Guild Wars 2

The forums are saturated with people complaining how op thieves are because of stealth. Well to tell you the truth they’re not. What’s op is the skill of the player. Any player who is skilled in their class can defeat any profession. Here I’ll explain the mindset of thieves and their fight-style given the common weapon set D/D and D/P with traits X/30/30/X/X.To my fellow experienced players, feel free to add anything I missed.

TL;DR
Thief class isn’t just about stealth and backstab. You need to be aware, have good positioning, reaction, and intiative management. Also, stealth can be countered by reading the thief’s animations of CnD and HS.

Top picked utilities
*Hide in Shadows
*Withdraw
*Shadow Step
*Shadow Refuge
*Blinding Power
*Infiltrators Signet
*Smoke Screen

[b]Characteristics of an Experienced Thief[b]
*Aware of your surrondings
*Positioning
*Reaction
*Initiative Management

Aware of your surroundings
Most theif builds run a mix of zerk, valk, calv, or soldier gear to maximize their damage while giving some survivability.This class has one of the lowest base health and no invuln, stability(except dagger storm), protection, or aegis for damage/cc mitigaton. Instead they have positioning, mobility, stealth, and evades for compensation. Thieves are always moving when fighting because once they are stunned, crippled, immobilized, or chilled, they are open to attack and usually equals death unless they re-position. In WvW thieves would/should constantly move their camera 360 degree to ensure their safety from a possible gank.

Positioning
Because of thieves’ low hp and toughness, they must know where to position themselves to avoid damage and create opportunities to safely strike. This is not easy since it requires knowledge of other professions and their builds.

Reaction
A thief player should always be watching their enemies’ animation to dodge their cc/burst combo which requires knowledge of the profession. Thieves are not like guardians or warriors where they can face tank the damage. It only takes one wrong move for a thief to be bursted to death or close to it. This why thieves must be precise and coordinated with their attacks. Usually when the enemy finishes their burst rotation the theif will safely go in for their burst.

Initiatve Management
Initiative management is key to a thief’s burst and survival. Thieves’ burst requires 6 initiative(D/D) or 9 initiative(D/P), when they attack they are vulnerable since they won’t have enough initiative to escape, unless they use an utility skill. Same goes if they use their initiative for survival(Shortbow #3 or HS), they won’t have enough to burst the opponenet. Knowing when to use inititive for burst or survival depends on the situation. If the enemey is on cool down go in for the burst. If their hp is low use HS, Shortbow #3 or #5 to escape. After numerous of deaths and learning, an experienced theif will instinctly react to the best option.

Stealth use

For thieves, stealth gives them a choice to play either offensively or defensively.

Offensive Play
D/D
IMO, the most important aspect to a D/D is their initiation. A common initiation in this set is Basilisk→CnD→Steal→BS→AA. If you are in 900 range, unless traited, and carefully observing the thief’s CnD cast(watch for the thief’s left hand swinging) be prepared to dodge. Disrupting this combo cost half of their total initiative(12), this leaves the thief vulnerable and forces them to play defensively. Defensive actions in forms of a second attempt in CnD, dodging, stealthing(blinding powder, Shadow Refuge) or positioning(Shadow Step).

The weakness in this build is that CnD can be easily avoided just by watching and dodging at the right time. Denying CnD will be an easy win for you. However, if they manage to stealth there are some points to keep in mind:
*4 second of stealth
*They’re most likey behind you
*Count 1,2,3 dodge
*Create some distance by using utilities or weapon mobility skills
*Auto attack to try and figure out their position
*If you run out of dodges: 1,2,3 quick turn 180 degrees. (It’s better to take a face
stab than a back stab)
*AoE for zoning. It’s best to immediately lay it down on your position right
when the thief CnD as your chances of hitting him will be higher. Also,
Staff necro can use marks to figure out a thief’s position.
*Most importantly, be running at all times
D/P
This weapon spec has on demand stealth(3s) and mobility with BP+HS combo. This combo cost 9 initiative so timing the interrupt when the thief HS takes practices, however if you manage to pull that off you will have a dead thief. Now some professions lack interrupt abilities so what you can do is observe how the thief HS. There are 3 common ways:
*Stacking stealth by short leap HS 3x
When the thief is stacking stealth they are usually using a short leap HS by moving the camera angle to the top and HS 2-3 times. What you can do, which seems counter-intuitive, is walk in the the Blinding Power. Since the camera view for the thief is restricted to the ground he won’t know you’re coming. The thief will most likely HS you causing the revealed debuff, giving you the opportunity to burst and forcing the thief on the defensive since they depleted their initiative.

*HS towards the opponent
When the thief HS onto you, at that moment the thief is right in front of you. What is the thief going to do? He’s going to walk behind you and back stab. Sometimes cicle strafing and auto attacking is enough to keep the thief from backstabbing. A safer way is to count 1,2 dodge and tips mentioned above.

*HS away from the opponent
This a safer way to stack stealth by HS away→HS towards 2×. This also has its counters. Just walk in front of his BP and auto attack to prevent his other two HS. The amount of time for the thief to try to re-position for a backstab or stack stealth takes too long causing him to be revealed and 4 less initiative.

Defensive Play
Not much to say just that thieves will use their mobility+stealth to disengage fights. It’s best to burst combo a thief at 50% hp since most thieves won’t react fast enough to shadow step away. Remember just be wary when a thief uses Shadow refuge(SR) and inflict massive AoE or CC him out of SR.

I hope that this has enlighten some players that thieves aren’t as easy as you say it is. To truly understand how a thief works is to roll a thief yourself and learn the mechanics. Sooner or later you’ll find out that it’s more than just stealthing and backstabbing. There’s also a level of awareness and precision needed to successfully be a good thief.

In WvW the only thing you can do is be a Terrormancer or condition Engineer, rest of the classes either need to clench their kitten or hope to outrun them into a tower if the Thief isn’t terrible.

it is not the regen in stealth trait
they use there heal skill in stealth so they don’t get interrupted

don’t get me wrong the heal in stealth helps a lil
but when u see a thief go in to stealth at 50% and come back out full they used a heal skill .

a t s e.9614:

Well SA should probably get nerfed to avoid endless trolling. For the rest. thieves are fine. Its rly just that regen in stealth trait that is broken not because its OP but because its troll.

The issue is less with SA and more with comboing D/P + SA

D/p can be easy to counter .
it is slow and predictible
go to where they will finish there black powder / heart seeker combo and attack.

or use pulls pushes stuns to stop them from finishing there D/p combo before they stealth.
specially if u time it when they r low on initiative and shadow refuge is on cool down
u break the combo and the thief can break to.

dustiny explained it pretty well in the d/p section.

but the thieves healing “grandmaster” trait
its nothing compared to the war’s healing signet

as a power ranger that uses both bows and signets, thieves are not one of those classes that i would avoid 1v1 in wvw. i find guardians and warriors much scarier. my server knows that. they have seen me kill thieves 1v1. i get to beat them by timing my skills perfectly. once i see them low in health i use rapid fire to finish them off before they hide in stealth.