Sadly every class is imbalanced

Sadly every class is imbalanced

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Posted by: glock.6590

glock.6590

After playing a lot of PvP and reaching minimum top 200 on both leaderboards( top 80 in solo Q) I noticed that every class doesn’t feel very balanced. Even the one I play which is thief is kinda overpowered in some situations.

I’ll start with my own class .

Thief- I really think the steal ability is overpowered when traited 30 in trickery. It has no cast time and deals too much damage on other glass cannons

Engineer- The passive burning damage that cannot be avoided is too strong ,it needs counter play and supply crate is imabalnced in spvp where you have to stand on point. And the turret build is too effective for the effort it requires. Huge problem in spvp , especially in solo Q.

Elementalist- I think protection is just too strong in general to give it away so easely. The standard Dagger/Dagger build has nearly perma protection. The duration needs to be reduced.

Mesmer- In my opinion they are balanced ( but maybe because I’m a thief , they are very easy kills for me)

Warrior- I think the warrior is balanced too but then again I think we thieves counter warriors fairly well so I might be biased.

Guardian- I really think the glass cannon meditation guardian has too much durability for the damage output. Maybe reducing the base healing of meditation would help.

Ranger- Honestly the only thing I hate about rangers is their downed state. They can interupt the stomp about 4 times and then self res. It is incredibly annoying.

Lastly Necro. Again the passive fears need to be toned down for more counter play.

That’s it folks!

6’4’’ Master Race. I am Above You.

(edited by glock.6590)

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Posted by: Jim Hunter.6821

Jim Hunter.6821

So anything that is challenging to fight against with your chosen build/profession isn’t balanced. Anything you can easily beat with your chosen build/profession is balanced…

Pretty much sums up every thread on this forum doesn’kitten

Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN

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Posted by: Kypriathe.4183

Kypriathe.4183

If it’s an easy kill then the class is balanced? Seems legit.

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Posted by: glock.6590

glock.6590

If it’s an easy kill then the class is balanced? Seems legit.

An easy kill for me dosent mean an easy kill for others. I’m sure mesmers wreck warriors and engineers pretty hard but for us thieves , mesmer is a free kill.

6’4’’ Master Race. I am Above You.

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Posted by: Lucentfir.7430

Lucentfir.7430

After playing a lot of PvP and reaching minimum top 200 on both leaderboards( top 80 in solo Q) I noticed that every class doesn’t feel very balanced. Even the one I play which is thief is kinda overpowered in some situations.

I’ll start with my own class .

Thief- I really think the steal ability is overpowered when traited 30 in trickery. It has no cast time and deals too much damage on other glass cannons

Engineer- The passive burning damage that cannot be avoided is too strong ,it needs counter play and supply crate is imabalnced in spvp where you have to stand on point. And the turret build is too effective for the effort it requires. Huge problem in spvp , especially in solo Q.

Elementalist- I think protection is just too strong in general to give it away so easely. The standard Dagger/Dagger build has nearly perma protection. The duration needs to be reduced.

Mesmer- In my opinion they are balanced ( but maybe because I’m a thief , they are very easy kills for me)

Warrior- I think the warrior is balanced too but then again I think we thieves counter warriors fairly well so I might be biased.

Guardian- I really think the glass cannon meditation guardian has too much durability for the damage output. Maybe reducing the base healing of meditation would help.

Ranger- Honestly the only thing I hate about rangers is their downed state. They can interupt the stomp about 4 times and then self res. It is incredibly annoying.

Lastly Necro. Again the passive fears need to be toned down for more counter play.

That’s it folks!

Steal thief with sleight of hand and mug requires a 8 point investment to make the build. Steal itself dosen’t do damage unless traited too, and if playing down that path you’re very squishy and prone to burst.

Medi Guardian, the class is turtle slow without traveler’s the bursts are telegraphed and easy to see and easy to predict. It’s a melee class that really has no good CC outside of hammer. Durability is in forms of 2k burst heals with short to long CDs with a low health pool. Without any of those things how would you expect a guardian to stay in a fight, team fights especially. They are relatively squishy and alot of their defenses are active not passive.

Necro doesn’t have any passive fears unless you trait 4 in death magic for Reaper’s protection which fears upon getting CC’d on a lengthy CD. Passive fear procs are most likely nightmare runes.

Mesmers have the ability to instagib most glass cannons if caught in a shatter combo, including thief. Another build would a PU condi build which you can’t kill but it’s not really good in Spvp which is about holding points.

Reth Grimrazor – Charr Guardian – [GWB]Grim Warband – Tarnished Coast
Redgen Furyblaze – Charr Guardian – [SHD]Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast
Lerious Warhowl – Charr Warrior – [SHD] Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast

(edited by Lucentfir.7430)

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Posted by: Anubis.7058

Anubis.7058

Nightmare runes annoying thus nerf necro.
Dont have cleanse when fighting engie thus op.
Guardian, the profession built on heal/block to augment low hp, on medi build, arguably the 3rd biggest pre cast combo build, thus actively easy to avoid with a block or stealth, too much healing for its damage.

Logic.

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Posted by: shimmerless.4560

shimmerless.4560

Thief wouldn’t be viable without trickery. It has been designed for 1v1 so its normal to not have counter play. I agree about passive engi and necro though . IP , nightmare and repear all need a nerf.

Medi guard is an OK 1v1 spec but has mediocre mobility so its not a big deal. I’d say only engi and ele are OP atm just because of celestial .

Thief has been viable since launch and back then no one went past 15 in Trickery, the standard was 25/30/0/0/15 (this was still common for a long time after the class line changes). When Mug was nerfed ANet buffed a lot of other traits to compensate, naturally being ANet they went way too far with Trickery XII so we’ve been stuck with it until the next flavor of the month (Panic Strike) rolled around.

Steal in general has been revamped and buffed to the point where it suffers from serious bloat once traited, it’s not uncommon (even on DA/non-Trickery) for steal to do ten different things. Now this means that landing steal is critically important for said specs, but steal is 100% instant cast with zero warning… yes, the class mechanic can end up being countered by completely random dodges or evades. How in the world anyone thinks this is healthy or intelligent gameplay is beyond me. It is pure feast or famine based on the worst kind of randomness.

Personally I don’t think any of the classes are really balanced, they all have too many frustrating or silly aspects to them when abused properly.

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Posted by: Simon.3794

Simon.3794

Lol, thief is probably class which counter warriors the least, also necro when fighting on point. Ele is just as hard if not harder to kill then hambow while do more damage. Warrior with adrenaline nerfed is pretty much dead as long berserker stance is on CD against any condition build. and mesmers. nothing more i can say. hambow is still the only serious tpvp build cuz gimmick.

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Posted by: glock.6590

glock.6590

@atse: true but they could buff the thief somewhere else if they nerf trickery
@ Simon: Im not an amazing player and I never got killed by a hambow in 1v1. Unless the warrior is shouts bunker , thieves have the advantage in 1v1.

6’4’’ Master Race. I am Above You.

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Posted by: Aberrant.6749

Aberrant.6749

So anything that is challenging to fight against with your chosen build/profession isn’t balanced. Anything you can easily beat with your chosen build/profession is balanced…

Pretty much sums up every thread on this forum doesn’kitten

Unfortunately yes. I wish people wouldn’t choose a specific class to identify with as much as they do. Seeing the bigger picture is very important.

Tarnished Coast
Salvage 4 Profit + MF Guide – http://tinyurl.com/l8ff6pa

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Posted by: tanztante.6532

tanztante.6532

engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi beats ele beats guard beats thief beats mesmer beats warrior beats ranger beats necro beats engi

Ayaílla ~all is [vain]

ele @ Gf Left Me Coz Of Ladderboard [vain] (EU) / Salty Strategy [PAIN]

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Posted by: Cynz.9437

Cynz.9437

- steal doesn’t do dmg w/o mug trait which is not in trickery

-passives were always problem be it nightmare runes or IP but i highly doubt they will get nerfed seeing as anet promotes passive brainless gameplay with every patch

as far as eles/wars/engis and co. goes devs really need to nerf max amount of might stacks in pvp so we don’t have bunkers dealing zerker dmg

mesmer might be not the biggest issue for a thief (i play one myself, we meet almost every match, OP) but he might be for other classes… i personally hate facing mesmers on my necro due to dodge spam, ports and AI body blocking everything

All is Vain~
[Teef] guild :>

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Posted by: dancingmonkey.4902

dancingmonkey.4902

- steal doesn’t do dmg w/o mug trait which is not in trickery

-passives were always problem be it nightmare runes or IP but i highly doubt they will get nerfed seeing as anet promotes passive brainless gameplay with every patch

as far as eles/wars/engis and co. goes devs really need to nerf max amount of might stacks in pvp so we don’t have bunkers dealing zerker dmg

mesmer might be not the biggest issue for a thief (i play one myself, we meet almost every match, OP) but he might be for other classes… i personally hate facing mesmers on my necro due to dodge spam, ports and AI body blocking everything

So what build are problematic? you keep cross posted this same thing in every other thread, but you avoid listing the builds that are problematic. I have even seen you make the ele/engi celestial might stack complaint, when everyone knows engineers do not stack might in that builds.

So what builds are you suggesting are problematic, so we can discuss the specifics, other then the broad stroke claim that the entire profession is OP of X profession. By the way do not promote thief and the fact that you play it, then use accusations such as “brainless game play”. It really doesn’t help your point.

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Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

the only things that need to be looked at are celestial d/d ele, celestial/turret engie (as well as incendiary powder), and PU phantasm mesmers (2/6/6/0/0 & 4/4/6/0/0).

almost everything else is pretty well balanced at the moment (IN SPVP) there’s certain builds that could use some very minor tweaks that improve the amount of counterplay available, builds like terrormancer and mediguard; but again, the only things that need rebalancing urgently are the builds i first mentioned.

(edited by sinject.4607)

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Posted by: dancingmonkey.4902

dancingmonkey.4902

the only things that need to be looked at are celestial d/d ele, celestial/turret engie (as well as incendiary powder), and PU phantasm mesmers (2/6/6/0/0 & 4/4/6/0/0).

almost everything else is pretty well balanced at the moment (IN SPVP) there’s certain builds that could use some very minor tweaks that improve the amount of counterplay available, builds like terrormancer and mediguard; but again, the only things that need rebalancing urgently are the builds i first mentioned.

What traits are those builds using that your suggesting are problematic? The traits are kind of key for the conversation.

What is problematic with the “terrormancer” and “mediguard” exactly?

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Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

the only things that need to be looked at are celestial d/d ele, celestial/turret engie (as well as incendiary powder), and PU phantasm mesmers (2/6/6/0/0 & 4/4/6/0/0).

almost everything else is pretty well balanced at the moment (IN SPVP) there’s certain builds that could use some very minor tweaks that improve the amount of counterplay available, builds like terrormancer and mediguard; but again, the only things that need rebalancing urgently are the builds i first mentioned.

What traits are those builds using that your suggesting are problematic? The traits are kind of key for the conversation.

What is problematic with the “terrormancer” and “mediguard” exactly?

terrormancer and mediguard are balanced but they just have one or two small things about them that isn’t. terrormancer’s issue is the passive fears from nightmare runes and when used with reaper’s protection, terror, and master of terror, similar to engineer’s incendiary powder it over-rewards passive gameplay but is defensive in nature/procs less so it’s not as nearly as bad as incendiary powder imo- and just to clarify reaper’s protection, terror, and master of terror aren’t the issue here though. reaper’s protection might be passive like nightmare’s 6th, but it’s justified because it takes 4 into death magic and gives necro some anti-cc outside of lich and plague form. all that needs to be done is give some kind of counterplay to nightmare rune’s 6th effect and problem solved (maybe?).

i don’t even know what to do with meditation guard. it’s in a weird place where it’s kinda too strong in 1v1s but too noticeably weak in groupfights. there’s probably a way to give the build an the option to balance out it’s performance in both situations but i am too lazy atm to think of anything.

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Posted by: Anubis.7058

Anubis.7058

the only things that need to be looked at are celestial d/d ele, celestial/turret engie (as well as incendiary powder), and PU phantasm mesmers (2/6/6/0/0 & 4/4/6/0/0).

almost everything else is pretty well balanced at the moment (IN SPVP) there’s certain builds that could use some very minor tweaks that improve the amount of counterplay available, builds like terrormancer and mediguard; but again, the only things that need rebalancing urgently are the builds i first mentioned.

What traits are those builds using that your suggesting are problematic? The traits are kind of key for the conversation.

What is problematic with the “terrormancer” and “mediguard” exactly?

Nightmare runes and limited camera, 2 things which have nothing to do with the professions; sadly most people are too… skritt to get it.

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Posted by: dancingmonkey.4902

dancingmonkey.4902

i don’t even know what to do with meditation guard. it’s in a weird place where it’s kinda too strong in 1v1s but too noticeably weak in groupfights. there’s probably a way to give the build an the option to balance out it’s performance in both situations but i am too lazy atm to think of anything.

Too strong in what way? Based on what? Do you lose to them regularly?

Why are you still refusing to list the traits in the engie, mesmer, and ele builds you are claiming as OP? How long have you played each of those 3 profession to have drawn such a conclusion? How long have you played guardian?

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Posted by: caveman.5840

caveman.5840

sadly this is a ridiculous balance thread

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Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

i don’t even know what to do with meditation guard. it’s in a weird place where it’s kinda too strong in 1v1s but too noticeably weak in groupfights. there’s probably a way to give the build an the option to balance out it’s performance in both situations but i am too lazy atm to think of anything.

Too strong in what way? Based on what? Do you lose to them regularly?

Why are you still refusing to list the traits in the engie, mesmer, and ele builds you are claiming as OP? How long have you played each of those 3 profession to have drawn such a conclusion? How long have you played guardian?

please explain in full and absolutely complete detail how you view celestial ele, turret/celestial engie, and pu phantasm mesmer to be fairly balanced. then proceed to give me a full list of your experience with every profession.

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Posted by: GreyWraith.8394

GreyWraith.8394

After playing a lot of PvP and reaching minimum top 200 on both leaderboards( top 80 in solo Q) I noticed that every class doesn’t feel very balanced. Even the one I play which is thief is kinda overpowered in some situations.

I’ll start with my own class .

Thief- I really think the steal ability is overpowered when traited 30 in trickery. It has no cast time and deals too much damage on other glass cannons

Engineer- The passive burning damage that cannot be avoided is too strong ,it needs counter play and supply crate is imabalnced in spvp where you have to stand on point. And the turret build is too effective for the effort it requires. Huge problem in spvp , especially in solo Q.

Elementalist- I think protection is just too strong in general to give it away so easely. The standard Dagger/Dagger build has nearly perma protection. The duration needs to be reduced.

Mesmer- In my opinion they are balanced ( but maybe because I’m a thief , they are very easy kills for me)

Warrior- I think the warrior is balanced too but then again I think we thieves counter warriors fairly well so I might be biased.

Guardian- I really think the glass cannon meditation guardian has too much durability for the damage output. Maybe reducing the base healing of meditation would help.

Ranger- Honestly the only thing I hate about rangers is their downed state. They can interupt the stomp about 4 times and then self res. It is incredibly annoying.

Lastly Necro. Again the passive fears need to be toned down for more counter play.

That’s it folks!

Attachments:

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Posted by: Lucentfir.7430

Lucentfir.7430

i don’t even know what to do with meditation guard. it’s in a weird place where it’s kinda too strong in 1v1s but too noticeably weak in groupfights. there’s probably a way to give the build an the option to balance out it’s performance in both situations but i am too lazy atm to think of anything.

Too strong in what way? Based on what? Do you lose to them regularly?

Why are you still refusing to list the traits in the engie, mesmer, and ele builds you are claiming as OP? How long have you played each of those 3 profession to have drawn such a conclusion? How long have you played guardian?

please explain in full and absolutely complete detail how you view celestial ele, turret/celestial engie, and pu phantasm mesmer to be fairly balanced. then proceed to give me a full list of your experience with every profession.

Against Necro with immoblizes and boon strips D/D ele dies, not to mention most of their key utilities have a high cooldown. Turret Engi only works on Conquest mode, anywhere else where else though you can simply not fight in that area and force urret setups to be null, even then bring a condition class and you can watch them melt because they’ll only have healing turret for clears. PU builds can’t hold points well just for the fact in order to abuse PU you must stealth which leads to decap, they’re broken in WvW against melee power specs..

Medi guards can burst that’s good, meanwhile other classes can burst as well, fun stuff zerker shattering thieves from 100-0% with a mesmer, or a warrior landing a eviscerate or a Warror landing a stun lock combo with deeps, and thieves picking off classes that require visual targeting in order to cast the abilities using stealth and high damage back stabs. Every class has some sort of burst and survival mechanism so they can unload burst.

Guardian risk and reward is in a great spot tbh. Great dueling build, but still loses to Condi engi PU mesmers and all the builds it used to lose to before the latest patch. The mobility problem, sure you can use Traveler runes, but you sacrifice a significant DPS boost/Utility boost for movement speed that’s available to everyone, and even then guardians still don’t have much CC so a melee class trying to keep up with classes that can kite without much cc? What are you supposed to do without traveler’s though? Teleports= Teleport and have you get walked away from a few seconds later. I’ve played all 8 classes and I have 13 characters.

Reth Grimrazor – Charr Guardian – [GWB]Grim Warband – Tarnished Coast
Redgen Furyblaze – Charr Guardian – [SHD]Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast
Lerious Warhowl – Charr Warrior – [SHD] Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast

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Posted by: Aberrant.6749

Aberrant.6749

Even in conquest turret eng isn’t amazing… it’s kind of like a minion mancer necro with minions that can’t move…

Tarnished Coast
Salvage 4 Profit + MF Guide – http://tinyurl.com/l8ff6pa

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Posted by: Dawntree.7246

Dawntree.7246

Even the one I play which is thief is kinda overpowered in some situations.

That should be the point.

Rock is overpowered when it confronts scissors.

Emanuel Dawntree – Nord Guardian of [TasH] – 9×80
Whiteside Ridge

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Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

i don’t even know what to do with meditation guard. it’s in a weird place where it’s kinda too strong in 1v1s but too noticeably weak in groupfights. there’s probably a way to give the build an the option to balance out it’s performance in both situations but i am too lazy atm to think of anything.

Too strong in what way? Based on what? Do you lose to them regularly?

Why are you still refusing to list the traits in the engie, mesmer, and ele builds you are claiming as OP? How long have you played each of those 3 profession to have drawn such a conclusion? How long have you played guardian?

please explain in full and absolutely complete detail how you view celestial ele, turret/celestial engie, and pu phantasm mesmer to be fairly balanced. then proceed to give me a full list of your experience with every profession.

Against Necro with immoblizes and boon strips D/D ele dies, not to mention most of their key utilities have a high cooldown. Turret Engi only works on Conquest mode, anywhere else where else though you can simply not fight in that area and force urret setups to be null, even then bring a condition class and you can watch them melt because they’ll only have healing turret for clears. PU builds can’t hold points well just for the fact in order to abuse PU you must stealth which leads to decap, they’re broken in WvW against melee power specs..

Medi guards can burst that’s good, meanwhile other classes can burst as well, fun stuff zerker shattering thieves from 100-0% with a mesmer, or a warrior landing a eviscerate or a Warror landing a stun lock combo with deeps, and thieves picking off classes that require visual targeting in order to cast the abilities using stealth and high damage back stabs. Every class has some sort of burst and survival mechanism so they can unload burst.

Guardian risk and reward is in a great spot tbh. Great dueling build, but still loses to Condi engi PU mesmers and all the builds it used to lose to before the latest patch. The mobility problem, sure you can use Traveler runes, but you sacrifice a significant DPS boost/Utility boost for movement speed that’s available to everyone, and even then guardians still don’t have much CC so a melee class trying to keep up with classes that can kite without much cc? What are you supposed to do without traveler’s though? Teleports= Teleport and have you get walked away from a few seconds later. I’ve played all 8 classes and I have 13 characters.

first of all let me establish this: having 1 or 2 hardcounters does not a mean a build is balanced, especially when those hardcounters are in turn countered much more easily by more things like necro is.

pu builds were the only thing implicitly banned from many 2v2 and 1v1 tournaments, and they’re also banned by just about every 1v1 KoTH duel server i’ve ever seen.

you’re right about turret engie though, good thing SPvP isn’t entirely composed of just conque- oh wait it is.

it also doesn’t really help when you defend a build by saying it can get beat by things that are genuinely overpowered in 1v1s like engie and pu mesmer.

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Posted by: Azure The Heartless.3261

Azure The Heartless.3261

I can’t get past the fact that the OP seems to be implying that anything that is easy for him to down is balanced, and everything that has even a miniscule amount of annoyance makes him view the class negatively.

It’s par for the course though.

Resident Disgruntled, Coffee-drinking Charr.
Zarin Mistcloak(THF) Valkyrie Mistblade(WAR) Kossori Mistwalker(REV) Durendal Mistward(GRD)
I used to think (build op, pls nerf) like you, but then I took a nerf to the knee.

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Posted by: coglin.1867

coglin.1867

pu builds were the only thing implicitly banned from many 2v2 and 1v1 tournaments, and they’re also banned by just about every 1v1 KoTH duel server i’ve ever seen.

You mention 1v1 a few times. Yet it is made very clear the game isn’t balanced around 1v1. Why do you repeatedly push this 1v1 argument when it is common knowledge it is not balanced for it? Do you enjoy beating this dead Centaur?

you’re right about turret engie though, good thing SPvP isn’t entirely composed of just conque- oh wait it is.

I can kill all of the turrets in literally 5s. Then the engineer has no weapon swap, and all utilities on CD. Play one for a few minutes, you will see what I mean.

it also doesn’t really help when you defend a build by saying it can get beat by things that are genuinely overpowered in 1v1s like engie and pu mesmer.

Again with this 1v1 obsession, when they do not balance for 1v1. Why?

A video on what weak PvPer’s and WvWer’s want.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6q3em9s5I4c

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Posted by: Lucentfir.7430

Lucentfir.7430

@ Sinject

And that’s not what I’m saying, instead you put words in my mouth. Certain specs will have a much better time with other specs that feel OP. For instance the whole Necromancer with boon corruption vs D/D bunker celestial ele, necro has a because it has the best tools available for deal with ele’s strongest aspect . it doesn’t appear you have enough knowledge about the classes or game. You’re bouncing your argument from competitive conquest scene, to dueling 1v1s on all the specs you think are OP.

1v1 2v2 Tournaments PU mesmer banned? I’m not surprised, it’s a entirely passive spec that leads to a endless duels. Clone death traits apply weakness, bleed, or vulnerability if you try to take aggression on the mesmer, which they will also stealth and gain defensive boons, being Aegis, Protection, Swiftness, Regen, or Might, for each second stealthed, but there’s also the double whammy minor when you gain regen, you gain protection. So forget about bursting mesmer down when you have weakness and protection, and aegis to go through. it doesn’t work in conquest well because it takes forever to bring down someone not attacking you with confusion or procing torment block, meanwhile teamights they do not contribute much if there’s AoE condi clears flying around, even transfers.

Turret Engi and conquest mode, it’s the only spec that takes advantage of this mode since it’s all about point capture and holding. Everywhere else though it is not worth taking because smart players will simply not fight you in your field of turrets or they’ll come with a friend and wreck your face, especially if it;‘s a condi spec’d player. You can also kill the turrets, but it’s mostly not worth killing if they placed them on different ground levels.

And finally the me defending medi guard guard statement. Decent engis will wreck your face as a guardian because most of the damage you do is in melee, and engis are ranged, with lots of soft CC and sustain, consistent poison/condition application and all so they can and will kite you all day if they can unless guardian happens to be running the Amplified Wrath spec and punish them with high damage burns for hitting while having blocks up. PU condi mesmers are immortal against melee power foes you need at least another person or two if you really want to kill them. Most of Guardian’s weapons cleave, meaning you will kill a majority of the clones and get punished for it with weakness bleeds and all frequently when you want to attack mesmer.

Smart players that know how medi guardian works can beat them, with with simple kiting and dodging key attacks. Thief, Warrior, Ele, Ranger, Engineer, Necromancer all have specs that can beat meditation guardian.

Also in order for Meditation Guards to have a chance to do damage well, they have to sacrifice their rune slots for a 25% movement speed so they’re not so painfully easy to kite, as well as not feel like a slow turtle. Another thing they give up is a lot of boon access and team support, for a more selfish build. and if you go the 4 in virtues path you slash your damage so you have a little bit more team support and condi clear. Their burst is also telegraphed for the most of it.

Play the other classes you think are OP, and get a feel with them. Thieves have told that to other player before, i know I did, now i know all the little quirks thieves pull off and it’s much easier to fight them.

Reth Grimrazor – Charr Guardian – [GWB]Grim Warband – Tarnished Coast
Redgen Furyblaze – Charr Guardian – [SHD]Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast
Lerious Warhowl – Charr Warrior – [SHD] Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast

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Posted by: Anchoku.8142

Anchoku.8142

Glock, what are you advocating? My old-timer mind thinks it is Pac Man. Everyone wants to feel special.

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Posted by: Jim Hunter.6821

Jim Hunter.6821

Glock, what are you advocating? My old-timer mind thinks it is Pac Man. Everyone wants to feel special.

Dear god I can only imagine the complaints we would hear if we were playing Pac Man. The ghosts are OP, nerf ghosts now! Turning is unresponsive! Respawn timer for ghosts is too short! Dots feel balanced.

Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN

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Posted by: velhavn.7694

velhavn.7694

almost all of the whiner

Dear Anet,

engie, ele, guard OP
others that i can kill are fine

sincerely – thief

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Posted by: shimmerlessEU.6841

shimmerlessEU.6841

@ Sinject

And that’s not what I’m saying, instead you put words in my mouth. Certain specs will have a much better time with other specs that feel OP. For instance the whole Necromancer with boon corruption vs D/D bunker celestial ele, necro has a because it has the best tools available for deal with ele’s strongest aspect . it doesn’t appear you have enough knowledge about the classes or game. You’re bouncing your argument from competitive conquest scene, to dueling 1v1s on all the specs you think are OP.

1v1 2v2 Tournaments PU mesmer banned? I’m not surprised, it’s a entirely passive spec that leads to a endless duels. Clone death traits apply weakness, bleed, or vulnerability if you try to take aggression on the mesmer, which they will also stealth and gain defensive boons, being Aegis, Protection, Swiftness, Regen, or Might, for each second stealthed, but there’s also the double whammy minor when you gain regen, you gain protection. So forget about bursting mesmer down when you have weakness and protection, and aegis to go through. it doesn’t work in conquest well because it takes forever to bring down someone not attacking you with confusion or procing torment block, meanwhile teamights they do not contribute much if there’s AoE condi clears flying around, even transfers.

Turret Engi and conquest mode, it’s the only spec that takes advantage of this mode since it’s all about point capture and holding. Everywhere else though it is not worth taking because smart players will simply not fight you in your field of turrets or they’ll come with a friend and wreck your face, especially if it;‘s a condi spec’d player. You can also kill the turrets, but it’s mostly not worth killing if they placed them on different ground levels.

And finally the me defending medi guard guard statement. Decent engis will wreck your face as a guardian because most of the damage you do is in melee, and engis are ranged, with lots of soft CC and sustain, consistent poison/condition application and all so they can and will kite you all day if they can unless guardian happens to be running the Amplified Wrath spec and punish them with high damage burns for hitting while having blocks up. PU condi mesmers are immortal against melee power foes you need at least another person or two if you really want to kill them. Most of Guardian’s weapons cleave, meaning you will kill a majority of the clones and get punished for it with weakness bleeds and all frequently when you want to attack mesmer.

Smart players that know how medi guardian works can beat them, with with simple kiting and dodging key attacks. Thief, Warrior, Ele, Ranger, Engineer, Necromancer all have specs that can beat meditation guardian.

Also in order for Meditation Guards to have a chance to do damage well, they have to sacrifice their rune slots for a 25% movement speed so they’re not so painfully easy to kite, as well as not feel like a slow turtle. Another thing they give up is a lot of boon access and team support, for a more selfish build. and if you go the 4 in virtues path you slash your damage so you have a little bit more team support and condi clear. Their burst is also telegraphed for the most of it.

Play the other classes you think are OP, and get a feel with them. Thieves have told that to other player before, i know I did, now i know all the little quirks thieves pull off and it’s much easier to fight them.

Prismatic Understanding is banned in those servers because the players in them are dumb and don’t really know anything about the game.

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Posted by: maha.7902

maha.7902

almost all of the whiner

Dear Anet,

engie, ele, guard OP
others that i can kill are fine

sincerely – thief

Oh, so I’m not the only one who noticed this.

Good job OP, you couldn’t have made it any more obvious that you only find classes balanced when you can wipe the floor with them but otherwise they’re imbalanced.

Serah Mahariel – Death and Taxes

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Posted by: Kahrgan.7401

Kahrgan.7401

Ham warrior, needs nerf in the cc department.

Don’t call anyone out on their BS, that’s an infraction and a deleted post. —Anet.

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Posted by: Kicast.1459

Kicast.1459

Thief wouldn’t be viable without trickery. It has been designed for 1v1 so its normal to not have counter play. I agree about passive engi and necro though . IP , nightmare and repear all need a nerf.

Medi guard is an OK 1v1 spec but has mediocre mobility so its not a big deal. I’d say only engi and ele are OP atm just because of celestial .

Thief has been viable since launch and back then no one went past 15 in Trickery, the standard was 25/30/0/0/15 (this was still common for a long time after the class line changes). When Mug was nerfed ANet buffed a lot of other traits to compensate, naturally being ANet they went way too far with Trickery XII so we’ve been stuck with it until the next flavor of the month (Panic Strike) rolled around.

Steal in general has been revamped and buffed to the point where it suffers from serious bloat once traited, it’s not uncommon (even on DA/non-Trickery) for steal to do ten different things. Now this means that landing steal is critically important for said specs, but steal is 100% instant cast with zero warning… yes, the class mechanic can end up being countered by completely random dodges or evades. How in the world anyone thinks this is healthy or intelligent gameplay is beyond me. It is pure feast or famine based on the worst kind of randomness.

Personally I don’t think any of the classes are really balanced, they all have too many frustrating or silly aspects to them when abused properly.

This….1000000 times

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Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

@ Sinject

And that’s not what I’m saying, instead you put words in my mouth. Certain specs will have a much better time with other specs that feel OP. For instance the whole Necromancer with boon corruption vs D/D bunker celestial ele, necro has a because it has the best tools available for deal with ele’s strongest aspect . it doesn’t appear you have enough knowledge about the classes or game. You’re bouncing your argument from competitive conquest scene, to dueling 1v1s on all the specs you think are OP.

you respond to a post asking for an argument to prove d/d celestial ele is balanced with:
“Against Necro with immoblizes and boon strips D/D ele dies, not to mention most of their key utilities have a high cooldown.”
and then say i’m putting words in your mouth when i tell you that having a hard counter doesn’t something make it balanced when you are clearly specifying necro’s advantage over d/d ele as a point in your post?

@ Sinject
Turret Engi only works on Conquest mode, anywhere else where else though you can simply not fight in that area and force urret setups to be null, even then bring a condition class and you can watch them melt because they’ll only have healing turret for clears. PU builds can’t hold points well just for the fact in order to abuse PU you must stealth which leads to decap, they’re broken in WvW against melee power specs.

you defend pu mesmer by saying that it’s bad in spvp but good elsewhere

PU builds can’t hold points well just for the fact in order to abuse PU you must stealth which leads to decap, they’re broken in WvW against melee power specs.

you defend turret engie by saying it’s good in spvp but bad elsewhere

@ Sinject
Turret Engi only works on Conquest mode, anywhere else where else though you can simply not fight in that area and force urret setups to be null

this just plain contradicts itself if you’re trying to prove either spec is balanced.

You’re bouncing your argument from competitive conquest scene, to dueling 1v1s on all the specs you think are OP.

you already bounced from WvW to SPvP in the argument you gave above, which is actually a lot worse given the balance differences.

i used the standards of the dueling community to show that PU is broken enough in 1v1s and similar encounters to warrant widespread disapproval. 1v1s/2v2s are absolutely integral to conquest and happen all the time, so my argument actually has grounds in both situations.

you on the otherhand are actually talking about completely different gamemodes.

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Posted by: Lucentfir.7430

Lucentfir.7430

@Sinject

1. I have never said anything regarding Ele being balanced to begin with, but I’m saying there are specs that can beat it/handle its not complete hard counters like Ele carrying around Diamond Skin against a condi build. I brought up necros since they have the tools to deal with all of eles boons / Anyone who pumps out boons easily, paired with teammates in a Spvp setting that’s pretty kitten devastating. Since Spvp is around capping points and teamplay over 1v1s.

2: Right lets put words in my mouth again, where PU mesmer is bad but good everywhere else. PU mesmer in PVE – Ask yourself, Spvp – Meh can’t hold points, WvW blobing – Ask yourself again, WvW Roaming – OP (Against melee power specs), Group Play – meh.

3: PVE – I guess people want Turret engis yeah? , WvW blobing- lolwut, WvW Roaming – Bye Mr turret engi if you want to fight I’ll be over here. WvW Small Group – Wut are you doing? So yeah it’s only really broken in Spvp where people have to grab nodes and sit on them.

4: I see no contradiction. either you’re talking about Competitive Conquest. or 1v1 duels which frankly you keep bouncing between.

5: Dueling and Conquest modes are two different game types with two different objectives. Dueling is about downing/stomping your opponents. Conquest is about point capping and scoring points. A PU mesmer taking on a Bunker guardian in a 1v1= A waste of time for that mesmer if the player is trying to debunk a bunker guardian even 1v2, all it is, is stall and make sure you have more nodes then the other team to score points. Lets not include the fact in order for the mesmer to take advantage of PU they have to stealth which leads to point decap, and if there’s 1v2 that means elsewhere has a advantage, should your team choose to take it.

Reth Grimrazor – Charr Guardian – [GWB]Grim Warband – Tarnished Coast
Redgen Furyblaze – Charr Guardian – [SHD]Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast
Lerious Warhowl – Charr Warrior – [SHD] Shade Warband – Tarnished Coast