Guild Wars 2

Warning: This topic was written when I was mentally disappointed on making no difference when compared to builds that weren’t DPS or *DPS-support.
I wasn’t thinking straight during that time.

Are there plans to update the OLD GROUP CONTENT?

Would be nice to know…

Mainly because old content doesn’t give good reasons to use Support, CC or condition builds, being mostly optimal for direct damage builds, like full berserkers…

And so they produce the unfair practices, full-berserker-teams and other exploits…

Of course, SOLO is not affected, because SOLO isn’t exactly a Group content, when played alone…

i’ll bait
So, exploit isn’t what you dislike. Full cleric teams are an exploit, since it allows to complete any pve content without dodging. See, that’s not the way it works.
I don’t know how many times this has been said, but wearing a gear ( berserker here) doesn’t kitten you in a role. A full berserker guard is actually your typical “support” role for trinity mmo: it gives damage mitigation and condi removal mainly, and the meta build isn’t a max damage build but rather a group friendly build. All classes but necro have some team support, and wearing full ptv or condi or whatever doesn’t prevent you from using these.
If full berserker teams are an exploit, care to explain why? What mechanics did they bypass? Dodge? Oh wait, wearing an offensive gear means you’ll use damage mitigations, and wearing tanky gear allows you to facetank stuff. That’s an exploit.
If dungeons doesn’t give you the ability to use cc, support, or even boonstrip, you’re just a selfish individual not supporting its team. Gear has nothing to do with role, every class is a damage dealer.

I love the unfair practices part, like he thinks it’s unfair practices that groups don’t want anything besides berserker. How about requiring groups to now have specific roles being an unfair practice? The current set up that we have is the only one that allows for every group comp to be able to complete content. It’s just a matter of how fast you can clear it. Also, as oxtred stated, every class has support, cc, and control options, these are defined through traits, weapons, and utility skills.

Oh I know, or do you mean you want to be a nomad wearing guardian, wanting to feel needed by the group because you are there to absorb damage for your team while healing them? Or do you want to be a water camping ele wearing clerics gear, and feel needed by your group because you are providing a needed part of the group?

But unless you have friends to do the content, others will very likely force you to use berserker…

Well, I see no answers from you, looks more like an angry outburst when pointing that most old group content doesn’t offer you reason to use support, CC or conditions, since berserker is the most optimal…

Much like some players get outraged when stuff is nerfed…

Did you know? I’m a magician. Look. I’ve a magic solution if you’re forced to play berserker. I know i’m awesome, that’s the way it is.

Open a lfg, say " P1, everyone welcome"
WOW
my god, I’m so intelligent it hurts.

Seriously though, you rant about something, we give you counter arguments, and you just deny it saying it’s an angry outburst? I mean, meaningful discussion is always nice, much less after the 1000th time but still; on the other hand why would you post a question on the forum if you’re not even looking for answers?
Also give me an exemple of a pve fight where support doesn’t make things faster.
Edit: typo

Every class provides support, CC, and conditions, through their use of utility skills. Those utility skills work the same regardless of the stat combo you are wearing. Think a Guardian’s WoR will reflect any better if he is wearing Soldier’s stats? No it won’t. The thing is that there is no reason to use any gear other than berserker. No one forces you to use any gear type. Yes, if you try to join a speed run group wearing Nomad’s, ur going to get kicked. Start your own group. It seems your answer to your perceived notion of people forcing you to play how they want, is to force them to play how you want. That is not a good solution to anything. I think that this game doesn’t offer what you want/need in a game, so instead of finding a game that does that for you, you want to change this game into what you want, for what ever reason.

Edit: oxtred and I both provided constructive feedback based on your question, and you attack us because it’s not the answer you want to hear. What, are you 12?

So, your answer is to not give challenging content, only remain on the direct damage/critical optimized for everything. Easy content in other name.

Don’t give reason to play other styles other than Berserker?

Support, CC, but players don’t use it, since it’s better to kill the monster as fast as possible, before they deal serious damage.
With more compelling group content, dps build with support might just almost barely keep players alive…

It was a bad mistake by ANet to design the content, the Mordrem on other hand are a step towards right way. Hopefully this gets more widespread, since combat is more active.

Other bad thing is that players think that professions should be buffed over their balance philosophy, while the problem is the PvE Group content that limits all to direct damage/crit as superior choice…

Every dungeon runner wants new content. That doesn’t mean the old content is bad, i’m still having a blast trying to get record times or soloing things, and the gw2 combat system is really good. You keep telling us cc and support is useless, but any good dungeon runner will tell you otherwise. IF you never used support or cc and still survived, it shows that an inexperienced group may be able to end a dungeon path, why would you complain about that? You’re being elitist for the sake of being elitist. Harder content is totally welcome and needed, but the paths we have now are far from bad designed. Some players find the fgs meta boring, i personally don’t but i can understand their point, apart from that pve fights are generally fun and chalenging when doing them for the first few times. If you balance the game to be hard for pve hardcore runners, all the pug playerbase won’t be able to even finish the content.

I do agree with you, new content would be great. But saying the dungeons we have now never use support or cc isn’t true at all, and you probably know it. Might, fury, stability, banners, frost spirit, projectile reflection or absorbtion, damage mitigation, conjured weapons, condi removal.. That’s support. CC is used in any high level guild to gain dps uptime, like interrupting arah P2 abom, CoE golem, berserkers spin, illusionists aa, etc. You may not need those when playing a selfish survivable build, but if my full zerker ele doesn’t interrupt or support, i’ll just get oneshot by a random critter.
(may contain typos)

tl;dr: You’re right, we need new content, but i wanted to argue against that misconception where full berserker teams are only focused on dps.

He just wants groups to have to have people heal specc’d or tanky specc’d. That is what he means by support. He doesn’t give two flips about blind fields, might stacking, fury, vulnerability, time warp, empower allies, Phalanyx Strength, spotter, wall of reflection, feedback. According to him that isn’t support at all. While harder and new content would be nice, he is wanting to force a trinity based system in where it doesn’t belong.

Active combat, which doesn’t exist in majority of old PvE Group content (corner exploits, blind spots etc.). You’re not rewarded for playing support, CC or heavy condition builds, since it is optional to play as one, while some players don’t want them because of that, they’re not necessary for gameplay…

Other being the armor sets, you don’t use most of them, since you can always go offensive since they’re the optimal choices…
Offensive support, they’re mostly boosting direct damage sources, while might does also condition dmg, still not providing reason to play other support. Most offensive support don’t use other armor sets, since those builds focus on boosting offensive stats.

You’re just saying that there’s no reason to use every armor sets, only the currently optimal ones, which excludes the most of the stat sets, because it’s better off to spec on offensive support. You’d rather keep it that way, no use for the armor sets, keep them in state where they’re barely used…

What I want, is full use for everything, and still make difference, than being just optional and not necessity, thus being avoided with majority of old PvE group content…

Did you read what i said? Are you really complaining there’s something optimal? Every single game has an optimal gear/comp. You can still complete a dungeon in cleric, nomad, rabid, naked, or whatever suits you, and it’s not even harder. What do you suggest to make selfish gameplay useful? ( Because, let’s not lie here, stacking toughness for yourself is far from group friendly). Also, bingo, i’ll try to avoid corners in dungeons since it’s an exploit. Yeah, the fastest pve set is the most damaging one. How surprising, a good team can maintain themselves alive without stacking toughness or vitality. I gave you exemple of support, and you keep spreading nonsense like corner exploiting or full berserker team exploiting. Do you even know what that means?

Let’s recap, you want all armors to be necessary. Ok, so we design a dungeon where the mobs deal so much damage you need to play in ptv. Now, dungeon running guild needs ptv to barely survive. What about pugs? The irony here is you want people to play your way whereas I’m defending the “phiw” playstyle.

Condition is indeed a problem in dungeons, with all that condition cap things, but making at least one condition user necessary won’t change the meta, it’ll just bring a new trinity, and Anet ( me as well) doesn’t want that.

As a side note, you keep involving support is tied to gear, tell me how your tanking worked while you were pewpewing with a scepter as a full ptv guard while your team was dying.

Sorry if i seem a bit harsh, but repeating the same things and just getting called an exploiter for that isn’t really enjoyeable. That said, back on topic, would you like more hardcore content suited for above average players or the kind of dungeons we have now with new mechanics and possibly punishing for fgs stacking if that’s really something that bugs you?

Since Old PvE content in general has been designed wrong. Mistake on ANet’s part.

What I want is every gear has meaning, current PvE design doesn’t give much meaning for other than DPS and offensive support. Again the new mordrem are exception.

“Play how I want”, also known as “Selfish gameplay where you don’t have to rely on allies” which fits more to Solo gameplay, when bringing same thing to group content, it gives players no reason to cooperate.

(Come with high armor, your aggro rating increases, if you know how to utilize it, but there’s no content to teach players how to use it, since it’s not made necessary, while high direct dmg builds are more desired, since mobs don’t have much of defense against direct damage.)

Group content always should require atleast minimum cooperation. As most group content are, there’s no actual benefit on bringing support, CC or conditions, because of design that doesn’t give reasons to bring them. Tho very few do bring out the need for support, while CC is mostly unwanted. It was never about making content hardcore, just more teaching and enough challenging

Again simple design that doesn’t utilize active combat elements, doesn’t teach players how to use it. The new content however does better job…

Once again, any other armor stats, than Pvt or Ppf are mostly despised. This in turn forces players to play DPS as there’s no actual player acknowledgement of healing, CC or conditions.

Dungeons, they’re designed for direct damage in mind, since there’s no good reasons to even play support, since it’s always better to kill the mobs fast, instead of bringing healing or CC to prolong allies DPS capabilities or control mobs, mostly because too simple designs and serious threats having Unshakable, and that mobs have more HP and DMG than armor.

Everything is designed to be vulnerable to direct damage sources, thus optimal for direct damage builds, like berserker gear.

“Play how I want” doesn’t bring group gameplay, it just makes players selfish. Unfortunately it also removes the meaning of RPG, along with players from actually learning stuff. One reason for making players deny existence of mechanics and even the trinity…

Again, you keep saying there is no reason to not bring support. How is Wall of Reflection not support? How is Feedback not support? How is stealth not support? How protection not support? Tell me how those are not support and how they scale off of stats? The only stat that scales is healing power, and poorly, with reason. Because Anet did not want a trinity or pvp players sitting back and getting massive amounts of heals. You can bring all the toughness in the world, but you have no taunt that makes sure that the mob stays on you, and even if you are taking the hits, it doesn’t matter because there isn’t enough sustain. You are trying to force a trinity into a game that was NOT designed for one. You want to play a healer and keep your allies alive, or a tank that protects your allies, I get that. You want to feel needed by your group, and because of that, this is not the game for you. And to say that other stats are not used, you must not wvw or pvp.

Tell you what, I challenge you to come up with an encounter that does what you want, without having to require parties to have to have a specific build, class, or anything. I promise you, if you start having mobs hit harder or more often, you switch from a berserker meta, to a PVT meta, or what have you. This games group support is through the usage of boons and utility skills.

Edit: You keep saying exploits, I do not think it means what you think it means.

Edit 2: You also keep saying no need for conditions. How are blinds, vulnerability, weakness, chilled. crippled, and immobilized not conditions? That is the majority of your conditions right there, and they don’t scale off of anything but condition duration.

I agree with the OP there must be added specific roles especially for dungeons.Instead 5 zerkers.Add from everything – dps/support/control.
Right now control is used mostly in WvW/PvP(bunkers) and Tequatl as they have a lot of health and are more tankier.
Support is great for when you need more cc removals and healing.
Those two roles at their current state are just useless in PvE enviroment.It doesn’t matter Is it dungeons or Open World.In PvE at this moment zerkers are just the best thing which is stupid.What about the other two roles?Buff the mobs so there can be an actual use for support and control.

Please take the time to read the posts before going on with your misinformation.