Guild Wars 2

Being able to stack cc promotes poor game mechanics, zerging and makes the game unfun and undiverse.

Gw2 has a huge amount of cc, and while im fine with it as you can use stability/dodge/stunbreaker i feel like there is not enough sources to counter how spamable CC actually is.

This is a general complain, not directed to any class, but let’s take two hammer warriors as an example (or w/e floats your boat, just taking warrior cus they are simplier to explain). If i get earthshacked for 3seconds, why in hell would a second earthshacker hitting me reset the counter back to 3 seconds? I was already grounded for getting hit by the first earthshacker, stacking CC is just beating someone who is already down.

Not to mention how stronk CC actually is, i think in all my MMO life i’ve never seen a game with such a long stun duration and to be fair i do belive not one of the games i played had stackable CC.

I would be fine with actually getting stunlocked by carefully timing CC’s one after the other as it would require fine timing but the current state of cc is just stupid imo.

Also, please don’t bother answering, lel use stability, lel stunbreaks, lel dodges. This not a solo problem but more of a team gameplay issue.

war/guard have ample stabo.

if your not a war/guard, you shouldnt be in the frontline eating earthshakers, stay back more.

engi cc is only other one i can think of that might be trouble if your not in frontline, so nerf engi is fine with me. otherwise, you might wanna rethink your positioning

I should have mentioned that my complains come from a spvp point of view, although in wvw the issue still exists is not as major imho, but i do belive your response is very situational, don’t be in the frontline is not a valid response tbh since a lot of Orgnaized guilds do run strike teams or even use the melee train to stunburst the kitten ouf of ranged.

Sons.5493:

Also, please don’t bother answering, lel use stability, lel stunbreaks, lel dodges. This not a solo problem but more of a team gameplay issue.

I.e. don’t respond with counters to my argument.

CobaltSixty.1542:

Sons.5493:

Also, please don’t bother answering, lel use stability, lel stunbreaks, lel dodges. This not a solo problem but more of a team gameplay issue.

I.e. don’t respond with counters to my argument.

More like, don’t respond obvious answers that do not solve the issue.

Are you kidding? This game has the lowest CC durations of any game I have ever played., to the point where in some situations CC is completely useless because your enemy is unstunned/standing back up again/whatever before your next attack even goes off properly, even an autohit. Plus, stability is a 100% hard counter with no luck-based mechanic, so once someone pops it that’s it.

The bad part is how classes have differing access to stability uptimes.

There are games where you can get stunned for 30+ seconds. If you value your sanity don’t ever play the original DAoC or any older MMO for that matter.

I’m always amused to read all these threads about how GW2 is the hardest and worst game ever when it has some of the easiest, most faceroll mechanics in the industry. Its like the entire decade of games preceeding it didn’t even exist.

However, I do agree that CC of the same type should not stack duration.

Hannelore.8153:

when it has some of the easiest, most faceroll mechanics in the industry.

This is what i am talking about. I think either you are not getting me or i explain myself really bad. And yes stability counters cc, but do you think there is enough stability to counter all the faceroll cc aviable? hardly. And it’s not that all classes have access to STAB and yes allies can help you but then again, Stab cds are way bigger than cc.

Anyways, i know it doesnt matter how much we discuss, ppl in this forum are way too thick in the head (and so i am sometimes) to actually come to a conclusion.

And for the record i never ever said gw2 is the worst game ever, it is one of the greatest MMOs and it brought a lot of new mechanics to the genre but there are some room for improvement that i belive the comunity can help with.

CC is nonexistant in this game.

please try to use earthshaker on tequatl or even any other lousy champ.
tell me how the CC stacked on him?

Lalangamena.3694:

CC is nonexistant in this game.

please try to use earthshaker on tequatl or even any other lousy champ.
tell me how the CC stacked on him?

He’s referring to CC in WvW/PvP.

Sons.5493:

CobaltSixty.1542:

Sons.5493:

Also, please don’t bother answering, lel use stability, lel stunbreaks, lel dodges. This not a solo problem but more of a team gameplay issue.

I.e. don’t respond with counters to my argument.

More like, don’t respond obvious answers that do not solve the issue.

I don’t understand the issue. The problem is that there are players that can time the chaining of CC? Why is this a problem?

Stab is a DoT effect, you can’t be CC’ed. Also, why put yourself in a position where you can be chain CC’ed without punishing the opposing team with cleave/AoE from your own team?

Also, do profs not have invuln’s, dodges, blinds, blocks, and evades, on top of stab to avoid CC?

If you are out of the numerous above counters, why not rotate out of the front line with someone else until you have some things come off cooldown?

Maybe OP just hasn’t thought of these things? Idk, I don’t see an issue, I see an opportunity to learn.

JJBigs.8456:

war/guard have ample stabo.

Just came by here.
I am over 30 and casual gamer. Would you mind explaining what that is ?
You kids are insane

Kurrilino.2706:

JJBigs.8456:

war/guard have ample stabo.

---

Just came by here.
I am over 30 and casual gamer. Would you mind explaining what that is ?
You kids are insane

Stab = Stability, not sure why the post uses stabo

I’ve never played a game with less crowd control than this one. I know that doesn’t add anything to the debate but I’m throwing it out there anyway.

I will say that the change to daze from the previous title has taken some getting used to since playing here. Kind of liked how it worked when it was a condition. Then again, interrupting in that game was a game of it’s own.

Roots and slows here are fine imo, except for maybe immobilize in some instances. That one is annoying sometimes.

Seems to me my biggest issue with cc in this game is that you don’t have those skills that take a player out of the equation fully but breaks on damage, something can be said for knowing how you apply damage around you and to what target. The only skill that reminds me of that type of cc is frostbow 5 from the ele weapon.

Something felt strategic about those types of cc. Then again, GW1 didn’t have any true cc at all beyond slows/knockdowns but the game still felt complex.

I guess here, because we have access to multiple types of cc breakers, we have multiple types of short duration cc’s. Most games you only get 1 or 2 hard cc breakers. Stun locking was usually reserved for very few classes and was actually apart of even playing the class, my largest example of that would probably be WoW’s rogue. DR I think is another option those games use because of the lack of get out jail free cards.

It’s not fun at times, but does have it’s counters so I guess it works.

Cc is not problem in any organized group in wvw. And useless in pve. I dont know how is it working in pvp

You guys talk like there is literally no way you ever get cc’d in this game. “Dodge,stab, SB…” Those are obvious counters, that i already know, “Dont put yourself in a position when u can get CCd” stop being delusional, at some point you’ll be caught up without any kind of escape and one cc after the other will keep you from recovering.

Also to people saying gw2 has the least CC ever, Lineage 2, Aion, Blade and soul, Tera have a way better CC system, those are the games i played, so im not aware how other titles work, i’m sure there are other titles with a even harsher CC sytem (DAoC like someone mentioned before).

Hannelore.8153:

There are games where you can get stunned for 30+ seconds. If you value your sanity don’t ever play the original DAoC or any older MMO for that matter.

It’s true you could be mezzed for 30 sec in daoc, but when CC was broken in DAOC (demez, being hit, CC expiring) you became immune to that CC for 60 freakin seconds.

You’re right that the crux of the issue is really the inequity of access to stability though.

Dodge it bro and use PVP build,dont use some pve build with no stun breaker and QQ…..

CC in wvw is fine. In zergs most people bring some form of aoe stability and group healing there are builds meant to work together. In s/tpvp its an entirely different story because most people aren’t running synergy builds as much as filling a role for that match(bunker, roamer, etc). Currently all I see is 1 bunker, 4 people mix n matched to run between mid and their home point and its boring as kitten. Even the EU tourney put me to sleep watching them just mindlessly fight mid and take 0 outside objectives.

There is no DR on disable effects, which just leads to button smashing and in the case of warrior, is really easy to do and rotate. Hambow is a plague in pvp right now, and at least 90% of them are just pressing 1-5 with F1 and swapping weapons sadly with positive results because it’s AoE (except backbreaker). Disables in pvp need DR, there is no skill in having 2-5 people use a cc on a class with no stability, especially when that cycle can be repeated fairly quick.

CC doesn’t stack? It resets. What do you want those two earthshakers to stun you for 6 seconds instead of 3? It overwrites the previously applied stun and this mechanic can become increasingly frustrating when other forms of hard CC are applied, disrupting that 3 second stun. In fact this problem you are having is a solution that people beg for with movement impairing conditions like Immob, and chill.

As someone who also has played (and still plays) both GW2 and TERA, I feel I need to call you out somewhat, Sons. You really can’t say TERA’s CC is more friendly, when you have the following issues:

• Warrior stagger/stun chains
• Lancer Shield Barrage/Block wackiness (generally macroed, but it exists)
• Slayer and Zerker Knockdowns
• Any PvP Mystic worth their salt.

Honestly, both games have their moments of “OMG, ridiculous CC!” Conversely, both games also have said CC nigh-worthless in high-end PvE content. As for GW2, the worst aspect of CC was introduced when ANet decided to allow CCs to stack/reboot the timer. While 5 applications of -say- Blind are annoying as hell, but survivable; 5 applications of Immobilize pretty much eat anyone without good Stability uptime, and/or the right Trait/gear composition.

Out of curiosity did you ever play the origional Guildwars?

I’m aware of how devistating stacked CC can be, but honestly having (quite literally) grown up on Guildwars it’s not that big an issue to me as I’m use to cripples that last for multitudes of seconds, and knockdowns that are 4 or 5 seconds long. Honestly I’m very greatful just to have skills that are flat out dedicated to getting you out of CC. (most of these skills even remove multiple instances of it)

Now as a suggestion as to avoid preaching to the choir, Anet could introduce talents that shorten the time of break stuns, and/or CC. (needless to say these would stack with other talents that shorten cooldowns; it would be pointless otherwise) The problem is, there’s a very, VERY fine line between CC being too powerful, and CC not doing it’s job.

Ssenkra Bloodroot.1028:

Out of curiosity did you ever play the origional Guildwars?

I’m aware of how devistating stacked CC can be, but honestly having (quite literally) grown up on Guildwars it’s not that big an issue to me as I’m use to cripples that last for multitudes of seconds, and knockdowns that are 4 or 5 seconds long. Honestly I’m very greatful just to have skills that are flat out dedicated to getting you out of CC. (most of these skills even remove multiple instances of it)

Now as a suggestion as to avoid preaching to the choir, Anet could introduce talents that shorten the time of break stuns, and/or CC. (needless to say these would stack with other talents that shorten cooldowns; it would be pointless otherwise) The problem is, there’s a very, VERY fine line between CC being too powerful, and CC not doing it’s job.

well..
IF you are having a problem with CC
just reduce the stun duration or damage recieved

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bowl_of_Roasted_Lotus_Root
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Melandru
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Roasted_Parsnip
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Loaf_of_Saffron_Bread

IF you are getting hit by more than one person…
Well…explain to me why you should just shrug it off and live?

Killface.1896:

Dodge it bro and use PVP build,dont use some pve build with no stun breaker and QQ…..

See this is the kind of kittenty answers i meant on my P.D

Ssenkra Bloodroot.1028:

IF you are getting hit by more than one person…
Well…explain to me why you should just shrug it off and live?

Not shrug it off and live, that’s not the situation but making additional CC reset the timer is just a bad unfun mechanic.

Sons.5493:

Ssenkra Bloodroot.1028:

IF you are getting hit by more than one person…
Well…explain to me why you should just shrug it off and live?

Not shrug it off and live, that’s not the situation but making additional CC reset the timer is just a bad unfun mechanic.

If CC is coming from one source it isnt that big of a deal
any of the listed counter’s in this thread will take care of that situation.
On the other hand.
If you are fighting people in a X v 1
coordinated chill,cripple, or immobilize will also pretty much keep you in place for pain.
Difference in stun and daze is that you can blind them before the skill lands, use stability, or get out of range assuming you aren’t fighting a mesmer or ranger ( and even then those two have a decently long CD on their stun’s and dazes)

I know it’s unfun to play when you are unable to move, but pretty much all classes have some way to negate the effects of a stun and its re-application( dodges,blinds, a stun of your own, food, runes, range, invul, evasion, and stability)

But when you talk about being in front of a zerg train, nothing but invul is going to save you from being killed.

So, the question still is, why do you think you should shrug it off and live vs multiple people?

Stacking duration of Immobilization is a real problem. There is couple fixes suggested for this one, it’s either make immob break with stun breaks or revert it back to the old one. This way you couldn’t stack insanely long immob durations to someone and people had more ways to break out of immob.

Then there is stuns. While I think it’s a bit ridiculous that one can be played ping pong till he is dead. I suppose a nice change here would be that if you have been hard CC (stun, daze, knock-down, knock-back) you can’t be hard CC for the duration of the last one. This way you can’t chain stun with warrior hammer for example, at least not as easy.

BUT, if they did change that they would need to change other stuff as well like how many stun breakers there is in this game and other skills that can be used while stunned (blinks and so on). There is plenty of tools to avoid being chain stunned if you keep your head cool, sometimes it can overwhelm you and there is not much to do but most professions have a good set of tools to break stun or teleport away from the next stun.

Ssenkra Bloodroot.1028:

Out of curiosity did you ever play the origional Guildwars?

I’m aware of how devistating stacked CC can be, but honestly having (quite literally) grown up on Guildwars it’s not that big an issue to me as I’m use to cripples that last for multitudes of seconds, and knockdowns that are 4 or 5 seconds long. Honestly I’m very greatful just to have skills that are flat out dedicated to getting you out of CC. (most of these skills even remove multiple instances of it)

Now as a suggestion as to avoid preaching to the choir, Anet could introduce talents that shorten the time of break stuns, and/or CC. (needless to say these would stack with other talents that shorten cooldowns; it would be pointless otherwise) The problem is, there’s a very, VERY fine line between CC being too powerful, and CC not doing it’s job.

I did play Gw1, since release. And yeah CC (or states, as in blind, weakness and so) were extremly waaaaay more powerfull than here, but there was not near as much hard CC as gw2 offers. And i repreat. that is not the problem, the problem is additional cc reseting the counter.

Paavotar.3971:

Stacking duration of Immobilization is a real problem. There is couple fixes suggested for this one, it’s either make immob break with stun breaks or revert it back to the old one. This way you couldn’t stack insanely long immob durations to someone and people had more ways to break out of immob.

There isn’t a problem with immobilize as it is minus the fact it isn’t prioritized over other conditions.
On the other hand, if you get crippled or chilled what’s so different from being chain immobilized * especially* when there are more attacks that can stack the two?

Then there is stuns. While I think it’s a bit ridiculous that one can be played ping pong till he is dead. I suppose a nice change here would be that if you have been hard CC (stun, daze, knock-down, knock-back) you can’t be hard CC for the duration of the last one. This way you can’t chain stun with warrior hammer for example, at least not as easy.

We already in this thread listed what you can do to counter stuns
But no one has answered the question of
“Why should you shrug it off and live when you fight multiple people?”
If you fight two+ coordinated people what makes you so special that you should be privileged to win that encounter with no difficulty?

BUT, if they did change that they would need to change other stuff as well like how many stun breakers there is in this game and other skills that can be used while stunned (blinks and so on). There is plenty of tools to avoid being chain stunned if you keep your head cool, sometimes it can overwhelm you and there is not much to do but most professions have a good set of tools to break stun or teleport away from the next stun.

So if we have the tools available what needs to change then?
I dont understand..
If you have counter’s to CC
What needs to change if the ability to negate them already exist?

P.S.
Everyone is aware
Stuns don’t stack in intensity

If I recall correctly the last stun you encounter overwrites the previous application…

Just for the record you can’t “stack” CCs. One CC cancels the other CC. Those who you think are “stacking” CC are timing their CCs, which you should probably learn to do with your dodges, stun breaks, and or stabilities if you’re having problems with CC.

Sons.5493:

Being able to stack cc promotes poor game mechanics, zerging and makes the game unfun and undiverse.

So if you are going to make this claim, tell us this. Why is it that before they changed it to stack, that the forums had thread after thread demanding that it stacks??? Look it up, do some searching. It is a fact. You are literally claiming something is unwanted and broken, that the player base demanded for month after month.

When it stacks, 8 players can immobilize, cripple, and chill me. One skill will remove each and every one. With the old way, I would just cast one immobilize, or chill, or cripple, wait till you burnt your cleanse or soft cc remover, then use one again, and you had no options but to take it.

Sons.5493:

Killface.1896:

Dodge it bro and use PVP build,dont use some pve build with no stun breaker and QQ…..

See this is the kind of kittenty answers i meant on my P.D

Seems like kind of a harsh thing to say for someone who is going to sit here and demand something gets changed back to the way everyone hated and demanded it changed from. You have no business demandin only a constructive conversation, when you yourself are not constructive enough to be aware of why the system is in its current form.

Solori.6025:

So, the question still is, why do you think you should shrug it off and live vs multiple people?

I do believe i never claimed that. But when one stun leads to a 10+ stunlock unavoidable from other players (there is not enough stab access or SB to efficiently negate CC spam).

Also where are you taking the frontline thingie from? I mainly argue this from a spvp/tpvp (more spvp) POV

coglin.1867:

Okay, i’m seeing one big error i made through all this post, my biggest issue is with hard CC, soft CC can be easily countered and im fine with it stacking.

About the guy saying lel dodge, i kinda already know all those answers, i know how the game works mechanically. It’s just the access to stability which everybody is claiming as supreme counter is hard to actually have access too as very limited classes have access to a prolonged stab uptime.

CC dont stack. Id rather qq about conditions than this

OP is to impressed by the animations to dodge..

Example below of a Warrior using Earthshaker.

http://tinyurl.com/mq4aquc