Guild Wars 2

Most of the trait lines make players decide to go either max damage or support. Please consider to make some distinctive separation of damage traits and support traits, giving every class a damage and support line so every class can go max dps and also some support without sacrifying the dps traits.
Make dps mutualy exclusive with character personal defences (toughness, vitality, character only heal/condi removal skills).
This game has a lot unused support utility since people are more or less pushed into maximum damage builds (which is understandable, as the best defence is a good offence, but sad).

Another idea would be to change Healing Power to Boon Power. Basically every boon would be affected by it. So if you want strong mightstacks or strong protection, you would have to invest points into Boon Power.

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Another idea would be to change Healing Power to Boon Power. Basically every boon would be affected by it. So if you want strong mightstacks or strong protection, you would have to invest points into Boon Power.

bad idea, it would hurt builds/skills that benefit stronly from healing power, such as most healing skills, Guard shout on rangers, traited shouts on warriors, water attunement on ele and so on.

Bad idea, bad bad idea

Prysin.8542:

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Another idea would be to change Healing Power to Boon Power. Basically every boon would be affected by it. So if you want strong mightstacks or strong protection, you would have to invest points into Boon Power.

bad idea, it would hurt builds/skills that benefit stronly from healing power, such as most healing skills, Guard shout on rangers, traited shouts on warriors, water attunement on ele and so on.

Bad idea, bad bad idea

Why should it hurt healingpower builds? o.O
Healingpower would be the only boon which doesn’t get hit by this change.

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Prysin.8542:

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Another idea would be to change Healing Power to Boon Power. Basically every boon would be affected by it. So if you want strong mightstacks or strong protection, you would have to invest points into Boon Power.

bad idea, it would hurt builds/skills that benefit stronly from healing power, such as most healing skills, Guard shout on rangers, traited shouts on warriors, water attunement on ele and so on.

Bad idea, bad bad idea

Why should it hurt healingpower builds? o.O
Healingpower would be the only boon which doesn’t get hit by this change.

It’s a risky concept though. Boons have a maximum amount of stacks. Right now if a pugs goes over 25 might/Vulnerability and has Perma Fury, smart people will swap out a certain weapon or utility for something else, generally a high damage ability (e.g. Warrior dropping FGJ for Frenzy/Signet or S/D Elementalist swap to D/F or Staff,) and stay effective, how-ever if you build yourself and your gear around stacking strong protection/might and you run into PuGs that did the same, you’re becoming way less effective. (Condition-specs anyone?)

For orginized groups, yes, I don’t see an issue if it’s worked out well (I couldn’t quite understand your reply to Prysin’s concerns) but for PuGs this can be a painful option.

A-net wanted a game where people didn’t need certain builds/classes to get PvE-content done, it’s the communities ‘fault’ we decide we want to get content done as quickly as we can. Kind of an obvious result though, I’ve yet to encounter an MMO where people prefer getting things done slowly.

Ironicly from what I’ve heard about gw1 PvE in the end they almost had it spot on there. You needed a healer? Well usually someone in your group could change builds a bit to still be a decent healer (Necromancer, Elementalist, Monks, Ritualist definitly, to some extend Dervishes and Mesmer and even Paragons could do quite well, leaving only Warriors as a non-healing/protecting class.) Ofcourse certain combinations were optimal, but you’ll always run into that issue.

Esmee.1067:

A-net wanted a game where people didn’t need certain builds/classes to get PvE-content done, it’s the communities ‘fault’ we decide we want to get content done as quickly as we can.

Not by a long shot. It was ANet that deliberately made the effectiveness of boons virtually disconnected from stats (except for regeneration you can only make them last longer), and thanks to the shared skills with SPVP made healing power return on investment downright stink.

Here is the thing: Healing power starts at zero. It is a secondary stat. Power, the basis for damage output, is on the other hand a primary stat. And at L80 that means it starts at 916. Precision is also a primary stat. And crit damage starts at 50%.

So from the get go fights are stacked in the offense’s favor.

And then you look at the co-efficiencies, and see offense skill after offense skill at 1.0 or above. But if you look at healing you find maybe 2 skills, and a couple of traits (elementalist and guardian) that come even close to 1.0. most of them are down below 0.25.

The return on investment basically stink.

Then you have mob designs that are deliberately forcing us to dodge. And are so health fat that anything short of full on offense will increase your risk of a failure, because longer fights equal a higher chance of a missed dodge, leading to a lost fight.

The irony is that defensive builds are clearing the field in SPVP, and so we are likely to see defensive skills and stats get even further nerfed in the future.

The only time defensive builds work in PVE is when you manage to glitch mobs into not using all their attacks.

BTW, Escape from LA shows how crazy it can get. There you have mobs dropping AOE attacks that score hits into the 30k range on people in as defensive a build as they can get. With that kind of damage flying around, defense is a wasted effort.

Esmee.1067:

For orginized groups, yes, I don’t see an issue if it’s worked out well (I couldn’t quite understand your reply to Prysin’s concerns) but for PuGs this can be a painful option.

I couldn’t understand his concern. If they would rework Healing Power to Boon Power, Boon Power would still influence your healing as Healing Power did.

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Esmee.1067:

For orginized groups, yes, I don’t see an issue if it’s worked out well (I couldn’t quite understand your reply to Prysin’s concerns) but for PuGs this can be a painful option.

I couldn’t understand his concern. If they would rework Healing Power to Boon Power, Boon Power would still influence your healing as Healing Power did.

No it wouldnt, unless you intend to introduce an ridiculously OP stat to the game.

Healing Power affects two things;
Direct Healing and Regeneration.

With your change, which i assume is intended to increase the raw power of boons directly, you would help regeneration builds A LOT. However they would become crazy OP, as you’d get duration + direct power. It is also uncertain how you plan to increase the power of other boons.

Do you intend for “Boon Power” to add to existing values? in which case, how would you balance stuff like Might and Protection, two boons that are already very strong. Imagine Protection granting you 50-60% damage reduction, or might giving you 75-100 stat boost/stack. Or retaliation which would go through the roof, instantly becoming a “defeat all attackers” boon to a more insane extent then it already is.

Aegis? would it get more usages before going away? if so, guards become undefeatable right there and then.

Stability? How would that work? CC duration reduction in addition to stun immunity?

A “simple stat” introduction would demand a complete overhaul of the boon system, alongside the duration and avaliability of boons to all professions. It would impose a power creep without equal. Even the introduction of Ascended gear doesnt come close to the power creep this would add.

Ontop of this; all passive/active direct healing skills would never get any bonus, as healing itself is not a boon, regeneration is. Therefore all professions must either get regeneration added to their healing skills, or their healing skills buffed up to counter the inability to “improve” their basic healing. This again is another form of power creep but it comes in the form of increased sustain.

As an aside… Its annoying having healing/buffing not contributing to events like DPS does. For example escorting in Lions Arch events I was healing the escort and got zero contribution which is counter intuitive.

Deifact.3095:

As an aside… Its annoying having healing/buffing not contributing to events like DPS does. For example escorting in Lions Arch events I was healing the escort and got zero contribution which is counter intuitive.

good point.
Supportive actions should count, although maybe less then active combat, simply because it is easier to drop 2 min of regeneration on something once and then go on the offense or sit back doing nothing

Healing and regeneration shouldn’t be affected by the change. The other boons on the other hand should be affected.
As an example: the current Fury adds flat 20% critical chance.
You could change it to 5% without Boon Power, which would stack up to 30% with a high amount of Boon Power. Another example: Might is determined by the following formula: 0.375 * Level + 5. Why not change it to Boon Power * Level + 5 or Boon Power/2 * Level + 5?

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Healing and regeneration shouldn’t be affected by the change. The other boons on the other hand should be affected.
As an example: the current Fury adds flat 20% critical chance.
You could change it to 5% without Boon Power, which would stack up to 30% with a high amount of Boon Power. Another example: Might is determined by the following formula: 0.375 * Level + 5. Why not change it to Boon Power * Level + 5 or Boon Power/2 * Level + 5?

then if you do not affect healing or regeneration you are effectively destroying all ranger shout support builds, nerfing healing spring, troll unguent, Signet of the Wild, Fern Hound and any other pet/skill/trait giving us regeneration and or healing.
And for what? so our already mediocre boons can be overshadowed by any other profession in existence?
Atm the best boons rangers can share are swiftness, protection, regeneration, fury and might. That’s it. However the ways we apply these is rather meh, dodgy and situationaly (pet/spirit trigger). Contrary to guards/eles which can easily spam these without even putting in effort.

In PvE this wouldnt affect rangers, in WvW it would destroy them.

Prysin.8542:

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Healing and regeneration shouldn’t be affected by the change. The other boons on the other hand should be affected.
As an example: the current Fury adds flat 20% critical chance.
You could change it to 5% without Boon Power, which would stack up to 30% with a high amount of Boon Power. Another example: Might is determined by the following formula: 0.375 * Level + 5. Why not change it to Boon Power * Level + 5 or Boon Power/2 * Level + 5?

then if you do not affect healing or regeneration you are effectively destroying all ranger shout support builds, nerfing healing spring, troll unguent, Signet of the Wild, Fern Hound and any other pet/skill/trait giving us regeneration and or healing.
And for what? so our already mediocre boons can be overshadowed by any other profession in existence?
Atm the best boons rangers can share are swiftness, protection, regeneration, fury and might. That’s it. However the ways we apply these is rather meh, dodgy and situationaly (pet/spirit trigger). Contrary to guards/eles which can easily spam these without even putting in effort.

In PvE this wouldnt affect rangers, in WvW it would destroy them.

It should not change the way healing and regeneration is affected.
And I’m not talking about the ranger in specific but about all professions.

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Prysin.8542:

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Healing and regeneration shouldn’t be affected by the change. The other boons on the other hand should be affected.
As an example: the current Fury adds flat 20% critical chance.
You could change it to 5% without Boon Power, which would stack up to 30% with a high amount of Boon Power. Another example: Might is determined by the following formula: 0.375 * Level + 5. Why not change it to Boon Power * Level + 5 or Boon Power/2 * Level + 5?

then if you do not affect healing or regeneration you are effectively destroying all ranger shout support builds, nerfing healing spring, troll unguent, Signet of the Wild, Fern Hound and any other pet/skill/trait giving us regeneration and or healing.
And for what? so our already mediocre boons can be overshadowed by any other profession in existence?
Atm the best boons rangers can share are swiftness, protection, regeneration, fury and might. That’s it. However the ways we apply these is rather meh, dodgy and situationaly (pet/spirit trigger). Contrary to guards/eles which can easily spam these without even putting in effort.

In PvE this wouldnt affect rangers, in WvW it would destroy them.

It should not change the way healing and regeneration is affected.

If it acts like old healing power, then it becomes a “power creep” stat, which is even more damaging to the game.

Prysin.8542:

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Prysin.8542:

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Healing and regeneration shouldn’t be affected by the change. The other boons on the other hand should be affected.
As an example: the current Fury adds flat 20% critical chance.
You could change it to 5% without Boon Power, which would stack up to 30% with a high amount of Boon Power. Another example: Might is determined by the following formula: 0.375 * Level + 5. Why not change it to Boon Power * Level + 5 or Boon Power/2 * Level + 5?

then if you do not affect healing or regeneration you are effectively destroying all ranger shout support builds, nerfing healing spring, troll unguent, Signet of the Wild, Fern Hound and any other pet/skill/trait giving us regeneration and or healing.
And for what? so our already mediocre boons can be overshadowed by any other profession in existence?
Atm the best boons rangers can share are swiftness, protection, regeneration, fury and might. That’s it. However the ways we apply these is rather meh, dodgy and situationaly (pet/spirit trigger). Contrary to guards/eles which can easily spam these without even putting in effort.

In PvE this wouldnt affect rangers, in WvW it would destroy them.

It should not change the way healing and regeneration is affected.

If it acts like old healing power, then it becomes a “power creep” stat, which is even more damaging to the game.

Gosh, why should it?
Healingpower is useless in PvE since you don’t have a healer.
With this change you would atleast have a reason to invest into this stat.

To be precise: This change is meant to hit the current dungeon-meta. You can’t just throw 5 zerkers into a dungeons because their boons would suck. You need atleast one who has invested in Boon Power in order to make the boons strong again.
For WvW, there would be no difference if a 0-Boon-Power ranger fights a 0-Boon-Power warrior or a 500-Boon-Power ranger vs. a 500-Boon-Power warrior.
Furthermore, if you want to invest into Boon Power, you wouldn’t been able to get Strength, Precision and Critical Chance all together, so you can’t play as Boon Power zerker.

More like it is useless because mobs will spike through any and all attempts at healing unless you dodge, so you dodge and don’t bother with healing unless you down and out panic.

I used Feedback to support my allies with projectile reflection, but i didn’t geared and traited for defense, oh wait …

digiowl.9620:

More like it is useless because mobs will spike through any and all attempts at healing unless you dodge, so you dodge and don’t bother with healing unless you down and out panic.

I think you didn’t understand what we’re talking about. We’re not talking about the heals but about the affect on boons and if it would be OP or not.

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Prysin.8542:

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Prysin.8542:

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Healing and regeneration shouldn’t be affected by the change. The other boons on the other hand should be affected.
As an example: the current Fury adds flat 20% critical chance.
You could change it to 5% without Boon Power, which would stack up to 30% with a high amount of Boon Power. Another example: Might is determined by the following formula: 0.375 * Level + 5. Why not change it to Boon Power * Level + 5 or Boon Power/2 * Level + 5?

then if you do not affect healing or regeneration you are effectively destroying all ranger shout support builds, nerfing healing spring, troll unguent, Signet of the Wild, Fern Hound and any other pet/skill/trait giving us regeneration and or healing.
And for what? so our already mediocre boons can be overshadowed by any other profession in existence?
Atm the best boons rangers can share are swiftness, protection, regeneration, fury and might. That’s it. However the ways we apply these is rather meh, dodgy and situationaly (pet/spirit trigger). Contrary to guards/eles which can easily spam these without even putting in effort.

In PvE this wouldnt affect rangers, in WvW it would destroy them.

It should not change the way healing and regeneration is affected.

If it acts like old healing power, then it becomes a “power creep” stat, which is even more damaging to the game.

Gosh, why should it?
Healingpower is useless in PvE since you don’t have a healer.
With this change you would atleast have a reason to invest into this stat.

That is it!!!!

Healing Power is useless in PVE. It is very good if built correctly in WvW and sPvP.
Introducing “Boon Power” would ONLY be balanced in PvE and completely brokenly OP in WvW and sPvP….

Before suggesting, atleast reflect over how things can affect other modes, or else the suggestion will never go through.

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digiowl.9620:

More like it is useless because mobs will spike through any and all attempts at healing unless you dodge, so you dodge and don’t bother with healing unless you down and out panic.

I think you didn’t understand what we’re talking about. We’re not talking about the heals but about the affect on boons and if it would be OP or not.

But the idea is to make healing power into something that is more worthwhile to take in PVE than it is at present. But the reason for it not being worthwhile in PVE, but much more so in PVP, is that in PVE the mobs are specifically designed to break any possibility of a tank and spank scenario. In essence, the problem is not the stat, it is the PVE mob design.

digiowl.9620:

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digiowl.9620:

More like it is useless because mobs will spike through any and all attempts at healing unless you dodge, so you dodge and don’t bother with healing unless you down and out panic.

I think you didn’t understand what we’re talking about. We’re not talking about the heals but about the affect on boons and if it would be OP or not.

But the idea is to make healing power into something that is more worthwhile to take in PVE than it is at present. But the reason for it not being worthwhile in PVE, but much more so in PVP, is that in PVE the mobs are specifically designed to break any possibility of a tank and spank scenario. In essence, the problem is not the stat, it is the PVE mob design.

That’s indeed true.

Deifact.3095:

As an aside… Its annoying having healing/buffing not contributing to events like DPS does. For example escorting in Lions Arch events I was healing the escort and got zero contribution which is counter intuitive.

Exactly as it should be if you didn’t even bother to hit any mobs during the event even once. If you didn’t even tag one mob, then that means you are trying to play a dedicated healer in a game that does not have dedicated healers.

The idea of boon power is as old as it is bad. All boons except regen are designed in a way that you know exactly what you get from it. If nonsense like boon power is introduced, there is one big problem in addition to several smaller ones: boons would be no longer reliable when coming from other players. So especially the defensive ones (vigor, protection, aegis) would become essentially worthless because you’d have to treat them as if they weren’t there.

ODB.6891:

Exactly as it should be if you didn’t even bother to hit any mobs during the event even once. If you didn’t even tag one mob, then that means you are trying to play a dedicated healer in a game that does not have dedicated healers.

AFAIK you don’t get ANY contribution for healing in events. If no one heals the escort, there is a decent chance the escort will die, resulting in a fail for everyone. Sure, you should definitely contribute to DPS (no classes really have enough healing skills to heal only without any down time) but healing and buffing shouldn’t count for nothing either.

It’s weird to create a game that has no tri-force of healer/dps/tank and say that everyone can do everything, but then only give contribution to DPSers.