Guild Wars 2

Ok, once more.

This is not WoW

Please remember that before suggesting mechanics from that game or any other with a permastealth mechanic.

Thanks for reading and considering this opinion.

Regards,

Me

@STRanger.5120

I do not understand your implications by your statement. We all know this is not WoW, we have all purchased the product.

Stealth in this game is broken and needs to be fixed. I hope that thieves are compensated accordingly, but stealth as it is is a little game breaking as it stands.

Bella Kim.4061:

@STRanger.5120
thank you for your opinion

actually you can achieve “permastealth” in this game

Smoke Field + Leap Finisher x 4
(Black Powder) + (Heartseeker) x 4
+ Infusion of Shadow: Gain initiative when you enter stealth
+ Patience: Regain initiative faster while in stealth
+ Quick Recovery: Gain bonus initiative over time
+ Meld with Shadows: Stealth lasts 1 second longer
= you can stay in stealth as long as you want

Cloak and Dagger
+ Infusion of Shadow: Gain initiative when you enter stealth
+ Patience: Regain initiative faster while in stealth
+ Quick Recovery: Gain bonus initiative over time
+ Meld with Shadows: Stealth lasts 1 second longer
= you can stay in stealth as long as you want

I dont have permastealth thief
but I have seen my friends staying stealth endlessly

Does that really mean anything though? They might be stealthing to infinity but they are blowing everything they have in the process making them useless and vulnerable.

yolo swaggins.2570:

Bella Kim.4061:

@STRanger.5120
thank you for your opinion

actually you can achieve “permastealth” in this game

Smoke Field + Leap Finisher x 4
(Black Powder) + (Heartseeker) x 4
+ Infusion of Shadow: Gain initiative when you enter stealth
+ Patience: Regain initiative faster while in stealth
+ Quick Recovery: Gain bonus initiative over time
+ Meld with Shadows: Stealth lasts 1 second longer
= you can stay in stealth as long as you want

Cloak and Dagger
+ Infusion of Shadow: Gain initiative when you enter stealth
+ Patience: Regain initiative faster while in stealth
+ Quick Recovery: Gain bonus initiative over time
+ Meld with Shadows: Stealth lasts 1 second longer
= you can stay in stealth as long as you want

I dont have permastealth thief
but I have seen my friends staying stealth endlessly

Does that really mean anything though? They might be stealthing to infinity but they are blowing everything they have in the process making them useless and vulnerable.

Exactly, thanks for sparing me the effort to explain this

The rest of you should realize that when you create a game with some mechanics, and if you decide to change some of the mechanics after 3 years, it’s not like when you take your wallet and go shopping, that means complete overhaul of a lot of things, not just the class which uses that mechanic….
I seriously doubt that Anet has spare time to do this, even if they would like to.
Also, Stealth was nerfed several times since release, because it was really OP. I’m not against necessary changes regarding the stealth mechanics, but you are suggesting to change the whole mechanic, which is simply not possible 3 years after release.

Yeah, I’m angry when some Thief downs me in 2 secs of course, but that’s not something I would cry on forums about, I know why is that. Because I’m playing Shatter Mesmer lately and thieves are quite effective counter agains us. When I log my main Ele though, it’s another story….

Most other professions can book it when the going gets tough and none of them use stealth. Most other professions also have nasty mechanics that make finisher guaranteed aswell.

And Bloodlust doesn’t mean much when you roam, which as far as anyone knows, that is all thief is generally good for. Maybe on low pop servers where roaming is more common does this apply. However, bloodlust is designed for zergs to continue to rack up points. Thief being a solo-friendlier class has little use to a zerg aside from a stealth bot and backlines ganker. Other uses like venom access and blast finisher bot may work but once the zerg is engaged the player has to be good or else they will melt, stealth or not.

I would also like to point out that you havn’t given any reason why it is broken other than stealth in real life application when stealth in this game is magic-based. The suggestions you posted are also a bad idea and cause more problems than they solve simply because it’ll break one profession. Specifically thief since their survivability and DPS is tied to stealth.

Bella Kim.4061:

@STRanger.5120

As a WvW roamer I contribute to my team by doing Borderlands Bloodlust Finishers
10 Borderlands Bloodlust Finisher = capturing a Tower
As a Triple Kit Condi Engineer I can do Borderlands Bloodlust Finishers on anyone I encounter
even if they outnumber me I can fight them all by myself
EXCEPT the stealth thieves who decides to run
there is no way to chase them down and do Borderlands Bloodlust Finishers
10 thieves running away = losing a Tower

Hmm, so Engi is OP, right?
I’m glad you admit that

Yeah, stealth has the possibility to escape easily, of course, but you know how is the game balanced?
I’ll give you slight advice – It’s not according to WvW….
Actually It’s according to balanced mode where stealthing and escaping won’t win you the game, it does exactly the opposite, it makes you a liability to the team…

See, for some of this, it just nerfs stealth beyond the necessary. For instance, bleeding and burning are two of the main damaging conditions most classes have access to in one way or another. It is not immediately removed[though can be traited to], and thus conditions removing stealth is unnecessary because the conditions don’t leave the stealther unpunished.

Cleaving skills and AoE also still hits stealthed opponents. So, stealth isn’t a big deal if you use your intuition to predict or read the opponent(Example: “1…2…3… the thief should be trying to backstab me… now!”). This is possible by using logic, such as acknowledging that the thief or otherwise will likely want to use their stealth to its fullest content, meaning attacking only at the last second of their invis, that the thief will likely want to come in close to perform their spam or attack, etc. Basically, I think stealth is balanced but, like many visually confusing mechanics, it takes a little more mental learning to deal with.

I guess I’ll bite this time.

1) The way you’ve explained this already exists. If you swing your weapon like a bat, your character does “feel” the thief. Your auto attacks will roll over as you hit. If you start a channeled attack such as volley or rapid fire before the thief stealths, it will track/point out the thief through the entire attack. Some skills do not point out the thief during the channel even though they are hitting such as mesmers’ confusing images.

2) Right? Except magic. A thief is not just hiding in such a way that you somehow can’t see them. Logically (if we assume magic as logical) whatever he applied his magic to (other players, blood, etc) should also be invisible. Since something burning is simply converting one state of matter to another, the particles would also be invisible. Those arguments aside, from a gameplay standpoint, this makes stealthing virtually impossible as burning and bleeding are often applied by autoattacks and random procs, meaning the thief would be revealed for the entire fight.

3) Sure pets might be able to smell that someone is there, but smelling someone and breaking someone’s magical spell are 2 different things. Again, revealed the entire fightwith no effort by the revealing class.

4) Possibly the closest to a reasonable point, then again holding up a shield, magical or physical, in front of you should not block a hit from behind you. If you want to go to the same fighting in the dark type of logic, if someone punches you in the dark, you can make a reasonable guess as to where they are even if you cant see them. This would be exactly how it currently works with the “block” message that pops up.

5) To better understand these mechanics, you should play a thief, or watch some videos of gameplay, especially thief vs thief fights to see how they react and move when fighting each other.

That build you posted is absolute trash and would only be good at trolling with no damage – Quick Recovery and Patience have been garbage since the inception of the game and no thief uses them

Your suggestions would break the class – Can not be taken seriously at all its obvious you just started playing the game with those suggestions

2+ years later and people still think Anet is going to make drastic changes to stealth – learn to play!

PS Bella Kim did you not quit the game!? Why are you still here lol

Dod you only cry on forums stealth is ok im mesmer thief is biggest hardcounter to me and you dont see me crying i deal with them go zerker and l2p

Instead of screwing around with core mechanics a better approach would be to add more audio and visuals cues. For example, with the recent change to Point Blank Shot we see that a skill can be balanced simply by adding an animation.

Here are some possible effects that could be added to stealth without diminishing its potential:

Damage floaters visible

Right now the only way to know you’re hitting an invisible target is with auto attack chains and on hit/crit sigils.

Footprints visible in snow

This would have limited application but it would look cool when you notice it.

I’m sure there are better ideas for effects that could be implemented but these are all I can think of for now.

Narkodx.1472:

PS Bella Kim did you not quit the game!? Why are you still here lol

Yeah, right. I remember the name and the paragraphs
Why whine here when being super-happy in the another totally balanced game with perma-stealth?

Clownmug.8357:

Instead of screwing around with core mechanics a better approach would be to add more audio and visuals cues. For example, with the recent change to Point Blank Shot we see that a skill can be balanced simply by adding an animation.

Here are some possible effects that could be added to stealth without diminishing its potential:

Damage floaters visible

Right now the only way to know you’re hitting an invisible target is with auto attack chains and on hit/crit sigils.

Footprints visible in snow

This would have limited application but it would look cool when you notice it.

I’m sure there are better ideas for effects that could be implemented but these are all I can think of for now.

Actually, this is at least constructive and well-thought post.
The snow thing is hardly doable I guess (graphic settings would most probably affect that giving some advantage to high-end machine users).
Damage floaters seems nice, however it gives absolute hard-counter to AOE heavy classes/builds, which looks like the end of Thieves imho. But at least some ideas which makes sense.

Bella Kim.4061:

@ yolo swaggins.2570
I had no choice but to become a roamer
because whenever I log into WvW
there was no commander
you said thieves are good for roaming
does that mean I must make a thief just like everyone else??
when I was roaming in WvW
90% of the encounters were thieves
does that mean I must become a part of 90% just like everyone else??
NO I will not become a part of 90% I will not become a thief
I think ANET should look into this
and find out why 90% of roamers are thieves
and find out why thieves cant join zergs
maybe thieves need some buffs in some area
because most thieves do not want to fight my condi engineer
they just run away after exchanging few blows
I think stealth mechanic needs to change
because I can never killl a thief that decides to run
and my reason for this change is because
in WvW, Borderlands Bloodlust Finisher plays a huge part
if you stealth and run away 10 times you save 10 points
and it is same as saving a Tower

Nobody’s saying that, but some classes are more specialized for certain roles and tasks than others. They can all do it, but they do this differently and you sometimes have to compensate with more skill. Plus, if 90% of your encounters are thieves, learn the best ways to counter thieves, namely strong AoE, immobilization, CC, Reveal, yadda yadda. Or, you could learn to run away. Sometimes you just have to, for the sake of surviving or getting things done.

So, basically, you just have to learn to deal with thieves who, like mesmers, are more specialized to work solo. They’re not impossible to beat, but you’re fighting them on their home turf, you have to expect some challenge.

Clownmug.8357:

Instead of screwing around with core mechanics a better approach would be to add more audio and visuals cues. For example, with the recent change to Point Blank Shot we see that a skill can be balanced simply by adding an animation.

Here are some possible effects that could be added to stealth without diminishing its potential:

Damage floaters visible

Right now the only way to know you’re hitting an invisible target is with auto attack chains and on hit/crit sigils.

Footprints visible in snow

This would have limited application but it would look cool when you notice it.

I’m sure there are better ideas for effects that could be implemented but these are all I can think of for now.

I like these, but I could see a problem with the damage floaters since conditions on the thief might tick constantly and basically reveal them. If this was more of a direct damage thing, it wouldn’t be too bad.

I do not agree with the OP in almost every aspect of his comment. If you see the last thread the OP made, you my not take this one so seriously. When posters make post with what you feel are bad ideas that are game breaking and counter productive, don’t post on it, let it fade away. The OPs last thread, was an extensive, why I quite the game and deleted it. Keep that In mind.

dancingmonkey.4902:

I do not agree with the OP in almost every aspect of his comment. If you see the last thread the OP made, you my not take this one so seriously. When posters make post with what you feel are bad ideas that are game breaking and counter productive, don’t post on it, let it fade away. The OPs last thread, was an extensive, why I quite the game and deleted it. Keep that In mind.

Yeah, we know, and the stubborn ability to ignore any argument he/she can’t reply to makes it even better. And if you add repeating the same post multiple times, we have a winner here

Seriously,

0/10 Bella Kim, Try harder next time

I play a condition engi in wvw which hard counters thieves

I get mad when they run away even though I play kittenous build

I get on forums and make terrible suggestions about a class I have never played myself

GW2 Forums

Bella Kim.4061:

I hope we come up with something productive that will improve this game

No. You can up with some suggestions that you feel are productive. You really shouldn’t approach this as if your opinion were fact, and that your personal perspective is that of everyone else.

Bella Kim.4061:

I hope Guild Wars 2 will improve after 3 months

I like improvements. In any game. I simply have faith that they will not implement any of the suggestions you listed. I feel they will clearly degrade the game, and certainly won’t improve it.

Bella Kim.4061:

I wonder what developers think about this issue
maybe they just want to ignore this because more fix = more work

Why do you wonder what they think? One would like to believe you would have read their previous post on the subject before making your post. You do yourself a great disservice by not knowing such things before you speak on them.

What profession do you play?

How long have you played it?

Do feel stealth is a problem on multiple professions or just one?

What professions do you feel it is a problem on?

Have you played those professions? If so, how long?

I feel that stealth only needs to apply reveal when using an attack skill (regardless of whether it misses or blocked), and whenever it expires (even naturally). Stealth duration from combo fields should be increased since with this change, would no longer be able to stack.

Bella Kim.4061:

@ Narkodx.1472
I play Triple Kit Condi Engineer and it is not kittenous build
I have 4 different weapon skill sets ( 1 main + 3 kits )
each set has 5 different weapon skills
which means I had to study and practice and utilize 20 different weapon skills
I have to precisely execute 20 different weapon skills at the right timing
some of them have long cooldowns so I cannot just mindlessly blow skills
and also I must keep track of cooldowns of 16 different weapon skills ( #1 = no cooldown
not only this I must utilize 4 different toolbelt skills
and supply crate cast time is not instant
this makes stunning multiple targets without getting interrupted very challenging
Ive never played thief but I think I know what Dagger Pistol thieves do
5 – 2 – 2 – 2 – 2 — 1 – 1 – 2 — 5 – 2 – 2 – 2 – 2 — 1 – 1 – 2 — 5 – 2 – 2 – 2 – 2
and I think I know what Pistol Dagger thieves do
F1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 5 – 5 – 5 – 5
these dire thieves pressing only 2 number keys fighting toe to toe with my 3 Kit Engi
just ridiculous

Then you don’t really know whats going on if thats what you think is going on. If P/D were doing that, a dodge would stop it the CnD. Or if you can’t dodge, there’s static shield or gear shield. If you still get hit by CnD, you have magnetic shield to reflect the Sneak Attack.

Apparently you aren’t interrupting the D/P combo either. I would recommend doing that. An engi is one of the most capable of taking on thieves with the ample soft and hard cc. Sorry that the thief has a limited palate of global cooldowns compared to the 20+ different skills you have the flexibility of using against them.

Bella Kim.4061:

@ yolo swaggins.2570
I had no choice but to become a roamer
because whenever I log into WvW
there was no commander
you said thieves are good for roaming
does that mean I must make a thief just like everyone else??
when I was roaming in WvW
90% of the encounters were thieves
does that mean I must become a part of 90% just like everyone else??

So you don’t like thief because they are viable roamers, yet how often you see thieves in blobs?

Don’t like the game mode, don’t play it. Thief is a great roamer, but they can be out played if you know what you’re up against.

Bella Kim.4061:

@ Maugetarr.6823
thank you for explaining your novice tactics
but I am already way over that level of play
I am mid to high level where I can trick you to waste skills and evades
and I hit you with what I really wanted to hit you with
I can play with your mind and I can make you waste your combos
I always save at least 1 interrupt and I never let you use your healing skill
dueling is never a problem
because I can beat most of you in 1 vs 1 dueling rooms
my problem is that thieves have ability to disengage from a fight at will
because I can never killl a one single noob thief that decides to run
in WvW, Borderlands Bloodlust Finisher plays a huge part
if they stealth and run away 10 times they save 10 points
and it is same as saving a Tower

Oh, well then I guess I am of no help to you. Go ahead and keep making suggestions to have a class that you already have no problems dealing with nerfed because they run away too well. My mistake in thinking you wanted help rather than just wanting an easier time collecting loot bags.

OP, Thief mobility is not due to stealth. That just supplements their ability to escape. Their mobility comes from their teleports and gap closers.

You should not be surprised that you can’t catch a thief on a triple kit engineer. Thief is the most mobile class in the game, closely followed by warrior. It’s designed to be fragile and agile.

Your issue is not stealth, an S/D thief would still escape from you, even if they don’t use shadow refuge.

Bella Kim.4061:

@ Shockwave.1230
I totally agree with this
I think thieves can disengage from a fight without using stealth
out of 8 classes this one class can disengage from a fight at will
they can choose to die and choose not to die
if the thief chooses not to die I can never kill the thief
I can kill the dumb ones by keeping my health low and baiting them
but most of them just disengage and run
maybe the stealth mechanic is fine as it is
maybe mobility is the main problem

That may be, but it doesn’t change the fact that thieves were [I assume] purposefully made this way to be capable of disengaging at a moments notice. And, rather than a full-on “problem”[which people usually say when something kills them easily] I’d put it in as a simple annoyance.

Bella Kim.4061:

Actually I change my mind
I just realized that stealth is not the problem
thieves have too many movement skills
Heartseeker (+swiftness)
Infiltrator Arrow
Infiltrator’s Signet
Infiltrator’s Strike
Shadowstep
Steal (untargeted)
and many more

You are still missing the real problem. Stealth is fine, mobility is fine, the problem is a thief can spam them both because they don’t have cooldowns. Removing initiative is what needs to happen so the dev’s can properly balance thieves instead of constantly nerfing them.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Bella Kim.4061:

Actually I change my mind
I just realized that stealth is not the problem
thieves have too many movement skills
Heartseeker (+swiftness)
Infiltrator Arrow
Infiltrator’s Signet
Infiltrator’s Strike
Shadowstep
Steal (untargeted)
and many more

You are still missing the real problem. Stealth is fine, mobility is fine, the problem is a thief can spam them both because they don’t have cooldowns. Removing initiative is what needs to happen so the dev’s can properly balance thieves instead of constantly nerfing them.

What are the chances of a complete redisign?? -looks at ranger’s pet- Most people got used to using and countering initiative it will never happen. -looks at ranger’s pet- Even if there is a rebirth event where all classes are properly reviewed and adjusted as well as the whole game the chances would go from 0.01% to 0.1%.

Some things can be adjusted initiative is not one of them.

Bella Kim.4061:

these are my suggestions for making stealth mechanic more understandable
lets apply stealth ability to real life situations

1. Damages taken should remove Stealth.
If you turn all the light off in your room and swing a bat in the darkness with your eyes closed, you will be able to feel the impacts whenever you hit something with your bat
this means when we hit a foe in stealth with melee attack we should be able to locate the foe in stealth or at least we should see the white damage numbers pop up
lets say there is a crystal clear wall of glass in my backyard
I throw a baseball and if the baseball hits something and bounces off it means I know there is something invisible
this means when we shoot a bullet or an arrow and if the bullet or the arrow gets stuck in the middle of the air it means the bullet or the arrow is stuck inside something invisible and we should be able to locate the foe in stealth unless the foe pulls out the all the bullets and arrows or at least we should see the white damage numbers pop up

No, this would make AoE against stealthed opponents, especially thieves, really really overpowered.

2. Some Conditions should remove Stealth.
(Bleeding) If the foe in stealth drips blood we should be able to see the blood dripping
we should see the red stuff spouting out like a fountain or is it too gruesome?
(Burning) If the foe in stealth has flames all over its body with black and gray smoke we should be able to see those flames and smoke and the foe in stealth should be turning black like ash

I have sort of the same idea as this, but making them spurt blood like a geyser would be too much. If it was just a small blood drop once every maybe 2 seconds it would be ok I would think. Same with burning and other damaging conditions, not non-damaging ones though. A small puff of flame for burn, drop of blood for bleeding, and poison puff for poison. Only one would be displayed however, that being the one that was applied most recently. Very small, like you would have to be watching to notice it.

3. Animals should remove Stealth.
npc monsters or pets with a well-developed sense of sound or smell should be able to locate foe in stealth
this means most pets should be able to apply reveal effect every second within ~1000 radius with unlimited number of targets

No as this would render stealth near unusable for dungeons, and rangers would be able to make thieves and possibly mesmers into pin cushions. They already have Sic’ Em to do this.

4 Blocking should remove Stealth.
you are wearing a football helmet with eyes closed and if someone hits your helmet with a bat, you will be able to feel the impact and you will know which direction the bat came from. this means blocking stealth attack should remove Stealth.

Agreed with this, or at least have that BLOCK floater appear to indicate you have been hit by the thief. I mean if you were able to time a block to the point a stealthed enemy was about to hit you, I believe you should be rewarded.

If they did some of these changes I agreed with though, classes that rely on stealth as a defensive mechanic, so thief, mesmer…maybe ranger, would need to have appropriate buffs to compensate. Thief could be rewarded for better timing their dodges I suppose, as well as making it so venoms were actually usuable by giving them a usuable cooldown, and perhaps giving boons depending on which venom was activated. Mesmers…I don’t play one nor have I played against that many, so I won’t comment. They however seem to use stealth as more of a tool rather than a defensive mechanic…least from the little experience I had with them, same with ranger. Engi has stealth as well I know, but it’s less on demand, they can’t just press a button and boom! Stealth! I flee! Well unless they use toolbelt elixir s.

This thread makes me laugh and cry at the same time…

I guess thanks for the amusement in the later hours

Sagat.3285:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Bella Kim.4061:

Actually I change my mind
I just realized that stealth is not the problem
thieves have too many movement skills
Heartseeker (+swiftness)
Infiltrator Arrow
Infiltrator’s Signet
Infiltrator’s Strike
Shadowstep
Steal (untargeted)
and many more

You are still missing the real problem. Stealth is fine, mobility is fine, the problem is a thief can spam them both because they don’t have cooldowns. Removing initiative is what needs to happen so the dev’s can properly balance thieves instead of constantly nerfing them.

What are the chances of a complete redisign?? -looks at ranger’s pet- Most people got used to using and countering initiative it will never happen. -looks at ranger’s pet- Even if there is a rebirth event where all classes are properly reviewed and adjusted as well as the whole game the chances would go from 0.01% to 0.1%.

Some things can be adjusted initiative is not one of them.

Well they could be changed but they won’t be, which is sad because most of the classes need some serious work -looks at rangers pet

Am I the only one who reads Bella Kim’s posts as poetry?

Bella Kim.4061:

@ Narkodx.1472
I play Triple Kit Condi Engineer and it is not kittenous build
I have 4 different weapon skill sets ( 1 main + 3 kits )
each set has 5 different weapon skills
which means I had to study and practice and utilize 20 different weapon skills
I have to precisely execute 20 different weapon skills at the right timing
some of them have long cooldowns so I cannot just mindlessly blow skills
and also I must keep track of cooldowns of 16 different weapon skills ( #1 = no cooldown
not only this I must utilize 4 different toolbelt skills
and supply crate cast time is not instant
this makes stunning multiple targets without getting interrupted very challenging
Ive never played thief but I think I know what Dagger Pistol thieves do
5 – 2 – 2 – 2 – 2 — 1 – 1 – 2 — 5 – 2 – 2 – 2 – 2 — 1 – 1 – 2 — 5 – 2 – 2 – 2 – 2
and I think I know what Pistol Dagger thieves do
F1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 1 – 1 – 5 – 5 – 5 – 5 – 5
these dire thieves pressing only 2 number keys fighting toe to toe with my 3 Kit Engi
just ridiculous

What is ridiculous is how easy is to play condi engi even for a complete noob, I for example, still struggle with the turret heal and I literally spam skills that are off cooldown, yet stuff dies. I will read the tooltips one day.

Bella Kim.4061:

thoughtless drivel

So basically, no more stealth.

Thinking only in terms of 1v1 or very small group:

1. Thief vs Anyone with AoE, no stealth
2. Thief vs Anyone with bleed condis, no stealth
   Thief vs Anyone with burn condis, no stealth
3. Thief vs Ranger, no stealth
4. Anyone with Aegis active, no stealth

Or, in other words, AoE to reveal, apply bleed/burn, no more stealth for remainder of fight, which won’t be long, because the thief has low HP even under the best circumstances. Any group with a ranger, no stealth immediately and revealed with sic ’em.

Take this to the medium to large group level with a mix of classes and it is literally impossible to stealth.

So what mechanic are you going to give thieves in exchange for permanently removing stealth from any combat scenario?

Ok lets take this to a real life situation.
Ppl don’t shoot fireballs from there hands, they don’t summon undead minions nor they swing huge hammers like they have no weights.

So yeah… I guess you can’t take the game to a real life situation…

Part 1/2

Bella Kim.4061:

…
lets apply stealth ability to real life situations
…

And this is where it begins…

Bella Kim.4061:

1. Damages taken should remove Stealth.
If you turn all the light off in your room and swing a bat in the darkness with your eyes closed, you will be able to feel the impacts whenever you hit something with your bat
this means when we hit a foe in stealth with melee attack we should be able to locate the foe in stealth or at least we should see the white damage numbers pop up
lets say there is a crystal clear wall of glass in my backyard
I throw a baseball and if the baseball hits something and bounces off it means I know there is something invisible
this means when we shoot a bullet or an arrow and if the bullet or the arrow gets stuck in the middle of the air it means the bullet or the arrow is stuck inside something invisible and we should be able to locate the foe in stealth unless the foe pulls out the all the bullets and arrows or at least we should see the white damage numbers pop up

Great analogy, creative. So, unless you’re hitting an object, creatures/people tend to move away from the position of where they were originally hit. It might sound strange, but if I was to hit you with a bat you would probably be in another place after it, you would either be on the ground or starting to limp/run away to avoid taking another hit. Which brings me to the next “sense” of reality, if you hit someone with a bat… well it should gravely injure them. So, you might as well ask for that too.
Now think of it in game, you have in fact hit the stealthed person, you have in fact hurt them, and their natural reaction is to move away from the place where they were hurt… Now if they don’t, you can continue to swing away (which btw, you should be doing anyways when fighting a stealthed foe).
Yeah, if you throw a baseball at the same exact location twice, presumably one throw would hit the object and the second throw would miss the object – since the object might have been knocked away by the first baseball throw.
Unfortunately, only some games support arrows stick out of their victims for a certain period of time. This is not one of them, and this game doesn’t support arrows sticking out of people. So, sorry, it can’t work here.

White numbers pop’ing up – AH, so in all this weird analogy, what you were asking for is feedback? Yes, maybe there should be feedback – but that would require a lot more thought put into it than analogies to real life (and trust me, there have, yet nothing has been done).

Bella Kim.4061:

2. Some Conditions should remove Stealth.
(Bleeding) If the foe in stealth drips blood we should be able to see the blood dripping
we should see the red stuff spouting out like a fountain or is it too gruesome?
(Burning) If the foe in stealth has flames all over its body with black and gray smoke we should be able to see those flames and smoke and the foe in stealth should be turning black like ash

(Bleeding) Yeah and they should die of bleeding unless they patch themselves up.
(Burning) Yeah and they should die within a minute of being engulfed in flames.
While this game does support debuffs, that emulate these conditions, they dont support textural/lighting impact (aside from fire). So again, sorry but this game can’t support it.

But I sense that what you’re trying to get at here is getting some feedback?

Part 2/2

Bella Kim.4061:

3. Animals should remove Stealth.
npc monsters or pets with a well-developed sense of sound or smell should be able to locate foe in stealth
this means most pets should be able to apply reveal effect every second within ~1000 radius with unlimited number of targets

kitten , you have no real life analogy here.
Maybe they could bark in the general direction of the stealthed creature… maybe lunge at it’s direction if the pet is brave enough to do so…
At the same time an opponent that can anticipate where the stealthed creature is can attempt to hit them. If anticipation isn’t your strong suit in combat, randomly swinging the sword might do the trick.

So here, you’re just asking for a pet buff to reveal/apply reveal on stealth characters. I guess another Sic’em, or a permanent Sic’em that auto-does it self.

Bella Kim.4061:

4 Blocking should remove Stealth.
you are wearing a football helmet with eyes closed and if someone hits your helmet with a bat, you will be able to feel the impact and you will know which direction the bat came from. this means blocking stealth attack should remove Stealth.

Yes, you will not only be able to feel it, you will also be probably disoriented by it (so let’s apply confusion!). At the same time, if they did hit you with a bat, a smart stealthed person would move away and hit you from another angle, keeping you confused… Or do you expecting to fight people with an IQ lower than yours? Hmmm…

Feed back again?

Bella Kim.4061:

5 It’s your turn now
there are many different mechanics in this game
give us your suggestions so that we can make these mechanics more understandable

Well. I wouldn’t cry for help after I got beat. I would try to improve myself. I would expect a “fix” to never come. Worst comes to worst, i would roll the said class i had problems with, and reap the souls of noobs just like they’ve reaped mine.

Feed back/Mechanic change? Providing feed back on stealth alone can ultimately break an entire class to the point of uselessness (maybe an over-exaggeration but, i doubt you will see many thieves left in pvp or roaming in WvW after this change). That being said, if some sort of feed back was to be provided on stealth, it would require a full on rework of stealth (many “buffs” and many “nerfs” – but in reality, just a complete overhaul). There have been MANY suggestions in the past, since this subject is almost as beaten to death as that horse that has the word “Mounts” written on it. And yet here we are, nothing has changed since… why? because the devs have their own agenda. Maybe they do listen, maybe they don’t… but they’re doing what they think will be right, whether they will do what I like or you like, we don’t know. When will they do it? We don’t know that either. What can we do? we can stop crying rivers of tears (although they are delicious) and attempt to find a solution by ourselves for ourselves. Attempting to overcome something, struggling to do something, seems to be how we’ve evolved thus far… so try not to fall behind. (Hey look at me, I made a real life analogy just like you!)

Holly hell I was bored tonight…

(Many spelling and grammatical fixes have been made…)

Also, I really love your attempt at being the next Burnfall in terms of your writing/response style… but you need to emphasize words… here let you with that

Bella Kim.4061:

@ yolo swaggins.2570
I had no choice but to become a roamer
because whenever I log into WvW
there was no commander
you said thieves are good for roaming
does that mean I must make a thief just like everyone else??
when I was roaming in WvW
90% of the encounters were thieves
does that mean I must become a part of 90% just like everyone else??
NO
I will not become a part of 90%
I will not become a thief
I think ANET should look into this
and find out why 90% of roamers are thieves
and find out why thieves cant join zergs
maybe thieves need some buffs in some area
because most thieves do not want to fight my condi engineer
they just run away after exchanging few blows
I think stealth mechanic needs to change
because I can never killl a thief that decides to run
and my reason for this change is because
in WvW, Borderlands Bloodlust Finisher plays a huge part
if you stealth and run away 10 times you save 10 points
and it is same as saving a Tower

Not as poetic either, but you have to develop that style yourself…

Now yolo swaggins… do you feel bad after re-reading that with bolded words?

No I don’t, Zero Day. It’s PvP. Git gud or git out.

yolo swaggins.2570:

No I don’t, Zero Day. It’s PvP. Git gud or git out.

Well kitten .
Seems like you got a long way to go in your poetry Bella.

Lol this thread again.
Keep dreaming, yo. It never hurts.

Bella Kim.4061:

Actually I change my mind
I just realized that stealth is not the problem
thieves have too many movement skills
Heartseeker (+swiftness)
Infiltrator Arrow
Infiltrator’s Signet
Infiltrator’s Strike
Shadowstep
Steal (untargeted)
and many more

Surprise!!
You know, that’s why the class is called “a Thief”, because it’s fast, agile and not encased in heavy armor or using magic thingies or gizmos like the others….

Take their mobility away and you can as well remove them from the game completely, because they would be useless that way…

Just stop it, nobody will grant you free kills on any class by changing the game mechanics.
Or should Thieves rant here because they can’t kill triple kit condi Engies? You can predict how this will end….