Guild Wars 2

(This post is mostly copy/pasted from another Thread but I feel it deserves its on post for visibility)

I keep seeing references to Warrior mobility being too strong. My question to these people is, how would you nerf this without dumbing down the game or making Warriors unable to close the gap?

Say you make skills like Rush and Savage Leap require a target. That to me seems like a major step back in terms of MMO design. Requiring a target to do an attack seems so archaic. Having more freedom of movement is one of the strongest parts of this game. I can’t touch other MMOs that require targets because of this system. Also, since this mobility issue is only really an “issue” in WvW do you think requiring a target would actually change anything? With skills that teleport it makes sense for it to require a target but less so with leaps/running. Here’s what would happen, the Warrior would target an ambient mob or any other mob and use the skill. If they get close enough to hit they’ll cancel the attack via weapon swap or sheathing the weapon. Basically, nothing will change.

If you give Rush/SL the Ride the Lightning treatment do you think that would really change anything? You’ll have the same situation as above where they’ll just target a white or yellow mob that are almost everywhere in WvW. If you did want to encourage these skills for only gap closing then maybe you could up the CD on Rush and have it be halved if it hits something. TO do that and be fair though ANet would HAVE to change the skill so that it more reliably connects with the target.

Reducing the distance also poses problems. Sure, this would make using them for running harder, but it would also make them even MORE susceptible to soft CC. It would be pretty much as bad as pre-buffs Warrior where they couldn’t avoid being kited to death.

With all these in mind here’s my suggestion:

• Increase the CD of Rush but make it be halved if it connects with something.

• Reduce the distance but make the attack faster and remove cripple and chill and make them immune to it while Rushing.

• Change the attack once you reach the target to one that activates as soon as you reach them and possible make it have a slightly wider range so that it can’t be so easily avoided with non dodge.

I’m suggesting that the ONLY skill that be touched right now is Rush. Messing with Rush, Savage leap, and Whirlwind Attack in the same patch could be disastrous for the class (reducing Whirlwind Attaack’s range would actually be a buff to it’s combat effectiveness I bet because the attacks would be close together).

Tee point of this post is that there needs to be a way to let Warriors use their gap closes as gap closers and not punishing Warriors that use them as such just because some run away in WvW. Complaining about S/Horn + GS builds is ridiculous seeing that their combat effectiveness isn’t that great.

The balance team has been making me nervous recently since many nerfs that are passed out come from demands on these forums from players who have never played Warrior and probably just want them to be like launch where they were easily soft CC’d to death. If Warrior’s ability to “run away” is reduced (which I still hardly find to be a issue and even in WvW it’s most due to -condi duration food) and Combustive Shot gets more counterplay there will be little left for people to whine about when it comes to Warrior. I’m sure they’ll still harp on Healing Signet even though now that I’ve started playing my Engi a lot more I find healing Turret to be much stronger but there’s always going to be players who hate on Warrior no matter what.

EDIT: One more small tangent, can we PLEASE get more frequent smaller balance changes!? Waiting 6 months to get the whole meta flipped upside down is really frustrating. Getting small tweaks every 1-2 months would make so much more sense.

Modify Rush to drop a loot bag if the warrior uses it while under 50% hp (ICD on loot drop: 3 minutes).

There, problem solved. Now warriors can run away all they want and nobody will complain about it.

;)

i think greatsword 5 rush is balanced at the moment, does not require further adjustments.

1,200 range, plus the warrior actually needs to run towards there, run, not fly or leap. cripple, immobilize, chilled will stop rush.

the 20 seconds without trait seems fair enough.

i dun use greatsword much but i think rush is fine as it is.

same as long sword 2 savage leap, it is balanced. no need further adjustments.

i think the warrior haters just need to deal with it.

by the way, skills should never be balanced for the sake of a few whiners who play WvW only.

skill balances should always focus on 5 vs 5 conquest mode sPvP.

some people only complain because they cannot put down some warriors in WvW.

BurrTheKing.8571:

Say you make skills like Rush and Savage Leap require a target. That to me seems like a major step back in terms of MMO design. Requiring a target to do an attack seems so archaic. Having more freedom of movement is one of the strongest parts of this game. I can’t touch other MMOs that require targets because of this system. Also, since this mobility issue is only really an “issue” in WvW do you think requiring a target would actually change anything? With skills that teleport it makes sense for it to require a target but less so with leaps/running. Here’s what would happen, the Warrior would target an ambient mob or any other mob and use the skill. If they get close enough to hit they’ll cancel the attack via weapon swap or sheathing the weapon. Basically, nothing will change.

And if you made Savage Leap and Rush require a target, what would happen to Whirlwind Attack?

• Increase the CD of Rush but make it be halved if it connects with something.
• Reduce the distance but make the attack faster and remove cripple and chill and make them immune to it while Rushing.
• Change the attack once you reach the target to one that activates as soon as you reach them and possible make it have a slightly wider range so that it can’t be so easily avoided with non dodge.

• If you do that, you’ll just end up with people asking to match it to RTL.
• The animation is already slow, so speeding it up shouldn’t be tied to “balancing” it.
• Again, this is how it should function by default.

Tee point of this post is that there needs to be a way to let Warriors use their gap closes as gap closers and not punishing Warriors that use them as such just because some run away in WvW. Complaining about S/Horn + GS builds is ridiculous seeing that their combat effectiveness isn’t that great.

Why is it that running away in WvW is such a big deal? Unless you have a 100 man zerg consisting entirely of GS Warriors Rushing all over the map, I don’t see why Rush should be changed based on its usage in WvW.

The best change to rush would be to rework it completely (a targeted leap instead of something that uses wonky pathing), and make it the new F1 and have it consume adrenaline in a similar manner to the LB (have Arcing Slice take over its old spot).

It would force Warriors to use it more tactically instead of a braindead way to reset combat, and to get max mobility some utilities might have to be factored in, like taking healing surge instead of signet, or taking signet of fury.

Lower distance but increase its damage to encourage people to use it in fight, not just to run away.

No need to make rush have some weird restriction like rtl does.

I don’t disagree with some of you. The fact is though that ANet has a history of giving in to these few people who are very vocal. If ANet is going to nerf Warrior mobility, then at least we can make the skill function how it should have in the first place and have it encourage using it as a gap closer and only being “eh” at running away.

BurrTheKing.8571:

The fact is though that ANet has a history of giving in to these few people who are very vocal. If ANet is going to nerf Warrior mobility

this is very unfortunate.

i guess we need to be more vocal than them then.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

by the way, skills should never be balanced for the sake of a few whiners who play WvW only.

skill balances should always focus on 5 vs 5 conquest mode sPvP.

some people only complain because they cannot put down some warriors in WvW.

High mobility is not only important in WvW, but also sPvP. When every1 is fighting at mid for instance, it is sometimes game changing if some1 can quickly run and cap far or close, and then come back to join the fight again.

TyPin.9860:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

by the way, skills should never be balanced for the sake of a few whiners who play WvW only.

skill balances should always focus on 5 vs 5 conquest mode sPvP.

some people only complain because they cannot put down some warriors in WvW.

High mobility is not only important in WvW, but also sPvP. When every1 is fighting at mid for instance, it is sometimes game changing if some1 can quickly run and cap far or close, and then come back to join the fight again.

while that is true.
it certainly does not justify any unreasonable requests to remove the “mobility” of warriors, particularly the long sword skill 2 – savage leap along with the various greatsword skills.

these skills were already there during beta weekends, and after launch.

but no one complained about these skills, because the warrior would be dead very quickly before the warrior could even think about escaping.

now, the warrior is in a very good spot, but the warrior haters who have gotten used to putting down warriors very easily in the past is not satisfied, and will not stop complaining until warriors are easy to put down again.

What about gap openings? (not running away but creating some distance)

I dont get it that warriors may not run away because many classes can do that..
But what about creating a GAP for defensive role???

Like mesmers cant run away but they can still teleport away to create some distance..

Every class have ways to create those gaps.. maby by fear or evade or stealth or teleport or whatever.. i really dont get it why you need to nerf this for warr

nicknamenick.2437:

What about gap openings? (not running away but creating some distance)

I dont get it that warriors may not run away because many classes can do that..
But what about creating a GAP for defensive role???

Like mesmers cant run away but they can still teleport away to create some distance..

Every class have ways to create those gaps.. maby by fear or evade or stealth or teleport or whatever.. i really dont get it why you need to nerf this for warr

because some minority warrior hater players are not happy when the warrior they are fighting fled away from the battle before they could put down the warrior.

then they come here to the forums to whine and complain.
they will not stop until their ridiculous demands are heard.

@Olba
Whirlwind attack is fine. I don’t see why it should be changed in any way.