Guild Wars 2

Just this. I’ve noticed that our zergs do not have enough veilbots since the Mesmers became so incredibly OP at roaming. The proposed nerfs to Mesmers are nowhere near enough. It is not fair that the majority of players should be deprived of our veil bots just so they can play the game by themselves … by themselves!!! Isn’t this a MMO? Please fix this Anet. (also maybe bring back some of the hot light armour from GW1 for the veil bots to wear so I have some eye candy while I’m waiting for the commander to get his head out….)

-signed, a sad and lonely warrior.

Give me a reason to be more than a veilbot, and I’ll be in large battles.

90% Of roamers do it because they feel zerging is mindless and not fun and they like a challenge, its not a build that causes this.

Wat?…. Making mesmer viable in raid is like the biggest challenge you can get in game. Roaming for mesmer is the boring part atm. We’re waaay too strong in roaming. Every monkey can faceroll 1v2’s with the right build, whereas we are nothing but a veilbot in large scale WvW.

90% of the roamers are mesmer because they rerolled mesmer to roam because it’s so op. They didn’t refuse to raid and went roaming because zerging is mindless or w/e. Hell, those mesmers who say that are probably less skilled players than the mesmers who try to be effective in raid.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/WvW-Mesmer-needs-to-be-balanced/first

I don’t roam because I never find fights and I don’t really find flipping camps an enjoyable way to play… so I follow my wvw guild in mid to large sized raids.

Here is what usually happens:
Veil
Chaos Storm + Null Field + shatter
Greatsword auto attack + berserker until Chaos Storm is back up while following eles for water fields
Repeat

Most of the challenge I get is surviving by Phase Retreating/Blinking around so I don’t fail my guild by leaving them without a veil bot the next clash -_-

I am against nerfing mesmers to the ground, but Arenanet needs to understand that stealth is extremely powerful in WvWvW roaming. Unlike in spvp/tpvp, where you need to contest points and you cannot contest them in stealth, there is no disadvantage of using stealth in WvWvW roaming. In WvWvW mobility and stealth are much more important than in spvp.

Mesmer hasn’t gotten any more stealth, but Prismatic Understanding (PU) gives them a good access to protection, regeneration and aegis. This allows the mesmer to have a lot of sustainability, while phantasm spam damage even while the mesmer is stealthed. Thieves have been broken in WvWvW roaming since the launch. Thousands of forum posts are proof of this. For some weird reason Arenane developers have never commented any of this threads!

Yet thieves cannot attack and remain stealthed, at least they get 3 sec revealed (which should be increased to 5 seconds or so). So right now mesmer is even more broken. Attacks from stealth, even if they from the phantasms, blocked or dodges should result revealed.

Don’t get me wrong. I have killed thieves and mesmers when I solo roam, but generally that requires them to do a mistake e.g. I play weak, let my health drop, because I know I can heal it back fast, to get them overconfident (extremely risky strategy from me). Of course I have also lost such fights.

Fighting against stealthed opponents and AI opponents is NOT fun at all.

Lol, you lose your veilbots because it’s not fun. Roaming can still be fun and is very strong but if that’s not your thing you don’t log to mesmer that often anymore.

sry, your veilbot is playing with us thieves now

Mesmers are the best 1v1 class in the game. Let them roam.

If you want mesmers in your fights, join an organized guild. Smart guilds know how to use mesmers for a lot more than just veils.

They do? I’m in the best WvW guild on raid-scaled for almost a year now and I haven’t noticed a lot of my usefullness besides veil so far after all nerfs.

The amount of useless arguments people are giving in these threats are almost to cry about… Sad thing is that arenanet doesn’t seem to care wether you give arguments or not but just base their balancing around a spinning toll that, when it ends with spinning and falls on a section, it will be that section to get nerfed.

I 100% support new light armors in this game.
I avoid blobing in wvw because I dislike mindless hammertrain gameplay, not because my class lacks skills in large scale pvp.
And only PU roaming mesmers are a problem. But yes… a huge majority of roaming mesmers are using a lame PU build. That’s sad, but I can’t blame them for chosing an easy build over something more risky.

Nausicca.6038:

I 100% support new light armors in this game.
I avoid blobing in wvw because I dislike mindless hammertrain gameplay, not because my class lacks skills in large scale pvp.
And only PU roaming mesmers are a problem. But yes… a huge majority of roaming mesmers are using a lame PU build. That’s sad, but I can’t blame them for chosing an easy build over something more risky.

The problem is the more “risky” specs are high risk low reward…. Shatter mes used to be something that should be feared…. Now it’s an absolute joke.

Personally, with the ability to evade and, block, riposte, and blur, combined with the damage I can do, I feel my mesmer is in a good place. This is coming from someone who has leveled all 8 professions to 80 with about the last 50-60 levels of each profession being in WvW. Personally, in my opinion, what mesmers need most is fixes to traits and skills that are not functioning properly, and small tweaks to some specific weapons skills.

jportell.2197:

Now it’s an absolute joke.

I don’t have this feeling. I can still kill a lot of people in wvw, and do more than ok in spvp ( not doing tpvp so far). Of course, I have a hard time agains’t skilled players, especialy thieves, but I think it’s something normal. And most of all, I have a lot of fun playing my shatter build compared to any PU build.

Nausicca.6038:

jportell.2197:

Now it’s an absolute joke.

I don’t have this feeling. I can still kill a lot of people in wvw, and do more than ok in spvp ( not doing tpvp so far). Of course, I have a hard time agains’t skilled players, especialy thieves, but I think it’s something normal. And most of all, I have a lot of fun playing my shatter build compared to any PU build.

Its a matter of effectiveness… If you compare the amount of work a shatter mesmer has to put in to down someone compared to any other mesmer build (almost any other build in general), it is grossly imbalanced. The nerf after nerf to the shatter build which is arguably one of the most skilled mesmer builds is what has killed it for me. My mesmer has been mostly shelved for the last few months. I pick it up after every update to test the changes and then realize that its still not on par with any other class except maybe ele…

@OP: Sorry to dissapoint you, but i won’t start zerging, no matter what. So far shatter is still playable (albeit barely).

If for some reason, they decide to nerf all mesmer roaming builds, those players won’t go “hey, let’s start zerging”. No, they will simply stop playing the class/game and be done with it.

/edit: Granted, i die a lot, but playing shatter demands fast reactions and, for me, is a lot more fun than playing a semi-afk PU build. I still kitten up many times where i misjudge some move and press F4 too early/late and die because i’m squishy as hell, but this way i can get still better.

Nausicca.6038:

jportell.2197:

Now it’s an absolute joke.

I don’t have this feeling. I can still kill a lot of people in wvw, and do more than ok in spvp ( not doing tpvp so far). Of course, I have a hard time agains’t skilled players, especialy thieves, but I think it’s something normal. And most of all, I have a lot of fun playing my shatter build compared to any PU build.

One of the biggest mistakes people make: Linking fun and balancing to eachother. Just because you have more fun playing a build that is pretty… underpowered atm, it doesn’t mean it’s balanced. Sure you’re having fun, but that doesn’t mean it’s underpowered.
I can also run some troll roaming build and kill 1/2 guys in a 25v60 and have fun, but that’s not being usefull.

BlackDevil.9268:

Nausicca.6038:

jportell.2197:

Now it’s an absolute joke.

I don’t have this feeling. I can still kill a lot of people in wvw, and do more than ok in spvp ( not doing tpvp so far). Of course, I have a hard time agains’t skilled players, especialy thieves, but I think it’s something normal. And most of all, I have a lot of fun playing my shatter build compared to any PU build.

One of the biggest mistakes people make: Linking fun and balancing to eachother. Just because you have more fun playing a build that is pretty… underpowered atm, it doesn’t mean it’s balanced. Sure you’re having fun, but that doesn’t mean it’s underpowered.
I can also run some troll roaming build and kill 1/2 guys in a 25v60 and have fun, but that’s not being usefull.

agreed. ther is mesmers out there that will say, yeah mes is in a great place in wvw, i get to support my team with veil and portal and im awesome at boonstripping and i can give boons ….and then dat timewarp is oo great. and me who used to be in a mesmer zergbusting guild is more like… yeah and this does like no dmg it is a support build, but this isnt the problem, the problem is the fighting mesmer the aoe dp which is non existant and no feedback doesnt count as the current meta has little to nothing to reflect.
only because u like being a support and utility build in wvw doesnt mean that the wvw mes is balanced. its not and i run with zergbusting groups and ele,necro and heavys are a must. im mostly the only mes.

BlackDevil.9268:

Nausicca.6038:

jportell.2197:

Now it’s an absolute joke.

I don’t have this feeling. I can still kill a lot of people in wvw, and do more than ok in spvp ( not doing tpvp so far). Of course, I have a hard time agains’t skilled players, especialy thieves, but I think it’s something normal. And most of all, I have a lot of fun playing my shatter build compared to any PU build.

One of the biggest mistakes people make: Linking fun and balancing to eachother. Just because you have more fun playing a build that is pretty… underpowered atm, it doesn’t mean it’s balanced. Sure you’re having fun, but that doesn’t mean it’s underpowered.
I can also run some troll roaming build and kill 1/2 guys in a 25v60 and have fun, but that’s not being usefull.

I don’t think it’s an underpowered build. It if was, I’d lose most of my fights. Of course, it’s kind of useless in a zerg vs zerg, but who cares? I’m using siege.
Mindless sieging vs mindless zerging. WvW at its best.

It’s quite effective, and super usefull. More than being a veil bot.

Nomin.5901:

90% Of roamers do it because they feel zerging is mindless and not fun and they like a challenge, its not a build that causes this.

Ofc, doing 1v1 instead (with that reason) is pot calling kettle black. :P

Nausicca.6038:

BlackDevil.9268:

Nausicca.6038:

jportell.2197:

Now it’s an absolute joke.

I don’t have this feeling. I can still kill a lot of people in wvw, and do more than ok in spvp ( not doing tpvp so far). Of course, I have a hard time agains’t skilled players, especialy thieves, but I think it’s something normal. And most of all, I have a lot of fun playing my shatter build compared to any PU build.

One of the biggest mistakes people make: Linking fun and balancing to eachother. Just because you have more fun playing a build that is pretty… underpowered atm, it doesn’t mean it’s balanced. Sure you’re having fun, but that doesn’t mean it’s underpowered.
I can also run some troll roaming build and kill 1/2 guys in a 25v60 and have fun, but that’s not being usefull.

I don’t think it’s an underpowered build. It if was, I’d lose most of my fights. Of course, it’s kind of useless in a zerg vs zerg, but who cares? I’m using siege.
Mindless sieging vs mindless zerging. WvW at its best.

It’s quite effective, and super usefull. More than being a veil bot.

Okay let’s see:
Shatter is superior in:
spvp killing noobs
…?

Right,
Pve: Phantasm
Roaming: PU
TPvP: No one picks mesmers for top 100
WvW Raid: No viable build possible
Dueling: PU/phantasm/lockdown.

You can’t base if a build is underpowered or not on your own experiences. You can however see it once you check where it’s good enough to be vialble in, and atm shatter is almost no where viable enough to join with the meta.

Yeah too bad there are some guilds playing WvW on a mindset that’s not mindless… The fact that you don’t even bother fighting and just rather sits on an AC already tells enough.

Coming from a Mesmer, nerf PU and mindless Phantasm spam. It isn’t fun for anyone. (I don’t know how either of these work in PvE, but in sPvP and WvW they are a problem)

Then buff or don’t change the highly active builds like Lockdown and Shatter.

I don’t know about other Mesmers, but I get tired of people always assuming you’re playing PU. It is a stupidly easy build and highly effective. It gives the rest of us a bad name, and therefore needs a nerf.

I think for PU, just return it to one boon every 3 seconds. It never felt weak to me in that state, I thought the buff was pretty odd.

Elegant Avenger.8042:

Coming from a Mesmer, nerf PU and mindless Phantasm spam. It isn’t fun for anyone. (I don’t know how either of these work in PvE, but in sPvP and WvW they are a problem)

Then buff or don’t change the highly active builds like Lockdown and Shatter.

I don’t know about other Mesmers, but I get tired of people always assuming you’re playing PU. It is a stupidly easy build and highly effective. It gives the rest of us a bad name, and therefore needs a nerf.

not all forms of pu are easy to play. i use pu only so i can survive in zergs and if i get focused i can stealth and reposition myslef while cleansing condi. i have seen a lot of pu mesmers in spvp that were terrible though.i play power pu and it does require skill for sure.

I am only seeing a uninformed call for a nerf to mesmers for roaming. My experience on my mesmer and my experience in fighting roaming mesmers, as well as my fighting against mesmers when I am on other professions, has shown me no evidence that they need a nerf of any kind.

What specifically about mesmers are being called for nerfs here?

BlackDevil.9268:

They do? I’m in the best WvW guild on raid-scaled for almost a year now and I haven’t noticed a lot of my usefullness besides veil so far after all nerfs.

The amount of useless arguments people are giving in these threats are almost to cry about… Sad thing is that arenanet doesn’t seem to care wether you give arguments or not but just base their balancing around a spinning toll that, when it ends with spinning and falls on a section, it will be that section to get nerfed.

Definitely looking forward to seeing you guys fight EP if you ever come to NA. They are probably the top NA GvG guild right now.

PU – the trait, and only this trait – needs a nerf.

Either:
- remove aegis
- increase boon interval to >2s
- reduce boon duration from stealth

That’s about it.

style.6173:

BlackDevil.9268:

They do? I’m in the best WvW guild on raid-scaled for almost a year now and I haven’t noticed a lot of my usefullness besides veil so far after all nerfs.

The amount of useless arguments people are giving in these threats are almost to cry about… Sad thing is that arenanet doesn’t seem to care wether you give arguments or not but just base their balancing around a spinning toll that, when it ends with spinning and falls on a section, it will be that section to get nerfed.

Definitely looking forward to seeing you guys fight EP if you ever come to NA. They are probably the top NA GvG guild right now.

I actually think it should be time for US guilds to come EU. So many EU guilds went to the US already once or twice.