while riding the lightning)

But earth should definitely be immobilize I think.

If it worked with lingering elements it’d be even better.

Mbelch.9028:

That trait was brought up before I think on page two.

It’s an interesting idea, but not necessarily a fix for what I perceive this problem to be.

If the trait were to work, I’d say it would need to cure X condition and make you immune to it while in that element.

Air should be less powerful like blind. (This would also help a little with missed RTLs, blind can be applied while riding the lightning)

But earth should definitely be immobilize I think.

If it worked with lingering elements it’d be even better.

At the risk of going off topic

Personally, any immunity trait, no matter how situational, is just asking for abuse. If not at the time of implementation, then far, far down the track. Automated Response for Engineer as an example was an Immunity trait since launch. Yet only now is it seeing use and abuse given the proliferation of Rabid or Dire setups with little Power damage output – and this is even with the fact that pre-existing conditions are not cleansed. AR abuse has led to the Decap Engineer setup that aims to sit at around the 25% threshold with regeneration and other slow healing traits. The same thing could well occur with Diamond skin if left untouched and Signet of Restoration is ever buffed, or Stow Weapon+1 spam to eliminate aftercast is exploited to increase effective HPS.

Even if only situational immunity exists such as to particular conditions on particular attunements, the potential for exploitation will remain. I would rather that traits like Diamond skin or AR or any other immunity trait discard immunity entirely in favour of a different mechanic.

One of the persisting issues with Elementalist is that specialisation within trait lines is still very much prevalent. Fire works off of Burning procs or Fire Fields and lacks Cleansing (Burning Fire is terrible before you start, adept tier at best), Air lacks defense (Fresh Air would be less abusable if Air 15 was Blinding Flash instead of Lightning Strike), Earth lacks offense, and Water’s meagre offensive abilities are entirely overshadowed by the defensive abilities, especially now that Bountiful Power has been nerfed. Only Arcana has enough broad base applicability that it is the de jour line for investment.

I would rather that Diamond Skin as a GM Major trait instead be:

• 10% of Toughness becomes Condition damage, 10% of Toughness becomes Power (Combining old Diamond Skin with Warrior’s Armoured Attack for a hybrid tanky DPS)
  or
• When you are afflicted with a condition by a foe within 600 units, your foe suffers it also. Gain 1 stack of Might for 5 seconds for each incoming condition. ICD of 1 second. (Getting into Mesmer Territory with Mirror of Anguish ) but removes the hard counter gameplay and makes Elementalist get stronger the more conditions are spammed against its low HP pool.

All of this discussion is off topic, however. I would recommend that a new thread discussing Diamond Skin and associated traits be created instead.

Interesting suggestions. I have a few comments back but we may as well get that thread started. Where would you like it? Balance or Ele forum?

On topic again now :p

Devs, please. Still waiting for some kind of feedback.

On a sidenote my friend got hacked last saturday. He posted on the forums and filed a ticket but still no feedback whatsoever. Maybe Anet is slacking off as a whole -.-

I was leaving this thread alone earlier, but after playing a lot of sPvP today…

Please fix this. This is such a death sentence it isn’t even funny.

I think that WITH 30 Arcane, Chill makes Attunements have a SIXTEEN second recharge time. And at base, they have a 21 SECOND COOLDOWN.

That’s insane, dude. I don’t see how anyone could think that’s alright.

Ryld, thanks for speaking up. Yes it becomes out of hand. And part of the issue is many of our ways to remove condi are everything or nothing. Like if traited for Cantrips in 30 water, cleansing fire removes 4 condis. I wouldn’t just bust that for chill. Switching to water will remove several. I won’t just bust that for chill. Because as soon as you leave water or bust cleansing fire, you get a condition nuke and have NO way to remove it.

Basically for elementalists — it’s die or die. GL;HF.

I’ve had players use chill and bleeds very well against me in that I can’t just use one condi removal.

Kyon, I won’t comment on your friends situation, but I know the devs certainly are busy with ranger stuff. My only beef is the question “who needs help most” was answered with rangers, and eles were a close second. So don’t ignore us, help us, too…

Mbelch.9028:

Kyon, I won’t comment on your friends situation, but I know the devs certainly are busy with ranger stuff. My only beef is the question “who needs help most” was answered with rangers, and eles were a close second. So don’t ignore us, help us, too…

You really don’t want the kind of help that thread has been giving.

I believe it, Bran. Just a little love verbally thrown our way would go a long way IMO.

Ganathar.4956:

Andele.1306:

Ganathar.4956:

Finally the other benefit of attunements is the 20 skills, which is null and void because of it’s counterbalance of having them be inferior.

Tis not like you have a massive amount of self finishers or that each element has a skill thats on a total of 1.4+ power ratio.

Class is reliant on self finishing unlike other classes. This also means that other classes get stronger when they are with friends who have fields while eles stay the same.
Also having a skill with 1.4+ power ratio is nothing special, there are many skills in the game with a way bigger coefficient, just check the wiki.

Finally damage is not the only thing the matters, cooldowns, defense and utility are all extremely important. Keep in mind that you are talking about the squishiest class which also happens to have less useful defensive utilities than the class with the most health and armor.

No profession can throw 4 of them in a row, thats kinda the point of being able to.
Also kitten please if someone has hybrid utilities (aka both defensive and offensive at once) its ele, compare to my necro who has a cheeze 1v1 fake invul and the only 2 mobility moves having kinda giant icons showing where i port to if at all/not get cced to hell and back.
Give me lightning hammer i give you flesh wurm, give me shield i give you spectral armor.
Doesnt mean ele aint kittened by chill unlike no other but you aint bloody weak just spoiled from choice, just as those whiny kittens that caused dhuumfire to be a thing.

Andele.1306:

Ganathar.4956:

Andele.1306:

Ganathar.4956:

Finally the other benefit of attunements is the 20 skills, which is null and void because of it’s counterbalance of having them be inferior.

Tis not like you have a massive amount of self finishers or that each element has a skill thats on a total of 1.4+ power ratio.

Class is reliant on self finishing unlike other classes. This also means that other classes get stronger when they are with friends who have fields while eles stay the same.
Also having a skill with 1.4+ power ratio is nothing special, there are many skills in the game with a way bigger coefficient, just check the wiki.

Finally damage is not the only thing the matters, cooldowns, defense and utility are all extremely important. Keep in mind that you are talking about the squishiest class which also happens to have less useful defensive utilities than the class with the most health and armor.

No profession can throw 4 of them in a row, thats kinda the point of being able to.
Also kitten please if someone has hybrid utilities (aka both defensive and offensive at once) its ele, compare to my necro who has a cheeze 1v1 fake invul and the only 2 mobility moves having kinda giant icons showing where i port to if at all/not get cced to hell and back.
Give me lightning hammer i give you flesh wurm, give me shield i give you spectral armor.
Doesnt mean ele aint kittened by chill unlike no other but you aint bloody weak just spoiled from choice, just as those whiny kittens that caused dhuumfire to be a thing.

4 of what in a row? Finishers? Because Engineer.

And I’d trade Spectral Armor for Arcane Shield any day. Arcane Shield is so bloody bad.

And yes, Elementalists in sPvP are pretty bad.

Andele.1306:

Ganathar.4956:

Andele.1306:

Ganathar.4956:

Finally the other benefit of attunements is the 20 skills, which is null and void because of it’s counterbalance of having them be inferior.

Tis not like you have a massive amount of self finishers or that each element has a skill thats on a total of 1.4+ power ratio.

Class is reliant on self finishing unlike other classes. This also means that other classes get stronger when they are with friends who have fields while eles stay the same.
Also having a skill with 1.4+ power ratio is nothing special, there are many skills in the game with a way bigger coefficient, just check the wiki.

Finally damage is not the only thing the matters, cooldowns, defense and utility are all extremely important. Keep in mind that you are talking about the squishiest class which also happens to have less useful defensive utilities than the class with the most health and armor.

Also kitten please if someone has hybrid utilities (aka both defensive and offensive at once) its ele, compare to my necro who has a cheeze 1v1 fake invul and the only 2 mobility moves having kinda giant icons showing where i port to if at all/not get cced to hell and back.

Are you serious? Thieves obviously has the most access to Hybrid skills. Offensive skills that have evasion frames and are very spammable.

And like Ryld said, Engineers have more access to blast finishers, even elite skill Supply Crate can be used as a blast finisher.

Seems like you have your “facts” wrong.

His facts may be wrong but even he admits eles are affected “by chill like no other.”

So it should be changed

Mbelch.9028:

His facts may be wrong but even he admits eles are affected “by chill like no other.”

So it should be changed

Sorry, I might have jumped the gun. I got a bit too edgy because I might have misinterpreted him saying “my necro got nerfed and is as weak as hell so you don’t deserve to be fixed.”

Kyon.9735:

Mbelch.9028:

His facts may be wrong but even he admits eles are affected “by chill like no other.”

So it should be changed

Sorry, I might have jumped the gun. I got a bit too edgy because I might have misinterpreted him saying “my necro got nerfed and is as weak as hell so you don’t deserve to be fixed.”

He was edgy as hell first :p I’m just interpreting his statement’s relevancy in this thread.

Well. Over 3000 views. Wonder if any of them were a Dev. I’d love a comment pretty please.

Mbelch.9028:

Well. Over 3000 views. Wonder if any of them were a Dev. I’d love a comment pretty please.

Looks like we will have to wait for the ele CDI when the Devs will actually pay attention to our issues. Until then, I believe that asking them to look at this thread is a waste of time.

Well it’d be a waste to let the thread die.

Mbelch.9028:

Well it’d be a waste to let the thread die.

Yeah, but we can’t just keep bumping without having anything constructive to post.
So here is one for you. If I am not mistaken, another inconsistency is that attunements proc confusion while weapon swaps don’t. Even though confusion isn’t as severe as chill I think that this is another issue that should be brought up in the CDI.

Also confusion is probably more severe for engi kits because engis swap more often, so that is definitely something that needs a fix.

Perhaps you could collectively start posting using that CDI proposal template on how/why/what on the whole chill thing.

Best case: They see something they like and you gets some feedback. Worst case: they announce “working as intended”.

So it’s been 2 weeks. What’s up, Anet?

I believe this is relevant to bring to the top again, especially given a topic I saw about thieves not affected by chill.

So. TTT.

Mbelch.9028:

I believe this is relevant to bring to the top again, especially given a topic I saw about thieves not affected by chill.

So. TTT.

If you’re referring to this thread it is interesting to see the Thieves attempt to justify their double standard position. That being said, it is likewise difficult to make a cooldown-agnostic class like Thief susceptible to Chill in a way that is “equitable” when it is very much an apples-and-oranges scenario. It’s a no-win for either side but having said that leaving Thieves completely unaffected by Chill was probably the wrong step for Arenanet to take. Thieves with Shadowsteps already bypass the snare portion of Chill and Initiative bypasses the rest. Possibly the only solution I could see is to make either cast times longer for Thief, or to decrease Initiative by a degree lesser than 66%, or increasing Initiative costs by 1-2.

As for Lily it is interesting to see the hysterical kneejerk posts against him when he was – and still is – one of the top players in the game .

Having said that, I do hope that Chill affecting Attunements is fixed. If not in the feature patch, then in the followup patches. The nerfs to Elementalist condition clear have really emphasised the deficiencies and secondary mechanics to Elementalist in recent times and it is just one aspect in a long line of problems every profession faces.

I find it rediculous. It affects everything on the ele and almost nothing on the thief. Attunement recharge rate should not be affected, unless Anet wishes to change it to affect every professions weapon swap CD.

That, and it needs to affect thieves and their initiative accumulation.

Malcastus.6240:

I find it rediculous. It affects everything on the ele and almost nothing on the thief. Attunement recharge rate should not be affected, unless Anet wishes to change it to affect every professions weapon swap CD.

That, and it needs to affect thieves and their initiative accumulation.

This is actually a strange claim when you think about it.

Attumenets are Elementalist “weapon swap”, but they are also the Elementalist class-mechanic. Just like Initiative is the Thieves class mechanic.

You are asking that Elementalist class mechanic is no longer affected by Chill, but then you are turning around and harping on Thieves because they are the only ones who have a class mechanic that isnt affected by Chill. And saying theirs should.

In my opinion no one should have their class mechanic exempt from Chill, and so thieves should be made to have Initiative effected by Chill aswell. Not a straight 66% carry-over, thats absurd given how the mechanic is very diffirent, but noticeable nonetheless.
But in the same way, i do not believe Elementalist should have their attunements completely unaffected by Chill either.

It may be the equivalent of a weaponswap, offering alternative nr#1-5 skills, but it is still a class mechanic and not actually a weaponswap. I also dont believe it was an oversight but done on purpose, as part of the tradeoff for all the extra weapon skills.

And therein lies the core of the problem for me, its not that Chill is to powerful its just that Attunements as a mechanic are to weak. And rather then making Elementalists another exception and exempting them from consequences other professions suffer from, similar to Thief.
I believe it is Attunements themselves that need to be buffed. I find the baseline cooldown still to long.

But a far bigger problem is that Attunements are often so poor on their own. That should you be forced to stay in an attunement longer due to Chill to have very little you can do while in this attunement. Because each individual attunement often just lacks real potency.

I play D/D myself, say i get into Earth. What do i have? A weak AA, a gapcloser that works rather clunky as a semi-CC, and an aoe cripple. On my off-hand two massively long cooldowns of 45sec aoe knockdown and a 30sec highly telegraphed, long channeled aoe.
Very rapidly will i exhaust my options, and as such my reason to stay in Earth. And thats just one example, the other attunements arent much better.

And thats what i see as the problem. A warrior or a thief can fight perfectly fine with just 1 weapon set, using the other for CC or mobility almost exclusively. Yet an elementalist that sticks to 1 attunement will quickly run out of abilities to cast, due to a lack of power or massive and unreasonable cooldowns.

Thats why Chill is perceived as this overpowered condition, because when you are locked into an attunement longer you have nothing left to do in that attunement. And i think that is perhaps a far bigger concern.

Terrahero.9358:

Malcastus.6240:

I find it rediculous. It affects everything on the ele and almost nothing on the thief. Attunement recharge rate should not be affected, unless Anet wishes to change it to affect every professions weapon swap CD.

That, and it needs to affect thieves and their initiative accumulation.

snip

Hm, and I thought that our long and unwarranted cooldowns and having to use 3 times the abilities to be as effective as other classes was our special mechanic…

Terrahero.9358:

Malcastus.6240:

I find it rediculous. It affects everything on the ele and almost nothing on the thief. Attunement recharge rate should not be affected, unless Anet wishes to change it to affect every professions weapon swap CD.

That, and it needs to affect thieves and their initiative accumulation.

This is actually a strange claim when you think about it.

Attumenets are Elementalist “weapon swap”, but they are also the Elementalist class-mechanic. Just like Initiative is the Thieves class mechanic.

You are asking that Elementalist class mechanic is no longer affected by Chill, but then you are turning around and harping on Thieves because they are the only ones who have a class mechanic that isnt affected by Chill. And saying theirs should.

In my opinion no one should have their class mechanic exempt from Chill, and so thieves should be made to have Initiative effected by Chill aswell. Not a straight 66% carry-over, thats absurd given how the mechanic is very diffirent, but noticeable nonetheless.
But in the same way, i do not believe Elementalist should have their attunements completely unaffected by Chill either.

It may be the equivalent of a weaponswap, offering alternative nr#1-5 skills, but it is still a class mechanic and not actually a weaponswap. I also dont believe it was an oversight but done on purpose, as part of the tradeoff for all the extra weapon skills.

And therein lies the core of the problem for me, its not that Chill is to powerful its just that Attunements as a mechanic are to weak. And rather then making Elementalists another exception and exempting them from consequences other professions suffer from, similar to Thief.
I believe it is Attunements themselves that need to be buffed. I find the baseline cooldown still to long.

But a far bigger problem is that Attunements are often so poor on their own. That should you be forced to stay in an attunement longer due to Chill to have very little you can do while in this attunement. Because each individual attunement often just lacks real potency.

I play D/D myself, say i get into Earth. What do i have? A weak AA, a gapcloser that works rather clunky as a semi-CC, and an aoe cripple. On my off-hand two massively long cooldowns of 45sec aoe knockdown and a 30sec highly telegraphed, long channeled aoe.
Very rapidly will i exhaust my options, and as such my reason to stay in Earth. And thats just one example, the other attunements arent much better.

And thats what i see as the problem. A warrior or a thief can fight perfectly fine with just 1 weapon set, using the other for CC or mobility almost exclusively. Yet an elementalist that sticks to 1 attunement will quickly run out of abilities to cast, due to a lack of power or massive and unreasonable cooldowns.

Thats why Chill is perceived as this overpowered condition, because when you are locked into an attunement longer you have nothing left to do in that attunement. And i think that is perhaps a far bigger concern.

This is also a very good point. Being “locked” into an attunement is mainly due to the vast disparities in autoattack damage output and utility though. Instead of making Elementalist able to play 1-3 attunements Arenanet chose to emphasise the “attunement dancing” aspect of Elementalist and in so doing inadvertently made the Arcana traitline pretty much necessary for all builds.

The solution is not going to be easy as it would essentially require a complete 180 in Arenanet’s design direction. But, here are a few intermediate steps on the way to making this possible and indirectly reducing the impact of Chill on the attunement dancing Ele:

1. Increasing autoattacks damage output/reliability for Dagger and Scepter outside of Air attunement; and outside of Fire for Staff.
2. Making Pyromancer’s/Aeromancer’s/Geomancer’s/Aquamancer’s Alacrity decrease Fire/Air/Earth/Water attunement CD as well (down to minimum of 10 seconds) <- This is probably the single most important step
3. Diversification of functions previously limited to certain Attunements across more attunements. Condition cleansing, for example, should not be localised to Water Attunement. Fire should allow cleansing by Blasting combo Fields, Air should allow cleansing on Blinding and Interrupts, Earth should allow cleansing through condition transfers/application of snares, or Reaping conditions to deal extra damage for each condition cleansed (both self and enemy). Similarly, functions like snares should not be the exclusive purview of Water and Earth.

Terrahero.9358:

Malcastus.6240:

I find it rediculous. It affects everything on the ele and almost nothing on the thief. Attunement recharge rate should not be affected, unless Anet wishes to change it to affect every professions weapon swap CD.

That, and it needs to affect thieves and their initiative accumulation.

This is actually a strange claim when you think about it.

Attumenets are Elementalist “weapon swap”, but they are also the Elementalist class-mechanic. Just like Initiative is the Thieves class mechanic.

You are asking that Elementalist class mechanic is no longer affected by Chill, but then you are turning around and harping on Thieves because they are the only ones who have a class mechanic that isnt affected by Chill. And saying theirs should.

In my opinion no one should have their class mechanic exempt from Chill, and so thieves should be made to have Initiative effected by Chill aswell. Not a straight 66% carry-over, thats absurd given how the mechanic is very diffirent, but noticeable nonetheless.
But in the same way, i do not believe Elementalist should have their attunements completely unaffected by Chill either.

It may be the equivalent of a weaponswap, offering alternative nr#1-5 skills, but it is still a class mechanic and not actually a weaponswap. I also dont believe it was an oversight but done on purpose, as part of the tradeoff for all the extra weapon skills.

And therein lies the core of the problem for me, its not that Chill is to powerful its just that Attunements as a mechanic are to weak. And rather then making Elementalists another exception and exempting them from consequences other professions suffer from, similar to Thief.
I believe it is Attunements themselves that need to be buffed. I find the baseline cooldown still to long.

But a far bigger problem is that Attunements are often so poor on their own. That should you be forced to stay in an attunement longer due to Chill to have very little you can do while in this attunement. Because each individual attunement often just lacks real potency.

I play D/D myself, say i get into Earth. What do i have? A weak AA, a gapcloser that works rather clunky as a semi-CC, and an aoe cripple. On my off-hand two massively long cooldowns of 45sec aoe knockdown and a 30sec highly telegraphed, long channeled aoe.
Very rapidly will i exhaust my options, and as such my reason to stay in Earth. And thats just one example, the other attunements arent much better.

And thats what i see as the problem. A warrior or a thief can fight perfectly fine with just 1 weapon set, using the other for CC or mobility almost exclusively. Yet an elementalist that sticks to 1 attunement will quickly run out of abilities to cast, due to a lack of power or massive and unreasonable cooldowns.

Thats why Chill is perceived as this overpowered condition, because when you are locked into an attunement longer you have nothing left to do in that attunement. And i think that is perhaps a far bigger concern.

Well may be it should not effect it’s class mechanic but it should do something to Thief.

At the moment, other then Thief walking slowly after it kills you, it does absolutely nothing to a Thief.

I have a D/D Ele build that can load extreme amount of chill to people, you can’t believe how ineffective is against all professions other then Elementalist.

Warrior – Hambox Cleansing Irre/ Dodging March (do I have to say anything)
Thief – no effect
Necro – loading conditions to Necro you must be kidding
Engi – Automated Response (I wished Diamond Skin will %10 effective as this one)
Ranger – Sprit take cares everything for Engi
Guardian – you don’t really mean Guardian has problem cleaning conditions or?
Mesmer’s – well PUs doesn’t have any problem with it other specs, I don’t know that much
Ele – screwed big time with, either you go to every available cleane trait/heal/skill and you will deal no damage or you will die from it.